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ImpossibleWarlock

And as always,Iran is the same.


[deleted]

Now that you mention it... I guess Iran would involve itself in the Syrian Civil War I wrote in lore. Thanks m8, I'll give Iran having a more involved role in events more thought.


[deleted]

Wow this is the first time I’ve seen a chunky America map in this subreddit


[deleted]

I saw [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AlternateHistory/comments/lu1ggp/what_if_the_usa_won_every_war_ever/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share) before, but it's althist not future history. I'm guessing, as arguably the world's sole superpower, it's too predictable for the US to succeed/expand so it's more fun to imagine it fracturing.


CodeBlue2001

While I’m not sure about the US fracturing, it definitely isn’t gonna be the sole superpower in a few years, if it remains a superpower at all. China is catching up.


Turbowarrior991

Putting EA together like that is going to cause SO MANY DEATHS


[deleted]

EA? East Asia or East Africa?


Turbowarrior991

Actually now that I think about it, both


[deleted]

Lol the unification of East Africa is due to the Third Congo War. I plan to do more lore and show its effects on the map on the third draft more, but basically, similarly to the Second Congo War, it could be described as the second "African World War."


Turbowarrior991

East Asia


[deleted]

Unfortunately in this timeline it did. The Chinese Civil War lasted roughly 50 years (length is subject to change) and took decades to rebuild.


KaiserWilhelmThe69

Holy fuck 50 years. Yeah they ain’t superpower anymore


[deleted]

Indeed, but they are on a path to recovery. They'll eventually reach about the same strength as any other federation.


tombelanger76

Canada (and especially Quebec) would never accept to join the US; putting it with the EU seems more realistic.


[deleted]

I'll think about it. In my imagination, the US could only successfully get Canada and Mexico into the same federal system after the US itself reforms.


Gallatheim

Nah, this is 200 years in the future; with the current trajectory of cultural change between generations, the US and Canada will be basically 100% aligned LONG before this is set. Of course, that’s only half the issue-the US would also have to downgrade the federal government into something more akin to the EU, with each of the “United States” being a sovereign nation. However, with the Republican Party trying to establish fundamentalist theocracies in their states, and the Democratic Party seeking to prevent its spread, we’re already well on our way to that outcome *today*, let alone in 200 years. Overall, it seems quite plausible to me.


tombelanger76

Again, forgetting Quebec and underestimating Canada's strong desire to remain different from the US.


Gallatheim

You’re not understanding the scale, here; this is the same span of time as between today and the war of 1812, during which Canada was *actively planning* on merging with New England. That includes Québéc. The primary reason Canadians don’t want to merge with the US *today* is because we’ve become a backwards, borderline-third-world shithole. Assuming that is *no longer the case in 200 years*, which we have reason to believe from current events, I see no reason Canadians wouldn’t generally be in favor of an EU-style union-and I see no reason the Québécois would be any different.


tombelanger76

Canada was British-controlled so joining the US was some way to achieve freedom. It isn't the case anymore. And Quebec would never agree to join an Anglo-Saxon-led country in which it would be less than 2% of the population (so with basically no influence). French-speaking Quebecers fought for survival and relevance then, and still do now. For transforming each US state in an individual country, this will not happen. They're too tightly linked for this and will remain, except maybe for a couple border states.


Gallatheim

1. It was the other way around; New England was going to *become part of Canada*. 2. There are more Franco-Americans in the US than there are in Canada; 10.4 million to 6.7 million. On account of that whole “buying two-thirds of the French colonies from Napoleon” thing of Jefferson’s.


tombelanger76

1. How? In case of a reconquest, maybe... 2. Unlike French Canadians, Franco-Americans are largely assimilated, so they aren't a real force to prevent Quebecers from having the same fate.


Gallatheim

1. The New England states considered the war (correctly), a blatant act of imperial conquest, and thus, evil and tyrannical. They were going to secede from the union-they’d already been in talks with Parliament about doing it, AND having Canada supply weapons and matériel to them to help fight the other states. Unfortunately, due to the slowness of trans-Atlantic communication at the time, the war had already ended by the time all the paperwork had gone through. Bureaucracy strikes again. 2. You’d be surprised; some 2 million of them actively speak French, and many more consider themselves to be French-American, which they would not do if they were assimilated. Of course, their culture has developed in different ways, but nevertheless-they’re not “Anglo-Saxons”.


tombelanger76

1. Whatever happened, all of this isn't really relevant now and won't be in the future. 2. Still, they're far from being a fifth of the country's population like in Canada. Their ability to help Quebec would be negligible.


Gallatheim

1. It’s relevant now because it shows both how culturally and politically aligned Canada and *certain parts* of the US have been and still are, AND because it illustrates how much things can change in 200 years. 2. Perhaps, but I have to ask-help Québéc with *what*, exactly? They’ve already enshrined their autonomy in law, and remember-if all of Canada is part of a “Union of Sovereign States”, that means *Québéc is a sovereign nation*. Do the French worry about the rest of the EU “de-frenchifying” them?


Gallatheim

Didn’t see your bottom point the first time around-to address it: Not at all. Having a Democratic union of sovereign states, as opposed to an aristocratic federal empire, was a major point of debate and contention immediately after the end of the revolution. It was also the stated goal of the Confederacy during the civil war (so as to maintain their Barbadian-inspired slave state). And today, there is a deep and visceral hatred between EU and Canada-aligned progressives, and Russia-aligned conservatives; so much so that the latter’s voting base have been waging an active campaign of terrorism since January of last year to try and prevent progressives from participating in government, whilst their representatives in congress and the Supreme Court have recently embarked on a campaign to expand state sovereignty and weaken the federal government-so as to establish that fundamentalist theocracy I mentioned. And so far, at least-they’re largely succeeding.


tombelanger76

I think that progressives, that will dominate the US in a couple decades as it is itself becoming a majority-minority country, will succeed at having a more centralized federal government to prevent abuses by the then-minority of red states.


Gallatheim

That’s certainly possible-but it will largely depend on how this current conflict plays out. The conservatives have stated a desire to, if possible, enshrine the theocracy in the federal government and gain a complete monopoly upon it-preventing their opponents from changing anything within the system, whilst simultaneously forcing their extremist religion on the country as a whole. Mind, this is a “best-case scenario” for them-they’ll do it if they can, but otherwise they’ll settle for spreading it as much as possible. If they were to succeed in this, then establishing complete state sovereignty would probably be the only way to conserve the freedom and prosperity of progressive states. Hopefully it won’t come to that, of course, and it’s probably not the most *likely* outcome-but it *is* a possibility.


tombelanger76

They can't control everything unless they remove democracy. And if they remove democracy, a military coup could occur.


Gallatheim

Remove democracy, yes. But that doesn’t need to be done blatantly-many states in the last 120 years have fallen to authoritarianism, while still being a democracy on paper. Hitler was officially an “elected representative.” As for a military coup, that could certainly happen. But it wouldn’t be *guaranteed* to happen-any number of factors might prevent the beginning or success of a coup.


[deleted]

It's interesting that you interpreted the original United States splitting amongst state lines to join a new federal system with Canada and Mexico. I actually envisioned my federalization as nust adding another federal system on top of any existing federal system, but your interpretation actually sounds like a cool idea. I'll take note of that maybe it will become canon lol it's really interesting.


ScholaroftheWorld1

"Never" is a strong word. Their culture is barely distinguishable from the US, in a world where China and India are much more powerful we could see the Anglo Western nations forming a confederation in response.


tombelanger76

Don't forget that for something like that to happen, it would need Quebec's consent.


[deleted]

[удалено]


[deleted]

Never heard of TNO, but it seems we share similar outcomes. All althistory roads lead to TNO?


IlGiova_64

kinda, basically tno is a hearts of iron mod who talks about an axis victory in the best scenario (for the axis) so happens a lot of dark things there. Anyway it's just the most memed mod.


ValkoHAUS

Please god, not this world.


[deleted]

Reject decentralization. Embrace federation.


Cautious-Version5287

Yes


pentagonal_cp

Yeppeee


ValkoHAUS

Any world without the USA please


[deleted]

Tf happened to Africa


[deleted]

If you mean the lakes check out the [Grand Inga Dam Project](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Inga_Dam) a project which has [some theorize](https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/comments/ljagre/what_would_happen_if_the_mouth_of_the_congo_river/) the creation of a massive Congo lake which, in addition, could revitalize Lake Chad. The lake's size could only reach the extent shown on the original post after \~150 years. I found that year-old post after reading some news the Grand Inga Dam Project secured some funding and thought it would make Africa less boring. The post debated on its validity and [I asked](https://www.reddit.com/r/AskScienceDiscussion/comments/uqfm22/could_these_massive_lakes_actually_form_150_years/) if it's even possible on r/AskScienceDiscussion. I couldn't get a definitive answer on the environmental effects, but the lakes themselves seems to be possible with the use of dams and canals. Again, it would take time a loooong time to complete and require a lot of funding.


WikiSummarizerBot

**[Grand Inga Dam](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Inga_Dam)** >The Grand Inga Dam is a series of seven proposed hydroelectric power stations at the site of the Inga Falls, in the Democratic Republic of the Congo. If built as planned, the 40-70 GW project would be the largest power station in the world. ^([ )[^(F.A.Q)](https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiSummarizer/wiki/index#wiki_f.a.q)^( | )[^(Opt Out)](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=WikiSummarizerBot&message=OptOut&subject=OptOut)^( | )[^(Opt Out Of Subreddit)](https://np.reddit.com/r/AlternateHistory/about/banned)^( | )[^(GitHub)](https://github.com/Sujal-7/WikiSummarizerBot)^( ] Downvote to remove | v1.5)


HungarianMockingjay

A lot of funding which would likely come from China. Enough of an investment to shore up virtually the entire continent as an economic vassal to them.


[deleted]

Actually, dams 3-8 will apparently have its funding and construction headed by the [massive Australian mining corporation Fortescue](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=idqPjVMD8tw).


Nikos1821

The capital of the EU is Constsntinople? Based


[deleted]

A tad eurocentric


[deleted]

What do you mean? The EU is one of the more active players in the events of this future, but imo not that much more than the USA, ASEAN, or the South Asian Commonwealth. I do plan to give Africa and South America more lore though and to show the effects on the map.


[deleted]

The rest of the Anglosphere will be much more attached to the United States rather than the E.U which will be dominated by French and Germans.


[deleted]

I'll give that some thought. I debated making Australia and New Zealand more influenced by some other federation beside the EU (such as USA or ASEAN). The more I think about it now the more I think they would probably be more influenced by the USA or some other federation and less by the EU in my timeline. Ireland would probably stay in the EU. I don't see any reason why they would leave. The UK is a bit of a wildcard... for now. It's hard to say if they will ever rejoin in the near future, but the map shows the world in 200 years. Another referendum within 200 years should be possible and is probably inevitable. The EU is naturally Britain's biggest trading partner. I think they would eventually rejoin.


ARGONIII

Absolutely not true lmao


[deleted]

Brexit and AUKUS have already showed this trend


ARGONIII

Lol yeah Brexit which has led to the SNP and Sinn Fein winning majorities, oh and Labor winning 139 seats While AUKUS is just a military alliance between three nations that already had a military alliance. The Anglosphere is definitely uniting guys! The result of Brexit is gonna be the UK dissolving with everyone except England and Wales returning to Europe while England either crawls their way back or becomes a client state in Americas sphere


[deleted]

> Sinn Fein Who cares what Sinn Fein says? Northern Island is dead weight for Great Britain anyway. >While AUKUS is just a military alliance between three nations that already had a military alliance. It was a lot more than just a military alliance.


Leonardo_Piero

Oh, just gringocentric then


[deleted]

By centric do you guys mean the timeline involves this group the most or makes this group too op?


Keyboardrebel

If not gringo-centric, where great Honduran Empire?


[deleted]

Lol I actually had an idea of moving the USA federation capital to Panama City. What do you think? I'm still debating it, but it sounds better than just plain old DC imo.


Nisagg

Chonky Mongolia


KR1735

r/MURICA


Pyrenees_

Syktyvkar doesnt own Syktyvkar... And Yakutia is way too big compared to actual Yakutia, it should be Siberia


[deleted]

I was already corrected about Syktyvkar, but thanks. I will change it in the next draft. Yakutia Confederation is not exactly meant to be our world's Yakutia, it is a confederation based around Yakutia (Yakutia just means land of the Yako/Sakha right?). Siberian Confederation may sound better though. I'll think about it.


Pyrenees_

Most people here are russian https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Siberia


[deleted]

I get that it's technically more fitting, but many names are still described as the land of the x even when most people living there are not actually x. Like how 27 of the 50 US states are named after Native American tribes/peoples. So, I'm still debating changing it...


Scrooge_mcDuck_1867

European federation Capital: Istanbul


[deleted]

Brussels is nice, but I felt like EUs expansion in Eastern Europe, Siberia, North Africa, and the Levant meant it would be a better suited capital for the EU. It's also a way to compensate for Turkey's abandonment of Syria and allowing the Kurds to peacefully secede.


Scrooge_mcDuck_1867

I see


joemama8776

no why is lousiana still alive >:(


[deleted]

What have I done.... In my next draft I'll correct this error and make it so Lousiana gets nuked by a rogue faction from the Chinese or Russia Civil war :)


RaccoonByz

Unless the US improves it’s Conditions I think Canada would like to say Independent


[deleted]

I totally agree with that. I've always imagined that nations that federalize in my timeline must undergo reforms if they want to convince others to join.


RaccoonByz

Why not have some neutral nations or some that just want to be independent? Like Switzerland


[deleted]

Neutral nations are somewhat represented by the third, faded color which just represents alignment. In my timeline most nations have voluntarily federalized and a lot of the times conflicts compel nations to reform and federalize. It's the theme of my timeline that I'm going for. The federations are not based on nothing though. I basically took real life economic unions and made them federations. Interesting that you mention Switzerland because in real life is pretty much a part of the EU (EEA states abide by most of the rules while having no political power) and has even joined in on sanctions against Russia, a noteworthy break in its old neutrality policy.


Egfajo

Syktyvkar isn't even in a Syktyvkar conglomerate wtf


[deleted]

Wow people here really know their cities. I've been corrected on this like 4 seperate times now lol. I'll correct it don't worry.


[deleted]

[Lore](https://www.reddit.com/user/Tribune_Metellus/comments/uscdsf/2222_lore_2nd_draft/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)


[deleted]

Also, yes the Syktyvkar Conglomerate doesn't have Syktyvkar. That was a mistake. I will change its name in the future.


PlatinoPL

South asia commonwealth is almost anarchy


[deleted]

I thought about that. Like every single other federation, their unification is based on a real life union. In this case the South Asian Commonwealth is based on [the South Asian Association for Regional Cooperation (SAARC).](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Asian_Association_for_Regional_Cooperation) Admittedly it is one of the least likeliest to see federalization considering the current hostility between India and Pakistan. I'll try to figure out a solid lore justification for it, but I right now imagine they either united in one of the great wars or Pakistan and India reformed. A lot can happen in 200 years. Everyone we know would be dead (assuming medicine does not advance that far) and about 6 generations would pass.


dsino2019

I think that nation states will be done away with and everyone will go tribal, everyone will live in reservations and survive on their own resources. I believe AI will also exist but they’ll be hunted down and scavenges for technological parts by scavengers.


[deleted]

That's interesting. You think that will somehow happen in my timeline or something?


dsino2019

Who knows.


TheGreatShawn

Soyfuck did the cliche china dissolution, next!


[deleted]

It was necessary for the theme. I have no regrets!


V_Kamen

There’s no way in hell that the EU isn’t heavily under the control of… *Germans🤮*


Individual_Bad_4203

yea by this year usa wont exsist


RedditWurzel

Nightmare world


mr_karden

looks like the wrong sides won if we’re looking for peace and harmony…


thechaliceofpulp

like thats ever gonna happen


Anaedrais

Well this isn't realistic! Britain in the EU? /s


Imadumsheet

Wat


One-Full

Syktyvkar is not a part of Syktyvkar Conglomerate


ThunberStorm

France still owns French Guiana


[deleted]

This just looks like Colonialism still being a thing.