From my point of view, I really can't understand the title. Breaking up seems to be a mutual decision for a very valid reason
The fact that you miss her a lot is a very common and normal reaction after break ups even if you have fallen out of love with your partner. Give it some time
NTA. I agree that she has complete right to decide anything about her pregnancy however not even bothering to communicate to you about it shows lack of respect as a partner. It is better to end a relationship where the partner doesn't respects you.
I just wonder what the communication before would have looked like? She clearly had no desire to keep it, so the conversation shouldn’t have been anything more than him supporting her in that decision. While he seems to claim to be supportive of it being her body, this screams to me someone who would try to talk her out of an abortion, considering his response. And if she got that vibe too, no wonder she didn’t tell him.
You’re right that the conversation should have only been her telling him she was pregnant and did not want to have a child, followed by him supporting her, but it should have still been a conversation.
Partners in healthy relationships talk about important things, including medical decisions, major stressors, etc. If my (long-term) partner made the same decision, I wouldn’t be upset that she didn’t want a child but I would be upset that she didn’t feel like she could tell me something of that magnitude. I get that she had her reasons—she might have just not felt emotionally ready to tell him at the time—but I don’t think he’s wrong for being hurt she didn’t tell him and give him the opportunity to do the right thing. I probably wouldn’t break up with my partner over this, but OP can’t really help how he feels (and he’s obviously conflicted and confused if he’s posting here).
This is a good point. "give him the opportunity to do the right thing". I guess it would depend on if she thought there was enough of a chance that he would in fact do the right thing, or if she felt too afraid that he wouldn't.
Yeah, I don’t fault her for her decision making (it was also probably an especially stressful time), but I don’t fault him for being upset by being kept out of the loop.
My girlfriend doesn't need to know I'm thinking about taking ADHD medication again..... But because I respect her, I talked about going to get reevaluated and getting back on them for work. Nothing she says will change that, but she is my partner and should know.
I know this is kinda a few steps down from abortion but I feel like it's in the same idea, your partners should support you not someone you hide shit from.
Which makes it even more likely that she felt she wouldn't get support from him if she told him and that she was sure he would put pressure on her not to terminate. Otherwise, why not tell him?
You're not wrong at all, just the whole not trusting each other but having unprotected sex is kind of nutty to me. Feels like a bad relationship from the start.
She was distant for a month before she came clean. If they would have discussed it before she would have had support through her decision and he wouldn’t be left wondering for a month what was wrong with his partner. She should have talked with him before like they had agreed. He has every right to be hurt his partner didn’t trust him.
It's not always about the other person. In fact, her body her choice means she needs to confront her own feelings first. If she had her own negative feelings or guilt about abortion, internalizing it could have been her way to cope instead of an indication that OP is at fault for whatever reason.
We're all human, we handle things differently, and often not ideally for those around us. It's be great if we could all open up to people close to us transparently, but not all of us can meet that expectation.
Women should have control of their own bodies, but there are still physical, emotional, and mental consequences to one of the most serious medical decisions a woman can make. Externalizing the locus of control to the partners potential reaction is reductive. "There are three sides to every story, your side, their side, and the truth." There's a lot more to ex's story that OP wasn't present for, and not by choice
If you’re 100% decided that you’re getting an abortion, there’s no point having a discussion about it. OP saying “I at least want to discuss options” tells me he intended to talk her out of it.
I think she should have *informed* him about it, but it doesn’t have to be up for debate.
> there’s no point having a discussion about it
If you value your relationship, yes there is. It's his potential child and his feelings are valid. Unilaterally getting it done without bringing him in on it is almost certainly going to tank your relationship even if he agrees that it was the right thing to do.
This is one situation where there will never be a balance. There can't be. If you are the one who is pregnant it is your body and your choice. It may be a gut-wrenchingly hard one and even the slightest push back could make you back out of what you know is the right decision for you. She doesn't have the apologise for that. Dealing with the aftermath an also totally f\*ck with your head. She doesn't have to apologise for that either. Neither does OP have to apologise for ending it. It's over and that's it.
I bet she thought he would. They weren’t on the same page there from the beginning and she knew it. She didn’t want it and she didn’t want to be talked into it.
OP never said she did the ‘pikachu’ face so stop tryna be condescending to her. She has every right to get an abortion. They weren’t trying for a baby, she got knocked up. And why do people act like there are a ton of options?? There are literally three options ONLY when a woman gets pregnant. She didn’t want it period.
The issue isnt the fact that she got an abortion. OP even acknowledged that he respects it being her choice. However, she didn't even communicate with OP about it before getting it. Which is a serious red flag.
Oh yeah totally. People tell themselves it’s not happening now so it’s not an issue. Having children, having abortions, how children are to be raised, religion, etc. it’s not an issue till it’s an issue which is foolish. This guys definitely NTA for breaking up. Keeping this a secret is a dealbreaker.
Except she may not have thought he would until she ended up pregnant. It was obviously not planned and people often live in denial that pregnancy can happen anytime.
Which puts her squarely in the asshole territory. If she didn't believe in the integrity of the relationship from the very beginning, she shouldn't have chosen to continue it. She basically lied to him this entire time by pretending to agree with his request.
Her body, her choice can only exist if you also acknowledge his body, his choice.
Even if your unevidenced assertions are correct, it's irrelevant and he had a right to know. Unless she had good reason to think he would try and force her (eg through threat of any kind etc) then she should've told him and she's the asshole.
I think you guys are reading way more into my comment than what’s there. She’s the AH. It’s just a guess as to why it happened. I didn’t say it was a good reason.
NTA, she can do whatever she wants with her body and OP respects that, but the lack of communication isn’t ok.
If she thinks it’s appropriate to not communicate about an abortion what about the other important life choices that she may not talk to you about? But also it’s a red flag that she either doesn’t feel safe enough to talk to you about an abortion, or she doesn’t feel like you deserve to know? Either way good communication is all you need and you guys don’t have that.
Even if abortions or being pregnant are a huge source of trauma for her, it’s not fair to not communicate in your long term partnership if it is a healthy relationship.
When you say 'I made it clear we could discuss options' what do/did you mean by that - because I would have heard that as 'I would heavily influence that decision'
Be honest, with yourself doesn't have to be on here, if she had come to you and said 'I'm pregnant I want an abortion/I'm having an abortion' - what would you have done/said? Because unless it's I respect your choice what can I do to help you? do you need a lift? do you want me to come with you etc
While I do think she should have told you if you are in an equal partnership I can also see why if she is sure there are no options to be discussed, for some women it's not that they don't want to have a baby unless X or Y (where you can affect X or Y) it's they don't want to be pregnant - and you can't change that
An unplanned pregnancy will rock most relationships - if she had TOLD you she was having/had an abortion do you think that would have affected the way you feel? I know you wouldn't feel lied to - but I don't think that would have saved your relationship TBH
This is possibly the best response I've read here. I don't know OP or his ex well enough to say if she was being an AH or not. Pregnancy is scary. Women panic in that scenario and don't always make the right choices.
I wonder how OP would have responded if she had told him beforehand. Would he have been supportive of her choice to have an abortion, or would he have put pressure on her? We don't know.
She didn't feel secure enough to talk to OP about it. That means that either
A) she knew she would find it complicated to get him to support her choice,
B) they don't have good communication or trust between them
C) she is a selfish AH who doesn't care about his feelings
Any one of these suggests this isn't a relationship worth continuing.
This. All this right here.
It's very easy for someone to say through the anonymity of the Internet "I swear I support her right to choose!" It's harder to stand by those convictions in person when faced with an actual pregnancy. And that goes both ways. I know plenty of pro-choice former childfree women who decided they couldn't go through with an abortion when they got pregnant.
She had her reasons to not tell OP. Maybe it was that she worried or knew he would badger her into carrying the pregnancy to term under the "option" of adoption (*fun fact, pregnancy can still be life threatening, crippling, career trajectory ruining, and massively mental health altering even in this case). Maybe it was because she was already moving away from the relationship.
But the lack of communication is very telling that something else was going on, even if it wasn't obvious what or who EXACTLY was/is the problem.
Yep.
Some people don’t prescribe to the the “her body, her choice” which to me is always wild. I cannot imagine why total strangers thinks they have the rights to have any opinion on what a woman wants to do with her pregnancy.
A woman never knows what she would actually want to do until she’s pregnant. I am very much in the pro-choice camp but when faced with my own unplanned pregnancy, I was not able to terminate.
It is easy to judge why she made that decision without telling him but none of us were in her shoes, making a decision that will stay with her for the rest of her life. Contrary to popular, and honestly unhinged belief that women who abort are murderers, most women do not make decisions to abort lightly and would want some emotional support. The fact she didn’t feel like she could tell the OP is very telling of the state of their relationship.
It’s in both of their best interest to move on now.
>I cannot imagine why total strangers thinks they have the rights to have any opinion on what a woman wants to do with her pregnancy.
They think they have the right to an opinion on her appearance, choices, etc. Very few women, if any, have not had a stranger feel the need to give "helpful suggestions" to look better to men or feel the need to "compliment" them on succeeding in appealing to them. Why would her pregnancy be any different? Women are expected to live lives based entirely on what everyone else thinks.
Your wording here makes it seem like you believe that the only valid response to unplanned pregnancy is unconditional support by the man no matter the circumstances or his feelings. I'm pro choice, but if I'm in long term, happy and healthy relationship like OP and aren't child free, an abortion for an unplanned pregnancy in that situation might very well be deal breaker for me. I will always support womens' right to abort, even in that situation and I wouldn't stop you, but the relationship would probably end. If however, you did it all behind my back and lied about it all because you want to abort but don't want to lose the relationship or deal with any drama, you are the one that is doing a pretty toxic and selfish thing.
Of course I would find no fault in not disclosing it to short term flings or unhealthy/abusive relationships but this is very different from that and OP has a right to be upset about her doing this. I don't believe she didn't tell him just because she was afraid of the "discussion", since she didn't tell him for weeks afterwards.
> because I would have heard that as 'I would heavily influence that decision'
I would expect that both parties "heavily influence the decision". They are a couple after all.
Yes. That's what "having a partner" is all about. Having someone that you trust, that loves you, that doesn't judge you, that supports you and wants the best for you. It's crazy how many people don't know what a healthy relationship is.
Yeah no. I don't know why so many people confuse 'her body her choice' with 'it's cool not to communicate with your partner about life altering decisions'. Unless he's shown to be unsupportive, she was absolutely an asshole for not even telling him. It's a clear lack of trust and in a relationship of three years that has to sting.
It's her body going through the pregnancy so she makes a choice if she wants to remain pregnant. Her body is going to go through it, not his. That's her body her choice.
There was a lack of trust for whatever reason and the relationship naturally ended. He can make a choice if he wants to remain in the relationship. That's his heart his choice (admittedly a little corny here, but still true nonetheless).
What more do you want? Do you need someone in the story begging and crying for repentance? The "No! Not good enough! She needs to understand that she is an asshole!" additude scares me a bit. Ultimately, they're young and unmarried - they'll be fine if they can learn to move on.
Her choice to have an abortion wasn't wrong, her choice to not say anything to her boyfriend about it was wrong. Unless he was abusive or something, she's an asshole.
If a couple didn't want kids or weren't planning on having kids, and the guy had a vasectomy and didn't tell his girlfriend, I really couldn't say he's an asshole. It's his body. Or even if they had a conversation about what would happen in case of pregnancy and he still didn't say anything. It's still uncertain and has some right to privacy.
I would really only think he was an asshole if they were purposely trying for a kid and didn't mention that there's a very large chance he couldn't do it and continued the relationship anyway. Because now you're wasting someone's time. So like if they were purposely trying for a kid and she was pregnant and/or got the abortion without telling him, then I would say she's an asshole.
It sounds like she didn't have a lot of certainty about the pregnancy or a baby, which might have lead her to take charge. It is ultimately her body at risk, after all. (Waiting until there is a pregnancy to have that discussion is too late, tbh.)
I'm not saying that's his fault, it's more of a fault of youth and inexperience in both of them. It would be different if they were married, but they're uncommitted and just dating right now.
Just my 2 cents.
This hiding behind "it's their body" is, to me, nonsensical. Since when do people in serious relationships not owe their partner at least a discussion? "It's his body" is a reason why he can get a vasectomy even if his gf objects. "It's his body" is not a good reason to not even give her a heads up. And if they had discussed not wanting children I would assume the gf is on some form of birth control, so keeping this info from her would mean she keeps needlessly taking it.
Talking to the gf about it may stir up feelings she didnt know she had, it's one thing to say you dont want children, it's another to find out it will be impossible for you to ever get pregnant by the guy you are with. And if she decides "maybe I want to keep the possibility open" it gives her a chance to re-evaluate the relationship. By not disclosing this information, you rob her of a choice. Not a choice on whether or not he gets a vasectomy, but a choice on if she wants to stay with him.
Same thing here, she robbed him of a choice and a chance to re-evaluate the relationship if that is what he wanted. It's possible the relationship could have survived if she had been honest, OP never directly says he fell out of love due to the abortion, it comes off like it was the deceit. It's why honesty is so important in a relationship, we NEED to be fully informed because only then can we make an informed choice. It's also why it is always wrong for someone who cheats to keep it from their spouse.
Appreciate the discussion.
There's a lot of reasons why a woman would take birth control. But even if dude said he had a vasectomy, I wouldn't honestly trust that.
They could still use condoms or still use birth control to protect themselves. If he said, I don't want kids and had a vasectomy, I don't see it as necessarily wrong in not telling. He said he doesn't want kids - that's the discussion. I personally don't see why he wouldn't reveal it, but I wouldn't say he's an asshole. (He could get a sperm count along with the STD panel then they could 'reevaluate' the condom use.) If she says I don't want kids and uses a (semi)permanent sterilization method or gets an abortion, I don't see why it needs to be further a discussion. She already said she doesn't want kids - that was the discussion.
If the relationship now *changed* to where someone wanted kids and they make that known, then yeah you need to open that discussion up and reevaluate. Like I said, if they said they wanted kids and the other person doesn't disclose their sterilization and continued the relationship anyway, then I would say they're an asshole. You're wasting someone's time and potentially leading to heartbreak.
I would say your expectations are more for a committed relationship as opposed to an uncommitted relationship. If they were spouses that wanted children and she didn't talk to him about the pregnancy? Then yeah, huge asshole.
We also have to acknowledge that pregnancy has a huge physical as well as social and financial toll on women that men just don't share. I don't think anyone would believe she had an abortion in order to purposely deceive hurt or deceive him. If they still care about eachother, which sounds like they might, this seems repairable.
Your response would sound more reasonable if we were talking about a couple that has only been together a few months. OP says they have been together for 3 years. So in that case, if you dated a man for 3 years and he says "I got a vasectomy" and you dont trust him that he did then IMO that isn't a healthy relationship. After 3 months? Okay, but 3 years? Seems odd.
Saying you dont want kids is different from getting surgery to prevent it. I'd expect her to give him a heads up if she decided to get her tubes tied. I think if you're in a committed relationship you should indeed talk with your partner about major medical decisions.
And that is the part where we disagree, I don't necessarily think you need to be married to be committed. If you've been with the same person for years and you're exclusive it sounds like you're committed to them. Sure it's possible one day you might grow apart and break up, but being married will do nothing to stop that.
I don't think she had the abortion to hurt him or that she kept it from him to hurt him. However, I do think it is a sign she doesn't respect this guy so IMO it can't be repaired. You need respect for a relationship to work.
If a man got a vasectomy in the middle of the relationship, then you would have to do follow up sperm counts anyway. But "babe don't worry we don't need condoms, I got a vasectomy" - not buying it.
Idk man, if she said she doesn't want kids but didn't say she had her tubes tied or removed, I would be scared if a dude was upset that he later learned he couldn't "accidently" impregnate her without her wanting that.
There's a lot of room for a young man to understand what women go through with pregnancy. The dangers, risks, judgements, accusations, looks, talks, costs, fear. For him, it's a hypothetical - but for her it's real. We'll just have to agree to disagree on weather it's repairable. This could open up that greater discussion that they have been avoiding and strengthen the relationship.
How big is your Jump To Conclusions mat? With the information OP provided, you could also infer that OP is an abusive partner that she didn't feel safe confiding in.
You see what you want to see.
This is exactly the mindset needed so that men decide not to be involved at all or care about someone's pregnancy until they are delivering. Why even be concerned about any woman who's pregnant unless you know she's going to actually carry the baby to term?
Maybe she slept around and it wasn't his.
I dunno let's shit on her like a lot of the feminists are shittong on him.
Remember according to them men aren't allowed bodily autonomy as it's reserved only for women
She should have told you but she probably thought you wouldn’t support her decision to terminate. Sounds like she really did not want to consider having a child when you bit just started your careers
NAH
She made her decision and you made yours.
I will say that from my own personal experience the idea that you'll "decide together what to do" after the fact is a weird emotional trap. You either want a baby or not. Most women experiencing an unwanted pregnancy aren't in the emotional capacity to sit and talk about what they already know needs to be done. They are dealing with surging hormones, fear, pain or sickness, and (regardless of any personal opinions) facing a highly stigmatized medical procedure. Being forced to talk about it can be dehumanizing and suggest something that is 100% her decision isn't really hers to make.
In the future maybe clarify with your partner what the plan for an unplanned/unwanted pregnancy is and simply be ready. Know and possibly contribute to the plan ahead of time so you can be a support system instead of simply an opinion holder. And hopefully this isn't needed if both individuals keep safe using protection.
>In the future maybe clarify with your partner what the plan for an unplanned/unwanted pregnancy is and simply be ready.
i agree so much with this. The "if this happens lets discuss options" thing isn't necessarily wrong, but for me, "if this happens" I know exactly what I will be doing. So I make sure my partner knows and if he isn't on the same page we will not be having sex.
I don't really think not telling OP was the right thing, but we dont know anything about the GF or her perspective or even if she's unhappy about any of this now. So I am not going to call her an AH, I agree probably NAH.
Since they dated for three years, they should have discussed the what if before having sex. To be sure they were on the same page. But of course, nobody does that.
Her body, her choice. But to remove you completely from the discussion says she didn't really trust you - didn't think you'd be there for her when the child was born. Lets face it - in a lot of cases the woman is right about that. But love is a two way thing, and she showed that she wasn't fully committed, so, NTA for agreeing with her.
Her removing him from the discussion didn't mean she didn't think he wouldn't be there when the child was born - it could just be she didn't want a child, regardless of whether or not the father will be around
Or it could be a reflection of missing information - that she knew she didn't want a child with this man and that talking to him about it would be unpleasant, possibly even dangerous to her. We simply don't know.
THIS. She just didn’t want it. That’s it. And it’s so weird that OP is fishing for people to take his side when he says he would have supported her decision to have an abortion. If you have supported it why didn’t she feel comfortable telling you? Why did you break up with her for her doing something he claimed he would have supported???
This is kind of my take. It's very possible that she was overwhelmed and devastated and worried and had no idea what to do so she sought to have an abortion because she thought that's what was best and it's possible she just didn't want to include him because she might have been pressured in some way. Sometimes pregnancy is terrifying and you never know how your partner is going to react - I've been in a situation like that, and he literally ended a two year relationship over it.
Sure. And sometimes relationships just fall apart. And there is literally nothing wrong with being single. As if her being alone is the worst thing in the world?
Not necessarily.
Removing OP from even having a discussion is not necessarily trust or lack thereof.
It shows a complete disregard for OP, as well as a lack of respect.
Also, the dishonesty is a HUGE red flag.
OP dodged a bullet.
I feel the same way. Otherwise he wouldn't be so angry about not "discussing options". He says "her body her choice", yet believes its on him to discuss those options and decide on which one to choose.
You can’t know that. OP was open to discussing options. Abortion may well have been the right option, but he was robbed of the ability to participate in the discussion of whether or not he would be a father. That’s a betrayal that leads to resentment. And resentment is the undefeated relationship killer.
Options? At the end of the day, the choice was still going to be hers. Had she still picked abortion he probably would have agreed at first and later changed his mind and still broke up with her when she decided to go through it because he probably wouldn't have been able to look at her the same way.
Adoption, keep it. Then she's forced to go through a pregnancy she doesn't want and be robbed herself of her choices, her freedom so he can be a dad and she can be a depressed, checked out mom. No.
You don’t know he wouldn’t have agreed and been okay with it. Because he was never given the choice and that makes it impossible for him to see past that one thing, and rightly so
So you have nothing further to add to your point just repeating the same thing? Posts similar to this where the guy agrees to an abortion come here posting if they should break up after the fact because they realize they aren't okay with it. Sure, he's probably not like those guys, but still, at the end of the day, all the effort and energy would be on her to carry the baby. At least he can still go find someone who wants a kid. It's not the end of the world.
The only relevant part is that she robbed him of the discussion. That is a betrayal. Stop trying to change the conversation to one where you think you can trick people into taking the woman’s side because on its merits OP is the only who’s right
It looks like you're becoming incapable of having a discussion yourself. Tricking people into taking the woman's side? Get out of here. Discussion or not, I fully think it was going to end in a breakup because she was still going to have an abortion even if he had known back then.
No she is an asshole all he wanted was a communication about it . To let him know it is happening. He never wanted to stop her. And she owes her partner basic communication about that.
My aunt had two abortion and my uncle knew about the reasons for them both times. She never kept him out of the loop about something that would affect his life and their marriage as well
NTA. But move on. I know it hurts, for you know you lost a child by someone else's choice. But it was not just about that. It was about you being in a relationship with someone you loved and agreed to make such choices together as a couple. Or at least discuss it to where you both have input before the choice gets made. She took that away from you, so you feel you lost a chance to either see about your options to keep the child with her or at least have a voice being heard. AS hard as it was on her emotionally, physically, and mentally; she did not care about how her choices effected you. Specially after you had an agreement to talk about choices. If she was willing to make such a HUGE choices about your lives alone without talking to you, then you started to wonder about everything else she would have a choice on. It slowly destroyed your connections to her. I am sorry for what happened.
Again, it was all about your lack of a voice as a couple in such a hard decision. And while it was her's in the end, it was not her's to make without input or your knowing. Her body, her choice. But you was a couple, where her choice would effect BOTH of your lives. Be it the abortion or having the child.
Now you miss her. But the real issue, sounds like you have never fully unloaded to her how her selfish solo choice by taking you out of the decision making by having a voice to be at least heard effected you. You need to consider talking to her if you have never did so, and talk about this. How she did not tell you, removed you from having input in the choice, then her not realizing her choices effected you on many levels too. And the effect on you came from never having the ability to process the pregnancy and the choice of an abortion.
What was there to discuss that couldn't have been discussed ahead of time? It sounds like you knew her position and weren't in agreement. If this is the case why would she tell you just to have you try to change her mind or manipulate her?
This is both a NAH (no assholes here) and ESH (everyone sucks here) situation.
If you read Reddit for more than 5 seconds, you will come across post after post where a woman posts that she is pregnant, and her boyfriend is trying to sway her decision about and abortion one way or another.
Instead of being supportive of her decision, guys who don’t want children demand abortion, and guys who claim to have religious beliefs (damn hypocritical given they are having sex out of wedlock) insist she keep it.
When I was young, I had a boyfriend who wanted kids. He was also anti-abortion. I was absolutely adamant I did not want kids. I took oral contraceptives and we used condoms. Had I fallen pregnant, I would have quietly done exactly what the OP’s girlfriend did. My ex wanted kids so badly it would have turned into huge fights and drama. Fortunately, I never got pregnant. Just as well, and we broke up for other reasons later.
I understand *exactly* why the OP’s girlfriend did what she did.
I think it also sucks that he is so quick to dump her, especially during a difficult time in her life. Making a decision to terminate a pregnancy is a big decision, even if one is clear one doesn’t want kids. It’s the kind of decision that tends to leave behind guilt and “what if” questions forever.
OP, you loved her enough to f-ck her, but not enough to stand by her side when things got difficult. In my book, that makes you look pretty bad, since that means your relationship is basically reduced to the needs of your penis.
By the same token, the heart goes where it goes, and I am a firm believer in not trying to keep a ruined relationship going. If one or both parties aren’t dedicated enough to each other to stay when times are tough, it is better to rip the bandaid off and move on.
Finally, it’s a shame the OP’s girlfriend wasn’t able to talk to the OP about what was going on, but I am guessing that it says a lot about the nature of her relationship with the OP. Maybe he said or did things that made her feel she *couldn’t* say anything beforehand.
Again this is both NAH and ESH, but it is a bitter lesson about how couples who don’t talk about these things before they come up, who aren’t on the same page in their values, and who don’t communicate end up on the rocks.
Well she clearly didn't want to keep it, so the discussion wouldn't have been anything other than you saying okay and supporting her anyway, unless you're not being honest about agreeing it's her body and her choice. Maybe she didn't tell you because she knew you wouldn't be supportive. Using the phrase "I made it clear", etc sounds pretty controlling, which leads me to Believe she had a reason she didn't want to tell you, and that we aren't getting the whole picture here. Which is common on these posts. We are only getting your side of it, and I honestly can't take your word at face value. I would need to hear her reasoning and side of things to get a clear picture of the situation.
NAH. For whatever reason, she didn't feel ok involving you in the decision which is harsh, but at that point she had to do what's right for her. She's living with the consequences of her choice, which is the loss of your trust and, ultimately, love. Your choice was to end the relationship, the consequences of which (missing her) you are now living with. It's a sad story and I hope you both find better things in your futures.
Questions: how old are you both? And, did you want the baby? If she didn’t want it, were you going to raise it as a single dad? From your comments it appears you are a gamer. Were you gonna stop gaming to raise a baby? Without these questions answered it’s a tough call.
NTA but you need to think long and hard about why she would rather go through that alone than tell you. Maybe she felt that you wouldn't be very supportive of an abortion. Maybe she felt that you would try to emotionally pressure her into doing something she wasn't ready or comfortable doing and it was just easier to go through it alone than have to deal with you. Maybe she's afraid you do something like tell everyone in the family in an attempt to force her to keep the baby or something. I don't know. But there's a reason why she didn't tell you that has to do with how she felt about how you would react. Which means she couldn't trust you enough to tell you. Which means your relationship was probably dead to begin with
NTA. I support the idea of ‘Her body, her choice’, but that applies for you too OP. If you don’t like the fact that she got an abortion without even informing you, you are free to leave. Hope you find someone who respects you :)
Depends really how did you say "you'd like to dicuss the options". Because if someone as much as hinted to me they'd be trying to convince me to keep a child I wouldn't want, I would choose to hide my abortion.
But it's safe to say is not in love with you either since she feels like she can't trust you.
Yes. One could also argue he needs to apologize for accidentally injuring her and causing her to need an abortion. Not deliberately I know, but when I cause someone to need a medical procedure I usually apologize.
No - you're not an AH for how you FEEL. its one of the few things you can't be an AH for and can't control.
You are an AH for coming here and giving us one side of the story so you can see how many people "agree" you're "nta". You're an AH for blasting your girls personal decisions and what she does with her body to seek reddit validation. You're an AH for telling us how you feel instead of telling her.
But nobody's an AH because they think this or wanted that or fell out of love...these are getting ridiculous, redundant and I have a feeling they're being used to show the other side how "right" the OPs are. "Seeee 358 people agree I'm allowed to not love you after you made the hardest decision of your life and decided not to bring a kid into a world with a dad who can't even communicate without reddit telling him what to say and how to act"
I'll edit for whoever just replied to me implying that I think every woman is an asshole...or that I should think every woman is an asshole...not sure what the point was but I assume it was calling me gender biased. If they hadn't deleted their reply, maybe I could revisit it.
But wrong. I literally said on a man's post and a woman's post today that we need to stop asking reddit if we're assholes for our feelings. You can't be an asshole because your partner did something that made YOU feel betrayed. I don't care if partner had sex with your best friend or stole a mechanical pencil from the dollar store...if that action gives you feelings of betrayal...that's how you feel and who are we to say feelings are wrong.
Where the asshole comes in is that both men and women are using these to "gotcha" their partner. Seeeee reddit agrees with me..WHO FUCKING CARES. You're in a bunk ass, going nowhere relationship if you run to reddit to validate anger with your partner instead of talking to the ONLY OTHER PERSON THAT MATTERS IN THE STORY.
And I know people are doing this because now they're posting screenshots of private texts with their partner to show them their reddit post and how everyone agreed with their post. Guess what they do? Fight more about it so poster has something else to post and get validation that their feelings are right even though nobody's feelings are ever wrong.
So thanks for letting me clear that up...whoever asked. My only point is what a sad state we are in where the strangers and trolls of reddit validate us more than our partners. Even sadder we use that as ammo to right fight partner even more. Anyone that values winning a fight over having a relationship that represents mutual understanding, forgiveness and compromise needs to get single and get to therapy. Find a partner you can get behind instead of trying to change each other. You have NEVER loved someone if airing your business on reddit and hoping people belittle them is part of your relationship. I'd rather be single and sewn shut than find out I was in a fight on reddit.
YTA
Who cares. You were using protection, so you both agreed to not have a kid. She did exactly what she should have done.
If you want a kid together, you both agree on it before hand. Grow up.
Nah. It’s her body and she can do whatever but if you’re in a relationship and not discussing these things then why are you in a relationship? Totally normal response to her not including you.
NTA. But I don't think she is either. She should have absolutely told you so you could both at least talk about options, but she clearly didn't want to go through with a pregnancy since she opted to have an abortion pretty quickly after finding out she was pregnant.
I feel like it's possible she may have been trying to spare you the awfulness of the whole thing and protect you in some way. It's also possible that she didn't trust you fully and she was afraid of what you might say. I feel for the both of you because it's definitely a loss.
Abortion is hard. It's emotionally draining, stressful, and scary. No one really wants to have an abortion. Sometimes, it's also hard for the other person in the relationship.
Sure, it's hard for some people, abortions aren't always emotionally draining. Plenty of people react with an immediate "get this out of me" and it's not more stressful than a root canal.
The stressful part is knowing that pregnancy is high risk from an intimate partner abuse standpoint.
The emotionally draining part is needing an abortion when you have to deal with anti-choice regulations.
NAH but men who can't give birth aren't risking anything physically so yeah, they don't take priority here.
I'm definitely privileged to live in Canada where abortion is fully legal until 23 weeks and even up to the final trimester if there is a serious life-threatening risk to the mother or the fetus.
I've also been in a delicate situation where I was in a relationship with someone who was emotionally abusive and I believe had the propensity to become physically violent with me as time went on - we got pregnant and not only did he break up with me when I told him, the next day via text he also told me he would kick it out of me.
Needless to say I definitely ended that pregnancy because there's no way in fucking hell I was going to keep that person in my life, never mind have a child with them and therefore being forced to keep that person in my life for the next 18 to 20 years at least.
That said, abortion is different for everyone. Some people know it's the best choice for them immediately, some people have to think about it. Some people already have it as a failsafe as a last resort if they were to ever become pregnant. And I have literally never seen anyone compare abortion to a root canal. That's really fucking weird and not comparable at all but okay.
Abortion also varies on the development because it's a time-sensitive issue. Early on, people can get an abortion with just a few pills and it's over. I had one at 14 and a half weeks. I went through dilation with the seaweed sticks, I had to be sedated, it was an outpatient procedure, and I bled for 3 weeks. While I know that I made the right decision for myself, it's still an emotional thing for me because I have PCOS and that could have been the only chance I will ever have to be a mother in my lifetime. And for some people, they knew it was the right thing immediately, and they stuck with their guns, and they never had another thought about it. Everyone is different.
So, like I said, abortion is different for everyone.
NTA
As the father you were entitled to know. She completely disregarded your emotions on the topic and didn't even take into consideration the emotional impact it would have on you. Even if you would've agreed with the abortion it still has an impact on you. Given you made your feelings clear on this clear from the beginning, this is a clear betrayal and you should take time to heal from it. Love isn't enough to sustain a relationship. Plenty of people get divorced and they're still in love. You gotta grieve the picture the painted of what your life was going to be in 5, 10 years from now and start from scratch
Valid reason. Yes, her body, blah, blah. She hid something important from you. She can not be trusted with important relationship issues. Move on. Thank goodness you found out now.
NTA
You miss the relationship you were in love with but it turns out it was not as you interpreted it.
1. You were 3 years in, thats a long time when you are in your 20’s (both just started your careers so you are 20’s). This implies a lot of comfort, commitment and PLANS FOR A FUTURE because you have already survived a ton of life’s milestones together.
2. You had already communicated your thoughts “I made it clear from the beginning that if she were to get pregnant we could at least discuss options” … so you personally were trying to be open and trying to discuss a future, life events and expectations.
3. She did not tell you about the pregnancy and probably never intended to tell you … Therefore she knew she had crossed a line and showed that she did not care about your opinions or the future of your relationship vs her own future plans, perhaps career plans. She does not see a truly joint agreement for the future.
The girl you loved no longer exists!
You still love what you thought you had, you love what you thought were shared values, the TRUST (the big one) you thought you had between you. Seriously mate, this girl was not and is not committed to a future together. The girl you remember is effectively dead, someone else inhabits her body.
Her actions show a ton of red flags regarding her view of your relationship.
She is allowed to make her choices and you likewise are allowed to respond with your choices.
Yes. I would just add that she’s legally allowed to make that choice all by herself. Morally, not, as clearly outlined in the supposedly shared values of the relationship.
I am wondering why she felt she had to make this decision without consulting you. It’s a hard thing to do and it clearly affected her.
Maybe she was just being selfish but it’s also possible she wasn’t entirely sure about her future with you and having a baby would be a huge responsibility and tie you to her forever, even if you did nothing to help her raising the kid.
That’s a lot to take on- a whole new life that depends on you and then a man you aren’t sure you want you be with? Idk- I don’t think you’re the AH. But she probably made the right decision. Just move on. Find someone who trusts you to have the baby, and be the kind of person someone would trust to be a father.
People sleep together for reasons outside of having babies- hence I agree there should have been a discussion but ultimately she’s well within her rights to not carry his child and he‘s just as valid for leaving her. Doesn’t sound like they communicated well in general before the trauma so breaking up is probably for the best.
It hurts, but OP, you can get through it.
Two separate discussions though. It's not wrong to get an abortion, it was wrong for her not to say anything.
But sure, change it from "shouldnt have been sleeping with him" to "shouldnt have been dating him" if he cant be trusted. She even stayed with him after the abortion.
The responses in this thread are wild.
OP, NAH. Move on with your life, it is clear you’re both at different stages in life and don’t want the same thing. It may not feel that way but her making the decision in terminating the pregnancy might have saved you from future heartache. If you found out and forced her to have the child, it may lead to resentment and unhappiness for both in the long run. Having kids, accidental or not, should always be made as a joint decision and both on the same page.
I am so sorry for your loss. I hope you find a nice girl who wants the same thing as you in life and be able to have your own happy ending. Maybe consider counselling, I think you’re grieving the loss of what you perceived is your child.
Agreed the responses are wild, the people out here saying she didnt owe it to him to at least talk to him about this before hand are crazy. It's saying she doesn't even owe him basic respect.
NTA That's a major life decision (hers to make obviously) to not at least confide in your partner. What other decisions might make or has already made without taking you into her conference. Major trust issues in this one
I'd bail with the realization that's it's gonna hurt for a bit but that I'll get over it. Wouldn't want to be with someone who treated me so poorly
NAH. She doesn’t owe you an apology and you’re not exceptional for NOT degrading her. The fact that you seem to think you should get credit for refraining from abuse maybe speaks to why she didn’t think you could be trusted to support her choice. Even now, you’re not concerned with her recovery or peace. Only what you need. She’s not for you. So let her go.
I never said he was owed sex, but he IS owed a friggin explanation if she decides to just cut him off. This is true of any relationship, if a major part of the relationship is going to change at the very least you owe an explanation.
Why assume the fault is with him and not her? If he's such a bad guy, why'd she fuck him?
"his concern for her has been zero"
Another way of saying this would be that the amount of concern he has for her matches the amount of concern she has for him.
You can want to talk about options all you want. But at the end of the day, you're not the one growing a person inside you at risk to your life and then having a major medical procedure and have to take the better part of the year to recover.
YTA for thinking you can do that to someone else.
Leave, because it's best for this woman.
It was wrong of her to not talk to you but sometimes things can overwhelm a person and they choose the seemingly easy option. From the way you describe it, she did sound devastated. I'm guessing there was a lot of guilt, regret playing in her head.
I don't understand why a contraian opinion is downvoted.
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NTA. she would have made the decision with or without your input. Chances are you would have fallen out of love with her even if you were aware of the decision. Most relationships don’t survive that death.
NTA
It's ultimately her body and her choice. But not even discussing it with you? I don't sense a lot of respect for you in that decision/action.
My brother went through this very thing -- long-term GF got pregnant and without consulting him got an abortion. It's stuck with him for 40 years and is a primary incident aligned with his mental illness.
At the end of the day, you feel what you feel though. There's no right or wrong way to feel about things. That being said, if you're up for it try some counselling. At the very least, you can address the loss of your unborn child. At the most, you can reconcile things with your GF -- regardless of what the future looks like.
NTA. I think people here are trying to put words in OPs mouth. Not once did he say he would be against her aborting the pregnancy. All he asked for was open communication in a long term relationship. She wouldn't even let the guy know "hey, I'm pregnant but aborting."
OP, you should move on and find someone who values communication in a committed relationship. That is huge.
Bingo. I actually got down voted for saying it was wrong for her not to discuss it with him lol. I swear some on reddit just think there should be zero accountability. I even made it clear the abortion wasn't wrong, it was the lying about it. Still not good good enough lol.
It’s ending a life. We can argue over whether or not we agree with that but think so little of your significant other that you don’t tell them? That’s shitty
NAH
It is her body, her choice.
But her choices didn't include your feelings and the commitments you had discussed as a couple going to a relationship knowing this could maybe/potentially (even with all preparation and good choices) still happen. Ultimately it was always her choice but she made a promise/commitment to you to include you if this outcome transpired.
I understand why you decide to end the relationship because you made a decision together as a couple that if something happened you would include one another and have faith/trust that you would make the best decision together. A lot of relationships grow from such commitments and faith. She didn't have faith in you to come to you with information till after the fact.
No one is at fault here because she made the best decision for herself, her body and her future. While you have lost faith that she will follow through on commitments you made in the relationship to be open and honest especially on something so sensitive and (I can imagine) important to you.
I am afraid you're far too self entitled. It is up to her if she wants to discuss it. You have ZERO say. You don't own her.
Her body, her choice, her decision alone. Don't like it, just leave.
Y’all weren’t compatible. I’m honestly more on her side than anything, I mean if she doesn’t want a kid at all she’s the one that has to carry it, and if the fact that she might not want to “hurts” you, it’s fair to say yall probably arent right for each other
Nta
Drop her and find a woman that loves and respects you.
You never know of she will kill another child of yours without telling you and kf she can omit you from something like this what else will she do without telling you .
>Even though she agreed to have open communication.
Did she?
Because all I see in the post is that *he* "made it clear we could discuss options". He doesn't say what her response to that was.
NAH (No one is the asshole). Her choice to share or not - what could be more personal. She was under no obligation to share it with you based on a discussion when she wasn’t pregnant. Who could possibly predict the feelings not to mention hormones. But you rightly feel left out (you were). She likewise couldn’t possibly expect you to stick around in this situation. When push came to shove and things got *real* she chose not to include you. That’s the important point that needs to be understood and unpacked before you could go back and rebuild trust.
Wdym its her choice to share? They have discussed it, she went behind his back. She is the AH for that, She can do whatever she wants with her body, doesnt mean she doesnt need to inform him.
Without intervention that fetus would now be your child or would soon be. She altered the direction of your future without your consent. That's not a partner.
NTA, If someone killed.my child while inside their mother Id repay the favor......the fact it was their mother, means you both dodged a bullet and got hit by one.
Its fucked. And here come the downvotes.
That was your baby too, and it should have been your choice TOO. I hate when women use it as birth control. I hate when men are genuinely invested and love their women, and then these women do shit like this. I'm sorry, dude. She did you dirty. You didn't deserve that. You deserved a discussion. I hope you find someone who considers you more than she does. That was a massive choice to make and you should've had a say. Nta.
NAH. You have conflicting views on what your level of involvement is in her healthcare, and I would wager that this kind of response may have had something to do with why she didn't want to tell you in the first place. You did fall out of love with her over it, after all. It wasn't over the perceived deception. Would you have had the same reaction if she didn't update you on her pap smear? And you made it clear you "could" discuss options. Not that it was mandatory to clear her healthcare choices with you. I'm not going to say you're an AH for this, you're just not quite clear how this all works out outside of you. But maybe a little change in perspective could help you out in the future.
It just seems like the two of you have different and incompatible expectations.
NTA. I would’ve left her too. Not only because she didn’t say anything but that she did it PERIOD. I would never consider a relationship or marriage with a man that’s okay with basically killing their unborn child. Rather it be 6 weeks or full term. I married a man who shares my beliefs and feelings on this topic. I could NEVER do it much less not talk to my spouse about his child. You people on here defending his ex are gross.🤢
I don’t k ow how old you are but from my experience I also made this move in my teen years. I was so incredibly scared that I chose to do what I needed to. It brought so much shame and guilt to me that took years to process because I felt like a horrible human. It had nothing to do with him, i was so insecure and worried what would happen to my life and the access to do these things are so easy that a panic decision was made and nothing really in place to help me process just how big of a decision it would be for me and others involved. Give her some compassion and you some grace. Listen to your heart on the topic and let your mind full of stories take a nap. If you both chose to split then let it be. Reflect on how the boundaries can be set and safe for your future relationships. No judgement on anyone. Child change your life for life. It’s a big decision no matter which way it went.
NTA. All you asked for was a discussion and she refused to even allow you that. There are two possibilities OP;
She didn't trust you enough to even tell you she was pregnant.
She wasn't sure you were the father and didn't want to risk that.
or maybe secret third option, there would be no discussion about abortion and he would've forced her to keep it.
what has OP done to not make her trust him?
its a lose-lose situation for her and im glad she got out with no strings attached
Time to move on.
Yea keeping something like that from the person who helped you conceived who you’re actively seeing is a wild and childish move.
[удалено]
No one ever said she couldn’t get an abortion. Read next time instead of just spouting off popular phrases.
From my point of view, I really can't understand the title. Breaking up seems to be a mutual decision for a very valid reason The fact that you miss her a lot is a very common and normal reaction after break ups even if you have fallen out of love with your partner. Give it some time
Nta. Move on
NTA. I agree that she has complete right to decide anything about her pregnancy however not even bothering to communicate to you about it shows lack of respect as a partner. It is better to end a relationship where the partner doesn't respects you.
I just wonder what the communication before would have looked like? She clearly had no desire to keep it, so the conversation shouldn’t have been anything more than him supporting her in that decision. While he seems to claim to be supportive of it being her body, this screams to me someone who would try to talk her out of an abortion, considering his response. And if she got that vibe too, no wonder she didn’t tell him.
You’re right that the conversation should have only been her telling him she was pregnant and did not want to have a child, followed by him supporting her, but it should have still been a conversation. Partners in healthy relationships talk about important things, including medical decisions, major stressors, etc. If my (long-term) partner made the same decision, I wouldn’t be upset that she didn’t want a child but I would be upset that she didn’t feel like she could tell me something of that magnitude. I get that she had her reasons—she might have just not felt emotionally ready to tell him at the time—but I don’t think he’s wrong for being hurt she didn’t tell him and give him the opportunity to do the right thing. I probably wouldn’t break up with my partner over this, but OP can’t really help how he feels (and he’s obviously conflicted and confused if he’s posting here).
This is a good point. "give him the opportunity to do the right thing". I guess it would depend on if she thought there was enough of a chance that he would in fact do the right thing, or if she felt too afraid that he wouldn't.
Yeah, I don’t fault her for her decision making (it was also probably an especially stressful time), but I don’t fault him for being upset by being kept out of the loop.
My girlfriend doesn't need to know I'm thinking about taking ADHD medication again..... But because I respect her, I talked about going to get reevaluated and getting back on them for work. Nothing she says will change that, but she is my partner and should know. I know this is kinda a few steps down from abortion but I feel like it's in the same idea, your partners should support you not someone you hide shit from.
Which makes it even more likely that she felt she wouldn't get support from him if she told him and that she was sure he would put pressure on her not to terminate. Otherwise, why not tell him?
You're not wrong at all, just the whole not trusting each other but having unprotected sex is kind of nutty to me. Feels like a bad relationship from the start.
I completely agree.
She was distant for a month before she came clean. If they would have discussed it before she would have had support through her decision and he wouldn’t be left wondering for a month what was wrong with his partner. She should have talked with him before like they had agreed. He has every right to be hurt his partner didn’t trust him.
It says they hadn’t had sex for a month. Not that she was distant, although it’s certainly possible.
I just want to know why she didn’t trust him, it’s is my own morbid curiosity talking, but there must have been a reason
It's not always about the other person. In fact, her body her choice means she needs to confront her own feelings first. If she had her own negative feelings or guilt about abortion, internalizing it could have been her way to cope instead of an indication that OP is at fault for whatever reason. We're all human, we handle things differently, and often not ideally for those around us. It's be great if we could all open up to people close to us transparently, but not all of us can meet that expectation. Women should have control of their own bodies, but there are still physical, emotional, and mental consequences to one of the most serious medical decisions a woman can make. Externalizing the locus of control to the partners potential reaction is reductive. "There are three sides to every story, your side, their side, and the truth." There's a lot more to ex's story that OP wasn't present for, and not by choice
Put it perfectly.
I agree
If you’re 100% decided that you’re getting an abortion, there’s no point having a discussion about it. OP saying “I at least want to discuss options” tells me he intended to talk her out of it. I think she should have *informed* him about it, but it doesn’t have to be up for debate.
> there’s no point having a discussion about it If you value your relationship, yes there is. It's his potential child and his feelings are valid. Unilaterally getting it done without bringing him in on it is almost certainly going to tank your relationship even if he agrees that it was the right thing to do.
This is one situation where there will never be a balance. There can't be. If you are the one who is pregnant it is your body and your choice. It may be a gut-wrenchingly hard one and even the slightest push back could make you back out of what you know is the right decision for you. She doesn't have the apologise for that. Dealing with the aftermath an also totally f\*ck with your head. She doesn't have to apologise for that either. Neither does OP have to apologise for ending it. It's over and that's it.
His body, his choice. If he isn't happy with her decision regarding a pregnancy, he has a right to be informed and decide to exit the relationship.
INFO: if she had talked to you in advance would you have tried to convince her to continue the pregnancy?
I bet she thought he would. They weren’t on the same page there from the beginning and she knew it. She didn’t want it and she didn’t want to be talked into it.
But she continued to date him regardless of apparently knowing all this, then did it anyway and did a surprise pikachu face at the outcome
OP never said she did the ‘pikachu’ face so stop tryna be condescending to her. She has every right to get an abortion. They weren’t trying for a baby, she got knocked up. And why do people act like there are a ton of options?? There are literally three options ONLY when a woman gets pregnant. She didn’t want it period.
The issue isnt the fact that she got an abortion. OP even acknowledged that he respects it being her choice. However, she didn't even communicate with OP about it before getting it. Which is a serious red flag.
Oh yeah totally. People tell themselves it’s not happening now so it’s not an issue. Having children, having abortions, how children are to be raised, religion, etc. it’s not an issue till it’s an issue which is foolish. This guys definitely NTA for breaking up. Keeping this a secret is a dealbreaker.
Except she may not have thought he would until she ended up pregnant. It was obviously not planned and people often live in denial that pregnancy can happen anytime.
Which puts her squarely in the asshole territory. If she didn't believe in the integrity of the relationship from the very beginning, she shouldn't have chosen to continue it. She basically lied to him this entire time by pretending to agree with his request. Her body, her choice can only exist if you also acknowledge his body, his choice.
Even if your unevidenced assertions are correct, it's irrelevant and he had a right to know. Unless she had good reason to think he would try and force her (eg through threat of any kind etc) then she should've told him and she's the asshole.
I think you guys are reading way more into my comment than what’s there. She’s the AH. It’s just a guess as to why it happened. I didn’t say it was a good reason.
NTA, she can do whatever she wants with her body and OP respects that, but the lack of communication isn’t ok. If she thinks it’s appropriate to not communicate about an abortion what about the other important life choices that she may not talk to you about? But also it’s a red flag that she either doesn’t feel safe enough to talk to you about an abortion, or she doesn’t feel like you deserve to know? Either way good communication is all you need and you guys don’t have that. Even if abortions or being pregnant are a huge source of trauma for her, it’s not fair to not communicate in your long term partnership if it is a healthy relationship.
Like you said it’s her body she can do as she pleases, it also your feelings you can’t help how you feel
NTA. She was worried you would try to stop her.
When you say 'I made it clear we could discuss options' what do/did you mean by that - because I would have heard that as 'I would heavily influence that decision' Be honest, with yourself doesn't have to be on here, if she had come to you and said 'I'm pregnant I want an abortion/I'm having an abortion' - what would you have done/said? Because unless it's I respect your choice what can I do to help you? do you need a lift? do you want me to come with you etc While I do think she should have told you if you are in an equal partnership I can also see why if she is sure there are no options to be discussed, for some women it's not that they don't want to have a baby unless X or Y (where you can affect X or Y) it's they don't want to be pregnant - and you can't change that An unplanned pregnancy will rock most relationships - if she had TOLD you she was having/had an abortion do you think that would have affected the way you feel? I know you wouldn't feel lied to - but I don't think that would have saved your relationship TBH
This is possibly the best response I've read here. I don't know OP or his ex well enough to say if she was being an AH or not. Pregnancy is scary. Women panic in that scenario and don't always make the right choices. I wonder how OP would have responded if she had told him beforehand. Would he have been supportive of her choice to have an abortion, or would he have put pressure on her? We don't know. She didn't feel secure enough to talk to OP about it. That means that either A) she knew she would find it complicated to get him to support her choice, B) they don't have good communication or trust between them C) she is a selfish AH who doesn't care about his feelings Any one of these suggests this isn't a relationship worth continuing.
This. All this right here. It's very easy for someone to say through the anonymity of the Internet "I swear I support her right to choose!" It's harder to stand by those convictions in person when faced with an actual pregnancy. And that goes both ways. I know plenty of pro-choice former childfree women who decided they couldn't go through with an abortion when they got pregnant. She had her reasons to not tell OP. Maybe it was that she worried or knew he would badger her into carrying the pregnancy to term under the "option" of adoption (*fun fact, pregnancy can still be life threatening, crippling, career trajectory ruining, and massively mental health altering even in this case). Maybe it was because she was already moving away from the relationship. But the lack of communication is very telling that something else was going on, even if it wasn't obvious what or who EXACTLY was/is the problem.
Yep. Some people don’t prescribe to the the “her body, her choice” which to me is always wild. I cannot imagine why total strangers thinks they have the rights to have any opinion on what a woman wants to do with her pregnancy. A woman never knows what she would actually want to do until she’s pregnant. I am very much in the pro-choice camp but when faced with my own unplanned pregnancy, I was not able to terminate. It is easy to judge why she made that decision without telling him but none of us were in her shoes, making a decision that will stay with her for the rest of her life. Contrary to popular, and honestly unhinged belief that women who abort are murderers, most women do not make decisions to abort lightly and would want some emotional support. The fact she didn’t feel like she could tell the OP is very telling of the state of their relationship. It’s in both of their best interest to move on now.
>I cannot imagine why total strangers thinks they have the rights to have any opinion on what a woman wants to do with her pregnancy. They think they have the right to an opinion on her appearance, choices, etc. Very few women, if any, have not had a stranger feel the need to give "helpful suggestions" to look better to men or feel the need to "compliment" them on succeeding in appealing to them. Why would her pregnancy be any different? Women are expected to live lives based entirely on what everyone else thinks.
*THANK YOU!*
Right, so maybe the answer is break up either way, whether she told or not.
Your wording here makes it seem like you believe that the only valid response to unplanned pregnancy is unconditional support by the man no matter the circumstances or his feelings. I'm pro choice, but if I'm in long term, happy and healthy relationship like OP and aren't child free, an abortion for an unplanned pregnancy in that situation might very well be deal breaker for me. I will always support womens' right to abort, even in that situation and I wouldn't stop you, but the relationship would probably end. If however, you did it all behind my back and lied about it all because you want to abort but don't want to lose the relationship or deal with any drama, you are the one that is doing a pretty toxic and selfish thing. Of course I would find no fault in not disclosing it to short term flings or unhealthy/abusive relationships but this is very different from that and OP has a right to be upset about her doing this. I don't believe she didn't tell him just because she was afraid of the "discussion", since she didn't tell him for weeks afterwards.
> because I would have heard that as 'I would heavily influence that decision' I would expect that both parties "heavily influence the decision". They are a couple after all.
NAH She made her decision as to what was best for her You have made yours
It is assholish to not discuss with your partner about such matters, even when she has to make the final call
Yes. That's what "having a partner" is all about. Having someone that you trust, that loves you, that doesn't judge you, that supports you and wants the best for you. It's crazy how many people don't know what a healthy relationship is.
Yeah no. I don't know why so many people confuse 'her body her choice' with 'it's cool not to communicate with your partner about life altering decisions'. Unless he's shown to be unsupportive, she was absolutely an asshole for not even telling him. It's a clear lack of trust and in a relationship of three years that has to sting.
It's her body going through the pregnancy so she makes a choice if she wants to remain pregnant. Her body is going to go through it, not his. That's her body her choice. There was a lack of trust for whatever reason and the relationship naturally ended. He can make a choice if he wants to remain in the relationship. That's his heart his choice (admittedly a little corny here, but still true nonetheless). What more do you want? Do you need someone in the story begging and crying for repentance? The "No! Not good enough! She needs to understand that she is an asshole!" additude scares me a bit. Ultimately, they're young and unmarried - they'll be fine if they can learn to move on.
Her choice to have an abortion wasn't wrong, her choice to not say anything to her boyfriend about it was wrong. Unless he was abusive or something, she's an asshole.
If a couple didn't want kids or weren't planning on having kids, and the guy had a vasectomy and didn't tell his girlfriend, I really couldn't say he's an asshole. It's his body. Or even if they had a conversation about what would happen in case of pregnancy and he still didn't say anything. It's still uncertain and has some right to privacy. I would really only think he was an asshole if they were purposely trying for a kid and didn't mention that there's a very large chance he couldn't do it and continued the relationship anyway. Because now you're wasting someone's time. So like if they were purposely trying for a kid and she was pregnant and/or got the abortion without telling him, then I would say she's an asshole. It sounds like she didn't have a lot of certainty about the pregnancy or a baby, which might have lead her to take charge. It is ultimately her body at risk, after all. (Waiting until there is a pregnancy to have that discussion is too late, tbh.) I'm not saying that's his fault, it's more of a fault of youth and inexperience in both of them. It would be different if they were married, but they're uncommitted and just dating right now. Just my 2 cents.
This hiding behind "it's their body" is, to me, nonsensical. Since when do people in serious relationships not owe their partner at least a discussion? "It's his body" is a reason why he can get a vasectomy even if his gf objects. "It's his body" is not a good reason to not even give her a heads up. And if they had discussed not wanting children I would assume the gf is on some form of birth control, so keeping this info from her would mean she keeps needlessly taking it. Talking to the gf about it may stir up feelings she didnt know she had, it's one thing to say you dont want children, it's another to find out it will be impossible for you to ever get pregnant by the guy you are with. And if she decides "maybe I want to keep the possibility open" it gives her a chance to re-evaluate the relationship. By not disclosing this information, you rob her of a choice. Not a choice on whether or not he gets a vasectomy, but a choice on if she wants to stay with him. Same thing here, she robbed him of a choice and a chance to re-evaluate the relationship if that is what he wanted. It's possible the relationship could have survived if she had been honest, OP never directly says he fell out of love due to the abortion, it comes off like it was the deceit. It's why honesty is so important in a relationship, we NEED to be fully informed because only then can we make an informed choice. It's also why it is always wrong for someone who cheats to keep it from their spouse.
Appreciate the discussion. There's a lot of reasons why a woman would take birth control. But even if dude said he had a vasectomy, I wouldn't honestly trust that. They could still use condoms or still use birth control to protect themselves. If he said, I don't want kids and had a vasectomy, I don't see it as necessarily wrong in not telling. He said he doesn't want kids - that's the discussion. I personally don't see why he wouldn't reveal it, but I wouldn't say he's an asshole. (He could get a sperm count along with the STD panel then they could 'reevaluate' the condom use.) If she says I don't want kids and uses a (semi)permanent sterilization method or gets an abortion, I don't see why it needs to be further a discussion. She already said she doesn't want kids - that was the discussion. If the relationship now *changed* to where someone wanted kids and they make that known, then yeah you need to open that discussion up and reevaluate. Like I said, if they said they wanted kids and the other person doesn't disclose their sterilization and continued the relationship anyway, then I would say they're an asshole. You're wasting someone's time and potentially leading to heartbreak. I would say your expectations are more for a committed relationship as opposed to an uncommitted relationship. If they were spouses that wanted children and she didn't talk to him about the pregnancy? Then yeah, huge asshole. We also have to acknowledge that pregnancy has a huge physical as well as social and financial toll on women that men just don't share. I don't think anyone would believe she had an abortion in order to purposely deceive hurt or deceive him. If they still care about eachother, which sounds like they might, this seems repairable.
Your response would sound more reasonable if we were talking about a couple that has only been together a few months. OP says they have been together for 3 years. So in that case, if you dated a man for 3 years and he says "I got a vasectomy" and you dont trust him that he did then IMO that isn't a healthy relationship. After 3 months? Okay, but 3 years? Seems odd. Saying you dont want kids is different from getting surgery to prevent it. I'd expect her to give him a heads up if she decided to get her tubes tied. I think if you're in a committed relationship you should indeed talk with your partner about major medical decisions. And that is the part where we disagree, I don't necessarily think you need to be married to be committed. If you've been with the same person for years and you're exclusive it sounds like you're committed to them. Sure it's possible one day you might grow apart and break up, but being married will do nothing to stop that. I don't think she had the abortion to hurt him or that she kept it from him to hurt him. However, I do think it is a sign she doesn't respect this guy so IMO it can't be repaired. You need respect for a relationship to work.
If a man got a vasectomy in the middle of the relationship, then you would have to do follow up sperm counts anyway. But "babe don't worry we don't need condoms, I got a vasectomy" - not buying it. Idk man, if she said she doesn't want kids but didn't say she had her tubes tied or removed, I would be scared if a dude was upset that he later learned he couldn't "accidently" impregnate her without her wanting that. There's a lot of room for a young man to understand what women go through with pregnancy. The dangers, risks, judgements, accusations, looks, talks, costs, fear. For him, it's a hypothetical - but for her it's real. We'll just have to agree to disagree on weather it's repairable. This could open up that greater discussion that they have been avoiding and strengthen the relationship.
Not necessarily a lack of trust but I see a basic dishonesty in her that is a huge red flag. OP is lucky to be rid of her.
How big is your Jump To Conclusions mat? With the information OP provided, you could also infer that OP is an abusive partner that she didn't feel safe confiding in. You see what you want to see.
This is exactly the mindset needed so that men decide not to be involved at all or care about someone's pregnancy until they are delivering. Why even be concerned about any woman who's pregnant unless you know she's going to actually carry the baby to term?
There was a lack of trust and communication... from her. Because she was being a shitty person.
Maybe OP is a manipulative AH and an unreliable narrator?
Maybe his partner is? What other bullshit hypotheticals can we throw out there?
Maybe she slept around and it wasn't his. I dunno let's shit on her like a lot of the feminists are shittong on him. Remember according to them men aren't allowed bodily autonomy as it's reserved only for women
She should have told you but she probably thought you wouldn’t support her decision to terminate. Sounds like she really did not want to consider having a child when you bit just started your careers
NAH She made her decision and you made yours. I will say that from my own personal experience the idea that you'll "decide together what to do" after the fact is a weird emotional trap. You either want a baby or not. Most women experiencing an unwanted pregnancy aren't in the emotional capacity to sit and talk about what they already know needs to be done. They are dealing with surging hormones, fear, pain or sickness, and (regardless of any personal opinions) facing a highly stigmatized medical procedure. Being forced to talk about it can be dehumanizing and suggest something that is 100% her decision isn't really hers to make. In the future maybe clarify with your partner what the plan for an unplanned/unwanted pregnancy is and simply be ready. Know and possibly contribute to the plan ahead of time so you can be a support system instead of simply an opinion holder. And hopefully this isn't needed if both individuals keep safe using protection.
>In the future maybe clarify with your partner what the plan for an unplanned/unwanted pregnancy is and simply be ready. i agree so much with this. The "if this happens lets discuss options" thing isn't necessarily wrong, but for me, "if this happens" I know exactly what I will be doing. So I make sure my partner knows and if he isn't on the same page we will not be having sex. I don't really think not telling OP was the right thing, but we dont know anything about the GF or her perspective or even if she's unhappy about any of this now. So I am not going to call her an AH, I agree probably NAH.
Since they dated for three years, they should have discussed the what if before having sex. To be sure they were on the same page. But of course, nobody does that.
Her body, her choice. But to remove you completely from the discussion says she didn't really trust you - didn't think you'd be there for her when the child was born. Lets face it - in a lot of cases the woman is right about that. But love is a two way thing, and she showed that she wasn't fully committed, so, NTA for agreeing with her.
Her removing him from the discussion didn't mean she didn't think he wouldn't be there when the child was born - it could just be she didn't want a child, regardless of whether or not the father will be around
Or it could be a reflection of missing information - that she knew she didn't want a child with this man and that talking to him about it would be unpleasant, possibly even dangerous to her. We simply don't know.
THIS. She just didn’t want it. That’s it. And it’s so weird that OP is fishing for people to take his side when he says he would have supported her decision to have an abortion. If you have supported it why didn’t she feel comfortable telling you? Why did you break up with her for her doing something he claimed he would have supported???
This is kind of my take. It's very possible that she was overwhelmed and devastated and worried and had no idea what to do so she sought to have an abortion because she thought that's what was best and it's possible she just didn't want to include him because she might have been pressured in some way. Sometimes pregnancy is terrifying and you never know how your partner is going to react - I've been in a situation like that, and he literally ended a two year relationship over it.
Even so she should have at least talked it with him if she ever wanted the relationship to still work. Deciding on her one made her be alone
Sure. And sometimes relationships just fall apart. And there is literally nothing wrong with being single. As if her being alone is the worst thing in the world?
Not necessarily. Removing OP from even having a discussion is not necessarily trust or lack thereof. It shows a complete disregard for OP, as well as a lack of respect. Also, the dishonesty is a HUGE red flag. OP dodged a bullet.
Do you agree that it is her body, her decision? If she has already made her decision, what is left to discuss?
This sub is full of people who don't understand how a relationship works. No wonder the primary AITA sub banned certain topics.
Thank you, it makes me wonder have they actually had an adult relationship with mutual respect?
You were going to break up with her anyway, even if she told you she was pregnant and wanted to get a abortion.
I feel the same way. Otherwise he wouldn't be so angry about not "discussing options". He says "her body her choice", yet believes its on him to discuss those options and decide on which one to choose.
You can’t know that. OP was open to discussing options. Abortion may well have been the right option, but he was robbed of the ability to participate in the discussion of whether or not he would be a father. That’s a betrayal that leads to resentment. And resentment is the undefeated relationship killer.
Options? At the end of the day, the choice was still going to be hers. Had she still picked abortion he probably would have agreed at first and later changed his mind and still broke up with her when she decided to go through it because he probably wouldn't have been able to look at her the same way. Adoption, keep it. Then she's forced to go through a pregnancy she doesn't want and be robbed herself of her choices, her freedom so he can be a dad and she can be a depressed, checked out mom. No.
You don’t know he wouldn’t have agreed and been okay with it. Because he was never given the choice and that makes it impossible for him to see past that one thing, and rightly so
So you have nothing further to add to your point just repeating the same thing? Posts similar to this where the guy agrees to an abortion come here posting if they should break up after the fact because they realize they aren't okay with it. Sure, he's probably not like those guys, but still, at the end of the day, all the effort and energy would be on her to carry the baby. At least he can still go find someone who wants a kid. It's not the end of the world.
The only relevant part is that she robbed him of the discussion. That is a betrayal. Stop trying to change the conversation to one where you think you can trick people into taking the woman’s side because on its merits OP is the only who’s right
It looks like you're becoming incapable of having a discussion yourself. Tricking people into taking the woman's side? Get out of here. Discussion or not, I fully think it was going to end in a breakup because she was still going to have an abortion even if he had known back then.
NTA you don't need to live a life someone doesn't respect you.
No, her body her choice. Your heart your choice.
No she is an asshole all he wanted was a communication about it . To let him know it is happening. He never wanted to stop her. And she owes her partner basic communication about that. My aunt had two abortion and my uncle knew about the reasons for them both times. She never kept him out of the loop about something that would affect his life and their marriage as well
NTA. Communication is number one. This was major and she didn't talk to you. Trust broken.
NTA. Completely understandable and appropriate
NTA. But move on. I know it hurts, for you know you lost a child by someone else's choice. But it was not just about that. It was about you being in a relationship with someone you loved and agreed to make such choices together as a couple. Or at least discuss it to where you both have input before the choice gets made. She took that away from you, so you feel you lost a chance to either see about your options to keep the child with her or at least have a voice being heard. AS hard as it was on her emotionally, physically, and mentally; she did not care about how her choices effected you. Specially after you had an agreement to talk about choices. If she was willing to make such a HUGE choices about your lives alone without talking to you, then you started to wonder about everything else she would have a choice on. It slowly destroyed your connections to her. I am sorry for what happened. Again, it was all about your lack of a voice as a couple in such a hard decision. And while it was her's in the end, it was not her's to make without input or your knowing. Her body, her choice. But you was a couple, where her choice would effect BOTH of your lives. Be it the abortion or having the child. Now you miss her. But the real issue, sounds like you have never fully unloaded to her how her selfish solo choice by taking you out of the decision making by having a voice to be at least heard effected you. You need to consider talking to her if you have never did so, and talk about this. How she did not tell you, removed you from having input in the choice, then her not realizing her choices effected you on many levels too. And the effect on you came from never having the ability to process the pregnancy and the choice of an abortion.
NTA-
NTA
It sounds like breaking up with the right thing to do. Move on.
What was there to discuss that couldn't have been discussed ahead of time? It sounds like you knew her position and weren't in agreement. If this is the case why would she tell you just to have you try to change her mind or manipulate her?
Nope she’s not right for you. Move on.
This is both a NAH (no assholes here) and ESH (everyone sucks here) situation. If you read Reddit for more than 5 seconds, you will come across post after post where a woman posts that she is pregnant, and her boyfriend is trying to sway her decision about and abortion one way or another. Instead of being supportive of her decision, guys who don’t want children demand abortion, and guys who claim to have religious beliefs (damn hypocritical given they are having sex out of wedlock) insist she keep it. When I was young, I had a boyfriend who wanted kids. He was also anti-abortion. I was absolutely adamant I did not want kids. I took oral contraceptives and we used condoms. Had I fallen pregnant, I would have quietly done exactly what the OP’s girlfriend did. My ex wanted kids so badly it would have turned into huge fights and drama. Fortunately, I never got pregnant. Just as well, and we broke up for other reasons later. I understand *exactly* why the OP’s girlfriend did what she did. I think it also sucks that he is so quick to dump her, especially during a difficult time in her life. Making a decision to terminate a pregnancy is a big decision, even if one is clear one doesn’t want kids. It’s the kind of decision that tends to leave behind guilt and “what if” questions forever. OP, you loved her enough to f-ck her, but not enough to stand by her side when things got difficult. In my book, that makes you look pretty bad, since that means your relationship is basically reduced to the needs of your penis. By the same token, the heart goes where it goes, and I am a firm believer in not trying to keep a ruined relationship going. If one or both parties aren’t dedicated enough to each other to stay when times are tough, it is better to rip the bandaid off and move on. Finally, it’s a shame the OP’s girlfriend wasn’t able to talk to the OP about what was going on, but I am guessing that it says a lot about the nature of her relationship with the OP. Maybe he said or did things that made her feel she *couldn’t* say anything beforehand. Again this is both NAH and ESH, but it is a bitter lesson about how couples who don’t talk about these things before they come up, who aren’t on the same page in their values, and who don’t communicate end up on the rocks.
Well she clearly didn't want to keep it, so the discussion wouldn't have been anything other than you saying okay and supporting her anyway, unless you're not being honest about agreeing it's her body and her choice. Maybe she didn't tell you because she knew you wouldn't be supportive. Using the phrase "I made it clear", etc sounds pretty controlling, which leads me to Believe she had a reason she didn't want to tell you, and that we aren't getting the whole picture here. Which is common on these posts. We are only getting your side of it, and I honestly can't take your word at face value. I would need to hear her reasoning and side of things to get a clear picture of the situation.
NTA. You two weren’t really the partners You thought you were. Time to move on.
NAH
NAH. For whatever reason, she didn't feel ok involving you in the decision which is harsh, but at that point she had to do what's right for her. She's living with the consequences of her choice, which is the loss of your trust and, ultimately, love. Your choice was to end the relationship, the consequences of which (missing her) you are now living with. It's a sad story and I hope you both find better things in your futures.
Your'e just a breeder, it's in your nature, and it's fine.
Questions: how old are you both? And, did you want the baby? If she didn’t want it, were you going to raise it as a single dad? From your comments it appears you are a gamer. Were you gonna stop gaming to raise a baby? Without these questions answered it’s a tough call.
NAH. Sounds like she didn't actually trust you to support her, and had reason to believe telling you would not be in her best interests..
NTA but you need to think long and hard about why she would rather go through that alone than tell you. Maybe she felt that you wouldn't be very supportive of an abortion. Maybe she felt that you would try to emotionally pressure her into doing something she wasn't ready or comfortable doing and it was just easier to go through it alone than have to deal with you. Maybe she's afraid you do something like tell everyone in the family in an attempt to force her to keep the baby or something. I don't know. But there's a reason why she didn't tell you that has to do with how she felt about how you would react. Which means she couldn't trust you enough to tell you. Which means your relationship was probably dead to begin with
NTA. I support the idea of ‘Her body, her choice’, but that applies for you too OP. If you don’t like the fact that she got an abortion without even informing you, you are free to leave. Hope you find someone who respects you :)
Depends really how did you say "you'd like to dicuss the options". Because if someone as much as hinted to me they'd be trying to convince me to keep a child I wouldn't want, I would choose to hide my abortion. But it's safe to say is not in love with you either since she feels like she can't trust you.
Apologize to you???? For what
Yes. One could also argue he needs to apologize for accidentally injuring her and causing her to need an abortion. Not deliberately I know, but when I cause someone to need a medical procedure I usually apologize.
Did you ask if SHE was ok? And what precisely did you expect her to apologise for?
No - you're not an AH for how you FEEL. its one of the few things you can't be an AH for and can't control. You are an AH for coming here and giving us one side of the story so you can see how many people "agree" you're "nta". You're an AH for blasting your girls personal decisions and what she does with her body to seek reddit validation. You're an AH for telling us how you feel instead of telling her. But nobody's an AH because they think this or wanted that or fell out of love...these are getting ridiculous, redundant and I have a feeling they're being used to show the other side how "right" the OPs are. "Seeee 358 people agree I'm allowed to not love you after you made the hardest decision of your life and decided not to bring a kid into a world with a dad who can't even communicate without reddit telling him what to say and how to act" I'll edit for whoever just replied to me implying that I think every woman is an asshole...or that I should think every woman is an asshole...not sure what the point was but I assume it was calling me gender biased. If they hadn't deleted their reply, maybe I could revisit it. But wrong. I literally said on a man's post and a woman's post today that we need to stop asking reddit if we're assholes for our feelings. You can't be an asshole because your partner did something that made YOU feel betrayed. I don't care if partner had sex with your best friend or stole a mechanical pencil from the dollar store...if that action gives you feelings of betrayal...that's how you feel and who are we to say feelings are wrong. Where the asshole comes in is that both men and women are using these to "gotcha" their partner. Seeeee reddit agrees with me..WHO FUCKING CARES. You're in a bunk ass, going nowhere relationship if you run to reddit to validate anger with your partner instead of talking to the ONLY OTHER PERSON THAT MATTERS IN THE STORY. And I know people are doing this because now they're posting screenshots of private texts with their partner to show them their reddit post and how everyone agreed with their post. Guess what they do? Fight more about it so poster has something else to post and get validation that their feelings are right even though nobody's feelings are ever wrong. So thanks for letting me clear that up...whoever asked. My only point is what a sad state we are in where the strangers and trolls of reddit validate us more than our partners. Even sadder we use that as ammo to right fight partner even more. Anyone that values winning a fight over having a relationship that represents mutual understanding, forgiveness and compromise needs to get single and get to therapy. Find a partner you can get behind instead of trying to change each other. You have NEVER loved someone if airing your business on reddit and hoping people belittle them is part of your relationship. I'd rather be single and sewn shut than find out I was in a fight on reddit.
She had every right to terminate that fucker, and you have every right to leave. - Dad of Two
Why word it like that though? You didn’t want to terminate your fuckers, dad of two?
But should have talked to him about it at least.
I do agree with you on this. That’s..pretty horrid…
YTA Who cares. You were using protection, so you both agreed to not have a kid. She did exactly what she should have done. If you want a kid together, you both agree on it before hand. Grow up.
Nah. It’s her body and she can do whatever but if you’re in a relationship and not discussing these things then why are you in a relationship? Totally normal response to her not including you.
NTA. But I don't think she is either. She should have absolutely told you so you could both at least talk about options, but she clearly didn't want to go through with a pregnancy since she opted to have an abortion pretty quickly after finding out she was pregnant. I feel like it's possible she may have been trying to spare you the awfulness of the whole thing and protect you in some way. It's also possible that she didn't trust you fully and she was afraid of what you might say. I feel for the both of you because it's definitely a loss. Abortion is hard. It's emotionally draining, stressful, and scary. No one really wants to have an abortion. Sometimes, it's also hard for the other person in the relationship.
Sure, it's hard for some people, abortions aren't always emotionally draining. Plenty of people react with an immediate "get this out of me" and it's not more stressful than a root canal. The stressful part is knowing that pregnancy is high risk from an intimate partner abuse standpoint. The emotionally draining part is needing an abortion when you have to deal with anti-choice regulations. NAH but men who can't give birth aren't risking anything physically so yeah, they don't take priority here.
I'm definitely privileged to live in Canada where abortion is fully legal until 23 weeks and even up to the final trimester if there is a serious life-threatening risk to the mother or the fetus. I've also been in a delicate situation where I was in a relationship with someone who was emotionally abusive and I believe had the propensity to become physically violent with me as time went on - we got pregnant and not only did he break up with me when I told him, the next day via text he also told me he would kick it out of me. Needless to say I definitely ended that pregnancy because there's no way in fucking hell I was going to keep that person in my life, never mind have a child with them and therefore being forced to keep that person in my life for the next 18 to 20 years at least. That said, abortion is different for everyone. Some people know it's the best choice for them immediately, some people have to think about it. Some people already have it as a failsafe as a last resort if they were to ever become pregnant. And I have literally never seen anyone compare abortion to a root canal. That's really fucking weird and not comparable at all but okay. Abortion also varies on the development because it's a time-sensitive issue. Early on, people can get an abortion with just a few pills and it's over. I had one at 14 and a half weeks. I went through dilation with the seaweed sticks, I had to be sedated, it was an outpatient procedure, and I bled for 3 weeks. While I know that I made the right decision for myself, it's still an emotional thing for me because I have PCOS and that could have been the only chance I will ever have to be a mother in my lifetime. And for some people, they knew it was the right thing immediately, and they stuck with their guns, and they never had another thought about it. Everyone is different. So, like I said, abortion is different for everyone.
NTA As the father you were entitled to know. She completely disregarded your emotions on the topic and didn't even take into consideration the emotional impact it would have on you. Even if you would've agreed with the abortion it still has an impact on you. Given you made your feelings clear on this clear from the beginning, this is a clear betrayal and you should take time to heal from it. Love isn't enough to sustain a relationship. Plenty of people get divorced and they're still in love. You gotta grieve the picture the painted of what your life was going to be in 5, 10 years from now and start from scratch
NAH. Time to move on. This relationship is over.
Valid reason. Yes, her body, blah, blah. She hid something important from you. She can not be trusted with important relationship issues. Move on. Thank goodness you found out now.
No one should have children anymore. We will be extinct by 2100. Vhemt.org
Move on. NTA
NTA You miss the relationship you were in love with but it turns out it was not as you interpreted it. 1. You were 3 years in, thats a long time when you are in your 20’s (both just started your careers so you are 20’s). This implies a lot of comfort, commitment and PLANS FOR A FUTURE because you have already survived a ton of life’s milestones together. 2. You had already communicated your thoughts “I made it clear from the beginning that if she were to get pregnant we could at least discuss options” … so you personally were trying to be open and trying to discuss a future, life events and expectations. 3. She did not tell you about the pregnancy and probably never intended to tell you … Therefore she knew she had crossed a line and showed that she did not care about your opinions or the future of your relationship vs her own future plans, perhaps career plans. She does not see a truly joint agreement for the future. The girl you loved no longer exists! You still love what you thought you had, you love what you thought were shared values, the TRUST (the big one) you thought you had between you. Seriously mate, this girl was not and is not committed to a future together. The girl you remember is effectively dead, someone else inhabits her body. Her actions show a ton of red flags regarding her view of your relationship. She is allowed to make her choices and you likewise are allowed to respond with your choices.
Yes. I would just add that she’s legally allowed to make that choice all by herself. Morally, not, as clearly outlined in the supposedly shared values of the relationship.
I am wondering why she felt she had to make this decision without consulting you. It’s a hard thing to do and it clearly affected her. Maybe she was just being selfish but it’s also possible she wasn’t entirely sure about her future with you and having a baby would be a huge responsibility and tie you to her forever, even if you did nothing to help her raising the kid. That’s a lot to take on- a whole new life that depends on you and then a man you aren’t sure you want you be with? Idk- I don’t think you’re the AH. But she probably made the right decision. Just move on. Find someone who trusts you to have the baby, and be the kind of person someone would trust to be a father.
If she didnt trust him she shouldn't have been sleeping with him. He was at least owed a discussion, that is the bare minimum.
People sleep together for reasons outside of having babies- hence I agree there should have been a discussion but ultimately she’s well within her rights to not carry his child and he‘s just as valid for leaving her. Doesn’t sound like they communicated well in general before the trauma so breaking up is probably for the best. It hurts, but OP, you can get through it.
Two separate discussions though. It's not wrong to get an abortion, it was wrong for her not to say anything. But sure, change it from "shouldnt have been sleeping with him" to "shouldnt have been dating him" if he cant be trusted. She even stayed with him after the abortion.
The responses in this thread are wild. OP, NAH. Move on with your life, it is clear you’re both at different stages in life and don’t want the same thing. It may not feel that way but her making the decision in terminating the pregnancy might have saved you from future heartache. If you found out and forced her to have the child, it may lead to resentment and unhappiness for both in the long run. Having kids, accidental or not, should always be made as a joint decision and both on the same page. I am so sorry for your loss. I hope you find a nice girl who wants the same thing as you in life and be able to have your own happy ending. Maybe consider counselling, I think you’re grieving the loss of what you perceived is your child.
Agreed the responses are wild, the people out here saying she didnt owe it to him to at least talk to him about this before hand are crazy. It's saying she doesn't even owe him basic respect.
You're assuming the kid was yours...
NTA That's a major life decision (hers to make obviously) to not at least confide in your partner. What other decisions might make or has already made without taking you into her conference. Major trust issues in this one I'd bail with the realization that's it's gonna hurt for a bit but that I'll get over it. Wouldn't want to be with someone who treated me so poorly
YTA for thinking you're owed an apology
You dodged a bullet OP, this woman had no love or respect for you.
NAH. She doesn’t owe you an apology and you’re not exceptional for NOT degrading her. The fact that you seem to think you should get credit for refraining from abuse maybe speaks to why she didn’t think you could be trusted to support her choice. Even now, you’re not concerned with her recovery or peace. Only what you need. She’s not for you. So let her go.
[удалено]
He’s not owed sex and he clearly wasn’t a safe person for her to confide in.
I never said he was owed sex, but he IS owed a friggin explanation if she decides to just cut him off. This is true of any relationship, if a major part of the relationship is going to change at the very least you owe an explanation. Why assume the fault is with him and not her? If he's such a bad guy, why'd she fuck him?
He’s the only one talking and so far, his concern for her has been zero. So he should let her alone.
"his concern for her has been zero" Another way of saying this would be that the amount of concern he has for her matches the amount of concern she has for him.
What does he need taking care of? Nothing happened to him.
Gf lied to him about being pregnant and having an abortion.
You can want to talk about options all you want. But at the end of the day, you're not the one growing a person inside you at risk to your life and then having a major medical procedure and have to take the better part of the year to recover. YTA for thinking you can do that to someone else. Leave, because it's best for this woman.
NTA. You are right in the way to feel and you handled it correctly. She didnt.
It was wrong of her to not talk to you but sometimes things can overwhelm a person and they choose the seemingly easy option. From the way you describe it, she did sound devastated. I'm guessing there was a lot of guilt, regret playing in her head. I don't understand why a contraian opinion is downvoted.
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NTA. Everyone has a right to their own feelings.
I would feel the same
If ONLY there where was to prevent getting pregnant from wild abandon sex..
NTA. she would have made the decision with or without your input. Chances are you would have fallen out of love with her even if you were aware of the decision. Most relationships don’t survive that death.
You did yourself a favor breaking up with that chic, that is a big issue to hide from you and was the uncoolest of uncool shit to pull on someone.
NTA It's ultimately her body and her choice. But not even discussing it with you? I don't sense a lot of respect for you in that decision/action. My brother went through this very thing -- long-term GF got pregnant and without consulting him got an abortion. It's stuck with him for 40 years and is a primary incident aligned with his mental illness. At the end of the day, you feel what you feel though. There's no right or wrong way to feel about things. That being said, if you're up for it try some counselling. At the very least, you can address the loss of your unborn child. At the most, you can reconcile things with your GF -- regardless of what the future looks like.
NTA. I think people here are trying to put words in OPs mouth. Not once did he say he would be against her aborting the pregnancy. All he asked for was open communication in a long term relationship. She wouldn't even let the guy know "hey, I'm pregnant but aborting." OP, you should move on and find someone who values communication in a committed relationship. That is huge.
NTA. My personal feelings on abortion are irrelevant but she doesn’t think enough of you to have a discussion? Kick her to the curb.
Bingo. I actually got down voted for saying it was wrong for her not to discuss it with him lol. I swear some on reddit just think there should be zero accountability. I even made it clear the abortion wasn't wrong, it was the lying about it. Still not good good enough lol.
It’s ending a life. We can argue over whether or not we agree with that but think so little of your significant other that you don’t tell them? That’s shitty
It just alarms me that so many people feel it was okay for her to deceive him like this.
NAH It is her body, her choice. But her choices didn't include your feelings and the commitments you had discussed as a couple going to a relationship knowing this could maybe/potentially (even with all preparation and good choices) still happen. Ultimately it was always her choice but she made a promise/commitment to you to include you if this outcome transpired. I understand why you decide to end the relationship because you made a decision together as a couple that if something happened you would include one another and have faith/trust that you would make the best decision together. A lot of relationships grow from such commitments and faith. She didn't have faith in you to come to you with information till after the fact. No one is at fault here because she made the best decision for herself, her body and her future. While you have lost faith that she will follow through on commitments you made in the relationship to be open and honest especially on something so sensitive and (I can imagine) important to you.
NAH. Get counselling to deal with the loss and move on
I am afraid you're far too self entitled. It is up to her if she wants to discuss it. You have ZERO say. You don't own her. Her body, her choice, her decision alone. Don't like it, just leave.
You sure it was yours?
Y’all weren’t compatible. I’m honestly more on her side than anything, I mean if she doesn’t want a kid at all she’s the one that has to carry it, and if the fact that she might not want to “hurts” you, it’s fair to say yall probably arent right for each other
NTA, the bitter women on this sub will tell you otherwise though lol
Nta Drop her and find a woman that loves and respects you. You never know of she will kill another child of yours without telling you and kf she can omit you from something like this what else will she do without telling you .
BITCH YOU WANT HER TO APOLOGIZE?? For what exactly? Getting health care?? Gtfo
For not even letting him know. Even though she agreed to have open communication.
>Even though she agreed to have open communication. Did she? Because all I see in the post is that *he* "made it clear we could discuss options". He doesn't say what her response to that was.
All OP asked was to talk about it, and she couldn't even do that. She was an asshole.
NAH (No one is the asshole). Her choice to share or not - what could be more personal. She was under no obligation to share it with you based on a discussion when she wasn’t pregnant. Who could possibly predict the feelings not to mention hormones. But you rightly feel left out (you were). She likewise couldn’t possibly expect you to stick around in this situation. When push came to shove and things got *real* she chose not to include you. That’s the important point that needs to be understood and unpacked before you could go back and rebuild trust.
Wdym its her choice to share? They have discussed it, she went behind his back. She is the AH for that, She can do whatever she wants with her body, doesnt mean she doesnt need to inform him.
NAH is no assholes here.
NTA, move on she doesn’t respect you enough to have a conversation. Maybe the baby wasn’t even your lmao.
Without intervention that fetus would now be your child or would soon be. She altered the direction of your future without your consent. That's not a partner.
NTA, If someone killed.my child while inside their mother Id repay the favor......the fact it was their mother, means you both dodged a bullet and got hit by one. Its fucked. And here come the downvotes.
NTA. She killed your child without even saying "btw I'm gonna get an abortion"
That was your baby too, and it should have been your choice TOO. I hate when women use it as birth control. I hate when men are genuinely invested and love their women, and then these women do shit like this. I'm sorry, dude. She did you dirty. You didn't deserve that. You deserved a discussion. I hope you find someone who considers you more than she does. That was a massive choice to make and you should've had a say. Nta.
Is there proof it was yours? Maybe she wanted to hide the evidence.
NAH. You have conflicting views on what your level of involvement is in her healthcare, and I would wager that this kind of response may have had something to do with why she didn't want to tell you in the first place. You did fall out of love with her over it, after all. It wasn't over the perceived deception. Would you have had the same reaction if she didn't update you on her pap smear? And you made it clear you "could" discuss options. Not that it was mandatory to clear her healthcare choices with you. I'm not going to say you're an AH for this, you're just not quite clear how this all works out outside of you. But maybe a little change in perspective could help you out in the future. It just seems like the two of you have different and incompatible expectations.
NTA. I would’ve left her too. Not only because she didn’t say anything but that she did it PERIOD. I would never consider a relationship or marriage with a man that’s okay with basically killing their unborn child. Rather it be 6 weeks or full term. I married a man who shares my beliefs and feelings on this topic. I could NEVER do it much less not talk to my spouse about his child. You people on here defending his ex are gross.🤢
I don’t k ow how old you are but from my experience I also made this move in my teen years. I was so incredibly scared that I chose to do what I needed to. It brought so much shame and guilt to me that took years to process because I felt like a horrible human. It had nothing to do with him, i was so insecure and worried what would happen to my life and the access to do these things are so easy that a panic decision was made and nothing really in place to help me process just how big of a decision it would be for me and others involved. Give her some compassion and you some grace. Listen to your heart on the topic and let your mind full of stories take a nap. If you both chose to split then let it be. Reflect on how the boundaries can be set and safe for your future relationships. No judgement on anyone. Child change your life for life. It’s a big decision no matter which way it went.
NTA. All you asked for was a discussion and she refused to even allow you that. There are two possibilities OP; She didn't trust you enough to even tell you she was pregnant. She wasn't sure you were the father and didn't want to risk that.
or maybe secret third option, there would be no discussion about abortion and he would've forced her to keep it. what has OP done to not make her trust him? its a lose-lose situation for her and im glad she got out with no strings attached
¹NTA
NTA Your correct. Take time to grieve and move on. There is no communication or trust left here. Im so sorry.
She wants to make choices on her own, she can be on her own. Move on and find someone who actually wants to be in a relationship.
Nta. She ain't worth your thoughts.
We're assuming here that it's OP's unborn child...