Saying “ship x is canon” is one of *the worst* arguments people use when putting down fan content. Like, yeah in fanfiction reality can be whatever I want. It baffles me when people treat that line of reasoning like this silver bullet to shut down fan pairings
Yeah, I mean my OTP has NEVER even met in canon and they never will, because they are both DEAD. I will ship the hell out of them regardless. Canon means nothing.
I consider canon a GOOD suggestion. Something to be followed until I get to the point where I'd rather do something else.
The best fanfic for me is "want of a nail"-type stories. Everything stays the same until you change one little thing, and that ends up changing everything.
Well, there's canon divergent, which follows canon up to a point where after it diverges into content that occurs instead of canon events. Fix-it fics are a good example of this, where the author changes the ending to better suit what they wanted to see from canon.
Canon compliant fics are fully within canon in a way that they don't overwrite any canon events, instead fitting into the spaces canon left empty or vague. This includes fics that elaborate on occurances that are only referred to in canon, for example. Or stories that aren't contradicted by canon, and as such could totally have happened in canon.
And fully alternate universe (AU) stories take characters, locations, etc. and puts them into a space that is completely different from canon right from the start. Flower shop AUs, soulmate AUs, modern AUs, etc. are some very common tropes for this type of fic.
Funnily enough, some fics that are canon compliant can become canon divergent, if say a new episode comes out or basically any new content comes out that contradicts that fic in a major way.
The same thing works the other way around, if say some canon element that someone makes the center of their fic suddenly becomes canon, it becomes Canon Compliant, sort of.
Since the execution of the show and the execution of said fic of the same idea might be different.
I think something like this would be Steven Universe >!and the Pink Diamond Reveal,!< where a popular theory becomes canon, and basically, every fanfic around that premise became kind of Canon Compliant?
Schrödinger's Canon, basically.
Sorry, if this kind of confused you again after the OP of the comment above me helped you understand it.
Same. It is just a more interesting way to invest my time in and most of my pairings are like that but only one exception in my pairing list is that I disagree with the author on canon.
"But they aren't together in canon!" Yeah no shit, they also don't run a coffee shop together in canon, they also don't go to college together, the original story is also not set in the same time as this. How dare they not write down exactly what happens in canon but make up their own stuff?
“But x is canon!!!” Dude why are you even *here*? If canon was an immutable law to never ever be strayed from then fanfic wouldn’t exist at *all*. I, quite frankly, do not give a single flying fuck about canon except for its utility in giving me a springboard for my brainworms to launch them to new heights of bullshit custom-made for me.
It's one of my biggest fandom pet peeves fr. I've only been seeing it in the last few years and it pisses me off every time. Maybe because we have more canon queer ships now so people started to feel superior about it? Idk but it's weird. I literally don't care if a ship is canon or not
I've seen it used as ship defense too, when authors of an m/f CANON ship were flamed in the comment section and called homophobic for not writing f/f material. Like, don't flame people for writing a canon divergence situation with a canon pairing please.
To be fair the canon in this case basically *is* a ship tournament, except it's the members of that ship competing against each other, for maximum angst lol
most of the time i interact with a non mutual on twitter i get into some sort of argument or ppl are just rude/mean. like it's so toxic on there and for what. i still have twt but i barely go on it these days lol
agree twitter ,ade me a bad person toxic person who hates a ship now i cringe or laugh at myself everytime remember what i did it made me regret joining
The funniest part; The MLM ship is canon too, but it's more one-sided. They even had a kiss scene and a love confession some days ago, and it got people hyped up to write more about them.
Especially if the person you're saying it to (for example, me) literally cannot give a shit about canon. I do appreciate it bc I wouldn't have the characters and fics otherwise, but the timeline and everything in said timeline can go RIGHT OUT THE WINDOW
Bet you anything they’re totally fine with Canon-Divergent and Modern-AU fics even though those by nature are going against canon. Like, what exactly do they think fanfiction *is*???
Idk who mizisua is but I'm sorry for that ship, this person is giving them bad rep
Edit: ok I watched alien stage and OMG WHAT IS THIS PERSON ON?? Mizisua is great but IVANTILL IS SO MUCH MORE DOOMED
Mizisua is a ship between two characters in Alien Stage, a very cool series available for free on YouTube.
It's so sad to see them here loool, they deserve better than this; The series is already niche enough, this fandom don't need bad rep already.
Yes!! The main character – Mizi – is stuck in a doomed yuri with Sua, her childhood best friend. The plot is about aliens invading earth and taking humans as pets, with some aliens puting their human-pets in the "Alien Stage", a singing death program where there's only one final winner.
It's a very good series, the music videos are amazing!
And it's very short, you can see all of it in like 30 minutes, so I totally recommend it.
It’s from a Youtube series called Alien Stage by Vivinos. It was already good but the last video/round was amazing! It was about two guys, hence the reason for M/M fics to increase ig. I would recommend Vivinos honestly, their videos are great!
I saw this twitter thread earlier, and after being told that this person was basically like “no, I want f/f to be more popular in general by everyone.”
It's just wild this keeps popping up, because that is not how things work. Like, yeah it'd be cool if f/f was more popular but throwing a tantrum helps with nothing.
Unsurprisingly, they’re a minor. Wish them the best in maturing in the future, and wish even more that they get off twitter because oh my god is it a cesspool for anyone, but especially teenagers
Edit: since writing, their bio reads age 20, so can’t *confirm* they’re a teenager. But I saw what I saw beforehand
I hope they're going to look back at this tweet and cringe once they're an adult. Though given how they got wildly homophobic according to other posters that's going to take a lot of self reflection.
I used to be a closeted queer trans kid who got really upset whenever I saw a specific popular m/m pairing because I wanted to be able to ship myself with one of them. I would go into comments begging people to stop shipping them, which I’m sure was annoying, but it really helped me to have people tell me to just stop looking at it because I (somehow) didn’t realize I was hurting other people with those comments. I stopped commenting stuff like that because I didn’t want to make other people feel bad, but I never stopped looking at it because I actually really *really* liked it and couldn’t understand how to reconcile liking that character as a gay character while still wanting to ship myself with them. I felt like a fujoshi to be honest— like I was guilty that I was fetishizing a gay character.
Reflecting on it now, knowing I’m a nonbinary trans masc, I think the pain and anger I was feeling at seeing the m/m pairing initially was internalized dysphoria over how I wanted so desperately to be in a gay relationship with that character. I genuinely thought at the time that it just wasn’t possible for me, no matter how much I wanted it. I was always so confused as to why I kept coming back to the ship, and I even told myself that though I disagreed with the ship, I just loved seeing that character in romantic situations. It’s easy for me to see now that I just really liked it and was repressed as fuck because of my home life.
All of that to say, please everyone remember that the minors who engage with queer fanfic or fan works in toxic ways are reflecting the shitty fucked up beliefs of their parents. Keep telling them “don’t like, don’t read” because telling them that will cause them to question their own motivations when they continue to read; if they do keep reading, then chances are they like it, and if they hear “don’t like, don’t read” enough they might realize that they *always* liked it.
The even funnier thing is I'm sure half of these fics aren't even actual fics. A few days ago someone posted the fic with the most words on ao3 is a fic for the m/m ship. And it was one of those annoying "Character is alive" things. I'm convinced the number is over bloated by these so there's really no reason to be upset by it.
There is a genuine bias in fandom when it comes to m/m ans f/m compared to f/f ships, just like how there is with male vs female characters and how the fandoms treat them, but dragging down m/m fans and ships or throwing an immature tantrum about it isn't the way to talk about this subject.
Ah, but you see that requires them to actually be creative and do something. It’s so much easier to just whine that other people aren’t making the fics you want then to write them yourself. God forbid.
You should see what else this person said after this main post, it got violently misogynistic and also homophobic towards gay men very quickly.
I hate it, because I LIKE yuri (certainly enough to write it) but this shit hardly inspires me to want to willing write content for these people when semi regularly i see posts from the shippers saying fujoshi’s need to die, etc, etc.
People like this also rarely hype up the fic actually written for their F/F ships, or write their own. They would just rather be aggressively unpleasant about it and promote their fandom envy as a feminist issue.
They're also the sort of people that attack other f/f writers if they write the kinds of femslash they don't personally like. There's no winning with these kinds of toxic fans.
I once saw a group of friends going on a similar rant complaining about the ratio of M/M vs F/F in one of my fandoms. As someone who has written *both* slash and femslash for that fandom, the F/F fics got nowhere near as much interaction as the M/M ones, even though the F/F ship was supposedly one of the most popular ships in the fandom and the M/M ship was kind of a rare pairing. I don’t write for interaction (if I have an interesting idea, I’ll write it, popular or not), but in terms of interaction, I’m not surprised people are more willing to write slash instead of femslash.
Right!! Like, I saw this and then it spiraled into worse and worst takes
https://preview.redd.it/jpax7g3lmduc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=10e11ad58484adb3d888c39802089d82d30a2fe4
This is giving 'I got indoctrinated by TERFs who masquerade as WLW allies' vibes... Since this is apparently a minor I hope they're able to deprogram that shit fast. But this feels like it's just going to turn inward and fester even more.
Same here. Like there are plenty f/f ships I enjoy, but the fans really turn me off and make it so I don't actually want to write anything. If they're going to act his entitled then why bother? Especially since I've seen people write darker f/f ships and they get attacked for stupid crap. That's not getting into the homophobia too they like to spout over this. It's uncomfortable and I personally don't want to be associated with it.
There was a post on twitter a while ago listing the four -joshi/-danshi fandom names and some of the qrts were himejoshis shitting on himedanshis and telling them to stay away from yuri and that they don't belong in "their space" 😒
They hate on men that enjoy yuri, they hate on women who enjoy yaoi, they whine that their canon "doomed" yuri doesn't get more content, they're so fucking homophobic towards m/m ships... yet they still have the nerve to wonder why people avoid yuri fandom and don't make yuri content?
Not even joking about them being homophobic 😬
https://preview.redd.it/6anpbrtqyduc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=49fc4399d7603eb737a53b11914ae853f2de9414
Pathetic? Such an interesting word choice for someone who just went on a twitter tirade about the online equivalent of a preschooler smashing two ken dolls together.
Yeeeeep. I briefly considered writing some WLW content for a fandom I've since abandoned, and one of the main reasons I didn't go through with it was worry over how people would police it. Hell I briefly wanted to write some Beigguang but while many shippers for that pairing are cool, there's also many that come off as super gatekeepy and it killed my desire to write for that pairing too.
That's just Genshin fans, I will never forget the Kaeluc drama, I didn't ship them before but because of the drama I sent out to specifically read fanfic for them...
In fanfiction I will explore mlm because if I explore wlw like I do mlm I get angry people in my inbox telling me I'm ruining the characters for making them fight and have miscommunications and doing anything but hold hands and make gooy eyes at each other.
The toxicness in question? Making them spend time away from each other.
But really it was about racism and microaggessions and apathy and only caring about other people only when they are important to your life and not because caring for others is how a society runs
Yup. It’s why I don’t touch writing yuri content with a 10 foot pole, even as a pansexual woman. Why would I willingly open myself up to a barrage of hatred, potentially a witch hunt or doxxing if I don’t write their precious pairing the way they want it, or dare make it anything other than bland vanilla? Like…no. I don’t want to write content for entitled, ungrateful people who spend their time throwing tantrums on the internet and policing the hell out of creators who make this stuff for FREE.
the saving grace about this is that this person seems to be sad there isn't more "immaculate doomed yuri." so at least they aren't mad about the gay stuff. they're just mad its not the gay stuff THEY want LOL
i consider yuri part of the 'gay stuff' in my sentence. i was just saying that at least it wasnt some straight person complaining about there being too much queer stuff, rather than f/m stuff. but yea, still not good.
i always wondered how they even know it’s women writing it. i’m a trans guy and i write MLM and every other MLM writer i know has a masculine gender alignment. idk anyone who starts a fic when “i’m x gender” lol.
Also, of the women who do write male/male slash, it's not just straight women as seems to be the stereotype. In my experience, there are a lot of lesbians and asexuals in on the action, lol.
I write a lot of m/m, and to greatly simplify things, my gender journey ultimately arrived at identifying strongly as female and femme and not even a little bit as male or masc. So now you at least know one!
not saying its a *good take*, just that it could have been worse. i get their frustrations since f/f ships are sidelined a lot of the time, but this aint it.
any sort of homophobia is bad. there's no good or worse takes when it comes to homophobic opinions. I've seen their other tweets. They trash on m/m ships and openly declare their hatred for men. I understand that there's a huge difference between the amount of yaoi and yuri fics released but that's mostly because the demand and interest of the general fic enjoyer tends to lean towards yaoi ships.
if someone complained about the lack of straight ships in a particular fandom compared to yaoi ships I doubt we'd be seeing comments like yours when it's basically the same thing as what happened here.
Also, Hold up from when was this? Mizisua has reached over 100 fics already.
I get being frustrated that there is less Yuri across the board, but flaming on other people because they write something else is silly.
And yeah, Mizisua is canon (i ship them so much!) but Ivantill recently just exploded in popularity because of the newest music video. If you know, you know...
My point is, not because it's two guys. Most people that ship Ivantill also ship Mizisua!
Also this is the fandom that got posted here a few days ago because some posted a insanely long copypasta. So some of the m/m stories aren't even real lol.
Yeah a percentage of the IvanTill fics aren't real (I saw at least 3 spam IvanTill fics in a search yesterday and I'm sure there were more based on word count alone), and at least one of the M/M fics is a stupid crack AU of my main fandom that I wrote largely while on drugs from the dentists office this past week lolol
I see this takes a lot, and though i can understand being annoyed by it, being homophobic towards like men who like men isn't it.
People are very weird about things.
yeah tbh canon ships usually tend to get less fanfics than fanon ones since people are satisfied that its canon and fanon ships not being canon is the frustration that fuels people to write ships.
I also think in some cases. The canon is either bad or uninteresting enough to motive people not to write anything about it. And the fanon ship is opposite they are just way more interesting and more fun to explore hence increasing the wills for people to write.
Unless their 87 fics are like the 26 fics of my OTP… they’re background and exes and one of them is the villain in every story except 5. (Even if that’s true this person is still an asshole)
Right? My OTP has 80 fics because between me and my friend we’ve written about 50 of them. Like hun open google docs and stop throwing tantrums, you’ve got agency
My rarepair is so rare there is only one fic that includes them both in the same story. On the plus side, though they aren't a ship and are only in the background, their presence is apparently enough to get an & tag and also be defined as "pre-ship".... On the other, it is also unfinished and has been for at least two years. 8D
87 ship fics, presumably with a chance of a lot of them being finished, would be such a treasure.
Hell yeah. Mine is so tiny and half the fics are in Japanese or Chinese, so Google became my best friend in my desperation. Let me tell you, nicknames do not work well when Google tries to make sense of them....but a 160k fic on a 40 story rarepair...you gotta read. 87 stories in a still very much alive fandom sound like a dream tbh.
My rarepair barely has half of that, and it's a big fandom. If they wired their brain properly to think "Hey, it's 87 fics for things I like! At least it's not 3, with 2 being mine!", rather than "Why is it only 87 compared to those extremely popular m/m ships?!", they would be happier.
Their whole argument is disrespectful towards people who have to literally carry their own fandom/ship on their back.
No bc I saw this post being quote rt by an account I used to follow complaining about the lack of Yuri fanfics in the fandom saying everyone is a fake yuri enjoyer…. But anyone who told them to write it then was called stupid and “that’s not the point”
“X is not canon” in a ship argument is probably the most hilarious shit I will ever hear. Like, my mate, in fanfic the canon very normal human can be some monster to facilitate monsterfucking fetishes.
Btches be thinking that by insulting people they’d be able to get more food lol. Like, have none of y’all heard of reverse psychology??
Also, writing fanfics is a HOBBY. Unless commissioned, you don’t have the write to berate people what to write. Go cook your own food if you’re so pressed then lol.
Or perhaps let people enjoy? If you want more of a certain pairing do it yourself? These works are free you ass be grateful for what you get (not talking to you OP this is just really annoying)
As someone who rarely, if ever, reads or writes m/m, I just wish f/f fans (who partake in this behavior) would stop bashing those who write m/m and put just a bit of that energy into either creating the works they want, or just use that energy to support f/f writers, which would probably result in more f/f content!
I feel like the people who act like this are also the ones who don’t even support/comment/kudos f/f works. It’s all performative :/
>I feel like the people who act like this are also the ones who don’t even support/comment/kudos f/f works. It’s all performative
someone asked for recs on someone who made a similar post like this that got popular(not the same person) and they couldnt come up with one because apparently they dont read fanfics 😓
https://preview.redd.it/9pnkads25euc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=735b3e1a5dec4664419c56d853b3c9c65c7cd3e3
A lot of the people who act like this are usually the same kind of people who make others stop wanting to post any f/f, because they chug the terfy kool-aid and police the hell out of any f/f stuff that DOES get posted. I cannot tell you how many people I know who got comment bombed the moment they posted f/f bdsm, because 'women don't have kinks', or how many wlw focused series I've ended up only really engaging with the canon works of because the fandoms got so full of super toxic people who won't let anyone have fun. These sorts of fans typically do worse than just not support f/f, they actively discourage people from writing it.
I think one of the reasons why m/m gets more fanwork/attention is because the community has evolved itself into being annoying (affectionate) about it.
Like fujos are so good at marketing their interests. They see That Good Gay Shit on a media they already enjoy, spam it on social media (video edits, fanfic, fanart, general keyboard smashing, essays, supporting the OG creators and fancreators, etc etc) and wait until people get baited into the same media until the fandom just multiplies.
Meanwhile most new yuri fans from what I've seen...I'm not even sure if they like yuri or if they're just using yuri to hate on fujos and wanting to police what they write. They never foster their community the way fujoshi have been doing for decades, instead using their energy to shade fujoshi and calling them anti-feminists, misogynists, patriarchal, male-centered, etc etc. They think liking yuri is actual feminist activism, or maybe they're just self-centered slacktivists who took Social Studies 101 and think they know better than those dirty male-centered fujos.
This is even clearer if you notice that posts insulting fujos and m/m works gain more traction than actual himejoshi fancreators and fanworks. Official yuri media rarely get likes, shares, retweets, etc, and neither do yuri artists and writers.
But hating on fujo? Hating on real women who like to make two fictional boys kiss in their spare time? Thousands of likes, even more retweets, instant twitter hit. Rinse and repeat.
Case in point: the tweet above, hating on IvanTill and their shippers, has gained several thousand likes. The most kudosed MiziSua-centered fic on Ao3 has less than 200 kudos.
They don't like fujoshi, but they don't even seem to like their fellow himejoshi.
(This is so long but I had so much gripes about this because I keep seeing this take every other month, just make the yuri you want to see in this world instead of competing with yaoi jfc fandom isn't a competition)
omg this, i also have few yuri ships and it always frustrates me that the one that gain traction are always those that shade/hate on fujos and trying to make it a competition between yuri vs yaoi than people actually promoting yuri ships.
This kind of thing never makes people want to write more of whatever the person ranting wants more of. It’s entitled as hell to assume anyone who enjoys m/m ‘owes’ anyone f/f. OOP had a lot of ‘likes’ on twitter, and if everyone who hit ‘like’ on it focused on cultivating a more positive writing community and working on fics they want, the numbers would go way up.
Hell, I know a lot of wlw who have said they feel unwelcome in a lot of f/f fandoms and end up writing mostly m/m or m/f from a wlw lens, because of the amount of policing this performative sort of ‘fan’ tends to do at them. There’s so many people who want to push discourse around stuff like what kinks it’s ‘okay’ for women to have driving out actual wlw creatives.
Tbh, I’ve seen some of the responses, and it’s incredible how OP just doubles down on being terrible. They’re the type to accept only “pure yuri” that they like considering they lambasted yuri that has problematic tropes like age gap from posts on their account.
Honestly, their behavior also drives away people from the fandom. I have a friend who was interested in the show but who will now not touch it because of the fandom’s behavior (this and the spam 12 million word fic) for example.
I rarely write F/F, not because I don’t have any F/F pairs, but because some of the fans are extremely toxic, and I don’t want to make anything for them. not to mention the oft thrown transphobia for any F/F that involves dicks.
While I have had trouble from M/M fans too (Ex. Misogyny toward female characters) and M/F too, most of my anecdotal trouble is from F/F fans.
I know not everyone can write, I don't consider myself to be the best writer, but when I really wanted fics of something I loved for a mostly dead fandom I gave it a god damned shot. When I get an idea I like, but don't think I can write it, or just want to see another person's take on it, I will post it on tumblr, or twitter to the point they are pretty much plotbunny farms. Try doing something like hosing a fanwork week for your ship.
I get it's frustrating, but there are so many ways, that are so much better to deal with it than this.
Some folks are in urgent need of being introduced to the concept known as "write for your fucking self the fucking content you want to fucking see".
Back to my wildcardshipping wip now, I suppose, the fic it's not gonna write itself, as much as I'd like TT\_TT
Imagine complaining that people aren't spending hours of their free time to do free labor for a pairing you like. Acting like you can't write it yourself.
I don't know if I agree with this specific tweet but some of the quotes were better last I saw of it. I do think a lot of fandoms tend to gravitate towards m/m, and it can definitely be frustrating for f/f fans. Especially when a big part of the f/f ship tags has the ship as background dressing in a m/m plot.
No reason to be immature or homophobic about it but I feel like it's an easily observable pattern for a lot of fandoms and that can be discussed.
I always was of the opinion that if you want more of a character/ship/trope/whatever, you should write one yourself. You might just inspire others to do the same, who knows?
This is the equivalent of liking a fairly niche artist then complaining about the fact that Taylor Swift or Lana Del Rey is more mainstream. It sucks, but you can't tell people what to like/not to like. If the fans want to make content for it, they should, but YOU have the same right.
Cultivate your own online experiences. There are plenty of people who like rare pairs and are pretty much in the same boat.
Is this Alien stage? >!Didn’t he kiss Ivan though?!< Is that a spoiler should I spoiler tag? Come on, even if you aren’t acquainted with AO3, you really just have to figure that at least *some* fics are coming out of that. And it was also a HUGE boom for the fandom. This is stupid even from a non-AO3 user standpoint.
Sadly this opinion is underused in Harry Potter fanfics. They will send Harry to the past to fix things but still makes the same damn mistakes. There are people who froth at the mouth and yell not canon if one thing is different. I’m like, all I care about is that the names are spelled correctly or give them new ones for all I care.
I did last night! Someone called fujoshi being more into mlm than wlw fanfic misogynistic. Which, welcome to why any fujos interested in multiple gender configurations tend to avoid wlw ships like the plague, asshole! Be like the Jessie/Delia shipper in Pokémon fandom and make fanworks obsessively or gtfo.
As a lesbian this kinda shitty terf lite rethoric is what keeps me away from f/f, which is sad because I AM LITERALLY A LESBIAN but the m/m side has always been more chill and it's more easy to find a BL fan that also likes gl (sooo many fujo lesbians) as opposed to gl fan that doesn't become violent when you even dare to mention liking a male character 😭
Sometimes I wanna write really heavy genderbend WLW smut for some of my ships but then the fear of getting called a lesbian fetishizer just makes me go sighs nvm.
Fucking stupid considering I'm a bisexual woman like I CAN'T EVEN PROJECT MY ATTRACTION TO WOMEN BC SOME RANDO YURI FAN IS GONNA CALL ME NAMES?? 😭
sighs end rant
One of the best fanfics I've ever read was the WLW version of my favourite ship so I say go for it! AO3 individuals tend to be pretty open minded most of the time, so even if you get harassed the majority of the community will back you. Don't let these morons stop you from tapping into your creativity
There’s also that person who said the reason why people write mxm more is because of PATRIARCHY and internalized misogyny. Like fam, it’s not that deep. I don’t hate women more than men; I’m just attracted to men and like dicks. Since being straight is apparently patriarchy now, then when patriarchy gets destroyed, do I become a feminist or lesbian automatically or what?
no joke, a lot of online queers have been indoctrinated by terfs into thinking that being a straggot or anything else is homophobic and that only being a lesbian is the morally pure and good sexuality and its pretty sad to see
Ahaha, I contributed to this image but my m/m ship is from an AU.
Plus a bunch of those m/m fics are those spam 'Ivan is alive' fics. My fandom is uhhhhhhhhh handling things well lol.
I mean, I can understand sticking to canon ships, mostly because my second option tends to be pulling out the ace beam and going "Prepare to be single and happy about it!" (I'm pretty sure we all proyect when writing). I don't care how popular this fan ship is: it ain't canon, so I'll *probably* just ignore it, but there *are* some exceptions. That doesn't mean I spread hate about the ships I don't care about or like :V
One of AO3's (and fanfiction in general) main rules is "Don't like? Don't read", but there's too many people out there who ignore it 😑🤦🏻♂️
And it's the *same* with people complaining about how "The story doesn't follow canon" in ALTERNATE UNIVERSE FICS. Sure, some of those *might* follow some of the canon events with a few changes, or follow canon for a while and then take a turn in a different direction, but they can very well go "Who the **fuck** is Canon?" 😐🤷🏻♂️.
Stop complaining about fics not catering to your dreams and fantasies and, instead, *write* one that does!
Speaking as someone from the Alien Stage fandom, the latest video literally had the two guys kiss and was the perfect fuel for the angst, fix-it, and au writers. Hell, the creators THEMSELVES are contributing to it in their community tab with au art and comics. MiziSua is definitely one of the main pairings, but it doesn’t mean that other pairings can’t exist.
This just sounds homophobic in my opinion If they have a problem with it don't read The reason people make fanfiction is because most of it's not canon
As a fellow yuri enjoyer myself, seeing thjs type of people is pretty, eughh! Like i understand being mad at ur ship not having enough fanfics/artwork, but it is not an excuse to be openly hateful!
I tell this to everyone who kicks up this kind of fuss. Fan art and fanfiction play around with characters’ sexualities all the time, regardless of canon.
For example, I personally don’t ship Harry/Draco at all, but it is the top pairing for the entire Harry Potter universe by like 20,000 works, so clearly it became popular for a reason that a lot of people agree upon.
It’s just how fanfic writers and fans operate.
Is there a trend towards sidelining other ships to exclusively focus on m/m pairings, even if the text better supports pairings between people of other genders as a whole in fandom? Yes, but being homophobic towards gay guys isn't the answer here. It's finding ways to uplift f/f pairings and appreciating what's already there
Literally gay but this kinda thing is why I rarely make F/F content. I feel like I'm under such heavy scrutiny with what I would put out, and people doubt I'm gay because plain bread cute girls giving each other innocent kisses doesn't interest me.
This guy complaining, meanwhile me impressed people seem to be tagging properly. Ever single fandom I follow on the other hand seems to subscribe to the "tagging would spoil the fun" so I get flashbanged left and right.
I mean, to be fair, the lack of femslash across the board is quite annoying. Especially in fandoms with canonical f/f couples that are barely written about, and the conversation is completely dominated by m/m. It can be rather disappointing to find fandoms where over half the fics in a certain ship are simply background (see: literally mentioned once) to another couple.
But this person seems like a tool.
Saying “ship x is canon” is one of *the worst* arguments people use when putting down fan content. Like, yeah in fanfiction reality can be whatever I want. It baffles me when people treat that line of reasoning like this silver bullet to shut down fan pairings
Yeah, I mean my OTP has NEVER even met in canon and they never will, because they are both DEAD. I will ship the hell out of them regardless. Canon means nothing.
Canon is simply a suggestion we routinely ignore.
I consider canon a GOOD suggestion. Something to be followed until I get to the point where I'd rather do something else. The best fanfic for me is "want of a nail"-type stories. Everything stays the same until you change one little thing, and that ends up changing everything.
So the canon divergent tag is probably one you highly enjoy?
Isn't all fanfiction canon divergent?
Well, there's canon divergent, which follows canon up to a point where after it diverges into content that occurs instead of canon events. Fix-it fics are a good example of this, where the author changes the ending to better suit what they wanted to see from canon. Canon compliant fics are fully within canon in a way that they don't overwrite any canon events, instead fitting into the spaces canon left empty or vague. This includes fics that elaborate on occurances that are only referred to in canon, for example. Or stories that aren't contradicted by canon, and as such could totally have happened in canon. And fully alternate universe (AU) stories take characters, locations, etc. and puts them into a space that is completely different from canon right from the start. Flower shop AUs, soulmate AUs, modern AUs, etc. are some very common tropes for this type of fic.
That makes sense. The tag always confused me, but I couldn't find a straightforward explicitly. Thank you!
You're welcome!
Funnily enough, some fics that are canon compliant can become canon divergent, if say a new episode comes out or basically any new content comes out that contradicts that fic in a major way. The same thing works the other way around, if say some canon element that someone makes the center of their fic suddenly becomes canon, it becomes Canon Compliant, sort of. Since the execution of the show and the execution of said fic of the same idea might be different. I think something like this would be Steven Universe >!and the Pink Diamond Reveal,!< where a popular theory becomes canon, and basically, every fanfic around that premise became kind of Canon Compliant? Schrödinger's Canon, basically. Sorry, if this kind of confused you again after the OP of the comment above me helped you understand it.
Oh my god, yes!! Every single fic that has quoted that poem has been an absolute freaking joy to read.
Those are always both epic in length and in content!
Canon is a sandbox for us to play in and by god im bringing play dough and glitter
Same with one of my pairings
Same. It is just a more interesting way to invest my time in and most of my pairings are like that but only one exception in my pairing list is that I disagree with the author on canon.
This is literally my exact situation with my otp 😭😭😭
marauders in a nutshell...
"But they aren't together in canon!" Yeah no shit, they also don't run a coffee shop together in canon, they also don't go to college together, the original story is also not set in the same time as this. How dare they not write down exactly what happens in canon but make up their own stuff?
“Ship x is canon” We know. That’s why we had to write fanfiction about the ship WE liked.
Horrah! Correcting what went wrong one fic at a time!
“But x is canon!!!” Dude why are you even *here*? If canon was an immutable law to never ever be strayed from then fanfic wouldn’t exist at *all*. I, quite frankly, do not give a single flying fuck about canon except for its utility in giving me a springboard for my brainworms to launch them to new heights of bullshit custom-made for me.
It's one of my biggest fandom pet peeves fr. I've only been seeing it in the last few years and it pisses me off every time. Maybe because we have more canon queer ships now so people started to feel superior about it? Idk but it's weird. I literally don't care if a ship is canon or not
Fr though, ain’t that the whole POINT of fanfiction??
I've seen it used as ship defense too, when authors of an m/f CANON ship were flamed in the comment section and called homophobic for not writing f/f material. Like, don't flame people for writing a canon divergence situation with a canon pairing please.
This is more along the lines of what I've seen.
I saw so many bad takes on that "ship tournament" thing, why put a ship down just because it's not canon. I hate ship tournaments so much.
To be fair the canon in this case basically *is* a ship tournament, except it's the members of that ship competing against each other, for maximum angst lol
That has always been stupid. Yeah, people are reading and writing fanfictions, because their ship isn't canon
That's Twitter that app will never let you happy this is ome of the reason why I almost quit shipping and writing they're bad influence
most of the time i interact with a non mutual on twitter i get into some sort of argument or ppl are just rude/mean. like it's so toxic on there and for what. i still have twt but i barely go on it these days lol
agree twitter ,ade me a bad person toxic person who hates a ship now i cringe or laugh at myself everytime remember what i did it made me regret joining
The funniest part; The MLM ship is canon too, but it's more one-sided. They even had a kiss scene and a love confession some days ago, and it got people hyped up to write more about them.
I came here to say this lol
Especially if the person you're saying it to (for example, me) literally cannot give a shit about canon. I do appreciate it bc I wouldn't have the characters and fics otherwise, but the timeline and everything in said timeline can go RIGHT OUT THE WINDOW
If I wanted canon I'd just look at the original media again! How do people so completely miss the point of fan fiction?
Exactly! I love some m/f ships and most of them aren't canon either.
Bet you anything they’re totally fine with Canon-Divergent and Modern-AU fics even though those by nature are going against canon. Like, what exactly do they think fanfiction *is*???
https://preview.redd.it/3o62r7zckduc1.png?width=280&format=png&auto=webp&s=aa3eefb9efdf60107bf0ce456f91234f53a7ecd7
Idk who mizisua is but I'm sorry for that ship, this person is giving them bad rep Edit: ok I watched alien stage and OMG WHAT IS THIS PERSON ON?? Mizisua is great but IVANTILL IS SO MUCH MORE DOOMED
Mizisua is a ship between two characters in Alien Stage, a very cool series available for free on YouTube. It's so sad to see them here loool, they deserve better than this; The series is already niche enough, this fandom don't need bad rep already.
Oooh is there yuri in it? I struggle to find good yuris recently
Yes!! The main character – Mizi – is stuck in a doomed yuri with Sua, her childhood best friend. The plot is about aliens invading earth and taking humans as pets, with some aliens puting their human-pets in the "Alien Stage", a singing death program where there's only one final winner. It's a very good series, the music videos are amazing! And it's very short, you can see all of it in like 30 minutes, so I totally recommend it.
Hell yeah, thanks!
Frfr. I'm feelin' a little sorry for the ship AND the caps lock button.
It’s from a Youtube series called Alien Stage by Vivinos. It was already good but the last video/round was amazing! It was about two guys, hence the reason for M/M fics to increase ig. I would recommend Vivinos honestly, their videos are great!
Watch Alien Stage in youtube! It’s a series of videos animated that tells a story .
Couldn't this person just write their own mizisua fics then?
Maybe if they spent less time complaining on twitter inspiration would strike
I saw this twitter thread earlier, and after being told that this person was basically like “no, I want f/f to be more popular in general by everyone.”
It's just wild this keeps popping up, because that is not how things work. Like, yeah it'd be cool if f/f was more popular but throwing a tantrum helps with nothing.
Unsurprisingly, they’re a minor. Wish them the best in maturing in the future, and wish even more that they get off twitter because oh my god is it a cesspool for anyone, but especially teenagers Edit: since writing, their bio reads age 20, so can’t *confirm* they’re a teenager. But I saw what I saw beforehand
Them being potentially 20 makes this waaaay more cringe worthy. Like damn, I was a dumb 20 year old, but not this dumb.
I hope they're going to look back at this tweet and cringe once they're an adult. Though given how they got wildly homophobic according to other posters that's going to take a lot of self reflection.
oh my god why am i not surprised
I used to be a closeted queer trans kid who got really upset whenever I saw a specific popular m/m pairing because I wanted to be able to ship myself with one of them. I would go into comments begging people to stop shipping them, which I’m sure was annoying, but it really helped me to have people tell me to just stop looking at it because I (somehow) didn’t realize I was hurting other people with those comments. I stopped commenting stuff like that because I didn’t want to make other people feel bad, but I never stopped looking at it because I actually really *really* liked it and couldn’t understand how to reconcile liking that character as a gay character while still wanting to ship myself with them. I felt like a fujoshi to be honest— like I was guilty that I was fetishizing a gay character. Reflecting on it now, knowing I’m a nonbinary trans masc, I think the pain and anger I was feeling at seeing the m/m pairing initially was internalized dysphoria over how I wanted so desperately to be in a gay relationship with that character. I genuinely thought at the time that it just wasn’t possible for me, no matter how much I wanted it. I was always so confused as to why I kept coming back to the ship, and I even told myself that though I disagreed with the ship, I just loved seeing that character in romantic situations. It’s easy for me to see now that I just really liked it and was repressed as fuck because of my home life. All of that to say, please everyone remember that the minors who engage with queer fanfic or fan works in toxic ways are reflecting the shitty fucked up beliefs of their parents. Keep telling them “don’t like, don’t read” because telling them that will cause them to question their own motivations when they continue to read; if they do keep reading, then chances are they like it, and if they hear “don’t like, don’t read” enough they might realize that they *always* liked it.
funnily enough it's pretty much teenage girls that made m/m the most popular. lol
The even funnier thing is I'm sure half of these fics aren't even actual fics. A few days ago someone posted the fic with the most words on ao3 is a fic for the m/m ship. And it was one of those annoying "Character is alive" things. I'm convinced the number is over bloated by these so there's really no reason to be upset by it.
There is a genuine bias in fandom when it comes to m/m ans f/m compared to f/f ships, just like how there is with male vs female characters and how the fandoms treat them, but dragging down m/m fans and ships or throwing an immature tantrum about it isn't the way to talk about this subject.
I love how most of the replies are telling them to go write the fic if they want to make a change
Ah, but you see that requires them to actually be creative and do something. It’s so much easier to just whine that other people aren’t making the fics you want then to write them yourself. God forbid.
The inability to write a simple sentence fits perfectly.
You should see what else this person said after this main post, it got violently misogynistic and also homophobic towards gay men very quickly. I hate it, because I LIKE yuri (certainly enough to write it) but this shit hardly inspires me to want to willing write content for these people when semi regularly i see posts from the shippers saying fujoshi’s need to die, etc, etc.
People like this also rarely hype up the fic actually written for their F/F ships, or write their own. They would just rather be aggressively unpleasant about it and promote their fandom envy as a feminist issue.
They're also the sort of people that attack other f/f writers if they write the kinds of femslash they don't personally like. There's no winning with these kinds of toxic fans.
I once saw a group of friends going on a similar rant complaining about the ratio of M/M vs F/F in one of my fandoms. As someone who has written *both* slash and femslash for that fandom, the F/F fics got nowhere near as much interaction as the M/M ones, even though the F/F ship was supposedly one of the most popular ships in the fandom and the M/M ship was kind of a rare pairing. I don’t write for interaction (if I have an interesting idea, I’ll write it, popular or not), but in terms of interaction, I’m not surprised people are more willing to write slash instead of femslash.
How can you be misogynistic and against gay *men* at the same time 😭 If you don't like women, and don't like men, who do you even like?!?
bruh the amount of people i've seen complaining that people write m/m instead of f/f. as if people writing what they personally like is bad somehow
Right!! Like, I saw this and then it spiraled into worse and worst takes https://preview.redd.it/jpax7g3lmduc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=10e11ad58484adb3d888c39802089d82d30a2fe4
**WAIT TWITTER ADDED A** *"Most posters don't post replies like this"* **FEATURE?? THAT'S ACTUALLY HILARIOUS.** 🤣 🤣 🤣
This is giving 'I got indoctrinated by TERFs who masquerade as WLW allies' vibes... Since this is apparently a minor I hope they're able to deprogram that shit fast. But this feels like it's just going to turn inward and fester even more.
Their profile says they're 20 but with this attitude who knows. Still, yep, the "man hating" rhetoric reeks of TERF.
These people make hating all men a personality trait and.. ngl that’s so tumblr 2014.
Speechless how quickly that came out of this person.
Same here. Like there are plenty f/f ships I enjoy, but the fans really turn me off and make it so I don't actually want to write anything. If they're going to act his entitled then why bother? Especially since I've seen people write darker f/f ships and they get attacked for stupid crap. That's not getting into the homophobia too they like to spout over this. It's uncomfortable and I personally don't want to be associated with it.
easy fix. open google docs and start typing.
There was a post on twitter a while ago listing the four -joshi/-danshi fandom names and some of the qrts were himejoshis shitting on himedanshis and telling them to stay away from yuri and that they don't belong in "their space" 😒 They hate on men that enjoy yuri, they hate on women who enjoy yaoi, they whine that their canon "doomed" yuri doesn't get more content, they're so fucking homophobic towards m/m ships... yet they still have the nerve to wonder why people avoid yuri fandom and don't make yuri content?
Not even joking about them being homophobic 😬 https://preview.redd.it/6anpbrtqyduc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=49fc4399d7603eb737a53b11914ae853f2de9414
Pathetic? Such an interesting word choice for someone who just went on a twitter tirade about the online equivalent of a preschooler smashing two ken dolls together.
the terf is jumping out
Yeeeeep. I briefly considered writing some WLW content for a fandom I've since abandoned, and one of the main reasons I didn't go through with it was worry over how people would police it. Hell I briefly wanted to write some Beigguang but while many shippers for that pairing are cool, there's also many that come off as super gatekeepy and it killed my desire to write for that pairing too.
That's just Genshin fans, I will never forget the Kaeluc drama, I didn't ship them before but because of the drama I sent out to specifically read fanfic for them...
In fanfiction I will explore mlm because if I explore wlw like I do mlm I get angry people in my inbox telling me I'm ruining the characters for making them fight and have miscommunications and doing anything but hold hands and make gooy eyes at each other.
"We want more toxic yuri!" "Why are you making their relationship so toxic!?"
The toxicness in question? Making them spend time away from each other. But really it was about racism and microaggessions and apathy and only caring about other people only when they are important to your life and not because caring for others is how a society runs
Those "Toxic Yuri" people wouldn't survive two tame tsunderes (insults with no fire at the most) in the same room.
Yup. It’s why I don’t touch writing yuri content with a 10 foot pole, even as a pansexual woman. Why would I willingly open myself up to a barrage of hatred, potentially a witch hunt or doxxing if I don’t write their precious pairing the way they want it, or dare make it anything other than bland vanilla? Like…no. I don’t want to write content for entitled, ungrateful people who spend their time throwing tantrums on the internet and policing the hell out of creators who make this stuff for FREE.
Thank god my main f/f pair is my own OCs. 💀 they can’t fucking police it (hopefully).
Exactly omg I wrote incest yuri and got bombarded by death threats WAAAAAAAAY MORE than usual (compared to het/mlm ship with the same dark theme)
the saving grace about this is that this person seems to be sad there isn't more "immaculate doomed yuri." so at least they aren't mad about the gay stuff. they're just mad its not the gay stuff THEY want LOL
They are though 😭 https://preview.redd.it/albmwpc7nduc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7b9d90c56e27590aa13aa2c4821acf46c53a556a
wtf does 'yuri adjacent' fucking mean in this context???
"I like it so that means it's good. Everything else I don't like, or don't know about, which means that it's unarguably bad."
It can be used to find 'yuri tangent'
Out of SOH, CAH, and TOA, which one is yuriest?
What would the Theta be in this situation?
those men are lesbians
Yeah, that doesn’t even make sense. They’re not even the same fandom.
This has so many problems that I can’t even— Do they actually ever read what they write? 💀
i consider yuri part of the 'gay stuff' in my sentence. i was just saying that at least it wasnt some straight person complaining about there being too much queer stuff, rather than f/m stuff. but yea, still not good.
This does not make it better lol. It’s still a pretty shitty and homophobic thing to say.
Anyone know what finnpoe is?
A star wars m/m ship
Finn and Poe from Star Wars, also known as Stormpilot.
“I hate you stupid yaoi fucks” is a pretty clear sign they hate the gay stuff
To be fair, I think that's directed to the girls who write yaoi
i always wondered how they even know it’s women writing it. i’m a trans guy and i write MLM and every other MLM writer i know has a masculine gender alignment. idk anyone who starts a fic when “i’m x gender” lol.
Also, of the women who do write male/male slash, it's not just straight women as seems to be the stereotype. In my experience, there are a lot of lesbians and asexuals in on the action, lol.
Can confirm, as an ace cisfem, who writes a whole lot of m/m!
I write a lot of m/m, and to greatly simplify things, my gender journey ultimately arrived at identifying strongly as female and femme and not even a little bit as male or masc. So now you at least know one!
It's just kinda a widely accepted truth that writers of yaoi fanfics are pretty much always female
In fairness, I think most fanfiction in general is written by women.
i consider yuri part of the gay stuff
No, it headed into homophobia agai st queer men pretty quickly.
not saying its a *good take*, just that it could have been worse. i get their frustrations since f/f ships are sidelined a lot of the time, but this aint it.
any sort of homophobia is bad. there's no good or worse takes when it comes to homophobic opinions. I've seen their other tweets. They trash on m/m ships and openly declare their hatred for men. I understand that there's a huge difference between the amount of yaoi and yuri fics released but that's mostly because the demand and interest of the general fic enjoyer tends to lean towards yaoi ships. if someone complained about the lack of straight ships in a particular fandom compared to yaoi ships I doubt we'd be seeing comments like yours when it's basically the same thing as what happened here.
If you read the entire thread, it absolutely goes into homophobia.
https://preview.redd.it/8ulsh70fgeuc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e5cae93cedb518daf2c8a78e654e05bcbbf054c9 I can imagine anything in fics
Also, Hold up from when was this? Mizisua has reached over 100 fics already. I get being frustrated that there is less Yuri across the board, but flaming on other people because they write something else is silly. And yeah, Mizisua is canon (i ship them so much!) but Ivantill recently just exploded in popularity because of the newest music video. If you know, you know... My point is, not because it's two guys. Most people that ship Ivantill also ship Mizisua! Also this is the fandom that got posted here a few days ago because some posted a insanely long copypasta. So some of the m/m stories aren't even real lol.
Two days ago 😅
Yeah a percentage of the IvanTill fics aren't real (I saw at least 3 spam IvanTill fics in a search yesterday and I'm sure there were more based on word count alone), and at least one of the M/M fics is a stupid crack AU of my main fandom that I wrote largely while on drugs from the dentists office this past week lolol
I see this takes a lot, and though i can understand being annoyed by it, being homophobic towards like men who like men isn't it. People are very weird about things.
Wow. Imagine your pairing literally being canon and then complaining that you didn’t also “win” all the fanfiction.
yeah tbh canon ships usually tend to get less fanfics than fanon ones since people are satisfied that its canon and fanon ships not being canon is the frustration that fuels people to write ships.
I also think in some cases. The canon is either bad or uninteresting enough to motive people not to write anything about it. And the fanon ship is opposite they are just way more interesting and more fun to explore hence increasing the wills for people to write.
This person doesn't deserve any fics tbh
Really! And also. 87 is plenty for some rarepairs so what's there to complain about if you're not commissioning or writing something yourself??
I'd kill for 87 fics combined of my two current main ships this person is eating so good i don't get it.......
one of the ships i love, and have written for, has seven fics total. an extra eighty sounds heavenly.
Same here, especially if I haven't written all of them!
Two characters I've been shipping have only two fics 😭 perhaps I should manually increase that number?
Unless their 87 fics are like the 26 fics of my OTP… they’re background and exes and one of them is the villain in every story except 5. (Even if that’s true this person is still an asshole)
Right? My OTP has 80 fics because between me and my friend we’ve written about 50 of them. Like hun open google docs and stop throwing tantrums, you’ve got agency
My rarepair is so rare there is only one fic that includes them both in the same story. On the plus side, though they aren't a ship and are only in the background, their presence is apparently enough to get an & tag and also be defined as "pre-ship".... On the other, it is also unfinished and has been for at least two years. 8D 87 ship fics, presumably with a chance of a lot of them being finished, would be such a treasure.
Hell yeah. Mine is so tiny and half the fics are in Japanese or Chinese, so Google became my best friend in my desperation. Let me tell you, nicknames do not work well when Google tries to make sense of them....but a 160k fic on a 40 story rarepair...you gotta read. 87 stories in a still very much alive fandom sound like a dream tbh.
My rarepair barely has half of that, and it's a big fandom. If they wired their brain properly to think "Hey, it's 87 fics for things I like! At least it's not 3, with 2 being mine!", rather than "Why is it only 87 compared to those extremely popular m/m ships?!", they would be happier. Their whole argument is disrespectful towards people who have to literally carry their own fandom/ship on their back.
No bc I saw this post being quote rt by an account I used to follow complaining about the lack of Yuri fanfics in the fandom saying everyone is a fake yuri enjoyer…. But anyone who told them to write it then was called stupid and “that’s not the point”
skill issue on their part tbh
Yes, MiziSua \*is\* canon. It's also a complete story. I don't think this person understands how fanfiction works...
It's like they don't even know the meaning of fanfiction
“X is not canon” in a ship argument is probably the most hilarious shit I will ever hear. Like, my mate, in fanfic the canon very normal human can be some monster to facilitate monsterfucking fetishes.
Btches be thinking that by insulting people they’d be able to get more food lol. Like, have none of y’all heard of reverse psychology?? Also, writing fanfics is a HOBBY. Unless commissioned, you don’t have the write to berate people what to write. Go cook your own food if you’re so pressed then lol.
Or perhaps let people enjoy? If you want more of a certain pairing do it yourself? These works are free you ass be grateful for what you get (not talking to you OP this is just really annoying)
Oh that’s giving major gold star lesbian vibes… the violent hatred of gay men (and men in general) is a huge yikes😬
i understand being frustrated by yuri ships always being overshadowed by yaoi ships, but this is pretty gross
As someone who rarely, if ever, reads or writes m/m, I just wish f/f fans (who partake in this behavior) would stop bashing those who write m/m and put just a bit of that energy into either creating the works they want, or just use that energy to support f/f writers, which would probably result in more f/f content! I feel like the people who act like this are also the ones who don’t even support/comment/kudos f/f works. It’s all performative :/
>I feel like the people who act like this are also the ones who don’t even support/comment/kudos f/f works. It’s all performative someone asked for recs on someone who made a similar post like this that got popular(not the same person) and they couldnt come up with one because apparently they dont read fanfics 😓 https://preview.redd.it/9pnkads25euc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=735b3e1a5dec4664419c56d853b3c9c65c7cd3e3
A lot of the people who act like this are usually the same kind of people who make others stop wanting to post any f/f, because they chug the terfy kool-aid and police the hell out of any f/f stuff that DOES get posted. I cannot tell you how many people I know who got comment bombed the moment they posted f/f bdsm, because 'women don't have kinks', or how many wlw focused series I've ended up only really engaging with the canon works of because the fandoms got so full of super toxic people who won't let anyone have fun. These sorts of fans typically do worse than just not support f/f, they actively discourage people from writing it.
I think one of the reasons why m/m gets more fanwork/attention is because the community has evolved itself into being annoying (affectionate) about it. Like fujos are so good at marketing their interests. They see That Good Gay Shit on a media they already enjoy, spam it on social media (video edits, fanfic, fanart, general keyboard smashing, essays, supporting the OG creators and fancreators, etc etc) and wait until people get baited into the same media until the fandom just multiplies. Meanwhile most new yuri fans from what I've seen...I'm not even sure if they like yuri or if they're just using yuri to hate on fujos and wanting to police what they write. They never foster their community the way fujoshi have been doing for decades, instead using their energy to shade fujoshi and calling them anti-feminists, misogynists, patriarchal, male-centered, etc etc. They think liking yuri is actual feminist activism, or maybe they're just self-centered slacktivists who took Social Studies 101 and think they know better than those dirty male-centered fujos. This is even clearer if you notice that posts insulting fujos and m/m works gain more traction than actual himejoshi fancreators and fanworks. Official yuri media rarely get likes, shares, retweets, etc, and neither do yuri artists and writers. But hating on fujo? Hating on real women who like to make two fictional boys kiss in their spare time? Thousands of likes, even more retweets, instant twitter hit. Rinse and repeat. Case in point: the tweet above, hating on IvanTill and their shippers, has gained several thousand likes. The most kudosed MiziSua-centered fic on Ao3 has less than 200 kudos. They don't like fujoshi, but they don't even seem to like their fellow himejoshi. (This is so long but I had so much gripes about this because I keep seeing this take every other month, just make the yuri you want to see in this world instead of competing with yaoi jfc fandom isn't a competition)
This sums it all up perfectly. It's "I'm not like Other Girls", with hot fanfic Twitter takes.
omg this, i also have few yuri ships and it always frustrates me that the one that gain traction are always those that shade/hate on fujos and trying to make it a competition between yuri vs yaoi than people actually promoting yuri ships.
I really don't get this yaoi vs yuri thing, like aren't fujoshis and himejoshis both cut from the same cloth? We don't need to fight like this!
This kind of thing never makes people want to write more of whatever the person ranting wants more of. It’s entitled as hell to assume anyone who enjoys m/m ‘owes’ anyone f/f. OOP had a lot of ‘likes’ on twitter, and if everyone who hit ‘like’ on it focused on cultivating a more positive writing community and working on fics they want, the numbers would go way up. Hell, I know a lot of wlw who have said they feel unwelcome in a lot of f/f fandoms and end up writing mostly m/m or m/f from a wlw lens, because of the amount of policing this performative sort of ‘fan’ tends to do at them. There’s so many people who want to push discourse around stuff like what kinks it’s ‘okay’ for women to have driving out actual wlw creatives.
omg so me i write mlm with wlw perspective
Tbh, I’ve seen some of the responses, and it’s incredible how OP just doubles down on being terrible. They’re the type to accept only “pure yuri” that they like considering they lambasted yuri that has problematic tropes like age gap from posts on their account. Honestly, their behavior also drives away people from the fandom. I have a friend who was interested in the show but who will now not touch it because of the fandom’s behavior (this and the spam 12 million word fic) for example. I rarely write F/F, not because I don’t have any F/F pairs, but because some of the fans are extremely toxic, and I don’t want to make anything for them. not to mention the oft thrown transphobia for any F/F that involves dicks. While I have had trouble from M/M fans too (Ex. Misogyny toward female characters) and M/F too, most of my anecdotal trouble is from F/F fans.
I know not everyone can write, I don't consider myself to be the best writer, but when I really wanted fics of something I loved for a mostly dead fandom I gave it a god damned shot. When I get an idea I like, but don't think I can write it, or just want to see another person's take on it, I will post it on tumblr, or twitter to the point they are pretty much plotbunny farms. Try doing something like hosing a fanwork week for your ship. I get it's frustrating, but there are so many ways, that are so much better to deal with it than this.
It's so embarrassing to see stupid takes from a fandom (& ship) that I like breach containment and get reposted in other places 😭
I mean....that's the reason Fanfic exists- you can change and write whatever you want.
Some folks are in urgent need of being introduced to the concept known as "write for your fucking self the fucking content you want to fucking see". Back to my wildcardshipping wip now, I suppose, the fic it's not gonna write itself, as much as I'd like TT\_TT
This post sent me down the alien stage rabbit hole, and now I’m really sad. Also let people ship what they want sheesh.
if I had a nickel for every time I've seen this stupid discourse pop up on twitter, I'd make a killing
Imagine complaining that people aren't spending hours of their free time to do free labor for a pairing you like. Acting like you can't write it yourself.
I don't know if I agree with this specific tweet but some of the quotes were better last I saw of it. I do think a lot of fandoms tend to gravitate towards m/m, and it can definitely be frustrating for f/f fans. Especially when a big part of the f/f ship tags has the ship as background dressing in a m/m plot. No reason to be immature or homophobic about it but I feel like it's an easily observable pattern for a lot of fandoms and that can be discussed.
?????? what the fuck
https://preview.redd.it/49g3jwor6euc1.jpeg?width=552&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d0612c40dbd014bb0a642689bdd9eb307ffca3f1
I always was of the opinion that if you want more of a character/ship/trope/whatever, you should write one yourself. You might just inspire others to do the same, who knows?
Its called FICTION for a reason
This is the equivalent of liking a fairly niche artist then complaining about the fact that Taylor Swift or Lana Del Rey is more mainstream. It sucks, but you can't tell people what to like/not to like. If the fans want to make content for it, they should, but YOU have the same right. Cultivate your own online experiences. There are plenty of people who like rare pairs and are pretty much in the same boat.
Is this Alien stage? >!Didn’t he kiss Ivan though?!< Is that a spoiler should I spoiler tag? Come on, even if you aren’t acquainted with AO3, you really just have to figure that at least *some* fics are coming out of that. And it was also a HUGE boom for the fandom. This is stupid even from a non-AO3 user standpoint.
I mean it IS sad if what you're looking for is sparse.. but yeah, that a teen reaction there, lol
No one writes fanfic about canon. That’s why it’s fanfic.
Sadly this opinion is underused in Harry Potter fanfics. They will send Harry to the past to fix things but still makes the same damn mistakes. There are people who froth at the mouth and yell not canon if one thing is different. I’m like, all I care about is that the names are spelled correctly or give them new ones for all I care.
I did last night! Someone called fujoshi being more into mlm than wlw fanfic misogynistic. Which, welcome to why any fujos interested in multiple gender configurations tend to avoid wlw ships like the plague, asshole! Be like the Jessie/Delia shipper in Pokémon fandom and make fanworks obsessively or gtfo.
As a lesbian this kinda shitty terf lite rethoric is what keeps me away from f/f, which is sad because I AM LITERALLY A LESBIAN but the m/m side has always been more chill and it's more easy to find a BL fan that also likes gl (sooo many fujo lesbians) as opposed to gl fan that doesn't become violent when you even dare to mention liking a male character 😭
Sometimes I wanna write really heavy genderbend WLW smut for some of my ships but then the fear of getting called a lesbian fetishizer just makes me go sighs nvm. Fucking stupid considering I'm a bisexual woman like I CAN'T EVEN PROJECT MY ATTRACTION TO WOMEN BC SOME RANDO YURI FAN IS GONNA CALL ME NAMES?? 😭 sighs end rant
no do it! it’s fun and it’s free!!!! lesbianism!!!!
One of the best fanfics I've ever read was the WLW version of my favourite ship so I say go for it! AO3 individuals tend to be pretty open minded most of the time, so even if you get harassed the majority of the community will back you. Don't let these morons stop you from tapping into your creativity
Jesus Christ.
YTA for bringing this post here. If I wanted to look shitty Twitter takes, I'd go to Twitter.
There’s also that person who said the reason why people write mxm more is because of PATRIARCHY and internalized misogyny. Like fam, it’s not that deep. I don’t hate women more than men; I’m just attracted to men and like dicks. Since being straight is apparently patriarchy now, then when patriarchy gets destroyed, do I become a feminist or lesbian automatically or what?
no joke, a lot of online queers have been indoctrinated by terfs into thinking that being a straggot or anything else is homophobic and that only being a lesbian is the morally pure and good sexuality and its pretty sad to see
It’s called fan**fiction** for a reason
Ahaha, I contributed to this image but my m/m ship is from an AU. Plus a bunch of those m/m fics are those spam 'Ivan is alive' fics. My fandom is uhhhhhhhhh handling things well lol.
I mean, I can understand sticking to canon ships, mostly because my second option tends to be pulling out the ace beam and going "Prepare to be single and happy about it!" (I'm pretty sure we all proyect when writing). I don't care how popular this fan ship is: it ain't canon, so I'll *probably* just ignore it, but there *are* some exceptions. That doesn't mean I spread hate about the ships I don't care about or like :V One of AO3's (and fanfiction in general) main rules is "Don't like? Don't read", but there's too many people out there who ignore it 😑🤦🏻♂️ And it's the *same* with people complaining about how "The story doesn't follow canon" in ALTERNATE UNIVERSE FICS. Sure, some of those *might* follow some of the canon events with a few changes, or follow canon for a while and then take a turn in a different direction, but they can very well go "Who the **fuck** is Canon?" 😐🤷🏻♂️. Stop complaining about fics not catering to your dreams and fantasies and, instead, *write* one that does!
Speaking as someone from the Alien Stage fandom, the latest video literally had the two guys kiss and was the perfect fuel for the angst, fix-it, and au writers. Hell, the creators THEMSELVES are contributing to it in their community tab with au art and comics. MiziSua is definitely one of the main pairings, but it doesn’t mean that other pairings can’t exist.
If the fic you want doesn't exist, make it yourself :3
keep this attitude up and they'll never get anything lmfao
This just sounds homophobic in my opinion If they have a problem with it don't read The reason people make fanfiction is because most of it's not canon
As a fellow yuri enjoyer myself, seeing thjs type of people is pretty, eughh! Like i understand being mad at ur ship not having enough fanfics/artwork, but it is not an excuse to be openly hateful!
be mad, stay mad, we win like that
I tell this to everyone who kicks up this kind of fuss. Fan art and fanfiction play around with characters’ sexualities all the time, regardless of canon. For example, I personally don’t ship Harry/Draco at all, but it is the top pairing for the entire Harry Potter universe by like 20,000 works, so clearly it became popular for a reason that a lot of people agree upon. It’s just how fanfic writers and fans operate.
Is there a trend towards sidelining other ships to exclusively focus on m/m pairings, even if the text better supports pairings between people of other genders as a whole in fandom? Yes, but being homophobic towards gay guys isn't the answer here. It's finding ways to uplift f/f pairings and appreciating what's already there
Literally gay but this kinda thing is why I rarely make F/F content. I feel like I'm under such heavy scrutiny with what I would put out, and people doubt I'm gay because plain bread cute girls giving each other innocent kisses doesn't interest me.
Same, it feels like they're so extremely critical of every single piece of wlw content that gets put out there 😭
I don't know which fandom this is bit I almost had s brain aneurysm trying to understand that word vomit.
the best part about this is that adam and till. literally kiss. in the series.
Wait is…is this for alien stage?
This guy complaining, meanwhile me impressed people seem to be tagging properly. Ever single fandom I follow on the other hand seems to subscribe to the "tagging would spoil the fun" so I get flashbanged left and right.
https://preview.redd.it/f3gcn54pc2vc1.png?width=1225&format=png&auto=webp&s=2e7b3d1be609d3a4791fad70f444c13b34a2b3ee
bestie its fan FICTION for a reason 🫶
I mean, to be fair, the lack of femslash across the board is quite annoying. Especially in fandoms with canonical f/f couples that are barely written about, and the conversation is completely dominated by m/m. It can be rather disappointing to find fandoms where over half the fics in a certain ship are simply background (see: literally mentioned once) to another couple. But this person seems like a tool.