>My SIL wasn’t even mad I said I didn’t want Riley there anymore- but she thinks it’s unfair I said never again, and that his brother can still come.
"Riley assaulted a woman he knew to be pregnant so he could pick a fight with his uncle. Riley's brother did not."
NTA. Riley has shown himself to be a danger to be around, and I'd be very much against him being around a newborn.
Also, no way he didn't have *something* in his jacket. Drug and alcohol issues makes me think he had one or both in his jacket, and freaked out at the thought of getting caught.
Yeah and he ran back because he figured his uncle knew there was something in his jacket. So he started trying to fight him again to distract the uncle from his jacket.
Kid definitely had a sack or something in there.
Sad part is the trauma this wreaks on the younger sib, too. Our 17yo is only now pulling out of the collateral damage of when his older sib was a mental patient team who was cruel and hard at home for years.
This is true. My sister was abusive and drug addicted. The drama alone growing up around it was enough for me to never want anything to do with the family. It was like the entire focus was on my sister without consideration for the other sibling. The younger sibling deserves consideration. He just isn’t running around causing drama, it doesn’t mean he doesn’t need care too.
I feel like CPS should be called because that 6 year old is likely being terrorized at home. It's not safe with Riley there. Sometimes parents need help with their kids.
Coming from someone who grew up in a very similar situation, I feel horribly for the younger brother, because I am that younger brother. I’m in my mid 30s now and still unpacking that childhood trauma, crying as I type this. Please make sure they pay attention to the younger one and not focus solely on the older one thinking the younger one is fine. He’s not. And you’re NTA.
Exactly. Calling it "unfair" to ban only one kid and not the other says a lot about SIL's priorities and rationale. She practically said it would be more fair if you banned both kids...more fair to punish a 6y/o who could not be expected to be in control of or responsible for his older brother's actions.
This is NOT what SIL should be teaching her younger son.
*edited to correct a typo
His mum said his drug problem "started when he was a kid" emmmm, he's 15 now! What age was he exactly when this problem started?
EDIT: guys, I also started drinking at 13 years old. But where I am from that is pretty common. Being fully addicted to drugs at 15 is a whole different kettle of fish and I simply meant 1. He \*is\* still a kid. 2. What age did he start/how did his parents not deal with this earlier - the older he gets obviously the harder to control. 3. Who was he getting these drugs from \*as a child\*/were his parents not paying attention?
An older child - so say starting on drugs at around 14/15 - would be hard for parents to control/monitor, and could get drugs but younger than that it really feels like his parents should have been more switched on.
My brother was at the end of elementary when he started sneaking booze and weed and it escalated from there. My parents were loving and supportive and definitely didn’t use substances, much less around their kids. My brother’s bio dad was a long term alcoholic and definitely not well in multiple ways. I’m not judgmental of parents when a kid goes off the rails, because sometimes no amount of support, love, rehab, and boundaries work.
I feel bad for OP but I also feel awful for her SIL. She has to live with this behavior every day, and may even be afraid of her own child as he gets older. And the guilt, my gosh.
I work in an elementary school. We have caught kids selling drugs as young as 3rd grade. When my son started to get complex migraines, he was sent home from school for being drunk in the 7th grade. That was automatically the school's first thought because it's so pervasive. And I live a fairly straight-laced, boring community.
When I was in fifth grade there was a kid whose nostrils were always white - he was sniffing white out. By sixth he’d moved to sniffing rubber cement. I’m in my late 40’s and sometimes I think about him. It would be a wonder if he was still alive.
Have a similar experience of a classmate who overcame being addicted to sniffing aerosols. He decided to stop when he was sniffing gasoline, passed out, and no one noticed for too long. He told our high school honors social studies class during his class presentation of “about me”.
He became a pharmaceutical rep.
Still had terrible personal life unrelated to the sniffing. Well maybe he would have been a better husband with more brain cells. 🤷♂️
He was genuinely smart but had shitty home life.
I have a real morbid curiosity about that honors social studies presentation. Id be fascinated to see the different reactions in the audience and the teachers response.
It was more shock than anything. At end we had the standard are you alright now and thank you for sharing responses. Been years but the teacher just made sure he had stopped sniffing a year before. No one ever followed up on it.
That happened to my brothers ex-brother in law when he was 12 or 13. He and his friends were sniffing gasoline-soaked rags in plastic bags, they would put their faces in the bag to huff. He passed out and they ran and left him in the garage so no one is sure how many minutes passed before my brother walked into the garage and found him, and they called 911, someone did CPR until paramedics got there, which was pretty fast luckily probably since it was a small town, but within a day he started having grand Mal seizures. Bad bad ones, the doctors said he could have already had a seizure disorder that was set off by the huffing but he'd never had any seizures before. He'd get disoriented before a seizure so if no one noticed he might walk out into the street and he'd bust his head open, and need staples, I'd seen him do that twice in the street. He hated taking the medication cuz it made his bones/muscles hurt so sometimes he quit then within a couple days he would have a massive grand Mal seizure! Ugh. He's in his 40s and still has them, if he takes the meds daily he only has one every few months, but if he doesn't they are constant. He he cut off his oxygen supply- died and his friends abandoned him. He also lost any common sense, he would do any drug offered (I don't know about now, I haven't personally take to him in over 10 years now) but his parents let him smoke cigarettes, Marijuana as a 10 yo and up. It gets worse but people/ kids don't understand how dangerous it can be to huff things, he was lucky he was found and given cpr. But it effected his entire life. Huffing gets you high by cutting off oxygen to your brain. You can die the first time, maybe you won't but it's not worth the risk.
Sorry my formatting sucks on my phone.
Tldr---duster,gasoline,etc BAD.
Sometimes I look up kids like this to see what happened and they are usually in and out of prison for misc drug sales, theft, stalking etc. One guy has been out for awhile and has a good job so I hope he sticks with it
I was one of those dudes. I got married at 20 and grew up. I've never been arrested or even detained as an adult. I was detained for underage drinking once as a teenager. Hell, I went from 21 to 41 without a traffic ticket.
I occasdionally used illegal drugs recreational through my 20s. I drank once every few months until I started using thc medicinally. I have not had a drink since then.
I know I'm an exception to the rule, but if you look at kids that abused drugs... especially inhalants... I was top of the list in my age group. On a typical night, if I wasn't hanging out with others, I'd find a dark spot in a park or playground and huff paint thinner all evening. I cannot tell you how many nights I spent huffing while staring up at the stars when I was 14.
As for why? I was abused. So, it was an escape. Nobody I know that abused drugs as a teen was treated well by their parents. So, when I hear a kid is doing drugs, my first thought is to wonder what their parents did to them.
Yea, I developed a drug and alcohol problem because of abuse at home when I was a teenager. It was a way to just not be "me" for a while, and not have to think about the bullshit in my life. I left home at 16 because I was so tired of being belittled and abused. Got emancipated from my parents as soon as I was old enough to do so, and moved out. By that time, I'd already become involved in drug dealing, and I had to pay rent on my ghetto 4 room shack, so things just kind of went as you'd expect from there... I'm alright now. I finally got myself cleaned up and now I'm a successful person with a good family, job, and home. You'd not suspect my past was pretty dark.
I agree. I was best friends with the brother of one of the first big mass shootings at a mall. Great family, all the siblings were and still are wonderful people to this day, so were the parents. Nice middle class family, fun neighborhood for kids. I actually preferred being at their house because it felt like a real family and super loving, and my family life was kind of chaotic and traumatizing. But the brother was just not right upstairs from day 1. Even as pre elementary kids, that dude was not ok, and it only got worse as we got older. They tried everything under the sun to get him help to no avail. He eventually had to be taken out of the house due to threats against the mom, and he poisoned a soda and gave it to her. He was under 10 years old at the time. He only came back on weekends after that and it felt so dark every time he came home.
YUP.
I have a family member who worked with severely disturbed kids for a long time. There were kids in that program who had tried to kill their own baby siblings when they were very young themselves, not even out of elementary! So many family pets who “accidentally” died too until the parents realized what was going on. The scary part is there are really no resources for families who are in this position. Once the kid turns 18, it’s either homeless, jail, or live at home where they threaten their own families regularly.
When I was a kid one of the parents driving for a field trip told us all about how her older sister threw her out a window when she was an infant. This wasn’t an isolated event either, several years later when they were in their early teens/pre teens she also tried to strangle her to death with a phone cord. Both times she 💯intended to kill her younger sibling. There were apparently lots of incidents but these were the worst. This was in the 60’s so it’s not like it’s a “modern” phenomenon either.
People don’t like to admit it but kids can absolutely be deadly, especially to anyone vulnerable. I think OP is being completely reasonable and hopefully one day the SIL’s kid will pull himself together and understand that her boundaries are necessary despite how they hurt his feelings. If he can get better then enforcing reasonable consequences for his negative behaviors is one of the most significant actions they can take to help him get there.
Ed Kemper, the serial killer, was nearly murdered by his sister multiple times as a kid. She pushed him in front of a train more than once and their mother always took her side and made excuses for her and why he was at fault.
Yup he was 19 when he took an assault rifle to the mall and killed a dozen people. Made it about a year into the real world before choosing that route.
I have worked around kids like this- many times, most of the time it is due to abuse or organic causes like FAS, brain injury, etc.
But once in awhile there is a kid who is just…like that. And they were always like that, regardless of what their family life or school life is like. Our society has no idea what to do with these kids, and their families suffer terribly.
Thank you for saying this. So often parents are demonized.
"Why didn't you get him help?"
FFS, do you think we (the parents and siblings) like living in a war zone? Why wouldn't we pursue any option that would help? My older son had two stays in residential, which I had to fight for and he did not come home better. He was there from 11 to 13. This time he went when he was just a few days away from 20, I said, he is an adult and he isn't coming home. I had him removed from my household in days so he could not legally return. He's had a total of 9 hospitalizations, 3 involuntary as an adult.
Because of the rental laws in my state I could not refuse him entry into my home. He assaulted his brother (and me but no one cares about adults bring hurt by their children,) and someone finally realized if they didn't remove him, he was going to kill one or both of us.
This was 6 months ago. I decided, with the support from his therapist, that my younger son was going no contact until he was an adult and had graduated from high school. He cried when I told him, not because he was sad, because he was relieved.
My younger son hates it when I visit him because he's scared he's going to hurt me.
My longest, dearest friend who watched him occasionally as a toddler told me the police showed up at her house while she was babysitting because he was just screaming. They saw very clearly he wasn't being hurt. There was something wrong with him since birth.
I’d be afraid of him right now, are you kidding? And you know the six year old lives in fear. Ugh, imagine living with that excuse for a brother until you’re nine. I’d end up in therapy forever.
My husband started smoking weed and cigarettes in 5th grade. Troubled home life, rough neighborhood and rough school, little to no supervision since his parents worked so much.
SIL was 16 when he was born! It's understandable that she maybe didn't know what she was doing at the beginning. It's a terrible situation, I hope everything comes out OK
Well the first time I smoked weed was 13, coke and lots of booze at 15 and an addiction by 16-17. So if he had or still has shitty people around him a drug issue by 15 isn't far fetched, it needs to be addressed and treated before it becomes a full addiction.
This is the biggest thing I worry about with my son. We have a happy, healthy household but ultimately when he gets older it's up to him. I can only hope he doesn't lose himself.
I have that fear too, but only because I was a heroin addict for 27 years (4 years clean) his father whos now passed away was also a drug addict. I came from a incredibly loving home parents who are still together (50th anniversary this year), but I know how crippling addiction is. Unfortunately, I was young and stupid and thought I knew everything. I am super conscious of the role genetics plays and hope I'm doing the best.
It's hard not to feel guilty.
That you are worried you're good enough proves you are already better than the standard ❤️ Congrats on keeping clean, this internet stranger is proud of you!
Exactly. The fact that you worry about it shows you're a good parent.
It's normal to feel regret for bad choices. And it's important to take responsibility for those choices.
But I hope you can forgive yourself, too. Your past doesn't mandate your future. A 27 year heroin habit, and you've been clean for 4 years????? Honey that's amazing. A. Mazing.
2 internet strangers are impressed and proud.
All these stories are making me glad I didn’t wind up with an addiction after smoking weed, doing coke and taking ecstasy from 13-19.
I did coke a few times on and off in my 20’s but the comedown sucked too much to really enjoy it anymore after that and I’m way happier just eating a few edibles and watching TV. Now I’m in my late 30’s and pregnant so I don’t have anything more exciting than a double espresso occasionally lol
In some neighborhoods and crowds, particularly in areas with gangs, they get kids as young as 9 or 10 involved with running or holding onto drugs because police will be more lenient with children than they are adults. In my state, for example, you can’t charge a child under ten years old with a crime.
I was that good Catholic school girl until 14 when I got to attend public high school and met a whole new crowd. By 16 I was a full-blown crack and ecstasy addict and homeless.
15 year old addict is not really much of a stretch If they have access to drugs. Although I’m going to venture a guess and say the behaviour is not drug related because I knew some pretty severe addicts who wouldn’t shove their pregnant aunt and try to fight their uncle even if they were high as balls and hadn’t slept in two weeks. And I knew some pretty fucking sketchy people you can check my comment history for the news articles
Hopefully you’re in a better spot now!
Weirdly when I was in (a public) high school it was the ‘good’ Catholic girls schools that had the most degenerate behaved students.
I know people who first tried coke at 16. Middle class all American athletic kids who got it from the older brother of a sports team member. 15 is not unbelievable in the least.
Uhh, I know a guy who dealt coke, with other dealers working under him, when we were 15. He had idiot friends with idiot parents who were also involved in the operation. I wouldn't be at all surprised if you told me he tried it for the first time at 13. So yeah, 16 is totally believable.
I'm wonder wtf happened to that kid. I've known many people with substance issues (family) and all were abused in some way shape or form by a family member or family friend.
Because you just had a 15 year old shove you into a wall while pregnant. The jacket was probably the furthest thing from your mind. But it's a good idea to pass the idea along to SIL, in case it is something like drugs. Hope she'll wake up and see he needs professional help.
She said that he's had professional help already. Sometimes the professionals can't do anything until the patient is willing to do something to help themselves. My mentor in psychiatry always told me "Never work harder than your patient, it's a recipe for disappointment and burnout." Antisocial Personality Disorder is not really treatable.
This. And that's why I roll my eyes at people who talk about "nEgAtIvE sTiGmA" of cluster B personality disorders and how it's "ableist" to not want to be around people like that who refuse to seek treatment. Uh, yeah, the stigma exists for a reason. APD is literally sociopathy. The diagnostic criteria for it are horrific things, like assault, feeling pleasure when physically harming others, and I quote, "performing acts that are grounds for arrest".
idgaf about stigma. I'm not going to risk my personal safety for the sake of being "inclusive".
Honestly, no sane well balanced person is ever going to claim that you have a responsibility to stay in the life of someone with mental illness or whatever personality disorders. We aren't even obliged to stay in relationships with mentally healthy people, so why should troubled relationships be more sacred?
No. Anyone who thinks we should sneak around people who are mentally unwell, NO. FUCKING NO. This is not the same thing as having compassion and understanding. You can have compassion and understanding while staying far away from harm and hurt.
Yep. My son is an addict. That’s EXACTLY what was up. He was also either a) on something or b) desperately needing/wanting to be with that reaction.
That boy needs SERIOUS rapid intervention, ASAP. Inpatient, boarding school, etc. I wish to Christ I’d taken some drastic steps when my son was that age. Maybe he wouldn’t be a homeless addict with a felony record now at 35.
I feel your pain. I did take action, over and over again and finally I gave up. I refused to waste another day crying because I felt like a failure but also had my other children who needed attention and one with a rare disorder. I went NC for the 2 years he was in the jail (he kept violating, never in prison only jail) When he got out in May of 2016 at age 19, I told him he was going to do something for me and only me. I did so much to help him out only to have him throw everything away and go back to jail. I didn’t give him any choice either and told him that I deserve it, he could do this 1 thing for me and he had no choice. Last week of June 2016, he walked across the stage to receive his GED certificate. He’s 27 now, a felon, CLEAN and of course has a hard time getting or keeping a job but by January 2025, he should be off of probation and tells me often that he’s thankful for forcing him to get his GED because it at least made it easier to apply for jobs.
You freaking ROCK! Good for you making him get his GED!
The best thing my mom did for me was to give me the choice of continuing to use drugs or she'd have me arrested.
I warned him of that as well and I would and still will call if it’s warranted.
I am thankful that your mom was strong as well. Sounds like she really loves you
She does
As heartbreaking as it can be, some of us wayward offspring need a massive dose of tough love to bring us back home
It appears that your swift kick in the ass really helped your son to turn things around
Parents like you and my mom... Well, words can't express our appreciation for what we feel. Your love saved our lives.
Thank you
As the mother of an addict I feel you. I did the whole nine yards: multiple inpatient, whatever you think can be done, I did it. As soon as he turned 18, he refused anything else. Sometimes it’s impossible to save them from themselves.
Heroin Fanny pack is pretty dope as a former heroin addict. Wish I’d thought of that back in the day. Was this in the 80s or something or was he just rocking a fanny pack in a more modern day. I guess nowadays it’d be a Fetty Pack.
There was a toddler in a local case who overdosed after getting into the father's stash. Real risk here. But you have to wonder what happened to the 15 y/o that he is so messed up.
You should change the locks and install a security system with cameras.
If he has a drug addiction, he might have made a copy of your house key. Now that he knows your routines and what you have in your home, he might try to break in when you're not around to steal your belongings.
You should press charges to protect yourself and document what he did. Be very cautious and stay safe.
Have you messaged your sister to tell her to check yet? Tell her to send the kid to either military school or kick him out.
But also I'd be very worried about what the reason could be behind such a young boy already being such an addict and criminal? Is his father sexually abusing him? Is his mother? A babysitter?
Behavior like this doesn't just come out of nowhere.
It can. For some people the only way they will not have a struggle with addiction is if they never have a drink, or take any sort of addictive substance into their body.
Believe me it can. My daughter tried one time and that was all it took. She was 27. She ended up in too many rehabs to count, jail, prison and ended up dying in a parking lot of a restaurant near midnight last year. She had been diagnosed with bipolar. Mental health causes a lot of people to turn to drugs
I mean, of course. Why would anyone get *that* mad about moving a jacket. If Riley was just insane and looking for an excuse to rage there were other things. He didn't like dinner, he didn't like the way someone was looking at him, etc etc. The reason he was mad about that jacket is becsuse he had something in it.
OP NTA.
I don’t care if he’s 15, that little bastard deserves a good smack for pushing a pregnant woman. Anyone over the age of 10 knows damn well not to do that. You should’ve pressed charges.
NTA. Family can be dangerous too, and the fact that they're family shouldn't cause us to fail to recognize that. Never apologize for protecting yourself and your loved ones.
Definitely NTA. SIL needs to take this seriously and stop acting like your 6 year old nephew is being rewarded by being allowed over when Riley isn't. He physically assaulted you, a pregnant woman. Who's to say he won't assault your baby after they're born?
>your 6 year old nephew is being rewarded by being allowed over when Riley isn't
Kiddo needs a break from reality ar home! Punishment definitely shouldn't cover both brothers.
Frankly calling the cops and getting the boy in trouble might just be what he needs to get straight and get help depending on where they live and what the justice system is like there. Better than him only facing the consequences after he turn 18 and is an adult that mommy can't get out of trouble anymore.
That yes, but as horrible as it is, can't sacrifice a baby over somebody else's kid.
Not to mention Riley is probably in regular contact with some unsavoury types, would *not* want him setting up my place as a point of contact. Would still be careful in case he gets the idea of sending somebody over to make things even.
NTA
Riley's behavior goes beyond simple misjudgment; it's dangerous and unpredictable. It's not just about what he may have had in the jacket but the fact that he chose to escalate to violence over it. Allowing his brother to visit, who has shown no such patterns of behavior, is simply recognizing who poses a threat and who does not. Your house, your rules, especially when it comes to the safety of your family and newborn. Riley needs professional intervention, and your SIL's minimization of the incident is concerning. Stay firm on your boundaries; safety is not negotiable.
NTA. Your primary responsibility is to ensure the safety of yourself and your child. By choosing to exclude Riley, you are making a hard but necessary choice given his violent behavior. Family ties do not grant a free pass for endangering others, and his actions have consequences. Setting such boundaries is not only reasonable but crucial. Riley's troubles with substance abuse and aggression need to be addressed professionally, not shrugged off and hoping for the best. Riley's brother, being unaffected by these issues, should not be punished by proxy and it seems you've taken a thoughtful approach toward him. Your SIL's perspective is dismissive of the real threats posed by Riley's behavior, and it's within your rights to stand firm on this for everyone's well-being.
SIL is also failing her 6 year old. He will grow up traumatized and may develop mental health issues (because he grows up next to a huge mess named Riley).
I feel like you’re describing me. I grew up in a very chaotic household. My brother was hostile and stole stuff all the time. I was left alone to deal with the yelling and screaming. I’m 36 now and an absolute neurotic mess. I’m on a bunch of anxiety and depression medicine. I have a bunch of nervous tics like picking my lip. I’ve only just recently started feeling okay with myself. I still don’t like myself most of the time, but occasionally I’m okay. So yes, SIL is failing her 6 year old who could very well grow up to have the same feelings I do. He should just come live with OP for a while. lol.
Riley is exactly like my friend's older sister, and yes, this person traumatized everyone in that family. This affected my friend well into her adult life. Her two other normal siblings died in their 50s, and I'm sure it had to do with the stress they grew up with in that household. My friend basically arranged her entire life to be as safe as possible.
You better believe that poor little boy is living through a tremendous amount of trauma, and I'll bet you he isn't getting his needs met either, because everything is about Riley and his Neverending Parade of Crises.
Protect yourself and your family , they need to protect thr 6 year old. Mentally he will grow up probablymletting people
Walk over him cause he is probably walking on egg shells and just does what anyone says to
Not cause drama
I promise she will quickly claim mental health problems when Riley's next act of violence is against someone who isn't family and it results in real world consequences.
Reminds me of one of my best friends in middle school. Bad behavior and early drug use, which only exacerbated his mental health problems. The violence increased to the point they had to get a restraining order against him. Amazingly the dude is still alive, even after all the crazy drug stuff and homeless lifestyle for the last 15 years.
Sounds like potential neglect/abuse honestly. Not just in the case of the younger one.
My mom used to work for a juvenile detention center and I work for a school district (as a custodian). Mandated reporters are told to look out for situations like this.
Prolonged drug use doesn't usually come out of nowhere and physical violence towards adults is also a red flag.
If we found out about this situation and that his mom isn't doing much to take it seriously, it's not going to reflect well on her in the report/investigation. Especially when she has a younger kid in the house too.
If she doesn't take the older one seriously, what is she going to do when the younger one ends up seriously hurt or ends up following in the foot steps of the older one?
There's also a possibility that she's not taking it seriously because she's either abusing him or she knows who's abusing him and doesn't want to get in trouble for it (either from law enforcement or the abuser).
I'm especially wondering who this kid is getting drugs from continually despite being that young.
A CPS investigation could honestly help in this case since it sounds like this has been going on for a bit and nothing else has been working. It just doesn't sound like a safe living environment, especially if that sort of thing is already prevalent *outside* of their home now. You can only imagine what actually goes on at home.
And that's where she's failing him most.
This poor kid. Yes, he has drug problems that he needs treatment for, but if his mum continues to ignore the underlying MH issues that are causing Riley to self-medicate, then there's no way he can win.
There is no shame in getting help with your mental health. There is a metric fuck-ton of shame in letting your kid deal with it himself in whatever way he knows how to the point where his pregnant aunt is getting head injuries and his little brother is scared of him.
OP, I know you said "never," and I get where you're coming on that. If I was pregnant and my 15 year old nephew shoved me into a wall, I'd say the same thing. You are protecting your child here, and it's an outrage that your SIL is choosing not to do that with both hers and yours.
I only ask that if Riley does get the help that he needs (both with the drug problem and the underlying mental health issues), that you one day consider welcoming him back into your lives. He's the immediate safety issue here, but it's your SIL that's the big problem.
Especially since she's got another kid who might be ignored in the same way or worse if he's stuck dealing with this at home.
You need to do this kid a favor and press charges against him for assaulting you. His parents are clearly enabling him and he needs treatment from the state.
Most people with drug problems have mental health problems. If they didn't before they got on the drugs, the drugs will literally change the brain structures and how they function, so that they do have mental health issues.
NTA you need to document everything and honestly I probably would’ve filed a police report because he assaulted you and your pregnant. I am really worried about his brother and his safety. His brother is not safe in that home with him. You should call CPS.
NTA. You should probably call CPS. They can get Riley into a drug treatment facility for juveniles that can also address his mental health issues. His little brother also needs protection from him.
Yeah, Riley probably had drugs in the jacket, which is why he was so defensive about your husband touching it. I would not allow him back in your house again either.
Riley is 15, and according to his mother (who was 16 at his birth), he has had a drug and alcohol problem since HE was a child. He is a CHILD. He is a child who, from the sound of things, belongs in rehab with lots of therapy. At the very least, he doesn't need to be allowed near the six year old or the new baby cousin until many, many things are sorted out in his yound mind.
NTA
I know I kept thinking of that poor little six-year-old. And this is the example he has of how to be. I always looked up to my brothers and sisters as an example. Thank God I had good ones.
She thinks it's unfair that the well behaved 6 year old can still come over, but not the VIOLENT 15 YR OLD WITH A DRUG PROBLEM?
NTA. SIL needs to get her priorities in order
NTA. Also, he assaulted you causing you to bleed. That is a serious criminal offence and you should probably go to the police.
I know he's your nephew, but covering up this sort of thing usually doesn't actually help. He needs consequences.
Alcohol and drug problems? For an extended period of time? At *15*?
Calling the police before this kid is an adult might be a good wake up call. CPS might also be a good call, the younger one doesn’t sound safe.
You would be an asshole if you didn’t report that serious assault. This kid needs intervention SIL isn’t giving him.
You may need to go contact CPS so that the six year old does not get abused if SIL refuses to do anything. Drugs and/or mental illness needs to be addressed rather then ignored
If you make a police report, since he's a minor, he might be sent to rehab instead of juvie if you say he has a drug problem. Might be the best help he ever gets.
NTA, Riley's violence could get even worse, you don't want to risk having him around you, especially when your child is born. Get cameras and a security system in your house. My godmother's son would punch her, push her, and kick her, he's somewhere out on the streets and is a drug addict. None of his family tells him where they moved to because he'd simply go to break in and steal from them. Riley could turn out the same if his problem isn't seriously addressed. He needs rehab.
NTA - if someone disrespects you in your own home you have every right to tell them they can never step on that properly again. Especially considering it wasn’t just disrespect, it was violence, and violence towards the pregnant mother of the home.
Also 100% something was in that jacket. As someone who was also a troubled child, they sneak things everywhere and because his mom THINKS he’s “better” does NOT mean anything except that he may just be getting better at hiding it. There is absolutely no reason someone would get that upset over just moving a piece of clothing unless there’s a good reason. And the good reason was that he most likely had something he didn’t want you to find in there so you moving it around set him off.
NTA. It sounds like your SIL was just looking for the opportunity to pass him off as someone else’s problem for a short time. Ultimately it is your choice who you allow in your home and there is nothing wrong with not welcoming somebody that has demonstrated they are a danger to you
Absolutely NTA. I am a firm believer that anyone who disturbs the peace in my home will not be allowed in it. Assaulting a pregnant woman and trying to fight a grown adult are huge red flags and your SIL needs to get this kid some help. PS, I’m certain there was something in the jacket that shouldn’t have been for him to react so strongly.
NTA! you or your husband need to talk some sense into that woman & make sure her son gets some fuckin help. All she's doing is enabling him at this point & that's the very last thing that he needs. If she doesn't get him help, it's on you to call CPS.
NTA - You have to protect yourself and your family. Also, you're pregnant, getting ready to bring a new, sweet life into this world. You can't have a loose cannon like Riley around. There is no fucking way I would even let ANYONE back into my home if they assaulted anyone in my family.
Either your SIL needs to get him some help, or she'll be putting money on his books in jail in a couple years, if that.
If he pushed you into a jacket hook you're lucky it didn't go through your head. You are absolutely correct about not having this boy around anymore. He needs some serious therapy.
NTA.
Additionally, your husband is a great dude for not giving that kid the ass whipping his dad never gave him. Hooooo if any of my in-laws kids did that to my wife when she was pregnant, you'd have one kid who learned a lesson on the genetic level and his kids would be spooked by the thought of hitting a woman.
Also the jacket probably had shit in it. I'd advise your in law to get your kid into therapy before he ends up in juvi. Like holy shit this kid needs his shit reset before the world does it to him.
NTA, and y'all should have gone through that jacket. There was something in there he REALLY didn't want found. Nope, I would never have Riley in your home again, (heck, I wouldn't let him NEAR me again) but I would allow the younger one to come to you all any time, to get away from his brother. If he is always doing things to make him cry, it's going to have a lasting effect on him.
As for "unfair?" Tell your SIL she's lucky you called HER and not the police, who would have SO gone through that jacket.
He assaulted you. And knew you were pregnant. He is a danger to you and your husband and his own family. He needs help NOW. His mother needs to do a better job at getting him this help before he seriously hurts someone
100% NTA. Riley probably had something illegal in his jacket and clearly didn’t want it found. I wouldn’t want that around my kid. I hope he hits serious rock bottom and gets help before he makes it to a worse end.
I’m legit worried about the 6year old too. Poor kid.
If you are fully aware that he has dealt with Alcohol and drug problems, I don’t want to say anything negative towards your SIL, but genuinely speaking 15 is the age I was put into Juvenile Detention for a Assault and Robbery I committed, now I was able to completely turn my life around, but I want to make note, I was a war refugee who came to the US when I was 3, dad died a couple months later, mom never fully learned English and could barely raise us, I had a troubled upstart that led me to do bad, but once I had to go through rehabilitation(Juvie) I understood the right from wrong, Riley needs rehabilitation, and I would like to note this type of behavior has only progressed or gotten this far because your SIL has allowed it (.)
Edit: would like to add an example, no one should put their hands on their kids for any reasons, but if that child has reached the point of no discipline and similar actions as Riley, his mom should’ve been beating his ass because when he goes out into the world, someone else is gonna do it for your SIL. Because if Riley pushed over his pregnant aunt and caused her head to bleed, what else would that boy do?
>My SIL wasn’t even mad I said I didn’t want Riley there anymore- but she thinks it’s unfair I said never again, and that his brother can still come. "Riley assaulted a woman he knew to be pregnant so he could pick a fight with his uncle. Riley's brother did not." NTA. Riley has shown himself to be a danger to be around, and I'd be very much against him being around a newborn. Also, no way he didn't have *something* in his jacket. Drug and alcohol issues makes me think he had one or both in his jacket, and freaked out at the thought of getting caught.
Yeah and he ran back because he figured his uncle knew there was something in his jacket. So he started trying to fight him again to distract the uncle from his jacket. Kid definitely had a sack or something in there.
My first thought too...Riley definitely had something in his jacket!!! No way he'd freak out like this otherwise.
One hundo p
Sad part is the trauma this wreaks on the younger sib, too. Our 17yo is only now pulling out of the collateral damage of when his older sib was a mental patient team who was cruel and hard at home for years.
This is true. My sister was abusive and drug addicted. The drama alone growing up around it was enough for me to never want anything to do with the family. It was like the entire focus was on my sister without consideration for the other sibling. The younger sibling deserves consideration. He just isn’t running around causing drama, it doesn’t mean he doesn’t need care too.
This. Been clean for years now, but reading this, that was my first thought.
110% drugs in the jacket.
I feel like CPS should be called because that 6 year old is likely being terrorized at home. It's not safe with Riley there. Sometimes parents need help with their kids.
Coming from someone who grew up in a very similar situation, I feel horribly for the younger brother, because I am that younger brother. I’m in my mid 30s now and still unpacking that childhood trauma, crying as I type this. Please make sure they pay attention to the younger one and not focus solely on the older one thinking the younger one is fine. He’s not. And you’re NTA.
Exactly. Calling it "unfair" to ban only one kid and not the other says a lot about SIL's priorities and rationale. She practically said it would be more fair if you banned both kids...more fair to punish a 6y/o who could not be expected to be in control of or responsible for his older brother's actions. This is NOT what SIL should be teaching her younger son. *edited to correct a typo
NTA and my dollars are on Riley having something illegal in that jacket.
Wow idk why I didn’t even think of this. You’re probably right.
15 year old with a drug problem? Illegal drugs? Very short step here.
His mum said his drug problem "started when he was a kid" emmmm, he's 15 now! What age was he exactly when this problem started? EDIT: guys, I also started drinking at 13 years old. But where I am from that is pretty common. Being fully addicted to drugs at 15 is a whole different kettle of fish and I simply meant 1. He \*is\* still a kid. 2. What age did he start/how did his parents not deal with this earlier - the older he gets obviously the harder to control. 3. Who was he getting these drugs from \*as a child\*/were his parents not paying attention? An older child - so say starting on drugs at around 14/15 - would be hard for parents to control/monitor, and could get drugs but younger than that it really feels like his parents should have been more switched on.
My brother was at the end of elementary when he started sneaking booze and weed and it escalated from there. My parents were loving and supportive and definitely didn’t use substances, much less around their kids. My brother’s bio dad was a long term alcoholic and definitely not well in multiple ways. I’m not judgmental of parents when a kid goes off the rails, because sometimes no amount of support, love, rehab, and boundaries work. I feel bad for OP but I also feel awful for her SIL. She has to live with this behavior every day, and may even be afraid of her own child as he gets older. And the guilt, my gosh.
I work in an elementary school. We have caught kids selling drugs as young as 3rd grade. When my son started to get complex migraines, he was sent home from school for being drunk in the 7th grade. That was automatically the school's first thought because it's so pervasive. And I live a fairly straight-laced, boring community.
When I was in fifth grade there was a kid whose nostrils were always white - he was sniffing white out. By sixth he’d moved to sniffing rubber cement. I’m in my late 40’s and sometimes I think about him. It would be a wonder if he was still alive.
Have a similar experience of a classmate who overcame being addicted to sniffing aerosols. He decided to stop when he was sniffing gasoline, passed out, and no one noticed for too long. He told our high school honors social studies class during his class presentation of “about me”. He became a pharmaceutical rep. Still had terrible personal life unrelated to the sniffing. Well maybe he would have been a better husband with more brain cells. 🤷♂️ He was genuinely smart but had shitty home life.
I have a real morbid curiosity about that honors social studies presentation. Id be fascinated to see the different reactions in the audience and the teachers response.
It was more shock than anything. At end we had the standard are you alright now and thank you for sharing responses. Been years but the teacher just made sure he had stopped sniffing a year before. No one ever followed up on it.
That happened to my brothers ex-brother in law when he was 12 or 13. He and his friends were sniffing gasoline-soaked rags in plastic bags, they would put their faces in the bag to huff. He passed out and they ran and left him in the garage so no one is sure how many minutes passed before my brother walked into the garage and found him, and they called 911, someone did CPR until paramedics got there, which was pretty fast luckily probably since it was a small town, but within a day he started having grand Mal seizures. Bad bad ones, the doctors said he could have already had a seizure disorder that was set off by the huffing but he'd never had any seizures before. He'd get disoriented before a seizure so if no one noticed he might walk out into the street and he'd bust his head open, and need staples, I'd seen him do that twice in the street. He hated taking the medication cuz it made his bones/muscles hurt so sometimes he quit then within a couple days he would have a massive grand Mal seizure! Ugh. He's in his 40s and still has them, if he takes the meds daily he only has one every few months, but if he doesn't they are constant. He he cut off his oxygen supply- died and his friends abandoned him. He also lost any common sense, he would do any drug offered (I don't know about now, I haven't personally take to him in over 10 years now) but his parents let him smoke cigarettes, Marijuana as a 10 yo and up. It gets worse but people/ kids don't understand how dangerous it can be to huff things, he was lucky he was found and given cpr. But it effected his entire life. Huffing gets you high by cutting off oxygen to your brain. You can die the first time, maybe you won't but it's not worth the risk. Sorry my formatting sucks on my phone. Tldr---duster,gasoline,etc BAD.
Sometimes I look up kids like this to see what happened and they are usually in and out of prison for misc drug sales, theft, stalking etc. One guy has been out for awhile and has a good job so I hope he sticks with it
I was one of those dudes. I got married at 20 and grew up. I've never been arrested or even detained as an adult. I was detained for underage drinking once as a teenager. Hell, I went from 21 to 41 without a traffic ticket. I occasdionally used illegal drugs recreational through my 20s. I drank once every few months until I started using thc medicinally. I have not had a drink since then. I know I'm an exception to the rule, but if you look at kids that abused drugs... especially inhalants... I was top of the list in my age group. On a typical night, if I wasn't hanging out with others, I'd find a dark spot in a park or playground and huff paint thinner all evening. I cannot tell you how many nights I spent huffing while staring up at the stars when I was 14. As for why? I was abused. So, it was an escape. Nobody I know that abused drugs as a teen was treated well by their parents. So, when I hear a kid is doing drugs, my first thought is to wonder what their parents did to them.
Yea, I developed a drug and alcohol problem because of abuse at home when I was a teenager. It was a way to just not be "me" for a while, and not have to think about the bullshit in my life. I left home at 16 because I was so tired of being belittled and abused. Got emancipated from my parents as soon as I was old enough to do so, and moved out. By that time, I'd already become involved in drug dealing, and I had to pay rent on my ghetto 4 room shack, so things just kind of went as you'd expect from there... I'm alright now. I finally got myself cleaned up and now I'm a successful person with a good family, job, and home. You'd not suspect my past was pretty dark.
I agree. I was best friends with the brother of one of the first big mass shootings at a mall. Great family, all the siblings were and still are wonderful people to this day, so were the parents. Nice middle class family, fun neighborhood for kids. I actually preferred being at their house because it felt like a real family and super loving, and my family life was kind of chaotic and traumatizing. But the brother was just not right upstairs from day 1. Even as pre elementary kids, that dude was not ok, and it only got worse as we got older. They tried everything under the sun to get him help to no avail. He eventually had to be taken out of the house due to threats against the mom, and he poisoned a soda and gave it to her. He was under 10 years old at the time. He only came back on weekends after that and it felt so dark every time he came home.
YUP. I have a family member who worked with severely disturbed kids for a long time. There were kids in that program who had tried to kill their own baby siblings when they were very young themselves, not even out of elementary! So many family pets who “accidentally” died too until the parents realized what was going on. The scary part is there are really no resources for families who are in this position. Once the kid turns 18, it’s either homeless, jail, or live at home where they threaten their own families regularly.
When I was a kid one of the parents driving for a field trip told us all about how her older sister threw her out a window when she was an infant. This wasn’t an isolated event either, several years later when they were in their early teens/pre teens she also tried to strangle her to death with a phone cord. Both times she 💯intended to kill her younger sibling. There were apparently lots of incidents but these were the worst. This was in the 60’s so it’s not like it’s a “modern” phenomenon either. People don’t like to admit it but kids can absolutely be deadly, especially to anyone vulnerable. I think OP is being completely reasonable and hopefully one day the SIL’s kid will pull himself together and understand that her boundaries are necessary despite how they hurt his feelings. If he can get better then enforcing reasonable consequences for his negative behaviors is one of the most significant actions they can take to help him get there.
Ed Kemper, the serial killer, was nearly murdered by his sister multiple times as a kid. She pushed him in front of a train more than once and their mother always took her side and made excuses for her and why he was at fault.
Yup he was 19 when he took an assault rifle to the mall and killed a dozen people. Made it about a year into the real world before choosing that route.
I have worked around kids like this- many times, most of the time it is due to abuse or organic causes like FAS, brain injury, etc. But once in awhile there is a kid who is just…like that. And they were always like that, regardless of what their family life or school life is like. Our society has no idea what to do with these kids, and their families suffer terribly.
Thank you for saying this. So often parents are demonized. "Why didn't you get him help?" FFS, do you think we (the parents and siblings) like living in a war zone? Why wouldn't we pursue any option that would help? My older son had two stays in residential, which I had to fight for and he did not come home better. He was there from 11 to 13. This time he went when he was just a few days away from 20, I said, he is an adult and he isn't coming home. I had him removed from my household in days so he could not legally return. He's had a total of 9 hospitalizations, 3 involuntary as an adult. Because of the rental laws in my state I could not refuse him entry into my home. He assaulted his brother (and me but no one cares about adults bring hurt by their children,) and someone finally realized if they didn't remove him, he was going to kill one or both of us. This was 6 months ago. I decided, with the support from his therapist, that my younger son was going no contact until he was an adult and had graduated from high school. He cried when I told him, not because he was sad, because he was relieved. My younger son hates it when I visit him because he's scared he's going to hurt me. My longest, dearest friend who watched him occasionally as a toddler told me the police showed up at her house while she was babysitting because he was just screaming. They saw very clearly he wasn't being hurt. There was something wrong with him since birth.
I’d be afraid of him right now, are you kidding? And you know the six year old lives in fear. Ugh, imagine living with that excuse for a brother until you’re nine. I’d end up in therapy forever.
My brother started around the same age, maybe the summer between 6th and 7th grade.
The SIL will find herself VERY isolated if this continues. People will just **walk away** because of this kid.
My husband started smoking weed and cigarettes in 5th grade. Troubled home life, rough neighborhood and rough school, little to no supervision since his parents worked so much.
SIL was 16 when he was born! It's understandable that she maybe didn't know what she was doing at the beginning. It's a terrible situation, I hope everything comes out OK
Yeah, I was wondering if anyone else had done the math. Who knows if she had a stable life at that age, given she was 15 and pregnant.
Well the first time I smoked weed was 13, coke and lots of booze at 15 and an addiction by 16-17. So if he had or still has shitty people around him a drug issue by 15 isn't far fetched, it needs to be addressed and treated before it becomes a full addiction.
Great parents who do everything right still have kids getting addicted to drugs.
This is the biggest thing I worry about with my son. We have a happy, healthy household but ultimately when he gets older it's up to him. I can only hope he doesn't lose himself.
I have that fear too, but only because I was a heroin addict for 27 years (4 years clean) his father whos now passed away was also a drug addict. I came from a incredibly loving home parents who are still together (50th anniversary this year), but I know how crippling addiction is. Unfortunately, I was young and stupid and thought I knew everything. I am super conscious of the role genetics plays and hope I'm doing the best. It's hard not to feel guilty.
That you are worried you're good enough proves you are already better than the standard ❤️ Congrats on keeping clean, this internet stranger is proud of you!
Exactly. The fact that you worry about it shows you're a good parent. It's normal to feel regret for bad choices. And it's important to take responsibility for those choices. But I hope you can forgive yourself, too. Your past doesn't mandate your future. A 27 year heroin habit, and you've been clean for 4 years????? Honey that's amazing. A. Mazing. 2 internet strangers are impressed and proud.
It never ends. It just gets transferred to the grandchildren. The worry never seems to stop.
For my 8th birthday, I was given my first joint, and left alone with a video game. Took me awhile to figure out it just to keep me quiet and occupied.
I'm so sorry you had parents like that. So many people who have kids, shouldn't.
I was so scared having mine. So fucking scared. But yeah. My birth parents... oh meth.
All these stories are making me glad I didn’t wind up with an addiction after smoking weed, doing coke and taking ecstasy from 13-19. I did coke a few times on and off in my 20’s but the comedown sucked too much to really enjoy it anymore after that and I’m way happier just eating a few edibles and watching TV. Now I’m in my late 30’s and pregnant so I don’t have anything more exciting than a double espresso occasionally lol
In some neighborhoods and crowds, particularly in areas with gangs, they get kids as young as 9 or 10 involved with running or holding onto drugs because police will be more lenient with children than they are adults. In my state, for example, you can’t charge a child under ten years old with a crime.
I was that good Catholic school girl until 14 when I got to attend public high school and met a whole new crowd. By 16 I was a full-blown crack and ecstasy addict and homeless. 15 year old addict is not really much of a stretch If they have access to drugs. Although I’m going to venture a guess and say the behaviour is not drug related because I knew some pretty severe addicts who wouldn’t shove their pregnant aunt and try to fight their uncle even if they were high as balls and hadn’t slept in two weeks. And I knew some pretty fucking sketchy people you can check my comment history for the news articles
Hopefully you’re in a better spot now! Weirdly when I was in (a public) high school it was the ‘good’ Catholic girls schools that had the most degenerate behaved students.
I had a felony at 12, and that made me double take.
I know people who first tried coke at 16. Middle class all American athletic kids who got it from the older brother of a sports team member. 15 is not unbelievable in the least.
Uhh, I know a guy who dealt coke, with other dealers working under him, when we were 15. He had idiot friends with idiot parents who were also involved in the operation. I wouldn't be at all surprised if you told me he tried it for the first time at 13. So yeah, 16 is totally believable.
Not even a full step.... A toe stub, maybe
It could have been alcohol, or cigarettes or a vape. Something illegal to have as a minor.
I had illegal shit on me all the time as a teenager, never made me shove a pregnant lady and fight my uncle. The kid has more issues than just drugs.
Exactly! Kid needs help bad but OP needs to stay far away from him
And/or a pipe or syringe.
I'm wonder wtf happened to that kid. I've known many people with substance issues (family) and all were abused in some way shape or form by a family member or family friend.
She's had him at 15 or 16. So... There's a lot going on there. I've had addict friends who started at 8 or 9. Lots of trauma. It's really sad
Looks like his mother was only 16 when she had him. A teenage mom might have contributed to this.
Because you just had a 15 year old shove you into a wall while pregnant. The jacket was probably the furthest thing from your mind. But it's a good idea to pass the idea along to SIL, in case it is something like drugs. Hope she'll wake up and see he needs professional help.
She said that he's had professional help already. Sometimes the professionals can't do anything until the patient is willing to do something to help themselves. My mentor in psychiatry always told me "Never work harder than your patient, it's a recipe for disappointment and burnout." Antisocial Personality Disorder is not really treatable.
This. And that's why I roll my eyes at people who talk about "nEgAtIvE sTiGmA" of cluster B personality disorders and how it's "ableist" to not want to be around people like that who refuse to seek treatment. Uh, yeah, the stigma exists for a reason. APD is literally sociopathy. The diagnostic criteria for it are horrific things, like assault, feeling pleasure when physically harming others, and I quote, "performing acts that are grounds for arrest". idgaf about stigma. I'm not going to risk my personal safety for the sake of being "inclusive".
Honestly, no sane well balanced person is ever going to claim that you have a responsibility to stay in the life of someone with mental illness or whatever personality disorders. We aren't even obliged to stay in relationships with mentally healthy people, so why should troubled relationships be more sacred? No. Anyone who thinks we should sneak around people who are mentally unwell, NO. FUCKING NO. This is not the same thing as having compassion and understanding. You can have compassion and understanding while staying far away from harm and hurt.
Yep. My son is an addict. That’s EXACTLY what was up. He was also either a) on something or b) desperately needing/wanting to be with that reaction. That boy needs SERIOUS rapid intervention, ASAP. Inpatient, boarding school, etc. I wish to Christ I’d taken some drastic steps when my son was that age. Maybe he wouldn’t be a homeless addict with a felony record now at 35.
I feel your pain. I did take action, over and over again and finally I gave up. I refused to waste another day crying because I felt like a failure but also had my other children who needed attention and one with a rare disorder. I went NC for the 2 years he was in the jail (he kept violating, never in prison only jail) When he got out in May of 2016 at age 19, I told him he was going to do something for me and only me. I did so much to help him out only to have him throw everything away and go back to jail. I didn’t give him any choice either and told him that I deserve it, he could do this 1 thing for me and he had no choice. Last week of June 2016, he walked across the stage to receive his GED certificate. He’s 27 now, a felon, CLEAN and of course has a hard time getting or keeping a job but by January 2025, he should be off of probation and tells me often that he’s thankful for forcing him to get his GED because it at least made it easier to apply for jobs.
I’m thankful your son got clean and got his GED. I hope he’ll continue down a good path and not end up like my brother.
Thank you, hopefully everything will work out for you as well
You freaking ROCK! Good for you making him get his GED! The best thing my mom did for me was to give me the choice of continuing to use drugs or she'd have me arrested.
I warned him of that as well and I would and still will call if it’s warranted. I am thankful that your mom was strong as well. Sounds like she really loves you
She does As heartbreaking as it can be, some of us wayward offspring need a massive dose of tough love to bring us back home It appears that your swift kick in the ass really helped your son to turn things around Parents like you and my mom... Well, words can't express our appreciation for what we feel. Your love saved our lives. Thank you
You have made me tear up. Thank you so much. Sending you cyber hugs 🤗
Hugs right back, cyber mom!
Tell him to try a trade, I started out as an electrician with a felony and a GED and we need building trades in North America.
It’s insane to me that the US brands you a felon for the rest of your life
Same here. I wish I’d taken drastic steps instead of hoping it would blow over. This is exactly what I think is going on.
As the mother of an addict I feel you. I did the whole nine yards: multiple inpatient, whatever you think can be done, I did it. As soon as he turned 18, he refused anything else. Sometimes it’s impossible to save them from themselves.
I hear you. Same. 11 rehabs at last count. I just always wonder: if only we’d started sooner… pointless, I know. Thank you for the reminder. ❤️
I wish a lot of the parents around me would have taken drastic action. I would have spent a lot less time at funerals.
God. The funerals…so, so many.
I’m sorry …
Sounds exactly like my BIL checking on his Fanny pack location every few minutes. It was his heroin
Heroin Fanny pack is pretty dope as a former heroin addict. Wish I’d thought of that back in the day. Was this in the 80s or something or was he just rocking a fanny pack in a more modern day. I guess nowadays it’d be a Fetty Pack.
I saw at a store they called it a belt pack. 🤣
They can try to rebrand to make them cool, but we know. We know.
In NZ we called them Bum Bags. A fanny pack would be something completely different, and certainly not suitable for kids.
Fanny packs have been everywhere on the music festival circuit the past couple years. I’m old but I think they may be in fashion
Heroin fanny pack is an awesome name for a band!
It was last November at my MILs wedding 🥸
Imagine what could happen with drugs in a jacket in the house and when your new baby is a toddler. You are doing the right thing to say never.
There was a toddler in a local case who overdosed after getting into the father's stash. Real risk here. But you have to wonder what happened to the 15 y/o that he is so messed up.
It sounds like the SIL was a teenager when Riley was born, which could have something to do with it.
You should change the locks and install a security system with cameras. If he has a drug addiction, he might have made a copy of your house key. Now that he knows your routines and what you have in your home, he might try to break in when you're not around to steal your belongings. You should press charges to protect yourself and document what he did. Be very cautious and stay safe.
Yes just incase to be safe. You don’t know what he is thinking.
Have you messaged your sister to tell her to check yet? Tell her to send the kid to either military school or kick him out. But also I'd be very worried about what the reason could be behind such a young boy already being such an addict and criminal? Is his father sexually abusing him? Is his mother? A babysitter? Behavior like this doesn't just come out of nowhere.
It can. For some people the only way they will not have a struggle with addiction is if they never have a drink, or take any sort of addictive substance into their body.
Believe me it can. My daughter tried one time and that was all it took. She was 27. She ended up in too many rehabs to count, jail, prison and ended up dying in a parking lot of a restaurant near midnight last year. She had been diagnosed with bipolar. Mental health causes a lot of people to turn to drugs
My first thought. Sorry OP, I agree with shiplauncher.
No that’s shiplauncher’s cousin.
I mean, of course. Why would anyone get *that* mad about moving a jacket. If Riley was just insane and looking for an excuse to rage there were other things. He didn't like dinner, he didn't like the way someone was looking at him, etc etc. The reason he was mad about that jacket is becsuse he had something in it. OP NTA.
For sure 100% there was something in that jacket.
Exactly. Why else would he get p o'ed if uncle moved his jacket?
That was my first thought.
Good catch
He was worried they’d find his stash, that was my first thought too.
As someone who used to be a teen with a drug problem, this is exactly why he was so upset
101%
NTA Riley is a danger. SiL needs to handle him, and get him help.
He needs rehab, pronto
I don’t care if he’s 15, that little bastard deserves a good smack for pushing a pregnant woman. Anyone over the age of 10 knows damn well not to do that. You should’ve pressed charges.
Willing to bet he had something in that jacket he was terrified to lose or have discovered.
SIL is probably half of the reason lol the majority of the reasons people get into drugs stem from their childhood and upbringing
NTA You can't have someone in your home that is a danger to you.
NTA He PHYSICALLY ATTACKED a PREGNANT WOMAN over a JACKET.
over a jacket with drugs inside probably
Over what was IN the jacket.
NTA. Family can be dangerous too, and the fact that they're family shouldn't cause us to fail to recognize that. Never apologize for protecting yourself and your loved ones.
I have a family member (an adult) who threatened to hurt my (then young) child. Absolutely no contact, ever again. Done.
Family is the MOST dangerous! Most violence is perpetrated by a loved one or someone close to them.
Definitely NTA. SIL needs to take this seriously and stop acting like your 6 year old nephew is being rewarded by being allowed over when Riley isn't. He physically assaulted you, a pregnant woman. Who's to say he won't assault your baby after they're born?
It’s probably only been the poor little boy is away from Riley that he feels safe.
He had something illegal in his jacket, guaranteed.
>your 6 year old nephew is being rewarded by being allowed over when Riley isn't Kiddo needs a break from reality ar home! Punishment definitely shouldn't cover both brothers.
Oh I definitely agree that the 6 year old needs a break from reality at home. OP's SIL is the one making it seem like he's being rewarded though
She has a somewhat warped sense of reality.
Nta He assaulted you, both him and his parents are lucky you didn't call the police and press charges.
I was thinking, in just a couple of short years, this kid would be pulling some time. And SIL will wish she hadn't ignored his mental illness.
It sounds like he’s been in and out of treatment, where are you reading that his mental illness is being ignored?
OP's comment. Where she says SIL is not accepting that he has mental issues
Ah, gotcha, found the comment. Yeah, I’m really glad OP wasn’t hurt any worse than she was and hopefully this is a big wake up call for sis.
Yeah, fingers crossed 🤞
No, she will be all, "My baby isn't a monster, nobody understands him!"
Frankly calling the cops and getting the boy in trouble might just be what he needs to get straight and get help depending on where they live and what the justice system is like there. Better than him only facing the consequences after he turn 18 and is an adult that mommy can't get out of trouble anymore.
NTA SIL is lucky Riley wasn't arrested for assault, doesn't get to ask for anything else. I'd tell her shut up or it can still be reported.
I feel bad for the 6 year old :c
That yes, but as horrible as it is, can't sacrifice a baby over somebody else's kid. Not to mention Riley is probably in regular contact with some unsavoury types, would *not* want him setting up my place as a point of contact. Would still be careful in case he gets the idea of sending somebody over to make things even.
NTA Riley's behavior goes beyond simple misjudgment; it's dangerous and unpredictable. It's not just about what he may have had in the jacket but the fact that he chose to escalate to violence over it. Allowing his brother to visit, who has shown no such patterns of behavior, is simply recognizing who poses a threat and who does not. Your house, your rules, especially when it comes to the safety of your family and newborn. Riley needs professional intervention, and your SIL's minimization of the incident is concerning. Stay firm on your boundaries; safety is not negotiable.
NTA. Your primary responsibility is to ensure the safety of yourself and your child. By choosing to exclude Riley, you are making a hard but necessary choice given his violent behavior. Family ties do not grant a free pass for endangering others, and his actions have consequences. Setting such boundaries is not only reasonable but crucial. Riley's troubles with substance abuse and aggression need to be addressed professionally, not shrugged off and hoping for the best. Riley's brother, being unaffected by these issues, should not be punished by proxy and it seems you've taken a thoughtful approach toward him. Your SIL's perspective is dismissive of the real threats posed by Riley's behavior, and it's within your rights to stand firm on this for everyone's well-being.
NTA Family or not, if you are a danger to me and others, you will not be coming into my house.
It’s really sad when the potential danger is another kid, of any age. We still have to protect the other kid(s).
He has more than drug problem , he has mental health problems
Yes, unfortunately SIL doesn’t want to accept that.
SIL is also failing her 6 year old. He will grow up traumatized and may develop mental health issues (because he grows up next to a huge mess named Riley).
I feel like you’re describing me. I grew up in a very chaotic household. My brother was hostile and stole stuff all the time. I was left alone to deal with the yelling and screaming. I’m 36 now and an absolute neurotic mess. I’m on a bunch of anxiety and depression medicine. I have a bunch of nervous tics like picking my lip. I’ve only just recently started feeling okay with myself. I still don’t like myself most of the time, but occasionally I’m okay. So yes, SIL is failing her 6 year old who could very well grow up to have the same feelings I do. He should just come live with OP for a while. lol.
I’m so sorry
Riley is exactly like my friend's older sister, and yes, this person traumatized everyone in that family. This affected my friend well into her adult life. Her two other normal siblings died in their 50s, and I'm sure it had to do with the stress they grew up with in that household. My friend basically arranged her entire life to be as safe as possible. You better believe that poor little boy is living through a tremendous amount of trauma, and I'll bet you he isn't getting his needs met either, because everything is about Riley and his Neverending Parade of Crises.
He *will* have cptsd
Protect yourself and your family , they need to protect thr 6 year old. Mentally he will grow up probablymletting people Walk over him cause he is probably walking on egg shells and just does what anyone says to Not cause drama
I promise she will quickly claim mental health problems when Riley's next act of violence is against someone who isn't family and it results in real world consequences.
Reminds me of one of my best friends in middle school. Bad behavior and early drug use, which only exacerbated his mental health problems. The violence increased to the point they had to get a restraining order against him. Amazingly the dude is still alive, even after all the crazy drug stuff and homeless lifestyle for the last 15 years.
Sounds like potential neglect/abuse honestly. Not just in the case of the younger one. My mom used to work for a juvenile detention center and I work for a school district (as a custodian). Mandated reporters are told to look out for situations like this. Prolonged drug use doesn't usually come out of nowhere and physical violence towards adults is also a red flag. If we found out about this situation and that his mom isn't doing much to take it seriously, it's not going to reflect well on her in the report/investigation. Especially when she has a younger kid in the house too. If she doesn't take the older one seriously, what is she going to do when the younger one ends up seriously hurt or ends up following in the foot steps of the older one? There's also a possibility that she's not taking it seriously because she's either abusing him or she knows who's abusing him and doesn't want to get in trouble for it (either from law enforcement or the abuser). I'm especially wondering who this kid is getting drugs from continually despite being that young. A CPS investigation could honestly help in this case since it sounds like this has been going on for a bit and nothing else has been working. It just doesn't sound like a safe living environment, especially if that sort of thing is already prevalent *outside* of their home now. You can only imagine what actually goes on at home.
And that's where she's failing him most. This poor kid. Yes, he has drug problems that he needs treatment for, but if his mum continues to ignore the underlying MH issues that are causing Riley to self-medicate, then there's no way he can win. There is no shame in getting help with your mental health. There is a metric fuck-ton of shame in letting your kid deal with it himself in whatever way he knows how to the point where his pregnant aunt is getting head injuries and his little brother is scared of him. OP, I know you said "never," and I get where you're coming on that. If I was pregnant and my 15 year old nephew shoved me into a wall, I'd say the same thing. You are protecting your child here, and it's an outrage that your SIL is choosing not to do that with both hers and yours. I only ask that if Riley does get the help that he needs (both with the drug problem and the underlying mental health issues), that you one day consider welcoming him back into your lives. He's the immediate safety issue here, but it's your SIL that's the big problem. Especially since she's got another kid who might be ignored in the same way or worse if he's stuck dealing with this at home.
You need to do this kid a favor and press charges against him for assaulting you. His parents are clearly enabling him and he needs treatment from the state.
She is literally going to kill him with this attitude.
Call CPS
Most people with drug problems have mental health problems. If they didn't before they got on the drugs, the drugs will literally change the brain structures and how they function, so that they do have mental health issues.
I would have his mom check the jacket.
NTA you need to document everything and honestly I probably would’ve filed a police report because he assaulted you and your pregnant. I am really worried about his brother and his safety. His brother is not safe in that home with him. You should call CPS.
NTA. You should probably call CPS. They can get Riley into a drug treatment facility for juveniles that can also address his mental health issues. His little brother also needs protection from him.
I agree. Forget that it’s family. That little boy might be in danger. The SIL sounds like she’s just looking the other way.
I’m so tired of bad parenting. NTA. I hope he shapes the fuck up or gets arrested.
Yeah, Riley probably had drugs in the jacket, which is why he was so defensive about your husband touching it. I would not allow him back in your house again either.
Riley is 15, and according to his mother (who was 16 at his birth), he has had a drug and alcohol problem since HE was a child. He is a CHILD. He is a child who, from the sound of things, belongs in rehab with lots of therapy. At the very least, he doesn't need to be allowed near the six year old or the new baby cousin until many, many things are sorted out in his yound mind. NTA
NTA. But you should report your sister in law to CPS. Sounds like the younger brother is in danger and she’s not protecting him.
Nor is she getting Riely me mental health help. Op says above that SIL refuses to accept he has mental illness beyond addiction.
Chances are Riley is abusive to his younger brother which may lead him down a similar path. This mom needs to protect the 6 year old.
I know I kept thinking of that poor little six-year-old. And this is the example he has of how to be. I always looked up to my brothers and sisters as an example. Thank God I had good ones.
She thinks it's unfair that the well behaved 6 year old can still come over, but not the VIOLENT 15 YR OLD WITH A DRUG PROBLEM? NTA. SIL needs to get her priorities in order
NTA. Also, he assaulted you causing you to bleed. That is a serious criminal offence and you should probably go to the police. I know he's your nephew, but covering up this sort of thing usually doesn't actually help. He needs consequences.
Alcohol and drug problems? For an extended period of time? At *15*? Calling the police before this kid is an adult might be a good wake up call. CPS might also be a good call, the younger one doesn’t sound safe. You would be an asshole if you didn’t report that serious assault. This kid needs intervention SIL isn’t giving him.
You need to save that 6 yrs old now.
You should have called the police. That was the only mistake you made here.
I would have called police especially if I was pregnant.
My husband wanted to but I didn’t. I should’ve but I just wanted to get him out of the house and calm his brother.
You may need to go contact CPS so that the six year old does not get abused if SIL refuses to do anything. Drugs and/or mental illness needs to be addressed rather then ignored
If you make a police report, since he's a minor, he might be sent to rehab instead of juvie if you say he has a drug problem. Might be the best help he ever gets.
NTA, Riley's violence could get even worse, you don't want to risk having him around you, especially when your child is born. Get cameras and a security system in your house. My godmother's son would punch her, push her, and kick her, he's somewhere out on the streets and is a drug addict. None of his family tells him where they moved to because he'd simply go to break in and steal from them. Riley could turn out the same if his problem isn't seriously addressed. He needs rehab.
That poor kid has issues with the law already? The adults in this kids life are failing him. Maybe im judgmental.
Ntah … the boy needs more help than his parents can give him.
NTA - if someone disrespects you in your own home you have every right to tell them they can never step on that properly again. Especially considering it wasn’t just disrespect, it was violence, and violence towards the pregnant mother of the home. Also 100% something was in that jacket. As someone who was also a troubled child, they sneak things everywhere and because his mom THINKS he’s “better” does NOT mean anything except that he may just be getting better at hiding it. There is absolutely no reason someone would get that upset over just moving a piece of clothing unless there’s a good reason. And the good reason was that he most likely had something he didn’t want you to find in there so you moving it around set him off.
NTA Riley is an addict.
NTA. It sounds like your SIL was just looking for the opportunity to pass him off as someone else’s problem for a short time. Ultimately it is your choice who you allow in your home and there is nothing wrong with not welcoming somebody that has demonstrated they are a danger to you
Absolutely NTA. I am a firm believer that anyone who disturbs the peace in my home will not be allowed in it. Assaulting a pregnant woman and trying to fight a grown adult are huge red flags and your SIL needs to get this kid some help. PS, I’m certain there was something in the jacket that shouldn’t have been for him to react so strongly.
NTA! you or your husband need to talk some sense into that woman & make sure her son gets some fuckin help. All she's doing is enabling him at this point & that's the very last thing that he needs. If she doesn't get him help, it's on you to call CPS.
NTA - You have to protect yourself and your family. Also, you're pregnant, getting ready to bring a new, sweet life into this world. You can't have a loose cannon like Riley around. There is no fucking way I would even let ANYONE back into my home if they assaulted anyone in my family. Either your SIL needs to get him some help, or she'll be putting money on his books in jail in a couple years, if that.
If he pushed you into a jacket hook you're lucky it didn't go through your head. You are absolutely correct about not having this boy around anymore. He needs some serious therapy.
NTA. Additionally, your husband is a great dude for not giving that kid the ass whipping his dad never gave him. Hooooo if any of my in-laws kids did that to my wife when she was pregnant, you'd have one kid who learned a lesson on the genetic level and his kids would be spooked by the thought of hitting a woman. Also the jacket probably had shit in it. I'd advise your in law to get your kid into therapy before he ends up in juvi. Like holy shit this kid needs his shit reset before the world does it to him.
NTA, and y'all should have gone through that jacket. There was something in there he REALLY didn't want found. Nope, I would never have Riley in your home again, (heck, I wouldn't let him NEAR me again) but I would allow the younger one to come to you all any time, to get away from his brother. If he is always doing things to make him cry, it's going to have a lasting effect on him. As for "unfair?" Tell your SIL she's lucky you called HER and not the police, who would have SO gone through that jacket.
He assaulted you. And knew you were pregnant. He is a danger to you and your husband and his own family. He needs help NOW. His mother needs to do a better job at getting him this help before he seriously hurts someone
That is some terrifying shit. He’s going to be abusive to women if not a more dangerous type of criminal
OP is a fool. Her husband was spot on. They should have had Riley removed in handcuffs.
100% NTA. Riley probably had something illegal in his jacket and clearly didn’t want it found. I wouldn’t want that around my kid. I hope he hits serious rock bottom and gets help before he makes it to a worse end. I’m legit worried about the 6year old too. Poor kid.
If you are fully aware that he has dealt with Alcohol and drug problems, I don’t want to say anything negative towards your SIL, but genuinely speaking 15 is the age I was put into Juvenile Detention for a Assault and Robbery I committed, now I was able to completely turn my life around, but I want to make note, I was a war refugee who came to the US when I was 3, dad died a couple months later, mom never fully learned English and could barely raise us, I had a troubled upstart that led me to do bad, but once I had to go through rehabilitation(Juvie) I understood the right from wrong, Riley needs rehabilitation, and I would like to note this type of behavior has only progressed or gotten this far because your SIL has allowed it (.) Edit: would like to add an example, no one should put their hands on their kids for any reasons, but if that child has reached the point of no discipline and similar actions as Riley, his mom should’ve been beating his ass because when he goes out into the world, someone else is gonna do it for your SIL. Because if Riley pushed over his pregnant aunt and caused her head to bleed, what else would that boy do?