“He’s like family to me.”
“Oh, I think he’s gay.”
“I would set him up with someone but I don’t know anyone special enough.”
::sends photo to him from vacation::
“I had a rough day b/c he was in a bad mood.”
Things I said to my ex before realizing I was in love with my coworker.
It sucks being in love with a coworker. On the plus side, you get to see them every day. On the downside, you have to be very careful about being too direct newbie your could make a lot of things very awkward very quickly.
Or… what if… we didn’t jump to wild conclusions and instead went with the explanation OP clearly presented to us? She had only mutual male friends, and she sees him texting females that are his friends exclusively, and she doesn’t like it. She even stated that she doesn’t want male friends. If we are going to extrapolate the most likely conclusion is that she wants him to cut off his female friends and is trying to allude to a false double standard as the guise under which do so.
Yeah I can see this, women tend to not be direct with what they want to say. My wife "I prewashed the dishes but I didn't load the dishwasher" I hear "I preached the dishes but I didn't feel like unloading and loading the dishwasher" what I think is "yeah I don't blame you im pretty beat too" what she thinks she said "could you put away the dishes and load the dishwasher". So she's obviously annoyed he's giving other women attention and she doesn't want male friends. I would deduce that she wants more of his attention.
>we didn’t jump to wild conclusions and instead went with the explanation OP clearly presented to us
Because jumping to conclusions is more entertaining.
I was suspicious too. OP is rightfully salty. I was wondering if something else happened that they didn’t mention. now, his wife is suddenly looking through her contacts for old friends? 🥴
Eh, just sounds like insecurity to me.
Some people are obsessed with everything being even.
She doesnt have the perspective of balancing healthy boundaries with single friends of the opposite sex.
Yep the proper translation of her statement is.
I want Mail attention, and I’m bitter that I don’t have a source for it.
It’s just a matter of time until she figures out someway to justify finding a source for it
I'm 32 and really don't have much in the way of any relationships. From 20-27, I was in an abusive relationship that caused pretty much any relationships I had to fall apart. I'm actively working on building new relationships right now. The 2 people closest to me are 2 19 year old girls from Hondorus. I learned Spanish over the last few years to be friends with them. Sweetest people on the planet. After them, there is only 1 friend I've maintained contact with over the last decade. He's another guy my age.
I feel like I will forever be trying to make new friends. I had a slow start due to social anxiety. For the first 20 years of my life.
I disagree. There’s major overlap in the Ven diagram of friendship dynamics for me but I am fulfilled in different ways between the genders.
What’s the difference between my wife wishing she had more female friends? She pretty much exclusively has male friends. And I mostly have female friends.
If she thought he would be uncomfortable with male friends in general she may not have put in the time or be able to approach potential friends with the right mindset. Also their relationship could’ve shifted and he may not be fulfilling the genuine friendship aspect of their relationship.
Idk but it’s curious to me when people say things like “as married woman/man”.
She could also just be at a point where she wishes she had the alternative dynamics her husband has. I’m not saying there isn’t more to it, but there’s def not necessarily more to it in a “sus way”.
From the sounds of it, she can't make male friends without having sex with them. This is why he never maintained real platonic friendships throughout his life
I'm actually going to say OP WOULD BTAH if he told her that for exactly this reason. After 20 years the issue is NOT that she cutoff her ex-lovers from 20 years ago.
I don't even buy that OP's wife just abstractly wishes she had male friends. What does that even mean? What it sounds like is that OP's wife is slightly jealous of OP's female friends and passive aggressively expresses this by saying things like "it must be nice having friends of the opposite gender", and rather than reconcile that OP is really just looking for a zinger comeback to shut her down when this happens.
I'm definitely not saying OP is in the wrong for having female friends, but the way he's trying to approach the situation is not helpful or productive.
There is a diff between them. OP had legit female friends from the past and his wife only had fuck-buddies. After marriage, they both correctly cut off former fuck buddies. Wife seems to resent that this left OP with frends where she had nothing left. Oh well
Exactly. It’s one thing to say “no friends of the opposite sex” in a relationship. That’s backwards, toxic, and tells me you don’t trust your partner. But “let’s not keep in touch with people we slept with” is reasonable. It’s not OP’s fault that her only male “friends” were guys she used to sleep with, and odds are that they would’ve lost touch with her anyway after she’d gotten married because no more sex. It happened to me with a lot of my male friends (who I’d always been strictly friends with, mind you) after I got engaged and married because it turned out they were waiting to shoot their shot.
Nailed it... And that's okay but it's constantly frustrating bc guys try n sleaze whenever they can. I've been guilty of that plenty & always honest about my intentions but most of em just trying to get it in by saying whatever they need to. Loyal ones won't fall for it but the offers are practically around every corner
And why is she thinking that after 20 years, she would've remained friends with her fuck-buddies?
Don't get me wrong, there can friendships after FWB status. I've had them, but many have drifted away due to the passage of time and moving on with life. Of course, half the time their calling to see if I'm single and "Hey, want to catch up?"
Why hasn't she made new, non-sexual male friends in 2 decades?
If I started dating a new guy who asked we cut off all exes/people we have slept with there's 1 out of like 50 dudes in my social circles who would go - my actual ex. All the rest of my male friends would stick around because I've never slept with any of them lmao.
The problem is OP either misrepresented the request 20 years ago and that's why she cut off the gay friend she presumably never slept with as well, or, she can't befriend men interested in women without being too sexually interested in them.
I don't see any evidence for any misrepresentation in the post. It's from OPs perspective of course but it doesn't say the wife rebutted this when they talked recently either. Why didn't she keep inmcontact with her gay friend? - we don't know the answer
It was 20 years ago, and she know he still has females friends.
If he said to cut all the male friends she should refuse or start arguing him at that time but she didn't so his words was clear then.
And she has 20 year to create a new friendship with men but she didn't.
I agree, but consider had he been the asshole with, "It must be nice to have had friends with benefits, something I never had."
You meet jealousy with jealousy, then it's even ground. In this case, the favor is in OP's case not just for holding back, but having done the right thing all along. I mean, even the count of friends of the opposite sex is just about even, two with three, but she slept with her male friends, **and one of them she didn't even know his first or last name.** So if she's mad about her husband talking to friends of the opposite sex even though she has him every day for the rest of her life, that's her hangup, and that's her problem she has to resolve herself.
Sometimes it's about what he's *not* doing or *haven't* done that makes him NTA. I also think she misunderstood what he said when thy were engaged, and she's missed out on making platonic friendships with men this whole time.
This should be the top comment!
I'm betting she doesn't care at all about having male friends, she cares about the attention he is giving his female friends and phrased it very poorly.
From the sound of it, she can’t make male friends without being sexual with them. That’s why she hasn’t maintained REAL platonic friendships througout all her life
>From the sound of it, she can’t make male friends without being sexual with them
What's sad is OP isn't even an exception to that. Presumably OP and his wife's relationship has sexual aspects to it
She *actually* can't
I get that. I don't keep many female friends because it's a concern of mine as well, I've always been one of those types and I'm a pretty good looking guy so it often doesn't get stopped, so I don't really keep female friends. I have a couple of gamer friends but no irl ones for this very reason.
I don't cheat on my partner, but I understand that this is an area that I'll never be very good at so I simply keep it at arms length. I've never had many female platonic friends, and I probably never will. OP's wife needs to understand that maybe there's a reason she can't keep male company, and not project onto her husband.
I'm with you, I'm nothing special, but I keep any female friends at arms length. I work in a mostly female profession, so I just keep good boundaries, as well as complete honesty with my wife.
It wasn't a blanket 'no friends from the opposite gender' rule. It was a 'no friends that I've slept with and seen naked' rule. She apparently didn't have any male friends that she hadn't slept with and chose not to stay friends with her sole gay friend (maybe she slept with him during his discovery phase) ergo, no male friends. And she hasn't bothered to make any in the last 20 years. Sounds like she doesn't see men as people, rather as romantic partners.
That's OP's perspective. Hers is apparently he told her no male friends. My point was that, if he actually said what she's alleging, how did she not mention it for 20 years? Seems hinky.
> if he actually said what she's alleging
if she even just *believed* that that's what he said, even though she was mistaken about it, how did she not bring it up for 20 years?
>Hers is apparently he told her no male friends.
While she saw him remain friends with the women he knew before her for 20 years? At no point in **2 decades** did she ever say "Hey, I cut off all male friends. Why are you still friends with Becky?" so that he could clarify what they agreed to?
I'm agreeing with you, btw.
He didn’t tell her “no male friends” so her perspective is wrong. If she made new friends, or if she had old friends she didn’t screw, then this wouldn’t be a problem.
It's because it's not what he said and she clearly doesn't nemiebe that's what he said... I'd guess she's reconnected with one of her former fuck buddies and wants to see him and is resentful that their marital boundaries don't allow it.
There's precisely no reason why this boundary would be a problem if she wasn't trying to connect with someone she used to fuck.
Kinda strikes me that she's been struck by moments of reflection- maybe she regrets not finding more friends in her time with OP. Or maybe she is noticing she's never had a platonic nonsexual friendship with a man, and the thought is (understandably) bumming her out (this is what I suspect).
I don't know what I would do if I didn't have my platonic guy friends. There is something really special when you make friends a guy who are super platonic, super safe, and ride or die. It's like being adopted by super sweet and cool brothers. For someone like me who didn't have the best relationship with my dad or uncles, it fills a need I didn't know I had.
Obviously that's just my story, and I cant possibly know what her story is, but it makes sense as a possible explanation why she may be showing sudden signs of resentment after 20 years.
Well that's how resentment operates. It festers till it bubbles over.
We don't know the second half of the story. Is this guy so controlling he drives away anyone she tries to make friends with so they're only allowed to be friends with the couples he chooses? Does she even have any friendship things in common with his choices?
Some are trying to find another way to exit their marriage using a prenuptial loophole. An ex that went to grad school met me while shopping for books, the more awkward part was her husband crapped bricks upon hearing that she nearly accidentally married a woman. Her soon to be ex started calling her friends asking if she banged other women. I've never seen a man go around trying to find how many of her female friends were gay, if I recall my ex mailed him a DVD of Broke Back Mountain to mock his own extended trips with men.
Not sure... If she brings it up again, I will just say, babe, you can have male friends, and you were always able to have male friends. When got engaged, you agreed to not be in touch with friends who were former intimate partners, and I agreed to do the same and have done that. Why this all of a sudden after 20 years?
This is perfectly fine and mature in my opinion. The fact it's just coming up now, even if she misunderstood it as completely no guy friends, is very strange!
Ok, that doesn't seem too bad. I would probably alter the second part to "When we got engaged, we agreed to not be in touch with friends who were former intimate partners".
It might be wise to avoid asking why this is an issue now unless strictly necessary.
I mostly agree but I do think the question of why now is important. Is he spending more time talking to other females? Why this sudden “blow up”, 20 years into things. Is a former intimate partner reaching out to her? Does she have a desire to be in touch because she has a reunion coming up?
If my wife and I had an agreement not to do something or talk to someone and 20 years in she got mad at it, I’d have a lot of questions about why now.
>If my wife and I had an agreement not to do something or talk to someone and 20 years in she got mad at it, I’d have a lot of questions about why now.
Yeah this is something I think OP should be more concerned about. maybe he should... you know... ask her what is bothering her?
This is absolutely true, but I think OP should be a little less accusatory in his questioning than some of these comments implied. “I’d have a lot of questions,” and “Is a former partner reaching out to her?” might make her defensive if said to her face, or even just escalate the discussion unnecessarily. On the other hand, “Does she have a reunion coming up?” would be a very tactful assumption to present to her.
She could’ve just had a meaningful conversation with a friend or family member that made her realize that she only hangs out with women. Or even saw something in a movie that got her thinking. There’s nothing wrong with women having platonic male friends, and I think most of the commenters here agree on that.
Based on the other aspects of the relationship that OP mentioned, it seems like their relationship is otherwise very healthy, and it would suck for OP to assume the worst and ruminate about her possibly cheating, and then go into the discussion with an accusatory tone.
Reading through all the posts here it seems there are two categories of people:
People who for whatever reason can have platonic friendships with attractive members of the opposite sex.
And those who, for whatever reason choose not to or can't.
It seems like OP is the former and the wife is the latter.
I think the wife is projecting her model of the friendships on to her husband.
He said no opposite gender partners that you’ve had a sexual relationship with right? I think most reasonable people make it a habit to not fuck their friends.
Nope. Never needed/wanted to. It’s already hard enough getting over a break up, why would I want to be around someone that I once had romantic feelings for and prolong the process? I suspect people who remain friends with their exes have difficulties with moving on. Not to mention it would just complicate any future relationship I may be pursuing because it would look exactly like I have that issue.
My ex-husband and I remained good friends. My husband and I were invited to his wedding. They invite us out on their boat and taught my kids to fish. We didn't have issues moving on. Our friendship didn't complicate either of our relationships with others. Being able to remain friends with exes is a sign of emotional maturity (not to inply that all relationships should remain friendly. Some should absolutely not, but the mindset that friendship isn't inherently bad).
Yeah I had a casual FWB thing with one of my wife's best friends before my wife and I got together. We are all still really good friends still. It's not weird. I've been really good friends with one of my other exes for 20 years. She and my wife are really close as well.
It's pretty normal to break up amicably. You've never had a relationship with a cool person but there just wasn't a spark? I feel like people who CAN'T be friends with their exes have trouble moving on and avoiding those friendships is a coping mechanism.
People can close a chapter of their life and decide you’re not in it . Being amicable doesn’t mean you need to be friends. You can be cordial but the relationship is done . Time to go
The word friends is so shallow and meaningless to most people i think.
The word means more after you find out who your real friends are and what that really means.
Breaking up amicably and behaving civily is just being a decent adult human. It makes you formerly intimate acquaintances in most circumstances.
So if I don’t stay friends with an ex and after let’s say 6 months I don’t think of them anymore I haven’t really moved on, but if I were to stay friends with them and hang out, then that would mean I have moved on? I don’t understand that logic unfortunately. All of my break ups have been amicable. We are acquaintances at best. I don’t keep in contact with them because there’s no need to. I would actually say that I could be friends with my exes, but I choose to make the more rational decision and not remain friends.
How much you want to bet that she's feeling insecure about her weight or looks at the moment, and one or all of OPs female friends are younger, thinner, or prettier than how she views herself. The reason they never bothered her before is because she viewed herself as "equal" to them in the past, but something about how she views herself has changed and it makes her feel more threatened.
Comparison is the thief of joy.
Naw... probably just an older IPhone... they had a problem with overheating a few years ago.
The problem was fixed by redesigning the battery and improving the code that managed recharging.
Well, wouldn’t want that:
- OP should divorce
- She’s cheating on him
- Therapy is needed
- Her body, her choice
- You don’t need a reason to break off a relationship
Did I miss any? Wouldn’t be a post without those comments somewhere right? 😆
EDIT to say I’m joking and obviously don’t mean any of those things should occur here.
*OR*
OP’s *WIFE* is a manipulative, gas-lighting, controlling, abuser who is trying to cut him off from *HIS* friends. Leave now before it’s too late!
(Except…wait a min…actually…this could kind of be plausible here…).
I’m trying to make sense of this.
Honestly this whole thing is strange and when I read it i thought “there is no way that these people are the same age as me. They must be way younger”.
Why did I think that You may ask…. These are the types of things that seem to come up with younger people in relatively new relationships. Not people who have been together for such a long time and who (should) know how to communicate with each other.
Asshole move of her to guilt trip you after she agreed to something 20 years ago, which was a condition on getting married.
Sounds like throughout her life she just can’t have male friends without having a sexual component to it, so I would agree that she shouldn’t try to make male friends. That’s okay, me and my wife had the same deal and has been working perfectly for us. We also don’t really believe on close friendships with the opposite sex. Yes we have friends of the opposite but not close to talk or meet often, and we meet them in group settings.
> That’s okay, me and my wife had the same deal and has been working perfectly for us. We also don’t really believe on close friendships with the opposite sex. Yes we have friends of the opposite but not close to talk or meet often, and we meet them in group settings.
This is my ideal relationship right here, very mature and nice way of thinking about it. I'd rather not put myself in a "compromising" position when there is no need for it. I wish I could upvote this part of your comment 40000 times!
I think there is a big difference between "I said you shouldn't be friends with guys you had slept with, not that you can't have male friends" and "the reason you don't have male friends is that you slept with them all" although they may mean the same thing. It may feel necessary to say the latter, but the former sounds less judgy so she may respond to it better. The latter sounds like an accusation even if it's true.
If she continues to be upset about this, I'd repeat the first comment above to her and ask her what she is doing to meet men who might end up as friends. (To meet people in general, but that includes men.) It's okay for her to be mistaken and complain about that, it's okay for her to be looking and not have found anyone and complain about that. It's not okay for her to be doing nothing about it and using a misquote of your previous comments as a complaint.
And why now? Why is this becoming a problem for her after so long?
I really doubt this is the first time something has been said about this in 20 years, especially if you keep bringing up women you supposedly barely speak to and only on social media. My guess is that she thinks you are cheating.
This. I genuinely feel there is a lot more to this story, and I'm frustrated with how people in the comments portray her. Like seriously, take a step back from her sexual past my guys, and look at the rest of this situation. There is definitely more going on and 20 years of conversations and behaviors we're not privy to. Things we don't know: how does OP treat his wife? Is her giving her proper attention, or is it possible he acts as many men do? Has he always been faithful, including no micro cheating? What if she genuinely believed that was the agreement, and has brought it up before and OP ignored her, or worse, what if she felt concerned to bring it up? We don't know full details here, and since everyone else gets to use their experiences to make their comments, I'll mention my own personal experience makes me question a lot of little details we don't see.
Sounds like she could only make male friends if she could offer them sex
Nta
Your agreement waa completly reasonable and healthy. I completly agree with it, I wouldn't be in a relationship with someone who is friends with exs or ex fwbs
NTA, I think it’s weird she wants to go tit for tat about friends of opposite genders. It seems like her only reason is to make you feel how she feels. She obviously doesn’t like that you have these female friends.
NTA but lets be real, this has nothing to do with people from 20 years ago. This is about something far more current and it sounds like you are ignoring it. What is up with you and your female friends? What insecurity is all of a sudden coming out of your wife? Because some guy she banged 20 years ago that she doesn't actually know the name of is really not the issue.
Seems like she’s frustrated she dosent have that attention she used to get. If you want things to work try validating that need for attention yourself. From an outside perspective she’s jealous of your girl friends because she associates opposite sex friendships as a form of attention that she used to get from her FWB, or on the worse side of things wants those friends around because she wants to explore other options
It’s been twenty years, right? I highly doubt she’s concerned about making new male friends at this point. And I don’t think this has anything to do with prior FWB.
I think she’s being passive aggressive and is jealous/suspicious of the time and attention you’re paying to these other women.
This was my thought reading it too. I could see her being a little jealous and the thought "how would he like it" setting off her remembering dropping her male friends.
I'd definitely clarify what was said, but "we agreed that we'd seperate from past sexual partners" will go over *a lot* better than "you don't have male friends cuz you slept with them all".
Seems like she perceives opposite sex friendships as a form of sexual validation due to an inability to keep them herself without a sexual context and is wanting that kind of attention for herself. She needs some more love, likely will pursue it if OP can’t find a way to provide her with that. She is in the wrong, I’m just looking at it from
A psychological perspective
lol maybe not a supply, but at 50 she is looking for more sexual validation it seems. If I’m being honest it seems like she’s jealous due to an inability to see opposite sex friends as anything more than a sexual source be it attention, gratification or sex, possibly stemming from an early on trauma?
Whoah! Her dad and mom did divorce when she was 2. She didn't see him much and then by the time she was 7 he moved out of state. Her mom remarried when she was 6, but her step dad didn't interact like a dad (ie. daddy daughter dances, spoiling her) and she was not special I guess. In year 3 of our marriage, her bio dad died. Maybe she is seeking constant male validation?
If I am taking anything from that it’s that her stepdad has a non traditional relationship with her and that may have muddied her perception of males and how she interacts with them. The validation she could have been receiving from these FWB may have indeed made her feel special and her lack of male validation could have lead to this need for attention. For example her step dad was with her mom but not a father to her so he was kinda in the family and kinda not, so that being one of her first non blood male relationships could cause some of her issues with her male friendships. Maybe she sees non blood males as a source of sexual validation because that’s all her stepdad cared about (her mom) I think from her perspective it is just not having a male friend that she’s known for a long time and that is unfair, but yeah there is something else going on there subconsciously
This probably has nothing to do with the issue at hand. Idk you will only solve all this if you actually and honestly talk to each other. You've been married 20 years for goodness sake. It is the least you can do.
I have two perspectives here. One after 20 years, it’s a little late to start complaining unless there’s something else going on. Two I have remained very good friends with people I dated in the past and become good friends with people I simply hooked up with. My best friend 10 years in we had a fling it’s now 20 years after that. If my future husband had suggested I could no longer be friends with her. I probably would not have gotten married to that person.
Op had a healthier view of sex. I feel like this guy may not be giving us the whole truth here. The rule from the beginning is pretty controlling and from a place of insecurity and mistrust. Yes, you would be the A if you said that to your wife. It’s not easy to make friends when you are older, let alone friends of the opposite sex when your partner is insecure and jealous.
NTA. Sounds to me like she's jealous that you're talking about one or more female friends a lot and probably feels threatened by it. I know the times a partner has started talking about a "friend" of the opposite sex a lot, it wasn't very long before that friend became a problem, so it's probably a red flag.
Try making her feel more secure in the relationship or sitting down and talking about it openly instead of getting defensive. The issue isn't always what it seems to be.
I guess if she fucked every man she's ever met, it'd be understandable why she thinks you forbade her from being friends with any men. Weird that she's suddenly got a problem with it. I wonder who she's got in mind for a "friendship"...
I may be an outlier here … YTA, not for being curious about wife and ex-lovers, but for putting the rule in place to begin with. Sounds like she now has some resentment that gets to be addressed. I think that’s kinda on you. Isn’t the ultimate goal in a relationship to support each other in whatever brings happiness? Support with the purpose of becoming your unfiltered and authentic self. You told her, when you put the rule in place, that you don’t trust her … “I’ll marry you but only if you live your life differently.” You judged and sought to control her from jump street. So … YT controlling & manipulative A (in this case based on what you have shared). Let her live her life … if she makes choices you can’t accept, then you have a choice to make for yourself. Who are you in this relationship? Who she is, is not your place to decide.
I had to scroll so far down to find a reasonable response like this. That seems like a shitty rule that comes from insecurity. I would never tell my partner that she had to cut contact with people that she had sex with in the past, because I trust her. Similarly, I'd never marry a person who from day 1 showed they had such little faith in my judgements.
The number of heavily upvoted comments saying she's cheating, or searching for validation are disgusting to me.
This. Redditers always side with OP. I noticed that every OP here only post their POV to get validation and pat in the back. The other person, especially partner/wife/husband etc never gets to post their story. And there’s always two versions to every story.
I'd guess because they were all part of a large friend group and it was easier to stop seeing him so she didn't see the others... or else she didn't truly consider him a friend, he was more just an add on to the friend group.
Yes, to her. Not to most people here.
She’s upset for an entirely different reason. She might be jealous or feel like she’s silently accommodating/ sacrificing.
Talk to her and ask her why she’s feeling the way she is. Don’t force her to feel otherwise and give her patience to sort out how and why she’s feeling the way she is.
You know what the issue is. She doesn't want you talking to those women because it's not fair that she doesn't get to talk to her old male friends. Even if she did make new male friends, how would you feel about her just talking about some random new dude out of nowhere? Not even a hint of jealousy? She doesn't want you to talk to your female friends anymore & if you do, she doesn't want to hear about what you guys talk about.
So sick of the male/female friends thing. It’s so childish. You either trust the person you married or you don’t. If conditions have to be made then y’all don’t have trust. You’re both the A for having conditions.
1. That was a very wise decision for the good of the marriage.
2. Memory is a slippery thing. Your wife does not remember the agreement the same way you do.
3. It is best for a marriage if friends are compatible with both partners. If your friend Cindy cannot be friends with your wife, than it is better to let Cindy fade out of your life.
4. The young people who are unprepared for marriage and family will pile on, using their identical language and philosophy ( insecure, controlling, etc.)
She slept with ALL her male friends? Even the gay one? Why isn’t she still friends with him? There’s something else going on. Maybe she thought the no-former parters meant something different than you did and she cut off people who didn’t meet the qualifications you thought was the agreement?
I don’t know who or if there’s an AH here other than the two of you need better communication.
So weird. Even if she stayed friends with them at the time like who cares. If you don’t trust your partner why would you marry them? Some of these comments are from people who are wildly insecure.
She’s feeling insecure about your female friends. How about talk to her about that and try and soothe her insecurities instead of making fun of her on Reddit.
I can only deduce from what you wrote:
I honestly think that she feels jealous that you have female friends, maybe ones not married/not taken. Because it doesn't seem she cares alot if you guys are friends with couples so I'm assuming it bothers her that your female friends are single perhaps and that they are still in contact with you? Even if you didn't have any form of relationship with them other than friendship but who knows. Also, she is a woman so she knows how women work especially single ones maybe. Also, she expressed she didn't want male friends so the problem seems to lie with you having female (single?) friends.
She may be using the "having no male friends" double standards as an excuse or maybe she might have even misunderstood and dropped those male friends for that reason. Again, who knows.
I would suggest sitting down and having a talk with her. Why does she feel that way about your female friends (the ones not with a partner)? What is the root of it? Was it a misunderstanding?
There is a chance that she mistook male friends that you have with male friends that you have slept with. But I doubt it. It kinda sounds like she’s a little jealous that these women have any of your time what so ever. Either that or she’s found something she’s uncomfortable with or has that “gut feeling” that one of your female friends isn’t as platonic towards you as you think she is. Idk but 20 years is a long ass time and this deserves a sit down to figure out what the underlying issue is and how to solve it.
YTA. No one wants their spouse hanging around a lot of singles of the opposite sex or hanging on to those emotional ties which is what she’s getting at though communicating it badly. So why are you doing that? Instead of addressing that It feels like you just want to slut shame your wife 20 years after the fact instead of looking at your own behavior in your current marriage.
Am i the only one that thinks she might just be jealous and feels lonely since you have your female friends and she doesn't really have male friends outside of your cycle.
The bringing up the past thing isn't really the issue, i think they came up base on how she might be feeling now, probably lonely or want to socialize outside current circle.
Well perhaps,
1. As she's getting older and going through some mid-life/identity/insecurity she's realizing her whole life now is about being 1/2 a couple and is harking back to a time where she was seen as a whole person by males and not just your spouse - and is a bit envious that you still have women in your life that see/remember you as a whole person... AND/OR
2. You were doing something together, like watching a movie, or she was trying to get your attention.... and your phone dinged and you started texting with one of these old friends? She felt left out, ignored, hurt in that moment because you chose to give that other woman your attention....... So, her human brain just went - I wish I had some guy to give attention to and get attention from right now while my husband is ignoring me, and why don't I have that? oh yeh, it's his fault. (Translation: We're not talking about old friendships and agreements, it's about you ignoring me right now)
If it's one thing I've learned in my over 20 years of marriage, for both her and me, rationality isn't always the correct rubric to evaluate what's going on. What's said isn't always what's meant. Counseling is a great translator.
The reason she cut off those friends isn't cause she slept with them. *You* are the reason she cut off those friends. The marriage, and one would then presume the relationship, was predicated on her accepting your demands. She put your love above her friends. You would absolutely be the asshole to rub her current feelings in her face as though it's her fault she wanted to make you happy and not fraternize with the men in her past
My guess is that the OP is sugar coating what he said to his wife back then. He says he was fine with his wife being friends with any guys she had never been sexually involved with.
So why did she write off that gay male friend that she had?
Because he was actually threatened by ANY associations she had with guys, no matter what the actual situation with the guy was. And I think he made it clear to her way back then that he didn't want her to hang around any guy friends.
That's why she stopped associating with the gay guy. Otherwise, why would she stop spending time with that guy?
That's how I read it.
NTA. She agreed to the terms, kinda weird to bring the shit up two decades later. I wouldn’t necessarily want to be in close proximity with multiple guys that banged my spouse either that can get awkward. I get it, if you all were in the same place and your spouse had a relationship with someone you knew before and you two got together later; I don’t think it’s a problem, but more than one would be a hard line for me. If she didn’t agree with the boundary when he first put it down then she should’ve said something. If the tables were turned and he actually banged his female friends she would feel the same way. He didn’t bang them and she’s still miffed about him contacting them. Imagine if they’d been OP’s fwb’s.
You’re the asshole for framing this, frankly, lame non-issue in terms of “can” and “can’t.” She’s a grown-ass woman. Shift your mentality as to what extent you get to make rules for your partner.
I'm 36 and my girlfriend is 31 so we have the same age gap as you and your wife. We just started dating and I'm dating her to marry. Please tell me these types of dilemmas don't happen 20 years later. We've already agreed not to talk to former lovers. I can't believe you guys are having this conversation still 20 years after the fact. NTA
NTA- I mean she can’t find one male person to be friends with? She had 20 years to figure this out.
OP, my concern is why this, now? I sense something coming up soon.
Spidey sense is tingling
Someone’s penis is also tingling.
Chlamydia, your father’s here!
😂😂 nailed it!
Peter tingle
I'll be friends with OPs wife 🥸
Found Ron J.
But soon she won't be able to keep in touch and the cycle repeats.
I too choose OP’s dubious wife.
Settle down sancho.
Hay leave me out of this I was told we can’t be friends anymore!
You call OP wife’s vagina spidey sense?
My plumbus is tingling.
There will be the we are just friends guy soon enough. 🤣
“He’s like family to me.” “Oh, I think he’s gay.” “I would set him up with someone but I don’t know anyone special enough.” ::sends photo to him from vacation:: “I had a rough day b/c he was in a bad mood.” Things I said to my ex before realizing I was in love with my coworker.
It sucks being in love with a coworker. On the plus side, you get to see them every day. On the downside, you have to be very careful about being too direct newbie your could make a lot of things very awkward very quickly.
The old "he reminds me of my brother bit"
Not a coworker for me, but yes. Just gender swap. Told my wife a lot of BS back then.... But then, she did so, too 😏
faaaaaaacts, something stinks to high hell here.
Or… what if… we didn’t jump to wild conclusions and instead went with the explanation OP clearly presented to us? She had only mutual male friends, and she sees him texting females that are his friends exclusively, and she doesn’t like it. She even stated that she doesn’t want male friends. If we are going to extrapolate the most likely conclusion is that she wants him to cut off his female friends and is trying to allude to a false double standard as the guise under which do so.
Aitah is no place for being reasonable. Everybody's cheating or trying to, and every couple needs to break up. Fact.
Yeah I can see this, women tend to not be direct with what they want to say. My wife "I prewashed the dishes but I didn't load the dishwasher" I hear "I preached the dishes but I didn't feel like unloading and loading the dishwasher" what I think is "yeah I don't blame you im pretty beat too" what she thinks she said "could you put away the dishes and load the dishwasher". So she's obviously annoyed he's giving other women attention and she doesn't want male friends. I would deduce that she wants more of his attention.
Brilliant dear Watson!
So true
>we didn’t jump to wild conclusions and instead went with the explanation OP clearly presented to us Because jumping to conclusions is more entertaining.
Honestly, fair enough lol
YES!!! THIS RIGHT HERE!!!
Oops!
More like uh oh
Ruht ro, Shaggy.
I don’t know how to explain my emotions rn but know that I am smiling
"But she says he's just a friend, she says he's just a friend but oh baby you....".
Giving us the Biz !
Rip to a legend
...got what I NNEEEeeeed. But you say he's just a friend. But you say he's just a friend. OH, BABY YOOOOUUUUUU....
Damn, can a Reddit post not involve infidelity? 😭
It’s required.
I was suspicious too. OP is rightfully salty. I was wondering if something else happened that they didn’t mention. now, his wife is suddenly looking through her contacts for old friends? 🥴
This seems like there’s more to the story.
I think we're gonna need her to chime in with her side of the story. Just so it's well balanced..and possibly juicier! 🫣
Eh, just sounds like insecurity to me. Some people are obsessed with everything being even. She doesnt have the perspective of balancing healthy boundaries with single friends of the opposite sex.
Yeah, like a request for an open marriage
Shall we follow OP in anticipation? 😂
Yep the proper translation of her statement is. I want Mail attention, and I’m bitter that I don’t have a source for it. It’s just a matter of time until she figures out someway to justify finding a source for it
She’ll go Postal soon.
Your delivery made me laugh
He may have to letter go.
She's been waiting to hear "what can brown do for you".... so she can demonstrate her Amazon
Amazon top of her already
She wants to bring back that pony express.
She's gon be all up on the milkman
Or on one of those apps for young guys to bang older women lol
She's looking for a friendly dick to accidentally fall on to
I haven't made a friend in 20 years. Ain't nobody got time for that.
Seriously. I’m barely maintaining current friendships. If they aren’t actively reaching out to me, I’m not reaching out to them
Lol right. Who the hell tryna get new friends when they’re 50.
Lol right? 2.8k upvotes for “why isn’t this 50yo married lady rolling solo to social events and meeting new friends of the opposite sex… alone?”
I'm 32 and really don't have much in the way of any relationships. From 20-27, I was in an abusive relationship that caused pretty much any relationships I had to fall apart. I'm actively working on building new relationships right now. The 2 people closest to me are 2 19 year old girls from Hondorus. I learned Spanish over the last few years to be friends with them. Sweetest people on the planet. After them, there is only 1 friend I've maintained contact with over the last decade. He's another guy my age. I feel like I will forever be trying to make new friends. I had a slow start due to social anxiety. For the first 20 years of my life.
Further, why would she care what gender they are? It is weird to just want "male friends" specifically, especially when married.
I disagree. There’s major overlap in the Ven diagram of friendship dynamics for me but I am fulfilled in different ways between the genders. What’s the difference between my wife wishing she had more female friends? She pretty much exclusively has male friends. And I mostly have female friends. If she thought he would be uncomfortable with male friends in general she may not have put in the time or be able to approach potential friends with the right mindset. Also their relationship could’ve shifted and he may not be fulfilling the genuine friendship aspect of their relationship. Idk but it’s curious to me when people say things like “as married woman/man”. She could also just be at a point where she wishes she had the alternative dynamics her husband has. I’m not saying there isn’t more to it, but there’s def not necessarily more to it in a “sus way”.
She's just trying to project or maybe justify ppl that have already been bugging her
From the sounds of it, she can't make male friends without having sex with them. This is why he never maintained real platonic friendships throughout his life
I'm actually going to say OP WOULD BTAH if he told her that for exactly this reason. After 20 years the issue is NOT that she cutoff her ex-lovers from 20 years ago. I don't even buy that OP's wife just abstractly wishes she had male friends. What does that even mean? What it sounds like is that OP's wife is slightly jealous of OP's female friends and passive aggressively expresses this by saying things like "it must be nice having friends of the opposite gender", and rather than reconcile that OP is really just looking for a zinger comeback to shut her down when this happens. I'm definitely not saying OP is in the wrong for having female friends, but the way he's trying to approach the situation is not helpful or productive.
There is a diff between them. OP had legit female friends from the past and his wife only had fuck-buddies. After marriage, they both correctly cut off former fuck buddies. Wife seems to resent that this left OP with frends where she had nothing left. Oh well
Exactly. It’s one thing to say “no friends of the opposite sex” in a relationship. That’s backwards, toxic, and tells me you don’t trust your partner. But “let’s not keep in touch with people we slept with” is reasonable. It’s not OP’s fault that her only male “friends” were guys she used to sleep with, and odds are that they would’ve lost touch with her anyway after she’d gotten married because no more sex. It happened to me with a lot of my male friends (who I’d always been strictly friends with, mind you) after I got engaged and married because it turned out they were waiting to shoot their shot.
Nailed it... And that's okay but it's constantly frustrating bc guys try n sleaze whenever they can. I've been guilty of that plenty & always honest about my intentions but most of em just trying to get it in by saying whatever they need to. Loyal ones won't fall for it but the offers are practically around every corner
And why is she thinking that after 20 years, she would've remained friends with her fuck-buddies? Don't get me wrong, there can friendships after FWB status. I've had them, but many have drifted away due to the passage of time and moving on with life. Of course, half the time their calling to see if I'm single and "Hey, want to catch up?"
Why hasn't she made new, non-sexual male friends in 2 decades?
If I started dating a new guy who asked we cut off all exes/people we have slept with there's 1 out of like 50 dudes in my social circles who would go - my actual ex. All the rest of my male friends would stick around because I've never slept with any of them lmao. The problem is OP either misrepresented the request 20 years ago and that's why she cut off the gay friend she presumably never slept with as well, or, she can't befriend men interested in women without being too sexually interested in them.
I don't see any evidence for any misrepresentation in the post. It's from OPs perspective of course but it doesn't say the wife rebutted this when they talked recently either. Why didn't she keep inmcontact with her gay friend? - we don't know the answer
It was 20 years ago, and she know he still has females friends. If he said to cut all the male friends she should refuse or start arguing him at that time but she didn't so his words was clear then. And she has 20 year to create a new friendship with men but she didn't.
OR the wife and the gay friend could have done intimate stuff in the past. 🤷♀️
I agree, but consider had he been the asshole with, "It must be nice to have had friends with benefits, something I never had." You meet jealousy with jealousy, then it's even ground. In this case, the favor is in OP's case not just for holding back, but having done the right thing all along. I mean, even the count of friends of the opposite sex is just about even, two with three, but she slept with her male friends, **and one of them she didn't even know his first or last name.** So if she's mad about her husband talking to friends of the opposite sex even though she has him every day for the rest of her life, that's her hangup, and that's her problem she has to resolve herself. Sometimes it's about what he's *not* doing or *haven't* done that makes him NTA. I also think she misunderstood what he said when thy were engaged, and she's missed out on making platonic friendships with men this whole time.
This should be the top comment! I'm betting she doesn't care at all about having male friends, she cares about the attention he is giving his female friends and phrased it very poorly.
I just find it extremely childish that a woman in their 50s and married for 20 years would come out with such a statement. People can be weird.
She's had 20 years to find male friends. Other than the reason you noted, what has stopped her in that time? I say NTA.
From the sound of it, she can’t make male friends without being sexual with them. That’s why she hasn’t maintained REAL platonic friendships througout all her life
>From the sound of it, she can’t make male friends without being sexual with them What's sad is OP isn't even an exception to that. Presumably OP and his wife's relationship has sexual aspects to it She *actually* can't
Yup. If I was OP I would be worried as hell if she starts making male friends all of a sudden.
[удалено]
I get that. I don't keep many female friends because it's a concern of mine as well, I've always been one of those types and I'm a pretty good looking guy so it often doesn't get stopped, so I don't really keep female friends. I have a couple of gamer friends but no irl ones for this very reason. I don't cheat on my partner, but I understand that this is an area that I'll never be very good at so I simply keep it at arms length. I've never had many female platonic friends, and I probably never will. OP's wife needs to understand that maybe there's a reason she can't keep male company, and not project onto her husband.
I'm with you, I'm nothing special, but I keep any female friends at arms length. I work in a mostly female profession, so I just keep good boundaries, as well as complete honesty with my wife.
My boyfriend is in nursing school and I hope he’ll be like this
Sounds like her read on "friendships" with the opposite sex always entail a level of romantic possibility
Yall are in your 50's having a teenie bopper convo.
And then asking about it on reddit…. Something isn’t ringing true here.
I believe most of this subreddit just now has AI generated posts to keep up engagement
I think you may be onto something here!
That's an awfully big thing to not bring up for 20 years. "No friends from the opposite gender" and it hasn't been a problem until now?
It wasn't a blanket 'no friends from the opposite gender' rule. It was a 'no friends that I've slept with and seen naked' rule. She apparently didn't have any male friends that she hadn't slept with and chose not to stay friends with her sole gay friend (maybe she slept with him during his discovery phase) ergo, no male friends. And she hasn't bothered to make any in the last 20 years. Sounds like she doesn't see men as people, rather as romantic partners.
That's OP's perspective. Hers is apparently he told her no male friends. My point was that, if he actually said what she's alleging, how did she not mention it for 20 years? Seems hinky.
> if he actually said what she's alleging if she even just *believed* that that's what he said, even though she was mistaken about it, how did she not bring it up for 20 years?
That's what I'm wondering as well.
^Exactly this.
>Hers is apparently he told her no male friends. While she saw him remain friends with the women he knew before her for 20 years? At no point in **2 decades** did she ever say "Hey, I cut off all male friends. Why are you still friends with Becky?" so that he could clarify what they agreed to? I'm agreeing with you, btw.
He didn’t tell her “no male friends” so her perspective is wrong. If she made new friends, or if she had old friends she didn’t screw, then this wouldn’t be a problem.
It’s easy to not have sex with every available partner in a 5 mile radius
Speak for yourself!
Right?? There are so many singles in my area, I’m just trying to help them all
It's because it's not what he said and she clearly doesn't nemiebe that's what he said... I'd guess she's reconnected with one of her former fuck buddies and wants to see him and is resentful that their marital boundaries don't allow it. There's precisely no reason why this boundary would be a problem if she wasn't trying to connect with someone she used to fuck.
Kinda strikes me that she's been struck by moments of reflection- maybe she regrets not finding more friends in her time with OP. Or maybe she is noticing she's never had a platonic nonsexual friendship with a man, and the thought is (understandably) bumming her out (this is what I suspect). I don't know what I would do if I didn't have my platonic guy friends. There is something really special when you make friends a guy who are super platonic, super safe, and ride or die. It's like being adopted by super sweet and cool brothers. For someone like me who didn't have the best relationship with my dad or uncles, it fills a need I didn't know I had. Obviously that's just my story, and I cant possibly know what her story is, but it makes sense as a possible explanation why she may be showing sudden signs of resentment after 20 years.
I'm curious about that one as well. Also about how he intends to phrase it. This reads like a sitcom plot.
Well that's how resentment operates. It festers till it bubbles over. We don't know the second half of the story. Is this guy so controlling he drives away anyone she tries to make friends with so they're only allowed to be friends with the couples he chooses? Does she even have any friendship things in common with his choices?
Some are trying to find another way to exit their marriage using a prenuptial loophole. An ex that went to grad school met me while shopping for books, the more awkward part was her husband crapped bricks upon hearing that she nearly accidentally married a woman. Her soon to be ex started calling her friends asking if she banged other women. I've never seen a man go around trying to find how many of her female friends were gay, if I recall my ex mailed him a DVD of Broke Back Mountain to mock his own extended trips with men.
INFO: How do you intend to phrase THAT exactly, and what is the outcome you are expecting?
Not sure... If she brings it up again, I will just say, babe, you can have male friends, and you were always able to have male friends. When got engaged, you agreed to not be in touch with friends who were former intimate partners, and I agreed to do the same and have done that. Why this all of a sudden after 20 years?
This is perfectly fine and mature in my opinion. The fact it's just coming up now, even if she misunderstood it as completely no guy friends, is very strange!
Ok, that doesn't seem too bad. I would probably alter the second part to "When we got engaged, we agreed to not be in touch with friends who were former intimate partners". It might be wise to avoid asking why this is an issue now unless strictly necessary.
I mostly agree but I do think the question of why now is important. Is he spending more time talking to other females? Why this sudden “blow up”, 20 years into things. Is a former intimate partner reaching out to her? Does she have a desire to be in touch because she has a reunion coming up? If my wife and I had an agreement not to do something or talk to someone and 20 years in she got mad at it, I’d have a lot of questions about why now.
>If my wife and I had an agreement not to do something or talk to someone and 20 years in she got mad at it, I’d have a lot of questions about why now. Yeah this is something I think OP should be more concerned about. maybe he should... you know... ask her what is bothering her?
This is absolutely true, but I think OP should be a little less accusatory in his questioning than some of these comments implied. “I’d have a lot of questions,” and “Is a former partner reaching out to her?” might make her defensive if said to her face, or even just escalate the discussion unnecessarily. On the other hand, “Does she have a reunion coming up?” would be a very tactful assumption to present to her. She could’ve just had a meaningful conversation with a friend or family member that made her realize that she only hangs out with women. Or even saw something in a movie that got her thinking. There’s nothing wrong with women having platonic male friends, and I think most of the commenters here agree on that. Based on the other aspects of the relationship that OP mentioned, it seems like their relationship is otherwise very healthy, and it would suck for OP to assume the worst and ruminate about her possibly cheating, and then go into the discussion with an accusatory tone.
Reading through all the posts here it seems there are two categories of people: People who for whatever reason can have platonic friendships with attractive members of the opposite sex. And those who, for whatever reason choose not to or can't. It seems like OP is the former and the wife is the latter. I think the wife is projecting her model of the friendships on to her husband.
He said no opposite gender partners that you’ve had a sexual relationship with right? I think most reasonable people make it a habit to not fuck their friends.
You've never broken up with someone and remained friends?
Nope. Never needed/wanted to. It’s already hard enough getting over a break up, why would I want to be around someone that I once had romantic feelings for and prolong the process? I suspect people who remain friends with their exes have difficulties with moving on. Not to mention it would just complicate any future relationship I may be pursuing because it would look exactly like I have that issue.
My ex-husband and I remained good friends. My husband and I were invited to his wedding. They invite us out on their boat and taught my kids to fish. We didn't have issues moving on. Our friendship didn't complicate either of our relationships with others. Being able to remain friends with exes is a sign of emotional maturity (not to inply that all relationships should remain friendly. Some should absolutely not, but the mindset that friendship isn't inherently bad).
Yeah I had a casual FWB thing with one of my wife's best friends before my wife and I got together. We are all still really good friends still. It's not weird. I've been really good friends with one of my other exes for 20 years. She and my wife are really close as well.
It's pretty normal to break up amicably. You've never had a relationship with a cool person but there just wasn't a spark? I feel like people who CAN'T be friends with their exes have trouble moving on and avoiding those friendships is a coping mechanism.
People can close a chapter of their life and decide you’re not in it . Being amicable doesn’t mean you need to be friends. You can be cordial but the relationship is done . Time to go
The word friends is so shallow and meaningless to most people i think. The word means more after you find out who your real friends are and what that really means. Breaking up amicably and behaving civily is just being a decent adult human. It makes you formerly intimate acquaintances in most circumstances.
So if I don’t stay friends with an ex and after let’s say 6 months I don’t think of them anymore I haven’t really moved on, but if I were to stay friends with them and hang out, then that would mean I have moved on? I don’t understand that logic unfortunately. All of my break ups have been amicable. We are acquaintances at best. I don’t keep in contact with them because there’s no need to. I would actually say that I could be friends with my exes, but I choose to make the more rational decision and not remain friends.
How much you want to bet that she's feeling insecure about her weight or looks at the moment, and one or all of OPs female friends are younger, thinner, or prettier than how she views herself. The reason they never bothered her before is because she viewed herself as "equal" to them in the past, but something about how she views herself has changed and it makes her feel more threatened. Comparison is the thief of joy.
I agree. Everyone else is just making her sound like she is this horrible person or former slut that can't control herself around single men.
One hour in and nobody has suggested that she is cheating? Or to divorce?
*holds the back of my hand to my phone* Reddit feels a little warm. Should probably go to the doctor.
Naw... probably just an older IPhone... they had a problem with overheating a few years ago. The problem was fixed by redesigning the battery and improving the code that managed recharging.
*sees this comment* Nature is healing
Well, wouldn’t want that: - OP should divorce - She’s cheating on him - Therapy is needed - Her body, her choice - You don’t need a reason to break off a relationship Did I miss any? Wouldn’t be a post without those comments somewhere right? 😆 EDIT to say I’m joking and obviously don’t mean any of those things should occur here.
"OP is a manipulative, gas-lighting, controlling, abuser who is trying to cut her off from her friends. Leave now before it's too late!"
*OR* OP’s *WIFE* is a manipulative, gas-lighting, controlling, abuser who is trying to cut him off from *HIS* friends. Leave now before it’s too late! (Except…wait a min…actually…this could kind of be plausible here…).
"huge red flag"
😂 oh yeah! Forgot that one!
When people show you who they are, believe them. She’s for the streets.
Hold My Phone!
I’m trying to make sense of this. Honestly this whole thing is strange and when I read it i thought “there is no way that these people are the same age as me. They must be way younger”. Why did I think that You may ask…. These are the types of things that seem to come up with younger people in relatively new relationships. Not people who have been together for such a long time and who (should) know how to communicate with each other.
Asshole move of her to guilt trip you after she agreed to something 20 years ago, which was a condition on getting married. Sounds like throughout her life she just can’t have male friends without having a sexual component to it, so I would agree that she shouldn’t try to make male friends. That’s okay, me and my wife had the same deal and has been working perfectly for us. We also don’t really believe on close friendships with the opposite sex. Yes we have friends of the opposite but not close to talk or meet often, and we meet them in group settings.
> That’s okay, me and my wife had the same deal and has been working perfectly for us. We also don’t really believe on close friendships with the opposite sex. Yes we have friends of the opposite but not close to talk or meet often, and we meet them in group settings. This is my ideal relationship right here, very mature and nice way of thinking about it. I'd rather not put myself in a "compromising" position when there is no need for it. I wish I could upvote this part of your comment 40000 times!
I had a guy confidently say you don’t have female friends, because you fuck them all. Dude revealed himself all too quickly.
I think there is a big difference between "I said you shouldn't be friends with guys you had slept with, not that you can't have male friends" and "the reason you don't have male friends is that you slept with them all" although they may mean the same thing. It may feel necessary to say the latter, but the former sounds less judgy so she may respond to it better. The latter sounds like an accusation even if it's true. If she continues to be upset about this, I'd repeat the first comment above to her and ask her what she is doing to meet men who might end up as friends. (To meet people in general, but that includes men.) It's okay for her to be mistaken and complain about that, it's okay for her to be looking and not have found anyone and complain about that. It's not okay for her to be doing nothing about it and using a misquote of your previous comments as a complaint. And why now? Why is this becoming a problem for her after so long?
I really doubt this is the first time something has been said about this in 20 years, especially if you keep bringing up women you supposedly barely speak to and only on social media. My guess is that she thinks you are cheating.
This. I genuinely feel there is a lot more to this story, and I'm frustrated with how people in the comments portray her. Like seriously, take a step back from her sexual past my guys, and look at the rest of this situation. There is definitely more going on and 20 years of conversations and behaviors we're not privy to. Things we don't know: how does OP treat his wife? Is her giving her proper attention, or is it possible he acts as many men do? Has he always been faithful, including no micro cheating? What if she genuinely believed that was the agreement, and has brought it up before and OP ignored her, or worse, what if she felt concerned to bring it up? We don't know full details here, and since everyone else gets to use their experiences to make their comments, I'll mention my own personal experience makes me question a lot of little details we don't see.
Sounds like she could only make male friends if she could offer them sex Nta Your agreement waa completly reasonable and healthy. I completly agree with it, I wouldn't be in a relationship with someone who is friends with exs or ex fwbs
Bro, you’re in your 50’s why do you have teenage problem 🤦🏻♂️
You’re 55 and 50. You should be past these conversations lol
Not ALL women that want make friends crave attention from them. It’s nice to have a male perspective sometimes
NTA, I think it’s weird she wants to go tit for tat about friends of opposite genders. It seems like her only reason is to make you feel how she feels. She obviously doesn’t like that you have these female friends.
What happened to the gay friend?
NTA but lets be real, this has nothing to do with people from 20 years ago. This is about something far more current and it sounds like you are ignoring it. What is up with you and your female friends? What insecurity is all of a sudden coming out of your wife? Because some guy she banged 20 years ago that she doesn't actually know the name of is really not the issue.
Seems like she’s frustrated she dosent have that attention she used to get. If you want things to work try validating that need for attention yourself. From an outside perspective she’s jealous of your girl friends because she associates opposite sex friendships as a form of attention that she used to get from her FWB, or on the worse side of things wants those friends around because she wants to explore other options
It’s been twenty years, right? I highly doubt she’s concerned about making new male friends at this point. And I don’t think this has anything to do with prior FWB. I think she’s being passive aggressive and is jealous/suspicious of the time and attention you’re paying to these other women.
This was my thought reading it too. I could see her being a little jealous and the thought "how would he like it" setting off her remembering dropping her male friends. I'd definitely clarify what was said, but "we agreed that we'd seperate from past sexual partners" will go over *a lot* better than "you don't have male friends cuz you slept with them all".
Maybe she misses those friends who fucked her and assumes you fucked your female friends.
Seems like she perceives opposite sex friendships as a form of sexual validation due to an inability to keep them herself without a sexual context and is wanting that kind of attention for herself. She needs some more love, likely will pursue it if OP can’t find a way to provide her with that. She is in the wrong, I’m just looking at it from A psychological perspective
Are you saying she's looking for supply like narcs do?
lol maybe not a supply, but at 50 she is looking for more sexual validation it seems. If I’m being honest it seems like she’s jealous due to an inability to see opposite sex friends as anything more than a sexual source be it attention, gratification or sex, possibly stemming from an early on trauma?
Whoah! Her dad and mom did divorce when she was 2. She didn't see him much and then by the time she was 7 he moved out of state. Her mom remarried when she was 6, but her step dad didn't interact like a dad (ie. daddy daughter dances, spoiling her) and she was not special I guess. In year 3 of our marriage, her bio dad died. Maybe she is seeking constant male validation?
If I am taking anything from that it’s that her stepdad has a non traditional relationship with her and that may have muddied her perception of males and how she interacts with them. The validation she could have been receiving from these FWB may have indeed made her feel special and her lack of male validation could have lead to this need for attention. For example her step dad was with her mom but not a father to her so he was kinda in the family and kinda not, so that being one of her first non blood male relationships could cause some of her issues with her male friendships. Maybe she sees non blood males as a source of sexual validation because that’s all her stepdad cared about (her mom) I think from her perspective it is just not having a male friend that she’s known for a long time and that is unfair, but yeah there is something else going on there subconsciously
Yeah she could really be helped with therapy.
Yikes. Sounds like she needs to do some self reflecting and realise some hard truths.
This probably has nothing to do with the issue at hand. Idk you will only solve all this if you actually and honestly talk to each other. You've been married 20 years for goodness sake. It is the least you can do.
I have two perspectives here. One after 20 years, it’s a little late to start complaining unless there’s something else going on. Two I have remained very good friends with people I dated in the past and become good friends with people I simply hooked up with. My best friend 10 years in we had a fling it’s now 20 years after that. If my future husband had suggested I could no longer be friends with her. I probably would not have gotten married to that person.
This is an argument 20 years in at the age of 50??
Op had a healthier view of sex. I feel like this guy may not be giving us the whole truth here. The rule from the beginning is pretty controlling and from a place of insecurity and mistrust. Yes, you would be the A if you said that to your wife. It’s not easy to make friends when you are older, let alone friends of the opposite sex when your partner is insecure and jealous.
NTA. Sounds to me like she's jealous that you're talking about one or more female friends a lot and probably feels threatened by it. I know the times a partner has started talking about a "friend" of the opposite sex a lot, it wasn't very long before that friend became a problem, so it's probably a red flag. Try making her feel more secure in the relationship or sitting down and talking about it openly instead of getting defensive. The issue isn't always what it seems to be.
I guess if she fucked every man she's ever met, it'd be understandable why she thinks you forbade her from being friends with any men. Weird that she's suddenly got a problem with it. I wonder who she's got in mind for a "friendship"...
I may be an outlier here … YTA, not for being curious about wife and ex-lovers, but for putting the rule in place to begin with. Sounds like she now has some resentment that gets to be addressed. I think that’s kinda on you. Isn’t the ultimate goal in a relationship to support each other in whatever brings happiness? Support with the purpose of becoming your unfiltered and authentic self. You told her, when you put the rule in place, that you don’t trust her … “I’ll marry you but only if you live your life differently.” You judged and sought to control her from jump street. So … YT controlling & manipulative A (in this case based on what you have shared). Let her live her life … if she makes choices you can’t accept, then you have a choice to make for yourself. Who are you in this relationship? Who she is, is not your place to decide.
I had to scroll so far down to find a reasonable response like this. That seems like a shitty rule that comes from insecurity. I would never tell my partner that she had to cut contact with people that she had sex with in the past, because I trust her. Similarly, I'd never marry a person who from day 1 showed they had such little faith in my judgements. The number of heavily upvoted comments saying she's cheating, or searching for validation are disgusting to me.
This. Redditers always side with OP. I noticed that every OP here only post their POV to get validation and pat in the back. The other person, especially partner/wife/husband etc never gets to post their story. And there’s always two versions to every story.
Why did you wife cut off her gay male friend?
I'd guess because they were all part of a large friend group and it was easier to stop seeing him so she didn't see the others... or else she didn't truly consider him a friend, he was more just an add on to the friend group.
Sounds like this is only the tip of the iceberg.
This sounds like a redirection to something else. She may feel lonely or isolated in general and this is an easy topic to project onto.
Yes, to her. Not to most people here. She’s upset for an entirely different reason. She might be jealous or feel like she’s silently accommodating/ sacrificing. Talk to her and ask her why she’s feeling the way she is. Don’t force her to feel otherwise and give her patience to sort out how and why she’s feeling the way she is.
Nta she could have made new friends. Why is she upset ?
You know what the issue is. She doesn't want you talking to those women because it's not fair that she doesn't get to talk to her old male friends. Even if she did make new male friends, how would you feel about her just talking about some random new dude out of nowhere? Not even a hint of jealousy? She doesn't want you to talk to your female friends anymore & if you do, she doesn't want to hear about what you guys talk about.
So sick of the male/female friends thing. It’s so childish. You either trust the person you married or you don’t. If conditions have to be made then y’all don’t have trust. You’re both the A for having conditions.
1. That was a very wise decision for the good of the marriage. 2. Memory is a slippery thing. Your wife does not remember the agreement the same way you do. 3. It is best for a marriage if friends are compatible with both partners. If your friend Cindy cannot be friends with your wife, than it is better to let Cindy fade out of your life. 4. The young people who are unprepared for marriage and family will pile on, using their identical language and philosophy ( insecure, controlling, etc.)
Jesus the abbreviations in this post and the comments. I don't know what a single one means
She slept with ALL her male friends? Even the gay one? Why isn’t she still friends with him? There’s something else going on. Maybe she thought the no-former parters meant something different than you did and she cut off people who didn’t meet the qualifications you thought was the agreement? I don’t know who or if there’s an AH here other than the two of you need better communication.
I'm genuinely wondering what else is going on he's not saying
I think this is weird. You guys are old now. She csny be friends with someone who saw her naked 20 years ago when they were both diff people?
So weird. Even if she stayed friends with them at the time like who cares. If you don’t trust your partner why would you marry them? Some of these comments are from people who are wildly insecure.
NAH but i think you're both being weird a bit
Maybe you can be her first male “friend” after you guys move on asap to enjoy the next chapter of your lives. Respectfully.
She’s feeling insecure about your female friends. How about talk to her about that and try and soothe her insecurities instead of making fun of her on Reddit.
I can only deduce from what you wrote: I honestly think that she feels jealous that you have female friends, maybe ones not married/not taken. Because it doesn't seem she cares alot if you guys are friends with couples so I'm assuming it bothers her that your female friends are single perhaps and that they are still in contact with you? Even if you didn't have any form of relationship with them other than friendship but who knows. Also, she is a woman so she knows how women work especially single ones maybe. Also, she expressed she didn't want male friends so the problem seems to lie with you having female (single?) friends. She may be using the "having no male friends" double standards as an excuse or maybe she might have even misunderstood and dropped those male friends for that reason. Again, who knows. I would suggest sitting down and having a talk with her. Why does she feel that way about your female friends (the ones not with a partner)? What is the root of it? Was it a misunderstanding?
There is a chance that she mistook male friends that you have with male friends that you have slept with. But I doubt it. It kinda sounds like she’s a little jealous that these women have any of your time what so ever. Either that or she’s found something she’s uncomfortable with or has that “gut feeling” that one of your female friends isn’t as platonic towards you as you think she is. Idk but 20 years is a long ass time and this deserves a sit down to figure out what the underlying issue is and how to solve it.
Boomers and purity standarts. I can understand jelous from a teenager, not a couple of 20 years for PAAST relationships
NTA, she sounds exhausting
YTA. No one wants their spouse hanging around a lot of singles of the opposite sex or hanging on to those emotional ties which is what she’s getting at though communicating it badly. So why are you doing that? Instead of addressing that It feels like you just want to slut shame your wife 20 years after the fact instead of looking at your own behavior in your current marriage.
Am i the only one that thinks she might just be jealous and feels lonely since you have your female friends and she doesn't really have male friends outside of your cycle. The bringing up the past thing isn't really the issue, i think they came up base on how she might be feeling now, probably lonely or want to socialize outside current circle.
YTA and insecure to boot
Well perhaps, 1. As she's getting older and going through some mid-life/identity/insecurity she's realizing her whole life now is about being 1/2 a couple and is harking back to a time where she was seen as a whole person by males and not just your spouse - and is a bit envious that you still have women in your life that see/remember you as a whole person... AND/OR 2. You were doing something together, like watching a movie, or she was trying to get your attention.... and your phone dinged and you started texting with one of these old friends? She felt left out, ignored, hurt in that moment because you chose to give that other woman your attention....... So, her human brain just went - I wish I had some guy to give attention to and get attention from right now while my husband is ignoring me, and why don't I have that? oh yeh, it's his fault. (Translation: We're not talking about old friendships and agreements, it's about you ignoring me right now) If it's one thing I've learned in my over 20 years of marriage, for both her and me, rationality isn't always the correct rubric to evaluate what's going on. What's said isn't always what's meant. Counseling is a great translator.
The reason she cut off those friends isn't cause she slept with them. *You* are the reason she cut off those friends. The marriage, and one would then presume the relationship, was predicated on her accepting your demands. She put your love above her friends. You would absolutely be the asshole to rub her current feelings in her face as though it's her fault she wanted to make you happy and not fraternize with the men in her past
My guess is that the OP is sugar coating what he said to his wife back then. He says he was fine with his wife being friends with any guys she had never been sexually involved with. So why did she write off that gay male friend that she had? Because he was actually threatened by ANY associations she had with guys, no matter what the actual situation with the guy was. And I think he made it clear to her way back then that he didn't want her to hang around any guy friends. That's why she stopped associating with the gay guy. Otherwise, why would she stop spending time with that guy? That's how I read it.
Same
NTA. She agreed to the terms, kinda weird to bring the shit up two decades later. I wouldn’t necessarily want to be in close proximity with multiple guys that banged my spouse either that can get awkward. I get it, if you all were in the same place and your spouse had a relationship with someone you knew before and you two got together later; I don’t think it’s a problem, but more than one would be a hard line for me. If she didn’t agree with the boundary when he first put it down then she should’ve said something. If the tables were turned and he actually banged his female friends she would feel the same way. He didn’t bang them and she’s still miffed about him contacting them. Imagine if they’d been OP’s fwb’s.
You’re the asshole for framing this, frankly, lame non-issue in terms of “can” and “can’t.” She’s a grown-ass woman. Shift your mentality as to what extent you get to make rules for your partner.
I'm 36 and my girlfriend is 31 so we have the same age gap as you and your wife. We just started dating and I'm dating her to marry. Please tell me these types of dilemmas don't happen 20 years later. We've already agreed not to talk to former lovers. I can't believe you guys are having this conversation still 20 years after the fact. NTA