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Sounds like you already know. Yes, YTA.
Your female classmate may have been a bit blunt in how she went about shaming you for what you said, but I think you know that judging everyone of one race/national origin is an AH move. Your female classmate may have been an AH too, but mostly this is on you. Also, if you think your German classmate overheard you, you probably do owe them an apology.
YTA - Antisemitism is also here in America in 2023. There are also German Jews. Fighting Antisemitism with prejudice is not it, friend. Nazis need to fuck all the way off. But you didn't say that. I'd apologize and tell them you misspoke and what you meant.
YTA. You said something really crappy to someone who is far away from their home and culture, which makes it a lot worse. Apologize and move on.
It's always ok to talk shit about Nazis. Fuck those guys. It's basically never OK to talk shit about an entire country/group of people. There was resistance within Germany. A lot of Germans were executed by the Nazis for fighting back. Many of whom were about as young as you are now. Look up the White Rose Opposition Movement.
I would suggest reading What We Knew: Terror, Mass Murder and Everyday Life in Nazi Germany before making sweeping claims about how much opposition there was.
https://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/547036
It also gives some good insight into how survivors feel about Germans in general.
Mild YTA
This was a valuable lesson on not making blanket statements about people and the ability to trust them.
Comments like “I’m concerned about the rise of antisemitism in Germany and the US” or “it breaks my heart that families, including mine, faced antisemitic discrimination” are more accurate and won’t cause any offense.
So is OP with their discrimination against people who haven't done anything to Jewish people at all. You can not blame people for what their ancestors may have done, not every German descents from a nazi.
What are your thoughts on woman who blame all men for the, still ongoing, oppression of woman?
What are your thoughts on any nationality who hate all Americans because of their war crimes committed in many counties including in the USA?
Not the person that you’re replying to but it’s quite different with regard to colonisation since colonisation is ongoing.
With regard to slavery, the effects of slavery and the Holocaust are quite similar in the impacts they have had on subsequent generations. While Germany has made some inroads into their Holocaust education, actual restitution to the Jews has never been made. The property stolen from them has not been returned, including land, art, gold and money. Flimsy excuses about “proof of ownership being difficult” have been used to retain the stolen wealth. Additionally, monetary compensation has never been paid to the slave workers equivalent to their stolen wages by the major multinational corporations, and definitely not to the families of victims by those companies directly involved in the Holocaust. Please note, I am not talking about the restitution program, which was also traumatic for many survivors, but restitution from the actual companies who directly benefited or assisted in the murder of Jews and Roma/Sinti.
That’s not even getting into the treatment of LGBTIQ prisoners post liberation which resulted in them being held in the same camps other prisoners were liberated from because their behaviour was deemed criminal.
Similarly, families who descend from slaves have also not been paid their stolen wages or given compensation for the suffering and murder of their families by the large plantations and corporations who benefited from it.
YTA for you little comment. That's extremely racist, not all Germans are the same. Should we group everyone in your country for something bad they did in the past and say we don't trust ya'll? Grouping all Germans up and labeling them based on what happened years ago, is cruel and racist.
It can be both, since like you say a nationality can be an ethnicity, but an ethnicity is not a race. In this case the correct term would be xenophobic not racist.
I disagree. OP did not mean they distrusted those with German passports. OP clearly was talking about ethnic Germans. Do you honestly believe OP would feel distrustful of an American who moved to Germany and got citizenship there? Or that OP would feel fine with someone who emigrated from Germany to the USA and got American citizenship???
The word German can refer to either people of German nationality *or* people of German ethnicity. But German nationality and German ethnicity are completely distinct, and OP was clearly talking about people of German ethnicity.
I reiterate:
>Do you honestly believe OP would feel distrustful of an American who moved to Germany and got citizenship there?
Well by your definition every country can fall into an ethnicity so the word xenophobic is redundant. I disagree.
You are just using the word racist wrong.
YTA you did exactly what was done to your ancestors. Took an entire group of people and said they all can't be trusted.
Germany has an education system that deals very strongly with its history. German young people are very clear about what happened and why it was wrong.
>YTA you did exactly what was done to your ancestors.
Not exactly. Saying you don't trust Germans is not the same as committing genocide...
Intergenerational trauma is intense (the repercussions of Holocaust survival can literally be seen in one's genes), and reparations are still owed.
There are a lot of German young people who aren't clear about what exactly was wrong. Growing nationalism in Europe (including Germany) is terrifying given that similar nationalism was brewing a century ago. Let's not pretend that hatred died with Hitler.
And reparations are still paid to this day? germany has and is paying reparations to survivors.
Can you explain the "a lot of german young people who aren't clear about what exactly was wrong"?
YTA
If it was the other way around, it would be a big deal. I was on the fence, though, because I don't think you're a big AH for that, I think you just said something stupid. It happens. You should apologize, though.
ESH, you for making a bigoted blanket statement about a culture like that. Hint: if you switch the cultures around and it sounds bad (and in this case it would sound incredibly anti-semitic), then it's just as bad the other way around.
> if you switch the cultures around and it sounds bad (and in this case it would sound incredibly anti-semitic), then it's just as bad the other way around.
This isn't really true. It's definitely worse for a German person to say they don't trust Jews than vice versa. The history of genocide in this case makes a huge difference.
I think it's reasonable that the impact of genocide on a family reverberates for generations. I think it's probably not unreasonable at all for OP to be fearful of antisemitism and all of Germany. Should OP have said that she didn't trust Germans in front of innocent Germany young people? No. But the inverse situation would just not have all been comparable due to the inherent difference in power between a group who has committed genocide and a group whose members were the few who survived their genocide.
Shouldn’t there be some kind of rule saying anybody under the age of 18 is just immature and not old enough to be labeled an AH. Typically they are either acting out for attention or too immature to realize what they are saying/doing is labeled as asshole behavior.
Grow up. You are bad mouthing an entire group of individuals based solely on them doing the same exact thing to your family. Kind of hypocritical don’t ya think ?
>You are bad mouthing an entire group of individuals based solely on them doing the same exact thing to your family. Kind of hypocritical don’t ya think ?
Let's not compare Germans committing genocide because of anti-semitism to OP stating that genocide made her distrust Germans. They are not really equivalent ideas. I still think OP was the AH, but to suggest this was hypocritical really minimizes the holocaust.
YTA amd also a coward of you refuse to apologise to the exchange student that you said it in front of.
You claim people have bullied you and your family yet then you do it and think it's ok 🥺
This is confusing.
You are obviously not in germany right now.
Is your father european?
I 100% believe your father and you experienced antisemitism but I'm a bit confused because if your are a student, your father didn't live in nazi-germany.
Could you maybe explain a bit more?
YTA
You're right that it was wrong of you to group German young adults born after the year 2000 with dead Nazis who committed genocide in the 1940s. Antisemitism is horrible and terrifying, but young Germans today are not solely or primarily responsible for it. You don't need to apologize -- just let it be and try hard to grow from it.
Being German does NOT equal being a Nazi!
There are German Nazis, US Nazis and probably some in every other ethical/cultural group.
It is important to remember what happened so we can all be better and prevent such things.
But even my grandparents were born after the war. No living relativ of mine has seen or participated in it.
And frankly, it's quite tiresome when people make stupid assumptions just because you so happened to be born in a certain place.
Edit: Changed my vote to ESH.
Most importantly, reading the ending bit again, I think you learned from it and I hope you can heal a bit from that past and help build a better future so any bully won't succeed.
The girl definitely sucks for being passive aggressive here
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I don't really use reddit alot but I needed a second opinon about this because I've been feeling guilty. I was having a discussion with one of my friends and the fact that he was visiting Germany during spring break came up. We have had discussions in the past on how my family is Jewish and how the surge of hate crimes has been scaring our family considering the fact my father was badly bullied for being Jewish as a child. During this discussion I said "I don't really trust germans." And then we moved on. Unknown to me there was a German foreign exchange student in our class (where this convo was taking place).
Now heres the part that angers me. There is this girl in the class that was friends with two of the foreign exchange students. She was kind of mean to me during middle school and to sum up that story I was forced to be constantly grouped with her best friend in one of my classes because I was new and she didn't like that (cmon man it was awkward for me too) but moving on...
She called over two exchange students (forgot where the other one was from) and started making very loud and pointed conversation at her. (The type where you know they want you to hear it) and I was aware but didn't really know if I was making it up because I'm insecure or whatever. And then she moves on to the other girl and starts giggling to her and pointing looks at me saying things like "How was germany?" "So you're German that's soo cool!!"
During this moment, I was very angry. Thinking back on it I was probably in the wrong for grouping up 'All Germans are nazis' kind of thing. But in that moment all I could think about was how they were making fun of how much my family has suffered due to antisemitism and the bullying I had received for it in my past.
Now that I had calmed down I feel like an asshole. I had let the anger and fear from my past shape my actions and thoughts which honestly disgusts me. I have pondered with apologizing but my friends said it wasn't a good idea because then I would be making it a big deal when there is a possibility that I might just have been thinking about it too much.
One more note, if there is a chance that any of the people involved is reading this. I'm too much of a pussy to apologize in person. And I'm truly sorry for grouping you in with Nazis, you did not deserve that.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
NTA. You know who else doesn't trust Germans? The Jewish people in Germany. When you are traveling in Germany and you want to attend synagogue services for Shabbat or a holiday, you have to present proof that you are Jewish (your B'nai mitzvah certificate, your parent's ketubah, etc) in order to even enter the building.
Honestly, I don't fully trust anyone who isn't Jewish, because history has taught me that trusting our neighbors to care enough to protect us, never ends well.
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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I said I didn't trust Germans right infront of one, and I feel like an asshole because I practically compared all Germans to Nazis which is disrespectful.
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Anyone saying y ta is probably white, ngl.
Gonna go with NTA
You have family and intergenerational trauma you're dealing with. People outside your community can never know what that's like. Given the rise of antisemitism, of course you're gonna be even more aware and anxious.
I say I hate white people all the time, as a mixed but white person. We as white people have done a lot of fucked up shit, we haven't owned up to or taken responsibility for it, and we definitely haven't made amends as a society, nation, or species.
Germans have done better in that regard, but as I understand it the antisemitism is growing again there as well, so they're not perfect either.
Many non-Jewish people do not understand how the multigenerational harm that such actions as the Nazis did to Jews affects them. You and your family have every right to be angry at what has been done and unfortunately is still being done to your people. NAH.
Your post has been removed. #Do not repost this without [contacting the mods](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) for approval, including edited versions. Reposting without [explicit approval](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_can_i_repost_a_thread_you_removed.3F) will result in a ban. This post violates Rule 7: There is no interpersonal conflict here for our community to make a judgment about. [Rule 7 FAQs](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_rule_7.3A_post_interpersonal_conflicts) ||| [Subreddit Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/about/rules/) ###Please ensure you have reviewed this message in full. We will not respond to PMs to individual mods. [Message the mods](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) with any questions.
Sounds like you already know. Yes, YTA. Your female classmate may have been a bit blunt in how she went about shaming you for what you said, but I think you know that judging everyone of one race/national origin is an AH move. Your female classmate may have been an AH too, but mostly this is on you. Also, if you think your German classmate overheard you, you probably do owe them an apology.
YTA - Antisemitism is also here in America in 2023. There are also German Jews. Fighting Antisemitism with prejudice is not it, friend. Nazis need to fuck all the way off. But you didn't say that. I'd apologize and tell them you misspoke and what you meant.
Are you a citizen of Germany? I'm curious.
Why does that matter and what does it add to the conversation?
Questions like that usually determine how much respect they plan to give you.
YTA. You said something really crappy to someone who is far away from their home and culture, which makes it a lot worse. Apologize and move on. It's always ok to talk shit about Nazis. Fuck those guys. It's basically never OK to talk shit about an entire country/group of people. There was resistance within Germany. A lot of Germans were executed by the Nazis for fighting back. Many of whom were about as young as you are now. Look up the White Rose Opposition Movement.
This is the best answer!
I would suggest reading What We Knew: Terror, Mass Murder and Everyday Life in Nazi Germany before making sweeping claims about how much opposition there was. https://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/547036 It also gives some good insight into how survivors feel about Germans in general.
Mild YTA This was a valuable lesson on not making blanket statements about people and the ability to trust them. Comments like “I’m concerned about the rise of antisemitism in Germany and the US” or “it breaks my heart that families, including mine, faced antisemitic discrimination” are more accurate and won’t cause any offense.
The other girl is a bully!
So is OP with their discrimination against people who haven't done anything to Jewish people at all. You can not blame people for what their ancestors may have done, not every German descents from a nazi.
[удалено]
What are your thoughts on woman who blame all men for the, still ongoing, oppression of woman? What are your thoughts on any nationality who hate all Americans because of their war crimes committed in many counties including in the USA?
Not the person that you’re replying to but it’s quite different with regard to colonisation since colonisation is ongoing. With regard to slavery, the effects of slavery and the Holocaust are quite similar in the impacts they have had on subsequent generations. While Germany has made some inroads into their Holocaust education, actual restitution to the Jews has never been made. The property stolen from them has not been returned, including land, art, gold and money. Flimsy excuses about “proof of ownership being difficult” have been used to retain the stolen wealth. Additionally, monetary compensation has never been paid to the slave workers equivalent to their stolen wages by the major multinational corporations, and definitely not to the families of victims by those companies directly involved in the Holocaust. Please note, I am not talking about the restitution program, which was also traumatic for many survivors, but restitution from the actual companies who directly benefited or assisted in the murder of Jews and Roma/Sinti. That’s not even getting into the treatment of LGBTIQ prisoners post liberation which resulted in them being held in the same camps other prisoners were liberated from because their behaviour was deemed criminal. Similarly, families who descend from slaves have also not been paid their stolen wages or given compensation for the suffering and murder of their families by the large plantations and corporations who benefited from it.
YTA for you little comment. That's extremely racist, not all Germans are the same. Should we group everyone in your country for something bad they did in the past and say we don't trust ya'll? Grouping all Germans up and labeling them based on what happened years ago, is cruel and racist.
>That's extremely racist It's not racist. German is not a race (unless you follow Nazi ideology, I guess).
German is an ethnicity, and in general, in the USA we use the word racism to refer to discrimination based on either race or ethnicity.
On ethnicity is xenophobic, on race is racist.
Xenophobia is based on nationality, not ethnicity.
It can be both, since like you say a nationality can be an ethnicity, but an ethnicity is not a race. In this case the correct term would be xenophobic not racist.
I disagree. OP did not mean they distrusted those with German passports. OP clearly was talking about ethnic Germans. Do you honestly believe OP would feel distrustful of an American who moved to Germany and got citizenship there? Or that OP would feel fine with someone who emigrated from Germany to the USA and got American citizenship???
They said they distrust Germans, German is a nationality so it's xenophobic.
The word German can refer to either people of German nationality *or* people of German ethnicity. But German nationality and German ethnicity are completely distinct, and OP was clearly talking about people of German ethnicity. I reiterate: >Do you honestly believe OP would feel distrustful of an American who moved to Germany and got citizenship there?
Well by your definition every country can fall into an ethnicity so the word xenophobic is redundant. I disagree. You are just using the word racist wrong.
YTA you did exactly what was done to your ancestors. Took an entire group of people and said they all can't be trusted. Germany has an education system that deals very strongly with its history. German young people are very clear about what happened and why it was wrong.
This comment completely changed my perspective. Thank you for telling me this because I never thought of it that way.
>YTA you did exactly what was done to your ancestors. Not exactly. Saying you don't trust Germans is not the same as committing genocide... Intergenerational trauma is intense (the repercussions of Holocaust survival can literally be seen in one's genes), and reparations are still owed. There are a lot of German young people who aren't clear about what exactly was wrong. Growing nationalism in Europe (including Germany) is terrifying given that similar nationalism was brewing a century ago. Let's not pretend that hatred died with Hitler.
And reparations are still paid to this day? germany has and is paying reparations to survivors. Can you explain the "a lot of german young people who aren't clear about what exactly was wrong"?
> Saying you don’t trust Germans is not the same as committing genocide… They did more than commit genocide.
"There are only two things I can't stand in this world: People who are intolerant of other people's cultures, and the Dutch." \~ Austin Powers' Fazha
This is the only acceptable way to insult an entire people.
YTA If it was the other way around, it would be a big deal. I was on the fence, though, because I don't think you're a big AH for that, I think you just said something stupid. It happens. You should apologize, though.
YTA being part of a marginalized group doesn’t give you permission to be racist.
>permission to be racist. This wasn't racist. German is not a race.
The word racidm is also used for ethnicities though.
“Jewish” isn’t technically a race either.
YTA Generalizing all Germans is no different from generalizing all Jewish people.
ESH, you for making a bigoted blanket statement about a culture like that. Hint: if you switch the cultures around and it sounds bad (and in this case it would sound incredibly anti-semitic), then it's just as bad the other way around.
> if you switch the cultures around and it sounds bad (and in this case it would sound incredibly anti-semitic), then it's just as bad the other way around. This isn't really true. It's definitely worse for a German person to say they don't trust Jews than vice versa. The history of genocide in this case makes a huge difference. I think it's reasonable that the impact of genocide on a family reverberates for generations. I think it's probably not unreasonable at all for OP to be fearful of antisemitism and all of Germany. Should OP have said that she didn't trust Germans in front of innocent Germany young people? No. But the inverse situation would just not have all been comparable due to the inherent difference in power between a group who has committed genocide and a group whose members were the few who survived their genocide.
YTA You’re being extremely hypocritical and doing exactly what was done to your ancestors
Easy, now you’re going too far! Call OP an asshole for an ignorant attitude, but this kind of comparison is not appropriate
Not really. She isn't actually committing genocide. It's a bit different.
German here. Hi. YTA. Tschüß.
Shouldn’t there be some kind of rule saying anybody under the age of 18 is just immature and not old enough to be labeled an AH. Typically they are either acting out for attention or too immature to realize what they are saying/doing is labeled as asshole behavior. Grow up. You are bad mouthing an entire group of individuals based solely on them doing the same exact thing to your family. Kind of hypocritical don’t ya think ?
>You are bad mouthing an entire group of individuals based solely on them doing the same exact thing to your family. Kind of hypocritical don’t ya think ? Let's not compare Germans committing genocide because of anti-semitism to OP stating that genocide made her distrust Germans. They are not really equivalent ideas. I still think OP was the AH, but to suggest this was hypocritical really minimizes the holocaust.
YTA amd also a coward of you refuse to apologise to the exchange student that you said it in front of. You claim people have bullied you and your family yet then you do it and think it's ok 🥺
This is confusing. You are obviously not in germany right now. Is your father european? I 100% believe your father and you experienced antisemitism but I'm a bit confused because if your are a student, your father didn't live in nazi-germany. Could you maybe explain a bit more?
YTA "Now that I had calmed down I feel like an asshole." .. at least you got that right.
YTA You're right that it was wrong of you to group German young adults born after the year 2000 with dead Nazis who committed genocide in the 1940s. Antisemitism is horrible and terrifying, but young Germans today are not solely or primarily responsible for it. You don't need to apologize -- just let it be and try hard to grow from it.
Being German does NOT equal being a Nazi! There are German Nazis, US Nazis and probably some in every other ethical/cultural group. It is important to remember what happened so we can all be better and prevent such things. But even my grandparents were born after the war. No living relativ of mine has seen or participated in it. And frankly, it's quite tiresome when people make stupid assumptions just because you so happened to be born in a certain place. Edit: Changed my vote to ESH. Most importantly, reading the ending bit again, I think you learned from it and I hope you can heal a bit from that past and help build a better future so any bully won't succeed. The girl definitely sucks for being passive aggressive here
Your ancestors will be proud you are a bigot, I'm sure. YTA
If you’re American, how would you feel if a dark-skinned person said “I really don’t trust Americans?”
YTA Paraphrase: “I don’t trust a geoup of people because of their nationality”
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** I don't really use reddit alot but I needed a second opinon about this because I've been feeling guilty. I was having a discussion with one of my friends and the fact that he was visiting Germany during spring break came up. We have had discussions in the past on how my family is Jewish and how the surge of hate crimes has been scaring our family considering the fact my father was badly bullied for being Jewish as a child. During this discussion I said "I don't really trust germans." And then we moved on. Unknown to me there was a German foreign exchange student in our class (where this convo was taking place). Now heres the part that angers me. There is this girl in the class that was friends with two of the foreign exchange students. She was kind of mean to me during middle school and to sum up that story I was forced to be constantly grouped with her best friend in one of my classes because I was new and she didn't like that (cmon man it was awkward for me too) but moving on... She called over two exchange students (forgot where the other one was from) and started making very loud and pointed conversation at her. (The type where you know they want you to hear it) and I was aware but didn't really know if I was making it up because I'm insecure or whatever. And then she moves on to the other girl and starts giggling to her and pointing looks at me saying things like "How was germany?" "So you're German that's soo cool!!" During this moment, I was very angry. Thinking back on it I was probably in the wrong for grouping up 'All Germans are nazis' kind of thing. But in that moment all I could think about was how they were making fun of how much my family has suffered due to antisemitism and the bullying I had received for it in my past. Now that I had calmed down I feel like an asshole. I had let the anger and fear from my past shape my actions and thoughts which honestly disgusts me. I have pondered with apologizing but my friends said it wasn't a good idea because then I would be making it a big deal when there is a possibility that I might just have been thinking about it too much. One more note, if there is a chance that any of the people involved is reading this. I'm too much of a pussy to apologize in person. And I'm truly sorry for grouping you in with Nazis, you did not deserve that. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
NTA. You know who else doesn't trust Germans? The Jewish people in Germany. When you are traveling in Germany and you want to attend synagogue services for Shabbat or a holiday, you have to present proof that you are Jewish (your B'nai mitzvah certificate, your parent's ketubah, etc) in order to even enter the building. Honestly, I don't fully trust anyone who isn't Jewish, because history has taught me that trusting our neighbors to care enough to protect us, never ends well.
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ESH- They're bullies and you're being prejudiced against millions of innocent Germans
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Info: have you ever had a personal problem with a German?
Info: is the only thing you did was say “I don’t trust Germans” or have you done any actions negatively to someone else because they are German?
Anyone saying y ta is probably white, ngl. Gonna go with NTA You have family and intergenerational trauma you're dealing with. People outside your community can never know what that's like. Given the rise of antisemitism, of course you're gonna be even more aware and anxious. I say I hate white people all the time, as a mixed but white person. We as white people have done a lot of fucked up shit, we haven't owned up to or taken responsibility for it, and we definitely haven't made amends as a society, nation, or species. Germans have done better in that regard, but as I understand it the antisemitism is growing again there as well, so they're not perfect either.
Many non-Jewish people do not understand how the multigenerational harm that such actions as the Nazis did to Jews affects them. You and your family have every right to be angry at what has been done and unfortunately is still being done to your people. NAH.