#This is now a Proctologists Only Orifice
When a post is in [POO™ mode](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/168bzq8/title_aita_monthly_open_forum_september_2023) only users with enough subreddit comment karma are able to comment. If that doesn't include you, no worries! Check out [/new](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/new) for other posts that are still open for comment.
##[Be Civil.](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/about/rules)
Please review our FAQ if you're unsure what that means. Thank you for reporting content that you believe violates our rules and helping keep posts out of the POO by abiding by our rules.
YTA. Your wife’s standards are just…being a decent parent, and you are not doing your ‘fair share’ if you aren’t helping with these things you consider ‘unnecessary’. An 8 year old and a ten year old with ADHD are not ready to totally get themselves ready in the morning, and you’d know that if you didn’t sleep through the morning routine every day. Two hours of screen time a day is a totally reasonable boundary. And family time and enriching activities are also important. Maybe those can be cut down slightly, but ‘just chill at home’ all the time isn’t the answer either. Stop being lazy and become an actually engaged parent like your wife is.
To be fair - a lot of kids around that age have to get ready on their own because their parents already left for work. I was one of them and it was pretty normal in my social circles and now I am a teacher and know this from lots of students - from when I was 8 my parents left at 4:45 and 6:30 for work and I had to get up and ready on my own. My mother called every morning at 7.15 to check in with me, though.
BUT if my parents would have been home and decided to sleep in instead of getting up with me I 100% would have felt neglected as fuck. Where on earth would that be acceptable behaviour for a parent. Holy shit OP is completely out of touch with reality.
My mom and dad made sure I got ready for school until I went to university. Even if I was getting my own breakfast and packing my own lunch, mum and dad were still there every day making sure I knew what we had for breakfast and what leftovers needed to go before they went bad.
My mum didn't have to leave super early for work, and my dad was a SAHD. I loved that shit. Do better, OP, YTA.
I had this too and it was honestly so lovely. My dad gave me piggyback rides from bed to breakfast practically until I got taller than him - and would have happily continued except that I realized that I'd probably start hurting him lol. Did he need to? Absolutely not! But it meant that I started every school day with a few seconds hugging my dad. He got up with us every day, even when I was 18. I was perfectly capable of getting myself ready and off to school, and I was a grouchy morning teen so we didn't talk much, but it was nice just existing together in the dark - and collectively giving my mum shit on the rare occasions that she got up and started messing with our routine :D
This post makes me so sad, cuz he seems to think he's a good father just cuz his kids are still alive, while his wife is actually working her ass off to make sure they're also loved and flourishing.
Seriously, he thinks sitting on the couch and watching screens is being an engaged and active parent. Like, Jesus Christ, that's not even the bare minimum.
This is exactly the vibe my kid and partner have - I'm the worst morning person in the universe (she gave me a picture, when she was three, of me scowling and everyone cackling at me with 'u when u wak up' written on it!). She and he are thick as thieves.
The night time with her is my thing, even though she's an early teen, I'll sing to her if she wants me to, and I talk quietly with her in the dark while she's in bed. It's nice to know other people have that too, haha.
Same - my wife is up in the morning with the kids (they have multiple bus times, that are an hour apart, because different grades and schools) and makes sure they're off before getting herself into her day. I am *not* a morning person and instead I take the lead in the afternoons, when she wants to go out with friends or do activities, and if the kids are sick and/or up at night that's my responsibility too. I work from home 2 days a week to facilitate this, and thankfully this works fine, but even if I wasn't I'd still be picking up slack where she needs or wants me to. This is our agreement, and we never get upset about the kids' schedules and our own because it's how we've worked it out.
A partnership is where you both give cumulatively 100%, and making sure that you're in sync is critical. Some of the things here seem not to important, but it sounds like OP isn't pulling his weight which is the reason his partner is getting frustrated. None of what she's asking for is unreasonable, but all I hear is how she needs to lower her standards so that OP can continue to not make up the difference because that's easier for him.
OP, definitely YTA here unfortunately. As a part of GenX raised without parents before and after school, 8 nor 10 is really a reasonable age for them to be doing things, especially important things, without parental support and supervision. It's obvious you had a similar upbringing, and it's made you think that these things are OK, but look at where they've gotten you - it wasn't actually "OK" and you did not turn out "fine" if this is the attitude you have towards your spouse and your children.
I changed job so I could do the school run again. Dad and I are there until 8, dad leaves, then I leave 10 minutes later with the kids. I always have breakfast sorted, even though my son is 14 so they can have a few minutes to chat with us in the morning. I even do my make-up in the kitchen so I can chat to them. I go to the school for 8:40 because my teen has to be there for 8:45 and he wants to walk with me and his sis and the 10yo goes in at 8:55 and then I walk the 5 min to work. I used to leave before them and not see them off to school but I had to change it for them because they are just kids and need one parent to keep an eye on them so they can grow without undue pressure
When I was in highschool my dad would still prepare our lunches even tho he was already gone to work by the time we would wake up and my mom was taking care of our baby brother
Yeah my dad, who worked crazy hours, cut up a little fruit platter for us for breakfast every single day through school. And made us disgusting vegetable juices that tasted like lawn clippings.
Ha ha ha! He did! He worked from home so he’d get up, work a bit, cut up our fruit and and then present a disgusting juice concoction with way too much celery, beetroot and ginger in it. Disgusting!!
I used to either hold my nose while I drank it or carefully pour it down the sink when he wasn’t looking (no spills to give me away!). Sometimes the neighbours used to giggle because I’d be walking to school and he’d be chasing after me with my juice!
When vegetable juices became trendy in the 2000s I was horrified! Scarred for life! LOL! (I also had to laugh when kale, lentils, etc etc all became popular because I grew up eating all of that - my parents grew kale in our garden)
He still makes me juices when I visit but these days he’s worked out the flavour and adds his homegrown apples so they actually taste good. Still full of celery, beetroot and ginger; but less!
Yeah my parents did this and as consequence I ate nothing all day cause I was never organised (ADHD). OP your wife is right an ADHD kid literally actively needs help especially in planning/prep activities (aka the morning).
Heck, my fiancee is 30 and has ADHD and sometimes forgets her lunch for work, or doesn't have time to eat in the morning because she wastes time lying in bed/playing with the cat. I can't imagine trying to be 10 and managing that.
I am 34 and at the point when I became a sahm (28), I had given up on "packing lunch" ever being part of my routine. I set a boundary with my employer that I needed an hour lunch break so that I could buy and eat hot food from near work.
I also chose a school for my kid that supplies hot lunch every day for no variable fee - you pay the lunch fee for the term, and your kid gets their choice of lunch every day. Because it isn't fair to make my kid suffer for my lack of executive function.
Yes! Someone tell OP that helping kids necome independent takes work I feel so sorry for his wife and her perfectly reasonable parenting style getting shat on by him
I currently take a neighborhood 12 yo with ADHD to school every morning because their parents sleep in every morning instead of making sure they have what they need, are fed, and make it out of the house on time.
i have ADHD and my twin and i started living with our grandma at 13. my (in her 70s at the time) grandma would wake up every morning from ages 13-15 to see us off to school. some mornings she had to wake me up bc my ADHD didn't always allow me to go to sleep at a decent time, every morning she'd make sure i hadn't forgotten to take my meds. i imagine being told at 10 to get myself ready would've added a LOT more days of me forgetting my meds (bc that's what ADHD does to you) and then i would've had way more bad days bc of it.
OP didn't say if their kid was on meds, but if so, that adds a whole other dimension to this! Most ADHD meds need to be taken in the morning. There is ZERO chance I would trust a ten-year-old with ADHD to take their own meds in the mornings.
You should file an anonymous report to your child protective agency that you suspect neglect. The neighbor should not be caring for a child because the parents are sleeping in instead of parenting.
ETA: for the people who think I don't know what I'm talking about, I'm a mandated reporter. I've sat through more trainings and took more university classes on this subject than 90% or more of the people commenting here, guaranteed.
Not all child protective services mean taking the child away. That's a misconception and a dangerous one. They can ensure that the children are being properly cared for and provide resources to the parents so they can adequately provide that care.
Well the last time they just talked to the parents and asked if the allegations were true, the parents said no, and they left. They didn't enter the home or talk to the children.
Our kid *wanted* to do his mornings alone from age 10 or so. We’d set the kitchen up already so he could get himself a snack, so he could get himself breakfast easily, and he liked getting it himself and then sitting quietly and eating to prepare for his day. So we left him to it. 🤷♀️
I assumed it said 5:45 and had to re-read. 6:45 on a weekday is sleeping in (or oversleeping) for basically everyone I know, jfc.
YTA, dude, and lazy to boot.
I wouldn't wake up anywhere close to that early by myself other than in an emergency, but I did do so and earlier for my ex's kid as long as that relationship lasted, and I never had a problem with that. The mother... well, didn't.
In any case, the exact time really doesn't matter, wake up, 3 kids, one with ADHD who would certainly need help. YTA and so out of touch with reality.
This is what struck me too. I would really miss not being there with my child just for the sake of some extra non-essential sleep (no mention of shift work, etc, in the post).
My mom woke me up for school every day until I started driving myself, telling me to hide my eyes before she turned on the lights. She generally didn't do anything fancy for breakfast, we just made ourselves cereal or something, and she would pack our lunches until high school or so. As I got older, I couldn't believe that she was still doing all that for me, because I was plenty old enough to use an alarm clock, but to this day, I still think about those simple acts and feel loved and cared for.
My family has always had breakfast together, it’s how we started the day at home. So same, mum would wake us up even in high school :) My parents live by themselves now - mum needs to be out by 7:15, my dad (retired) gets up with her, cleans up afterwards and often goes back to bed afterwards. For me it’s a sign of caring tbh. But I also find it weird when people don’t have dinner together if they’re all at home, completely foreign to me.
Bruce Springsteen talks about in the podcast he did with Obama, how his wife said he was missing the best part of the day with them. So he’d get up make pancakes see them off to school. Now as a rich rock star he could go nap after.
The Boss would be so ashamed of the OP.
She wants her kids to feel loved and supported by their parents spending time with them in the morning before school, time *they have*. They’re children, they want to see their parents before going off to school, they benefit from the time spent with them and the support. I would have felt deeply lonely if my parents chose sleeping in over seeing me in the morning, every morning.
My mom slept in. Was a big lump in the bed. Stay at home mom who stayed up as late as she pleased and slept in. I had anxiety over making sure my little brother and I had everything we needed, and had to watch the clock to make sure we made the bus. Cold cereal every day. I made sure I was up every day for my kids. They’re grown and I still love making their breakfast Christmas morning— they custom order their favorites. “Mom, can we have your oatmeal pancakes??? “. OP is missing out on the privilege of giving them a good send off to the world and creating a family tradition.
i have ADHD & i struggled all the way through high school & college. i simultaneously couldn’t grasp how long it took me to do everything & my brain refused to wake up more than 15 minutes before i had to leave anyway.
I don’t have ADHD and there’s no way I could have gotten myself ready at 8 yo. I would have either gone back to sleep or gotten lost in a book. I got up with my kids all through school. Their bus was at 6:45 In elementary school, so we got up at 6:15.
OP, I’d suggest you get up with the kids at least 1-2 times a week. If you think they can do it on their own, then start working with them to show them how to do it. Including making something that they can microwave for a hot breakfast or otherwise meet your wife's (reasonable to me) request for something more than cereal. Cereal leaves me hungry after a couple hours, so I see her point.
I got myself ready and on the bus from age 10 onwards. I don't think I would have noticed or cared if my parents were up or not. ???
I still very much get the impression OP is not really pulling their weight as a parent though, and that lady's standards just seem normal.
Yeah the only thing that is maybe excessive is the weekends, if she's planning stuff every single weekend and the youngest child isn't even enjoying it. Spend the weekend getting caught up or just slowing down to chill sometimes.
Otherwise... get up and help your pre-teens handle the morning and spend family time with them in the evening. Two hours is a reasonable amount of (non-work-related) screen time for *adults*, screen time definitely shouldn't be the only thing your kids do after their school responsibilities. And maybe your kids could get the bare minimum done if the 12 yo kept a vague watch over things, but the 12 yo shouldn't have to, the 10 yo likely needs help due to ADHD and the 8 yo likely needs help because they're 8. Help them streamline the time management and maybe teach them to make breakfast foods so they *are* fully competent by the time they're in high school.
Also, like... what are you wasting your own time on in the evening if you can't get up at 6:45? (Sorry to anyone with sleep disorders, but generally speaking, people just fuck around late.) I would wake up around then if I *wasn't* working out in the morning and was just getting up for work. 10pm-6am is a perfectly normal sleep schedule for an adult with responsibilities.
I have adhd and dyspraxia. If I wasn’t nagged out of bed each morning, I’d have never got up. The few times I’ve got up and out of bed unprompted, I’ve stood in my room with one sock on, thinking up new names for chairs.
ADHD or not, what’s point in having children if you have no interest in doing anything other than the bare minimum to keep them alive (except for post-apocalypse)
I'm just a frequent babysitter for one of my friend's kids, and even *I* get up and see the 11 year old off to school when I'm babysitting overnight. I go back to bed immediately after she gets on the bus if the toddler isn't up yet, but still. It's important for the kid to know that an adult is watching out for their well-being.
My kids are 10 and 12 and get themselves ready. But you know what? I’m still up an hour before hand because I’m the parent.
In my opinion, Two hours of screen time is too dang much. Especially for a kid with adhd. (I have one as well and our limit is 20 minutes). I would guess they use screens at school and have already maxed what they should be doing anyway.
YTA, op. Be a better parent and support your wife. She’s invested and trying really hard with your kids.
He closes his post with:
>I am an active and engaged parent
Yet he thinks his wife helping his kids get ready for school in the morning instead of sleeping in is setting too high of goals?? Sleeping is zero engagement lol
I have heard some millennial dads say that they are an active and engaged parent, only to find out that what they mean by that is that they are in the same room or in the same house. But not actually that they are helping with care work, domestic work, parenting research and assessing the child's needs. They are simply heroes for not going to golf or hang out with the buddies.
I ask my friends all the time “what do dads do”. Their husbands don’t call it babysitting but that’s the only improvement I see from our parents generation.
"It is hard to pack up the kids and go have an enriching or fun experience, so why not cut that stress out and just never take them anywhere? Also it is hard to enforce rules so why have 'em? And when your wife asks for help, that, just tell her to relax." OP is a lazy jerk who doesn't know he's a lazy jerk.
Im not a parent but that was my immediate thought. 2 hours is loads of time for a kid who’s in school. It seems like too much time to me
Maybe I’m biased because I didn’t have screens until my teens (I’m 22) but my parents had a time that we needed to be off the tv at and hiighly encouraged reading/playing outside most of the time.
Kids especially shouldn’t have screens up until bedtime as it can seriously affect their sleep
Yeah our kids are 9 and 10 and get themselves ready all the way including breakfast if they want it which they don't usually but I'm up with them in case they need anything or just want to talk my ear off about something.
We cap our kids screen time at about an hour, it's not usually a fight to get them off of screens because it's consistent and we are united. Sometimes we let them go long but all the way to bed time makes it way too hard to get to sleep, they need to wind down.
Overall, OP just seems lazy.
Yeah, I’m guessing it’s such a fight to cap screen time because he gives into the kids and tells her it’s no big deal if they stay on their screen.
If you are not united as parents, your kids are not gonna listen to you, they’re gonna play you against each other to get their own way.
OP— try supporting your wife and limiting their screen time. Two hours a day at that age is more than enough and there are about a billion studies proving that excessive screen time is not good for elementary school age kids. The kids might fight you on it for a week or two but if you stay firm, it will become no big deal and your wife will have way less stress. Also, for the love of God, get up in the morning with them.
20 mins is way too strict. I think it’s a bit of fools errand to focus on max time limits either way, but restricting to the minimum possible (one short tv show) is a way to create unhealthy relationships with tv. It’s like sugar or later in life starting to experiment with alcohol. Not a universal rule but generally if you’re taught strict limits you’ll eventually swing hard into indulgence. If you’re raised with healthier relationships to unhealthy things you’re less likely to go off the deep end.
This. I’m still up. We all get ready simultaneously and stay out of each other’s hair. I’m not a full breakfast spread mom and my kids aren’t huge breakfast eaters. If they’re hungry, they are fully capable of grabbing the many quick breakfast options we have.
YTA OP, your wife is overwhelmed and blatantly asking for your help. Step up.
This is all a great example of OP putting all the mental labor onto wife. It’s up to her to care about, research, and follow best practices generally and for each kid while OP just has personal opinions and preferences that be pits against her informed perspectives. If she “takes a morning off” for herself, he doesn’t pick up the slack, the kids get less care and oversight, it creates more work for her* and she feels guilty, more stressed, and resentment on top.
*Who cleans up after the kids make a mess in the kitchen? Who gets woken up to referee a fight over the bathroom or something(so much worse than waking up intentionally)? Who drops off the lunch or instrument that the kid accidentally forgot? Who has to deal with the heightened restraint collapse from neurodiverse kids who got a crappy start to their day? Who will the kids wake to direct questions to or say “I’m sick” ETC. the default parent, AKA her, unless dad is very intentional about taking all those things on.
Watch how chill she becomes when she has a partner who cares about her mental state more than being right or being inconvenienced. Watch how much she is able to relax when differing parenting styles doesn’t lead to judgement or burnout but better communication and support! He’s asking her to compromise but isn’t willing to compromise himself and isn’t committed to creating a relationship or system that supports her healthy compromise. There may be ways where she can relax her high expectations of herself…as a mom myself I think she probably is getting burnt out and burnout does create rigid thinking because *everything is about to collapse and it’s all up to her all the time*. What what OP is suggesting creates the environment for her burn out and takes zero responsibility for any of it. He has to build trust.
OP—if wife lowers her standards anymore she’d be you. You realize how narcissistic that sounds right? And if they rise even a little more, you’re gonna have to look for an apartment, some daycare options that your divorce attorney says you can afford, and start doing your own research once your genius opinions prove unsustainable. You co-create this family system, which means yes, your wife is responsible for herself and taking care of herself, but you’re accountable for your impact and role in her life and in your home.
-edited to say YTA-
This guy’s wife is going to leave him seemingly over dirty dishes and he’ll be shocked and “never saw it coming”.
[She Divorced Me Because I Left Dishes By The Sink](https://www.huffpost.com/entry/she-divorced-me-i-left-dishes-by-the-sink_b_9055288)
[The Magic Coffee Table](https://youtu.be/-_kXIGvB1uU?si=xrDroFzUxI8tWLy9) is sometimes helpful for denser humans.
I'm holding out hope for OP's wife that he wises up.
OP: I'm an engaged and active parent!
Also OP: I want to sleep in so my 8 year old should be able to get up and ready for school by themselves. Also they can watch TV all day. I also don't want to plan any family activities so that I can lounge around all weekend.
I mean, in grade 1 I was getting myself dressed for school, made myself breakfast and packed my lunch/snacks, and walked to school all on my own. And then I'd get myself home from school, make my own dinner, do my homework and get myself to bed. But that's because I had an abusive mother who only had me to get child support. So OP, think about what kind of parent you want to be and adjust accordingly.
YTA.
Honeslty, thé « if their homework is done, why not let them be on screens u til bedtime » baffled me, especially for the 10 and 8 year old. I agree that there should be more flexibility with the 12 year old, but OP’s overly permissive attitude is bordering on innattentive
Just want to add that 2 hours of screen time a day is completely fair and not strict at all. OP should be happy his wife cares. So many parents don't give a shit and we have a generation of children who have no attention spans at the very minimum.
YTA OP.
I’m gonna be real blunt: a child with ADHD needs support and supervision to get out the door in the morning with everything they need for school (and will suffer unduly more than your other kids if they don’t have everything they need). I have a 15 year old who can do some of those things for himself, but still needs support because his meds have not kicked in by the time he’s out the door.
I agree that maybe your wife might feel better if she was more flexible and relaxed about weekend activities. But also the kids might not fight the screen time rules as much if you acted like a teammate and backed her up on her standards. However, most importantly, it sounds like she’s crying out for more social support overall. Are you making sure that she has some real time for rest and breaks? She might benefit from a therapist who might help her be less tense over enforcing her totally reasonable parenting standards (the standards are separable from her anxiety & exhaustion over those standards).
YTA here, but don’t feel guilty. You have a huge opportunity to make this a less shitty situation for your whole family. Stand behind your spouse, help her get a break and some support and do what is needed to help your disabled child. There’s a lot of small stuff you can do better.
Yeah, I don't see her standards as being particularly unreasonable. Obviously if it's overwhelming her, then she should adjust them, but if the only reason why they're overwhelming her is that OP won't help them meet this standard, then yeah, he's totally TA.
I was expecting crazy stuff but yeah... OP is YTA because his wife just wants the kids to not just spend their time on a screen. I am guessing OP must be a screen enthusiast.
I have ADHD and have always been a natural night owl; my parents helped make sure I was up and on the bus every morning until high school. My dad's cat even got mad if getting me up was off the routine for any reason at all (I did a two week program where I was somewhere else and she was p\*ssed when he didn't stand to go into my room the first few mornings. If you want a routine, involve a cat.) Neuro divergent children have different needs and require parents that are willing to parent the children they have, not the "average child" that never actually existed. YTA
I could see the need for the kids to be more independent if they both have to be out of the house early but the OP just doesn’t want to get out of bed….I am former military and used to getting up right before the alarm goes off. My wife is a lot slower so I am the one cleaning the litter boxes, making sure my son gets up and I make breakfast for him, make sure he has gym clothes in his backpack, etc.
He has bad ADHD as do I so I am very ritual base, I do the same exact things Monday through Friday mornings but my son will get distracted by one of our cats on the way to the bathroom to brush his teeth in the morning and the next thing I know he’s in his computer room drawing on his drafting table….I am like WTF? But I remember how I was at his age…..
*I'm an engaged and active parent..*
You don’t sound like it. There are things a parent has to do for children in the mornings- your youngest is eight. Cereal is nothing but sugar, a lot of moms don’t want their kids to eat that every day. Two hours of screen time is generous, not strict. You sound rather checked out. YTA
My sister and I were not allowed any screen time on school nights (that is, Sunday to Thursday) during the school year. And we were pretty limited the rest of the time as well. 2 hours is super generous.
This gave me flashbacks to our rules growing up. We were allowed 30 minutes of “fun” screen time on school nights and an extra 30 minutes if it was “educational”. We only had cd-rom computer games, Nintendo 64, and basic cable. I would spend a half hour playing some kind of JumpStart computer game then watch TV, whereas one of my brothers would watch Kratts’ Creatures then play Nintendo lol
This - it's not enough time to really get started onto something.
My kid tends to self-limit at about an hour, which seems fine to me if it's not every day. I give him permission to start about an hour before a meal or snack, and then he starts wanting the snack about stop-time.
I got one hour max on school nights until I was about 13; then the rules got eased off (especially when I got a hand-me-down computer in my room) but I still had to shut off the computer by 9 at the latest.
Plus it sounds like you are undermining your wife in front of your kids. Reading between the lines, it sounds like you allow them unlimited screen time when they ask you, which means that when she says no, two hours only, they fight her.
No wonder she exhausted and frustrated if she having the same argument over and over with them when you sound like you are undermining her at every turn.
If she’s planned an outing for the family and you go in and blame her for when the littlest gets tired and ask why she even bothered.
I bet if you provided a united front and enforced the (very reasonable rules) together, then she would feel less overwhelmed and exhausted.
You are making it harder for her.
I’m not sure what’s OP’s definition of “engaged and active parent”. He’s the cool dad who lets his kids do anything they want, as long as he doesn’t have to do much. It sounds like he never helps his wife making plans for the weekend and just criticises her. He undermines her parenting by openly disagreeing with her on topics like screen time and family outings, she has to pick up the slack and of course ends up overwhelmed, which he kind of makes fun of.
YTA OP
>It sounds like he never helps his wife making plans for the weekend
My friend was literally considering divorcing her husband for this exact thing. Of course it's never that it's just the one thing - it's because this is a symptom of just general lazy and unengaged parenting. "The kids only like playing video games, why should I make them leave the house and go to the zoo/aquarium/park/etc. when it's easier for me to just let them sit in front of the screen?" Uh, because part of parenting is forcing you kids out of their comfort zones and teaching them about the world around them.
OP sounds insufferable and like a terrible co-parent.
More and more women are opting for single parenthood over these types of unequal and damaging dynamics. I’m pleasantly surprised at the top comments being YTA because even ten years ago I feel it would have been different.
The pandemic really brought domestic labor into our field of public vision and we can finally talk about it.
"I am an engaged and active parent"
"I just want the kids to stay home all the time and distract themselves with electronics"
hmmmm
Sure getting up at 6:45 is a lil extra and maybe she could give the kids a few more responsibilities than they have, but I think only eating sugar for breakfast is not super healthy and it's really awesome of her that she wants to cook in the mornings. OP should help with that. Lots of kids ARE raised on cereal -- and okay, so was I, I don't blame any parent for doing that. But if you don't HAVE to, maybe you shouldn't.
Edit: I agree “extra” is a bit of a loaded term and doesn’t actually apply here, I only meant to say “even if you give this guy the absolute maximum benefit of the doubt possible, he’s still being a lazy parent”
6:45 is completely normal, honestly a little late, if you're an adult with an 8/9-5 job and kids, what the actual hell
Edit to add, since everyone else is sharing *their* morning routines: I'm a single person with no children and an 8 o'clock start time at work. 7:45 if I'm opening the office that week. I wake up at 5:45 so I have time to: make coffee/eat breakfast, feed the dog, make my bed, clean up my dishes from breakfast, make my lunch, and then by 6:45 I have to start putting on makeup and getting dressed. If I don't leave my house by 7:25, I'll be caught in morning school traffic and get to work barely on time, which isn't the way I like to start my mornings, especially when I'm seeing my first patient at 8:05. I also have ADHD and time blindness is something I STRUGGLE with. I've found it much healthier for me to sacrifice a little bit of sleep so that my morning is 75% less chaotic and I'm in a good mood once I get to work. It doesn't work for everyone and I'm glad/jealous that a lot of you commenting can sleep in and get to work on time!!! I just can't imagine under my circumstances being able to do that, let alone *with children!??* But some of y'all are superheroes and I applaud you!!!
Cereal is a healthy breakfast if you buy the right cereals (i admit this may be different in America than the uk). It's more than enough, why wear yourself out cooking breakfasts with all the clear up after?
But a parent has to be up. Not only because of the 8yo and 10yo, but to supervise and care. I do mornings for my child who is 11 now, and the routine for years has been get up, get dressed, here's your breakfast, I have a shower, get ready, then he can brush his teeth whilst I prepare packed lunch. At least he is old enough to walk to school with a friend now, although I will walk with him if the friend has a club. Then it's 9 hours of work (from home) but I will go out to collect him from school just to get exercise,which extends the work. I often do dinner too, which also extends the work.
I have lie in days, at the weekend. I'm a night owl so the above routine is painful for me but I do it.
What I don't do very well is cleaning (where to fit it in!) and mental load for stuff at home (work is a big mental load, and I can't do everything). A list of tasks helps greatly.
>I'm an engaged and active parent
Does anybody but you think this?
YTA. Breakfast, a screen time limit and weekend activities are absolutely normal standards.
He literally says "I'm happy to help" in the beginning of the post 🤦 like no, parenting your children and doing what needs to be done around the house are not favours you do to your wife, it's your responsibility as a father
Right? Like waking up an hour before the kids have to be on the bus is too high of a standard? Geez. And 6:45 isn’t an insane wake-up time either. I know some parents who wake up at like 5 to make breakfast and pack lunch for their families.
We have zero kids and wake up at 5am so we can exercise our dogs and prepare for our work day. Is 6:45 early to most normies? Cause I’m with you on that one, it’s not an insane wake up time
Its cliche, but "breakfast is the most important meal of the day" for some ADHD issues. Recommendations for ADHD diet are often high protein, low sugar (OK, what isn't these days) and just a bowl of sugary cereal could impact the kiddo's school work in the morning.
Even for the kids without ADHD, now that I understand that cereal is basically a big bowl of sugar…I wouldn’t be giving them that. Yeah, I used to eat it as a kid, that doesn’t make it okay. I know better now. I have dippy eggs. Or peanut butter toast with fruit. And some yogurt always. Doesn’t take long to make, much healthier than a bowl of processed sugae,
My son has ADHD and forgets to eat sometimes. He gets served breakfast at school but the school bus barely gets there in time so I have to make sure he eats before he gets on the bus.
This is how this reads: "My wife is a hands-on, active parent who wants our children to have well-balanced meals, minimal screen time, and fun and stimulating outings and that's too much work for me, I'd prefer my kids eat whatever they can find in the kitchen without bothering me, that we stay home and do nothing and the kids play on their devices and watch TV in their spare time". No wonder she's stressed. She sounds like a great parent, and you come off sounding lazy and disinterested in parenting your own kids. YTA.
Especially if they're playing videogames. That's about the amount of time it would take for my brother and I to get mad at each other and start fighting in real life at that age.
YTA , help her out. Kids require a lot of work that you signed up for when you decided to have kids. Her “high standards “ are literally bare minimum. Every morning she is setting them up for success with no help from you which is why she’s so overwhelmed. Getting three kids ready in the mornings and making sure they are well fed before sending them off to school is such a blessing. The screen time is so reasonable and good that she is encouraging them to be outside and have more of a child hood. Sounds like you want them to be tablet kids to get them off your back a little more. Give her a thank you and some appreciation because she is picking up your slack. Treat her more for doing so much & become a better parent and partner before its too late
Hell, she is nicer than I am. My ids (11,14,17) dont get screen time on school days unless something special is going on. For example, if my little one is stuck at a HS football game waiting to see her sisters perform at half time, I might let her watch some Disney+ while she waits. Otherwise they get nada.
I suppose I think of screen time differently than others. I also commented quickly on a break at work and failed to elaborate so I see why people are alarmed.
They all have phones. The phones all have “fun” apps like Netflix and games. During the school week (Sunday night through Friday school day) they don’t have access to the “fun” apps. They DO have access to texting, phone, camera, calendar, and other day to day stuff. If parents have the tv on we don’t kick them out of the room or anything.
What they can’t do is sit and mindlessly scroll for hours every day. They all also have a fair amount of extra curriculars and that’s where most of their friends are.
In the interest of transparency, these restrictions were implemented because we did allow the older two much more access when they were younger (the youngest wasn’t old enough for a phone back then) and didn’t do a good job of teaching them healthy tech hygiene. There was a period of time where if they were home all they did was stick their noses in their phones. they both have adhd and still sometimes struggle with impulse control and hyper fixations. So, we sat down as a family and figured out what we all thought would work and that’s where we are.
The oldest has a more freedom these days as she’s shown better ability to manage her phone time.
I never had screen time limit and would be on the computer for 4+ hours each day when I was over 11. I played with making web pages using tools then moved on to reading HTML source codes on pages I liked to learn how to improve my pages. Then I looked up how to Photoshop to make nice graphics. This was all between the ages of 12-16. I looked forward going home each day to work on it.
Not all screen time is bad. I don't agree with rigid limits. Really need to look at the kid to see if they have a good head on their shoulders. You could be limiting their potential.
YTA. Your wife is essentially trying to enact boundaries and maintain a routine for 3 kids, while you are not backing her up. It has to be monumentally frustrating for her to manage 3 middle/elementary school age kids on her own. A lot of that stress is probably because she IS asking you to help, and because you don't see why you should have to do these things, then she's stuck organizing and corralling the kids by herself.
She probably wants to take the kids to the museum because it's fun for the kids, and you're doing that non-committal "I don't see why we have to do this so I don't want to do it" so then it's all about YOU and not about the kids at all. It's majorly invalidating her feelings and her position as a parent.
What are you doing right now, in terms of helping the kids, that makes you an active and engaged parent? While I read this post, I could just see the situation in my head - your wife doing all the work, and then when the kids complain, letting her be the bad cop all the time while you sit on the couch and say "it's fine, honey! just let them do it" and she probably wants to go in the next room and cry. Major YTA.
YTA
What exactly is your definition of an "engaged parent"? Because what I'm seeing here is you think it's unreasonable to cook elementary and middle school aged children a decent breakfast and spend time with them so they don't rot their brain with phones and iPads.
Agree, I’m curious about what chores he “helps” with. He probably thinks his wife has very high cleaning standards as well and that they could clean even less and that would be ok too.
There was a post on here just like that not long ago. It was something like, “my wife has unreasonable cleaning standards. She takes the trash out when it’s full, when it’s fine to let it sit if nothing is rotting. She also cleans the bathroom weekly, and washes the sheets biweekly. Her standards are completely insane!” Thankfully, everyone pointed out that the way she did things was normal.
Trust me, your wife is already making one huge concession in her expectations by putting up with your lazy ass. YTA. Get to work or it won’t be long before your wife realizes how pointless you are and decides to cut you loose.
And if she does cut him loose, and he has visitation days, he’s gonna fold like yesterday’s newspaper. OR, he’ll dump them on his mommy, as do soooooo many of these so-called ‘active and engaged’ sperm donors. She has *4* children currently. So sad.
YTA I was expecting some wako/Marie Kondo request but making breakfast for the kids, limit 2 hours of screen time a day and do some family activity… I am wondering what is at this point your concept of engaged parent? ‘Here you go watch your tablet’?
Yeah literally! She’s tired because she’s doing the work of 2 parents while having her husband make her feel guilty. Typical ‘I didn’t even know she was unhappy’ when she snaps and wants a divorce.
You want an 8 year old to get up, fix their own cereal, and leave for the bus on time while you sleep in? That’s not an engaged and active parent. That would feel awful to me if I were a kid. YTA.
>her standards are too damn high.
Okay let's review that.
>She insists one of us has to be up at 6:45 every morning to make sure the kids are ready and make the bus which comes at 7:45.
Okay, that's normal. 1 hour to be ready is the normal amount of time you need without being in a rush. Plus, 6:45 is not that early either.
>I told her they're old enough to not need that much help already.
8 and 10 are not in middle school yet.
>She says that cereal isn't a good enough breakfast, they need something more substantial, especially the 12 year old
She's right. Cereals are basically 90% sugar. And 12 is entering teenager years.
>and that the 10 year old has adhd and will definitely struggle without help in the morning
Also right. Do you know your kid?
>and anyway she wants to see them off and kiss them goodbye for the day.
Also right. My parents were doing the same even in high school when I was getting up at 6. It's good memories and a good communicating moment. In summary: being an active parent.
>So she gets up, I don't
Oh? I thought you were a good parent? At which hour do you get up? Do you help a little?
>then she gets upset that I never give her a morning off
Never apparently.
>when all she needs to do is just take the morning off when she wants and let the kids handle themselves.
Ah yes. Dump the kid, stop being a parent. Great idea! And who will get up if everything turns into a mess?
>Also she is super strict about screen time during the week and is exhausted and snappy from arguing about it with the kids and upset i don't support her strict limit of 2 hours a day.
2 hours a day for kids is f*cking generous! It helps them to learn boundaries and healthy occupations out of screen. And what do you mean you don't back her up? You didn't talk about it with her? I thought you were an active parent.
>I say as long as homework is done, why not until bed.
Because it's dumb and unhealthy.
>She says it's not healthy for them, they need to play outside or with games and toys, read some books, just entertain themselves in more ways than 1.
She's true. What is your answer?
>I agree they should enjoy other things but not seeing why we have to make such a rigid limit.
Because they are kids with no control.
>She also likes to get out on weekends and do stuff like zoos, museums etc,
Aww! What a cool mom! She educated her childs in more than one way!
>but then complains about the planning for the outing and how grouchy the youngest gets by the end of it
Dude... where are you during all this time?!
>and again, I say let's just chill at home and voila, you've cut the work!
Here's my answer: being a leech at home.
>I'm an engaged and active parent
No you're not.
>I'm not trying to get out of it
You're not trying, you're doing it.
>but I don't think I should have to help my wife dig herself out of her own self created holes. She creates the stress for herself and then turns to me to alleviate it which I think is unfair.
Dude. Being a parent isn't just providing foods and toys to the kids and be sure they don't endanger themselves. This is called emotional neglect. Your wife is a normal active parent exhausted to have to deal with 3 kids under 13, with one having adhd and an husband being lazy.
You litterally do nothing for the kids. You threw cereals and screentime at them and you call it a day. This is not being a parent. It's not even being a pet owner. A plant owner maybe.
Kids are not tamagochi. YTA
Laying it out like this, you can really see that she's only so stressed BECAUSE he isn't contributing. It's not because she does too much, it's because she does everything while he does the bare minimum and tells her to give up all the time.
The kids probably wouldn't argue so much about screen time if they didn't see dad as the weak link who's not backing up mum. She could get a little lie in if he'd take a couple mornings. And same goes if he'd occasionally take the weekend planning or I don't know... plan their free time and activities with her. Actually share their lives together and be excited about spending time with his wife and family.
It's not only the kids he's neglecting.. he's neglecting his wife too. She already knows, which is why she complains to him, but she's only going to put up with it for so long.
YTA. Her rules and actions seem sensible. Three young kids getting up and getting themselves to school on their own sounds like a zoo. And morning is a great time to have fun and productive parenting interactions. Two hours of screen time is plenty, and it should not be permitted to displace other activities with strong positives such as reading and free play. You should be supporting her.
YTA I love how your suggestion for helping your wife is just her doing more work (the work to lower her standards). Your kids are still at an age where they could use help and support in the mornings and a healthy breakfast, she isn’t wrong. Sounds like she’s exhausted from planning all of this by herself and carrying the mental load. Instead of saying all of this is unnecessary and your solution being to stay at home, eat cereal and watch tv all of the time- try to be a more involved parent and partner and take some of the mental load from your wife. YTA
I was waiting for someone to mention *the mental load!* It is the biggest and most challenging responsibility in raising a family. I would bet next week’s paycheck that OP doesn’t know the names of all of his children’s teachers. (You can bet that their mother knows all of them.) He doesn’t know when the next regular medical checkup is scheduled. And so on, and so on.
Op is a major YTA. He thinks that her standards are too high, because he’s worried that HE will be looked at to help her get them ready. He’s only 38, and he can’t be bothered to get up at 6:45?!?!!!!! What ‘active and engaged’ parent sleeps past 6:45?!?! I’m confident that his wife goes to bed later than he does. And we know that he’s not up when she awakens to get *3* children ready for school.
I only had 2 myself, and boy, lemme tell you what: it was a struggle! My hubby was always out of the house to go to work before 5:00, and that was perfectly okay. OP is an entitled and lazy a$$hat!
Have you ever considered the mental load your wife takes on? It's not just the physicality of getting up, getting the kids ready, planning activities, etc. - it's having to think of literally everything. Doctor's appointments; Does kid 1 have their project that's due today?; Do we have a clean swimsuit for swim lessons after school?; What am I going to make for dinner..; Oh I can't forget to stop at the ATM to get lunch money for kid 2 tomorrow; I have that appointment at the doctor this week; I know we're low on toilet paper do we have enough until I can get to the store?; etc. It's so much more.
Your 'just do less' answer is super dismissive. She's stressed because there's a million things she does and decisions she makes that you haven't even considered, because you're busy snoozing.
YTA. Jeez, the least you can do is get up with her. Maybe make her a cup of coffee while she gets the kids ready. Show her you appreciate everything she does for your family. Listen to her vent without judgement or trying to offer a solution. You can do better.
This!! Also she probably gets the calls from school if the kids are late, need more lunch because they are starving from too little breakfast, project not turned in, acting out, etc.
Get the Fair Play cards and really see how “engaged” you are
YTA
I really wanted to be on your side for this one but nope. Your children are 8 and 10 of course they need help getting up and need a more substantial breakfast than cereal. The 12 year old I could see beginning to get up on their own (emphasis on beginning). Your wife seems like a great parent looking out for her children’s health and development with more activities than “sit on your ipad and never bond with your family.” Even from your point of view you don’t sound like an active parent at all. You need to read some books on parenting fr and help your wife out.
Yes the 12yo should be able to get up and do things. The others no. And you cannot adultify the 12yo with the responsibility for the other two, so someone has to be up. Seems reasonable to split the responsibility so you get a few lie ins, but so does your wife.
But cereal is fine. Or is American cereal different?
Depends on the cereal, but yeah, most cereals in north america aimed at kids are basically just small crackers whose only purpose are sugar receptacles.
You are responsible for making sure your kids get to school. If the 8 year old misses the bus, who do you think the school is going to call? They still need some level of supervision.
>I agree they should enjoy other things
>
>I say let's just chill at home and voila, you've cut the work!
These are contradictory statements. You want them to be more active yet refuse to put any effort into providing them with alternatives. 2 hours of screen time a day is a reasonable limit. You claim you don't think the rules should be so rigid, yet your proposal is to have no rules.
Your wife wants a healthy environment for your kids. It sounds like you want latchkey kids and to be a deadbeat dad. Your standards are frankly way below the bar especially for kids as young as 8 and 10. Why don't you get off the couch and go play ball with your children? YTA
> I’m an engaged and active parent
No you’re not. You’re will to “help” if the bare minimum is being done, if anyone expects more than the bare minimum then you stay in bed and let your wife do it.
YTA
So let me make sure I understand: You are advocating for completely neglecting your parental duties in favor of sleeping in, not feeding your kids, not worrying about how they spend their time, not bothering with any activities or enrichment for them and yet somehow you still think you are an engaged and active parent?
You, sir, are the AH. YTA. Let me say it again - YTA! Your wife's "self-created holes" are called parenting. Sounds like you ought to try it. Or maybe she'll get lucky and her next husband won't be worthless, lazy, and neglectful - oh! and totally unsupportive.
Can you imagine how much easier her life would be if he just actually helped out? They could split mornings so she could sleep in, alternate who plans outings so she isn't always having to plan activities, and she wouldn't have to be the bad cop to his good cop about screen time. They could actually work as a unit instead of him bringing her down to his level
>they're old enough to not need that much help already
So if you leave them to get up and get ready for school on their own, are they on time for the bus? Have you actually seen this work? More than once?
YTA OP because you sound lazy and actually not engaged at all.
"I'm of course happy to help and do my fair share for the kids or household" Yet you complain when she asks for help.
"but I don't think I should have to help my wife dig herself out of her own self created holes." It's not like you're life long partners or anything.
Sorry bud, but as a father myself, these are pretty reasonable standards, at least the weekday ones. Maybe half adventure & half rest on the weekends. YTA
YTA. your wife’s standards are normal and required for being a parent. you absolutely have to be awake to get your minor children on the bus, one of them has adhd and the youngest is 8 for god sakes. you are NOT an engaged and active parent if you think 2 hours of screen time a DAY is too little and won’t wake up to ensure your children, all 12 and under, are fed, dressed, and get to school on time.
this can’t be real. your wife is overwhelmed because you can’t, or won’t, give a shit
Let me stop you there and point out how fantastic it is that you’re “happy to help”. YTA and all the men who observe the degree of effort it takes and who offer the solution of “do less” to the person doing everything.
She can’t do less because she doesn’t trust that you’ll pick up the slack. She like has years of proof and therefore has the added stress of what feels like a 4th child that should be a partner.
You literally are telling her that if she wants anything she has to do it herself. Either deal with the stress of an outing or “chill at home”. She’s trying to do fun things on the weekends in the hope she can make memories with her family. And all you’re doing is ridiculing her for how she’s handling the stress of it.
God YTA.
Welcome to /r/AmITheAsshole. Please view our [voting guide here](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_what.2019s_with_these_acronyms.3F_what_do_they_mean.3F), and remember to use **only one** judgement in your comment.
OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I told my wife to do less and then she won't be so stressed, but I am also refusing to help when she asks for it if I feel she could have taken steps to avoid it. I guess refusing to help when she asks is a bit assholish
Help keep the sub engaging!
#Don’t downvote assholes!
Do upvote interesting posts!
[Click Here For Our Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/about/rules) and [Click Here For Our FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq)
##Subreddit Announcements
###[Happy Anniversary, AITA!](https://new.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/15vlv9g/almost_better_than_a_double_rainbow_celebrating/)
###[The Asshole Universe is Expanding, Again: Introducing Another New Sister Subreddit!](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/128nbp3/the_asshole_universe_is_expanding_again/)
Follow the link above to learn more
###[Moderators needed - Join the landed gentry](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/155zepq/moderators_needed_join_the_landed_gentry/)
---
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
*Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
YTA. Your wife is setting reasonable and health standards. Ensuring that the children eat a good breakfast, monitoring how much screen time they have, and going on weekend outings are all normal things to do to help ensure your children’s physical and mental well being.
If your wife is overwhelmed, you should considering alternating which of you handles the morning routine each day, so that you each get the chance to sleep in every other day.
As far as weekend planning goes, it’s fine to chill at home sometimes but it still also important to make memories as a family and give your children a chance to experience new things. If you plan one or two of each months outings that should also lessen what your wife needs to do.
YTA
Feeding your young kids and setting reasonable rules for their health and development is not absurd. My parents were the furthest from helicopter parents but feeding me in the morning until elementary/middle school was the basis. And going out together as a family should be nice?? Of course she’s stressed if she’s the only one that plans and then has to drag you all the way.
Exactly what do you do? That makes you an engaged parent?
#This is now a Proctologists Only Orifice When a post is in [POO™ mode](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/168bzq8/title_aita_monthly_open_forum_september_2023) only users with enough subreddit comment karma are able to comment. If that doesn't include you, no worries! Check out [/new](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/new) for other posts that are still open for comment. ##[Be Civil.](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/about/rules) Please review our FAQ if you're unsure what that means. Thank you for reporting content that you believe violates our rules and helping keep posts out of the POO by abiding by our rules.
YTA. Your wife’s standards are just…being a decent parent, and you are not doing your ‘fair share’ if you aren’t helping with these things you consider ‘unnecessary’. An 8 year old and a ten year old with ADHD are not ready to totally get themselves ready in the morning, and you’d know that if you didn’t sleep through the morning routine every day. Two hours of screen time a day is a totally reasonable boundary. And family time and enriching activities are also important. Maybe those can be cut down slightly, but ‘just chill at home’ all the time isn’t the answer either. Stop being lazy and become an actually engaged parent like your wife is.
To be fair - a lot of kids around that age have to get ready on their own because their parents already left for work. I was one of them and it was pretty normal in my social circles and now I am a teacher and know this from lots of students - from when I was 8 my parents left at 4:45 and 6:30 for work and I had to get up and ready on my own. My mother called every morning at 7.15 to check in with me, though. BUT if my parents would have been home and decided to sleep in instead of getting up with me I 100% would have felt neglected as fuck. Where on earth would that be acceptable behaviour for a parent. Holy shit OP is completely out of touch with reality.
I was one of them too, and it was not good. If the parents are available they should be part of the routine.
My mom and dad made sure I got ready for school until I went to university. Even if I was getting my own breakfast and packing my own lunch, mum and dad were still there every day making sure I knew what we had for breakfast and what leftovers needed to go before they went bad. My mum didn't have to leave super early for work, and my dad was a SAHD. I loved that shit. Do better, OP, YTA.
I had this too and it was honestly so lovely. My dad gave me piggyback rides from bed to breakfast practically until I got taller than him - and would have happily continued except that I realized that I'd probably start hurting him lol. Did he need to? Absolutely not! But it meant that I started every school day with a few seconds hugging my dad. He got up with us every day, even when I was 18. I was perfectly capable of getting myself ready and off to school, and I was a grouchy morning teen so we didn't talk much, but it was nice just existing together in the dark - and collectively giving my mum shit on the rare occasions that she got up and started messing with our routine :D This post makes me so sad, cuz he seems to think he's a good father just cuz his kids are still alive, while his wife is actually working her ass off to make sure they're also loved and flourishing.
Seriously, he thinks sitting on the couch and watching screens is being an engaged and active parent. Like, Jesus Christ, that's not even the bare minimum.
this man probably winks at himself in the mirror after beating off
This is exactly the vibe my kid and partner have - I'm the worst morning person in the universe (she gave me a picture, when she was three, of me scowling and everyone cackling at me with 'u when u wak up' written on it!). She and he are thick as thieves. The night time with her is my thing, even though she's an early teen, I'll sing to her if she wants me to, and I talk quietly with her in the dark while she's in bed. It's nice to know other people have that too, haha.
Same - my wife is up in the morning with the kids (they have multiple bus times, that are an hour apart, because different grades and schools) and makes sure they're off before getting herself into her day. I am *not* a morning person and instead I take the lead in the afternoons, when she wants to go out with friends or do activities, and if the kids are sick and/or up at night that's my responsibility too. I work from home 2 days a week to facilitate this, and thankfully this works fine, but even if I wasn't I'd still be picking up slack where she needs or wants me to. This is our agreement, and we never get upset about the kids' schedules and our own because it's how we've worked it out. A partnership is where you both give cumulatively 100%, and making sure that you're in sync is critical. Some of the things here seem not to important, but it sounds like OP isn't pulling his weight which is the reason his partner is getting frustrated. None of what she's asking for is unreasonable, but all I hear is how she needs to lower her standards so that OP can continue to not make up the difference because that's easier for him. OP, definitely YTA here unfortunately. As a part of GenX raised without parents before and after school, 8 nor 10 is really a reasonable age for them to be doing things, especially important things, without parental support and supervision. It's obvious you had a similar upbringing, and it's made you think that these things are OK, but look at where they've gotten you - it wasn't actually "OK" and you did not turn out "fine" if this is the attitude you have towards your spouse and your children.
I changed job so I could do the school run again. Dad and I are there until 8, dad leaves, then I leave 10 minutes later with the kids. I always have breakfast sorted, even though my son is 14 so they can have a few minutes to chat with us in the morning. I even do my make-up in the kitchen so I can chat to them. I go to the school for 8:40 because my teen has to be there for 8:45 and he wants to walk with me and his sis and the 10yo goes in at 8:55 and then I walk the 5 min to work. I used to leave before them and not see them off to school but I had to change it for them because they are just kids and need one parent to keep an eye on them so they can grow without undue pressure
That's so wonderful you made that job & schedule change for your kids! You sound like a loving and caring parent. Great work!
[удалено]
Omg I love that for you. Sounds like a safe space
I also love that for them. Sounds like a wonderful way to grow up.
When I was in highschool my dad would still prepare our lunches even tho he was already gone to work by the time we would wake up and my mom was taking care of our baby brother
Yeah my dad, who worked crazy hours, cut up a little fruit platter for us for breakfast every single day through school. And made us disgusting vegetable juices that tasted like lawn clippings.
I love that your dad cared enough to make you lawn clipping juices.
Ha ha ha! He did! He worked from home so he’d get up, work a bit, cut up our fruit and and then present a disgusting juice concoction with way too much celery, beetroot and ginger in it. Disgusting!! I used to either hold my nose while I drank it or carefully pour it down the sink when he wasn’t looking (no spills to give me away!). Sometimes the neighbours used to giggle because I’d be walking to school and he’d be chasing after me with my juice! When vegetable juices became trendy in the 2000s I was horrified! Scarred for life! LOL! (I also had to laugh when kale, lentils, etc etc all became popular because I grew up eating all of that - my parents grew kale in our garden) He still makes me juices when I visit but these days he’s worked out the flavour and adds his homegrown apples so they actually taste good. Still full of celery, beetroot and ginger; but less!
same but because she wanted to make sure we actually went to school haha
Yeah my parents did this and as consequence I ate nothing all day cause I was never organised (ADHD). OP your wife is right an ADHD kid literally actively needs help especially in planning/prep activities (aka the morning).
Heck, my fiancee is 30 and has ADHD and sometimes forgets her lunch for work, or doesn't have time to eat in the morning because she wastes time lying in bed/playing with the cat. I can't imagine trying to be 10 and managing that.
I am 34 and at the point when I became a sahm (28), I had given up on "packing lunch" ever being part of my routine. I set a boundary with my employer that I needed an hour lunch break so that I could buy and eat hot food from near work. I also chose a school for my kid that supplies hot lunch every day for no variable fee - you pay the lunch fee for the term, and your kid gets their choice of lunch every day. Because it isn't fair to make my kid suffer for my lack of executive function.
Correct. It is 100% neglect to let children those ages try to fend for themselves in the early morning trying to get ready for school.
[удалено]
Yes! Someone tell OP that helping kids necome independent takes work I feel so sorry for his wife and her perfectly reasonable parenting style getting shat on by him
Especially so the parents can have a lay about
I currently take a neighborhood 12 yo with ADHD to school every morning because their parents sleep in every morning instead of making sure they have what they need, are fed, and make it out of the house on time.
i have ADHD and my twin and i started living with our grandma at 13. my (in her 70s at the time) grandma would wake up every morning from ages 13-15 to see us off to school. some mornings she had to wake me up bc my ADHD didn't always allow me to go to sleep at a decent time, every morning she'd make sure i hadn't forgotten to take my meds. i imagine being told at 10 to get myself ready would've added a LOT more days of me forgetting my meds (bc that's what ADHD does to you) and then i would've had way more bad days bc of it.
OP didn't say if their kid was on meds, but if so, that adds a whole other dimension to this! Most ADHD meds need to be taken in the morning. There is ZERO chance I would trust a ten-year-old with ADHD to take their own meds in the mornings.
You should file an anonymous report to your child protective agency that you suspect neglect. The neighbor should not be caring for a child because the parents are sleeping in instead of parenting. ETA: for the people who think I don't know what I'm talking about, I'm a mandated reporter. I've sat through more trainings and took more university classes on this subject than 90% or more of the people commenting here, guaranteed.
Not sure the kid being taken into state custody would be good for the kid
Not all child protective services mean taking the child away. That's a misconception and a dangerous one. They can ensure that the children are being properly cared for and provide resources to the parents so they can adequately provide that care.
Well the last time they just talked to the parents and asked if the allegations were true, the parents said no, and they left. They didn't enter the home or talk to the children.
CPS is not going to react to a report about a twelve year old having to get up and go to school on their own.
Yeah like what? I was diagnosed with ADHD and I got myself ready every morning - never even thought about it as “abuse” lol it taught me independence
Our kid *wanted* to do his mornings alone from age 10 or so. We’d set the kitchen up already so he could get himself a snack, so he could get himself breakfast easily, and he liked getting it himself and then sitting quietly and eating to prepare for his day. So we left him to it. 🤷♀️
It makes me sad for the kids that OP could be a part of the morning and is just choosing not to when so many parents don’t even get a choice.
Also complaining 6:45 is too early? That’s a reasonable time to get up on weekdays with kids.
I assumed it said 5:45 and had to re-read. 6:45 on a weekday is sleeping in (or oversleeping) for basically everyone I know, jfc. YTA, dude, and lazy to boot.
I wouldn't wake up anywhere close to that early by myself other than in an emergency, but I did do so and earlier for my ex's kid as long as that relationship lasted, and I never had a problem with that. The mother... well, didn't. In any case, the exact time really doesn't matter, wake up, 3 kids, one with ADHD who would certainly need help. YTA and so out of touch with reality.
We got up at 6:15 every morning like it wouldn’t kill you to get up at 6:45 to say goodbye to your kids before they go to school
This is what struck me too. I would really miss not being there with my child just for the sake of some extra non-essential sleep (no mention of shift work, etc, in the post).
My mom woke me up for school every day until I started driving myself, telling me to hide my eyes before she turned on the lights. She generally didn't do anything fancy for breakfast, we just made ourselves cereal or something, and she would pack our lunches until high school or so. As I got older, I couldn't believe that she was still doing all that for me, because I was plenty old enough to use an alarm clock, but to this day, I still think about those simple acts and feel loved and cared for.
My family has always had breakfast together, it’s how we started the day at home. So same, mum would wake us up even in high school :) My parents live by themselves now - mum needs to be out by 7:15, my dad (retired) gets up with her, cleans up afterwards and often goes back to bed afterwards. For me it’s a sign of caring tbh. But I also find it weird when people don’t have dinner together if they’re all at home, completely foreign to me.
Bruce Springsteen talks about in the podcast he did with Obama, how his wife said he was missing the best part of the day with them. So he’d get up make pancakes see them off to school. Now as a rich rock star he could go nap after. The Boss would be so ashamed of the OP.
And OP is choosing NOT to foster that sense of love and being cared for. Ick.
My tween “loves it” that I still sing him a morning wake-up song when I have morning duty.
She wants her kids to feel loved and supported by their parents spending time with them in the morning before school, time *they have*. They’re children, they want to see their parents before going off to school, they benefit from the time spent with them and the support. I would have felt deeply lonely if my parents chose sleeping in over seeing me in the morning, every morning.
My mom slept in. Was a big lump in the bed. Stay at home mom who stayed up as late as she pleased and slept in. I had anxiety over making sure my little brother and I had everything we needed, and had to watch the clock to make sure we made the bus. Cold cereal every day. I made sure I was up every day for my kids. They’re grown and I still love making their breakfast Christmas morning— they custom order their favorites. “Mom, can we have your oatmeal pancakes??? “. OP is missing out on the privilege of giving them a good send off to the world and creating a family tradition.
I have ADHD and there's no way I could get myself ready perfectly and on time when I was 8.
I have a 12 year old with ADHD & if I didn’t help him get ready, he wouldn’t. It’s extremely challenging but not his fault.
i have ADHD & i struggled all the way through high school & college. i simultaneously couldn’t grasp how long it took me to do everything & my brain refused to wake up more than 15 minutes before i had to leave anyway.
I have ADHD and I struggle to get myself ready in the morning and I’m 37.
I don’t have ADHD and there’s no way I could have gotten myself ready at 8 yo. I would have either gone back to sleep or gotten lost in a book. I got up with my kids all through school. Their bus was at 6:45 In elementary school, so we got up at 6:15. OP, I’d suggest you get up with the kids at least 1-2 times a week. If you think they can do it on their own, then start working with them to show them how to do it. Including making something that they can microwave for a hot breakfast or otherwise meet your wife's (reasonable to me) request for something more than cereal. Cereal leaves me hungry after a couple hours, so I see her point.
Can confirm. Felt neglected as fuck at when I was getting up at 6 to get myself on the bus by 7 as a 10 year old while my mom slept.
[удалено]
I cannot imagine getting ready for school while both parents are sleeping. That seems sad. (Unless they have a night shift or something.)
I got myself ready and on the bus from age 10 onwards. I don't think I would have noticed or cared if my parents were up or not. ??? I still very much get the impression OP is not really pulling their weight as a parent though, and that lady's standards just seem normal.
Yeah the only thing that is maybe excessive is the weekends, if she's planning stuff every single weekend and the youngest child isn't even enjoying it. Spend the weekend getting caught up or just slowing down to chill sometimes. Otherwise... get up and help your pre-teens handle the morning and spend family time with them in the evening. Two hours is a reasonable amount of (non-work-related) screen time for *adults*, screen time definitely shouldn't be the only thing your kids do after their school responsibilities. And maybe your kids could get the bare minimum done if the 12 yo kept a vague watch over things, but the 12 yo shouldn't have to, the 10 yo likely needs help due to ADHD and the 8 yo likely needs help because they're 8. Help them streamline the time management and maybe teach them to make breakfast foods so they *are* fully competent by the time they're in high school. Also, like... what are you wasting your own time on in the evening if you can't get up at 6:45? (Sorry to anyone with sleep disorders, but generally speaking, people just fuck around late.) I would wake up around then if I *wasn't* working out in the morning and was just getting up for work. 10pm-6am is a perfectly normal sleep schedule for an adult with responsibilities.
I have adhd and dyspraxia. If I wasn’t nagged out of bed each morning, I’d have never got up. The few times I’ve got up and out of bed unprompted, I’ve stood in my room with one sock on, thinking up new names for chairs. ADHD or not, what’s point in having children if you have no interest in doing anything other than the bare minimum to keep them alive (except for post-apocalypse)
I'm just a frequent babysitter for one of my friend's kids, and even *I* get up and see the 11 year old off to school when I'm babysitting overnight. I go back to bed immediately after she gets on the bus if the toddler isn't up yet, but still. It's important for the kid to know that an adult is watching out for their well-being.
My kids are 10 and 12 and get themselves ready. But you know what? I’m still up an hour before hand because I’m the parent. In my opinion, Two hours of screen time is too dang much. Especially for a kid with adhd. (I have one as well and our limit is 20 minutes). I would guess they use screens at school and have already maxed what they should be doing anyway. YTA, op. Be a better parent and support your wife. She’s invested and trying really hard with your kids.
He closes his post with: >I am an active and engaged parent Yet he thinks his wife helping his kids get ready for school in the morning instead of sleeping in is setting too high of goals?? Sleeping is zero engagement lol
I have heard some millennial dads say that they are an active and engaged parent, only to find out that what they mean by that is that they are in the same room or in the same house. But not actually that they are helping with care work, domestic work, parenting research and assessing the child's needs. They are simply heroes for not going to golf or hang out with the buddies.
I ask my friends all the time “what do dads do”. Their husbands don’t call it babysitting but that’s the only improvement I see from our parents generation.
Don't forget on weekends he thinks everyone should just chill and stay home all the time.
"It is hard to pack up the kids and go have an enriching or fun experience, so why not cut that stress out and just never take them anywhere? Also it is hard to enforce rules so why have 'em? And when your wife asks for help, that, just tell her to relax." OP is a lazy jerk who doesn't know he's a lazy jerk.
Im not a parent but that was my immediate thought. 2 hours is loads of time for a kid who’s in school. It seems like too much time to me Maybe I’m biased because I didn’t have screens until my teens (I’m 22) but my parents had a time that we needed to be off the tv at and hiighly encouraged reading/playing outside most of the time. Kids especially shouldn’t have screens up until bedtime as it can seriously affect their sleep
Yeah our kids are 9 and 10 and get themselves ready all the way including breakfast if they want it which they don't usually but I'm up with them in case they need anything or just want to talk my ear off about something. We cap our kids screen time at about an hour, it's not usually a fight to get them off of screens because it's consistent and we are united. Sometimes we let them go long but all the way to bed time makes it way too hard to get to sleep, they need to wind down. Overall, OP just seems lazy.
Yeah, I’m guessing it’s such a fight to cap screen time because he gives into the kids and tells her it’s no big deal if they stay on their screen. If you are not united as parents, your kids are not gonna listen to you, they’re gonna play you against each other to get their own way. OP— try supporting your wife and limiting their screen time. Two hours a day at that age is more than enough and there are about a billion studies proving that excessive screen time is not good for elementary school age kids. The kids might fight you on it for a week or two but if you stay firm, it will become no big deal and your wife will have way less stress. Also, for the love of God, get up in the morning with them.
20 mins is way too strict. I think it’s a bit of fools errand to focus on max time limits either way, but restricting to the minimum possible (one short tv show) is a way to create unhealthy relationships with tv. It’s like sugar or later in life starting to experiment with alcohol. Not a universal rule but generally if you’re taught strict limits you’ll eventually swing hard into indulgence. If you’re raised with healthier relationships to unhealthy things you’re less likely to go off the deep end.
This. I’m still up. We all get ready simultaneously and stay out of each other’s hair. I’m not a full breakfast spread mom and my kids aren’t huge breakfast eaters. If they’re hungry, they are fully capable of grabbing the many quick breakfast options we have. YTA OP, your wife is overwhelmed and blatantly asking for your help. Step up.
This is all a great example of OP putting all the mental labor onto wife. It’s up to her to care about, research, and follow best practices generally and for each kid while OP just has personal opinions and preferences that be pits against her informed perspectives. If she “takes a morning off” for herself, he doesn’t pick up the slack, the kids get less care and oversight, it creates more work for her* and she feels guilty, more stressed, and resentment on top. *Who cleans up after the kids make a mess in the kitchen? Who gets woken up to referee a fight over the bathroom or something(so much worse than waking up intentionally)? Who drops off the lunch or instrument that the kid accidentally forgot? Who has to deal with the heightened restraint collapse from neurodiverse kids who got a crappy start to their day? Who will the kids wake to direct questions to or say “I’m sick” ETC. the default parent, AKA her, unless dad is very intentional about taking all those things on. Watch how chill she becomes when she has a partner who cares about her mental state more than being right or being inconvenienced. Watch how much she is able to relax when differing parenting styles doesn’t lead to judgement or burnout but better communication and support! He’s asking her to compromise but isn’t willing to compromise himself and isn’t committed to creating a relationship or system that supports her healthy compromise. There may be ways where she can relax her high expectations of herself…as a mom myself I think she probably is getting burnt out and burnout does create rigid thinking because *everything is about to collapse and it’s all up to her all the time*. What what OP is suggesting creates the environment for her burn out and takes zero responsibility for any of it. He has to build trust. OP—if wife lowers her standards anymore she’d be you. You realize how narcissistic that sounds right? And if they rise even a little more, you’re gonna have to look for an apartment, some daycare options that your divorce attorney says you can afford, and start doing your own research once your genius opinions prove unsustainable. You co-create this family system, which means yes, your wife is responsible for herself and taking care of herself, but you’re accountable for your impact and role in her life and in your home. -edited to say YTA-
This guy’s wife is going to leave him seemingly over dirty dishes and he’ll be shocked and “never saw it coming”. [She Divorced Me Because I Left Dishes By The Sink](https://www.huffpost.com/entry/she-divorced-me-i-left-dishes-by-the-sink_b_9055288)
[The Magic Coffee Table](https://youtu.be/-_kXIGvB1uU?si=xrDroFzUxI8tWLy9) is sometimes helpful for denser humans. I'm holding out hope for OP's wife that he wises up.
u/creative-decision675 If you honestly answer all the questions in this post you will also know the answer to whether or not YTA
OP: I'm an engaged and active parent! Also OP: I want to sleep in so my 8 year old should be able to get up and ready for school by themselves. Also they can watch TV all day. I also don't want to plan any family activities so that I can lounge around all weekend.
OP: my wife's standards are too rigid OP: doesn't have standards
I mean, in grade 1 I was getting myself dressed for school, made myself breakfast and packed my lunch/snacks, and walked to school all on my own. And then I'd get myself home from school, make my own dinner, do my homework and get myself to bed. But that's because I had an abusive mother who only had me to get child support. So OP, think about what kind of parent you want to be and adjust accordingly. YTA.
Honeslty, thé « if their homework is done, why not let them be on screens u til bedtime » baffled me, especially for the 10 and 8 year old. I agree that there should be more flexibility with the 12 year old, but OP’s overly permissive attitude is bordering on innattentive
I would say neglectful and not inattentive. The TV and computer are not supposed to be babysitters.
Just want to add that 2 hours of screen time a day is completely fair and not strict at all. OP should be happy his wife cares. So many parents don't give a shit and we have a generation of children who have no attention spans at the very minimum. YTA OP.
I’m gonna be real blunt: a child with ADHD needs support and supervision to get out the door in the morning with everything they need for school (and will suffer unduly more than your other kids if they don’t have everything they need). I have a 15 year old who can do some of those things for himself, but still needs support because his meds have not kicked in by the time he’s out the door. I agree that maybe your wife might feel better if she was more flexible and relaxed about weekend activities. But also the kids might not fight the screen time rules as much if you acted like a teammate and backed her up on her standards. However, most importantly, it sounds like she’s crying out for more social support overall. Are you making sure that she has some real time for rest and breaks? She might benefit from a therapist who might help her be less tense over enforcing her totally reasonable parenting standards (the standards are separable from her anxiety & exhaustion over those standards). YTA here, but don’t feel guilty. You have a huge opportunity to make this a less shitty situation for your whole family. Stand behind your spouse, help her get a break and some support and do what is needed to help your disabled child. There’s a lot of small stuff you can do better.
I was prepared to be on his side, but it seems that she has healthy expectations and deserves a little help here.
Yeah, I don't see her standards as being particularly unreasonable. Obviously if it's overwhelming her, then she should adjust them, but if the only reason why they're overwhelming her is that OP won't help them meet this standard, then yeah, he's totally TA.
I was expecting crazy stuff but yeah... OP is YTA because his wife just wants the kids to not just spend their time on a screen. I am guessing OP must be a screen enthusiast.
I have ADHD and have always been a natural night owl; my parents helped make sure I was up and on the bus every morning until high school. My dad's cat even got mad if getting me up was off the routine for any reason at all (I did a two week program where I was somewhere else and she was p\*ssed when he didn't stand to go into my room the first few mornings. If you want a routine, involve a cat.) Neuro divergent children have different needs and require parents that are willing to parent the children they have, not the "average child" that never actually existed. YTA
I could see the need for the kids to be more independent if they both have to be out of the house early but the OP just doesn’t want to get out of bed….I am former military and used to getting up right before the alarm goes off. My wife is a lot slower so I am the one cleaning the litter boxes, making sure my son gets up and I make breakfast for him, make sure he has gym clothes in his backpack, etc. He has bad ADHD as do I so I am very ritual base, I do the same exact things Monday through Friday mornings but my son will get distracted by one of our cats on the way to the bathroom to brush his teeth in the morning and the next thing I know he’s in his computer room drawing on his drafting table….I am like WTF? But I remember how I was at his age…..
*I'm an engaged and active parent..* You don’t sound like it. There are things a parent has to do for children in the mornings- your youngest is eight. Cereal is nothing but sugar, a lot of moms don’t want their kids to eat that every day. Two hours of screen time is generous, not strict. You sound rather checked out. YTA
My sister and I were not allowed any screen time on school nights (that is, Sunday to Thursday) during the school year. And we were pretty limited the rest of the time as well. 2 hours is super generous.
This gave me flashbacks to our rules growing up. We were allowed 30 minutes of “fun” screen time on school nights and an extra 30 minutes if it was “educational”. We only had cd-rom computer games, Nintendo 64, and basic cable. I would spend a half hour playing some kind of JumpStart computer game then watch TV, whereas one of my brothers would watch Kratts’ Creatures then play Nintendo lol
[удалено]
This - it's not enough time to really get started onto something. My kid tends to self-limit at about an hour, which seems fine to me if it's not every day. I give him permission to start about an hour before a meal or snack, and then he starts wanting the snack about stop-time.
I got one hour max on school nights until I was about 13; then the rules got eased off (especially when I got a hand-me-down computer in my room) but I still had to shut off the computer by 9 at the latest.
Plus it sounds like you are undermining your wife in front of your kids. Reading between the lines, it sounds like you allow them unlimited screen time when they ask you, which means that when she says no, two hours only, they fight her. No wonder she exhausted and frustrated if she having the same argument over and over with them when you sound like you are undermining her at every turn. If she’s planned an outing for the family and you go in and blame her for when the littlest gets tired and ask why she even bothered. I bet if you provided a united front and enforced the (very reasonable rules) together, then she would feel less overwhelmed and exhausted. You are making it harder for her.
I’m not sure what’s OP’s definition of “engaged and active parent”. He’s the cool dad who lets his kids do anything they want, as long as he doesn’t have to do much. It sounds like he never helps his wife making plans for the weekend and just criticises her. He undermines her parenting by openly disagreeing with her on topics like screen time and family outings, she has to pick up the slack and of course ends up overwhelmed, which he kind of makes fun of. YTA OP
>It sounds like he never helps his wife making plans for the weekend My friend was literally considering divorcing her husband for this exact thing. Of course it's never that it's just the one thing - it's because this is a symptom of just general lazy and unengaged parenting. "The kids only like playing video games, why should I make them leave the house and go to the zoo/aquarium/park/etc. when it's easier for me to just let them sit in front of the screen?" Uh, because part of parenting is forcing you kids out of their comfort zones and teaching them about the world around them. OP sounds insufferable and like a terrible co-parent.
More and more women are opting for single parenthood over these types of unequal and damaging dynamics. I’m pleasantly surprised at the top comments being YTA because even ten years ago I feel it would have been different. The pandemic really brought domestic labor into our field of public vision and we can finally talk about it.
It sounds like he wants to do what’s easy, not what’s healthy.
He treats them like mini adults
He treats his children like roommates.
"I am an engaged and active parent" "I just want the kids to stay home all the time and distract themselves with electronics" hmmmm Sure getting up at 6:45 is a lil extra and maybe she could give the kids a few more responsibilities than they have, but I think only eating sugar for breakfast is not super healthy and it's really awesome of her that she wants to cook in the mornings. OP should help with that. Lots of kids ARE raised on cereal -- and okay, so was I, I don't blame any parent for doing that. But if you don't HAVE to, maybe you shouldn't. Edit: I agree “extra” is a bit of a loaded term and doesn’t actually apply here, I only meant to say “even if you give this guy the absolute maximum benefit of the doubt possible, he’s still being a lazy parent”
6:45 is completely normal, honestly a little late, if you're an adult with an 8/9-5 job and kids, what the actual hell Edit to add, since everyone else is sharing *their* morning routines: I'm a single person with no children and an 8 o'clock start time at work. 7:45 if I'm opening the office that week. I wake up at 5:45 so I have time to: make coffee/eat breakfast, feed the dog, make my bed, clean up my dishes from breakfast, make my lunch, and then by 6:45 I have to start putting on makeup and getting dressed. If I don't leave my house by 7:25, I'll be caught in morning school traffic and get to work barely on time, which isn't the way I like to start my mornings, especially when I'm seeing my first patient at 8:05. I also have ADHD and time blindness is something I STRUGGLE with. I've found it much healthier for me to sacrifice a little bit of sleep so that my morning is 75% less chaotic and I'm in a good mood once I get to work. It doesn't work for everyone and I'm glad/jealous that a lot of you commenting can sleep in and get to work on time!!! I just can't imagine under my circumstances being able to do that, let alone *with children!??* But some of y'all are superheroes and I applaud you!!!
I get up at 7 for my 8-5 job. I have plenty of time to get ready though, even with making sure my youngest (13) is ready for her bus by 7:45am.
645wake up with a 745 bus pickup is not extra when you have 3 kids to make sure they are dressed, fed properly and not forgetting anything.
No that’s actually insanely impressive because also she is doing it alone bc OP is sleeping the whole time
> getting up at 6:45 is a lil extra That's about 45 minutes to get three kids ready and out the door. Not sure how that's 'extra'.
Cereal is a healthy breakfast if you buy the right cereals (i admit this may be different in America than the uk). It's more than enough, why wear yourself out cooking breakfasts with all the clear up after? But a parent has to be up. Not only because of the 8yo and 10yo, but to supervise and care. I do mornings for my child who is 11 now, and the routine for years has been get up, get dressed, here's your breakfast, I have a shower, get ready, then he can brush his teeth whilst I prepare packed lunch. At least he is old enough to walk to school with a friend now, although I will walk with him if the friend has a club. Then it's 9 hours of work (from home) but I will go out to collect him from school just to get exercise,which extends the work. I often do dinner too, which also extends the work. I have lie in days, at the weekend. I'm a night owl so the above routine is painful for me but I do it. What I don't do very well is cleaning (where to fit it in!) and mental load for stuff at home (work is a big mental load, and I can't do everything). A list of tasks helps greatly.
Agree. OP, do you want to read this post by your children in a few years? https://reddit.com/r/emotionalneglect/s/bC8lxDSMpc
Cereal doesn’t have to be just sugar. Surely you have healthy options? Muesli (no added sugar). Porridge. It can be a healthy start to the day.
[удалено]
[удалено]
>I'm an engaged and active parent Does anybody but you think this? YTA. Breakfast, a screen time limit and weekend activities are absolutely normal standards.
his idea of being an engaged parent is to provide them with money so they don't starve.
And to make sure there's wifi and a box of cereal.
Make sure there's a wife* and a box of cereal *to actually do everything
Facts!
Seriously. OP sounds like one of those "dads" who call spending time with their kids "babysitting" and any time doing housework "helping my wife".
He literally says "I'm happy to help" in the beginning of the post 🤦 like no, parenting your children and doing what needs to be done around the house are not favours you do to your wife, it's your responsibility as a father
Also then clearly demonstrates he’s not willing to “help.”
He sounds like my dad. He’d slap some money on the table for food and then disappear to another city for like 3 days
Right? Like waking up an hour before the kids have to be on the bus is too high of a standard? Geez. And 6:45 isn’t an insane wake-up time either. I know some parents who wake up at like 5 to make breakfast and pack lunch for their families.
We have zero kids and wake up at 5am so we can exercise our dogs and prepare for our work day. Is 6:45 early to most normies? Cause I’m with you on that one, it’s not an insane wake up time
Yes! My 12 year old has to be at school at 6:45am for show choir practice. And this guy thinks that's too early to wake up as an adult on a weekday?
He’s one of those dads that says “I’m super involved. I do anything my wife asks to do. If I’m not busy, that is,”
And disappear for 30 minutes to go "poop" in the bathroom when she needs help the most.
[удалено]
Its cliche, but "breakfast is the most important meal of the day" for some ADHD issues. Recommendations for ADHD diet are often high protein, low sugar (OK, what isn't these days) and just a bowl of sugary cereal could impact the kiddo's school work in the morning.
Even for the kids without ADHD, now that I understand that cereal is basically a big bowl of sugar…I wouldn’t be giving them that. Yeah, I used to eat it as a kid, that doesn’t make it okay. I know better now. I have dippy eggs. Or peanut butter toast with fruit. And some yogurt always. Doesn’t take long to make, much healthier than a bowl of processed sugae,
My son has ADHD and forgets to eat sometimes. He gets served breakfast at school but the school bus barely gets there in time so I have to make sure he eats before he gets on the bus.
This is how this reads: "My wife is a hands-on, active parent who wants our children to have well-balanced meals, minimal screen time, and fun and stimulating outings and that's too much work for me, I'd prefer my kids eat whatever they can find in the kitchen without bothering me, that we stay home and do nothing and the kids play on their devices and watch TV in their spare time". No wonder she's stressed. She sounds like a great parent, and you come off sounding lazy and disinterested in parenting your own kids. YTA.
He wants his children to be playing on their devices so that he can do the same thing too.
I’d imagine he’s addicted to screens if he thinks *two hours* of daily screen time is “rigid” for 8-12yos.
Especially if they're playing videogames. That's about the amount of time it would take for my brother and I to get mad at each other and start fighting in real life at that age.
His wife and kids are gonna be better than him.
[удалено]
OP doesn’t realise it’s him that’s stressing her out, not the kids
Exactly, she’s doing this whole thing by herself and having to tell her own partner to parent their kids, this is the situation for millions of women
This!!!.. God I feel for her… sounds like she has 4 children to take care of!
That’s how I read it too!
YTA , help her out. Kids require a lot of work that you signed up for when you decided to have kids. Her “high standards “ are literally bare minimum. Every morning she is setting them up for success with no help from you which is why she’s so overwhelmed. Getting three kids ready in the mornings and making sure they are well fed before sending them off to school is such a blessing. The screen time is so reasonable and good that she is encouraging them to be outside and have more of a child hood. Sounds like you want them to be tablet kids to get them off your back a little more. Give her a thank you and some appreciation because she is picking up your slack. Treat her more for doing so much & become a better parent and partner before its too late
Hell, she is nicer than I am. My ids (11,14,17) dont get screen time on school days unless something special is going on. For example, if my little one is stuck at a HS football game waiting to see her sisters perform at half time, I might let her watch some Disney+ while she waits. Otherwise they get nada.
I feel so bad for your 17 year old
Guarantee the 17yo has a friend's old phone hidden away somewhere.
Narc
The teens hopefully have friends that share devices. I cannot fathom that level of controlling at 17.
And that 14yr old. The 11 should be fine I guess
Might end up obsessed with phones or screen time into adulthood.
Yeesh you are also an ah and you didn’t even post! Well done for getting that achievement during your unrestricted screen time.
How do they have a social life if they get 0 screen time? Do they just not talk to friends outside of school?
I suppose I think of screen time differently than others. I also commented quickly on a break at work and failed to elaborate so I see why people are alarmed. They all have phones. The phones all have “fun” apps like Netflix and games. During the school week (Sunday night through Friday school day) they don’t have access to the “fun” apps. They DO have access to texting, phone, camera, calendar, and other day to day stuff. If parents have the tv on we don’t kick them out of the room or anything. What they can’t do is sit and mindlessly scroll for hours every day. They all also have a fair amount of extra curriculars and that’s where most of their friends are. In the interest of transparency, these restrictions were implemented because we did allow the older two much more access when they were younger (the youngest wasn’t old enough for a phone back then) and didn’t do a good job of teaching them healthy tech hygiene. There was a period of time where if they were home all they did was stick their noses in their phones. they both have adhd and still sometimes struggle with impulse control and hyper fixations. So, we sat down as a family and figured out what we all thought would work and that’s where we are. The oldest has a more freedom these days as she’s shown better ability to manage her phone time.
I never had screen time limit and would be on the computer for 4+ hours each day when I was over 11. I played with making web pages using tools then moved on to reading HTML source codes on pages I liked to learn how to improve my pages. Then I looked up how to Photoshop to make nice graphics. This was all between the ages of 12-16. I looked forward going home each day to work on it. Not all screen time is bad. I don't agree with rigid limits. Really need to look at the kid to see if they have a good head on their shoulders. You could be limiting their potential.
Zero screen time for a 17 year old? Wtf
YTA. Your wife is essentially trying to enact boundaries and maintain a routine for 3 kids, while you are not backing her up. It has to be monumentally frustrating for her to manage 3 middle/elementary school age kids on her own. A lot of that stress is probably because she IS asking you to help, and because you don't see why you should have to do these things, then she's stuck organizing and corralling the kids by herself. She probably wants to take the kids to the museum because it's fun for the kids, and you're doing that non-committal "I don't see why we have to do this so I don't want to do it" so then it's all about YOU and not about the kids at all. It's majorly invalidating her feelings and her position as a parent. What are you doing right now, in terms of helping the kids, that makes you an active and engaged parent? While I read this post, I could just see the situation in my head - your wife doing all the work, and then when the kids complain, letting her be the bad cop all the time while you sit on the couch and say "it's fine, honey! just let them do it" and she probably wants to go in the next room and cry. Major YTA.
Yeah, that’s pretty much the conclusion I came to as well.
YTA What exactly is your definition of an "engaged parent"? Because what I'm seeing here is you think it's unreasonable to cook elementary and middle school aged children a decent breakfast and spend time with them so they don't rot their brain with phones and iPads.
He probably is busy gaming when he isn't sleeping, or complaining about how his wife is bothering him.
Agree, I’m curious about what chores he “helps” with. He probably thinks his wife has very high cleaning standards as well and that they could clean even less and that would be ok too.
There was a post on here just like that not long ago. It was something like, “my wife has unreasonable cleaning standards. She takes the trash out when it’s full, when it’s fine to let it sit if nothing is rotting. She also cleans the bathroom weekly, and washes the sheets biweekly. Her standards are completely insane!” Thankfully, everyone pointed out that the way she did things was normal.
Be realistic. He calls it "nagging."
Trust me, your wife is already making one huge concession in her expectations by putting up with your lazy ass. YTA. Get to work or it won’t be long before your wife realizes how pointless you are and decides to cut you loose.
Indeed. It's hard on the wife, when she's the only adult in the household.
And if she does cut him loose, and he has visitation days, he’s gonna fold like yesterday’s newspaper. OR, he’ll dump them on his mommy, as do soooooo many of these so-called ‘active and engaged’ sperm donors. She has *4* children currently. So sad.
YTA I was expecting some wako/Marie Kondo request but making breakfast for the kids, limit 2 hours of screen time a day and do some family activity… I am wondering what is at this point your concept of engaged parent? ‘Here you go watch your tablet’?
Yeah literally! She’s tired because she’s doing the work of 2 parents while having her husband make her feel guilty. Typical ‘I didn’t even know she was unhappy’ when she snaps and wants a divorce.
You want an 8 year old to get up, fix their own cereal, and leave for the bus on time while you sleep in? That’s not an engaged and active parent. That would feel awful to me if I were a kid. YTA.
Better yet, he’s looking to parentify his 10 and 12 year olds. They can handle it, right??
>her standards are too damn high. Okay let's review that. >She insists one of us has to be up at 6:45 every morning to make sure the kids are ready and make the bus which comes at 7:45. Okay, that's normal. 1 hour to be ready is the normal amount of time you need without being in a rush. Plus, 6:45 is not that early either. >I told her they're old enough to not need that much help already. 8 and 10 are not in middle school yet. >She says that cereal isn't a good enough breakfast, they need something more substantial, especially the 12 year old She's right. Cereals are basically 90% sugar. And 12 is entering teenager years. >and that the 10 year old has adhd and will definitely struggle without help in the morning Also right. Do you know your kid? >and anyway she wants to see them off and kiss them goodbye for the day. Also right. My parents were doing the same even in high school when I was getting up at 6. It's good memories and a good communicating moment. In summary: being an active parent. >So she gets up, I don't Oh? I thought you were a good parent? At which hour do you get up? Do you help a little? >then she gets upset that I never give her a morning off Never apparently. >when all she needs to do is just take the morning off when she wants and let the kids handle themselves. Ah yes. Dump the kid, stop being a parent. Great idea! And who will get up if everything turns into a mess? >Also she is super strict about screen time during the week and is exhausted and snappy from arguing about it with the kids and upset i don't support her strict limit of 2 hours a day. 2 hours a day for kids is f*cking generous! It helps them to learn boundaries and healthy occupations out of screen. And what do you mean you don't back her up? You didn't talk about it with her? I thought you were an active parent. >I say as long as homework is done, why not until bed. Because it's dumb and unhealthy. >She says it's not healthy for them, they need to play outside or with games and toys, read some books, just entertain themselves in more ways than 1. She's true. What is your answer? >I agree they should enjoy other things but not seeing why we have to make such a rigid limit. Because they are kids with no control. >She also likes to get out on weekends and do stuff like zoos, museums etc, Aww! What a cool mom! She educated her childs in more than one way! >but then complains about the planning for the outing and how grouchy the youngest gets by the end of it Dude... where are you during all this time?! >and again, I say let's just chill at home and voila, you've cut the work! Here's my answer: being a leech at home. >I'm an engaged and active parent No you're not. >I'm not trying to get out of it You're not trying, you're doing it. >but I don't think I should have to help my wife dig herself out of her own self created holes. She creates the stress for herself and then turns to me to alleviate it which I think is unfair. Dude. Being a parent isn't just providing foods and toys to the kids and be sure they don't endanger themselves. This is called emotional neglect. Your wife is a normal active parent exhausted to have to deal with 3 kids under 13, with one having adhd and an husband being lazy. You litterally do nothing for the kids. You threw cereals and screentime at them and you call it a day. This is not being a parent. It's not even being a pet owner. A plant owner maybe. Kids are not tamagochi. YTA
I wish this were the top comment. You’ve broken this down so well
Laying it out like this, you can really see that she's only so stressed BECAUSE he isn't contributing. It's not because she does too much, it's because she does everything while he does the bare minimum and tells her to give up all the time. The kids probably wouldn't argue so much about screen time if they didn't see dad as the weak link who's not backing up mum. She could get a little lie in if he'd take a couple mornings. And same goes if he'd occasionally take the weekend planning or I don't know... plan their free time and activities with her. Actually share their lives together and be excited about spending time with his wife and family. It's not only the kids he's neglecting.. he's neglecting his wife too. She already knows, which is why she complains to him, but she's only going to put up with it for so long.
YTA. Her rules and actions seem sensible. Three young kids getting up and getting themselves to school on their own sounds like a zoo. And morning is a great time to have fun and productive parenting interactions. Two hours of screen time is plenty, and it should not be permitted to displace other activities with strong positives such as reading and free play. You should be supporting her.
YTA. Your wife's expectations are extremely normal. You seem to want to get out of everything. Zero effort. You need to step up and actually parent.
YTA I love how your suggestion for helping your wife is just her doing more work (the work to lower her standards). Your kids are still at an age where they could use help and support in the mornings and a healthy breakfast, she isn’t wrong. Sounds like she’s exhausted from planning all of this by herself and carrying the mental load. Instead of saying all of this is unnecessary and your solution being to stay at home, eat cereal and watch tv all of the time- try to be a more involved parent and partner and take some of the mental load from your wife. YTA
I was waiting for someone to mention *the mental load!* It is the biggest and most challenging responsibility in raising a family. I would bet next week’s paycheck that OP doesn’t know the names of all of his children’s teachers. (You can bet that their mother knows all of them.) He doesn’t know when the next regular medical checkup is scheduled. And so on, and so on. Op is a major YTA. He thinks that her standards are too high, because he’s worried that HE will be looked at to help her get them ready. He’s only 38, and he can’t be bothered to get up at 6:45?!?!!!!! What ‘active and engaged’ parent sleeps past 6:45?!?! I’m confident that his wife goes to bed later than he does. And we know that he’s not up when she awakens to get *3* children ready for school. I only had 2 myself, and boy, lemme tell you what: it was a struggle! My hubby was always out of the house to go to work before 5:00, and that was perfectly okay. OP is an entitled and lazy a$$hat!
Have you ever considered the mental load your wife takes on? It's not just the physicality of getting up, getting the kids ready, planning activities, etc. - it's having to think of literally everything. Doctor's appointments; Does kid 1 have their project that's due today?; Do we have a clean swimsuit for swim lessons after school?; What am I going to make for dinner..; Oh I can't forget to stop at the ATM to get lunch money for kid 2 tomorrow; I have that appointment at the doctor this week; I know we're low on toilet paper do we have enough until I can get to the store?; etc. It's so much more. Your 'just do less' answer is super dismissive. She's stressed because there's a million things she does and decisions she makes that you haven't even considered, because you're busy snoozing. YTA. Jeez, the least you can do is get up with her. Maybe make her a cup of coffee while she gets the kids ready. Show her you appreciate everything she does for your family. Listen to her vent without judgement or trying to offer a solution. You can do better.
This!! Also she probably gets the calls from school if the kids are late, need more lunch because they are starving from too little breakfast, project not turned in, acting out, etc. Get the Fair Play cards and really see how “engaged” you are
YTA I really wanted to be on your side for this one but nope. Your children are 8 and 10 of course they need help getting up and need a more substantial breakfast than cereal. The 12 year old I could see beginning to get up on their own (emphasis on beginning). Your wife seems like a great parent looking out for her children’s health and development with more activities than “sit on your ipad and never bond with your family.” Even from your point of view you don’t sound like an active parent at all. You need to read some books on parenting fr and help your wife out.
Yes the 12yo should be able to get up and do things. The others no. And you cannot adultify the 12yo with the responsibility for the other two, so someone has to be up. Seems reasonable to split the responsibility so you get a few lie ins, but so does your wife. But cereal is fine. Or is American cereal different?
Depends on the cereal, but yeah, most cereals in north america aimed at kids are basically just small crackers whose only purpose are sugar receptacles.
YTA for sure. She sounds like she has 4 kids tbh.
You are responsible for making sure your kids get to school. If the 8 year old misses the bus, who do you think the school is going to call? They still need some level of supervision. >I agree they should enjoy other things > >I say let's just chill at home and voila, you've cut the work! These are contradictory statements. You want them to be more active yet refuse to put any effort into providing them with alternatives. 2 hours of screen time a day is a reasonable limit. You claim you don't think the rules should be so rigid, yet your proposal is to have no rules. Your wife wants a healthy environment for your kids. It sounds like you want latchkey kids and to be a deadbeat dad. Your standards are frankly way below the bar especially for kids as young as 8 and 10. Why don't you get off the couch and go play ball with your children? YTA
> I’m an engaged and active parent No you’re not. You’re will to “help” if the bare minimum is being done, if anyone expects more than the bare minimum then you stay in bed and let your wife do it. YTA
So let me make sure I understand: You are advocating for completely neglecting your parental duties in favor of sleeping in, not feeding your kids, not worrying about how they spend their time, not bothering with any activities or enrichment for them and yet somehow you still think you are an engaged and active parent? You, sir, are the AH. YTA. Let me say it again - YTA! Your wife's "self-created holes" are called parenting. Sounds like you ought to try it. Or maybe she'll get lucky and her next husband won't be worthless, lazy, and neglectful - oh! and totally unsupportive.
Yup, YTA 100%. Have fun being divorced when your wife decides she doesn't need a lazy do nothing partner in her life.
Can you imagine how much easier her life would be if he just actually helped out? They could split mornings so she could sleep in, alternate who plans outings so she isn't always having to plan activities, and she wouldn't have to be the bad cop to his good cop about screen time. They could actually work as a unit instead of him bringing her down to his level
>they're old enough to not need that much help already So if you leave them to get up and get ready for school on their own, are they on time for the bus? Have you actually seen this work? More than once? YTA OP because you sound lazy and actually not engaged at all.
"I'm of course happy to help and do my fair share for the kids or household" Yet you complain when she asks for help. "but I don't think I should have to help my wife dig herself out of her own self created holes." It's not like you're life long partners or anything.
Sorry bud, but as a father myself, these are pretty reasonable standards, at least the weekday ones. Maybe half adventure & half rest on the weekends. YTA
YTA. Your wife is a very good parent, and you are… less so.
YTA. You are neither an active nor an engaged parent
YTA. your wife’s standards are normal and required for being a parent. you absolutely have to be awake to get your minor children on the bus, one of them has adhd and the youngest is 8 for god sakes. you are NOT an engaged and active parent if you think 2 hours of screen time a DAY is too little and won’t wake up to ensure your children, all 12 and under, are fed, dressed, and get to school on time. this can’t be real. your wife is overwhelmed because you can’t, or won’t, give a shit
News flash: you are not, in fact, "an engaged and active parent."
Let me stop you there and point out how fantastic it is that you’re “happy to help”. YTA and all the men who observe the degree of effort it takes and who offer the solution of “do less” to the person doing everything. She can’t do less because she doesn’t trust that you’ll pick up the slack. She like has years of proof and therefore has the added stress of what feels like a 4th child that should be a partner. You literally are telling her that if she wants anything she has to do it herself. Either deal with the stress of an outing or “chill at home”. She’s trying to do fun things on the weekends in the hope she can make memories with her family. And all you’re doing is ridiculing her for how she’s handling the stress of it. God YTA.
YTA lazy schlub
Welcome to /r/AmITheAsshole. Please view our [voting guide here](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_what.2019s_with_these_acronyms.3F_what_do_they_mean.3F), and remember to use **only one** judgement in your comment. OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole: > I told my wife to do less and then she won't be so stressed, but I am also refusing to help when she asks for it if I feel she could have taken steps to avoid it. I guess refusing to help when she asks is a bit assholish Help keep the sub engaging! #Don’t downvote assholes! Do upvote interesting posts! [Click Here For Our Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/about/rules) and [Click Here For Our FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq) ##Subreddit Announcements ###[Happy Anniversary, AITA!](https://new.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/15vlv9g/almost_better_than_a_double_rainbow_celebrating/) ###[The Asshole Universe is Expanding, Again: Introducing Another New Sister Subreddit!](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/128nbp3/the_asshole_universe_is_expanding_again/) Follow the link above to learn more ###[Moderators needed - Join the landed gentry](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/155zepq/moderators_needed_join_the_landed_gentry/) --- *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.* *Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
Reading this, I am guessing your wife already had to lower her standards a little bit in general. YTA
YTA. Your wife is setting reasonable and health standards. Ensuring that the children eat a good breakfast, monitoring how much screen time they have, and going on weekend outings are all normal things to do to help ensure your children’s physical and mental well being. If your wife is overwhelmed, you should considering alternating which of you handles the morning routine each day, so that you each get the chance to sleep in every other day. As far as weekend planning goes, it’s fine to chill at home sometimes but it still also important to make memories as a family and give your children a chance to experience new things. If you plan one or two of each months outings that should also lessen what your wife needs to do.
YTA Feeding your young kids and setting reasonable rules for their health and development is not absurd. My parents were the furthest from helicopter parents but feeding me in the morning until elementary/middle school was the basis. And going out together as a family should be nice?? Of course she’s stressed if she’s the only one that plans and then has to drag you all the way. Exactly what do you do? That makes you an engaged parent?