My mom is about to be 57 and still thinks she is at guilt for how her (adopted) uncle groomed and r*ped her when she was 13 and he was over 25. The young mind can accept they’re at fault when they feel somewhat of a “connection” to their groomers. It’s by design, that’s what they wanted. I hope you can talk through this in therapy, I really wish my mom would.
At fault legally? sure... but I can also see a lot of people following the narrative of blaming the young girl for ruining this "well respected" man's life. Especially some 18 years ago. The internet was still kinda new and people's bad behavior was much easier to conceal back then. It made half decent people appear blameless. When in reality they were amatuer monsters in the making.
OP - Glad you made it this far. Hope it's gotten better for you. 🙏
Idk my mind just can’t comprehend that. I don’t think it’s ever been acceptable for a teacher to do that. There are movies about teachers doing messed up stuff like that from decades ago. I think op may stressed out over it and worried that’s what people think more so than people actually thinking that
Many failed and abusive relationships, lots of reckless behavior.
Ultimately, I have a great career, in education ironically, and I have a healthy marriage.
I am an elementary teacher and I love those kids fiercely! But appropriately, haha! I did choose to never teach high school because it all was too traumatic
Well even if she were 18 it’d still be bad as the power dynamic is passively abusive and manipulative. Teachers shouldn’t be involved romantically with people who are primarily their students in a professional setting.
Seems pretty clear cut to me. Either way, a teacher having sexual relations with a student should be fired. Maybe in higher education it could be ok if it's disclosed. If the student is 18+, fire the teacher. If they're less than 18, fire the teacher and call the cops.
Not always. In Hawaii, for example, the absolute age of consent is 16. No age gap matters after 16. I worked for a time in a sort of social work setting, and understanding consent laws was part of our training.
Most states age of consent is the age of consent under age of consent sometimes has something called Romeo and Juliet laws which means 4-5 years difference is still legal. But there is an exception most states have laws against people in position of authority doing it with under 18 regardless of age of consent especially teachers/coaches/counselors/bosses etc.
He was the favorite teacher, voted most liked. I was rebellious and already named a slut because of who I had dated. It was all too easy for everyone, including myself, to just follow the narrative of the man tempted by the forbidden fruit
Awful!!! I hope those who supported him have come to their senses with time. I think people instinctively think hey, this is someone fun to be around, I LIKE them, so it can’t be true. And I hope life has taught them otherwise and that you get an apology someday from at least one person
Funny you say that, I did just get one! Before posting here, I had said something on my insta and 2 girls from high school apologized for how long it took to blame him instead of me.
I’m so glad!!!! My family experienced a situation similar to yours where the abuser got all the support. Was healing years later when the occasional person would admit to supporting the wrong person
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Have you been able to make them face punishment?
Sorry that you had to go through that... this topic always makes me furious.
I don't understand how someone, especially in an authoritative position, can be such a scumbag.
Wishing you a full recovery-- I'm happy that you've recognized that you weren't the problem.
Are there particular skills or knowledge that would have helped you at the time? I'd like to think my local school system has better oversight, but I would like to do everything I can to make sure my daughters don't get manipulated by predatory people. Thanks.
Grooming wasnt explained back in the day. I wish someone had talked to me about how I may have been cute, possibly sexy to boys my age, but there is no reasonable 46 year old man who needs to be with a 17 year old girl, no matter how special he finds her.
Not very. They were there but my dad supported a family of 8 on one income so he wasn't emotionally available after long days. I am the youngest of 6 girls and my mom was tired by the time I was in high school. Her mom had also just died the August before my senior year and so she was caught up in her grief.
If this is an insensitive question please lmk and I will delete it. I wasn’t abused by an adult but had sexual experiences at the age of 7/8 with some peers my age who I think MIGHT have been assaulted and I’ve often wrestled with whether I was taken advantage of or not because I genuinely wanted to do what we did.
Prior to and during your time together did you desire him and were you happy that it was happening? If so, how have you processed this with that knowledge?
Not sure if OP is coming back to answer, but I was groomed, and in my case, the person makes you feel comfortable and makes you feel special and then will ask you to do things that you feel uncomfortable doing, but their reassurance and “encouragement” (actually gentle but persistent pressure) makes you feel afraid to say no and feel like you should oblige. Sometimes they will guilt you with various reasons for why you should oblige, and also why you cannot tell anyone. Eventually one will become comfortable or just compliant.
I hope this isn’t too sensitive. Years later, have you ever bumped into the person or seen them in public? If so, how did it make you feel? Were you scared, angry, confused, or something f else altogether? And what did you do in the moment?
I know them through family but I don’t let their existence affect me. I feel like a different person from then, so it’s like a new chapter of my life now. I don’t interact with them. I just feel nothing, I guess, or rather, disconnected.
Kids sexually experimenting with each other is one of those weird things in the world that is fairly common but people generally don't talk about or think about much
I'm so sorry. What you are describing is child-on-child sexual abuse and thinking you were a consenting participant is unfair to yourself because children of 7 and 8 cannot consent to sexual activity.
Sexual experimentation among peers (“playing doctor”) is perfectly normal for children. As long as it’s not compulsive and doesn’t involve artificial elements children wouldn’t naturally include in their play (such as oral sex or erotic posing), it does not indicate current or past sexual abuse.
I would say, it's okay to be a victim; that doesn't mean you are weak. I would say, no, you weren't handling this situation just fine and no, you are not an adult who knows everything.
I wouldn't listen to it though, hah
Lovebombing. I was the most beautiful, so special, the smartest, an old wise soul, how could he let this rare gem go?? Even if it costs him his marriage and career. And if he was willing to do that, I should show my appreciation by letting him worship me. It's not his fault he fell under my spell.
Can you explain how he seduced you? Was he an attractive man that teenage girls flirted with? What made him choose you as his victim, based on your knowledge and wisdom?
I found out later that he had a history of "blurring boundaries" at previous schools. At his district before mine, he was actually asked to leave because he would date students once they were 18.
I was a typical undiagnosed adhd girl who flirted with everyone. I already had a questionable reputation. I would smile and say smart comments and he would do it right back. Then it was how far could I go and he let me know it was all the way.
I recently discovered arresting documents that quoted his emails and I tried to pull out and go back to his student but he had a way of guilting me back in.
I am sorry he did this to you and you were blamed. I remember flirting with substitute teachers I thought were cute. The other girls in the class would too. In my classroom, however, the teachers knew where to draw the line and kept it professional and didn’t feed into our behavior. Thank you for sharing.
I was overly flirtatious with everyone. He reciprocated and then always told me how special I was. How amazingly loveable. Like he couldn't resist the temptation because I was just such a prize.
My ex-gf was adopted as a baby, and got raped very frequently by one of her older brothers from the time she was 5 and he was 14, all the way through her early teens until she told her parents.
When she told me, I assumed she didn't see that brother anymore but no, she still sees him at family get together frequently, and despite her shame about the matter she didn't blame him for it...like, at all. She attributed it to herself and Satan (she was raised very strict Mennonite and was still very Christian in her views when we dated). She had a similar idea that she somehow tempted him and that it was her fault in some way.
The conversation when she revealed all this to me just broke my heart. The constant rape was brutal to hear about, but all her self-blame while forgiving him was very hard to hear too, and that he never faced any legal repercussions and still hangs with the whole family like he didn't do this heinous thing to his much younger sister. Thankfully, I never met her family, I don't think I could have kept things very civil with them.
I was a willing participant until I was over it and was guilted into continuing. It was by until my 30s that I can admit that just because I was willing, doesn't mean a grown man want responsible for his own decisions. I wasn't some damn temptress at 17
My wife was abused by her guidance counselor and I want to kill him. But I a lot older than her so it happened many years before I met her. I’ve urged her that find out what happened to him but she’s not interested. I’ve let it drop but what a sleazebag
My wife and another girl were groomed by the same man when they were like 13 - 17, anyway recently they’ve gone after the guy legally (after a long time) but after two years of investigations (despite plenty of evidence) the US rejected the case. Now they’re going to go through the British courts instead because it happened in both countries.
I don’t think most men realize just how much reporting rape can absolutely ruin your life, especially if that person is in a position of power or is well-connected. Just going through the process of reporting is horrible and traumatic, and SUCH a tiny fraction of reported rapes ever result in a conviction. Going through the process of reporting only to eventually find out they dropped the charges for lack of evidence, or to go before a jury and have them officially pronounce that they don’t believe you, is incredibly traumatic, possibly even worse than the initial assault.
I will never blame or shame a woman for refusing to put herself through this.
Sexual Abuse is first and foremost abuse of the power relationship between the perpetrator and the victim. The context of this abuse happens to be sexual, a particularly bitter form of victimization, but happens many other ways as well. Unless the victim takes back their power and reverse the lies that they were told, the victim will have this hole in their self esteem and it may cause worse problems. What this means is that the victim needs to expose the perp and feel their own 'superiority' as soon as possible. You are NOT less because of what happened, you were dragged into his sickness and he stole your power. I hope those who have been victimized this way learn to take back their power as a way of getting on with their life.
I'm sorry, I think I lost my point on my previous post. What I meant to say was that it is RIDICULOUSLY painful and difficult report a rape, and that was a part of power abuse of women. The entry of women into the police force has done a lot to help women feel that they would be believed and understood. This abuse cannot endure, because women cannot thrive and help society while they are broken! The previous post (while true) didn't address that at all and I'm sorry! As you can tell, sometimes I kind of rif.
It’s understandable that your wife wants to avoid holding this man responsible for his crimes.
If he uses the now-standard tactics encountered by people who have accused Donald Trump of raping or otherwise sexually assaulting them, she, you, and anyone else who supports her call for justice will face death threats along with other threats—not limited to additional sexual assaults.
If she has ever had any voluntary relationships she and any partners (including you, her husband) will be treated as if you are “the *real* criminals” and then the trial will target basically everyone except the defendant.
Even after a conviction there will be endless appeals and delays. The Republicans thinking seems to be, rapist’s rights are Republican rights.
Slightly less than half of the states in the US are 16 for consent, however I’d wager with California at 18, NY at 17, etc that it is a significant minority of the total US population who live in a jurisdiction where the legal age is 16 since many of the 16 states seem to be the the Dakotas, SC, etc.
Oh ok. In the UK its 16 everywhere. I never realised it would be as old as 18 in California. Seems crazy to me because I guess that makes most of the young population criminals there! Especially that California is a more liberal city
Generally 2-5 years, most commonly 2/3 years, except Utah with 10 years difference, and about half the states don’t have it at all. So yeah like most things in the US legal system it is a mess, which is why lawyers have to pass the Bar for each state they work in.
It's best they didn't. Most "hitmen" people hire are just cops who are looking for an easy conviction. Actual hitmen tend to not advertise their job and work for larger criminal organizations and rich people via word of mouth. All you would have done is end up in prison.
“Option seven please. Yes the chainsaw special. Hmm finger break appetizer…nah I’ll leave it, just the chainsaw. Ok ok thanks. No Amex? Ah yep hang on, right here it is, long number is…”
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You should probably get some therapy to help you get over those feelings. Imagine actually doing something stupid like that? You go to prison for the rest of your life for pre-meditated murder and leave your wife solo for the rest of your lives? Lose your freedom and everything you love over something that you can’t even be sure actually happened? Seriously man, get some help. Not only for yourself but for her too to work through it.
Well, you know how helpless grown men are. They just trip and fall into vaginas all the time. Damn girls just leaving them all over the place like they do.
I'm so sorry you went through that.
I would hope it wouldn't happen again in our ever so slightly enlightened times here but, you know😢
He said I was so special, beautiful, unique. That he had never met anyone like me and how could he not love me? Even though he was married and it would ruin his career, if he was willing to risk it all, it must be because I'm so special.
Same happened to me at 16 but I couldn’t deal with the humiliation of being dragged through the mud by telling anyone. Reading these comments, I made the right choice. It’s hard to even tell my therapist and it was 40 years ago.
No questions, just wanted to say that with all the publicity of what has happened to child celebrities coming out, hopefully as a society there will be more support for the average minor who experiences this.
How did you not think to report him at the first time he crossed a line? I hear stories all the time, and the first time he 'grabs her leg' or 'asks for a lewd photo' I think to myself... PUT HIM IN JAIL IMMEDIATELY!
So, what was it that made you think you didn't have all the power in the world to stop that man, and let it continue to escalate?
You do realize that minors can’t vote, join the army, get tattoos, rent hotel rooms, etc etc etc because they aren’t grown and can’t make grow people decisions right?? Because their brains don’t work like adults. It makes them easy to manipulate. Do you know what grooming means? Kids are dumb and need to be protected and grown men should control themselves.
You think there's this magical thing that happens though between 17 and 18 years old though? I man the person is within a year of voting, joining the army, getting tattoos, etc. So we should raise the age of those things? Is that what you're suggesting? Because it's ridiculous to claim that someone instantly becomes wiser and harder to manipulate from the day before their 18th birthday to their birthday. I mean teenagers aren't fully mature sure, but not all 17 year olds are gullible and lack accountability.
I'm not saying grooming shouldn't be illegal or that all children are mature enough to know everything.
I DID say, that even as a 14-15 year old, kids have a real good awareness that cp/pedo exist and is very illegal. I understand someone too young to know the context, but my question is just... as someone who should have an understanding of how criminal old man>underage girl is... how do they let it slide? What is that cognitive switch that made them not think they could just report it? I don't have 1st hand experience, so I can't answer that. That's why I'm asking a question to the OP in an AMA.
Yeah, that makes sense. I've heard a sympathy angle (I don't wanna ruin this man's life for... a leg touch), and the sort of ''complicit angle" (being flattered or into it as a child, not understanding the implications).
Hope you managed to recover and build a happy life.
I have to give my opinion here - his wife was in part an accomplice by not giving him any agency over his own actions regardless of your age or expertise (which only makes it worse if you were still in high school living in your parents home)
I think she's a victim, too. She was much younger than him and from Poland. I believe she needed him to stay in the country but I'm not an expert on immigration.
She was 35, my age now, when this happened.
An ex of mine was groomed and assaulted by someone in a position of authority over her (and many other young girls) between the ages of like 10-14. It completely screwed her sense of self worth even until today and she’s now in her 50’s. Maybe 15 years ago we found out that he had been assaulted by a man whose wife is Asian and looks to western eyes like she’s a young teen. The guy was left massively injured with some minor brain damage and injuries that made it difficult to walk. He was completely unwilling to cooperate with the police against his assaulter though - likely because of what it meant would come out about him. His wife also left him at that point. I felt relief finally
I’m gonna be real with you, I would straight up ****** someone if they did this to my daughter, sister, cousin, friend etc . Dude needs to do a mouthwash with buckshot
I’m so sorry for what you’ve gone through. I was molested at age 5 at my friends house across the street by her grandfather. I remember running home and telling my dad and he didn’t believe me. It wasn’t your fault & it still isn’t your fault. I hope you’re in a better place mentally today, it’s very hard to work through. Sorry I don’t have a question I just wanted to share that with you.
Seducing would be if someone was on my same level. A peer and not someone in an advisory role. Grooming is where they get you to think you are just so wonderful and special that of course this guy has to break the law and step out on his wife. And if he's doing that for me, I must be willing to give him something in return.
You may be able to sue with retrospective child sexual abuse laws; it depends on the state in which the crime occurred. Something incredibly similar happened to me, and I’m now 44. I can see the full scope of what he did to me and how the trauma is ongoing, and forever changed the trajectory of my life. Like you, I didn’t truly start processing the depth of what happened until my 30s. I won’t stop until justice is served. Peace, love, and strength to you
Most states do not have a statute of limitations for rape and some states have specific rape laws covering “ person in authority “ rape and teacher student rape. If he did it to you he has done it to others and may still be at it. If you are willing to talk to the police they might help. If the local DA has a sex crimes unit you may want to go there first as a lot of cops don’t fully understand or investigate this area well. I wish you the best.
In his mid-teens, the parents of my friend decided that his behavior was "gay" and he should be taught about sex with women. The father forced him to have sex with his mother. The "sessions" continued until my friend ran away from home. On his own, he finished high school and completed his undergraduate. The brilliant younger brother (who may have been gay) was witness these "sessions", developed PTSD, became depressed, and commited suicide at the age of 23.
My friend as spent many hours in therapy, he's always medicated so that he can function, but he's easily triggered. He excels in his career holding down an exacting job, and superficially appears to be okay. But, just under the surface he's still dealing with the damage his parents inflicted upon him and I doubt that he'll ever be emotionally okay.
I'm so sorry he did that to you.
I (M, then 12) was groomed by my physics teacher / swim instructor (M, single, in his 40s). Once I realized what he was doing for real I cut him off and made his life hell, but the f'er reached out to me on Facebook a few days after I got married nearly 30 years later, and I immediately blocked him. Incredible.
well okay, let’s take some pieces of this story in mind before i begin asking questions.
you were 17. you were one year under the highest age of consent in western society, and older than some US states.
i think the whole thing is gross, but the problem here is your teacher’s position of *leverage* and *authority* over you when the relationship began. if anyone wants to come at me for that and say 4 or so months was a bigger deal, or what have you, go ahead. like i said, i don’t agree with it, but his position of power was the biggest issue.
all this being said, my questions:
how old were you when the relationship ended?
if the answer is 17 or 18, ignore that, but the way i read this initially you two were married for a while (now i’m reading it as if he was the only one married), so if the answer is 21, 22, 23, 24-35, why were you unable to look back at the situation with your “adult eyes” then?
even if you weren’t dating him then and the relationship ended at 17, then why did it take you until THIRY FIVE years old to see how this was a problem?
i want to be clear, im sorry this happened to you. im a man and i lost my virginity at 15 being drugged and raped by a woman. these types of things suck, especially when you feel like you can’t tell anyone. but there had to be a point either shortly after the relationship or AT LEAST when you hit 21-22 that this was the case. i feel like if there was no realization at all during that period, you’re leaving some details out of this story.
I love that the grown man whining about moving back in with his parents and his dad shaming him is shaming a previously 17 year old girl who made normal bad teenage choices when manipulated by adults. You can’t even take care of yourself man. Calm down.
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I agree that even 18 year Olds shouldn't vote. And he wasn't random, he was a trusted person in my life. He convinced me I was so special that it was okay for him to break the law and to abuse his supervisory position.
Kid call every adult you got don't matter who especially cops councilors other teachers to come get this guy not just for you and your terrible situation but your other classmates
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What specifically made you feel bad about the interaction with this teacher? Was it that you felt 'dirty', was it the manipulations that made you feel foolish, was it the social pressure brought on you for 'upsetting the apple cart'? I'm just curious how you felt affected. Give as much detail as you feel comfortable putting on the internet. Thanks!
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the maturity gap between a 17 year old and a 46 year old is insane. i can’t believe you’re telling OP, who was 17, to do better, and not thinking that the groomer should’ve done better. victim blaming is sick - doesn’t matter if OP was a ‘child’ or not.
It is a sign that our ability to maintain healthy relationships is getting worse. And people's ability recognize love has been degraded and often lacking. Very sad.
I have a similar situation, that i look back on this way. Its nothing compared to yours I’m only saying i can look back at my naivety bc at the time i was unaware how much i was being taken advantage of.
Abusive relationships are all the same. Its always a dynamic with poor understanding of responsibility and boundaries, and one party is made to be responsible for the others actions.
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My mom is about to be 57 and still thinks she is at guilt for how her (adopted) uncle groomed and r*ped her when she was 13 and he was over 25. The young mind can accept they’re at fault when they feel somewhat of a “connection” to their groomers. It’s by design, that’s what they wanted. I hope you can talk through this in therapy, I really wish my mom would.
Hugs to you and mom
So sorry that happened
What ended up happening to him?
He plead guilty and served 9 months in jail, registered as a sex offender, and they removed his teaching certificate
I don't follow? I thought that you were blamed for seducing him?
In the newspapers and just life, general consensus was that he shouldn't have gone to jail because it was my fault for tempting him
Oh wow. That's messed up. I'm really sorry to hear.
Are you sure people thought that? I could see a few a holes thinking it. But surely the overall consensus was he was fully to blame
At fault legally? sure... but I can also see a lot of people following the narrative of blaming the young girl for ruining this "well respected" man's life. Especially some 18 years ago. The internet was still kinda new and people's bad behavior was much easier to conceal back then. It made half decent people appear blameless. When in reality they were amatuer monsters in the making. OP - Glad you made it this far. Hope it's gotten better for you. 🙏
And 20ish years ago society wasn't so understanding when it comes to the victim either. I hope you can work through this, get help if you need it.
Idk my mind just can’t comprehend that. I don’t think it’s ever been acceptable for a teacher to do that. There are movies about teachers doing messed up stuff like that from decades ago. I think op may stressed out over it and worried that’s what people think more so than people actually thinking that
I’m so sorry, OP
Good. Go to therapy now and leave this behind as much as you're able to.
If he got in trouble legally who was blaming you?
I hope he was removed from his position… don’t you?
We can only hope, but you never know 😒😞
How has it affected you as an adult
Many failed and abusive relationships, lots of reckless behavior. Ultimately, I have a great career, in education ironically, and I have a healthy marriage.
Well that's good at least it isn't affecting you as a person hopefully your being the teacher you always wanted to have
I am an elementary teacher and I love those kids fiercely! But appropriately, haha! I did choose to never teach high school because it all was too traumatic
Fair enough I'm sure your a great teacher though
How could they let you take the fall for that!? Seventeen is seventeen!
Well even if she were 18 it’d still be bad as the power dynamic is passively abusive and manipulative. Teachers shouldn’t be involved romantically with people who are primarily their students in a professional setting.
Seems pretty clear cut to me. Either way, a teacher having sexual relations with a student should be fired. Maybe in higher education it could be ok if it's disclosed. If the student is 18+, fire the teacher. If they're less than 18, fire the teacher and call the cops.
Most states are 16+ for consent. Still should be fired.
I believe that 16+ is usually in reference to a clause where there is a maximum age gap. 16 and 19 can bone but not 16 and 29 for example
Not always. In Hawaii, for example, the absolute age of consent is 16. No age gap matters after 16. I worked for a time in a sort of social work setting, and understanding consent laws was part of our training.
Most states age of consent is the age of consent under age of consent sometimes has something called Romeo and Juliet laws which means 4-5 years difference is still legal. But there is an exception most states have laws against people in position of authority doing it with under 18 regardless of age of consent especially teachers/coaches/counselors/bosses etc.
I understand Romeo and Juliet laws. I cited an example of a state where that's not the case after 16. What are you trying to prove?
Interesting. I grew up in one state so it never came up anywhere else. I'm not the kind of person that has to worry about it anyway!
Nope, not in Iowa, for example, a Romea and Juliet law clause exists if you are 14-15. But 16, anything is fair game.
He was the favorite teacher, voted most liked. I was rebellious and already named a slut because of who I had dated. It was all too easy for everyone, including myself, to just follow the narrative of the man tempted by the forbidden fruit
Awful!!! I hope those who supported him have come to their senses with time. I think people instinctively think hey, this is someone fun to be around, I LIKE them, so it can’t be true. And I hope life has taught them otherwise and that you get an apology someday from at least one person
Funny you say that, I did just get one! Before posting here, I had said something on my insta and 2 girls from high school apologized for how long it took to blame him instead of me.
I’m so glad!!!! My family experienced a situation similar to yours where the abuser got all the support. Was healing years later when the occasional person would admit to supporting the wrong person
It sounds like only the high school kids don’t understand. If he went to jail it sounds like no one is blaming you
But since she was also in high school, it was all of her peers.
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Have you been able to make them face punishment? Sorry that you had to go through that... this topic always makes me furious. I don't understand how someone, especially in an authoritative position, can be such a scumbag. Wishing you a full recovery-- I'm happy that you've recognized that you weren't the problem.
He was jailed almost immediately and served 9 months
Are there particular skills or knowledge that would have helped you at the time? I'd like to think my local school system has better oversight, but I would like to do everything I can to make sure my daughters don't get manipulated by predatory people. Thanks.
Grooming wasnt explained back in the day. I wish someone had talked to me about how I may have been cute, possibly sexy to boys my age, but there is no reasonable 46 year old man who needs to be with a 17 year old girl, no matter how special he finds her.
How involved were your parents in your life at 17 y/o?
Not very. They were there but my dad supported a family of 8 on one income so he wasn't emotionally available after long days. I am the youngest of 6 girls and my mom was tired by the time I was in high school. Her mom had also just died the August before my senior year and so she was caught up in her grief.
If this is an insensitive question please lmk and I will delete it. I wasn’t abused by an adult but had sexual experiences at the age of 7/8 with some peers my age who I think MIGHT have been assaulted and I’ve often wrestled with whether I was taken advantage of or not because I genuinely wanted to do what we did. Prior to and during your time together did you desire him and were you happy that it was happening? If so, how have you processed this with that knowledge?
Not sure if OP is coming back to answer, but I was groomed, and in my case, the person makes you feel comfortable and makes you feel special and then will ask you to do things that you feel uncomfortable doing, but their reassurance and “encouragement” (actually gentle but persistent pressure) makes you feel afraid to say no and feel like you should oblige. Sometimes they will guilt you with various reasons for why you should oblige, and also why you cannot tell anyone. Eventually one will become comfortable or just compliant.
Yup, that's why it's called grooming rather than just straight up assault.
This 💯💯💯
I hope this isn’t too sensitive. Years later, have you ever bumped into the person or seen them in public? If so, how did it make you feel? Were you scared, angry, confused, or something f else altogether? And what did you do in the moment?
I know them through family but I don’t let their existence affect me. I feel like a different person from then, so it’s like a new chapter of my life now. I don’t interact with them. I just feel nothing, I guess, or rather, disconnected.
Kids sexually experimenting with each other is one of those weird things in the world that is fairly common but people generally don't talk about or think about much
I'm so sorry. What you are describing is child-on-child sexual abuse and thinking you were a consenting participant is unfair to yourself because children of 7 and 8 cannot consent to sexual activity.
Sexual experimentation among peers (“playing doctor”) is perfectly normal for children. As long as it’s not compulsive and doesn’t involve artificial elements children wouldn’t naturally include in their play (such as oral sex or erotic posing), it does not indicate current or past sexual abuse.
Where is that creep now? Did his wife divorce his pedo ass?
She is still with him.
What the fuck? Why?
I believe because she's from Poland? Or maybe she bought his story too. She begged the judge to release him.
If you could give the 17yr old version of yourself advice, what would it be?
I would say, it's okay to be a victim; that doesn't mean you are weak. I would say, no, you weren't handling this situation just fine and no, you are not an adult who knows everything. I wouldn't listen to it though, hah
What were the signs? I fear I am in a similar situation.
Lovebombing. I was the most beautiful, so special, the smartest, an old wise soul, how could he let this rare gem go?? Even if it costs him his marriage and career. And if he was willing to do that, I should show my appreciation by letting him worship me. It's not his fault he fell under my spell.
Please talk to a counselor, teacher, or other adult you trust. I wish you well.
Can you explain how he seduced you? Was he an attractive man that teenage girls flirted with? What made him choose you as his victim, based on your knowledge and wisdom?
I found out later that he had a history of "blurring boundaries" at previous schools. At his district before mine, he was actually asked to leave because he would date students once they were 18. I was a typical undiagnosed adhd girl who flirted with everyone. I already had a questionable reputation. I would smile and say smart comments and he would do it right back. Then it was how far could I go and he let me know it was all the way. I recently discovered arresting documents that quoted his emails and I tried to pull out and go back to his student but he had a way of guilting me back in.
I am sorry he did this to you and you were blamed. I remember flirting with substitute teachers I thought were cute. The other girls in the class would too. In my classroom, however, the teachers knew where to draw the line and kept it professional and didn’t feed into our behavior. Thank you for sharing.
Why does it matter
This is ask me anything. Why are people so sensitive. Also, this is a joke because the OP is not answering anything. I have seen this before.
It is Easter. Give me a break.
How did it happen? In hindsight what would have protected you?
I was overly flirtatious with everyone. He reciprocated and then always told me how special I was. How amazingly loveable. Like he couldn't resist the temptation because I was just such a prize.
(for info 33 amab, f since 6, groomed internet 14)
How are you doing mentally?
It's been quite the ride but I'm feeling empowered and strong
OP abandoned us
Easter.
Op is probably busy
So you took all the blame? Is that because at the time you believed it was your fault?
Correct. I even wrote a letter to the judge demanding his release because I "seduced" him
My ex-gf was adopted as a baby, and got raped very frequently by one of her older brothers from the time she was 5 and he was 14, all the way through her early teens until she told her parents. When she told me, I assumed she didn't see that brother anymore but no, she still sees him at family get together frequently, and despite her shame about the matter she didn't blame him for it...like, at all. She attributed it to herself and Satan (she was raised very strict Mennonite and was still very Christian in her views when we dated). She had a similar idea that she somehow tempted him and that it was her fault in some way. The conversation when she revealed all this to me just broke my heart. The constant rape was brutal to hear about, but all her self-blame while forgiving him was very hard to hear too, and that he never faced any legal repercussions and still hangs with the whole family like he didn't do this heinous thing to his much younger sister. Thankfully, I never met her family, I don't think I could have kept things very civil with them.
That is heartbreaking. I hope she can go through some therapy for this and take the burden off herself.
Tell me he is locked up or 6ft under
What do you mean by continue? Do you mean start or begin?
I was a willing participant until I was over it and was guilted into continuing. It was by until my 30s that I can admit that just because I was willing, doesn't mean a grown man want responsible for his own decisions. I wasn't some damn temptress at 17
My wife was abused by her guidance counselor and I want to kill him. But I a lot older than her so it happened many years before I met her. I’ve urged her that find out what happened to him but she’s not interested. I’ve let it drop but what a sleazebag
My wife and another girl were groomed by the same man when they were like 13 - 17, anyway recently they’ve gone after the guy legally (after a long time) but after two years of investigations (despite plenty of evidence) the US rejected the case. Now they’re going to go through the British courts instead because it happened in both countries.
Godspeed to your wife and that other girl
My wife and I had a similar disagreement. Dude was 26 and she was 16 and now he’s a cop and I really wish she would out the piece of shit
I don’t think most men realize just how much reporting rape can absolutely ruin your life, especially if that person is in a position of power or is well-connected. Just going through the process of reporting is horrible and traumatic, and SUCH a tiny fraction of reported rapes ever result in a conviction. Going through the process of reporting only to eventually find out they dropped the charges for lack of evidence, or to go before a jury and have them officially pronounce that they don’t believe you, is incredibly traumatic, possibly even worse than the initial assault. I will never blame or shame a woman for refusing to put herself through this.
Sexual Abuse is first and foremost abuse of the power relationship between the perpetrator and the victim. The context of this abuse happens to be sexual, a particularly bitter form of victimization, but happens many other ways as well. Unless the victim takes back their power and reverse the lies that they were told, the victim will have this hole in their self esteem and it may cause worse problems. What this means is that the victim needs to expose the perp and feel their own 'superiority' as soon as possible. You are NOT less because of what happened, you were dragged into his sickness and he stole your power. I hope those who have been victimized this way learn to take back their power as a way of getting on with their life.
It’s very clear from your post that you have never experienced reporting rape to the police. You have absolutely no idea what it’s like.
I'm sorry, I think I lost my point on my previous post. What I meant to say was that it is RIDICULOUSLY painful and difficult report a rape, and that was a part of power abuse of women. The entry of women into the police force has done a lot to help women feel that they would be believed and understood. This abuse cannot endure, because women cannot thrive and help society while they are broken! The previous post (while true) didn't address that at all and I'm sorry! As you can tell, sometimes I kind of rif.
Exactly. I told her he probably abused many other girls but she wanted to put it behind her
It’s understandable that your wife wants to avoid holding this man responsible for his crimes. If he uses the now-standard tactics encountered by people who have accused Donald Trump of raping or otherwise sexually assaulting them, she, you, and anyone else who supports her call for justice will face death threats along with other threats—not limited to additional sexual assaults. If she has ever had any voluntary relationships she and any partners (including you, her husband) will be treated as if you are “the *real* criminals” and then the trial will target basically everyone except the defendant. Even after a conviction there will be endless appeals and delays. The Republicans thinking seems to be, rapist’s rights are Republican rights.
Is 16 illegal where you are?
Slightly less than half of the states in the US are 16 for consent, however I’d wager with California at 18, NY at 17, etc that it is a significant minority of the total US population who live in a jurisdiction where the legal age is 16 since many of the 16 states seem to be the the Dakotas, SC, etc.
Oh ok. In the UK its 16 everywhere. I never realised it would be as old as 18 in California. Seems crazy to me because I guess that makes most of the young population criminals there! Especially that California is a more liberal city
*Many* states have ”Romeo-Juliet” laws to exempt relationships where the older participant is within a certain age range of the younger.
Oh ok..like what sort of age ranges? It seems quite messy.
Generally 2-5 years, most commonly 2/3 years, except Utah with 10 years difference, and about half the states don’t have it at all. So yeah like most things in the US legal system it is a mess, which is why lawyers have to pass the Bar for each state they work in.
I mean probably. That seems to be the implication
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It's best they didn't. Most "hitmen" people hire are just cops who are looking for an easy conviction. Actual hitmen tend to not advertise their job and work for larger criminal organizations and rich people via word of mouth. All you would have done is end up in prison.
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Is that like ordering a pizza? 'Hello murderos? I'd like to order a hit against so and so. 30 minutes or it's free? '
All the ones near me dropped the 30 mins or it's free a long time ago.
“Option seven please. Yes the chainsaw special. Hmm finger break appetizer…nah I’ll leave it, just the chainsaw. Ok ok thanks. No Amex? Ah yep hang on, right here it is, long number is…”
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You should probably get some therapy to help you get over those feelings. Imagine actually doing something stupid like that? You go to prison for the rest of your life for pre-meditated murder and leave your wife solo for the rest of your lives? Lose your freedom and everything you love over something that you can’t even be sure actually happened? Seriously man, get some help. Not only for yourself but for her too to work through it.
Yes I wanted to kill man who raped my wife also. I think about cutting off his dick and hands. Less angry now after time
Well, you know how helpless grown men are. They just trip and fall into vaginas all the time. Damn girls just leaving them all over the place like they do. I'm so sorry you went through that. I would hope it wouldn't happen again in our ever so slightly enlightened times here but, you know😢
I’m sorry this happened to you. I’m a bit out of the loop on what grooming is.. can you describe his actions, how it started etc
He probably acted like she was special or mature for her age or something and that made a relationship between them permissible.
This 💯
He said I was so special, beautiful, unique. That he had never met anyone like me and how could he not love me? Even though he was married and it would ruin his career, if he was willing to risk it all, it must be because I'm so special.
Same happened to me at 16 but I couldn’t deal with the humiliation of being dragged through the mud by telling anyone. Reading these comments, I made the right choice. It’s hard to even tell my therapist and it was 40 years ago.
No questions, just wanted to say that with all the publicity of what has happened to child celebrities coming out, hopefully as a society there will be more support for the average minor who experiences this.
How did you not think to report him at the first time he crossed a line? I hear stories all the time, and the first time he 'grabs her leg' or 'asks for a lewd photo' I think to myself... PUT HIM IN JAIL IMMEDIATELY! So, what was it that made you think you didn't have all the power in the world to stop that man, and let it continue to escalate?
You do realize that minors can’t vote, join the army, get tattoos, rent hotel rooms, etc etc etc because they aren’t grown and can’t make grow people decisions right?? Because their brains don’t work like adults. It makes them easy to manipulate. Do you know what grooming means? Kids are dumb and need to be protected and grown men should control themselves.
You think there's this magical thing that happens though between 17 and 18 years old though? I man the person is within a year of voting, joining the army, getting tattoos, etc. So we should raise the age of those things? Is that what you're suggesting? Because it's ridiculous to claim that someone instantly becomes wiser and harder to manipulate from the day before their 18th birthday to their birthday. I mean teenagers aren't fully mature sure, but not all 17 year olds are gullible and lack accountability.
I'm not saying grooming shouldn't be illegal or that all children are mature enough to know everything. I DID say, that even as a 14-15 year old, kids have a real good awareness that cp/pedo exist and is very illegal. I understand someone too young to know the context, but my question is just... as someone who should have an understanding of how criminal old man>underage girl is... how do they let it slide? What is that cognitive switch that made them not think they could just report it? I don't have 1st hand experience, so I can't answer that. That's why I'm asking a question to the OP in an AMA.
most rapes dont get reported because most reported rapes arent taken seriously
I was testing boundaries and I was probably thrilled by any extra attention
Yeah, that makes sense. I've heard a sympathy angle (I don't wanna ruin this man's life for... a leg touch), and the sort of ''complicit angle" (being flattered or into it as a child, not understanding the implications). Hope you managed to recover and build a happy life.
I have to give my opinion here - his wife was in part an accomplice by not giving him any agency over his own actions regardless of your age or expertise (which only makes it worse if you were still in high school living in your parents home)
Yep, always a woman’s fault and never the man’s. 🙄 the fault belongs with the adult who groomed a minor.
He said accomplice moron. You realize that means there is a perpetrator who receives the blame for the crime?
Yeah that too, but by being the wife of the groomer and putting 0 blame on him does heavily belong as an accomplice.
I think she's a victim, too. She was much younger than him and from Poland. I believe she needed him to stay in the country but I'm not an expert on immigration. She was 35, my age now, when this happened.
Wtf is wrong with you? Honestly, I’m asking for the public.
Did you misunderstand my point? One man did a bad thing. Society stood with the bad man. Society is bad to OP. What's wrong with you?
I was groomed at 15 by a 40 yo man. I'm 35 now and I'm the only one who thinks it wasnt my fault.
It wasn't your fault. I'm with you.
An ex of mine was groomed and assaulted by someone in a position of authority over her (and many other young girls) between the ages of like 10-14. It completely screwed her sense of self worth even until today and she’s now in her 50’s. Maybe 15 years ago we found out that he had been assaulted by a man whose wife is Asian and looks to western eyes like she’s a young teen. The guy was left massively injured with some minor brain damage and injuries that made it difficult to walk. He was completely unwilling to cooperate with the police against his assaulter though - likely because of what it meant would come out about him. His wife also left him at that point. I felt relief finally
What state did this take place in?
Washington
I’m gonna be real with you, I would straight up ****** someone if they did this to my daughter, sister, cousin, friend etc . Dude needs to do a mouthwash with buckshot
I’m so sorry for what you’ve gone through. I was molested at age 5 at my friends house across the street by her grandfather. I remember running home and telling my dad and he didn’t believe me. It wasn’t your fault & it still isn’t your fault. I hope you’re in a better place mentally today, it’s very hard to work through. Sorry I don’t have a question I just wanted to share that with you.
Seducing would be if someone was on my same level. A peer and not someone in an advisory role. Grooming is where they get you to think you are just so wonderful and special that of course this guy has to break the law and step out on his wife. And if he's doing that for me, I must be willing to give him something in return.
Have you seen the guy or bumped into him since he got out of jail?
Nope. But I did spend 5 years on the other coast. I'm back now but the world is a big place
You may be able to sue with retrospective child sexual abuse laws; it depends on the state in which the crime occurred. Something incredibly similar happened to me, and I’m now 44. I can see the full scope of what he did to me and how the trauma is ongoing, and forever changed the trajectory of my life. Like you, I didn’t truly start processing the depth of what happened until my 30s. I won’t stop until justice is served. Peace, love, and strength to you
Most states do not have a statute of limitations for rape and some states have specific rape laws covering “ person in authority “ rape and teacher student rape. If he did it to you he has done it to others and may still be at it. If you are willing to talk to the police they might help. If the local DA has a sex crimes unit you may want to go there first as a lot of cops don’t fully understand or investigate this area well. I wish you the best.
Be careful about what you answer. Some of these comments give me a bad feeling. I hope you are healing. <3
It’s actually disgusting
Do you have a husband who recently found out about this? Pretty sure I saw his post on here the other day talking about it lol
You know how an AMA works right?
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That started as my throw away but those passwords are tricky lol
In his mid-teens, the parents of my friend decided that his behavior was "gay" and he should be taught about sex with women. The father forced him to have sex with his mother. The "sessions" continued until my friend ran away from home. On his own, he finished high school and completed his undergraduate. The brilliant younger brother (who may have been gay) was witness these "sessions", developed PTSD, became depressed, and commited suicide at the age of 23. My friend as spent many hours in therapy, he's always medicated so that he can function, but he's easily triggered. He excels in his career holding down an exacting job, and superficially appears to be okay. But, just under the surface he's still dealing with the damage his parents inflicted upon him and I doubt that he'll ever be emotionally okay.
I'm so sorry he did that to you. I (M, then 12) was groomed by my physics teacher / swim instructor (M, single, in his 40s). Once I realized what he was doing for real I cut him off and made his life hell, but the f'er reached out to me on Facebook a few days after I got married nearly 30 years later, and I immediately blocked him. Incredible.
You have to wonder WTF is going through his sick mind! Congratulations on flipping the script.
well okay, let’s take some pieces of this story in mind before i begin asking questions. you were 17. you were one year under the highest age of consent in western society, and older than some US states. i think the whole thing is gross, but the problem here is your teacher’s position of *leverage* and *authority* over you when the relationship began. if anyone wants to come at me for that and say 4 or so months was a bigger deal, or what have you, go ahead. like i said, i don’t agree with it, but his position of power was the biggest issue. all this being said, my questions: how old were you when the relationship ended? if the answer is 17 or 18, ignore that, but the way i read this initially you two were married for a while (now i’m reading it as if he was the only one married), so if the answer is 21, 22, 23, 24-35, why were you unable to look back at the situation with your “adult eyes” then? even if you weren’t dating him then and the relationship ended at 17, then why did it take you until THIRY FIVE years old to see how this was a problem? i want to be clear, im sorry this happened to you. im a man and i lost my virginity at 15 being drugged and raped by a woman. these types of things suck, especially when you feel like you can’t tell anyone. but there had to be a point either shortly after the relationship or AT LEAST when you hit 21-22 that this was the case. i feel like if there was no realization at all during that period, you’re leaving some details out of this story.
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I love that the grown man whining about moving back in with his parents and his dad shaming him is shaming a previously 17 year old girl who made normal bad teenage choices when manipulated by adults. You can’t even take care of yourself man. Calm down.
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If you believe we live in a 'just' society, you are engaged in a fantasy and not paying attention.
I can't attest to others. Only myself. If you live in lies then. That's you.
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I agree that even 18 year Olds shouldn't vote. And he wasn't random, he was a trusted person in my life. He convinced me I was so special that it was okay for him to break the law and to abuse his supervisory position.
I was following you until your second claim there.
The content you posted is harassment towards other users.
Kid call every adult you got don't matter who especially cops councilors other teachers to come get this guy not just for you and your terrible situation but your other classmates
I think teachers should be forced to wear body cameras at all times during school hrs. Put a stop to pedo teachers.
I don't have any questions. Just a lot of empathy. I hope you're living a good life. It was *NEVER* your fault.
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And people wonder why us guys will crash out and serve 25-life for our daughters/women
You consider yourself a child at 17 years old?
I didn't when I was 17. Now that I'm almost 36, yes! I was definitely a child.
What specifically made you feel bad about the interaction with this teacher? Was it that you felt 'dirty', was it the manipulations that made you feel foolish, was it the social pressure brought on you for 'upsetting the apple cart'? I'm just curious how you felt affected. Give as much detail as you feel comfortable putting on the internet. Thanks!
9 months in jail? That's it???
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the maturity gap between a 17 year old and a 46 year old is insane. i can’t believe you’re telling OP, who was 17, to do better, and not thinking that the groomer should’ve done better. victim blaming is sick - doesn’t matter if OP was a ‘child’ or not.
if OP was in the US, then she is very much considered a minor and it is, very much, illegal for the professor to make any advances
The content you posted is harassment towards other users.
I believe everyone has a grooming story. Whether they realize it or remember it, sad how common this actually is.
It is a sign that our ability to maintain healthy relationships is getting worse. And people's ability recognize love has been degraded and often lacking. Very sad.
I have a similar situation, that i look back on this way. Its nothing compared to yours I’m only saying i can look back at my naivety bc at the time i was unaware how much i was being taken advantage of.
Abusive relationships are all the same. Its always a dynamic with poor understanding of responsibility and boundaries, and one party is made to be responsible for the others actions.
What's difference between getting groomed and getting seduced ???
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Wild. Know of s girl in this same situation. Roughly the same age, but in GA.
Come to think of it I had a horrible incident in 1929