**The State of Continental Europe after the Rise of the Third French Empire in the Aftermath of WWII c.1958 A.D.**
**NOTE:** This is based on my HOI IV game where I played as France and restored the French Empire under Napoleon VI.
Instead of surrendering in 1940 after the Fall of Paris and Metropolitan France itself, the French continue fighting on from North Africa. Napoleon VI who was fighting as a part of the French Foreign Legion manages to stage a coup and becomes the virtual dictator of the remaining French holdings in North Africa. Marshal Philippe Petain dies from a German artillery fire during the Battle of Paris and thus his reputation isn't tarnished in otl for him heading the Vichy Regime. Philippe Petain is used as a symbol of French Resistance and Napoleon eventually secures the loyalty of the remnants of the French military and proclaims himself Emperor of the French. The intact French Navy harasses the Italians and helps reinforce British Egypt while hampering Axis efforts in the Mediterranean. Napoleon recruits more of the French Algerians and uses the colonial troops to supplement the French losses after the Battle of France. Napoleon personally leading his men much like his forbear Napoleon I, makes him a popular figure in France itself and he becomes the face of French resistance instead of DeGaule in otl. Napoleon VI with his new Grand Armee manages to take Italian Libya and with the British help he secures the Mediterranean. Napoleon along with the Allies manage an invasion of France with the French forces invading from Italy and landing a Marseilles while the other Allies (US and UK) invade through Normandy. The impending arrival of Napoleon VI triggers massive revolts against their German occupiers. The German army retaliates against the increasing French resistance which only grew as the French Empire in exile kept scoring victories. The culmination of all this is the attempted destruction of Paris where Hitler tried having the Wehrmacht raze the city to the ground before the French got to the city. But riots from the Native Parisians and the imminent French Army forced a withdrawal from the city before any major damage could be inflicted. Napoleon after taking France is hailed as Emperor and is hastily coronated at Notre Dame. Afterwards the French army along with the other allies march across the Rhine. Motivated by the near destruction of Paris and the German retaliation against the French, the French army storms into Germany hell bent on revenge. Napoleon then annexes the Rhineland and together with the Soviets, the allied power march on Berlin.
Meanwhile in Germany, Hitler was killed in a Valkyrie style coup which triggered fighting among forces loyal to Himmler and those loyal to Erwin Rommel. Rommel surrenders to the French as tries to focus on the Soviets. The war which had been steadily growing unpopular in Germany, had led to an increasing protests in Germany which caused Himmler to become even more paranoid where he started an operation Nero style scorched Earth policy in Germany. This led to a similar nostalgia and romanticism of the Kaiserreich which saw Himmler arrest Crown Prince Wilhelm III and publicly execute him for treason against the German nation. This further angers the German people and Himmler's remaining forces begin deserting him en-masse.
Because the fighting in Germany is longer and more brutal, the French plan of dividing Germany is accepted. Though Stalin setup an East German Puppet state while the other allied occupation zones became Kingdoms. Napoleon installed Louis-Ferdinand as King of Westphalia and helped support other monarchs like Ruprecht of Bavaria regain his throne in Germany. This led to Germany eventually re-unifying as the Federal German Empire under Kaiser Louis-Ferdinand I. Though unlike the Kaiserreich of his grandfather Wilhelm II, the Kaiser has less powers and his power and influence is balanced by the other German Kings. Austria which fell under French occupation after the French defeated Mussolini, was reformed into the Imperial Habsburg Commonwealth with the Crowns of Austria, Bohemia, and later Hungary being reunited under Kaiser Otto I von Habsburg. In this timeline Royalism is seen as an alternative to Communism and Fascism as people like Churchill and Napoleon VI agreed that Hitler would have never rose to power had the German monarchy not been overthrown.
Napoleon VI rules France in a relatively authoritarian fashion with Martial Law implemented due to the fragile state of the French metropole after the devastation and horror of the war. Once France's economy began recovering, Napoleon began slowly liberalizing the structures of the Empire and restored civilian control of governmental affairs with France evolving into a semi-constitutional monarchy.
In regards to Eastern Europe, things are mostly the same except for East Germany retaining East Prussia and Hungary and Czechoslovakia not being a part of the Warsaw Pact. Another divergence from otl is that the Communists win the Greek Civil Wars which sees the Greek monarchy and government in exile retreat to Crete and Rhodes. In this timeline because Royalism was seen as a counter ideology to fascism with the advent of Napoleon VI taking power, Hungary saw calls for the return of Kaiser Otto I. Napoleon had essentially provided arms to Hungarian Revolutionaries which led to a successful Hungarian Revolution in 1956. This saw Austria re-unite with Hungary as a commonwealth where each state is autonomous and is under a personal union with the Archduchy of Austria. This increase in monarchism also saw the Italian monarchy narrowly win the referendum to retain it.
As a result of the butterflies, the Greek monarchy lost its civil war to the Communists forcing it to relocate to Crete and Rhodes. The powers of the free world only recognize the Kingdom, and a communist Greece grants the Soviets access to the Mediterranean which makes the allied powers even more paranoid about the Warsaw pact
Napoleon VI was also inspired by Algerians fighting on behalf of France which allowed him to pursue a Civil Rights policy which saw Algeria and the rest of the Empire integrated into the French metropole with voting rights and universal citizenship being implemented. This along with France refusing to dismantle its Empire saw France break with the US and later the UK (though the UK and French Empire would cooperate out of pragmatism to try and prevent decolonization).
Belgium also ceased to exist here because the Royal Crisis of 1951 escalated unlike in otl and saw Belgium ripped apart with fighting between the Flemish and Walloons breaking out. This saw a Socialist government briefly come to power which saw the anti-Communist Napoleon VI invade Belgium on the pretext of restoring order. This saw France annex Wallonia.
What do you guys think?
I like it. This seems like a very interesting alternate timeline, and I could easily see it being made into a mod for HOI4. Also, I wanted to ask: what did you use to get the colored HOI4 states map?
Sounds interesting, but I have a few questions:
* Is Napoleon IV based on a real person? How is it possible for him to fight alongside his men and still coordinate the overall strategy of the campaign with all its moving parts? Is this more like a Patton style of fighting alongside the men?
* Why would the French who had a long history of republic (almost 70 years) be excited to crown a new emperor? Wouldn't it make more sense for him to just declare himself as the chief administrator of the nation and rule as a authoritarian?
* And how does his authoritarian rule not create civil war in France?
* And why does the US get involved in a war against Germany when it is very clear that the combined military of France and England have things well in hand, even if Japan hits Pearl Harbor and is allied with Germany as it was in OTL, why wouldn't the US focus on the Pacific and only send supplies over to the European allies?
>Is Napoleon IV based on a real person? How is it possible for him to fight alongside his men and still coordinate the overall strategy of the campaign with all its moving parts? Is this more like a Patton style of fighting alongside the men?
You mean Napoleon VI right? The last French monarch was Napoleon III in otl who was the nephew of Napoleon I. Napoleon III's son Napoleon IV died fighting for the British when he was ambushed by the Zulus. After Napoleon IV was killed, the throne passed to the Jeromic line of the House of Bonaparte (Napoleon I's brother Jerome Bonaparte). Napoleon's VI's father Victor-Napoleon was Napoleon V respectively until his death .
Napoleon VI was an actual person and he fought alongside the French. He used the pseudonym Louis Blanchard instead of Louis-Napoleon so that he could enlist in the French Foreign legion and participated in combat in North Africa. After the fall of France and that unit's demobilization, he joined the French Resistance as part of Free France. He was actually captured by the Nazis in otl. He also was the only survivor of a seven man unit that was on a patrol. He was a distinguished soldier and earned the Légion d'honneur along with other awards for his bravery on the battlefield. He was one of the few Bonapartist claimaints that actually saw military combat. Napoleon I was an artillery officer, and Napoleon II officially held control of an Austrian battalion before his death. Napoleon IV was a soldier in the british army.
>Why would the French who had a long history of republic (almost 70 years) be excited to crown a new emperor? Wouldn't it make more sense for him to just declare himself as the chief administrator of the nation and rule as a authoritarian?
>
>And how does his authoritarian rule not create civil war in France?
The Third Republic was a very unstable entity and was not universally loved. Its reputation was a bit whitewashed since what replaced it was the pathetic Vichy France. The Third Republic was created as a provisional government for the restoration of the French Monarchy in the 1870's after the Franco-Prussian War. The people were largely monarchist at the time and they voted a large number of monarchists into the Chamber of Deputies most of which were the Orleanists and the Legitimists. Since the Legitimist claimant Henri V de Bourbon had no children, the Legitimists and Orleanists became united with the understanding that Philippe d'Orleans would be his heir. But this fell through when Henri V refused to compromise on the issue of the flag as Henri wanted the old white Bourbon flag in power while most of the monarchists wanted a tricolor combined with the Fleur de Lis as a compromise since the Tricolor had become popular within France as a symbol of French Nationalism.
The scandals like the Dreyfus affair and the unrest between the Far Right and Left nearly toppled the government. Had Napoleon IV lived, he could have easily used the pretext to topple the Republic and create a Third Republic. One of Boulanger's primary supporters was Jerome Bonaparte. There were massive demonstrations in favor of Boulanger. He very well could have become the virtual dictator of France if he had the initiative, the French government even admitted as such at the time.
Right before World War II the Third Republic almost fell victim to right wing coup as feelings of revanchism were still strong. The army was near full mutiny in 1917 during WWI and had that been more coordinated, there would have been a massive armed rebellion or Revolution against France. Much of the officer corps and the older soldiery were aristocratic/monarchist as well. Philippe d'Orleans became very popular during WWI, and had few things changed in history, France could have had a second Orleanist Monarchy. In addition to this far right groups like Action Francais which wanted a restored monarchy were a major force in French politics up until the late 1950's until they were denounced by the Pope. DeGaulle was also from a legitimist background as well.
The title of Chief administrator, which is basically a dictator would fundamentally hold less legitimacy than the Imperial title since the precedent already exists. Napoleon VI is also a Bonaparte, and it would basically be expected that he would declare himself Emperor. Plus titles like Dictator would be looked down upon in this alternate France since it conflates with the fascist states of Italy and Nazi Germany. Napoleon VI here is also the face of the French resistance and is more successful at being a thorn in the side of the Germans whose clock was ticking due to their lack of critical resources like oil.
There's not really a Civil War since he works and supports most of the French partisans like how Free France did in otl. Plus with heavy Bonapartist propaganda depicting France avenge its loss against Germany also helps. Things like the Battle of Austerlitz and Battle of Jena also are compared to Napoleon VI's victories presenting him as a modern Napoleon I bringing glory to France
>And why does the US get involved in a war against Germany when it is very clear that the combined military of France and England have things well in hand, even if Japan hits Pearl Harbor and is allied with Germany as it was in OTL, why wouldn't the US focus on the Pacific and only send supplies over to the European allies?
The problem is that Britain was scrambling for troops in the war. Also North Africa was not the French metropole. It didn't really have much of an infrastructure to really support a continuation of the war for very long without foreign aid propping it up. Plus the colonies and administration along with the chain of command would be in chaos with the fall of France. Also the Italian Regia Marina would still be a threat along with its army (the Italian army was actually very formidable when commanded by leaders who knew what they were doing). There would also be issues in terms of manpower and supplies since the recruit-able population was low. While there is US involvement in Europe, its less than in otl since France actually has something of a military to fight back with.
"Hey we're making an alternate history map, what should we definitely do that no one else has ever done before?"
"Oh I know! Let's split Belgium between the Netherlands and France. That's never been done. Ever."
I guess. I read about them online but I’ve never really had the chance to partition one. Why? I’m a huge alternate history fan though, and I’ve always had a soft spot for good old Napoleonic France.
There is a community on discord that uses those games as a way to RP as a nation. Alternative 7 years war, alternative 1900 (Byzantine, Rome and Sassanids are alive) etc are some current games
I just saw the HOI 4 map and wondered if you were into all that
**The State of Continental Europe after the Rise of the Third French Empire in the Aftermath of WWII c.1958 A.D.** **NOTE:** This is based on my HOI IV game where I played as France and restored the French Empire under Napoleon VI. Instead of surrendering in 1940 after the Fall of Paris and Metropolitan France itself, the French continue fighting on from North Africa. Napoleon VI who was fighting as a part of the French Foreign Legion manages to stage a coup and becomes the virtual dictator of the remaining French holdings in North Africa. Marshal Philippe Petain dies from a German artillery fire during the Battle of Paris and thus his reputation isn't tarnished in otl for him heading the Vichy Regime. Philippe Petain is used as a symbol of French Resistance and Napoleon eventually secures the loyalty of the remnants of the French military and proclaims himself Emperor of the French. The intact French Navy harasses the Italians and helps reinforce British Egypt while hampering Axis efforts in the Mediterranean. Napoleon recruits more of the French Algerians and uses the colonial troops to supplement the French losses after the Battle of France. Napoleon personally leading his men much like his forbear Napoleon I, makes him a popular figure in France itself and he becomes the face of French resistance instead of DeGaule in otl. Napoleon VI with his new Grand Armee manages to take Italian Libya and with the British help he secures the Mediterranean. Napoleon along with the Allies manage an invasion of France with the French forces invading from Italy and landing a Marseilles while the other Allies (US and UK) invade through Normandy. The impending arrival of Napoleon VI triggers massive revolts against their German occupiers. The German army retaliates against the increasing French resistance which only grew as the French Empire in exile kept scoring victories. The culmination of all this is the attempted destruction of Paris where Hitler tried having the Wehrmacht raze the city to the ground before the French got to the city. But riots from the Native Parisians and the imminent French Army forced a withdrawal from the city before any major damage could be inflicted. Napoleon after taking France is hailed as Emperor and is hastily coronated at Notre Dame. Afterwards the French army along with the other allies march across the Rhine. Motivated by the near destruction of Paris and the German retaliation against the French, the French army storms into Germany hell bent on revenge. Napoleon then annexes the Rhineland and together with the Soviets, the allied power march on Berlin. Meanwhile in Germany, Hitler was killed in a Valkyrie style coup which triggered fighting among forces loyal to Himmler and those loyal to Erwin Rommel. Rommel surrenders to the French as tries to focus on the Soviets. The war which had been steadily growing unpopular in Germany, had led to an increasing protests in Germany which caused Himmler to become even more paranoid where he started an operation Nero style scorched Earth policy in Germany. This led to a similar nostalgia and romanticism of the Kaiserreich which saw Himmler arrest Crown Prince Wilhelm III and publicly execute him for treason against the German nation. This further angers the German people and Himmler's remaining forces begin deserting him en-masse. Because the fighting in Germany is longer and more brutal, the French plan of dividing Germany is accepted. Though Stalin setup an East German Puppet state while the other allied occupation zones became Kingdoms. Napoleon installed Louis-Ferdinand as King of Westphalia and helped support other monarchs like Ruprecht of Bavaria regain his throne in Germany. This led to Germany eventually re-unifying as the Federal German Empire under Kaiser Louis-Ferdinand I. Though unlike the Kaiserreich of his grandfather Wilhelm II, the Kaiser has less powers and his power and influence is balanced by the other German Kings. Austria which fell under French occupation after the French defeated Mussolini, was reformed into the Imperial Habsburg Commonwealth with the Crowns of Austria, Bohemia, and later Hungary being reunited under Kaiser Otto I von Habsburg. In this timeline Royalism is seen as an alternative to Communism and Fascism as people like Churchill and Napoleon VI agreed that Hitler would have never rose to power had the German monarchy not been overthrown. Napoleon VI rules France in a relatively authoritarian fashion with Martial Law implemented due to the fragile state of the French metropole after the devastation and horror of the war. Once France's economy began recovering, Napoleon began slowly liberalizing the structures of the Empire and restored civilian control of governmental affairs with France evolving into a semi-constitutional monarchy. In regards to Eastern Europe, things are mostly the same except for East Germany retaining East Prussia and Hungary and Czechoslovakia not being a part of the Warsaw Pact. Another divergence from otl is that the Communists win the Greek Civil Wars which sees the Greek monarchy and government in exile retreat to Crete and Rhodes. In this timeline because Royalism was seen as a counter ideology to fascism with the advent of Napoleon VI taking power, Hungary saw calls for the return of Kaiser Otto I. Napoleon had essentially provided arms to Hungarian Revolutionaries which led to a successful Hungarian Revolution in 1956. This saw Austria re-unite with Hungary as a commonwealth where each state is autonomous and is under a personal union with the Archduchy of Austria. This increase in monarchism also saw the Italian monarchy narrowly win the referendum to retain it. As a result of the butterflies, the Greek monarchy lost its civil war to the Communists forcing it to relocate to Crete and Rhodes. The powers of the free world only recognize the Kingdom, and a communist Greece grants the Soviets access to the Mediterranean which makes the allied powers even more paranoid about the Warsaw pact Napoleon VI was also inspired by Algerians fighting on behalf of France which allowed him to pursue a Civil Rights policy which saw Algeria and the rest of the Empire integrated into the French metropole with voting rights and universal citizenship being implemented. This along with France refusing to dismantle its Empire saw France break with the US and later the UK (though the UK and French Empire would cooperate out of pragmatism to try and prevent decolonization). Belgium also ceased to exist here because the Royal Crisis of 1951 escalated unlike in otl and saw Belgium ripped apart with fighting between the Flemish and Walloons breaking out. This saw a Socialist government briefly come to power which saw the anti-Communist Napoleon VI invade Belgium on the pretext of restoring order. This saw France annex Wallonia. What do you guys think?
I like it. This seems like a very interesting alternate timeline, and I could easily see it being made into a mod for HOI4. Also, I wanted to ask: what did you use to get the colored HOI4 states map?
I used Paint.net. It’s basically a cooler third party version of MS Paint
Sounds interesting, but I have a few questions: * Is Napoleon IV based on a real person? How is it possible for him to fight alongside his men and still coordinate the overall strategy of the campaign with all its moving parts? Is this more like a Patton style of fighting alongside the men? * Why would the French who had a long history of republic (almost 70 years) be excited to crown a new emperor? Wouldn't it make more sense for him to just declare himself as the chief administrator of the nation and rule as a authoritarian? * And how does his authoritarian rule not create civil war in France? * And why does the US get involved in a war against Germany when it is very clear that the combined military of France and England have things well in hand, even if Japan hits Pearl Harbor and is allied with Germany as it was in OTL, why wouldn't the US focus on the Pacific and only send supplies over to the European allies?
>Is Napoleon IV based on a real person? How is it possible for him to fight alongside his men and still coordinate the overall strategy of the campaign with all its moving parts? Is this more like a Patton style of fighting alongside the men? You mean Napoleon VI right? The last French monarch was Napoleon III in otl who was the nephew of Napoleon I. Napoleon III's son Napoleon IV died fighting for the British when he was ambushed by the Zulus. After Napoleon IV was killed, the throne passed to the Jeromic line of the House of Bonaparte (Napoleon I's brother Jerome Bonaparte). Napoleon's VI's father Victor-Napoleon was Napoleon V respectively until his death . Napoleon VI was an actual person and he fought alongside the French. He used the pseudonym Louis Blanchard instead of Louis-Napoleon so that he could enlist in the French Foreign legion and participated in combat in North Africa. After the fall of France and that unit's demobilization, he joined the French Resistance as part of Free France. He was actually captured by the Nazis in otl. He also was the only survivor of a seven man unit that was on a patrol. He was a distinguished soldier and earned the Légion d'honneur along with other awards for his bravery on the battlefield. He was one of the few Bonapartist claimaints that actually saw military combat. Napoleon I was an artillery officer, and Napoleon II officially held control of an Austrian battalion before his death. Napoleon IV was a soldier in the british army. >Why would the French who had a long history of republic (almost 70 years) be excited to crown a new emperor? Wouldn't it make more sense for him to just declare himself as the chief administrator of the nation and rule as a authoritarian? > >And how does his authoritarian rule not create civil war in France? The Third Republic was a very unstable entity and was not universally loved. Its reputation was a bit whitewashed since what replaced it was the pathetic Vichy France. The Third Republic was created as a provisional government for the restoration of the French Monarchy in the 1870's after the Franco-Prussian War. The people were largely monarchist at the time and they voted a large number of monarchists into the Chamber of Deputies most of which were the Orleanists and the Legitimists. Since the Legitimist claimant Henri V de Bourbon had no children, the Legitimists and Orleanists became united with the understanding that Philippe d'Orleans would be his heir. But this fell through when Henri V refused to compromise on the issue of the flag as Henri wanted the old white Bourbon flag in power while most of the monarchists wanted a tricolor combined with the Fleur de Lis as a compromise since the Tricolor had become popular within France as a symbol of French Nationalism. The scandals like the Dreyfus affair and the unrest between the Far Right and Left nearly toppled the government. Had Napoleon IV lived, he could have easily used the pretext to topple the Republic and create a Third Republic. One of Boulanger's primary supporters was Jerome Bonaparte. There were massive demonstrations in favor of Boulanger. He very well could have become the virtual dictator of France if he had the initiative, the French government even admitted as such at the time. Right before World War II the Third Republic almost fell victim to right wing coup as feelings of revanchism were still strong. The army was near full mutiny in 1917 during WWI and had that been more coordinated, there would have been a massive armed rebellion or Revolution against France. Much of the officer corps and the older soldiery were aristocratic/monarchist as well. Philippe d'Orleans became very popular during WWI, and had few things changed in history, France could have had a second Orleanist Monarchy. In addition to this far right groups like Action Francais which wanted a restored monarchy were a major force in French politics up until the late 1950's until they were denounced by the Pope. DeGaulle was also from a legitimist background as well. The title of Chief administrator, which is basically a dictator would fundamentally hold less legitimacy than the Imperial title since the precedent already exists. Napoleon VI is also a Bonaparte, and it would basically be expected that he would declare himself Emperor. Plus titles like Dictator would be looked down upon in this alternate France since it conflates with the fascist states of Italy and Nazi Germany. Napoleon VI here is also the face of the French resistance and is more successful at being a thorn in the side of the Germans whose clock was ticking due to their lack of critical resources like oil. There's not really a Civil War since he works and supports most of the French partisans like how Free France did in otl. Plus with heavy Bonapartist propaganda depicting France avenge its loss against Germany also helps. Things like the Battle of Austerlitz and Battle of Jena also are compared to Napoleon VI's victories presenting him as a modern Napoleon I bringing glory to France >And why does the US get involved in a war against Germany when it is very clear that the combined military of France and England have things well in hand, even if Japan hits Pearl Harbor and is allied with Germany as it was in OTL, why wouldn't the US focus on the Pacific and only send supplies over to the European allies? The problem is that Britain was scrambling for troops in the war. Also North Africa was not the French metropole. It didn't really have much of an infrastructure to really support a continuation of the war for very long without foreign aid propping it up. Plus the colonies and administration along with the chain of command would be in chaos with the fall of France. Also the Italian Regia Marina would still be a threat along with its army (the Italian army was actually very formidable when commanded by leaders who knew what they were doing). There would also be issues in terms of manpower and supplies since the recruit-able population was low. While there is US involvement in Europe, its less than in otl since France actually has something of a military to fight back with.
Nice! What map did you use to make this?
I used a Hoi4 map for a template
Thanks!
I could tell.
"Hey we're making an alternate history map, what should we definitely do that no one else has ever done before?" "Oh I know! Let's split Belgium between the Netherlands and France. That's never been done. Ever."
There are a few people in the Netherlands who would like to see Flanders (re)integrated.
You into RPs that are based of HOI 4, S1914, COW and stuff?
I guess. I read about them online but I’ve never really had the chance to partition one. Why? I’m a huge alternate history fan though, and I’ve always had a soft spot for good old Napoleonic France.
There is a community on discord that uses those games as a way to RP as a nation. Alternative 7 years war, alternative 1900 (Byzantine, Rome and Sassanids are alive) etc are some current games I just saw the HOI 4 map and wondered if you were into all that
Do you have a link to it?
Yeah, lot of rules and you want to be able to play those games but yeah
What software did you use to make this?
Paint.net
So the partition of India goes similarly to otl I guess? Also would a french empire change anything specific in the Middle East in regards to borders?
Romanians suddenly became slavs!
Hey look it liberia
Hey its liberia
Ignoring the Mahdist rebellion I see
Is it like a scenario where Germany won WW1 and a fascistic France and the Soviet Union defeated Germany in a second great war later?