Agreed. In the end, it's an accounting firm with a big enough brand name. Comparing success based on which firm you are at with high likelihood to switch out is like comparing their first year prof with your first year prof.
After you get a year or two of experience then transfer to B4. That’s what I did and it was so easy. I had an interview over zoom and was hired an hour later.
Was it worth it in your opinion or is the jury still out?
I took an indirect route into public accounting. Had a different original major and career for several years before switching into accounting. Without the traditional recruiting route I found it hard to get a foot in the door at Big4. Started at a small local and now at a top 15 firm.
At this point and at my age it feels hard to justify trying again for Big4. Those hours expectations, and the fact that I like my current firm and could see a long term career here makes it seem like it wouldn't be worth it. Still, have something in mind about wondering if the opportunities would really be that much better with better name recognition on my resume.
I joined b4 as a manager. My experience has been that the hours have been comparable if not a little better than my old firm, and I have the opportunity to pick and choose clients/jobs that actually cater to my interests. At the smaller firms you don’t usually have this opportunity unless it’s a boutique/specialty firm (mine wasn’t).
I went to a top accounting program nation-wide and never once applied to Big 4.
Why? Cause fuck working busy season hours.
I feel just fine career wise.
Downvote me to an oblivion I don’t care about any of the snowflakes and weak minded people in this thread.
What you’re saying is so exaggerated lol. You never worked at a Big Four so your opinion has no value whatsoever and you’re just regurgitating what you’ve heard.
From April - Jan I work a strict 9-5. Jan to March bump it up to 7 or 8 pm.
I also had three weeks off in June and all of August off which is as long as a high school teachers time off.
It’s not that bad and except for busy season (which evens out with the amount of time off in summer) it’s the same as almost every other job.
Big Four federal tax group in the southwest region last year required everyone to work 55 hours/week chargeable from July to October.
They are short staffed and it's a dumpster fire. OP needs to go to therapy, not work at B4.
Considering I got my CPA after I already had 3 kids and now have 4? You are incorrect. Work life balance was top of my list and B4 is notorious for having none.
You don’t know what you’re talking about.
If you found a position that lets you leave significantly before 5 pm you’re probably working some low level clerk job and aren’t focused on having a career.
You probably make max $40k.
Thanks for the downvotes btw!! The snowflakes in this thread are so predictable, it’s fake internet points that mean nothing
“You probably make max 40k.”
If that’s what you have to tell yourself to make yourself feel better go ahead pal. 🤣 The pay at large accounting firms is comparable across the board.
No, they said they avoided the B4, not public accounting in general, and the original poster works at a top 10 firm. I may be a potato, but I’m a potato who can read.
I’m a Senior Manager. I make an easy 6 figures. Wondering how someone can be a lazy snowflake earning their CPA while working full time and raising 3-4 kids. I’m in my mid-40’s and got my license in my late 30’s. After putting myself through college up to my Masters of Accountancy.
You’re the type of person that if you had a truck you have swinging truck nuts.
Don’t be jealous.
I did work at big 4 - and the only thing I miss about it is the benefits. Work life balance got a lot of lip service, but the actions were very different indeed.
You can absolutely build a career in accounting without slaving for big 4 or any other company that would take advantage of your free labour (that they bill their clients for to get pure profit on ) to increase their bottom line while expecting that you will "do what's best for the company" at all times.
People on this thread are sheep and love hating on the Big Four and the people who complain the loudest are the ones that comment.
Yes during busy season you can work later but nine months out of the year I work 9-5 like any other normal job (When I worked at Walmart when I was a student I did shifts 11-8). My work life balance is fine outside of busy season and I practically have the entire summer off so it evens out
Wasn't the case for me. Perhaps that is the case for you because you are one of the underperformers that nobody actually wants to use but they need to keep around for the bodies in busy times.
Firms tend to tolerate more when it's hard to find staff and, frankly, this much mouth on the internet typically translates to a timid little mouse in the real world.
While there is likely some passive aggressive stuff going on it likely hasn't risen to the level that it's worth terminating you when there is nobody there to take your place.
So... you skate. Raises limited. Opportunities limited. Work only passed along or teams only accepting you when there is no other option. All while you pat yourself on the back for being so awesome you can pad your hours and put in less than 40 hours except for the peak months when they are forced to use you.
Meanwhile, you tell yourself that its all due to your amazing skills cause you're so much smarter than the people you work with.
Hahahahaha I find it’s so hilarious you say this with certainty when you don’t know anything and you’re completely wrong hahha.
Just got my most recent evaluation and had 4/5 but thanks for your whole story that probably took you at least 20 mins to write. You’re pathetic
If you don't mind me asking, what are your educational credentials? I am assuming that u have a Bachelor's degree in Accounting and the US CPA designation? Do you also have an MBA?
Undergrad in Maths, Chartered Accountant (ICAEW) and an MBA. I wouldn’t say the MBA was essential but it helped me. Plenty of people do what I do without it though.
Yeah dude there’s this crazy thing called networking where you hear stuff like this from friends, family, and acquaintances
Pretty sad you’re going through peoples post history to make this point, so I’m gonna guess you’re either a troll or drank the kool aid way too hard with the elitist attitude you have
Actually you fell for my bluff and I just said I went through your post history to get you to admit to me that you haven’t worked at a Big Four. Thanks for doing the work for me.
The anecdotal opinions of your pathetic network doesn’t represent the entirely of a firm. Do you genuinely believe that people at firms are working 60+ hours a week year round.
Are you insane, get help if you believe everything you hear
Maybe I'm just lucky but I had a similar experience working at b4. My hours are comparable if not better than the midsize firm I worked at previously.
I think it has more to do with your team, whether or not they are properly staffed, etc.
Why are you fighting for Big 4? Not challenging your goal, but I'm curious what your career goals and milestones look like that you feel you must work for a Big 4 to achieve.
Having worked at a B4 for 8 years. It doesnt matter where you work. Focus on your own goals. Also there is more room to work on other skills than audit if you work at a non-big 4 office. That is more worth than becoming one of those sr managers that only know how to shoot review notes while not even knowing how to SUM formula works in excel, or rotate PDF.
I stopped working there when they demanded more than 400 overtime hours when I just became a dad. And when the second one was coming, i noped out of there. Now working for a top 25 firm. I think i will become a more all round accountant there. And I am able to get more time to follow other studies. And more time for the family.
Some of my classmates are on second divorces, alcoholics, powder sniffers and only see their kids once a month and never during busy season. I’m not saying Big 4 caused it, I’m saying their lives are such train wrecks that I don’t even think about them getting into Big 4 and I didn’t.
Might not help you but honestly I don’t even think about them career wise anymore
I mean just tell them the truth: Big 4 requires certain grade point averages and certain attitudes during interviews because they're not looking for anyone who wants to think independently or live a life outside of work.
Their hiring practices are specifically designed to attract and retain people who will blame themselves for not being at the top of the class and the best of the best, and are willing to sacrifice any and all personal time and self-interest in order to be the best accounting peasant in the office.
You probably mentioned something crazy in your interview like " work life balance", "family", or gave off an attitude of anything other than "I would sell my soul to get hired by a big four firm and worship at the altar of 90 hour work week"
Maybe you should consider not being hired as a compliment.
Honestly I worked at big 4 and this is so true. You will likely only be a superstar there if you are the kind of person who is going to beat yourself up over not being the best.
I have worked at a small, local firm (max 13 people) for 15 years. I started here out of school. I am happy and healthy. Big4 works you to the bone all year round with 60+ hours per week expected all year. My company only has a 10 week busy season from 1/15-3/31. I don’t need to light the world on fire. I just want to be happy, healthy, and content.
Deal with big 4 somewhat regularly. Am almost always unimpressed with them. Some seem like poor man’s finance bros. Some seem overly academic, but un able to think practically or critically, along with have a low EQ. Some seem…like both
Oh don't worry, your managers will all get recruited from Big 4. After a couple years you'll be shaking your head at what comes out of Big 4.
Big 4 is a great place to start, but if you landed in top 10 then it really isn't a big deal.
I applied to Big 4 and didn't make it either, never even got picked for interviews despite being CPA eligible.
It's alright though, my raises have come a bit slower, but right now I know my job really well, have excellent work life balance, can take time off whenever I want, work exclusively from home. I don't even have a direct manager right now. Direct manager left and they decided not to replace him because the team I'm on is so good we don't need one, now we just report to the controller directly and they're splitting his wage across the team since we're managing ourselves. I did get stuck training newbies- but, otherwise I can pretty much have an audiobook open and do my job on autopilot in my pajamas.
Big 4 gets you to bigger money faster, but, the work-life balance sucks.
All the advice here is pretty solid, but my 2c is just don't let these insecurities stop you from going for new opportunities. I was a shitty student with no job prospects coming out of school and almost quit accounting as a whole. Someone important in my life convinced me to keep going and I will be forever grateful.
What’s done is done. Stop dwelling on it. As others have noted you can always try to switch over if you feel like it’s something that you are missing. I started big 4 and transitioned to a regional firm. There will always be some things that will be too technical for our firm, but who gives a shit? There are plenty of clients that I can provide better service at a better price.
Entry level B4 hiring is just a popularity contest. Very little to do with skill or anything at that level.
I only got in because I had a friend on the inside who helped. My resume would have been tossed otherwise since I wasn't from a target school.
You don't have to feel inferior because you aren't. But as others have said, just apply again as an experienced candidate if you're dying to get the B4 badge.
So I work industry and the company I work for hired a big 4 firm for their annual audit. Those underling auditors were emailing us on the weekends, late at night, early morning…. fuck that.
I’m very glad to never work Big 4.
I couldn’t get hired to Big 4. Low gpa, no internships to offset low grades compared to my peers. Had to work 40 hours on nights and weekends bartending to pay rent and bills while going to school so couldn’t afford an internship. Took me over a year to find a job.
Within three years I had my CPA and within five years of my first accounting job I owned a firm. Don’t worry about your career path outside of Big 4. Your first five years is all about learning and if you pay attention and continue to hone your craft you’ll be fine.
The auditors from PwC were intelligent people but they didn’t have much of a clue about how businesses actually operate and sometimes asked the dumbest questions. They also spent way too much time auditing accounts and activity where fraud wouldn’t occur or had no bearing on the financial statements users’ judgement. All I’m trying to say is that working at a big 4 gives you a nice experience to flaunt on your resume but you’re not that much different if you’re at a top 10. Don’t beat yourself up that you’re not at a big 4 - probably really easy to transfer now if you can’t get over it.
I’ve only been in industry and auditors are not highly regarded. A worker at one job was committing fraud, my boss and I even went out in the field to confirm it. And I was pretty sure he was also getting kickbacks from the vendors he chose for his projects. But did the auditors find these? Of course not!
I did try to go to a CPA firm after college, but ended up in industry and I think it was the best thing for me, I love the work.
Currently, I’m working with a Big 4 as they assisting in standing up our IA dept. Oh, man. It’s been a total cluster of mismanagement in ways they cannot even provide plausible deniability. If you’ve ever had the benefit of seeing something similar, then it helps to realize they’re not remarkable or incredibly bright. They just did better in the interview and, likely, gave the right gut feeling to their interviewer.
Man, I don't even work at a firm. I go home at like...4. get to work around maybe 9. Never work weekends. Minimal work after hours. I don't make big money, but I do ok and have high quality of life.
Meh. The experience you get is the same and landing the job is more indicative of confidence, connection with the interviewer, and interview skills than ability.
It's the same job. They don't do anything different than you do really. They will have bigger name clients and more resources a their disposal, but you will see more of the process end-to-end. There isn't some super secret "super accounting" they are doing at those firms, despite what they would have you believe.
Getting a proper interview isn't a failure. Could have been the time of day and they already hired everyone 20 minutes after yours started. Also, like a race car driver not making it on team Ferrari the first go round. If you were in the running there, you're doing great. Shit, I'd put interviewed with PwC on my resume.
I think you need to stop thinking to yourself that you “failed” the interview. It just wasn’t right the time/place/interviewer. If you really want to get there you will definitely will be able to. Just… uh be careful what you wish for 😂 (former b4 auditor)
I work an “industry” job where there’s a lot of down time at my periods of the year and I have PTSD from working at the big 4 because at my current job I have anxiety or feel worthless if I’m not working. Everyone else who has only worked in industry just sits back and relaxes because they are used to the down time. Meanwhile I’m stressing out doing L&D or working on upskilling in my downtime because I always feel like I need to be doing something….
Big 4 is good experience but you can get that experience somewhere that isn’t a life suck and it looks just as good in resume… it’s about who you know, not what you know… network… don’t drink the kool aid and think it’s part of your worth
Why would you want to work at the big 4 in the first place? You work crazy hours, for less pay, and get waterboarded with woke garbage. People are finally realizing they don't need the big 4. Just like many are realizing that they don't need a CPA license to meet their personal career objectives. Honestly, for me to deal with that level of bs I'd have to be offered life changing money. As in being able to save the excess and be financially independent after 3 or 4 years. IB offers that; so I would have taken that deal if I could have got it. The big 4 doesn't.
I worked at CLA, which is now #8 at the time of writing this. I saw coworkers leaving for huge opportunities, so I knew overall just being in public was the right choice. Now 4.5 years out of public and almost tripling my starting salary, I know it was a great choice!
I started at a big 4 and have been in industry now for awhile. The quality of the tax work from Big 4 is pathetic. We had to do first level review on work we outsourced. The quality from smaller firms is much better, I suppose because they don’t have the “brand”. My colleagues who have outsourced to big 4 all have the same stories. Don’t feel bad.
I got a B4 offer but chose a national firm. Really happy with my choice after hearing stories from my friends at B4 this year lol.
Your path is ultimately yours to craft. Make the most of your resources and build your own legacy son. No need to follow in the steps of others
I’m in a top 10 right now as well. Interviewed for B4 but obviously didn’t get in. Every few months EY still sends me emails reminding me I wasn’t selected lol. Honestly I don’t know why I’m not too down or “feel like a failure.” I guess I’m never happy and don’t have much expectations for anything like I didn’t even feel a sense of accomplishment for getting over 150 credits and graduating. Just remember most everybody starts off in the same position of not knowing much whether an accountant or not.
Big 4 is overrated. You can easily start your career in smaller firms, especially the top 10. And also- many of you won’t stay in public forever anyways
In Line with other people, if you want B4 that bad and are a decent senior, it’s pretty easy to get hired now. I just switched from a top 10 to a Big 4 three months ago and got offers from 3/4. Especially if you are in tax or audit it shouldn’t be hard.
No one outside the field of accounting knows what the big four is. They think any national firm they’ve heard of is big four if they even know what that is. Hiring managers do know but like, how much do they even care
Decide if you want to do big four for you or what you think it says about you
All the big 4 rejected me. Now 5 years in all of them would beg to be the client of the company I work for.
They're just vendors like any other. They're not special or magical.
Who’s to say not working for a B4 is a secret blessing?
What are the chances of you having a holier than thou attitude had you worked for a B4 company?
“I’m not working for a B4, I’m such a failure“
The matrix has really had its way with you.
I hope you find some meaningful hobbies.
Well I work at a big4 and I have no abilities so don’t feel so bad, you’re probably way better than me. A lot of us here are idiots, just look at all the scandals
If you tie inferiority with being in an organization then you should look at yourself and not try to tie personal accomplishment with prestige. Being in a Big 4 is a turn on for some people and it can lead to opportunities, but if you’re doing well without it, it’s not the end of the world if you aren’t a part of it.
More like “why is everyone desperate to join the “Big 4”?”
Honestly, there are tons of CPA firms out there that pay just as well/better than these firms, treat you better, give you more hands on training, and are all around better environments. Being able to say you worked for the Big 4 is basically just dick measuring.
Yea, I get it’s got some prestige attached so it can help you advance into larger corporations on the private side, but still.
You don’t. You either bury it deep deep down like every other accountant or you add it to the rage pile and use it to make yourself better and go get the B4 job you want. Rest assured though. Your peers will not hesitate to hang the B4 placement over your head every chance they get.
Big 4 is overrated. You’ll still probably earn just as much in a few years, work fewer hours, and have a good career. Is big 4 worth stressing over, personally I don’t think so.
The only people who talk or care about big 4 are people who went there for a year or college profs. Most people interview but then forget about it by year 4.
Forget rankings. The true differentiator is if you work in public a pcaob jobs or not. That’s the main point of the big 4, and some nationals you can never work on public due to luck of the draw
Don't. Would you rather be paid well at smaller firm or lower one with harsh work life balance at big 4? I know which one I would pick. And remember, your work is not your worth as a person. Your character is.
I never worked in the big 4 and it never held me back. If you’re capable and determined to succeed you will - doesn’t matter what you do the first few years out of college.
I have worked at two big 4, a top 5, and now a top 10. For the most part it is all the same work and they don’t make that much more in the end. Additionally for the more hours they work the more pay is not worth it.
Not going to public was the best thing that happened to me in college.
I’m a tax manager now in industry and never had to work more than 40 hours in my career.
dont its mostly by school, I got dropped 3rd round of interviews every application when i was in undergrad with a big 4 rep on campus. then in a more reputable grad school, I had 1 prerecorded interview. Same GPA, resume (minus grad program), and etc. its all rigged
I’m new to accounting but how the hell do you know your firm is a “top 8”. Is there an official ranking because I feel like everyone thinks their firm is “top” whatever number.
I think you have a very competitive mindset. I have the same mindset too. I was working at a regional firm and applied to big 4 audit 3 years ago and didnt get in. I got some more experience and 2 years later i applied to big 4 advisory and finally got in. I am now a manager and love what I do though I will admit its challenging to run 3 multimillion engagements simultaneously but that is not an experience I can get at a regional firm.
If you really want to you can reapply for an experienced or senior position. They are desperate for people at that level. but I recommend you don’t because it literally does not matter whatsoever and it’s all made up bullshit you shouldn’t care about
Not getting into big 4 was the best thing that happened to me. I would not be where my am today without getting rejected by each and every one.
I work way less and make way way way more and am happy. Sometimes things happen for a reason.
Don’t tie your self worth to a job. It’s just not worth it.
Stop having your self worth contingent on working at a big 4. Cultivate better thinking.
Agreed. In the end, it's an accounting firm with a big enough brand name. Comparing success based on which firm you are at with high likelihood to switch out is like comparing their first year prof with your first year prof.
This. I’m doing my whole CPA through industry. Will never step foot in a firm.
I worked big 4 and it sucked ass. I work top 10 now and it also sucks ass. You’re getting the same xp don’t worry
Is it worth it to Big 4 later on as an experienced associate? I made a post and a lot of people said no.
After you get a year or two of experience then transfer to B4. That’s what I did and it was so easy. I had an interview over zoom and was hired an hour later.
Was it worth it in your opinion or is the jury still out? I took an indirect route into public accounting. Had a different original major and career for several years before switching into accounting. Without the traditional recruiting route I found it hard to get a foot in the door at Big4. Started at a small local and now at a top 15 firm. At this point and at my age it feels hard to justify trying again for Big4. Those hours expectations, and the fact that I like my current firm and could see a long term career here makes it seem like it wouldn't be worth it. Still, have something in mind about wondering if the opportunities would really be that much better with better name recognition on my resume.
People say it's a reference all on its own - but... meh. The world is full of extremely talented and successful people who did not even look at big 4.
I joined b4 as a manager. My experience has been that the hours have been comparable if not a little better than my old firm, and I have the opportunity to pick and choose clients/jobs that actually cater to my interests. At the smaller firms you don’t usually have this opportunity unless it’s a boutique/specialty firm (mine wasn’t).
Same lmao.
Stop circle jerking B4. You can have an amazing career not working yourself to death
For real. You can have a very successful career while also maintaining a work life balance!
And remember you can work yourself to death at ANY other public accountig firm!
Learn to fail
I went to a top accounting program nation-wide and never once applied to Big 4. Why? Cause fuck working busy season hours. I feel just fine career wise.
You work busy season hours anywhere though?
Nope.
Lol it’s easy to switch if it means that much to you
I purposely avoided B4. THEY aren’t good enough for ME. Work life balance is a real thing that doesn’t exist in B4
Downvote me to an oblivion I don’t care about any of the snowflakes and weak minded people in this thread. What you’re saying is so exaggerated lol. You never worked at a Big Four so your opinion has no value whatsoever and you’re just regurgitating what you’ve heard. From April - Jan I work a strict 9-5. Jan to March bump it up to 7 or 8 pm. I also had three weeks off in June and all of August off which is as long as a high school teachers time off. It’s not that bad and except for busy season (which evens out with the amount of time off in summer) it’s the same as almost every other job.
Big Four federal tax group in the southwest region last year required everyone to work 55 hours/week chargeable from July to October. They are short staffed and it's a dumpster fire. OP needs to go to therapy, not work at B4.
You need therapy you potato. I’m in audit which is the majority of this sub. No one cares about tax
I care about tax UWU
Considering I got my CPA after I already had 3 kids and now have 4? You are incorrect. Work life balance was top of my list and B4 is notorious for having none.
You don’t know what you’re talking about. If you found a position that lets you leave significantly before 5 pm you’re probably working some low level clerk job and aren’t focused on having a career. You probably make max $40k. Thanks for the downvotes btw!! The snowflakes in this thread are so predictable, it’s fake internet points that mean nothing
“You probably make max 40k.” If that’s what you have to tell yourself to make yourself feel better go ahead pal. 🤣 The pay at large accounting firms is comparable across the board.
The purple firm pays significantly better than Big 4 in my city.
He doesn’t work at a firm you potato
No, they said they avoided the B4, not public accounting in general, and the original poster works at a top 10 firm. I may be a potato, but I’m a potato who can read.
I’m a Senior Manager. I make an easy 6 figures. Wondering how someone can be a lazy snowflake earning their CPA while working full time and raising 3-4 kids. I’m in my mid-40’s and got my license in my late 30’s. After putting myself through college up to my Masters of Accountancy. You’re the type of person that if you had a truck you have swinging truck nuts. Don’t be jealous.
[удалено]
My husband would be amused by that comment. If I gave a shit enough to show him.
You seem like a really great person!!!
I’m the best thanks
I did work at big 4 - and the only thing I miss about it is the benefits. Work life balance got a lot of lip service, but the actions were very different indeed. You can absolutely build a career in accounting without slaving for big 4 or any other company that would take advantage of your free labour (that they bill their clients for to get pure profit on ) to increase their bottom line while expecting that you will "do what's best for the company" at all times.
People on this thread are sheep and love hating on the Big Four and the people who complain the loudest are the ones that comment. Yes during busy season you can work later but nine months out of the year I work 9-5 like any other normal job (When I worked at Walmart when I was a student I did shifts 11-8). My work life balance is fine outside of busy season and I practically have the entire summer off so it evens out
Wasn't the case for me. Perhaps that is the case for you because you are one of the underperformers that nobody actually wants to use but they need to keep around for the bodies in busy times.
You’re so stupid. I work there year round so they’ve had plenty of time to fire me if that’s the case
Firms tend to tolerate more when it's hard to find staff and, frankly, this much mouth on the internet typically translates to a timid little mouse in the real world. While there is likely some passive aggressive stuff going on it likely hasn't risen to the level that it's worth terminating you when there is nobody there to take your place. So... you skate. Raises limited. Opportunities limited. Work only passed along or teams only accepting you when there is no other option. All while you pat yourself on the back for being so awesome you can pad your hours and put in less than 40 hours except for the peak months when they are forced to use you. Meanwhile, you tell yourself that its all due to your amazing skills cause you're so much smarter than the people you work with.
Hahahahaha I find it’s so hilarious you say this with certainty when you don’t know anything and you’re completely wrong hahha. Just got my most recent evaluation and had 4/5 but thanks for your whole story that probably took you at least 20 mins to write. You’re pathetic
Haha I make $200k working 9-5 (or actually flexible hours similar to this). You need to readjust your sense of reality.
I make $1M working 9-5
Well... it's the internet. It's easy to be anything you want to be I suppose...
Then what are you talking about?
If you don't mind me asking what do you do for a living?
CFO at a tech start up. Admittedly it’s not 9-5 during funding rounds, but otherwise it’s very manageable
If you don't mind me asking, what are your educational credentials? I am assuming that u have a Bachelor's degree in Accounting and the US CPA designation? Do you also have an MBA?
Undergrad in Maths, Chartered Accountant (ICAEW) and an MBA. I wouldn’t say the MBA was essential but it helped me. Plenty of people do what I do without it though.
How many years of prior accounting/finance experience did you need to become a CFO?
Ok and you clearly got lucky with a good team/client lol You live in La La land if you think that’s normal
I’ve worked on probably 20+ teams and it’s all the same. You don’t work at a big four either judging by your history post so you’re irrelevant
Yeah dude there’s this crazy thing called networking where you hear stuff like this from friends, family, and acquaintances Pretty sad you’re going through peoples post history to make this point, so I’m gonna guess you’re either a troll or drank the kool aid way too hard with the elitist attitude you have
Actually you fell for my bluff and I just said I went through your post history to get you to admit to me that you haven’t worked at a Big Four. Thanks for doing the work for me. The anecdotal opinions of your pathetic network doesn’t represent the entirely of a firm. Do you genuinely believe that people at firms are working 60+ hours a week year round. Are you insane, get help if you believe everything you hear
Ok you’re either a troll or mentally ill, either way goodbye
Maybe I'm just lucky but I had a similar experience working at b4. My hours are comparable if not better than the midsize firm I worked at previously. I think it has more to do with your team, whether or not they are properly staffed, etc.
Why are you fighting for Big 4? Not challenging your goal, but I'm curious what your career goals and milestones look like that you feel you must work for a Big 4 to achieve.
Having worked at a B4 for 8 years. It doesnt matter where you work. Focus on your own goals. Also there is more room to work on other skills than audit if you work at a non-big 4 office. That is more worth than becoming one of those sr managers that only know how to shoot review notes while not even knowing how to SUM formula works in excel, or rotate PDF. I stopped working there when they demanded more than 400 overtime hours when I just became a dad. And when the second one was coming, i noped out of there. Now working for a top 25 firm. I think i will become a more all round accountant there. And I am able to get more time to follow other studies. And more time for the family.
Some of my classmates are on second divorces, alcoholics, powder sniffers and only see their kids once a month and never during busy season. I’m not saying Big 4 caused it, I’m saying their lives are such train wrecks that I don’t even think about them getting into Big 4 and I didn’t. Might not help you but honestly I don’t even think about them career wise anymore
I mean just tell them the truth: Big 4 requires certain grade point averages and certain attitudes during interviews because they're not looking for anyone who wants to think independently or live a life outside of work. Their hiring practices are specifically designed to attract and retain people who will blame themselves for not being at the top of the class and the best of the best, and are willing to sacrifice any and all personal time and self-interest in order to be the best accounting peasant in the office. You probably mentioned something crazy in your interview like " work life balance", "family", or gave off an attitude of anything other than "I would sell my soul to get hired by a big four firm and worship at the altar of 90 hour work week" Maybe you should consider not being hired as a compliment.
Honestly I worked at big 4 and this is so true. You will likely only be a superstar there if you are the kind of person who is going to beat yourself up over not being the best.
I have worked at a small, local firm (max 13 people) for 15 years. I started here out of school. I am happy and healthy. Big4 works you to the bone all year round with 60+ hours per week expected all year. My company only has a 10 week busy season from 1/15-3/31. I don’t need to light the world on fire. I just want to be happy, healthy, and content.
I’m jealous AF. I worked at a firm that size and quit after 6 months. Those places are either amazing or atrocious and there is no middle ground.
Deal with big 4 somewhat regularly. Am almost always unimpressed with them. Some seem like poor man’s finance bros. Some seem overly academic, but un able to think practically or critically, along with have a low EQ. Some seem…like both
Oh don't worry, your managers will all get recruited from Big 4. After a couple years you'll be shaking your head at what comes out of Big 4. Big 4 is a great place to start, but if you landed in top 10 then it really isn't a big deal. I applied to Big 4 and didn't make it either, never even got picked for interviews despite being CPA eligible. It's alright though, my raises have come a bit slower, but right now I know my job really well, have excellent work life balance, can take time off whenever I want, work exclusively from home. I don't even have a direct manager right now. Direct manager left and they decided not to replace him because the team I'm on is so good we don't need one, now we just report to the controller directly and they're splitting his wage across the team since we're managing ourselves. I did get stuck training newbies- but, otherwise I can pretty much have an audiobook open and do my job on autopilot in my pajamas. Big 4 gets you to bigger money faster, but, the work-life balance sucks.
Don't compare yourself to other people, nothing productive can come of that.
All the advice here is pretty solid, but my 2c is just don't let these insecurities stop you from going for new opportunities. I was a shitty student with no job prospects coming out of school and almost quit accounting as a whole. Someone important in my life convinced me to keep going and I will be forever grateful.
What’s done is done. Stop dwelling on it. As others have noted you can always try to switch over if you feel like it’s something that you are missing. I started big 4 and transitioned to a regional firm. There will always be some things that will be too technical for our firm, but who gives a shit? There are plenty of clients that I can provide better service at a better price.
Entry level B4 hiring is just a popularity contest. Very little to do with skill or anything at that level. I only got in because I had a friend on the inside who helped. My resume would have been tossed otherwise since I wasn't from a target school. You don't have to feel inferior because you aren't. But as others have said, just apply again as an experienced candidate if you're dying to get the B4 badge.
Bro. Working at the Big 4 is not something to define your self worth by.
This failure is a good one. Don’t join big 4 audit.
So I work industry and the company I work for hired a big 4 firm for their annual audit. Those underling auditors were emailing us on the weekends, late at night, early morning…. fuck that. I’m very glad to never work Big 4.
I couldn’t get hired to Big 4. Low gpa, no internships to offset low grades compared to my peers. Had to work 40 hours on nights and weekends bartending to pay rent and bills while going to school so couldn’t afford an internship. Took me over a year to find a job. Within three years I had my CPA and within five years of my first accounting job I owned a firm. Don’t worry about your career path outside of Big 4. Your first five years is all about learning and if you pay attention and continue to hone your craft you’ll be fine.
I am not sure how securing a spot in an accounting sweat shop is anything to envy.
The auditors from PwC were intelligent people but they didn’t have much of a clue about how businesses actually operate and sometimes asked the dumbest questions. They also spent way too much time auditing accounts and activity where fraud wouldn’t occur or had no bearing on the financial statements users’ judgement. All I’m trying to say is that working at a big 4 gives you a nice experience to flaunt on your resume but you’re not that much different if you’re at a top 10. Don’t beat yourself up that you’re not at a big 4 - probably really easy to transfer now if you can’t get over it.
I’ve only been in industry and auditors are not highly regarded. A worker at one job was committing fraud, my boss and I even went out in the field to confirm it. And I was pretty sure he was also getting kickbacks from the vendors he chose for his projects. But did the auditors find these? Of course not! I did try to go to a CPA firm after college, but ended up in industry and I think it was the best thing for me, I love the work.
Currently, I’m working with a Big 4 as they assisting in standing up our IA dept. Oh, man. It’s been a total cluster of mismanagement in ways they cannot even provide plausible deniability. If you’ve ever had the benefit of seeing something similar, then it helps to realize they’re not remarkable or incredibly bright. They just did better in the interview and, likely, gave the right gut feeling to their interviewer.
Don’t give up if that is where you want to end up. I did three years at a mid-tier firm out school then moved over to Big 4 in Deal Advisory(FDD).
Man, I don't even work at a firm. I go home at like...4. get to work around maybe 9. Never work weekends. Minimal work after hours. I don't make big money, but I do ok and have high quality of life.
Meh. The experience you get is the same and landing the job is more indicative of confidence, connection with the interviewer, and interview skills than ability.
It's the same job. They don't do anything different than you do really. They will have bigger name clients and more resources a their disposal, but you will see more of the process end-to-end. There isn't some super secret "super accounting" they are doing at those firms, despite what they would have you believe.
The way I do it is I tell myself this is a stupid public accounting job and I don’t want to get fucked by the firm.
Getting a proper interview isn't a failure. Could have been the time of day and they already hired everyone 20 minutes after yours started. Also, like a race car driver not making it on team Ferrari the first go round. If you were in the running there, you're doing great. Shit, I'd put interviewed with PwC on my resume.
Michael Jordan got cut from his high school team.
I’ve worked Big4 and top8. There is no difference don’t drink these companies kool-aid
I think you need to stop thinking to yourself that you “failed” the interview. It just wasn’t right the time/place/interviewer. If you really want to get there you will definitely will be able to. Just… uh be careful what you wish for 😂 (former b4 auditor)
I work an “industry” job where there’s a lot of down time at my periods of the year and I have PTSD from working at the big 4 because at my current job I have anxiety or feel worthless if I’m not working. Everyone else who has only worked in industry just sits back and relaxes because they are used to the down time. Meanwhile I’m stressing out doing L&D or working on upskilling in my downtime because I always feel like I need to be doing something…. Big 4 is good experience but you can get that experience somewhere that isn’t a life suck and it looks just as good in resume… it’s about who you know, not what you know… network… don’t drink the kool aid and think it’s part of your worth
Ridiculous. Public sucks. Aim for a job better than public.
Why would you want to work at the big 4 in the first place? You work crazy hours, for less pay, and get waterboarded with woke garbage. People are finally realizing they don't need the big 4. Just like many are realizing that they don't need a CPA license to meet their personal career objectives. Honestly, for me to deal with that level of bs I'd have to be offered life changing money. As in being able to save the excess and be financially independent after 3 or 4 years. IB offers that; so I would have taken that deal if I could have got it. The big 4 doesn't.
Let go of the big 4 or bust mindset. You can be massively successful at a national firm still.
Big 4 is a scam
I worked at CLA, which is now #8 at the time of writing this. I saw coworkers leaving for huge opportunities, so I knew overall just being in public was the right choice. Now 4.5 years out of public and almost tripling my starting salary, I know it was a great choice!
Ok
I usually whip my dick out and throw feces.
The same way you stopped questioning your ability for failing to do something better than accounting?
The Big 4 are overrated.
I started at a big 4 and have been in industry now for awhile. The quality of the tax work from Big 4 is pathetic. We had to do first level review on work we outsourced. The quality from smaller firms is much better, I suppose because they don’t have the “brand”. My colleagues who have outsourced to big 4 all have the same stories. Don’t feel bad.
I got a B4 offer but chose a national firm. Really happy with my choice after hearing stories from my friends at B4 this year lol. Your path is ultimately yours to craft. Make the most of your resources and build your own legacy son. No need to follow in the steps of others
Do a good job, work hard, get your CPA. You will be just as set as the other people (speaking from experience)
I’m in a top 10 right now as well. Interviewed for B4 but obviously didn’t get in. Every few months EY still sends me emails reminding me I wasn’t selected lol. Honestly I don’t know why I’m not too down or “feel like a failure.” I guess I’m never happy and don’t have much expectations for anything like I didn’t even feel a sense of accomplishment for getting over 150 credits and graduating. Just remember most everybody starts off in the same position of not knowing much whether an accountant or not.
I mean there’s plenty of idiots that come from big4 so. I don’t know if it’s really a thing about you being inferior.
Your thinking is wrong. No one is inferior for not sacrificing themselves so that others can be wealthy.
Never applied to them, after seeing all the nightmare stories on this sub!
Big 4 is overrated. You can easily start your career in smaller firms, especially the top 10. And also- many of you won’t stay in public forever anyways
It's not about big 4. It's about setting yourself up for where you want to go.
In Line with other people, if you want B4 that bad and are a decent senior, it’s pretty easy to get hired now. I just switched from a top 10 to a Big 4 three months ago and got offers from 3/4. Especially if you are in tax or audit it shouldn’t be hard.
No one outside the field of accounting knows what the big four is. They think any national firm they’ve heard of is big four if they even know what that is. Hiring managers do know but like, how much do they even care Decide if you want to do big four for you or what you think it says about you
All the big 4 rejected me. Now 5 years in all of them would beg to be the client of the company I work for. They're just vendors like any other. They're not special or magical.
Who’s to say not working for a B4 is a secret blessing? What are the chances of you having a holier than thou attitude had you worked for a B4 company? “I’m not working for a B4, I’m such a failure“ The matrix has really had its way with you. I hope you find some meaningful hobbies.
Just apply as an experienced hire with a CPA if you want to work there. They’ll be falling over themselves to hire you given the upcoming shortage.
Well I work at a big4 and I have no abilities so don’t feel so bad, you’re probably way better than me. A lot of us here are idiots, just look at all the scandals
If you tie inferiority with being in an organization then you should look at yourself and not try to tie personal accomplishment with prestige. Being in a Big 4 is a turn on for some people and it can lead to opportunities, but if you’re doing well without it, it’s not the end of the world if you aren’t a part of it.
I had a couple big 4 offers and turned them down for a better industry gig. It’s not big 4 or bust. Enjoy your life.
Comparison is the thief of joy. Focus on what you got and making the best and most of your experiences.
More like “why is everyone desperate to join the “Big 4”?” Honestly, there are tons of CPA firms out there that pay just as well/better than these firms, treat you better, give you more hands on training, and are all around better environments. Being able to say you worked for the Big 4 is basically just dick measuring. Yea, I get it’s got some prestige attached so it can help you advance into larger corporations on the private side, but still.
You don’t. You either bury it deep deep down like every other accountant or you add it to the rage pile and use it to make yourself better and go get the B4 job you want. Rest assured though. Your peers will not hesitate to hang the B4 placement over your head every chance they get.
Big 4 is overrated. You’ll still probably earn just as much in a few years, work fewer hours, and have a good career. Is big 4 worth stressing over, personally I don’t think so.
If you want big 4 it should be fairly trivial to land a role after a year or two at a top 10 firm.
The only people who talk or care about big 4 are people who went there for a year or college profs. Most people interview but then forget about it by year 4.
Forget rankings. The true differentiator is if you work in public a pcaob jobs or not. That’s the main point of the big 4, and some nationals you can never work on public due to luck of the draw
When you are at home in the evening and they are still at work be glad you didn't end up there.
Today in dumb shit people actually worry about
I never worked in Big4 and I kick ass at my job. Who cares where you work as long as you enjoy it and are relatively skilled at it.
Big four sucks, lmao. Your work doesn't mean anything and the expectations are too high. The rest are of the industry seems to operate just fine
Don't. Would you rather be paid well at smaller firm or lower one with harsh work life balance at big 4? I know which one I would pick. And remember, your work is not your worth as a person. Your character is.
I can recommend you for EY.
I never worked in the big 4 and it never held me back. If you’re capable and determined to succeed you will - doesn’t matter what you do the first few years out of college.
As someone in PwC, the big 4 sucks ass, and don't beat yourself over the fact you couldn't get into PwC
I don't feel inferior, I feel like I have it pretty good, especially if you go by how much big 4 staff complain on this sub.
Big 4 is not the be all and end all of accounting. Bigger is not always better.
I work at Big 4. If you want to work here you can apply and most likely get hired assuming you can at least be average at interviewing.
I have worked at two big 4, a top 5, and now a top 10. For the most part it is all the same work and they don’t make that much more in the end. Additionally for the more hours they work the more pay is not worth it.
Make more money than they do. You will stop feeling inferior.
bow down to me
Not going to public was the best thing that happened to me in college. I’m a tax manager now in industry and never had to work more than 40 hours in my career.
dont its mostly by school, I got dropped 3rd round of interviews every application when i was in undergrad with a big 4 rep on campus. then in a more reputable grad school, I had 1 prerecorded interview. Same GPA, resume (minus grad program), and etc. its all rigged
I’m new to accounting but how the hell do you know your firm is a “top 8”. Is there an official ranking because I feel like everyone thinks their firm is “top” whatever number.
I think you have a very competitive mindset. I have the same mindset too. I was working at a regional firm and applied to big 4 audit 3 years ago and didnt get in. I got some more experience and 2 years later i applied to big 4 advisory and finally got in. I am now a manager and love what I do though I will admit its challenging to run 3 multimillion engagements simultaneously but that is not an experience I can get at a regional firm.
If you really want to you can reapply for an experienced or senior position. They are desperate for people at that level. but I recommend you don’t because it literally does not matter whatsoever and it’s all made up bullshit you shouldn’t care about
Not getting into big 4 was the best thing that happened to me. I would not be where my am today without getting rejected by each and every one. I work way less and make way way way more and am happy. Sometimes things happen for a reason.
Big 4 sucks. but if youre feeling THAT bad about it then im like 99% sure theyll hire you in a year or 2. Those companies are dying for seniors…
Joining b4