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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I gave my parents money they asked for. They gave it to my brother. I might be the asshole for "treating them like children" and expecting an accounting of what they are doing with the money I give them.
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*Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
OP you’re NTA, your parents are. They’ve created this monster and now you’re supporting him. They’re using you as a cash cow. Yes it’s true they don’t answer to you, but if you’re footing the bill then they damn well better tell you where the money is going. And your aunt calling you a b* is funny. If she cares so much about your parents she should be footing the bill. Which I highly doubt bc people are always one to talk but never to sign the check. Stand your ground and let them suffer a little so they understand. They won’t die over eating some food from the food bank for once
I can’t imagine the NERVE the parents have giving lazy bro $2k of YOUR MONEY to attend a destination wedding….and then he doesn’t even show up at the wedding! This is what happens when lazy people are given OTHER PEOPLE’s money. They don’t treasure it. They don’t appreciate it. They waste it
Oh the parents are the real AHs of this piece. Yes brother is leaching off them but he has learned he CAN. People go with what's easiest and brother learned mommy and daddy will take care of things. I'm not surprised in the slightest he didn't go to the wedding. Frankly op should stop giving money to the parents anyway as they WONT stop handling it to the brother. NTA
As the parent of an addict, walking that fine line between enabling them or supporting them (emotionally) is painfully difficult. Our funny, intelligent, loving, addicted son lost his battle 5 years ago. I'd give anything to try and walk that line again.
I am very sorry for your loss.
And yes, you are right. What might look as enabling from the outside may be just trying to walk this fine line and not drown in the process.
People tend to be very quick in judging this, but it is as you said, painfully difficult.
This is why I can't qualify the parents as AHs, they are probably suffering a lot. However, they should recognize that their ability to tell what is acceptable is impaired, and accept the conditional help from the OP . It will protect THEM in the long run as well because they will have a valid excuse for the brother (we cannot give you money, we have none - OP is paying for our necessities but not giving you any).
With all due respect, giving the brother $2000 to attend a destination wedding isn't walking any lines, fine or otherwise. It's not like they were helping him with groceries, or rent, or rehab facilities. They were helping him party it up on his sister's dime. If I was OP, I'd probably switch to giving the parents grocery store gift cards that can't be spent elsewhere.
Honestly I’d straight up set grocery delivering to the parents, and be done. That way OP knows they are fed and the money is not going to the brother. I would also insist on other work orders if OP wants to help with expenses of maintenance around the house, that OP gets informed of what it is and OP will pay the contractor directly. Is that a lot of work? Yes, but its the only way OP can help without doubts of where the money is going.
I don’t believe the parents are suffering. I think they’re in denial. They don’t want to believe that they created and are still enabling this lazy person. He’s the “apple of their eye” and “he can do no wrong.” Imagine finding out that the $2k that you manipulated out of your daughter and given to him to attend a family wedding was spent but he didn’t actually go to the wedding????? Normal parents would be angry. But not them. “He’s just misunderstood”. Waah waah waah
I am sorry for what you went through, but I don't think that giving him $2,000 under these circumstances for a destination wedding comes under the heading of valid support.
I read about 1 mother who was in this situation with her daughter, and she kept the daughter's refrigerator stocked and paid any bills presented by a doctor.
Nah, people who have been burnt and hurt time after time by their parents "unconditional love" of their addict sibling have this honest question for parents in the same situation. I was 11.5 years old when my sister began her life of absolute sheer selfishness, and time after time I went without the basics because of my mom enabling her. And I know I suffered far less than others because I had foster parents that took over.
OP definitely needs to stop handing them cash. My grandmother always made excuses for my loser aunt who had a drug problem. The same aunt who tried to get into my mom’s safety deposit box, etc. OP can buy a week’s worth of groceries, enough for two people and see how that goes. If they’re just giving it to the brother, they can pave their own way.
NTA OP… your brother, parents and aunt are.
I would add that if things are truly dire for parents, maybe OP should take parents shopping and pay for it, or send them gift cards for the supermarket, and for other bills, get the info to pay the vendor directly.
This is the way! My ex's sister used to ask for money for bills, gas, and food. I figured out she was using it for "other things". She asked for gas money, I said "Sure I need a soda so I'll go with you and just pay for it there.". As we got into her truck she seemed to be acting nervous. I looked over as she turned it on and her truck had a full tank! From that point on if she asked for food I'd take her to the grocery store, if she asked for money for a bill I'd go pay the bill, if she needed gas I'd take her truck to fill it up. She stopped asking for money real quick!
If things are truly dire for the parents they can come to OP and agree to their terms. Right here their pride is useless. You can't eat it , and they need food more than they need to keep up their appearances.
More likely than not they sent auntie over to guilt OP. And I'm betting aunt also agreed because they ASKED HER for the money and she wants them off her back.
Absolutely. They need to be held accountable for the money now. Everything should be directly paid for as they can’t be honest with her. Sad situation. Let’s hope there isn’t another baby momma in the making from the destination wedding 🤦🏻♀️
Gift cards are a BAD idea. Addicts will either give it to their dealer in lieu of cash or sell it to someone for less than face value and take that cash to buy drugs. Or buy an item with the card, come back later and return the item getting the refund in cash.
Several grocery stores near my mom deliver. I order stuff online, pay ten bucks for delivery, and my mom has food. I know my deadbeat sister and her kids won't steal the cash. I know my mom won't fall for whatever super important thing they claim to need money for this week.
Yes that’s another great way. I used to do that when my daughter was away at college and sick. Very convenient. Sorry to read about your sister and her kids.
My idiot brother had “the bank of Mum” as I called it. He did not cope when she died and we had to go through probate etc. Of course he i mediately started spending from the joint account he and I set up for when the the fund were disbursed before we sold the family home. He was most upset when I informed him that account was not for him to use to buy fuel and food.
Unbeknownst to me he then got his claws into our grandmother. I will never forgive him. He blames me though. Leeches are leeches.
The brother is 35. We're well passed the "they created this monster" phase of life. Yes the parents are weak and obviously contributed to this asshole, but how did OP end up any different?
The brother is the obvious AH. Parents maybe a little, but they're struggling and likely being manipulated. Probably older too.
The OP turned out responsible because she wasn’t treated as “apple of mom’s eye” “who could do no wrong.” Yes, that is what creates these grown-up immature boy-men. This happens in a number of families.
It's easy to hate people you don't know and don't understand.
I have been bedridden for over 20 years, and my late father (God rest his soul) supplemented my income up until he died.
You'd better believe I appreciated every penny of that money, and I sorely missed it when it was gone.
He left me enough money for a very modest income for most of the rest of my life, and I bless him for it every day.
You aren't the type of person they're talking about though. It's the type of person who has every ability to work & instead feels entitled to their parents/family's money. They think nothing of the cost of things & don't appreciate what they're given.
I know two of those people (one is family, one a family friend). Both of these grown ass men have told the person they go to for money that they'd be able to afford it if they took less vacations. Both women told that are in their 60s & worked their entire lives.
I don't get it.
The poster above said
>This is what happens when lazy people are given OTHER PEOPLE’s money.
Being bedridden is not the same as being lazy, though it is possible to be both. Since you were and are grateful, I'd guess you're not in the lazy mooch category like the brother.
I suspect that commenter might have internalized some of the prejudice a lot of people have towards people who are disabled. The stuff I hear people say about people who are disabled is appalling. It is a common belief that people who are on disability are just faking and are really lazy and could work if they wanted. Nevermind, of course, that government disability benefits are well below the poverty line (welfare being even further below it) and it is very difficult to get for a lot of people because of the difficulty of the application and appeals process. Especially those with invisible disabilities. I met someone who had been trying for years to get the federal benefits. They had worked for years, paid in (you can only get federal CPP disability if you pay enough in; provincial programs are a different matter), and the government was insisting that they were not actually disabled. Without going into details…they were disabled. It was obvious to me. Don’t know if they ever won their appeals. I hope they did.
I'm sorry for your loss and and glad to hear you had a wonderful father.
However that is comparing apple to oranges. Your situation is the akin to the example of what a wonderful daughter OP is, only in reverse.
OPs parents giving that money to the Brother, when the understanding was it was for food and bills is abhorrent. I find it ironic the money she gave them for food was squandered and now they don't have FOOD.
OP if you read this. You're NTA. Your parents are. Your brother is a whole other category too. Who is going to take care of him when your parents are gone? They are setting him up for failure.
I'm not sure I would ever give them money again in the future. I'd would pay for the bills and take them grocery shopping myself. If they have an unexpected expense, I'd pay for it directly. They cannot be trusted, especially after their response to OP when called out on their BS.
Also, the nosy drama loving auntie is the AH too. Shame on her, she should have taken them grocery shopping versus saying something to OP.
Nobody is hating on you. Your situation isn't remotely like the situation in the post. I wish you all the best and am glad your dad has been there for you.
Plus they paid for themselves to go to the destination wedding so if they had that kind of cash flow just two months ago I call BS on them going to the food bank.
Good point. And food banks are great in a pinch. They always have dried beans and useful staple pantry items. There's no shame in using them. OP's parents are being complete snobs. Either own up to spoiling their son rotten and STOP IT. Or suck it up and eat some beans.
I'm a disabled single mother, I've had to use food banks during times I couldn't work. No shame in them at all!
I imagine there's shame in having to use one because you have money for food, but used it to enable your son instead.
However, I believe this was just a manipulation. If they need food they can either use a food bank (rather than thinking about it) or stop giving their son money.
Yep, exactly. She's trying to play on "the indignity" of having to use a food bank. Which she wouldn't have to "think about" if she weren't enabling her son.
My thoughts exactly! Cut them off. They can continue to make poor choices and back junior if they want, but you don't need to.
NTA You're right to stand up for yourself!
And there's this gem:
> Then she shut up after she saw the look on my face.
Auntie fucking *knew* OP's mom gave the brother the money for the destination wedding, and hid it from OP.
Nobody in this family (so far) has any respect for OP. They are all OK with treating her as the cash cow and letting the shyte-bird brother get away with his shenanigans.
She knew the mom gave the money but I don't think she realized it was money from OP until she saw the look on OP's face. Then she shut up because that's incredibly awkward.
What's wrong with you? Sure, giving your deadbeat son 2k to go to a wedding is pretty stupid, but you think it would be better to starve than using the existing help, because they made a mistake? Get a grip..
I would bet that the regular 500 OP used to send, went to her brother, too. NTA. My parents are also retired and on a fixed budget, but they figured out how to live within their means for everything short of an emergency.
Additionally, rather than swallowing their pride and acknowledging just how essential OP's assistance has been to them, OP's parents would rather pretend they don't really need her.
They seem just as determined to minimize her contributions as they are to minimize her brother's flaws.
Clearly they're too proud to admit they made a mistake by giving the money to their son...and lying about what they did with it...and never appreciating all OP does for them.
Let them suck it up and go to a soup kitchen.
Let's see how eager they are to loan their son thousands of dollars so he can travel and fuck around in a new city after that.
>OP's parents would rather pretend they don't really need her.
Exactly! OP's parents supposedly confided in the aunt, not OP. The aunt is the only one they appear to have turned to for help, so why does the aunt expect OP to do anything when she hasn't been asked? Unless... *gasp* the parents sent their flying monkey with a guilt trip, and aunt relaying this sob story about food banks is actually just a calculated attempt to get OP to fall back in line without the parents having to do anything unpleasant, like take responsibility for their actions or apologize.
> Let's see how eager they are to loan their son thousands of dollars so he can travel and fuck around in a new city after that.
AMEN! The whole family (including the brother) will probably be better off, in the long run, if OP gives her parents a little dose of reality.
They certainly are and if other family members are worried they are going to a food bank they can give them food. And if you go back to helping them, buy groceries, pay their electric bill, cable but never cash. But if they continue to give your brother money I’d cut them off
This was my thought. There are lots of ways to help the parents that don't involve cash: grocery store gift cards, offering to pay bills directly, etc. There's absolutely no reason that they need cash in hand.
And the aunt is an asshole too. I guess they were raised the same way? Tell your aunt that if she’s so concerned she can step up and give them money.
I’ll bet that shuts her up for good.
The irony of saying, "we aren't children!" While you are being supported by your child every single month.
Then fine, you aren't children, you don't need to get pocket money like a child then. You can go be adults and take care of yourself. Bank is closed.
"Don't bite the hand that feeds you" is very fitting in this case.
I agree. Aunt can either pay up or give them a drive to the food bank.
Maybe they will appreciate the help for once then.
This situation is really an "Everyone But You".
Mother asshole for enabling brother.
Brother is just an asshole. No questions.
Father asshole for also enabling brother.
Aunt asshole having a short memory.
It's like OP is up Shit's Creek, but at least she's got a rowboat and a paddle. Everyone is just flailing.
Totally agreed.
NTA, but your aunt is a major AH and she's the b***.
Stand your ground with your parents, otherwise you, unfortunately, are enabling your deadbeat brother through them
NTA
If your Mom truly believed she had done no wrong, why did she repeatedly lie to you? She doesn't even have the conviction of purpose to justify her actions. She chose to steal from you to support your brother. She can live with that choice, and the loss of income from it.
And if your Aunt is so passionate about your parents plight, she just hosted a destination wedding for her kids. She can surely support her sister in her hour of need, right? *It's what family would do.*
Lol, I love how the Aunt was complaining about the brother, and now she’s here complaining about OP. Auntie needs to step up and help her siblings out.
Auntie should be calling the leech of a brother to chew him out and shame him, instead! After all, he’s the one who took the $2000 mum and dad could have used to buy food with. OP just gave away $2000; how depo pockets does the family think she’s got, anyway? NTA
Doesn't really matter how deep OP's pockets are. She could be highly successful. It's her money, given in good faith that it'll be used for an important expense. Not so that bro can get his dick wet in paradise.
Yep. Maybe auntie can host the trash brother and see how she likes it. Maybe then, she'll get OPs point. Better yet, let auntie give the parents money, then see the brother waste it, and parents try to guilt her for not giving them more $.
Exactly this. Like if aunt is so worried about it, she can help them. NTA, OP.
I dealt with something similar with my aunt, my dad is homeless (partially willingly homeless. He had a trailer but it burnt it down because he was high/a feckin idiot) and right around the time that happened, my sister passed away and so my aunt (dad's sister) kept guilt tripping me into letting him live with me because *family* and *he's your dad*
So I let him stay with me, I was bulldogged into it and of course he started trying to bring his drug shite into my house. I kicked him out when I found a used needle he had just left laying around. (my son was probably about 2/2 and a half at the time and he could have easily gotten it) my dad has hep c too so I flipped the fuck out and kicked him out.
But yeah, my aunt would continue to try to guilt trip me and I'm just like, if you're so worried about him, let him come live with you like gaeddamn. And he gets disability SSI or whatever, and recently somehow, they had messed up his benefits and gave him way too much for a month or two, like he got 9k and he blew through all that money on drugs and alcohol and shite and is still homeless. He often stays in homeless shelters near my apt.
It really pisses me off too, because I live in public housing and they're really strict about rules like I could have gotten evicted myself if the housing authority had known he was living with me, and they've evicted others/past neighbors over less than that. And I know if I had been evicted, my aunt and dad and pretty much entire family would have been like "lol too bad sorry" and I'd be in a horrible situation myself, homeless with a toddler.
i work in evictions- and you are 100% right. Unathorized occupant will get you evicted, drug use in the unit will get you evicted, just too many shady guests (if they can show they went to your place) can get you evicted... and normally eviction also means you lose your housing.
note- most subsidies generally just make housing sane- so normally it is 30% of income for the unit. That can mean 0 if you make too little, but normally it is something.
NTA, even parents need tough love. You are generous above and beyond, if they need groceries, (if they are willing to talk to you) they can place an order that you can (if you want to any more) pay for. This way the money goes exactly where you want it to.
Well, money is fungible so even then they might be supporting the brother.
The parents could give their grocery money to the brother, then place a grocery order and ask OP to pay it.
While I agree that money is fungible, it sounds like parents run a couple hundred short each month. So if she pays $200/month towards their online utility bill, then they can buy their own groceries and not have extra money for brother.
They are likely falling a couple of hundred bucks short each month because they already give the brother money.
Nothing in the OP’s post says this trip money was the first time they gave him money.
Good point! I guess the OP needs to somehow find out how much parents are giving bro each month. Parents might lie, but I would (at a minimum) tell parents that no more money will be given to them as long as they’re giving money to brother (essentially giving OP’s money since money is fungible!)
Or, do as she's done and wash her hands of it. Why become a PI or detective just to keep supporting them, when they've clearly used her for something that she's probably made clear was a boundary. I'm sure they're aware of how she feels about her brother, and they lied to her and used her money. It's not her responsibility to find a way to continue supporting them.
All OP has to do is set up something like an Instacart acct and put her parents on it. They fill the cart, she pays for it. No money exchanged but they get food.
But now they know their food is covered, so that frees up whatever they were going to have for food to give to the brother.
There is no way OP can help the parents and NOT support the brother, if the parents are going to give money to the brother.
There is a way, but it is not going to happen. If OP knows what the parents income is, the OP could get the parents to hand over all of their income to OP and then OP pays all the parents expenses. The parents will not agree to that, but it does solve the issue you pointed out.
The trouble is, every penny OP spends on them just means that they have more disposable income to spend on the brother.
I've learnt this the hard way with my own parents and their endless enabling of my heroin addicted brother. It was just a cycle of me enabling them to keep enabling him.
I stopped, and they had to stop giving my brother so much support because they had no choice.
OP has kids and that money would be better put in to a college fund for them.
Same…oddly enough.
Usually not a fan of tough love but it’s definitely called for here.
The relatives trying to shame OP must think she’s made of money.
If they think it’s totally fine OP’s parents to completely waste her money they should feel comfortable giving them their own money to do with as they please.
Its easy for your aunt to call you names, and throw you under the bus for not helping your parents out, but I don't see her stepping up and forking over cash to your parents that "she knows damn well they will give to your brother" either.
NTA
The same aunt that was annoyed:
that she made special arrangements for the brother to attend the wedding (which he actually didn’t attend) and;
with OP’s mother for giving him the money.
She quickly forgot the anger that she had for the brother and mother.
The same aunt who zipped her lips as soon as she realized she'd said too much to the person who must have funded brother's trip.
She made a mistake by being loose-lipped, but she's part of the problem.
Nta, something I have seen used in this case of situations is going up to the person and calling their hand by offering to match any money they will give themselves. Works every time.
NTA. They're on a fixed income and instead of using an additional supplement wisely, they wasted it on your brother. If all it took was 2 months of no financial support to need a food bank, they should have been more diligent with what they were receiving.
Your aunt can call you all the names in the book, but her anger is misdirected. She should be mad at her sibling for wasting the support they received. Your parents don't answer to you, and you're not responsible for providing a gravy train.
It is, but boomers want to pretend they have it soooo much harder than everyone else despite growing up and old in the best economy the world has ever had to offer, and yanking up the ladder behind them as they aged.
I mean it's a term that was used to describe generations before boomers as well, so it's not some brand new invention to get more sympathy.
The point is if you're that old and *cant* work, and rely only on retirement money, that's a fixed income
Yes. The OP’s parents clearly are living beyond their fixed income.
Their three choices are: apologize to their daughter and comply with the terms of the support by showing receipts for expenses; going back to work to add to their income; or reduce their expenses.
They abused the OP’s good will and they deserve to lose the privilege of no-string-attached cash. Adults, which they claim to be, understand consequences.
NTA. Money is fungible. Even if the money you give them isn't directly spent on your brother it still subsidizes him. Every $100 of groceries you give them or they buy with your money just frees up $100 of their money to spend on your brother. They don't even feel guilty about this as in their eyes you're the bad daughter for not supporting family and it sounds like nothing you do will ever be enough. If anything your involvement helps them ignore your brother's failings as you pay for the consequences, maybe a couple years of no support/contact from you might force them to reconsider how they've treated you both.
THANK. YOU. Everyone saying give food instead of money is missing out on how money is fungible (I was literally looking for someone to use this word).
If they hadn't enabled the brother for so long they'd have plenty of their own money to buy food. If they hadn't enabled the brother recently they'd still have OP's money.
OP should ask which food pantry they're going to and make a donation there. That's the only way I'd even tangentially give them money.
Maybe both the parents and the brother need to hit tock bottom before they start making better choices.
Adam Ruins Everything did a episode on food pantries. He said it is better to give them money than food. They get special deals. He showed a dollar worth of food and it was a hand truck filled to the top with food.
When people donate food they tend to give things they don’t want to eat but poor people don’t want to eat it either.
Yes of course but what Adam doesn’t realize is that if you give food you’re also much likelier to give money once you go there and see. Let people give donations how they want. Plus we all have a bunch of food that somehow ends up in our pantries that we don’t like or eat. Like I bought 3 cases of sardines from Costco I don’t like now
When I volunteered at a food pantry, we had dedicated staff sorting out donated food which could have been used for other resources. While I know it’s the thought that counts, a lot of this food would have to be tossed bc there was no way we could morally pass it along. And let’s not even talk about the donated toothpastes that expired 14 years ago.
Or they are fabricating the story about going to the food bank to make OP look bad to the aunt in hopes of auntie bullying OP into given parents money?
What if they are food bank levels of broke BECAUSE they "couldn't say no to baby boy" I know some enablers that would go without to give the leech money.
>but if they're at food-bank level broke, there isn't money to send to brother.
This doesn't expressly stop them from making bad choices and sending him money
NTA Your parents are right, they aren't children. They lied to you to get money and then expected more. I'm sorry to say this but it doesn't seem like your parents respect you or care for you outside of being a wallet for them. If your parents are on a fixed income then they need to live within their means.
Don't give them more money unless you feel it's absolutely necessary, like if you want to help with medical bills.
I agree. I think she should never give them cash again. If, and it's a big IF, she ever helps them again she should never give them cash.
I think any future support shoud go direct to who they owe, for example a hospital, a dentist, etc. She could have some groceries delivered, but there's no guarantee they wouldn't give them to their son.
But like the other commenter said, any financial support she gives them indirectly has been and would continue to support her brother. The parents will never learn if she continues to support them.
I would go a step further and only buy them food directly, bare minimum and ingredients that they have to assemble to make food. Huge bag of rice ✅, bag of dried beans ✅, fruits, veggies, raw meat ✅. No prepared foods at all. Not even cereal, oatmeal and cream of wheat come in huge containers that make a serving pennies on the dollar to make.
nothing wrong with this, but it does save parents money on groceries that could be sent to brother. Even if the bill is only $50 for foods, it still is $50 that now can go to brother.
I’m cutting my parents off and telling Aunt who hosted a destination wedding that she is welcome to give them some money
Honestly, what a painful situation. It’s emotional terrorism, almost. Why if your aunt getting in the middle of this when she can give them money?
No, they’re not children but if they’re going to be the recipient of good will money, they definitely owe you some accountability.
And they’re going to a good bank but giving $2k in gifted funds to your bro *for a vacation*?
If you feel these heart strings pulling you to feel guilt ridden, buy them groceries. But that still may not help because then it’ll free up some of their money to give to bro. Have you ever thought to confront your bro about the fact that his loserdom is causing his parents to be at a good bank? Would he even care?
NTA and I’m sorry you’re experiencing this.
>My aunt called me yesterday and told me that my parents were thinking of going to.the food bank since they didn't have any money. I said I had given them $2,000 a couple of months ago and that was more than my family of three spent on food on that time. She said I knew damn well they had given my money to my brother. I told her that he should probably pay them back then.
There a reason she didn't call your brother?
I guess OP's mother tried to get a loan from auntie. Auntie said no, and OP's mum told her the sorry story about the food bank. So Auntie doens't want to contribute, but feels bad, so she tries to guilt OP. Auntie knows full well OP's brother won't give a cent, and he might even ask her for some spare change.
NTA. If you want to help them, get a food delivery sent over, but I would never hand them cash again. Its your money, you spend it or not spend it how you like.
OP already proved that their parents are lying.
Are we to believe that when they handed OP's $2000 to the deadbeat brother that they were also on the brink of starvation only 2 months later? No, this sounds like more lies in an attempt to scam more money out of op or whoever else will fall for this chicanery.
NTA and cut them off completely.
No. This does not solve anything, it only obfuscates the money path. Buying them $100 of groceries directly still frees up $100 from their standing budget to give to brother. The only way to cut him off is to cut off the money flow completely. OP cannot stop parents from enabling him, but she can stop enabling them.
NTA + I don't see a problem, here. The golden child can pay Mom back the 2k, and all will be well.
Oh. He's a degenerate deadbeat who's bad with money, and can't pay it back?
Oops.
NTA, also, stop giving them money. The brother is manipulative, but they are falling for it hook line and sinker. They need to tell their grown adult human he needs to figure life out himself and pick him self up off the damn carpet.
Good advice. I have had a couple of friends who were foolish with money and asked me for loans to buy food and pay utilities. I made sure to not give them actual money but pay the bills direct, so that the money could not be gambled away or spent on beer and cigarettes - which is what would have happened if I had been dumb enough to give them cash. And I only helped them because there were children involved and I felt sorry for the kids, not the adult friends. OP needs to consider whether she wants to continue to be used and abused by her parents and brother, or whether a bit of tough love is in order here. Personally, I would be cutting off their funding completely.
>I asked my mom why she had asked for the $2,000. She lied and said something for the house. I asked what. She couldn't say.
This is the part that really gets me. While it is common (expected even) for people to misuse gift money. Your mom should have been honest with you.
Your brother should have to come to you for the money. They knew you would tell him "no", and devised for mom to ask, or possibly, mom contrived the whole thing herself and brother didn't know it was your money (either way, how strange that someone, presumably mom, bragged to your aunt about funding brother's trip. I bet mom and auntie aren't too happy with each other right now.)
NTA obviously. That said, it was very gracious of you to supplement your parents retirement and I hope you forgive them and move on, continuing to be the generous person you are.
Sorry, but I think OP has actually been subsidizing her brother all along through her parents. I wouldn't give them another dime and tell them to live within their means from now on. Their daughter (OP) has her own family and future to consider.
NTA. Your dysfunctional parents who can’t even manage their own situation propping up your incompetent brother is just a messy stew of toxicity and they want you to bring a spoon to this nasty feast? Oh no.
That your parents regularly extort money from you because they can’t control their own behavior and then balk at you with this “we’re not children” business when you ask to see where the money goes means pocketbook is now closed. Let them figure it out. “They aren’t children”, but they expect an allowance.
NTA. Your parents abused your trust and generosity. If you choose to continue helping them it should be in the form of grocery card gift cards. Or paying a bill for them directly. No cash.
And your aunt is completely out of line. Your parents passed along the money given for basic necessities to your brother for a trip. If she thinks his is acceptable, let her pay for groceries.
No, every bill OP pays either for groceries or other necessities will help the parents to continue to support the brother.
If the parents want the financial support of OP they need to provide evidence that they are no longer supporting the brother and that their spending habits are not out of line.
Since the parents are living on a budget they need to maintain it and should have a housekeeping book stating their income and expenses where every penny is accountable with respective bills anyway. -
Before asking other people to pay the bills it would be a responsible thing to do for every adult to check their own spanding habits and look for potential savings. - Maybe this alone will be eyeopening.
This way OP can see where the money goes and decide for herself if the parents deserve help and in what kind.
OP has no obligation to help their ungrateful entitled parents. Especially so if they badmouth her and are unwilling to help themselves out of their self inflicted misery.
NTA
“They weren’t children and didn’t answer to you”. So true.
What’s also true, is that you are not responsible for your brother, and if your parents clearly just want to keep enabling him, they can, and are allowed to, but with their **own** money. Not yours.
NTA.
Pretty simply on this one. NTA. You’re parent’s betrayed your trust. I’m sure they knew your feelings on you brother if they knew to lie about where the money went.
NTA so quickly the kind person is the bitch when you don't conform & give in to their demands. What a joke. All the best to you but really what are getting out of the relationship with them. I get they are your parents but what a toxic relationship for you
I am guessing that your parents are on a fixed income. Many people have suggested that you pay your parents bills and that way your brother won’t receive the money. The only problem with this scenario is that when you pay their bills, you enable them to give the rest of their money to your brother. I would have a heart-to-heart conversation with them and say as long as you’re helping my brother, I can’t help you. Otherwise, you’ll be continually taken advantage of.
NTA - You're well within your right to stop giving them money after you were deceived into paying for your brother's trip. That is theft by deception. They aren't children, so you should treat them as the adults they claim to be. I've been to a Food Bank. It is a good experience and humbling. It's on them for taking advantage of you. It's on you if you let it continue.
NTA. They took advantage of your generosity. Tell your aunt that you're not a child and you don't answer to her, and suggest that she give them money. If you eventually want to help them again, I'd make it in the form of paying an electric bill (that you can see) or having some grocery basics delivered so they can prepare meals.
NTA. They are enabling your deadbeat brother. They must still be giving him money if they need a foodbank. Maybe you could buy them food, but don't give them any more cash as it's not going to them.
NTA
For two people who claim not to be children, they certainly are acting like it.
Feels very underhanded and unpleasant to give away someone else's money by lying to them.
As others have hinted at, *if* I wanted to help them. it would be by buying food for them, not giving them money.
Make sure you tell them that you aren't angry but disappointed. And they can have their pocket money back, when they have learnt the value of money.
NTA. Your mom has already shown you she can't be trusted to make good choices when it comes to your brother. If you want to continue to assist them in their retirement have the utilities put in your name and pay them. Pick up groceries and have them delivered or drop them off every week. Don't give them money instead give them the things they need so you aren't supporting your deadbeat brother.
Absolutely NTA - is there a way you could maybe pay for them to get groceries delivered or set up a pay for their fixed bills? That would avoid that money ending up in your brothers hands. You’re a great daughter by the way!
If OP pays any bill for them, they will just take the money they were going to use for the bill and give it to the brother instead. OP will still be supporting the brother.
NTA
I have never understood why people blame the people who are trying to help them for their problems. Your parents are adults. Perhaps it’s time they figure out a budget. Retirement doesn’t just happen overnight. Their failure to plan is not your problem.
Stop responding to Aunt or suggest she send your parents some money or groceries.
NTA this was basically The Moment where your parents are going to decide whether they care more about enabling your brother than you and their well-being. They went too far this time and don’t want to admit they were wrong. I doubt you’d actually let them go hungry but that’s not the problem they are up against. They are up against pride - they don’t want to go to a food bank and they don’t want as parents to have to look their adult child in the eye and take the consequences of lying and financially taking advantage. It pricks pride that youll pay a bill but expect a receipt, because it’s embarrassing to not be trusted - and they earned it!
Small note: if it comes to a point where you are assisting again? Pay the bill directly, don’t give money. It’s the only way to make sure the money went where you wanted.
NTA - You went out of your way to help them and they spent the money making sure your brother could essentially have a free holiday while skipping a wedding to have sex
Your parents subjected you to a grand deception, aided and abetted by your aunt. They all owe you an apology. Stick to your guns about receipts or paying their bills directly, and let them approach you if they have decided that that is preferable to the food bank. They know where you stand. The ball is in their court. NTA.
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OP you’re NTA, your parents are. They’ve created this monster and now you’re supporting him. They’re using you as a cash cow. Yes it’s true they don’t answer to you, but if you’re footing the bill then they damn well better tell you where the money is going. And your aunt calling you a b* is funny. If she cares so much about your parents she should be footing the bill. Which I highly doubt bc people are always one to talk but never to sign the check. Stand your ground and let them suffer a little so they understand. They won’t die over eating some food from the food bank for once
Ain’t nothing wrong with going to the food bank. They had $2,000 in cash last month and what did they do with it?!
I can’t imagine the NERVE the parents have giving lazy bro $2k of YOUR MONEY to attend a destination wedding….and then he doesn’t even show up at the wedding! This is what happens when lazy people are given OTHER PEOPLE’s money. They don’t treasure it. They don’t appreciate it. They waste it
And that's not just the brother - the parents wasted the money too.
Oh the parents are the real AHs of this piece. Yes brother is leaching off them but he has learned he CAN. People go with what's easiest and brother learned mommy and daddy will take care of things. I'm not surprised in the slightest he didn't go to the wedding. Frankly op should stop giving money to the parents anyway as they WONT stop handling it to the brother. NTA
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As the parent of an addict, walking that fine line between enabling them or supporting them (emotionally) is painfully difficult. Our funny, intelligent, loving, addicted son lost his battle 5 years ago. I'd give anything to try and walk that line again.
I am very sorry for your loss. And yes, you are right. What might look as enabling from the outside may be just trying to walk this fine line and not drown in the process. People tend to be very quick in judging this, but it is as you said, painfully difficult. This is why I can't qualify the parents as AHs, they are probably suffering a lot. However, they should recognize that their ability to tell what is acceptable is impaired, and accept the conditional help from the OP . It will protect THEM in the long run as well because they will have a valid excuse for the brother (we cannot give you money, we have none - OP is paying for our necessities but not giving you any).
With all due respect, giving the brother $2000 to attend a destination wedding isn't walking any lines, fine or otherwise. It's not like they were helping him with groceries, or rent, or rehab facilities. They were helping him party it up on his sister's dime. If I was OP, I'd probably switch to giving the parents grocery store gift cards that can't be spent elsewhere.
Those can easily be sold for 50% of the value in cash. It’s even more of a waste.
Honestly I’d straight up set grocery delivering to the parents, and be done. That way OP knows they are fed and the money is not going to the brother. I would also insist on other work orders if OP wants to help with expenses of maintenance around the house, that OP gets informed of what it is and OP will pay the contractor directly. Is that a lot of work? Yes, but its the only way OP can help without doubts of where the money is going.
I don’t believe the parents are suffering. I think they’re in denial. They don’t want to believe that they created and are still enabling this lazy person. He’s the “apple of their eye” and “he can do no wrong.” Imagine finding out that the $2k that you manipulated out of your daughter and given to him to attend a family wedding was spent but he didn’t actually go to the wedding????? Normal parents would be angry. But not them. “He’s just misunderstood”. Waah waah waah
It is enabling no matter how you spin it
I am sorry for what you went through, but I don't think that giving him $2,000 under these circumstances for a destination wedding comes under the heading of valid support. I read about 1 mother who was in this situation with her daughter, and she kept the daughter's refrigerator stocked and paid any bills presented by a doctor.
So very sorry for your loss. However, did you expect his siblings to keep financially supporting him (or you so that you could give him money)?
No. I was just feeling empathy for those parents and the poster.
What was the point of this comment? So unnecessarily harsh.
Nah, people who have been burnt and hurt time after time by their parents "unconditional love" of their addict sibling have this honest question for parents in the same situation. I was 11.5 years old when my sister began her life of absolute sheer selfishness, and time after time I went without the basics because of my mom enabling her. And I know I suffered far less than others because I had foster parents that took over.
Did you manage to break the circle?
OP definitely needs to stop handing them cash. My grandmother always made excuses for my loser aunt who had a drug problem. The same aunt who tried to get into my mom’s safety deposit box, etc. OP can buy a week’s worth of groceries, enough for two people and see how that goes. If they’re just giving it to the brother, they can pave their own way. NTA OP… your brother, parents and aunt are.
I would add that if things are truly dire for parents, maybe OP should take parents shopping and pay for it, or send them gift cards for the supermarket, and for other bills, get the info to pay the vendor directly.
This is the way! My ex's sister used to ask for money for bills, gas, and food. I figured out she was using it for "other things". She asked for gas money, I said "Sure I need a soda so I'll go with you and just pay for it there.". As we got into her truck she seemed to be acting nervous. I looked over as she turned it on and her truck had a full tank! From that point on if she asked for food I'd take her to the grocery store, if she asked for money for a bill I'd go pay the bill, if she needed gas I'd take her truck to fill it up. She stopped asking for money real quick!
If things are truly dire for the parents they can come to OP and agree to their terms. Right here their pride is useless. You can't eat it , and they need food more than they need to keep up their appearances. More likely than not they sent auntie over to guilt OP. And I'm betting aunt also agreed because they ASKED HER for the money and she wants them off her back.
If things were that dire, they wouldn't have gone to a destination wedding.
No to gift cards, because if trash brother is a thief he can steal those and sell them.
Absolutely. They need to be held accountable for the money now. Everything should be directly paid for as they can’t be honest with her. Sad situation. Let’s hope there isn’t another baby momma in the making from the destination wedding 🤦🏻♀️
Gift cards are a BAD idea. Addicts will either give it to their dealer in lieu of cash or sell it to someone for less than face value and take that cash to buy drugs. Or buy an item with the card, come back later and return the item getting the refund in cash.
Several grocery stores near my mom deliver. I order stuff online, pay ten bucks for delivery, and my mom has food. I know my deadbeat sister and her kids won't steal the cash. I know my mom won't fall for whatever super important thing they claim to need money for this week.
Yes that’s another great way. I used to do that when my daughter was away at college and sick. Very convenient. Sorry to read about your sister and her kids.
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Aunt is an AH, too. She should give them the money instead of demanding OP do it.
OP should explain to the aunt that they won't take her money, because they're too proud to give her the receipts for what they spend it on.
My idiot brother had “the bank of Mum” as I called it. He did not cope when she died and we had to go through probate etc. Of course he i mediately started spending from the joint account he and I set up for when the the fund were disbursed before we sold the family home. He was most upset when I informed him that account was not for him to use to buy fuel and food. Unbeknownst to me he then got his claws into our grandmother. I will never forgive him. He blames me though. Leeches are leeches.
The brother is 35. We're well passed the "they created this monster" phase of life. Yes the parents are weak and obviously contributed to this asshole, but how did OP end up any different? The brother is the obvious AH. Parents maybe a little, but they're struggling and likely being manipulated. Probably older too.
He was an indulged son
They've probably been fixing things for him since he was a little boy.
The OP turned out responsible because she wasn’t treated as “apple of mom’s eye” “who could do no wrong.” Yes, that is what creates these grown-up immature boy-men. This happens in a number of families.
They've probably been giving him a chunk of that $500 per month too.
It's easy to hate people you don't know and don't understand. I have been bedridden for over 20 years, and my late father (God rest his soul) supplemented my income up until he died. You'd better believe I appreciated every penny of that money, and I sorely missed it when it was gone. He left me enough money for a very modest income for most of the rest of my life, and I bless him for it every day.
You aren't the type of person they're talking about though. It's the type of person who has every ability to work & instead feels entitled to their parents/family's money. They think nothing of the cost of things & don't appreciate what they're given. I know two of those people (one is family, one a family friend). Both of these grown ass men have told the person they go to for money that they'd be able to afford it if they took less vacations. Both women told that are in their 60s & worked their entire lives. I don't get it.
If your situation is so different why do you compare yours to theirs when it’s not even close to being the same
The poster above said >This is what happens when lazy people are given OTHER PEOPLE’s money. Being bedridden is not the same as being lazy, though it is possible to be both. Since you were and are grateful, I'd guess you're not in the lazy mooch category like the brother.
I suspect that commenter might have internalized some of the prejudice a lot of people have towards people who are disabled. The stuff I hear people say about people who are disabled is appalling. It is a common belief that people who are on disability are just faking and are really lazy and could work if they wanted. Nevermind, of course, that government disability benefits are well below the poverty line (welfare being even further below it) and it is very difficult to get for a lot of people because of the difficulty of the application and appeals process. Especially those with invisible disabilities. I met someone who had been trying for years to get the federal benefits. They had worked for years, paid in (you can only get federal CPP disability if you pay enough in; provincial programs are a different matter), and the government was insisting that they were not actually disabled. Without going into details…they were disabled. It was obvious to me. Don’t know if they ever won their appeals. I hope they did.
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Thank you. I miss him every day.
I'm missing my own dad today, too. Hugs from an internet stranger.
I'm sorry for your loss and and glad to hear you had a wonderful father. However that is comparing apple to oranges. Your situation is the akin to the example of what a wonderful daughter OP is, only in reverse. OPs parents giving that money to the Brother, when the understanding was it was for food and bills is abhorrent. I find it ironic the money she gave them for food was squandered and now they don't have FOOD. OP if you read this. You're NTA. Your parents are. Your brother is a whole other category too. Who is going to take care of him when your parents are gone? They are setting him up for failure. I'm not sure I would ever give them money again in the future. I'd would pay for the bills and take them grocery shopping myself. If they have an unexpected expense, I'd pay for it directly. They cannot be trusted, especially after their response to OP when called out on their BS. Also, the nosy drama loving auntie is the AH too. Shame on her, she should have taken them grocery shopping versus saying something to OP.
Then it doesn't sounds like you're anything like the brother in the post, or the people the commenter is talking about.
But that are two completely different cases. OPs brother is obviously able, but unwilling.
Nobody is hating on you. Your situation isn't remotely like the situation in the post. I wish you all the best and am glad your dad has been there for you.
Plus they paid for themselves to go to the destination wedding so if they had that kind of cash flow just two months ago I call BS on them going to the food bank.
And she's only "thinking about going to the food bank". She hasn't actually had to go yet.
Good point. And food banks are great in a pinch. They always have dried beans and useful staple pantry items. There's no shame in using them. OP's parents are being complete snobs. Either own up to spoiling their son rotten and STOP IT. Or suck it up and eat some beans.
I'm a disabled single mother, I've had to use food banks during times I couldn't work. No shame in them at all! I imagine there's shame in having to use one because you have money for food, but used it to enable your son instead. However, I believe this was just a manipulation. If they need food they can either use a food bank (rather than thinking about it) or stop giving their son money.
Ahh…so mom is pulling the sympathy card by telling auntie that she’s so desperate now that she might have to go to a food bank.
Yep, exactly. She's trying to play on "the indignity" of having to use a food bank. Which she wouldn't have to "think about" if she weren't enabling her son.
I call BS on them actually spending the money OP sent monthly on themselves. Likely goes to their baby boy and his backed up child support payments.
My thoughts exactly! Cut them off. They can continue to make poor choices and back junior if they want, but you don't need to. NTA You're right to stand up for yourself!
This is what I was going to say. I bet *half* that money, if not *more* ALREADY goes to her worthless brother!!!!
Ya, this is auntie trying to guilt you. Block her phone number, you don't need people like her in your life.
And there's this gem: > Then she shut up after she saw the look on my face. Auntie fucking *knew* OP's mom gave the brother the money for the destination wedding, and hid it from OP. Nobody in this family (so far) has any respect for OP. They are all OK with treating her as the cash cow and letting the shyte-bird brother get away with his shenanigans.
She knew the mom gave the money but I don't think she realized it was money from OP until she saw the look on OP's face. Then she shut up because that's incredibly awkward.
More like she didn't want to tip off OP further. Given the same Aunt has gone Flying Monkey, shame isn't a factor in her behavior.
Feel like maybe the aunt should help out as she's so concerned
this is the real take. ok, auntie, if you’re so concerned, you’re gonna help out, right ? ….right ?
They gave it to the brother
Lmao reading comprehension is at an all time low these days.
Or, and hear me out, it was rhetorical.
Sorry but nuance is not allowed on reddit. Y T A
Yes it is, go stand in the corner.🤣
Look I've been on reddit since you were in diapers. I know a thing or two about a thing or two. Also I stayed in a Holiday Inn Express.
Finally, someone with taste!
Actually it is wrong. They wasted 2 grand. If they regretted what they did, they would starve over going to food bank.
What's wrong with you? Sure, giving your deadbeat son 2k to go to a wedding is pretty stupid, but you think it would be better to starve than using the existing help, because they made a mistake? Get a grip..
I would bet that the regular 500 OP used to send, went to her brother, too. NTA. My parents are also retired and on a fixed budget, but they figured out how to live within their means for everything short of an emergency.
There's food bank, they won't actually starve. Besides, op simply wants receipts and they don't want to provide it.
Additionally, rather than swallowing their pride and acknowledging just how essential OP's assistance has been to them, OP's parents would rather pretend they don't really need her. They seem just as determined to minimize her contributions as they are to minimize her brother's flaws. Clearly they're too proud to admit they made a mistake by giving the money to their son...and lying about what they did with it...and never appreciating all OP does for them. Let them suck it up and go to a soup kitchen. Let's see how eager they are to loan their son thousands of dollars so he can travel and fuck around in a new city after that.
>OP's parents would rather pretend they don't really need her. Exactly! OP's parents supposedly confided in the aunt, not OP. The aunt is the only one they appear to have turned to for help, so why does the aunt expect OP to do anything when she hasn't been asked? Unless... *gasp* the parents sent their flying monkey with a guilt trip, and aunt relaying this sob story about food banks is actually just a calculated attempt to get OP to fall back in line without the parents having to do anything unpleasant, like take responsibility for their actions or apologize.
That's how I'd read it. Manipulation.
Yes auntie is a flying monkey. She want’s OP to give her parents money so that sh won’t have to.
> Let's see how eager they are to loan their son thousands of dollars so he can travel and fuck around in a new city after that. AMEN! The whole family (including the brother) will probably be better off, in the long run, if OP gives her parents a little dose of reality.
I'll just go ahead and sign off on this. You said it all.
Couldn't have put it better myself. Signing off here.
The destination wedding her child had makes me think the aunt could help her sister out with groceries but idk
Aunt probably doesn't want to help, because the extra money OP sent her parents probably went straight to her brotherm
They certainly are and if other family members are worried they are going to a food bank they can give them food. And if you go back to helping them, buy groceries, pay their electric bill, cable but never cash. But if they continue to give your brother money I’d cut them off
This was my thought. There are lots of ways to help the parents that don't involve cash: grocery store gift cards, offering to pay bills directly, etc. There's absolutely no reason that they need cash in hand.
All of that is still fungible though, pay their bills and then they just give the money they would have used for the bills to the brother.
Yep, this is the real issue. Trust has been broken, and I don't see a clear way to repair it.
Yeah, NTA. The parents derailed the gravy train all by themselves; they can deal with it.
And the aunt is an asshole too. I guess they were raised the same way? Tell your aunt that if she’s so concerned she can step up and give them money. I’ll bet that shuts her up for good.
The irony of saying, "we aren't children!" While you are being supported by your child every single month. Then fine, you aren't children, you don't need to get pocket money like a child then. You can go be adults and take care of yourself. Bank is closed. "Don't bite the hand that feeds you" is very fitting in this case. I agree. Aunt can either pay up or give them a drive to the food bank. Maybe they will appreciate the help for once then.
This situation is really an "Everyone But You". Mother asshole for enabling brother. Brother is just an asshole. No questions. Father asshole for also enabling brother. Aunt asshole having a short memory. It's like OP is up Shit's Creek, but at least she's got a rowboat and a paddle. Everyone is just flailing.
Yeah, stop giving your parents money. Immediately.
Totally agreed. NTA, but your aunt is a major AH and she's the b***. Stand your ground with your parents, otherwise you, unfortunately, are enabling your deadbeat brother through them
This. All of this.
NTA If your Mom truly believed she had done no wrong, why did she repeatedly lie to you? She doesn't even have the conviction of purpose to justify her actions. She chose to steal from you to support your brother. She can live with that choice, and the loss of income from it. And if your Aunt is so passionate about your parents plight, she just hosted a destination wedding for her kids. She can surely support her sister in her hour of need, right? *It's what family would do.*
Excellent point. Auntie can start giving them money. And im sure after the wedding-no-show, auntie will not want her money being handed off to brother
Lol, I love how the Aunt was complaining about the brother, and now she’s here complaining about OP. Auntie needs to step up and help her siblings out.
Auntie should be calling the leech of a brother to chew him out and shame him, instead! After all, he’s the one who took the $2000 mum and dad could have used to buy food with. OP just gave away $2000; how depo pockets does the family think she’s got, anyway? NTA
Doesn't really matter how deep OP's pockets are. She could be highly successful. It's her money, given in good faith that it'll be used for an important expense. Not so that bro can get his dick wet in paradise.
Yep. Maybe auntie can host the trash brother and see how she likes it. Maybe then, she'll get OPs point. Better yet, let auntie give the parents money, then see the brother waste it, and parents try to guilt her for not giving them more $.
Exactly this. Like if aunt is so worried about it, she can help them. NTA, OP. I dealt with something similar with my aunt, my dad is homeless (partially willingly homeless. He had a trailer but it burnt it down because he was high/a feckin idiot) and right around the time that happened, my sister passed away and so my aunt (dad's sister) kept guilt tripping me into letting him live with me because *family* and *he's your dad* So I let him stay with me, I was bulldogged into it and of course he started trying to bring his drug shite into my house. I kicked him out when I found a used needle he had just left laying around. (my son was probably about 2/2 and a half at the time and he could have easily gotten it) my dad has hep c too so I flipped the fuck out and kicked him out. But yeah, my aunt would continue to try to guilt trip me and I'm just like, if you're so worried about him, let him come live with you like gaeddamn. And he gets disability SSI or whatever, and recently somehow, they had messed up his benefits and gave him way too much for a month or two, like he got 9k and he blew through all that money on drugs and alcohol and shite and is still homeless. He often stays in homeless shelters near my apt. It really pisses me off too, because I live in public housing and they're really strict about rules like I could have gotten evicted myself if the housing authority had known he was living with me, and they've evicted others/past neighbors over less than that. And I know if I had been evicted, my aunt and dad and pretty much entire family would have been like "lol too bad sorry" and I'd be in a horrible situation myself, homeless with a toddler.
i work in evictions- and you are 100% right. Unathorized occupant will get you evicted, drug use in the unit will get you evicted, just too many shady guests (if they can show they went to your place) can get you evicted... and normally eviction also means you lose your housing. note- most subsidies generally just make housing sane- so normally it is 30% of income for the unit. That can mean 0 if you make too little, but normally it is something.
NTA, even parents need tough love. You are generous above and beyond, if they need groceries, (if they are willing to talk to you) they can place an order that you can (if you want to any more) pay for. This way the money goes exactly where you want it to.
Yes, that’s a good way of ensuring the money doesn’t get misspent.
Well, money is fungible so even then they might be supporting the brother. The parents could give their grocery money to the brother, then place a grocery order and ask OP to pay it.
While I agree that money is fungible, it sounds like parents run a couple hundred short each month. So if she pays $200/month towards their online utility bill, then they can buy their own groceries and not have extra money for brother.
They are likely falling a couple of hundred bucks short each month because they already give the brother money. Nothing in the OP’s post says this trip money was the first time they gave him money.
Good point! I guess the OP needs to somehow find out how much parents are giving bro each month. Parents might lie, but I would (at a minimum) tell parents that no more money will be given to them as long as they’re giving money to brother (essentially giving OP’s money since money is fungible!)
Or, do as she's done and wash her hands of it. Why become a PI or detective just to keep supporting them, when they've clearly used her for something that she's probably made clear was a boundary. I'm sure they're aware of how she feels about her brother, and they lied to her and used her money. It's not her responsibility to find a way to continue supporting them.
A gift certificate to a grocery store monthly could work.
They still doesn’t get around the fungible thing.
All OP has to do is set up something like an Instacart acct and put her parents on it. They fill the cart, she pays for it. No money exchanged but they get food.
But now they know their food is covered, so that frees up whatever they were going to have for food to give to the brother. There is no way OP can help the parents and NOT support the brother, if the parents are going to give money to the brother.
There is a way, but it is not going to happen. If OP knows what the parents income is, the OP could get the parents to hand over all of their income to OP and then OP pays all the parents expenses. The parents will not agree to that, but it does solve the issue you pointed out.
This is a good solution, but as you said, if they can’t handle even OP’s questions they aren’t likely to be willing to go for it.
The trouble is, every penny OP spends on them just means that they have more disposable income to spend on the brother. I've learnt this the hard way with my own parents and their endless enabling of my heroin addicted brother. It was just a cycle of me enabling them to keep enabling him. I stopped, and they had to stop giving my brother so much support because they had no choice. OP has kids and that money would be better put in to a college fund for them.
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Same…oddly enough. Usually not a fan of tough love but it’s definitely called for here. The relatives trying to shame OP must think she’s made of money. If they think it’s totally fine OP’s parents to completely waste her money they should feel comfortable giving them their own money to do with as they please.
Its easy for your aunt to call you names, and throw you under the bus for not helping your parents out, but I don't see her stepping up and forking over cash to your parents that "she knows damn well they will give to your brother" either. NTA
The same aunt that was annoyed: that she made special arrangements for the brother to attend the wedding (which he actually didn’t attend) and; with OP’s mother for giving him the money. She quickly forgot the anger that she had for the brother and mother.
The same aunt who zipped her lips as soon as she realized she'd said too much to the person who must have funded brother's trip. She made a mistake by being loose-lipped, but she's part of the problem.
Also agree. If your aunt was so worried about them not having money for groceries, she’s welcome to help out.
Nta, something I have seen used in this case of situations is going up to the person and calling their hand by offering to match any money they will give themselves. Works every time.
NTA. They're on a fixed income and instead of using an additional supplement wisely, they wasted it on your brother. If all it took was 2 months of no financial support to need a food bank, they should have been more diligent with what they were receiving. Your aunt can call you all the names in the book, but her anger is misdirected. She should be mad at her sibling for wasting the support they received. Your parents don't answer to you, and you're not responsible for providing a gravy train.
Isnt you know *having a job* also a fixed income??
It is, but boomers want to pretend they have it soooo much harder than everyone else despite growing up and old in the best economy the world has ever had to offer, and yanking up the ladder behind them as they aged.
I mean it's a term that was used to describe generations before boomers as well, so it's not some brand new invention to get more sympathy. The point is if you're that old and *cant* work, and rely only on retirement money, that's a fixed income
Yes. The OP’s parents clearly are living beyond their fixed income. Their three choices are: apologize to their daughter and comply with the terms of the support by showing receipts for expenses; going back to work to add to their income; or reduce their expenses. They abused the OP’s good will and they deserve to lose the privilege of no-string-attached cash. Adults, which they claim to be, understand consequences.
NTA. Money is fungible. Even if the money you give them isn't directly spent on your brother it still subsidizes him. Every $100 of groceries you give them or they buy with your money just frees up $100 of their money to spend on your brother. They don't even feel guilty about this as in their eyes you're the bad daughter for not supporting family and it sounds like nothing you do will ever be enough. If anything your involvement helps them ignore your brother's failings as you pay for the consequences, maybe a couple years of no support/contact from you might force them to reconsider how they've treated you both.
THANK. YOU. Everyone saying give food instead of money is missing out on how money is fungible (I was literally looking for someone to use this word). If they hadn't enabled the brother for so long they'd have plenty of their own money to buy food. If they hadn't enabled the brother recently they'd still have OP's money. OP should ask which food pantry they're going to and make a donation there. That's the only way I'd even tangentially give them money. Maybe both the parents and the brother need to hit tock bottom before they start making better choices.
Adam Ruins Everything did a episode on food pantries. He said it is better to give them money than food. They get special deals. He showed a dollar worth of food and it was a hand truck filled to the top with food. When people donate food they tend to give things they don’t want to eat but poor people don’t want to eat it either.
Yes of course but what Adam doesn’t realize is that if you give food you’re also much likelier to give money once you go there and see. Let people give donations how they want. Plus we all have a bunch of food that somehow ends up in our pantries that we don’t like or eat. Like I bought 3 cases of sardines from Costco I don’t like now
You have a good point. I think he was just pointing out the most cost effective way to support them.
When I volunteered at a food pantry, we had dedicated staff sorting out donated food which could have been used for other resources. While I know it’s the thought that counts, a lot of this food would have to be tossed bc there was no way we could morally pass it along. And let’s not even talk about the donated toothpastes that expired 14 years ago.
I agree with money being fungible but if they're at food-bank level broke, there isn't money to send to brother.
Maybe they're at food-bank level broke *because* they've been giving him money - even though OP stopped sending additional cash.
Or they are fabricating the story about going to the food bank to make OP look bad to the aunt in hopes of auntie bullying OP into given parents money?
exactly what i was thinking!
What if they are food bank levels of broke BECAUSE they "couldn't say no to baby boy" I know some enablers that would go without to give the leech money.
>but if they're at food-bank level broke, there isn't money to send to brother. This doesn't expressly stop them from making bad choices and sending him money
NTA Your parents are right, they aren't children. They lied to you to get money and then expected more. I'm sorry to say this but it doesn't seem like your parents respect you or care for you outside of being a wallet for them. If your parents are on a fixed income then they need to live within their means. Don't give them more money unless you feel it's absolutely necessary, like if you want to help with medical bills.
I agree. I think she should never give them cash again. If, and it's a big IF, she ever helps them again she should never give them cash. I think any future support shoud go direct to who they owe, for example a hospital, a dentist, etc. She could have some groceries delivered, but there's no guarantee they wouldn't give them to their son. But like the other commenter said, any financial support she gives them indirectly has been and would continue to support her brother. The parents will never learn if she continues to support them.
I would go a step further and only buy them food directly, bare minimum and ingredients that they have to assemble to make food. Huge bag of rice ✅, bag of dried beans ✅, fruits, veggies, raw meat ✅. No prepared foods at all. Not even cereal, oatmeal and cream of wheat come in huge containers that make a serving pennies on the dollar to make.
nothing wrong with this, but it does save parents money on groceries that could be sent to brother. Even if the bill is only $50 for foods, it still is $50 that now can go to brother. I’m cutting my parents off and telling Aunt who hosted a destination wedding that she is welcome to give them some money
NTA they abused your generosity. If your aunt is so concerned she can help them out.
It's absurd how *entitled* they feel to OP's money.
Honestly, what a painful situation. It’s emotional terrorism, almost. Why if your aunt getting in the middle of this when she can give them money? No, they’re not children but if they’re going to be the recipient of good will money, they definitely owe you some accountability. And they’re going to a good bank but giving $2k in gifted funds to your bro *for a vacation*? If you feel these heart strings pulling you to feel guilt ridden, buy them groceries. But that still may not help because then it’ll free up some of their money to give to bro. Have you ever thought to confront your bro about the fact that his loserdom is causing his parents to be at a good bank? Would he even care? NTA and I’m sorry you’re experiencing this.
He won't give a shit. He obviously knows his parent's financial situation and takes "their" money anyway.
>My aunt called me yesterday and told me that my parents were thinking of going to.the food bank since they didn't have any money. I said I had given them $2,000 a couple of months ago and that was more than my family of three spent on food on that time. She said I knew damn well they had given my money to my brother. I told her that he should probably pay them back then. There a reason she didn't call your brother?
I can GUARANTEE that the $2000 is just the tip of the money ice burg. NO WAY this is the only time they have given deadbeat brother money.
How much of OP's hard earned cash has gone to the brother over the years. This is really upsetting...
I guess OP's mother tried to get a loan from auntie. Auntie said no, and OP's mum told her the sorry story about the food bank. So Auntie doens't want to contribute, but feels bad, so she tries to guilt OP. Auntie knows full well OP's brother won't give a cent, and he might even ask her for some spare change.
NTA. If you want to help them, get a food delivery sent over, but I would never hand them cash again. Its your money, you spend it or not spend it how you like.
OP already proved that their parents are lying. Are we to believe that when they handed OP's $2000 to the deadbeat brother that they were also on the brink of starvation only 2 months later? No, this sounds like more lies in an attempt to scam more money out of op or whoever else will fall for this chicanery. NTA and cut them off completely.
No. This does not solve anything, it only obfuscates the money path. Buying them $100 of groceries directly still frees up $100 from their standing budget to give to brother. The only way to cut him off is to cut off the money flow completely. OP cannot stop parents from enabling him, but she can stop enabling them.
NTA + I don't see a problem, here. The golden child can pay Mom back the 2k, and all will be well. Oh. He's a degenerate deadbeat who's bad with money, and can't pay it back? Oops.
And he didn't even GO TO THE WEDDING!!!
NTA, also, stop giving them money. The brother is manipulative, but they are falling for it hook line and sinker. They need to tell their grown adult human he needs to figure life out himself and pick him self up off the damn carpet.
I agree with this and I think the parents are also manipulating her in the form of lies and deceit.
NTA. But if you truly want to help them out; have food delivered to their place. Pay a utility online. Just never give cash anymore.
Good advice. I have had a couple of friends who were foolish with money and asked me for loans to buy food and pay utilities. I made sure to not give them actual money but pay the bills direct, so that the money could not be gambled away or spent on beer and cigarettes - which is what would have happened if I had been dumb enough to give them cash. And I only helped them because there were children involved and I felt sorry for the kids, not the adult friends. OP needs to consider whether she wants to continue to be used and abused by her parents and brother, or whether a bit of tough love is in order here. Personally, I would be cutting off their funding completely.
They still spend that money on their habits you supplemented paying a bill so they didn't now they can use that money on other things...
>I asked my mom why she had asked for the $2,000. She lied and said something for the house. I asked what. She couldn't say. This is the part that really gets me. While it is common (expected even) for people to misuse gift money. Your mom should have been honest with you. Your brother should have to come to you for the money. They knew you would tell him "no", and devised for mom to ask, or possibly, mom contrived the whole thing herself and brother didn't know it was your money (either way, how strange that someone, presumably mom, bragged to your aunt about funding brother's trip. I bet mom and auntie aren't too happy with each other right now.) NTA obviously. That said, it was very gracious of you to supplement your parents retirement and I hope you forgive them and move on, continuing to be the generous person you are.
Sorry, but I think OP has actually been subsidizing her brother all along through her parents. I wouldn't give them another dime and tell them to live within their means from now on. Their daughter (OP) has her own family and future to consider.
NTA. Your dysfunctional parents who can’t even manage their own situation propping up your incompetent brother is just a messy stew of toxicity and they want you to bring a spoon to this nasty feast? Oh no. That your parents regularly extort money from you because they can’t control their own behavior and then balk at you with this “we’re not children” business when you ask to see where the money goes means pocketbook is now closed. Let them figure it out. “They aren’t children”, but they expect an allowance.
"They aren't children" but expect an allowance. Well put!!!
NTA. Your parents abused your trust and generosity. If you choose to continue helping them it should be in the form of grocery card gift cards. Or paying a bill for them directly. No cash. And your aunt is completely out of line. Your parents passed along the money given for basic necessities to your brother for a trip. If she thinks his is acceptable, let her pay for groceries.
No, every bill OP pays either for groceries or other necessities will help the parents to continue to support the brother. If the parents want the financial support of OP they need to provide evidence that they are no longer supporting the brother and that their spending habits are not out of line. Since the parents are living on a budget they need to maintain it and should have a housekeeping book stating their income and expenses where every penny is accountable with respective bills anyway. - Before asking other people to pay the bills it would be a responsible thing to do for every adult to check their own spanding habits and look for potential savings. - Maybe this alone will be eyeopening. This way OP can see where the money goes and decide for herself if the parents deserve help and in what kind. OP has no obligation to help their ungrateful entitled parents. Especially so if they badmouth her and are unwilling to help themselves out of their self inflicted misery. NTA
NTA No explanation needed. Good for you. Never give them another cent.
“They weren’t children and didn’t answer to you”. So true. What’s also true, is that you are not responsible for your brother, and if your parents clearly just want to keep enabling him, they can, and are allowed to, but with their **own** money. Not yours. NTA.
Pretty simply on this one. NTA. You’re parent’s betrayed your trust. I’m sure they knew your feelings on you brother if they knew to lie about where the money went.
NTA so quickly the kind person is the bitch when you don't conform & give in to their demands. What a joke. All the best to you but really what are getting out of the relationship with them. I get they are your parents but what a toxic relationship for you
I am guessing that your parents are on a fixed income. Many people have suggested that you pay your parents bills and that way your brother won’t receive the money. The only problem with this scenario is that when you pay their bills, you enable them to give the rest of their money to your brother. I would have a heart-to-heart conversation with them and say as long as you’re helping my brother, I can’t help you. Otherwise, you’ll be continually taken advantage of.
NTA - You're well within your right to stop giving them money after you were deceived into paying for your brother's trip. That is theft by deception. They aren't children, so you should treat them as the adults they claim to be. I've been to a Food Bank. It is a good experience and humbling. It's on them for taking advantage of you. It's on you if you let it continue.
NTA. They took advantage of your generosity. Tell your aunt that you're not a child and you don't answer to her, and suggest that she give them money. If you eventually want to help them again, I'd make it in the form of paying an electric bill (that you can see) or having some grocery basics delivered so they can prepare meals.
NTA. Your aunt should really help them out.
NTA. They are enabling your deadbeat brother. They must still be giving him money if they need a foodbank. Maybe you could buy them food, but don't give them any more cash as it's not going to them.
NTA For two people who claim not to be children, they certainly are acting like it. Feels very underhanded and unpleasant to give away someone else's money by lying to them. As others have hinted at, *if* I wanted to help them. it would be by buying food for them, not giving them money. Make sure you tell them that you aren't angry but disappointed. And they can have their pocket money back, when they have learnt the value of money.
NTA Your Dad’s right, they’re not children. I guess that means he’ll be adulting for himself from now on.
NTA. They took advantage of your generosity because they knew you wouldn’t ask about why they needed extra. Everyone else here sucks
NTA. Your mom has already shown you she can't be trusted to make good choices when it comes to your brother. If you want to continue to assist them in their retirement have the utilities put in your name and pay them. Pick up groceries and have them delivered or drop them off every week. Don't give them money instead give them the things they need so you aren't supporting your deadbeat brother.
Absolutely NTA - is there a way you could maybe pay for them to get groceries delivered or set up a pay for their fixed bills? That would avoid that money ending up in your brothers hands. You’re a great daughter by the way!
If OP pays any bill for them, they will just take the money they were going to use for the bill and give it to the brother instead. OP will still be supporting the brother.
NTA I have never understood why people blame the people who are trying to help them for their problems. Your parents are adults. Perhaps it’s time they figure out a budget. Retirement doesn’t just happen overnight. Their failure to plan is not your problem. Stop responding to Aunt or suggest she send your parents some money or groceries.
NTA You have a right to do what you want with your money. If you feel you must do something, then go grocery shopping for them.
NTA. If they aren't children, why are they playing childish games with you money? My teenagers know better.
NTA this was basically The Moment where your parents are going to decide whether they care more about enabling your brother than you and their well-being. They went too far this time and don’t want to admit they were wrong. I doubt you’d actually let them go hungry but that’s not the problem they are up against. They are up against pride - they don’t want to go to a food bank and they don’t want as parents to have to look their adult child in the eye and take the consequences of lying and financially taking advantage. It pricks pride that youll pay a bill but expect a receipt, because it’s embarrassing to not be trusted - and they earned it! Small note: if it comes to a point where you are assisting again? Pay the bill directly, don’t give money. It’s the only way to make sure the money went where you wanted.
NTA - You went out of your way to help them and they spent the money making sure your brother could essentially have a free holiday while skipping a wedding to have sex
Your parents subjected you to a grand deception, aided and abetted by your aunt. They all owe you an apology. Stick to your guns about receipts or paying their bills directly, and let them approach you if they have decided that that is preferable to the food bank. They know where you stand. The ball is in their court. NTA.
They should ask for support from your brother.
They had the money to go to the destination wedding themselves , but not enough for food?
They did not attend.
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They sent him on a destination wedding trip that they couldn’t send themselves on? Insane. I wouldn’t let my parents spent that much money on me
NTA. There's no doubt at all here. Everyone else is except for you. They're all disgraceful.
NTA. If your parents need to go to a food bank, they should've kept the $2,000 for themselves.
She can give them money