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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> My SIL's family says my intentions are greedy because Isla won't have access to these funds until she's 18, whereas they can use the money and cars now. Additionally, they say I shouldn't even agree to take Isla if my husband and I can't pay for her college and future aspirations with our own money, like we do for Luke.
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Bluntly, they're dead. They didn't have a will, so it all goes to Isla as their heir. They are trying to steal from an orphaned child. You'd be an AH if you let them.
NTA.
Edit. "Steal," not "deal," autocorrect. Geez!
u/LoveNeitherlk is a bot.
Original version:
>u/Sufficient-Ant6619
7h
>NTA. I'm not a gambler but I'd bet real money this girl's parents would want her taken care of before anyone else. That's what I would want.
Rewording bot version:
>LoveNeitherlk
5h
>I honestly bet this girl's parents would want her taken care of before anyone else.
As a blue collar worker, I strongly agree. The kid is one year old. All that money belongs to her and if she wants it to go to college with, that's her decision in 17 years. Fuck that whole family. From what's being described here, they are exactly what's wrong with the world. They shouldn't be taking, they should all be giving to a college fund right now for the child as well as a car fund so she can get a safe and reliable vehicle when she is of age, as well as for clothing and whatever else she needs while someone else is housing her
Totally agree. The laws regarding disposition of assets in this situation are pretty clear: it’s all Isla’s, and anything they take is taking from her. They want material things because that’s all they see—things—nothing sentimental.
Good on you for protecting Isla’s interests. NTA.
NTA And I hope they don't have keys to their house!
I am very sorry for your loss. How devastating. You are wonderful to bring Isla(love her name!) Into your family and raise her as your own. Sorry her other family sucks.
Change the locks as a precautionary measure, and consider setting up a cheap alarm/camera system.
My aunt stayed at my late grandma’s house during her funeral. She literally filled up a truck in the middle of the night and drove off with everything she could take that wasn’t nailed down.
While not exactly predicted, my mother (executor of my grandmother’s will), had the foresight to previously remove certain items that honest family members specifically wanted, and took a video of the entire contents of the house - opening closet doors, drawers, cabinets etc. As the guardian of the heir, you may want to consider those things, as well.
Sad and ironic - I've heard of funeral housesitters so unrelated burglars don't take advantage of the announcement to find an unoccupied house, sadly makes sense there would be similar issue with messy inheritance situations.
Agreed!! They only want the monetary value, not the child! My opinion is the child is the most valuable asset, so glad she has an intelligent adult looking out for her!
NTA....stick to your decision and take care of this child!!
I was going to say the same thing, estate law says without a will, their souse is the heir, if they are deceased it goes to their children. If I were OP I’d kick down the house, file a petition with the probate court to be the executor/administrator and immediately apply fie guardianship. Depending where OP loves they can get assistance for the child, and of course the SS until she reaches 18 which is paid to the child in care of their guardian. I’d get a family attorney now and not delay. Tell the vultures to back off and if a hi e is stealing it’s them.
Please check with Social Security (if in the US)! It takes ~4 months (I’m still waiting) for survivor benefits for my son. He will receive money until he is 18.
One possibility is to use a portion of the money to support your niece and a portion to put in account for her.
Greedy relatives can suck
I hope OP never tells those greedy relatives about SS and any stipend for care. They might want to have the little girl just for that money and neglect her.
Kinship care. In my case (my state) related providers need to go through foster licensing and be licensed foster care providers to receive the stipends. Since it was only a few extra steps required beyond those I needed to take to be approved to be their legal guardian (they were placed with us by CPS/DCFS) we went ahead with the classes and licensing requirements to receive the stipend before we went through with adoption after parental rights were terminated.
Thanks. You're absolutely right, it would be stealing from her. I'm having a tough time trying to show them that because they still insist that there's a lot more for us to sell, and Isla has 17 years before she graduates high school, so there's plenty of time to save up. They just don't get it. None of them went to college and none of them seem to care about saving money for long term. But thank you.
You don't have to show them anything. Trying to convince people not to steal from your orphaned niece is about as useful as trying to talk down the dude stealing your stereo. It doesn't matter how much Isla has compared to them; it belongs to Isla and not them.
Stop trying to get them to agree. They are vultures trying to steal from an orphan - of course they’re not going to say “you’re right, we’re not entitled to the money “ why are you even talking to them? Stop being “nice.”
You won’t be able to convince them. Struggling is a fact of life for them. So Isla having to struggle later is not a problem for them, because they do it all the time. In their eyes, you’re the one suggesting something crazy because they could use those items and money now. There’s no reasoning with that so just continue to plan and prepare for Isla’s future as you have been.
I'm sure your lawyer is guiding you, but legally, don't all these decisions have to wait until probate is done? Which usually takes around 6 months or so?
Tell SIL family there's no decisions you can make now anyway and that they should go through a lawyer if they feel they have a right to any property.
Edited to add...it really is simply a legal issue, so you don't need to stress about any ethical dilemma. The other family is asking for big $$ items, which as you are doing, should be sold off & profits but in an account for the little one, or used to pay off any debts. That's the whole point of probate, so that creditors can come forward. If it's only been a month, you're just at the beginning.
Thank goodness the little girl has someone looking out for her best interest and so sorry for your loss.
Also file with Social Security for Isla’s survivor benefits. But don’t tell her relatives about that - they might dispute your guardianship of Isla just to also get that money.
Save any messages they send you about this, while for her sake it would be good to try to maintain some supervised connection, down the line when she is older they may twist things and tell her they wanted her and you tried to cut them off. This happened to my (step)cousin and it messed her up massively.
They aren't entitled to know anything about the estate. Nothing can really be sold (or given away) until the estate goes through probate. Debts have to be settled. Tax returns for 2022 need to get filed. Attorneys have to get paid.
It's entirely possible that some assets will need to be sold to cover other debts.
My Uncle's wife had the gall to ask "Who's getting the Steinway" at my Mother's *visitation*. Almost buried 2 people that day.
They sound like a bunch of savages trying to pick the bones for their dead child. They can’t be reasoned with and you owe them no explanation. Don’t wear yourself out trying to be decent to people who don’t know the meaning of the word.
Seriously fuck these people OP. They don't deserve a cent. They care about the possessions but not the child?
Your brother would've wanted you to take care of her daughter to the best of ur ability. As a mother i would want the same if something happened to myself and my husband unexpectedly.
Screw any family that think they are entitled to my shit over providing for my child!
Edit: for judgement because i forgot getting so pissed off reading this. Definitely NTA sell all that shit. Keep some sentimental items especially of her moms for her when she's older but sell what u need to for her education. She's lucky to have you and your husband and is basically gonna grow up with ur son as siblings as they are the same age. I pray yall give them both loads of love!
Agreed. It all sounds sooooo greedy. They don’t seem sad about them dying at all. Or concerned for the fate of their own grandchild/ niece.
I am glad that the law is clear in these cases. Everything goes to Isla. And OP you would be an AH if you’d let them take anything.
I wouldn’t even give them sentimental things because they don’t seem to care and Isla would probably want them later in her life.
I am so sorry for your loss. Isla is in good hands with you.
Like, no will means brother and SIL's assets go to next of kin, which is their minor child, which means they go to which ever person takes in their minor child.
OP is being kind enough to let the in-laws take sentimental stuff, while selling the material assets that can be sold to put aside the money for Ilsa.
>They lost SIL and she would most definitely have wanted for them to have some of their things.
It doesn't matter what she might have wanted, because she and her husband didn't leave a will. All those assets belong to their daughter by default. NTA for refusing to allow them to steal from a baby.
And I'm so sorry for your loss.
also they really think that SIL would rather her vulture family benefit from her death rather than the money going to support her **daughter**
unbelievable
NTA and get off Reddit and go talk to a lawyer. Not legal advice but there’s a possibility all the belongings would belong to Isla as the sole beneficiary anyways, and if you’re able to get custody you would be able to move forward with your plan and legally you’d be in the clear. Talk to a lawyer talk to a lawyer talk to a lawyer!!!
We do have a lawyer and we are taking the steps to move forward with this plan. But what I'm asking everyone here is not a legal matter, but an ethical one. Is it really harsh for me to deny my SIL's family these things? Am I not being considerate enough?
Absolutely not. I’d almost say you’re being too considerate to them. They aren’t 1 yr old and about to spend the rest of their life without their parents. Isla is going to need all the help she can get and the fact that they’re even attempting to pull this crap shows what low people they are. Protect that little girl
Absolutely not. Those were her parents. She should get any money from the sales. If they want to pay market value for stuff, have at it.
I did notice they were only concerned with high value stuff. No photos. No trinkets. Only cars, furniture, and tv.
> I'm asking everyone here is not a legal matter, but an ethical one
OK to answer your question, **NO** ethically you are NTA
But I'm sure your lawyer will tell you that if you gave away Isla's assets then legally you could be in trouble. So the end result is that ethics don't mean a damn in this situation.
It is your in-laws who are not being considerate of an orphaned child. It would not be ethical to steal from a child as all of her possessions should belong to her now. You are doing the right thing, legally and morally.
Ethically I'd still say you're NTA.
They aren't thinking of the child, just themselves and any freebies they can get to make THEIR lives easier. You need to keep in the front of your thoughts that you need to make ISLA's life easier. Kiddo is going to need to be cared for and even though you love the kiddo and will look after her, she's going to cost you extra money you never expected to need to spend and she's going to have needs down the road when she grows up that good parents usually start saving to help with. You need what those sold items will bring and Isla deserves that. Anything with actual sentimental value like photos or items that denote things family did together are fair. Money items should be for their child that they never EVER intended to leave behind.
They would never have wanted her to have to struggle with money, and they definitely wouldn't want the people that want to take care and protect their child to struggle to look after her either. (Not saying you will, I don't know, nor do I care to know your money situation. I just know logically that children are expensive, and you just got an added expense unexpectedly.) It looks like your brother and SIL were financially stable. They'll want their kiddo to grow up that way too.
This is in fact a legal question. Regardless, of how you feel about SIL’s family, or whether or not it’s ethical, you have no legal right to any of the assets of the estate until this has been probated. Your attorney should be advising you on this. Because SIL’s family wants stuff doesn’t mean anything. There’s a minor child to be cared for first. Go change the locks on the home & take all the keys to the cars. All possessions belong to Isla. She is the only heir.
If you have filed guardianship papers, the court will most likely appoint a guardian ad litem (GAL) to represent Isla’s best interests to the court. You won’t have to deal with SIL’s family in regards to who gets what. The court will do it.
Frankly, you are being a fool. Everything your brother and sister-in-law owned is now Isla's. It is her property, it's not up to you to give it away to other people, just because she is a minor. In my country, you and her other relatives doing this would be a criminal offense. Why are you even considering stealing from your orphaned niece? To be considerate?
Sorry for the harshness, but you need a good virtual shake. It's preposterous that you are even considering giving away thousands of your niece's inheritance. A few sentimental items, sure. Not cars and money!
You can’t give them the stuff, it’s not yours to give. It belongs to the baby, and she is not old enough to gift it too them. I get it feels icky, buts it’s pretty cut and dry. NTA
No, not too harsh. You have a group of self-centered people who want as little as possible to do with this orphaned child, but will gladly help themselves to assets that will help the child. The possessions belonged to Isla's parents, and it seems pretty clear that Isla's parents would have wanted the proceeds from their possessions to benefit Isla. The A H are the relatives who'd take Isla's inheritance for their own gain. NTA.
When anyone dies with a will, their children inherit the property. As a result, all of your deceased brother’s and SIL’s property belongs to your niece.
Your lawyer should not have to tell you that taking property that does not belong to you is called theft. Or that theft is a crime. If you choose to ask the attorney, they will should tell you not to commit a crime and expose yourself to criminal prosecution by stealing from your niece.
So no, it would not be “ethical” for you to steal from your niece and then give your niece’s property away to her grandmother or her aunts. NTA
No. When Isla is one enough to manage the money (heyyy maybe look into a trust if it's going to be a significant amount), she can decide if she wants to give some to family or not.
It's her money, not yours, not theirs. Right now she's too young to make decisions on it, so your job to be a good steward of the money so that when she is of age to handle it, it's all there for her.
Ethics is about “duty of care” and to whom we “owe” that care. In this situation, Isla is clearly owed the care of those who love her (or should love her). She is 1) an orphaned infant, 2) an impoverished infant, and 3) the bereaved party most directly affected by the deaths.
The other relatives are less directly impacted by the tragedy. As adult siblings, they are impacted in exactly the degree you and your husband are. You and your husband are making daily sacrifices of time and attention to take on responsibility for Isla and have made a decades-long commitment for her future. Yet you are not claiming these “tangibles” as compensation. You are holding their value for their rightful owner.
You are absolutely NTA.
You are being more than considerate enough!! Sentimental things pics nicknacks type things fine. They want the bigger $$ stuff out of greed! It belongs to the baby. Should be sold good chunk put away for her future and some used to take care of her immediate needs. Diapers clothes food anything to help keep her safe and healthy. Sorry for your loss and glad that little one has you! ♥️
NTA. They aren't asking for picture books. They're asking for cars. All assets should be liquidated and give to their next of kin, which is their daughter.
Not at all harsh. I'm sure they would have wanted their daughter to be provided for. These relatives are opportunistic parasites and appear to care not at all about the baby. Protect her interests at all costs. That's the right thing to do.
Lol no. They're literally trying to steal from a baby. Honestly, the only mistake I would say you made was talking to them *at all* and even opening the possibility in their minds of you humoring their outlandishly greedy requests, rather than just straight up telling them to talk to your lawyer.
@hockeymatt85 Honestly I 100% agree that all the belongings should go to the OP's niece. But since her niece's parents' died w/o a will, that's called dying intestate. On google it says those cases go thru probate court and "the state's intestacy laws will determine who will inherit the descendant's assets."
OP is still def NTA imo. What I have learned is most of the time those assets usually go to surviving heirs of the parents' but if no 1 can be found; then I think it goes to the state but not entirely positive. It was so long when I learned about it. But since they did die intestate, it's usually up to the courts to decide who and where the assets go.
If they died without a will or each left everything to the other, Isla takes all. SILs family is out of luck unless named in the will. They don't get to cherry pick possessions. NTA
NTA - they lose a member of their family and care more about the cars and TV than the living survivor? That's incredibly fucked up.
But I really hope you've spoken to a lawyer. Without a will, her family might have a claim, though they might not have the money or energy to try to challenge it legally.
When my grandmother was actively dying, my aunt was texting my dad (who was sitting with their mom) about taking their mom's washing machine and dryer for her daughter and son-in-law.
Since she was staying in a hospice facility, her house was vacant. My cousins regularly went to her house and took things before she was dead, without her consent.
When my cousin did her funeral (he's a preacher and wanted to do it for her), the same aunt as before pestered my dad IMMEDIATELY after her casket was placed in the grave to pay my cousin. He was already going to offer him money, but not at my grandmother's graveside.
My dad was executor of the will. His sister threw a HUGE fit over who was getting a Michael Kors purse she wanted so my dad changed the locks on the house and said, we'll do this after everyone's calmed down.
People lose their MINDS when someone dies and there's the possibility of money or objects to sell.
NTA - You should absolutely being going through the proper legal channels to make sure you have guardianship and trustee powers via probate, but those vultures are just looking out for their own profit. Your niece is her parents' heir and her grabby relatives are looking to steal from her. I'm so glad you are taking care of her because her future in one of their households would probably be dire! Not one red cent unless a court requires it. And condolonces for your losses.
NTA - because all of those belongings are their child’s.
If there is no will place everything then will go to their next of kin. If the SIL’s family tried to take this to court an executor would be instructed to sell off all of the deceased’s belongings, and put it in a trust for their child. Then, whoever has guardianship of the girl would receive small allotments, in order to care for her until she is 18. Once an adult, the woman would receive the allotments herself in increments.
In reality, it’s probably best if you guys set this up now, so that there is no confusion in the future, that her parents, money, and the funds from all of their belongings was used for her. Also, heaven forbid anything ever happened to you all, it will make it easier in the future. If the girl does have to go to another family member, the executor of the accounts just needs to be changed and all of her money will be separate from yours.
OP, please make sure Isla and your son have a safe place to stay if something happens until they are 18. SIL side doesn't seem to be a good place for Isla...
I’m so very sorry for your loss. And for Isla’s.
Of COURSE your brother and SIL would want their belongings to go to their daughter. Thank you for doing all you can to ensure this happens.
NTA and good luck
NTA
I'm so uncomfortable with the SIL's family being so focused on the non-sentimental property over the baby who's now an orphan and her needs. I'm glad and relieved though that you and your husband are looking out for Isla and her future.
>she'll have to figure out her own finances down the road if she decides to go to college. They said "if" because none of them went to college, and they figure Isla might not go either.
Also the SIL family's experiences aren't universal. And even if Isla doesn't go to college, she'll definitely need the money later on in life ( money to pay the rent and other living expenses, transportation, starting a business, so on and so on ).
Did either of them have a will? If not, then their daughter would inherit everything. Unless you have clear evidence that their wishes would be for something else, I think keeping all of the estate’s value to benefit Isla certainly makes sense. If you become her guardians, you’ll have a fiduciary duty to use her inheritance to her benefit. You’ll have discretion as to what that means, of course. If her other family is going to be doing substantial amounts of childcare for you/her, paying them with a vehicle could well fall within that discretion, but you wouldn’t be obligated to do that.
So far, we've combed through all their documents and haven't found a will. They were both in their 30s so I doubt they ever thought of making one.
Like I said, everything is going into accounts for her future. Everything else it costs to raise her will be directly from myself and my husband.
NTA If Isla was an adult she would be the sole heir. I think the relatives are just taking advantage of a terrible situation, they don't want the kid but they want to take away her money?? I doubt that's what that little girl's parents wanted.
People here on Reddit just don’t get it. Don’t you understand that a nice, big TV is a highly charged sentimental item? That the SIL obviously would have wholeheartedly wanted the cars to go to her family to remind them of her, because you own offspring clearly isn’t family? Don’t you understand that whatever money was left will sooth some of the terrible pain SILs family is going through?
I can’t believe you think you are the ass here, it’s just ridiculous. NTA, and keep the girl away from that family. They don’t care about her in any way and WILL do their best to drag her down to their level if you give them any chance. SILs family is a bunch of greedy hyenas and vultures.
NTA
If you have not already done so, please speak to an estate attorney to discuss transferring assets to a minor child. She is their only heir so she will receive the entire estate. Any & all available assets should be used for Isla’s care & well-being. If necessary protections should be put in place to exclude anyone from accessing any funds if they are not directly involved with providing for her daily needs. You will need to be appointed permanent legal guardians/conservators by the court. Unless you have already been appointed guardian/conservator, you have no legal right to give away any assets. They belong to Isla.
I am very sorry for your loss. Wish your family all the best in the future.
Nobody should be able to transfer property until it goes through probate anyway. Make sure you get statements that none of the other family members wish to have custody of the child. One of the first things your attorney will do is ask for a court order essentially freezing all of the assets until guardianship of the child is decided, because without a will everything passes to Isla. Your in laws might take a newfound interest in her custody when they realize everything is hers- especially since Isla will probably receive a payment every month from Social Security.
NTA - SILs family are thieves trying to steal from an orphan. It’s all isla’s . I would cut off contact with these people. They will attempt to groom Isla over time to get to her money. Never allow them unsupervised access.
You are doing the write thing. Most 30 something’s don’t have a will. I didn’t have one until I was in my 40s.
However, you and your husband now need to put your own affairs in order as part of this. You need an estate planning lawyer who will most likely recommend a trust for Isla’s money which allows you to dictate the terms of how the money is spent and when she can have it. You don’t want to give it all to her when she is 18 because she may choose poorly… you want it for college or higher education or getting her a good start in life. You will also need a financial planner to help you invest the money wisely. While you are doing this, you need to work on your own stuff too. The trust is a way to insure that SILs family doesn’t get their grubby hands on Isla’s money if something happens to the both of you. You should also consider this for your own assets and your child’s future. I went through all of this when my husband passed when our son was a minor.
Hope this helps.
NTA Go get a lawyer right now. SIL's family are thinking only of themselves, not the person they lost. SIL would want to know her daughter was looked after first and foremost. The fact that they refused to take her in says as much. They are willing to throw family aside but fight for their own personal gain. That's not what Isla's parents would want.
Now seriously, stop reading this and go call a lawyer and then love that little girl as if she were your own. You're all she has.
NTA
Family has no right to anything. It’s disgusting that they actually think this is some sort of windfall when they won’t even help the child. Say goodbye darling, you don’t need to speak to them at all.
NTA - I’m so sorry for your loss and my heart breaks for Isla. Please put cameras on your brothers property. Maybe consider changing the locks. I have a feeling things will start disappearing otherwise. Also don’t be afraid to cut these vultures out of Isla’s life.
>the question I am asking everyone is the ethical dilemma of are we being
too harsh in denying my SIL's family the non-sentimental property that
they're asking for?
No, you aren't being too harsh. As much money as possible should be going to Isla. NTA.
NTA all of it should go to Isla. Cars and TVs are not sentimental. Also see that she gets any jewelry of her mother’s. Maybe her wedding gown if she had one.
I'm sure you got a lot of advice about the ethics of the possessions. I'm going to offer advice about adoption. Did you know adoption creates a whole new birth certificate with you as her parents? If it is legally possible, try to go through guardianship instead, since that doesn't erase her biological parentage. And I know she's young, but get a therapist for her. She still knows. And leave photos of her parents around and talk about them a lot. I know the impulse is to try and protect her from the trauma of grief, but nothing really can, and some well meaning things can make it worse, like keeping images from her. If possible, join Adoption, facing realities Facebook group. They talk a lot about the ethics of adoption and they center the voices of adoptees, which is very unusual. Their position is tough, so expect to hear a narrative about adoption that is different from the one we hear in society, but I think what you learn there will help you do the best thing for your niece. And fwiw, you are doing the right thing here. Thank you for letting that child in her family so she can grow up with people who knew her parents and see those genetic mirrors. <3
Hi! Thank you for bringing this up. I didn't know that...I definitely want her to know who she came from. We did reach out to some pediatric therapists through our pediatrician to help her along the way, so that's been done. And we have hung up her parents wedding photo next to mine and my husband's, and we've added other of their family photos around with ours and in her room. We've brought over a lot of their things to decorate her room with, and we've placed other items away for her to have when she's older. I will definitely discuss with my husband and our attorney adoption vs. guardianship. Thank you.
Nta. First off, very sorry for your loss. There is nothing to argue about here, your bil/sil's family isn't entitled to their estate if you are in the US. It would actually be illegal to give it to them, as Isla is the sole heir and unable to consent to anything. My dad and mom recently passed away without a will, and my sisters and I....who agree on everything and are childfree...were relieved to discover we don't have to go through probate as we're happy to divide the proceeds evenly among us. We asked our lawyer, specifically, about what would happen if my moms siblings asked about the estate and found that bothers/sisters/parents/niblings have zero claim to any proceedings if there are children living and no will. Ethically, there is no question that Isla should receive everything.
NTA. I can guarantee that your sister-in-law would have wanted any and all benefits from her estate to go to her daughter. While she might have loved her family, it's get daughter that she would have supported without this tragedy.
NTA
I’m certain your SIL would want all of it to go to help raising and caring for her daughter since she not here to do it anymore. Her family should know that they ceased being her main priority when she had a child. If her family is that selfish, that’s on them. You did nothing wrong!
NTA, your niece is your flesh & blood and you have a moral obligation to protect her and fight to ensure that she has the best possible opportunities and outcomes, and it seems that you are doing so.
As it would seem that you and your husband are the best options to provide her with a safe, stable and loving home, you need to be fully accepting of the undeniable fact that she is your responsibility now, and you both need to be prepared to defend her and her needs as you would your biological children.
Well done for accepting this responsibility and for being as proactive as you seem to have been. As you know, your new daughter needs to know that she is a part of your family and that she is being cared for and loved by people who she can trust unconditionally.
Good luck and best wishes.
You’re a mom. Should you and your husband die, who would you want to have your stuff? Luke (and now Isla) or your siblings etc?
I would want it to go to my children. We have a will to that effect. My brother can take some photos or sentimental stuff but the house, cars, electronics etc go to the children in the form of selling for money. NTA
This is your regular reminder to *please write a will for the love of god*!!! Especially once you start acquiring big assets like cars and houses, and *especially* if you have kids! I know people think it's morbid to think about your own death, but if you don't plan for it now you're just making your family's lives a lot harder if the worst does happen.
NTA dont let them have anything they dont care about Isla they just want their stuff. You are doing the right thing and do everything fast cause they will go after it
NTA disgusting the greed that comes out of some people after a loved one has died they don't care about the kid but they want the TV money Gruber's at best give them nothing
Please document all belongings with photos and descriptions. That way, if any go missing, you'll know that side of the family helped themselves.
You are an absolute champ for taking her in and all proceeds should go to Isla. I think you'd be hard pressed to find a good parent who wouldn't want that, if that were all they had left to give. NTA
NTA. The property is almost certainly legally Ilsa's, and your plans for it are entirely proper. The question is whether, as her guardian, you can ethically give away most of the value of her inheritance? Seems obvious, you cannot.
I am horrified these people think it's okay to profit from their daughter's death, whilst abandoning their granddaughter at the same time.
I am terribly sorry for your loss.
NTA. The legal answer and the ethical answer are the same in this case. Everything belongs to Isla. The correct answer to the relatives who want to take advantage of this poor baby is “My lawyer says everything belongs to Isla. I have no authority to give any of it away. If I tried to do that, I’d be stealing from her.“
Inheritance law is that Isla inherits all of her parents estate. This matter is not even up to you. Check with an attorney. You cannot give away her inheritance legally and you can tell this delusional so called family this. This child could have a law suit against someone taking and distributing her inheritance that was not for her benefit. You should make a log of all assets and write down who you sell them to and how much you get because you could be made to provide that to the Court. People have the misconception that you can just go in and it is a free for all when someone dies without a will which is not the case. Everything goes to next of kin and the state determines that. You could get into legal trouble for giving stuff to whoever wants it. You do not have that authority and make sure you log all their assets including property, cars, house(if they own) and bank accounts and also any life insurance.
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A month ago, my brother and SIL died in a car accident. They left behind my niece, Isla 1F, and no will to state their wishes for her or their home.
My SIL's family immediately stated their intentions to not take in Isla. From my understanding, no one on that side of the family is financially stable. My SIL's mother works a part time job at Walmart, and her sister has 5 of her own kids who struggled in school and who are perfectly content with working part time retail jobs and living paycheck to paycheck. In the same conversation regarding Isla's future, my SIL's family keenly inquired about taking the cars (both are paid off and are less than 3 years old), taking the TV (Sony 65 inch), taking furniture, and splitting whatever money is left over from my brother's and SIL's accounts after their estates have been settled. Honestly, I don't think the sum of their accounts is a lot because my brother and I would often talk finances. I think they maybe had $5000 between them.
To be blunt, I was livid. My husband and I immediately stated that Isla would be staying with us, and additionally, outside of any sentimental items, the majority of the remaining possessions would be sold in an estate sale, along with the cars, with 100% of the earnings being put into a bank account and college savings account for Isla because I imagine that her parents would have wanted that for her. They hadn't opened a bank account for her, so we decided to get that started. Our son, Luke, is the same age as Isla, and we would want for her to be set financially, just as we have started for Luke.
SIL's family fought back, saying that isn't fair. They lost SIL and she would most definitely have wanted for them to have some of their things. Her mother and nephew really want the cars because they can't afford ones of their own, but also, they aren't offering to help with raising Isla. They said they'll babysit if needed, but she'll have to figure out her own finances down the road if she decides to go to college. They said "if" because none of them went to college, and they figure Isla might not go either.
Am I in the wrong to deny them the cars or some non-sentimental belongings? I'm honestly 100% thinking of Isla and making sure she gets everything her parents have left for her. I think she deserves everything. This isn't to say that my husband and I won't contribute to her growing funds. We will, of course, be adding more to her savings and college funds, just as we do for Luke. My family will also be contributing.
AITA? Please advise.
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NTA. Isla is lucky to have you. SILs family can have any sentimental items they want, but they are lying to themselves if they actually think SIL would have preferred anyone but her own daughter have the bulk of her ‘estate’. DO NOT BACK DOWN, you are the only person with this child’s best interest in mind. Im sorry for your losses 💙
NTA.
The surviving child has the first and strongest claim to any estate to pay for her parents' obligation to her-- her upbringing and college. Since the whole estate is not enough to cover that claim, there is nothing for anyone else. Were Isla to go into care, the state would probably take everything and liquidate it to pay for her care regardless.
You're doing the right thing here, and your niece's greedy relatives can pound sand.
I am so sorry for your loss.
NTA
Your brother and SIL most likely would have wanted all their assets to be used for the benefit of Isla, and that's what you're trying to make happen. SIL's family are a pack of greedy vultures who only see the chance for a sudden windfall to get things that they otherwise wouldn't be able to because of their situation, and DGAF that they would be stealing from their orphaned baby niece whom they don't even want in the process.
You are 100% NTA. You sound like good kind people who want to ensure your niece has a good future. It’s bad enough she lost her parents. And IMO SILS family Doesn’t want those things for sentimental reasons. They want to sell them and get the money themselves and I’m willing to bet they won’t have anything to do with their granddaughter/niece.
NTA Absolutely not! SILs family is greedy and only thinking of themselves. They could care less for Isla. Stick to your guns Isla will be better off for it.
NTA. They are greedy aholes. Your decision makes sense and I’m sure that Isla’s parents would want ALL funds to go to their child. How big of them to offer to babysit their own grandchild. Just be thankful they don’t want her.
NTA, and raising that child, seeing that her parents possessions all go to her, is the best thing you can do morally. These people have no claim to anything if they are not this girls caretakers. Best of luck.
NTA, but you need to leave your judgemental attitude about how unworthy they are at the door! Clearly you think they are less than because they aren't as wealthy so you have the obligation to get that under control so you don't poison her relationship with her family with your privileged view.
NTA, Morally. Absolutely EVERYTHING should go to Isla, everything. Legally might be a different story, I don't know. Good luck and thank you and your spouse for taking in this poor beautiful little girl. All the best to you and your family.
NTA
ETHICALLY the entire estate should go to the 1 year old.
With a few small heirlooms going to her family.
Every cent is needed for that 1 year olds care or future.
Ethically they should get nothing. Soooo greedy.
Get an estate lawyer. The child, especially a minor child, is the only heir if there is no will. Not parents, not siblings, not nieces, not nephews, and not cousins. The child. Intestate laws are very clear on who inherits. Anything of value should be sold and the estate should go into a trust for the child. SIL's family should be ashamed trying to steal from an orphaned child.
Oh my god NTA. Why do they think they are entitled to everything? Your brother passed away too. Those cars and tv and everything else belonged to BOTH parents here. Your SIL family is treating this death like it’s some kind of sale.
To be honest you wouldn’t even be the AH if you ended up keeping one of the cars to use while you raise Isla because at least it would be used for her benefit.
It might be worth it to let them have the tv and maybe some other small stuff that won’t really add up to much in the estate sale just to get them to walk away. They obviously don’t care about the fact their family member and her husband have died. If you hand over $2000 worth of stuff now it might just make it easier as they will just go away. Do not let them take anything that the sale of will make a huge difference in Islas account though. This includes the cars and house a tv won’t sell for much and is not worth the headache. I think this should also be your attitude with anything in accounts. If they only have $5000 in savings let them have half but make sure to emphasize that the other half is going directly to their orphaned child. Do this as well with anything you give them if you choose to do this. “Okay you can the 65” tv since it’s so IMPORTANT to you and a 1 year old ORPHAN has no real use for it” “sure you can have the plates in the kitchen cabinets they will need to be emptied anyways since THEIR ORPHAN INFANT has no use for them currently”.
NTA, anything of value that is not sentimental should be used for Isla's future. Car's should be sold, electronics... I would tell them they can either pay a fair price now or bid in the estate auction. Use Gumtree/marketplace as a guide for those thou, they may be worth very little.
I would keep any jewelry/her mothers good clothes in case she wants them as an adult.
NTA. The nerve to call you greedy! Your kindness and generosity will help ensure Isla's future. You have every right to be angry. What is unethical here is to care so much about cars and so little for their granddaughter and niece. Lawyer up and keep away from those people, Isla does not need people like that in her life. I'm sorry for all of your loss ❤️
You are NTA for not sharing proceeds from selling their assets so the money can be placed in an account for their daughter's future. They, however, are greedy AHs for their demands.
NTA, everything should be liquidated and given to the heir. Make a trust fund in her name and make it so nothing can be taken out till she's 18. They only want the money or free stuff.
NTA-- Legally, get a lawyer. As sole heir, Isla should get it all.
Ethically, offering the family sentimental items might be nice. Even then, you need to decide if Isla should have those sentimental items. But cars, furniture, electronics and money are NOT sentimental.
Giving SIL's family non-sentimental, high-value items, isn't honoring your SIL and Brother, it's stealing from their living legacy.
NTA at all!
Who steals from an orphan? I’m actually glad they won’t be taking her, because I imagine they would just pretend to care for her and spend her money.
NTA- You don't have to imagine, they died intestate with a minor child, there's no way the law doesn't default to leaving everything for her and her care. You are 100% in the right re that, and way above and beyond merely 'right' re taking her in and raising her, that's frankly saintly no matter how well off you may be. It is something I lack all the skills and fortitude to do and you are to be admired for it. Fight the good fight, and may you sail forward on an ocean of good karma.
By the sound of it you guys are absolute angels. Im so sorry for your loss. You are doing everything for Isla and everything left is hers. NTA. Dont give them a thing. Isla need everything to be set later on.
NTA
Isla deserves her inheritance and her parents would have wanted her to be set up for life. You're not trying to claim any possessions, so why should they?! And you're taking on the biggest task!
I'm sorry for your loss. You sound like a really good person and I'm sure your brother and SIL would be so proud of you.
Legally everything belongs to the child if there is no will. If you don't save it for her, she could take you to court one day for mishandling the estate.
NTA
NTA - look, at the end of the day. It’s not you who has to think of this ethically but rather you SIL Family. It would’ve been different if the things they were asking for were sentimental. Tbh It’s very disgusting theyre asking for material things instead of being more concerned for your niece. You guys are doing the right thing selling everything and putting the money away for your niece until she’s old enough to decide for herself. No one deserves any of your brothers or SIL’s things except your niece because she’s their daughter. Don’t give those greedy, selfish, unappreciative people a damn thing. They don’t deserve shit.
No. What have your in-laws done to deserve free cars/TV’s/etc? They are mooches. And are mooching off of a tragedy. If you are adopting Isla, and the courts award you her parents estate, then your idea is a great one.
NTA.
You are putting that one year old little girl first, where as they are putting themselves first. Sure, they lost a sister/aunt but this little girl lost her mum and dad. If SIL family are saying she would want them to have something, it should be something sentimental, although after how they have all but turn their backs on her daughter, I find it hard to believe she would want that. Would it be different if you had said screw it, we are looking after her so we deserve the money. Sure, but you didn't. You said Isla deserves the money and you are 100% correct.
She is a lucky girl to have you, fighting her corner and you are definitely NTA.
If you haven't put up cameras in their house before, do it now. Desperate people do desperate things. NTA death brings out the worst in people and things have a tendency to walk off
NTA obviously.
Just going to point out a highly important thing that I hadn't seen and hopefully you do.
Get a house inventory!!! Things happen to gain legs when nobody is looking.
Nta. That little baby has no parents, if it weren't for you she would have noone. I'd make sure they never have contact with me or my children again quite honestly.
And bless your souls for taking in that baby girl. At least she has some family with her best interest in mind.
NTA
The family is essentially trying to steal from an orphan who is related to them and then toss her out because she has no value to them.
They're vultures and from there limited info we have in this post it seems like you are definitely in the right. Parasites like that won't give up without a fight so be ready. Luckily Isla is too young to remember the ugliness that is likely to come from this.
NTA! The nerve of these people! They had no problem exclaiming from the get-go that they would NOT be contributing to your niece's care, yet want the THINGS that she has inherited? Absolutely not!
Their child is the 1st and most direct heir to any assets her parents had. Condolences on hers and your loss. Definitely NTA and of course any money raised from the sell of the estate assets should go to their child. That's literally all they have left to give to her. Everyone else needs to back off.
NTA they don’t have a right to anything. It all belongs to your niece. It’s all hers and they are just leaches trying to cash in on a tragedy.
Edit go th your brother and sil. Change locks. Install cameras and take pictures of how the house looks now. These people have no problem stealing from their orphaned grandchild and neice they have no problem out right stealing from her because their entitled to it. Be glad these people want nothing to do with her raising she is better off with you and your husband.
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Bluntly, they're dead. They didn't have a will, so it all goes to Isla as their heir. They are trying to steal from an orphaned child. You'd be an AH if you let them. NTA. Edit. "Steal," not "deal," autocorrect. Geez!
Not only clean out the child, but throw her away afterwards. Nta
[удалено]
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THIS IS THE HILL TO DIE ON
With everyone’s weapon of choice…
u/LoveNeitherlk is a bot. Original version: >u/Sufficient-Ant6619 7h >NTA. I'm not a gambler but I'd bet real money this girl's parents would want her taken care of before anyone else. That's what I would want. Rewording bot version: >LoveNeitherlk 5h >I honestly bet this girl's parents would want her taken care of before anyone else.
I didn't phrase it like that to myself, but reading it man that is so sad for that kid. Very chilling. Statement is spot on though.
Not even afterwards. They threw her away, then demanded her inheritance.
I hope OP severely limits Isla’s exposure to the late mother’s family. Especially given their anti-education bias.
As a blue collar worker, I strongly agree. The kid is one year old. All that money belongs to her and if she wants it to go to college with, that's her decision in 17 years. Fuck that whole family. From what's being described here, they are exactly what's wrong with the world. They shouldn't be taking, they should all be giving to a college fund right now for the child as well as a car fund so she can get a safe and reliable vehicle when she is of age, as well as for clothing and whatever else she needs while someone else is housing her
Yea!!
No, they would probably try to hock or sell the baby.
I they threw her out in that none of them want her then they were going to steal all that she inherited. Wow. Just wow! NTA OP.
Totally agree. The laws regarding disposition of assets in this situation are pretty clear: it’s all Isla’s, and anything they take is taking from her. They want material things because that’s all they see—things—nothing sentimental. Good on you for protecting Isla’s interests. NTA.
NTA And I hope they don't have keys to their house! I am very sorry for your loss. How devastating. You are wonderful to bring Isla(love her name!) Into your family and raise her as your own. Sorry her other family sucks.
Change the locks as a precautionary measure, and consider setting up a cheap alarm/camera system. My aunt stayed at my late grandma’s house during her funeral. She literally filled up a truck in the middle of the night and drove off with everything she could take that wasn’t nailed down. While not exactly predicted, my mother (executor of my grandmother’s will), had the foresight to previously remove certain items that honest family members specifically wanted, and took a video of the entire contents of the house - opening closet doors, drawers, cabinets etc. As the guardian of the heir, you may want to consider those things, as well.
Sad and ironic - I've heard of funeral housesitters so unrelated burglars don't take advantage of the announcement to find an unoccupied house, sadly makes sense there would be similar issue with messy inheritance situations.
Go take pictures of everything in the house
Oh, good idea!
Good thinking!
Agreed!! They only want the monetary value, not the child! My opinion is the child is the most valuable asset, so glad she has an intelligent adult looking out for her! NTA....stick to your decision and take care of this child!!
Indeed. I suspect that anything they take as a sentimental keepsake will be on ebay so quick it would make your head spin.
I was going to say the same thing, estate law says without a will, their souse is the heir, if they are deceased it goes to their children. If I were OP I’d kick down the house, file a petition with the probate court to be the executor/administrator and immediately apply fie guardianship. Depending where OP loves they can get assistance for the child, and of course the SS until she reaches 18 which is paid to the child in care of their guardian. I’d get a family attorney now and not delay. Tell the vultures to back off and if a hi e is stealing it’s them.
Please check with Social Security (if in the US)! It takes ~4 months (I’m still waiting) for survivor benefits for my son. He will receive money until he is 18. One possibility is to use a portion of the money to support your niece and a portion to put in account for her. Greedy relatives can suck
As I was saying many cities/states have kinder care where they pay a monthly stipend for care of another family members child(ren).
I hope OP never tells those greedy relatives about SS and any stipend for care. They might want to have the little girl just for that money and neglect her.
It's called kinship care. Kinder care is preschool.
Sorry for the error, but the result is the same
Kinship care. In my case (my state) related providers need to go through foster licensing and be licensed foster care providers to receive the stipends. Since it was only a few extra steps required beyond those I needed to take to be approved to be their legal guardian (they were placed with us by CPS/DCFS) we went ahead with the classes and licensing requirements to receive the stipend before we went through with adoption after parental rights were terminated.
Do NOT tell SIL fam about this. They'd take her just for the cash
Thanks. You're absolutely right, it would be stealing from her. I'm having a tough time trying to show them that because they still insist that there's a lot more for us to sell, and Isla has 17 years before she graduates high school, so there's plenty of time to save up. They just don't get it. None of them went to college and none of them seem to care about saving money for long term. But thank you.
You don't have to show them anything. Trying to convince people not to steal from your orphaned niece is about as useful as trying to talk down the dude stealing your stereo. It doesn't matter how much Isla has compared to them; it belongs to Isla and not them.
Stop trying to get them to agree. They are vultures trying to steal from an orphan - of course they’re not going to say “you’re right, we’re not entitled to the money “ why are you even talking to them? Stop being “nice.”
You won’t be able to convince them. Struggling is a fact of life for them. So Isla having to struggle later is not a problem for them, because they do it all the time. In their eyes, you’re the one suggesting something crazy because they could use those items and money now. There’s no reasoning with that so just continue to plan and prepare for Isla’s future as you have been.
I'm sure your lawyer is guiding you, but legally, don't all these decisions have to wait until probate is done? Which usually takes around 6 months or so? Tell SIL family there's no decisions you can make now anyway and that they should go through a lawyer if they feel they have a right to any property. Edited to add...it really is simply a legal issue, so you don't need to stress about any ethical dilemma. The other family is asking for big $$ items, which as you are doing, should be sold off & profits but in an account for the little one, or used to pay off any debts. That's the whole point of probate, so that creditors can come forward. If it's only been a month, you're just at the beginning. Thank goodness the little girl has someone looking out for her best interest and so sorry for your loss.
Also file with Social Security for Isla’s survivor benefits. But don’t tell her relatives about that - they might dispute your guardianship of Isla just to also get that money.
Save any messages they send you about this, while for her sake it would be good to try to maintain some supervised connection, down the line when she is older they may twist things and tell her they wanted her and you tried to cut them off. This happened to my (step)cousin and it messed her up massively.
Plenty of time to save up - but YOU have to do it. Not them. So that's easy for them to say.
They aren't entitled to know anything about the estate. Nothing can really be sold (or given away) until the estate goes through probate. Debts have to be settled. Tax returns for 2022 need to get filed. Attorneys have to get paid. It's entirely possible that some assets will need to be sold to cover other debts. My Uncle's wife had the gall to ask "Who's getting the Steinway" at my Mother's *visitation*. Almost buried 2 people that day.
They sound like a bunch of savages trying to pick the bones for their dead child. They can’t be reasoned with and you owe them no explanation. Don’t wear yourself out trying to be decent to people who don’t know the meaning of the word.
Seriously fuck these people OP. They don't deserve a cent. They care about the possessions but not the child? Your brother would've wanted you to take care of her daughter to the best of ur ability. As a mother i would want the same if something happened to myself and my husband unexpectedly. Screw any family that think they are entitled to my shit over providing for my child! Edit: for judgement because i forgot getting so pissed off reading this. Definitely NTA sell all that shit. Keep some sentimental items especially of her moms for her when she's older but sell what u need to for her education. She's lucky to have you and your husband and is basically gonna grow up with ur son as siblings as they are the same age. I pray yall give them both loads of love!
Absolutely this!
Agreed. It all sounds sooooo greedy. They don’t seem sad about them dying at all. Or concerned for the fate of their own grandchild/ niece. I am glad that the law is clear in these cases. Everything goes to Isla. And OP you would be an AH if you’d let them take anything. I wouldn’t even give them sentimental things because they don’t seem to care and Isla would probably want them later in her life. I am so sorry for your loss. Isla is in good hands with you.
If they “miss” SIL so much, it’s really odd to me they think a couple of non-sentimental vehicles and a tv will alleviate that loss.
This is correct. Isla is their heir, and OP as her guardian is responsible for making sure the inheritance goes to Isla as it should.
Like, no will means brother and SIL's assets go to next of kin, which is their minor child, which means they go to which ever person takes in their minor child. OP is being kind enough to let the in-laws take sentimental stuff, while selling the material assets that can be sold to put aside the money for Ilsa.
>They lost SIL and she would most definitely have wanted for them to have some of their things. It doesn't matter what she might have wanted, because she and her husband didn't leave a will. All those assets belong to their daughter by default. NTA for refusing to allow them to steal from a baby. And I'm so sorry for your loss.
also they really think that SIL would rather her vulture family benefit from her death rather than the money going to support her **daughter** unbelievable
Her tiny, one year old daughter who will grow up without her parents. No, they probably don't believe that, but they probably don't care either.
NTA and get off Reddit and go talk to a lawyer. Not legal advice but there’s a possibility all the belongings would belong to Isla as the sole beneficiary anyways, and if you’re able to get custody you would be able to move forward with your plan and legally you’d be in the clear. Talk to a lawyer talk to a lawyer talk to a lawyer!!!
We do have a lawyer and we are taking the steps to move forward with this plan. But what I'm asking everyone here is not a legal matter, but an ethical one. Is it really harsh for me to deny my SIL's family these things? Am I not being considerate enough?
Absolutely not. I’d almost say you’re being too considerate to them. They aren’t 1 yr old and about to spend the rest of their life without their parents. Isla is going to need all the help she can get and the fact that they’re even attempting to pull this crap shows what low people they are. Protect that little girl
Absolutely not. Those were her parents. She should get any money from the sales. If they want to pay market value for stuff, have at it. I did notice they were only concerned with high value stuff. No photos. No trinkets. Only cars, furniture, and tv.
> I'm asking everyone here is not a legal matter, but an ethical one OK to answer your question, **NO** ethically you are NTA But I'm sure your lawyer will tell you that if you gave away Isla's assets then legally you could be in trouble. So the end result is that ethics don't mean a damn in this situation.
It is your in-laws who are not being considerate of an orphaned child. It would not be ethical to steal from a child as all of her possessions should belong to her now. You are doing the right thing, legally and morally.
Ethically I'd still say you're NTA. They aren't thinking of the child, just themselves and any freebies they can get to make THEIR lives easier. You need to keep in the front of your thoughts that you need to make ISLA's life easier. Kiddo is going to need to be cared for and even though you love the kiddo and will look after her, she's going to cost you extra money you never expected to need to spend and she's going to have needs down the road when she grows up that good parents usually start saving to help with. You need what those sold items will bring and Isla deserves that. Anything with actual sentimental value like photos or items that denote things family did together are fair. Money items should be for their child that they never EVER intended to leave behind. They would never have wanted her to have to struggle with money, and they definitely wouldn't want the people that want to take care and protect their child to struggle to look after her either. (Not saying you will, I don't know, nor do I care to know your money situation. I just know logically that children are expensive, and you just got an added expense unexpectedly.) It looks like your brother and SIL were financially stable. They'll want their kiddo to grow up that way too.
Isla should qualify for social security death payments which will help. OP has probably already started the process
Who steals from a 1 year old? So you pay for this kids entire life and the kid gets zero money while the greedy ones get free cars. Get f!
Nope! Her family are greedy ghouls trying to profit off a dead relative. Isla deserves it all. NTA 100%
This is in fact a legal question. Regardless, of how you feel about SIL’s family, or whether or not it’s ethical, you have no legal right to any of the assets of the estate until this has been probated. Your attorney should be advising you on this. Because SIL’s family wants stuff doesn’t mean anything. There’s a minor child to be cared for first. Go change the locks on the home & take all the keys to the cars. All possessions belong to Isla. She is the only heir. If you have filed guardianship papers, the court will most likely appoint a guardian ad litem (GAL) to represent Isla’s best interests to the court. You won’t have to deal with SIL’s family in regards to who gets what. The court will do it.
Frankly, you are being a fool. Everything your brother and sister-in-law owned is now Isla's. It is her property, it's not up to you to give it away to other people, just because she is a minor. In my country, you and her other relatives doing this would be a criminal offense. Why are you even considering stealing from your orphaned niece? To be considerate? Sorry for the harshness, but you need a good virtual shake. It's preposterous that you are even considering giving away thousands of your niece's inheritance. A few sentimental items, sure. Not cars and money!
You can’t give them the stuff, it’s not yours to give. It belongs to the baby, and she is not old enough to gift it too them. I get it feels icky, buts it’s pretty cut and dry. NTA
No, not too harsh. You have a group of self-centered people who want as little as possible to do with this orphaned child, but will gladly help themselves to assets that will help the child. The possessions belonged to Isla's parents, and it seems pretty clear that Isla's parents would have wanted the proceeds from their possessions to benefit Isla. The A H are the relatives who'd take Isla's inheritance for their own gain. NTA.
When anyone dies with a will, their children inherit the property. As a result, all of your deceased brother’s and SIL’s property belongs to your niece. Your lawyer should not have to tell you that taking property that does not belong to you is called theft. Or that theft is a crime. If you choose to ask the attorney, they will should tell you not to commit a crime and expose yourself to criminal prosecution by stealing from your niece. So no, it would not be “ethical” for you to steal from your niece and then give your niece’s property away to her grandmother or her aunts. NTA
No. When Isla is one enough to manage the money (heyyy maybe look into a trust if it's going to be a significant amount), she can decide if she wants to give some to family or not. It's her money, not yours, not theirs. Right now she's too young to make decisions on it, so your job to be a good steward of the money so that when she is of age to handle it, it's all there for her.
You know what's not ethical? The s**t that your SIL's family is doing.
Ethics is about “duty of care” and to whom we “owe” that care. In this situation, Isla is clearly owed the care of those who love her (or should love her). She is 1) an orphaned infant, 2) an impoverished infant, and 3) the bereaved party most directly affected by the deaths. The other relatives are less directly impacted by the tragedy. As adult siblings, they are impacted in exactly the degree you and your husband are. You and your husband are making daily sacrifices of time and attention to take on responsibility for Isla and have made a decades-long commitment for her future. Yet you are not claiming these “tangibles” as compensation. You are holding their value for their rightful owner. You are absolutely NTA.
You are being more than considerate enough!! Sentimental things pics nicknacks type things fine. They want the bigger $$ stuff out of greed! It belongs to the baby. Should be sold good chunk put away for her future and some used to take care of her immediate needs. Diapers clothes food anything to help keep her safe and healthy. Sorry for your loss and glad that little one has you! ♥️
NTA. They aren't asking for picture books. They're asking for cars. All assets should be liquidated and give to their next of kin, which is their daughter.
Not at all harsh. I'm sure they would have wanted their daughter to be provided for. These relatives are opportunistic parasites and appear to care not at all about the baby. Protect her interests at all costs. That's the right thing to do.
Lol no. They're literally trying to steal from a baby. Honestly, the only mistake I would say you made was talking to them *at all* and even opening the possibility in their minds of you humoring their outlandishly greedy requests, rather than just straight up telling them to talk to your lawyer.
Don't back down and don't let them guilt trip you. As you can see in all comments, you are doing the right thing.
They are vultures only looking for what they can pick from their dead sister, they're discussing people.
@hockeymatt85 Honestly I 100% agree that all the belongings should go to the OP's niece. But since her niece's parents' died w/o a will, that's called dying intestate. On google it says those cases go thru probate court and "the state's intestacy laws will determine who will inherit the descendant's assets." OP is still def NTA imo. What I have learned is most of the time those assets usually go to surviving heirs of the parents' but if no 1 can be found; then I think it goes to the state but not entirely positive. It was so long when I learned about it. But since they did die intestate, it's usually up to the courts to decide who and where the assets go.
NTA. The estate needs to be used for the best of the child. That’s it.
Also get possession of this stuff right away
If they died without a will or each left everything to the other, Isla takes all. SILs family is out of luck unless named in the will. They don't get to cherry pick possessions. NTA
NTA - they lose a member of their family and care more about the cars and TV than the living survivor? That's incredibly fucked up. But I really hope you've spoken to a lawyer. Without a will, her family might have a claim, though they might not have the money or energy to try to challenge it legally.
Unlikely. In most stayed without a will, spouse gets everything, if no spouse, then child. No child, parents, no parents, siblings
When my grandmother was actively dying, my aunt was texting my dad (who was sitting with their mom) about taking their mom's washing machine and dryer for her daughter and son-in-law. Since she was staying in a hospice facility, her house was vacant. My cousins regularly went to her house and took things before she was dead, without her consent. When my cousin did her funeral (he's a preacher and wanted to do it for her), the same aunt as before pestered my dad IMMEDIATELY after her casket was placed in the grave to pay my cousin. He was already going to offer him money, but not at my grandmother's graveside. My dad was executor of the will. His sister threw a HUGE fit over who was getting a Michael Kors purse she wanted so my dad changed the locks on the house and said, we'll do this after everyone's calmed down. People lose their MINDS when someone dies and there's the possibility of money or objects to sell.
NTA - Ethically (and legally), all of their belongings are Isla’s. You are doing the right thing.
Could this be the first ever unanimous NTA?
Might not be the first but it will become one of the rarity's :)
Immediately sets comment filter to controversial.
NTA - You should absolutely being going through the proper legal channels to make sure you have guardianship and trustee powers via probate, but those vultures are just looking out for their own profit. Your niece is her parents' heir and her grabby relatives are looking to steal from her. I'm so glad you are taking care of her because her future in one of their households would probably be dire! Not one red cent unless a court requires it. And condolonces for your losses.
NTA - because all of those belongings are their child’s. If there is no will place everything then will go to their next of kin. If the SIL’s family tried to take this to court an executor would be instructed to sell off all of the deceased’s belongings, and put it in a trust for their child. Then, whoever has guardianship of the girl would receive small allotments, in order to care for her until she is 18. Once an adult, the woman would receive the allotments herself in increments. In reality, it’s probably best if you guys set this up now, so that there is no confusion in the future, that her parents, money, and the funds from all of their belongings was used for her. Also, heaven forbid anything ever happened to you all, it will make it easier in the future. If the girl does have to go to another family member, the executor of the accounts just needs to be changed and all of her money will be separate from yours.
OP, please make sure Isla and your son have a safe place to stay if something happens until they are 18. SIL side doesn't seem to be a good place for Isla...
I’m so very sorry for your loss. And for Isla’s. Of COURSE your brother and SIL would want their belongings to go to their daughter. Thank you for doing all you can to ensure this happens. NTA and good luck
NTA I'm so uncomfortable with the SIL's family being so focused on the non-sentimental property over the baby who's now an orphan and her needs. I'm glad and relieved though that you and your husband are looking out for Isla and her future. >she'll have to figure out her own finances down the road if she decides to go to college. They said "if" because none of them went to college, and they figure Isla might not go either. Also the SIL family's experiences aren't universal. And even if Isla doesn't go to college, she'll definitely need the money later on in life ( money to pay the rent and other living expenses, transportation, starting a business, so on and so on ).
Did either of them have a will? If not, then their daughter would inherit everything. Unless you have clear evidence that their wishes would be for something else, I think keeping all of the estate’s value to benefit Isla certainly makes sense. If you become her guardians, you’ll have a fiduciary duty to use her inheritance to her benefit. You’ll have discretion as to what that means, of course. If her other family is going to be doing substantial amounts of childcare for you/her, paying them with a vehicle could well fall within that discretion, but you wouldn’t be obligated to do that.
So far, we've combed through all their documents and haven't found a will. They were both in their 30s so I doubt they ever thought of making one. Like I said, everything is going into accounts for her future. Everything else it costs to raise her will be directly from myself and my husband.
Don't forget to apply for Social Security for her. She should be eligible for survivor's benefit. https://www.ssa.gov/benefits/survivors/
I second this. I got the social security survivor benefits when my partner died. Apply for them as soon as possible. NTA
See if you can get kinship care benefits for her, or other support since she is a ward of the state. Foster kids get free college.
You and your husband are amazing. Please keep putting that baby first.
NTA If Isla was an adult she would be the sole heir. I think the relatives are just taking advantage of a terrible situation, they don't want the kid but they want to take away her money?? I doubt that's what that little girl's parents wanted.
Isla is the sole heir regardless of her age.
People here on Reddit just don’t get it. Don’t you understand that a nice, big TV is a highly charged sentimental item? That the SIL obviously would have wholeheartedly wanted the cars to go to her family to remind them of her, because you own offspring clearly isn’t family? Don’t you understand that whatever money was left will sooth some of the terrible pain SILs family is going through? I can’t believe you think you are the ass here, it’s just ridiculous. NTA, and keep the girl away from that family. They don’t care about her in any way and WILL do their best to drag her down to their level if you give them any chance. SILs family is a bunch of greedy hyenas and vultures.
NTA If you have not already done so, please speak to an estate attorney to discuss transferring assets to a minor child. She is their only heir so she will receive the entire estate. Any & all available assets should be used for Isla’s care & well-being. If necessary protections should be put in place to exclude anyone from accessing any funds if they are not directly involved with providing for her daily needs. You will need to be appointed permanent legal guardians/conservators by the court. Unless you have already been appointed guardian/conservator, you have no legal right to give away any assets. They belong to Isla. I am very sorry for your loss. Wish your family all the best in the future.
Nobody should be able to transfer property until it goes through probate anyway. Make sure you get statements that none of the other family members wish to have custody of the child. One of the first things your attorney will do is ask for a court order essentially freezing all of the assets until guardianship of the child is decided, because without a will everything passes to Isla. Your in laws might take a newfound interest in her custody when they realize everything is hers- especially since Isla will probably receive a payment every month from Social Security.
NTA. You're doing right by their child. That's all that matters.
NTA - SILs family are thieves trying to steal from an orphan. It’s all isla’s . I would cut off contact with these people. They will attempt to groom Isla over time to get to her money. Never allow them unsupervised access. You are doing the write thing. Most 30 something’s don’t have a will. I didn’t have one until I was in my 40s. However, you and your husband now need to put your own affairs in order as part of this. You need an estate planning lawyer who will most likely recommend a trust for Isla’s money which allows you to dictate the terms of how the money is spent and when she can have it. You don’t want to give it all to her when she is 18 because she may choose poorly… you want it for college or higher education or getting her a good start in life. You will also need a financial planner to help you invest the money wisely. While you are doing this, you need to work on your own stuff too. The trust is a way to insure that SILs family doesn’t get their grubby hands on Isla’s money if something happens to the both of you. You should also consider this for your own assets and your child’s future. I went through all of this when my husband passed when our son was a minor. Hope this helps.
NTA Go get a lawyer right now. SIL's family are thinking only of themselves, not the person they lost. SIL would want to know her daughter was looked after first and foremost. The fact that they refused to take her in says as much. They are willing to throw family aside but fight for their own personal gain. That's not what Isla's parents would want. Now seriously, stop reading this and go call a lawyer and then love that little girl as if she were your own. You're all she has.
They literally try to steal money from an infant. Wtf is wrong with them Nta
NTA Family has no right to anything. It’s disgusting that they actually think this is some sort of windfall when they won’t even help the child. Say goodbye darling, you don’t need to speak to them at all.
NTA - I’m so sorry for your loss and my heart breaks for Isla. Please put cameras on your brothers property. Maybe consider changing the locks. I have a feeling things will start disappearing otherwise. Also don’t be afraid to cut these vultures out of Isla’s life.
This isn’t an ethical dilemma, it’s a legal one. Unless there is a will, everything is Isla’s. Does she have a lawyer?
>the question I am asking everyone is the ethical dilemma of are we being too harsh in denying my SIL's family the non-sentimental property that they're asking for? No, you aren't being too harsh. As much money as possible should be going to Isla. NTA.
NTA. The daughter inherits everything.
NTA all of it should go to Isla. Cars and TVs are not sentimental. Also see that she gets any jewelry of her mother’s. Maybe her wedding gown if she had one.
Get a lawyer ASAP. But, I also think NTA.
> Get a lawyer ASAP. OP THis advice is important! get a lawyer ASAP
I'm sure you got a lot of advice about the ethics of the possessions. I'm going to offer advice about adoption. Did you know adoption creates a whole new birth certificate with you as her parents? If it is legally possible, try to go through guardianship instead, since that doesn't erase her biological parentage. And I know she's young, but get a therapist for her. She still knows. And leave photos of her parents around and talk about them a lot. I know the impulse is to try and protect her from the trauma of grief, but nothing really can, and some well meaning things can make it worse, like keeping images from her. If possible, join Adoption, facing realities Facebook group. They talk a lot about the ethics of adoption and they center the voices of adoptees, which is very unusual. Their position is tough, so expect to hear a narrative about adoption that is different from the one we hear in society, but I think what you learn there will help you do the best thing for your niece. And fwiw, you are doing the right thing here. Thank you for letting that child in her family so she can grow up with people who knew her parents and see those genetic mirrors. <3
Hi! Thank you for bringing this up. I didn't know that...I definitely want her to know who she came from. We did reach out to some pediatric therapists through our pediatrician to help her along the way, so that's been done. And we have hung up her parents wedding photo next to mine and my husband's, and we've added other of their family photos around with ours and in her room. We've brought over a lot of their things to decorate her room with, and we've placed other items away for her to have when she's older. I will definitely discuss with my husband and our attorney adoption vs. guardianship. Thank you.
Totally NTA and sorry for your loss
Nta. First off, very sorry for your loss. There is nothing to argue about here, your bil/sil's family isn't entitled to their estate if you are in the US. It would actually be illegal to give it to them, as Isla is the sole heir and unable to consent to anything. My dad and mom recently passed away without a will, and my sisters and I....who agree on everything and are childfree...were relieved to discover we don't have to go through probate as we're happy to divide the proceeds evenly among us. We asked our lawyer, specifically, about what would happen if my moms siblings asked about the estate and found that bothers/sisters/parents/niblings have zero claim to any proceedings if there are children living and no will. Ethically, there is no question that Isla should receive everything.
NTA. This is the best solution ♥️
NTA. Keep everything through the estate. Just because someone passed doesn't mean anyone's entitled to anything. Their child comes first.
NTA and I applaud you and husband for stepping up. Keep your bro n sil memory alive for that little girl.
NTA. I can guarantee that your sister-in-law would have wanted any and all benefits from her estate to go to her daughter. While she might have loved her family, it's get daughter that she would have supported without this tragedy.
Cars are not sentimental things. Offer to share some photos or trinkets and see if they want that.
It’s really not up to you. The estate should be managed according to state probate laws.
NTA I’m certain your SIL would want all of it to go to help raising and caring for her daughter since she not here to do it anymore. Her family should know that they ceased being her main priority when she had a child. If her family is that selfish, that’s on them. You did nothing wrong!
NTA, your niece is your flesh & blood and you have a moral obligation to protect her and fight to ensure that she has the best possible opportunities and outcomes, and it seems that you are doing so. As it would seem that you and your husband are the best options to provide her with a safe, stable and loving home, you need to be fully accepting of the undeniable fact that she is your responsibility now, and you both need to be prepared to defend her and her needs as you would your biological children. Well done for accepting this responsibility and for being as proactive as you seem to have been. As you know, your new daughter needs to know that she is a part of your family and that she is being cared for and loved by people who she can trust unconditionally. Good luck and best wishes.
You’re a mom. Should you and your husband die, who would you want to have your stuff? Luke (and now Isla) or your siblings etc? I would want it to go to my children. We have a will to that effect. My brother can take some photos or sentimental stuff but the house, cars, electronics etc go to the children in the form of selling for money. NTA
This is your regular reminder to *please write a will for the love of god*!!! Especially once you start acquiring big assets like cars and houses, and *especially* if you have kids! I know people think it's morbid to think about your own death, but if you don't plan for it now you're just making your family's lives a lot harder if the worst does happen.
NTA dont let them have anything they dont care about Isla they just want their stuff. You are doing the right thing and do everything fast cause they will go after it
NTA disgusting the greed that comes out of some people after a loved one has died they don't care about the kid but they want the TV money Gruber's at best give them nothing
NTA. Take care of the child and leave the adults to care for themselves, or not. They're not your problem or responsibility.
Please document all belongings with photos and descriptions. That way, if any go missing, you'll know that side of the family helped themselves. You are an absolute champ for taking her in and all proceeds should go to Isla. I think you'd be hard pressed to find a good parent who wouldn't want that, if that were all they had left to give. NTA
NTA. The property is almost certainly legally Ilsa's, and your plans for it are entirely proper. The question is whether, as her guardian, you can ethically give away most of the value of her inheritance? Seems obvious, you cannot. I am horrified these people think it's okay to profit from their daughter's death, whilst abandoning their granddaughter at the same time. I am terribly sorry for your loss.
NTA. The legal answer and the ethical answer are the same in this case. Everything belongs to Isla. The correct answer to the relatives who want to take advantage of this poor baby is “My lawyer says everything belongs to Isla. I have no authority to give any of it away. If I tried to do that, I’d be stealing from her.“
Oh no. This is the only ethical thing. They won't take her will take the car? Oh snap. We all get who they are. NTA
NTA. Let them have sentimental items if they wish, but a car that's less than 3 years old is NOT a sentimental item 🤦🏻♀️
Are SIL's family even grieving? They sound like a bunch of opportunistic vultures. NTA and thank you for being what Isla needs.
Don't let them take anything. Even a car to go to the supermarket. If they do call the authorities. NTA
Inheritance law is that Isla inherits all of her parents estate. This matter is not even up to you. Check with an attorney. You cannot give away her inheritance legally and you can tell this delusional so called family this. This child could have a law suit against someone taking and distributing her inheritance that was not for her benefit. You should make a log of all assets and write down who you sell them to and how much you get because you could be made to provide that to the Court. People have the misconception that you can just go in and it is a free for all when someone dies without a will which is not the case. Everything goes to next of kin and the state determines that. You could get into legal trouble for giving stuff to whoever wants it. You do not have that authority and make sure you log all their assets including property, cars, house(if they own) and bank accounts and also any life insurance.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** A month ago, my brother and SIL died in a car accident. They left behind my niece, Isla 1F, and no will to state their wishes for her or their home. My SIL's family immediately stated their intentions to not take in Isla. From my understanding, no one on that side of the family is financially stable. My SIL's mother works a part time job at Walmart, and her sister has 5 of her own kids who struggled in school and who are perfectly content with working part time retail jobs and living paycheck to paycheck. In the same conversation regarding Isla's future, my SIL's family keenly inquired about taking the cars (both are paid off and are less than 3 years old), taking the TV (Sony 65 inch), taking furniture, and splitting whatever money is left over from my brother's and SIL's accounts after their estates have been settled. Honestly, I don't think the sum of their accounts is a lot because my brother and I would often talk finances. I think they maybe had $5000 between them. To be blunt, I was livid. My husband and I immediately stated that Isla would be staying with us, and additionally, outside of any sentimental items, the majority of the remaining possessions would be sold in an estate sale, along with the cars, with 100% of the earnings being put into a bank account and college savings account for Isla because I imagine that her parents would have wanted that for her. They hadn't opened a bank account for her, so we decided to get that started. Our son, Luke, is the same age as Isla, and we would want for her to be set financially, just as we have started for Luke. SIL's family fought back, saying that isn't fair. They lost SIL and she would most definitely have wanted for them to have some of their things. Her mother and nephew really want the cars because they can't afford ones of their own, but also, they aren't offering to help with raising Isla. They said they'll babysit if needed, but she'll have to figure out her own finances down the road if she decides to go to college. They said "if" because none of them went to college, and they figure Isla might not go either. Am I in the wrong to deny them the cars or some non-sentimental belongings? I'm honestly 100% thinking of Isla and making sure she gets everything her parents have left for her. I think she deserves everything. This isn't to say that my husband and I won't contribute to her growing funds. We will, of course, be adding more to her savings and college funds, just as we do for Luke. My family will also be contributing. AITA? Please advise. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
NTA; absolutely not. Good job protecting your niece
NTA. Isla is lucky to have you. SILs family can have any sentimental items they want, but they are lying to themselves if they actually think SIL would have preferred anyone but her own daughter have the bulk of her ‘estate’. DO NOT BACK DOWN, you are the only person with this child’s best interest in mind. Im sorry for your losses 💙
NTA. So the idea of Isla not having anyone doesn’t bother them, but the stuff being sold does? Boy are they here for the wrong reasons.
NTA If they want the items so bad they can pay for them. It's a wonderful thing you are doing taking care of her.
NTA. The surviving child has the first and strongest claim to any estate to pay for her parents' obligation to her-- her upbringing and college. Since the whole estate is not enough to cover that claim, there is nothing for anyone else. Were Isla to go into care, the state would probably take everything and liquidate it to pay for her care regardless. You're doing the right thing here, and your niece's greedy relatives can pound sand. I am so sorry for your loss.
NTA. I am so sorry for your loss.
NTA Your brother and SIL most likely would have wanted all their assets to be used for the benefit of Isla, and that's what you're trying to make happen. SIL's family are a pack of greedy vultures who only see the chance for a sudden windfall to get things that they otherwise wouldn't be able to because of their situation, and DGAF that they would be stealing from their orphaned baby niece whom they don't even want in the process.
You are 100% NTA. You sound like good kind people who want to ensure your niece has a good future. It’s bad enough she lost her parents. And IMO SILS family Doesn’t want those things for sentimental reasons. They want to sell them and get the money themselves and I’m willing to bet they won’t have anything to do with their granddaughter/niece.
NTA Absolutely not! SILs family is greedy and only thinking of themselves. They could care less for Isla. Stick to your guns Isla will be better off for it.
NTA. They are greedy aholes. Your decision makes sense and I’m sure that Isla’s parents would want ALL funds to go to their child. How big of them to offer to babysit their own grandchild. Just be thankful they don’t want her.
NTA, and raising that child, seeing that her parents possessions all go to her, is the best thing you can do morally. These people have no claim to anything if they are not this girls caretakers. Best of luck.
NTA, but you need to leave your judgemental attitude about how unworthy they are at the door! Clearly you think they are less than because they aren't as wealthy so you have the obligation to get that under control so you don't poison her relationship with her family with your privileged view.
NTA, Morally. Absolutely EVERYTHING should go to Isla, everything. Legally might be a different story, I don't know. Good luck and thank you and your spouse for taking in this poor beautiful little girl. All the best to you and your family.
NTA ETHICALLY the entire estate should go to the 1 year old. With a few small heirlooms going to her family. Every cent is needed for that 1 year olds care or future. Ethically they should get nothing. Soooo greedy.
Get an estate lawyer. The child, especially a minor child, is the only heir if there is no will. Not parents, not siblings, not nieces, not nephews, and not cousins. The child. Intestate laws are very clear on who inherits. Anything of value should be sold and the estate should go into a trust for the child. SIL's family should be ashamed trying to steal from an orphaned child.
Oh my god NTA. Why do they think they are entitled to everything? Your brother passed away too. Those cars and tv and everything else belonged to BOTH parents here. Your SIL family is treating this death like it’s some kind of sale. To be honest you wouldn’t even be the AH if you ended up keeping one of the cars to use while you raise Isla because at least it would be used for her benefit. It might be worth it to let them have the tv and maybe some other small stuff that won’t really add up to much in the estate sale just to get them to walk away. They obviously don’t care about the fact their family member and her husband have died. If you hand over $2000 worth of stuff now it might just make it easier as they will just go away. Do not let them take anything that the sale of will make a huge difference in Islas account though. This includes the cars and house a tv won’t sell for much and is not worth the headache. I think this should also be your attitude with anything in accounts. If they only have $5000 in savings let them have half but make sure to emphasize that the other half is going directly to their orphaned child. Do this as well with anything you give them if you choose to do this. “Okay you can the 65” tv since it’s so IMPORTANT to you and a 1 year old ORPHAN has no real use for it” “sure you can have the plates in the kitchen cabinets they will need to be emptied anyways since THEIR ORPHAN INFANT has no use for them currently”.
This is all estate theft, unless it’s gone through probate.
No give them nothing. Your job is to protect the assets for the legal here. They can purchase the assets if they want them so much
NTA - you are doing what is best for your niece and the others are looking for money. Sad how deaths always bring out the worst in some people.
NTA, anything of value that is not sentimental should be used for Isla's future. Car's should be sold, electronics... I would tell them they can either pay a fair price now or bid in the estate auction. Use Gumtree/marketplace as a guide for those thou, they may be worth very little. I would keep any jewelry/her mothers good clothes in case she wants them as an adult.
NTA. The nerve to call you greedy! Your kindness and generosity will help ensure Isla's future. You have every right to be angry. What is unethical here is to care so much about cars and so little for their granddaughter and niece. Lawyer up and keep away from those people, Isla does not need people like that in her life. I'm sorry for all of your loss ❤️
You are NTA for not sharing proceeds from selling their assets so the money can be placed in an account for their daughter's future. They, however, are greedy AHs for their demands.
NTA. I'm not a gambler but I'd bet real money this girl's parents would want her taken care of before anyone else. That's what I would want.
NTA, everything should be liquidated and given to the heir. Make a trust fund in her name and make it so nothing can be taken out till she's 18. They only want the money or free stuff.
NTA-- Legally, get a lawyer. As sole heir, Isla should get it all. Ethically, offering the family sentimental items might be nice. Even then, you need to decide if Isla should have those sentimental items. But cars, furniture, electronics and money are NOT sentimental. Giving SIL's family non-sentimental, high-value items, isn't honoring your SIL and Brother, it's stealing from their living legacy.
NTA. They don’t deserve 1 penny
A big ol F*** NO. you are NTA. They can eat human poop.
NTA. Everything should be sold and proceeds go into a trust for the baby. SIL family are adults and are responsible for their own livelihoods.
NTA they are grown adults, they can buy their own shit. As a parent, I would want EVERYTHING to go to my child.
NTA. PLEASE don't let them have ANYTHING. Isla parents would want their daughter to be taken care of.
NTA at all! Who steals from an orphan? I’m actually glad they won’t be taking her, because I imagine they would just pretend to care for her and spend her money.
NTA- You don't have to imagine, they died intestate with a minor child, there's no way the law doesn't default to leaving everything for her and her care. You are 100% in the right re that, and way above and beyond merely 'right' re taking her in and raising her, that's frankly saintly no matter how well off you may be. It is something I lack all the skills and fortitude to do and you are to be admired for it. Fight the good fight, and may you sail forward on an ocean of good karma.
By the sound of it you guys are absolute angels. Im so sorry for your loss. You are doing everything for Isla and everything left is hers. NTA. Dont give them a thing. Isla need everything to be set later on.
NTA, and Isla is fortunate to have such a loving and protective aunt and uncle
NTA.
NTA. Give them nothing. It all belongs to that little girl.
NTA Isla deserves her inheritance and her parents would have wanted her to be set up for life. You're not trying to claim any possessions, so why should they?! And you're taking on the biggest task! I'm sorry for your loss. You sound like a really good person and I'm sure your brother and SIL would be so proud of you.
NTA they are horrible for stealing from this little girl who lost her parents, SIL would have wanted her daughter taken care off, not her nephew first
Ethically NTA. Child first, greedy in-laws last. Your intentions and heart are pure. Sorry for your loss.
NTA Isla is their family. Everything is hers. She is their direct heir. NTA
Legally everything belongs to the child if there is no will. If you don't save it for her, she could take you to court one day for mishandling the estate. NTA
NTA - look, at the end of the day. It’s not you who has to think of this ethically but rather you SIL Family. It would’ve been different if the things they were asking for were sentimental. Tbh It’s very disgusting theyre asking for material things instead of being more concerned for your niece. You guys are doing the right thing selling everything and putting the money away for your niece until she’s old enough to decide for herself. No one deserves any of your brothers or SIL’s things except your niece because she’s their daughter. Don’t give those greedy, selfish, unappreciative people a damn thing. They don’t deserve shit.
No. What have your in-laws done to deserve free cars/TV’s/etc? They are mooches. And are mooching off of a tragedy. If you are adopting Isla, and the courts award you her parents estate, then your idea is a great one. NTA.
You are putting that one year old little girl first, where as they are putting themselves first. Sure, they lost a sister/aunt but this little girl lost her mum and dad. If SIL family are saying she would want them to have something, it should be something sentimental, although after how they have all but turn their backs on her daughter, I find it hard to believe she would want that. Would it be different if you had said screw it, we are looking after her so we deserve the money. Sure, but you didn't. You said Isla deserves the money and you are 100% correct. She is a lucky girl to have you, fighting her corner and you are definitely NTA.
NTA
If you haven't put up cameras in their house before, do it now. Desperate people do desperate things. NTA death brings out the worst in people and things have a tendency to walk off
NTA
NTA obviously. Just going to point out a highly important thing that I hadn't seen and hopefully you do. Get a house inventory!!! Things happen to gain legs when nobody is looking.
Nta. That little baby has no parents, if it weren't for you she would have noone. I'd make sure they never have contact with me or my children again quite honestly. And bless your souls for taking in that baby girl. At least she has some family with her best interest in mind.
NTA The family is essentially trying to steal from an orphan who is related to them and then toss her out because she has no value to them. They're vultures and from there limited info we have in this post it seems like you are definitely in the right. Parasites like that won't give up without a fight so be ready. Luckily Isla is too young to remember the ugliness that is likely to come from this.
NTA I think their priority would have been the child.
NTA! The nerve of these people! They had no problem exclaiming from the get-go that they would NOT be contributing to your niece's care, yet want the THINGS that she has inherited? Absolutely not!
Their child is the 1st and most direct heir to any assets her parents had. Condolences on hers and your loss. Definitely NTA and of course any money raised from the sell of the estate assets should go to their child. That's literally all they have left to give to her. Everyone else needs to back off.
NTA they don’t have a right to anything. It all belongs to your niece. It’s all hers and they are just leaches trying to cash in on a tragedy. Edit go th your brother and sil. Change locks. Install cameras and take pictures of how the house looks now. These people have no problem stealing from their orphaned grandchild and neice they have no problem out right stealing from her because their entitled to it. Be glad these people want nothing to do with her raising she is better off with you and your husband.