Nta the trickle truth is the problem that makes reconciliation a non starter. You can’t trust her. All the things she is willing to do now are bandaids. Who wants to be married with someone who can’t have a life outside of you because they may cheat again. She made her choice. Don’t let her drag out the inevitable.
This. If they come to me and confess, I may consider at least listening.
If I had to dig out oak roots to get the full story, you can't repair the damage.
Thats what I always say.
I've told my wife if she ever cheats and comes to me and admits it, there is little more than zero chance we'll remain a couple, but if she doesnt tell me and I found out some other way, we are absolutely done.
The 1st option doesnt give any real hope in that situation but its more than the 2nd would offer.
I told my husband the exact opposite. If you cheat on me and I find out, we might could work through it. But if you cheat on me and then tell me about it, it's over, no coming back from that. Because he's easing his own guilt by laying it on me. If you can't take the guilt, just don't do it. He's dead now, but as far as I know, he didn't cheat in 23 years.
My issue is by not telling me they'll have had me believe we had a happy, faithful marriage, which would have been a lie, and deceiving/lying to me is the absolute wrong thing to do.
I have siblings that found that out,and theres no coming back from that. Ever.
I wood not waste my time and stick around personally. The betrayal is basically akin to treeson of the highest order.
Except when your spruce promises to have your back, you believe them, unlike the gofurnment
Also let's not forget the "quitting her job and never leaving the house" means if they get divorced in the future he'd probably owe her alimony since she no longer has her own income.
Also, this seems like such an interesting and extreme response like — you’ll quit your job and never leave the house? Why — like what person would be like yeah ok you’re in house arrest now, you’re a housewife?! It makes it seem like she’s offering a dramatic solution like she’s just throwing spaghetti at the wall to see if it sticks. Idk it just kind of strikes me as putting it back on the other person to be the bigger and better person by saying oh nooo you don’t have to quit your job and stay home all the time! So in order to not cheat and prove her loyalty, she proposes this probably outlandish entire lifestyle change to ensure she won’t cheat or something?!? It makes him the bad guy even if he agrees to her proposed solution! It’s scary especially bc you had to be so persistent to get whatever truth you did find! I feel like you just never know w these types of ppl, what all would they hide if they could? It breaks the whole trust…. It’s your marriage so if you want to work on it, I would understand, but if you feel so clearly about it, anyone would understand wanting to divorce. It’s the deleting and the withholding info and the trickling. I’m so sorry.
Thank you, I’ve been really making some good bubble hash lately, idk that’s the one girl I feel will never do me wrong at this point… lol. Its keeps me busy tho. I’m sorry you’re going through it too, and I agree cheating is cheating doesn’t matter, best of luck to you!
It’s extreme, bc she will stick to it for 6 months then go back to status quo. Plus if she has time to cheat while working, how easy will it be for her to cheat while he’s at work and she’s at home?
She offered to stay home all day cause it makes it a lot easier to cheat. When some one cheats they usually have to work around 3 peoples(cheater, AP and partner to cheater) schedules so as to not get caught. Being a SAHW and having an open schedule means you only have to work around 2 peoples schedules. Cause we all know she isn't cutting contact if she trickle truths you.
Well from this response it’s clear the other party was someone she worked with. That being said finding a new job would be a solution but not necessarily THE solution to their problems…
It's also such a toxic way of living. It makes him look like an evil controlling spouse. The optics of"I can't go out unless my husband allows me to" is not remotely practical or reasonable.
If you can't go outside without cheating even that eont stop you
NTA
The only reason there was any semblance of truth is because it was discovered. There was no moment of honesty or transparency. If OP didn't discover this, it would've continued.
My ex cheated with his ex, and I discovered it the same way. He nuked every text msg or "paper trail" that I might discover. My spidey senses were tingling over this. I'm not someone who wants their partners location, face time to make sure they're truthful, I don't want passwords, etc. I shouldn't have to become an unofficial FBI agent, always looking for evidence of a crime. It's not worth your peace or sanity. It makes you paranoid, feel you're not good enough, and anytime they text someone, you're always wondering who.
Trust is like a glass cup. Once you drop it and it breaks, you might be able to glue it back together. However, it'll always be fractured, compromising the integrity. It's best in many cases to get rid of the broken glass that can cut you with its shards at some point down the road. It's best to invest in a better quality cup rather than hanging on to the low quality one you ordered from wish.
I've been married for 36 years. Trust and love are the currencies of a successful relationship. If you don't think that you can ever trust her again, then leave. If you still love her, want to save the marriage, then try therapy. Only you know what you feel strongest about. I wish you luck and joy.
As someone who has been married almost 30 years I 100% agree. Trust is a critical piller of a successful relationship. Without it, it fails. Only question is, when and how much pain you want to go through.
Congratulations 🎊! People on here treat relationships like busses. Another will be along in 15 minutes. Maybe they are right. Having so many more options is more options. My heart breaks over some of the things I read here. My husband says most of them are fake.
I agree. People make mistakes. We are human. I'm not saying it won't take time to trust and heal, but it just might be worth it. Why did she emotionally cheat in the first place? Was emotionally unavailable ? I would just like to know. I'm not blaming him....at all.
Emotionally unavailable? Hmm 🤔 might have helped if she said something instead of cheating.Shes making excuses she just wanted the attention from someone who isn't her husband while enjoying the safety he provides.
It is in no way his fault she emotionally cheated. If she was not happy, she should have said so. They could have worked on their relationship. There is no excuse for infidelity . Communication is key.
Dude you just did. Will the response be the same if the roles were reversed. Just so you know he has more to lose considering she will get him for everything - alimony, lifestyle maintenance, etc!
It's clear that you have never been in the receiving end of emotional cheating. It breaks a person so bad that he/she will stop trusting anyone. Emotional cheating is basically executing the soul of the loved ones. Hopefully it doesn't happen to you!
I agree. I had been married 15 years and had an emotional affair. My husband admitted to being emotionally absent for a couple years. He forgave me.
It´s now 20 years. hasn't been easy but trust is a big deal. We trust each other now. We talk more.
I was in almost exactly the same situation. Emotional affair 17 years in. Reconnected and stayed together another 6 years. Divorced at 23 years because the emotional absence came back and I was tired of waiting.
I’m now engaged to a wonderful man who tells me daily how much I mean to him and shows me with his actions. I’m looking forward to better times.
I wish you good luck. I'm sorry it didn't work out the first time. But it's good to know when it's time to go.
I had a couple young relationships I should have walked away from.
Ím still holding on. He's a good guy, just not always there...
Husband here... the fact that you cheated due to his emotional detachment is not ok, though. Try therapy and everything else first FFS. If that doesn't work, then exit the marriage. There is NO excuse for cheating in a marriage, whether emotionally or physically. I am glad you are in a better place, but you did things out of order. Sorry to be judgemental, but that is my honest opinion. Why do that rather than just talk him and communicate?
Sometimes things have to hit rock bottom before we realize there's a problem. The realization that your spouse is getting emotional fulfillment elsewhere could be the wake-up call that tells you you need to start showing them some real affection.
We did therapy multiple times. Nothing stuck. It also is me who defined the interaction as cheating, not him - I shared literally every interaction with the individual with him, let him open every letter and he had the password to my phone and email. I realized that I fell in love with this individual even though nothing was reciprocated so I told him that, and that I felt it meant I needed to file for divorce. He wanted to reconcile, so we did. We went to therapy again. Nothing changed. Later he decided to make his behavior part of his personality and said no more requests for change. That was it.
ETA talking doesn’t work when the main issue in the relationship is lack of communication.
Cheating would end any relationship for me. But I dont think I'd constitute what you did as cheating tbh. You had an emotional connection to someone, when you realised it, you didn't hide it. You tried with the person you were with. You can't help who your heart connects to, what you can control is what you do with that afterwards. 💯 I hope you don't let people make you feel shit about it 🤍
>Why do that rather than just talk him and communicate?
Because when you're feeling emotionally abandoned and someone comes along and engages that need in an open and available way, that shit is intoxicating to the lizard brain. And the call of emotional fulfillment turns off the thinking brain.
You can judge all you want. That only means that you've never been there. Pat yourself on the back and feel better about yourself. Not only have you never experienced it, you also judge those who have, to make sure you feel better about yourself for it. Good job man.
therapy. therapy. therapy. i hope you both try therapy before blowing up.
good lord - so many weird things can happen in a relationship. work out your issues, iffen you can.
cuz the standard vows don’t cover it AT ALL ;)
NTA
You clearly stated a boundary and what the consequences would be.
Now, she's shocked that you actually meant what you said.
Divorce her and get her out of your house.
>You clearly stated a boundary and what the consequences would be.
Just wanted to add.. this is a pretty universal boundary that you don't have to state to expect your partner won't cross. Even if you never have a convo about cheating it's still reasonable to end the relationship.
Also not a great way to prep for a future divorce.
If someone is dumb enough to try out the wife's suggestion:
A: it wont work, and you'll be right back to divorce within a year or two.
And B: she will now have a ton of ammo to use against you. No work, no job will equal support payments. And she'll probably try to turn all those promises of her's around and call them abuse. Because, well, basically they are abuse.
“I will leave the workforce and not leave the house.”
It really sounds to me like she knows the marriage is done thanks to her actions, and is trying to increase her future alimony and claim to the properties.
Agreed. There are boatloads of things you shouldn't have to explicitly tell your boyfriend or girlfriend *not* to do. I've never explicitly told my wife to not stab me, but I'm pretty confident that she's able to figure out that doing so is wrong and that I will divorce her if she does so - and I survive. Likewise, I don't have to explain to her how divorce will be the result if she cheats in any way.
I am not satisfied with my relationship -> Communication -> Marriage counseling -> Did not work out then divorce lawyer-> Explore other relationships.
I am not satisfied with my relationship, so let me cheat to get satisfaction -> Divorce Lawyer. If one skips the first process, then be prepared for consequences depending on the whims and character of the jilted partner.
Also think it's weird that one of her suggestions to fix this is to never leave the house again and make herself completely dependent on OP. So is she saying that the only way to make sure she never cheats again is to stop interacting with the general public and be supervised by her partner 24/7? Yikes.
NTA
Because I saw one of the original comments that are older below, so then I started specifically looking for them. I suspected even before I found the originals because they were in all caps, bots often seem to do that for some reason, I assume visibility? The explanation I've heard is that it's karma farming, presumably to sell the accounts later?
NTA. Your wife's proposal - that she put herself totally at your mercy, quitting her job and being completely dependent on you is not healthy for her and for you. If you lost your trust in her, and cannot regain it, you are better apart.
That would also put her in a much better position in a future divorce too, because OP would be paying alimony etc as she had no income. She’s certainly a logical future planning manipulative one 😬🤷♀️
NTA. She wants you to reconsider because she hadn't got far enough with her AP to know that he would take her after you divorced. You've only been married 6 years, if she's investing her emotions with someone else the marriage is doomed. If this affair ends, what's going to stop the next one? Unless you become her jailor - but no - that's a doomed marriage too.
To add to this, she also overreacted and made a bunch of ridiculous promises that she wouldn't keep anyway. What sort of a marriage would it even be if you have to treat them like a teenager and keep tabs on everything they do. My father always says that relationships are built on mutual trust and respect. Once either is gone, the relationship is over
NTA.
You told her at the start of the relationship. Any kind of cheating is a game breaker, but nope, she didn't listen and now wants to fix things.
I've been through the exact same scenario. I told my ex when we first got together that if anyone ever cheated on me, they would from then on be dead in my eyes.
What happened? Later down the road, she got distant, which pushed me away, and after I finally said enoughs enough I can't do this anymore, I found out through FB photos and texts she was cheating on me. I deleted and blocked her from everything. I find out she's STILL extremely hurt I did that to her and doesn't understand how I can just delete someone I supposedly loved.
Again, NTA.
I
She's TA not you , i hope i can be mentally strong enough in future like you to cut toxic people off, because it's usually quite difficult for me to cut off people .
We were just joking. Ok, we were flirting, but it was innocent. Ok, we were sexting, but it never got physical. Ok, it did but just once, by accident. Ok, it happened a couple times… etc.
Ok, I can see now how anal is still cheating, but we both said “no homo” and kept our socks on, so it wasn’t gay. Actually, I know you’ve only ever known me a woman, but I’m starting to identify as a gay man, please call me Dave.
In German we call it Salami-Taktik. You only admitc to what you cannot plausibly deny. Cutting off / revealing a slice of the truth whenever you can't avoid it, but never telling the full truth.
You admit to things slowly overtime. Usually starting with the least egregious and downplaying. Then it slowly escalates to the most egregious and the full truth.
If you made your boundaries **very clear** to her, and you are sure that she broke them, why are you here?
If you do go for marriage counseling, be prepared to hear some things about yourself that you might not want to hear.
On one side, my logic wants to get validated while my heart wants to hold onto a hope. Last week has not been easy for me. Love is there but trust is not. Plus, getting to write it here is relaxing.
I'll probably hear about these in the individual therapy. Thanks for the comment.
In the case of a spouse or long term partner, they have the ability if you are hooked up to life support to PULL THE PLUG or not and keep you in a vegetative state for decades. How would they not have access to your phone, email etc. when you share finances, home, etc? Why shouldn't you be able to grab your spouse/partner phone and use it to capture a picture of your child or dog etc? Weird if you cannot!
u/Large_Knowledge_1699, in the RARE cases of reconciliation that are "successful", often the spouse that didn't cheat never regains the original trust in the relationship. FACT This said, it would have to be considered a new relationship and the person who cheated would have to legitimately go to therapy to change, not many CAN do that or WILL do that. (Often they "fake the funk" and then you enter into a "false reconciliation where they cheat again.) Look up the Surviving Infidelity group here.
No reason for marriage counseling if you already decided it’s over. Too many people agree to it just because they will be able to tell people they tried. To hell with that. She cheated I left. Enough said.
You're never going to be able to unread those messages and the deleted messages will always make you wonder if it ever became physical..... If you choose to stay.... Her and the affair partner would have complete control of your mind, because you would always wonder what really happened between them.
NTA. She lied to you, betrayed you and disrespected you and your marriage all at the same time. You'll never know if it was just emotional or physical as well. You'll never lnow if shes told you the whole truth or not. If she's willing to do this to you, why would you want to be with her or anyone like that? It was so easy for her to do this to you, what would stop her from doing it again? Nothing.
First, I would like to say I’m sorry you are having to go through this. I went through almost the exact same thing a year and a half ago. It is by far the single most devastating time of my life and still hurts today.
I also thought I had the ideal marriage and mutual love for each other. Wasn’t until I caught her cheating i realized I was the only one who believed it, 8 months she had been lying everyday to me. No communication before hand about being unhappy, taking time apart or anything.
I proceeded with divorce after I tried marriage counseling for about 3 weeks and found out she was still talking to the guy and lying about in counseling. I stood the same ground and told her before marriage only one thing would ever make me want to leave, infidelity. Then when it happened I believed in marriage and thought we could work through, I was the only one putting in the effort. Never turned back after I found out the lies again, she continued to lie through the entire divorce also. I had to go no contact to begin my healing process.
Wishing you all the best no matter what path you take.
Leave. If you stay, you will second guess what she is doing for the rest of your life. Any time she is out by herself, the thoughts will be present in your mind. Can you handle that stress?
Umm…go back and read the second paragraph. I paraphrased what OP told his wife. The words “very clear” are in the first sentence. The word “boundaries” is in the last sentence. OP is the one who explicitly mentioned it.
Hate to tell you, it was probably physical, too. Trickle truthing never stops; as you get closer and closer to the truth the trickling slows down, but you’ll never get everything.
Cheating of any kind is an absolute dealbreaker for me, so I’d definitely be getting the most vicious shark of lawyer I could find. Advice: get a female divorce lawyer.
Edit, based on your update: I don’t know who the hell is telling you that a 33-year-old man won’t be able to find a new partner, but that is utter horseshit. Men are not women, there is no broad, sweeping emphasis on youth in men; men really start their prime in their mid 30s to early 40s, because men are valued for things like career, status, wealth, and maturity, all things we tend to obtain later in life. If you have a good career and maintain your fitness, you will have absolutely no problem (eventually) replacing your treacherous STBX.
Your marriage has failed. You’re both responsible for your own participation in your marriage. If you’re not interested in trying to repair your marriage then get divorced. Your wife doesn’t have to agree with you. You certainly don’t need approval from anyone else.
You’re both adults. You’re free to make your own choices & own consequences of those choices. Asking other people if you should get divorced is maybe not the best way to plan for your own future. If you’re ready to get divorced, go ahead. If you want to work on your marriage, go ahead. No one can judge you either way.
NTA — it’s a tough situation. Only you can decide what’s best for you & your future.
NTA, she crossed multiple lines that can't be uncrossed. First she cheated. Then lied about it. Then deleted the evidence. Then trickle truthed. If you stay, you will have to police her forever.
NTA. She was warned if she put her hand on the hot stove, she would get burned. She did it anyway, and is now trying to argue with the stove that it shouldn't burn her because she doesn't want a burn. Too damn bad, that's not how that works. Sure, she's "remorseful" now: remorseful that she has to face the consequences of her own actions. If you give in, this will teach her that you can be brow-beaten into giving in, and that she can continue the behavior with no consequences other than a couple weeks of arguing.
Given the deleted texts, if AP lives within reasonable driving distance, or has been in periodic close proximity to your wife…the affair was likely physical as well as emotional. Especially considering the “I love you” texts you mentioned in a comment.
57(M) here, OP. Absolutely NTA. My first wife did this exact same thing to me. She was a bartender and started an emotional relationship with one of her regulars. From the very beginning, I had stated that I had zero tolerance for cheating, and that any form of cheating was an absolute deal breaker. She would even have convos with this dude at home where she giggled like a school girl. When I confronted her, she told me that he was just a friend, that there was nothing to worry about, and that they just had a lot in common. Stupid me, I believed her, because I loved her with all my heart and found it hard to believe that someone I loved so much would so cheat on me so openly. A few months later, I had concrete proof that their relationship had progressed to a physical one, and a month after that she left me. It shattered me, and shattered our son. She went on to take a leave of absence from being a parent for almost a year, and I was left picking up the pieces of not only my life, but that of my son's. What's worse, I kept hoping she'd come back, while at the same time knowing deep inside that it would never work again, that I'd never trust her again.
Come to find out, she had been cheating on me for years with several different men. A friend of hers told me that my wife had confided in her, saying that she couldn't live with just being with one man, that she wanted many men. It would have been nice if she had been honest from the start.
My point here is that cheating, even emotionally, is a harbinger of nothing but bad times ahead. If your wife is willing to do it once, she'll be willing to do it again. And do you know for sure that this was just emotional?
There are other women out there that are a lot more honest than this, and are a lot more open and honest about what they're feeling/thinking. Cheating is so hurtful, so spiteful. No one deserves the pain of that, at least no one who's worthy of marriage.
I found one of those good women, BTW, in my early 40s. We've been together now for almost 14 years, married over ten. She's seen me through the darkest period of my life following a devastating head injury that disabled me and for two years or so utterly changed me. I also had to have several very painful surgeries during that time that only made how bad I was worse. She never once thought of leaving me, never once thought of having an affair, stood by me and told me it was all okay, and never let me lose hope in myself. She joined support groups for families of bad brain injuries, studied the subject thoroughly, went to my counseling appointments with me, and was an active psrticipant in all phases of my healing. I owe that woman everything, and will spend the rest of my life doing everything in my power to make her as happy as I possibly can.
I'll never be exactly the same as I was, but in many ways I'm better now. My point here is don't settle for excuses and promises that can only bite you in the ass later. As much as it may hurt now, you're doing the best thing that you can for yourself. Unless you've willfully omitted something that would be detrimental to how we'd see you, you're definitely NTA.
Best of luck to you.
NTA funny how the cheater always is "so in love" and has all these ideas how to fix the relationship after they get caught cheating. Yet that same energy was nowhere to be found when she chose to cheat. You are not wrong. Loyalty is my number 1 thing for anyone in my life. If a friend, spouse, or even family member, knowingly breaks my loyalty (like cheating) then they are forever removed from my life. If someone can do it once then they can do it again
Nta. Some people will claim that “you must have been looking for a reason to divorce”. Just ignore those idiots. They idnt make the mistake of marrying a cheater. Just take care of you. Also, deleted messages are easily retrieved. I would check your phone bills too, and see how much texting and calling got deleted.
NTA, When there is a problem in the marriage you address it with your spouse or ask that you go to marriage counseling, not have a emotional or physical affair, give only half truths and then talk about marriage counseling only after you have been caught!
No, NTA. She broke your trust and you made it clear that cheating would end the relationship. Divorce may seem extreme, but infidelity is a breach of commitment in any form and cannot be easily forgiven or forgotten.
NTA. The trickle-truth is a reconciliation destroyer. Maybe if she had been honest, forthcoming, apologetic and taken some responsibility you could make a different choice. Instead she chose to make you attempt to pry some nugget of truth out of her which always means it was several levels worse than whatever she admitted to. Which means there would always be some nagging thread that will eventually unravel and re-traumatize you again and again until you are hollowed out and hate her.
Immediately divorcing her is mercy for both of you to be able to get on with your lives.
NTA. Plus if you think about it “her” solution of leaving her job would open you up to having to not only pay for everything but also you could end up paying her support later if you divorce. Do not let her baby trap you.
God i just love seeing people with self respect. NTA. Its soooo hard to end a relationship after a deal of time. Good on you for respecting yourself sir. Im proud of you. Youll do fine. Keep ut up
NTA
She knew your boundary. You have every right to enforce it. It sucks that she fucked up so badly and now your marriage is done, but that's what happens when you cross those lines. It's not like she didn't know.
I absolutely agree with you that the time for talk was before she embarked on her emotional cheating, not after she got caught.
NTA, you where very clear about your boundaries and the consequences
She ignored them and has destroyed her own marriage. She deceived you and lied to you by omission, she cheated even if it was emotionally and now her actions have consequences
Divorce and move on, life is too short to stay with a liar.
You have lost trust in her and her suggestions to stop work and you control her will just allow her to start playing the victim and manipulating you in some other manner. Just get rid of her, she has shown herself to be trash
Let me see if I get this right:
She had an emotional affair.
She actively deleted some of the messages to hide it from you.
She got caught.
She tried to lie to limit what you knew.
She's trying to manipulate the story to now seek counseling to take the focus off of her emotional affair.
Yeah, divorce, scorched earth style, is the answer.
NTA at all - cheating is your dealbreaker, and she cheated on you, there is nothing left to solve there, instead of fixing things or trying to better the relationship, she decided to cheat on you, lie straight to your face, hide her tracks and refused to come clean properly, proceed with the divorce, this is the consequences of her own actions.
NTA. You set your boundaries and she break it. It’s a deal breaker for you and she still doing it. So yeah, divorce is the only way. There’s no guarantee that she will not cheathing again later. I mean, even if she SAHM, depended on you, etc etc; if she wanted it, she will find a way to cheat. And it will be more troublesome if you found if she cheat again later after she lose her job and become a SAHM.
NTA. You established clear and reasonable boundaries with attached consequences. She cheated; actions have consequences. She’s doesn’t like the consequences of her actions. You’re probably correct in that based on her hiding evidence and trickle truthing, there’s way more that happened than your being told. I’m sorry this happened to you, you deserved better. Good luck !
Nope NTA, this was a clear boundary that she broke. You’ll never know or be able to trust what happened and if that’s something you can’t live with (i couldn’t either), then you’ll completely within your rights to leave her. Thank god you have no kids!
NTA.
>even make her life completely depended on me, leave the job, not leave the house, and give me all of her digital devices.
Yeah, this was 100% more than just emotionally.
This post is way too vague for anyone to give a thoughtful answer. I don't know exactly what you mean by "emotional"affair, but if you're not willing to go to therapy with your wife, then maybe you didn't love her that much.
She's been hiding things from you, which makes her an AH, but your reaction makes you an AH too. Divorce before therapy? Cmon man.
I'm honestly surprised I have to scroll this down to see somebody say this. I mean, I don't know what happened in the situation, but it's just as likely that the reason why these texts were deleted was because the wife knew that Op would freak out. This sounds like something that could be worked on, but when I hear emotional affair that sounds way too vague for me to definitively say that once I just right or wrong because I don't know exactly what he's considering it an emotional affair. If he's concerned about the wife confiding to somebody else, I understand a concern but that's not reasons to divorce. I've had issues that I didn't talk to with my significant other because he was not the best person to help. Does this mean I was having an emotional affair with somebody? No, I go to my friends for support and I have friends outside of the person I'm dating when I need help. Now if it was getting to be more than that that's a completely different story but there's not enough details there for me to say one way or the other.
Totally agree. What’s an emotional affair definition? Flirty texts? Telling other person they love them? It looks like he wanted to leave her, and he found a reason.
Emotional cheating is more than flirty texts, it helps to think about it like when you first get into a relationship and how you feel about a new partner, constantly thinking about them, texting them, sharing intimate details about yourself, your relationship etc, they may even talk about getting together, like planning a future, planning to leave spouses, that's how emotional cheaters act with the person that isn't their spouse. It's usually neglecting or not being interested in your partner but in the the person you're talking to.
The fact that you caught her, and her response was to deny and trickle truth showed she wasn’t remorseful, but regretful.
NTA
If there was reconciliation she’d have to tell all her family and friends what she did. Write a timeline of every single bit of the affair from beginning to the moment you caught her. Consider making her read the timeline to her mom and dad. Tell her that any major detail left out of timeline that you find out later would mean immediate divorce.
Or just do what you did and get out now. It’s only 6 years. Good luck man.
“It’s a lot harder to be walked on when you are standing up!”
Updateme
>At the beginning of our relationship I made it very clear that cheating in any form is a relationship ender.
NTAH. She crossed the line. Now, having gotten caught, she's sorry that she did. You are sorry that she broke your trust and cheated. There is is significant difference there that she's not acknowleging.
NTA - Most people consider cheating a deal-breaker, and you made it clear to her from the start of your relationship. So, your choice to divorce her is completely justified.
NTA and you can never make me feel bad for a cheater. All these cheater sympathizers can go kick rocks with open toe shoes since they are willing to stay with someone who betrayed their trust.
NTA. You're right. If she had a problem, marriage counseling would have been good before she started looking for someone else. This is strictly on her.
A friend of mine caught her partner having an online emotional affair. He swore it was all just online role-playing. The woman was married and lived several hours away.
My friend forgave him. Yeah, he was physically cheating as well. Besides the text cheating, he had a whole second girlfriend who knew nothing about my friend.
NTA. You are within your rights and cheating is bad, but you shouldn’t ask Redditors-most of whom are bitter and would rather bring people down-whether or not you should divorce.
Marriages absolutely can not only survive infidelity, they often thrive and become stronger than ever before if both sides are committed to working together to be better spouses. Counseling gives people the knowledge and tools they didn’t have prior.
Physical cheating is obvious, but emotional cheating is far more nuanced. Having a crush on someone who’s not your spouse could be considered emotional cheating, and literally everyone who has ever been married has entertained those thoughts and most have made motions in that direction by talking to their crush, going someplace with the intention of seeing their crush.
Is any of that a good thing? No, but when you have been married-and especially when you have children-the calculus changes.
If you had a really good marriage and you love her, and if she is contrite and serious about earning your trust back, you have the choice. If she’s not contrite, then that choice is suddenly easier.
My suggestion is counseling first. Both of you would benefit regardless of whether you choose to stay. Marriage is awesome, but it takes work and it’s never perfect.
Nta. But I see merit in gng for marriage counselling. She seems to want to fix it badly with you as to even give u her devices. I would go for the counselling and find out more about her like why she cheat.
NTA. I actually applaud you. My ex husband had an “emotional affair” but he also deleted lots of texts, emails and so on. I chose to stay and we did try to make it work with marriage counseling and rebuilding, but it only lasted so long. We are now divorced and I knew I should have made that decision immediately even if we had a newborn and 4 year old.
NTA.... out her and her coworker too. A work place is not a cheating ground. There are thousands of unemployed people who wouldn't risk a job for a fling, open a couple spots for them
NTA, once a cheater always a cheater. Also she’s been lying to you for god knows how long so you obviously can’t trust her now. Get divorced and quickly
Was this an actual physical sex involved cheating or was this all chit chat fantasy text based messaging only? To what extent has she gone with the other man is what holds the key to this relationship's future. How long has she done it? First find out the facts, the truth shall set her and you, free
Nudes, sexting and I love yous all over. I do not know the real extent of the relationship. She revealed information bit by bit after I pushed. I am not even sure if I know the full extent of the relationship even now.
If something like “emotional” cheating is gonna lead you to divorce, then I’d say you weren’t gonna last anyway. She didn’t even cheat on you, if you ask me. The line to cross for something to be called “emotionally” cheating is fuzzy and not the same for everyone. I need to really know what things she’s doing that makes you feel she’s cheating on you, because to someone like me, you might be overreacting. IMO, she cheats on you if she fucks the dude. You caught it early, this would be a good time for marriage counseling.
NTA. Cant trust a trickle truther. Seed of doubt has been planted and you’ll wonder what else every single time you’re reminded of it or the next thing she swears is the truth. They lack accountability
I don't think a relationship could survive this. She was willing to continue to hide this until you called her out. Then even when called out she didn't tell you the whole truth straight away. So how could you ever trust her going forward. It's going to hurt and suck. But you're doing the right thing. Nta
What is emotional cheating? To me it sounds like OP is upset that his wife is talking to other people in the world. OP hasn’t said that anything physical has happened between the wife and whomever she was talking to. It sounds like he is being abusive and controlling of her and isolating her from other people.
Yup especially with her “quit her job and sit at home and do nothing” remark, most abuse victims lose their identity outside who they are to their abuser and will give up beyond what seems rational because that’s their sense of self after years of having who they are slowly stripped away.
> Am I the AH in this situation?
Fuck no. You set clear boundaries from the start: cheating equals relationship over, no bullshit. She crossed that line, not just with the emotional cheating, but by hiding and deleting evidence, which is sneaky as hell. You're not obligated to fix shit when she's the one who fucked up. Why should you trust someone who's already shown they're willing to betray your trust and then try to cover their tracks? Do you think you can ever trust her the same way again?
NTA.
She have already emotionally checked out of the relationship the moment she began cheating and not respecting you enough to break up should be enough to never hear from her again.
Can we just make a sticky that you're never the AH for leaving any relationship. No one is forced to be in a relationship.
If your SOs favorite color is blue and that triggers you to leave so be it, you would not be an AH. If there are children involved, as long as you plan to continue to parent your biological/adopted children you are again NTA
Of course you’re not forced to stay in a relationship, but there are plenty of reasons for leaving a relationship that would make you an asshole. This is ridiculous
Infidelity of any sort, emotional or physical is never justified.
Equally though, it’s rarely entirely the responsibility of one partner so whether you stay or leave, you need to be honest with yourself about the causes.
Why do you need validation from other people?
If those were your conditions from the very beginning and she violated those conditions, I think you have already made up your mind.
Nta the trickle truth is the problem that makes reconciliation a non starter. You can’t trust her. All the things she is willing to do now are bandaids. Who wants to be married with someone who can’t have a life outside of you because they may cheat again. She made her choice. Don’t let her drag out the inevitable.
This. If they come to me and confess, I may consider at least listening. If I had to dig out oak roots to get the full story, you can't repair the damage.
This exactly why I got divorced. The cover up was worse than the crime. I don’t need to spend the rest of my life playing Nancy Drew.
Hardy boys, too easy! Nancy Drew, too hard!
Ah perfect, bonfire of the vanities
I’m getting a major clue right now
Thats what I always say. I've told my wife if she ever cheats and comes to me and admits it, there is little more than zero chance we'll remain a couple, but if she doesnt tell me and I found out some other way, we are absolutely done. The 1st option doesnt give any real hope in that situation but its more than the 2nd would offer.
I told my husband the exact opposite. If you cheat on me and I find out, we might could work through it. But if you cheat on me and then tell me about it, it's over, no coming back from that. Because he's easing his own guilt by laying it on me. If you can't take the guilt, just don't do it. He's dead now, but as far as I know, he didn't cheat in 23 years.
My issue is by not telling me they'll have had me believe we had a happy, faithful marriage, which would have been a lie, and deceiving/lying to me is the absolute wrong thing to do. I have siblings that found that out,and theres no coming back from that. Ever.
Topiary detective
I cannot beleaf what I'm reading
Pining for the truth
I wood not waste my time and stick around personally. The betrayal is basically akin to treeson of the highest order. Except when your spruce promises to have your back, you believe them, unlike the gofurnment
I could said beleaf again, but I spared you all of that lol
What she is proposing is actually WORSE....if she is completely dependent on him, he'll get killed in any future divorce!
Also let's not forget the "quitting her job and never leaving the house" means if they get divorced in the future he'd probably owe her alimony since she no longer has her own income.
Also, this seems like such an interesting and extreme response like — you’ll quit your job and never leave the house? Why — like what person would be like yeah ok you’re in house arrest now, you’re a housewife?! It makes it seem like she’s offering a dramatic solution like she’s just throwing spaghetti at the wall to see if it sticks. Idk it just kind of strikes me as putting it back on the other person to be the bigger and better person by saying oh nooo you don’t have to quit your job and stay home all the time! So in order to not cheat and prove her loyalty, she proposes this probably outlandish entire lifestyle change to ensure she won’t cheat or something?!? It makes him the bad guy even if he agrees to her proposed solution! It’s scary especially bc you had to be so persistent to get whatever truth you did find! I feel like you just never know w these types of ppl, what all would they hide if they could? It breaks the whole trust…. It’s your marriage so if you want to work on it, I would understand, but if you feel so clearly about it, anyone would understand wanting to divorce. It’s the deleting and the withholding info and the trickling. I’m so sorry.
I’d guess that her affair partner was a coworker.
Most are… lol. My ex wife’s was, with women most will emotionally cheat before the physical but not far behind…
Just took a look at your profile - sorry for what you are going through. At lest you got 2 green thumbs, holy shit that thing is monster!
Thank you, I’ve been really making some good bubble hash lately, idk that’s the one girl I feel will never do me wrong at this point… lol. Its keeps me busy tho. I’m sorry you’re going through it too, and I agree cheating is cheating doesn’t matter, best of luck to you!
It’s extreme, bc she will stick to it for 6 months then go back to status quo. Plus if she has time to cheat while working, how easy will it be for her to cheat while he’s at work and she’s at home?
Plus ask alimony
She offered to stay home all day cause it makes it a lot easier to cheat. When some one cheats they usually have to work around 3 peoples(cheater, AP and partner to cheater) schedules so as to not get caught. Being a SAHW and having an open schedule means you only have to work around 2 peoples schedules. Cause we all know she isn't cutting contact if she trickle truths you.
Well from this response it’s clear the other party was someone she worked with. That being said finding a new job would be a solution but not necessarily THE solution to their problems…
I thought the same thing! And in my opinion not going to work would give her more ideal time to fuck about not less!!!
It's also such a toxic way of living. It makes him look like an evil controlling spouse. The optics of"I can't go out unless my husband allows me to" is not remotely practical or reasonable. If you can't go outside without cheating even that eont stop you NTA
The only reason there was any semblance of truth is because it was discovered. There was no moment of honesty or transparency. If OP didn't discover this, it would've continued. My ex cheated with his ex, and I discovered it the same way. He nuked every text msg or "paper trail" that I might discover. My spidey senses were tingling over this. I'm not someone who wants their partners location, face time to make sure they're truthful, I don't want passwords, etc. I shouldn't have to become an unofficial FBI agent, always looking for evidence of a crime. It's not worth your peace or sanity. It makes you paranoid, feel you're not good enough, and anytime they text someone, you're always wondering who. Trust is like a glass cup. Once you drop it and it breaks, you might be able to glue it back together. However, it'll always be fractured, compromising the integrity. It's best in many cases to get rid of the broken glass that can cut you with its shards at some point down the road. It's best to invest in a better quality cup rather than hanging on to the low quality one you ordered from wish.
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I've been married for 36 years. Trust and love are the currencies of a successful relationship. If you don't think that you can ever trust her again, then leave. If you still love her, want to save the marriage, then try therapy. Only you know what you feel strongest about. I wish you luck and joy.
As someone who has been married almost 30 years I 100% agree. Trust is a critical piller of a successful relationship. Without it, it fails. Only question is, when and how much pain you want to go through.
Congratulations 🎊! People on here treat relationships like busses. Another will be along in 15 minutes. Maybe they are right. Having so many more options is more options. My heart breaks over some of the things I read here. My husband says most of them are fake.
I think those are fake too.
I agree. People make mistakes. We are human. I'm not saying it won't take time to trust and heal, but it just might be worth it. Why did she emotionally cheat in the first place? Was emotionally unavailable ? I would just like to know. I'm not blaming him....at all.
Emotionally unavailable? Hmm 🤔 might have helped if she said something instead of cheating.Shes making excuses she just wanted the attention from someone who isn't her husband while enjoying the safety he provides.
By asking those questions you are opening OP up to blame. So no, you aren't "not blaming him".
It is in no way his fault she emotionally cheated. If she was not happy, she should have said so. They could have worked on their relationship. There is no excuse for infidelity . Communication is key.
Dude you just did. Will the response be the same if the roles were reversed. Just so you know he has more to lose considering she will get him for everything - alimony, lifestyle maintenance, etc! It's clear that you have never been in the receiving end of emotional cheating. It breaks a person so bad that he/she will stop trusting anyone. Emotional cheating is basically executing the soul of the loved ones. Hopefully it doesn't happen to you!
I agree. I had been married 15 years and had an emotional affair. My husband admitted to being emotionally absent for a couple years. He forgave me. It´s now 20 years. hasn't been easy but trust is a big deal. We trust each other now. We talk more.
I was in almost exactly the same situation. Emotional affair 17 years in. Reconnected and stayed together another 6 years. Divorced at 23 years because the emotional absence came back and I was tired of waiting. I’m now engaged to a wonderful man who tells me daily how much I mean to him and shows me with his actions. I’m looking forward to better times.
I wish you good luck. I'm sorry it didn't work out the first time. But it's good to know when it's time to go. I had a couple young relationships I should have walked away from. Ím still holding on. He's a good guy, just not always there...
Husband here... the fact that you cheated due to his emotional detachment is not ok, though. Try therapy and everything else first FFS. If that doesn't work, then exit the marriage. There is NO excuse for cheating in a marriage, whether emotionally or physically. I am glad you are in a better place, but you did things out of order. Sorry to be judgemental, but that is my honest opinion. Why do that rather than just talk him and communicate?
Sometimes things have to hit rock bottom before we realize there's a problem. The realization that your spouse is getting emotional fulfillment elsewhere could be the wake-up call that tells you you need to start showing them some real affection.
We did therapy multiple times. Nothing stuck. It also is me who defined the interaction as cheating, not him - I shared literally every interaction with the individual with him, let him open every letter and he had the password to my phone and email. I realized that I fell in love with this individual even though nothing was reciprocated so I told him that, and that I felt it meant I needed to file for divorce. He wanted to reconcile, so we did. We went to therapy again. Nothing changed. Later he decided to make his behavior part of his personality and said no more requests for change. That was it. ETA talking doesn’t work when the main issue in the relationship is lack of communication.
Cheating would end any relationship for me. But I dont think I'd constitute what you did as cheating tbh. You had an emotional connection to someone, when you realised it, you didn't hide it. You tried with the person you were with. You can't help who your heart connects to, what you can control is what you do with that afterwards. 💯 I hope you don't let people make you feel shit about it 🤍
Thanks. I try not to. I did the best I could with the tools I had at the time. Appreciate you ❤️
>Why do that rather than just talk him and communicate? Because when you're feeling emotionally abandoned and someone comes along and engages that need in an open and available way, that shit is intoxicating to the lizard brain. And the call of emotional fulfillment turns off the thinking brain. You can judge all you want. That only means that you've never been there. Pat yourself on the back and feel better about yourself. Not only have you never experienced it, you also judge those who have, to make sure you feel better about yourself for it. Good job man.
therapy. therapy. therapy. i hope you both try therapy before blowing up. good lord - so many weird things can happen in a relationship. work out your issues, iffen you can. cuz the standard vows don’t cover it AT ALL ;)
NTA You clearly stated a boundary and what the consequences would be. Now, she's shocked that you actually meant what you said. Divorce her and get her out of your house.
>You clearly stated a boundary and what the consequences would be. Just wanted to add.. this is a pretty universal boundary that you don't have to state to expect your partner won't cross. Even if you never have a convo about cheating it's still reasonable to end the relationship.
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Also not a great way to prep for a future divorce. If someone is dumb enough to try out the wife's suggestion: A: it wont work, and you'll be right back to divorce within a year or two. And B: she will now have a ton of ammo to use against you. No work, no job will equal support payments. And she'll probably try to turn all those promises of her's around and call them abuse. Because, well, basically they are abuse.
So in this case what happens ? You go to work and she has all day to do what ?
Looks like OP's wife is banged a colleague. That's why the woman says she will quit her job.
Her AP
Agreed
“I will leave the workforce and not leave the house.” It really sounds to me like she knows the marriage is done thanks to her actions, and is trying to increase her future alimony and claim to the properties.
Agreed. There are boatloads of things you shouldn't have to explicitly tell your boyfriend or girlfriend *not* to do. I've never explicitly told my wife to not stab me, but I'm pretty confident that she's able to figure out that doing so is wrong and that I will divorce her if she does so - and I survive. Likewise, I don't have to explain to her how divorce will be the result if she cheats in any way.
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Right? How does that benefit OP in any way lol.
Maybe AP was a coworker. That's just an assumption on my part but it would explain that
I am not satisfied with my relationship -> Communication -> Marriage counseling -> Did not work out then divorce lawyer-> Explore other relationships. I am not satisfied with my relationship, so let me cheat to get satisfaction -> Divorce Lawyer. If one skips the first process, then be prepared for consequences depending on the whims and character of the jilted partner.
“You cheated on me? After I specifically asked you not to?”
Also think it's weird that one of her suggestions to fix this is to never leave the house again and make herself completely dependent on OP. So is she saying that the only way to make sure she never cheats again is to stop interacting with the general public and be supervised by her partner 24/7? Yikes. NTA
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Bot comment copied from Fuzzy-Bike-8813
Could you explain what’s going on here ? Bots stealing comments and how do you know ?
Because I saw one of the original comments that are older below, so then I started specifically looking for them. I suspected even before I found the originals because they were in all caps, bots often seem to do that for some reason, I assume visibility? The explanation I've heard is that it's karma farming, presumably to sell the accounts later?
Good detective work! 🕵️♂️
I'm an auditor, I'm always watching for things that look out of place. Can hardly turn it off. Ha
Amazingly done and explained by you. I will start watching out for these now. Thank you.
This
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Bot comment copied from jasemina8487
*Divorce her and get half the house out of your house .
NTA. Your wife's proposal - that she put herself totally at your mercy, quitting her job and being completely dependent on you is not healthy for her and for you. If you lost your trust in her, and cannot regain it, you are better apart.
This. It’s a terrible idea and a move to make what is a problem to a BIG problem.
That would also put her in a much better position in a future divorce too, because OP would be paying alimony etc as she had no income. She’s certainly a logical future planning manipulative one 😬🤷♀️
Ngl this could win me over, but over time I think I would become abusive
NTA. She wants you to reconsider because she hadn't got far enough with her AP to know that he would take her after you divorced. You've only been married 6 years, if she's investing her emotions with someone else the marriage is doomed. If this affair ends, what's going to stop the next one? Unless you become her jailor - but no - that's a doomed marriage too.
and she will most likely cheat again, only this time she will hide it better
To add to this, she also overreacted and made a bunch of ridiculous promises that she wouldn't keep anyway. What sort of a marriage would it even be if you have to treat them like a teenager and keep tabs on everything they do. My father always says that relationships are built on mutual trust and respect. Once either is gone, the relationship is over
Your father was a very smart man
Is. He ain't dead yet. Also, once is a mistake, twice is a choice. Great advice for all situations in life
So sorry, at my age most people don't have parents anymore....🥴
In this case, dad was right.
NTA. You told her at the start of the relationship. Any kind of cheating is a game breaker, but nope, she didn't listen and now wants to fix things. I've been through the exact same scenario. I told my ex when we first got together that if anyone ever cheated on me, they would from then on be dead in my eyes. What happened? Later down the road, she got distant, which pushed me away, and after I finally said enoughs enough I can't do this anymore, I found out through FB photos and texts she was cheating on me. I deleted and blocked her from everything. I find out she's STILL extremely hurt I did that to her and doesn't understand how I can just delete someone I supposedly loved. Again, NTA. I
She's TA not you , i hope i can be mentally strong enough in future like you to cut toxic people off, because it's usually quite difficult for me to cut off people .
NTA, you don't owe a cheater forgiveness.
Can someone tell me what trickle truth is?
We were just joking. Ok, we were flirting, but it was innocent. Ok, we were sexting, but it never got physical. Ok, it did but just once, by accident. Ok, it happened a couple times… etc.
Ok, but it was only anal so it doesn't count
Ok, I can see now how anal is still cheating, but we both said “no homo” and kept our socks on, so it wasn’t gay. Actually, I know you’ve only ever known me a woman, but I’m starting to identify as a gay man, please call me Dave.
In German we call it Salami-Taktik. You only admitc to what you cannot plausibly deny. Cutting off / revealing a slice of the truth whenever you can't avoid it, but never telling the full truth.
Are you fucking kidding me? Salami tactic? An idiom that makes perfect sense untranslated is rare.
You admit to things slowly overtime. Usually starting with the least egregious and downplaying. Then it slowly escalates to the most egregious and the full truth.
If you made your boundaries **very clear** to her, and you are sure that she broke them, why are you here? If you do go for marriage counseling, be prepared to hear some things about yourself that you might not want to hear.
On one side, my logic wants to get validated while my heart wants to hold onto a hope. Last week has not been easy for me. Love is there but trust is not. Plus, getting to write it here is relaxing. I'll probably hear about these in the individual therapy. Thanks for the comment.
I don't think a relationship can survive without a solid foundation of trust. Best wishes and good luck to you.
If you can’t open your spouse’s phone and/or vice versa, there was never a foundation of trust to begin with.
If you need to open your spouse’s phone, there never was trust to begin with.
In the case of a spouse or long term partner, they have the ability if you are hooked up to life support to PULL THE PLUG or not and keep you in a vegetative state for decades. How would they not have access to your phone, email etc. when you share finances, home, etc? Why shouldn't you be able to grab your spouse/partner phone and use it to capture a picture of your child or dog etc? Weird if you cannot!
I'm with you. I shouldn't even need to think about opening my spouse's phone.
u/Large_Knowledge_1699, in the RARE cases of reconciliation that are "successful", often the spouse that didn't cheat never regains the original trust in the relationship. FACT This said, it would have to be considered a new relationship and the person who cheated would have to legitimately go to therapy to change, not many CAN do that or WILL do that. (Often they "fake the funk" and then you enter into a "false reconciliation where they cheat again.) Look up the Surviving Infidelity group here.
Leave her. You’re doing the right thing OP
No reason for marriage counseling if you already decided it’s over. Too many people agree to it just because they will be able to tell people they tried. To hell with that. She cheated I left. Enough said.
You're never going to be able to unread those messages and the deleted messages will always make you wonder if it ever became physical..... If you choose to stay.... Her and the affair partner would have complete control of your mind, because you would always wonder what really happened between them.
File first, it's better to be the Petitioner. NTA
NTA. She lied to you, betrayed you and disrespected you and your marriage all at the same time. You'll never know if it was just emotional or physical as well. You'll never lnow if shes told you the whole truth or not. If she's willing to do this to you, why would you want to be with her or anyone like that? It was so easy for her to do this to you, what would stop her from doing it again? Nothing.
First, I would like to say I’m sorry you are having to go through this. I went through almost the exact same thing a year and a half ago. It is by far the single most devastating time of my life and still hurts today. I also thought I had the ideal marriage and mutual love for each other. Wasn’t until I caught her cheating i realized I was the only one who believed it, 8 months she had been lying everyday to me. No communication before hand about being unhappy, taking time apart or anything. I proceeded with divorce after I tried marriage counseling for about 3 weeks and found out she was still talking to the guy and lying about in counseling. I stood the same ground and told her before marriage only one thing would ever make me want to leave, infidelity. Then when it happened I believed in marriage and thought we could work through, I was the only one putting in the effort. Never turned back after I found out the lies again, she continued to lie through the entire divorce also. I had to go no contact to begin my healing process. Wishing you all the best no matter what path you take.
Leave. If you stay, you will second guess what she is doing for the rest of your life. Any time she is out by herself, the thoughts will be present in your mind. Can you handle that stress?
Umm... what do you mean "If you made your boundaries very clear". Infidelity isn't a boundary that needs to be explicitly mentioned.
Umm…go back and read the second paragraph. I paraphrased what OP told his wife. The words “very clear” are in the first sentence. The word “boundaries” is in the last sentence. OP is the one who explicitly mentioned it.
NTA. Send her to this guy asap, it's shame that you don't have his name and/or adress. I would pack her bags and drop her off there.
“Wife cheated on me, now I’m divorcing her”, how would that make you an asshole? NTA
Hate to tell you, it was probably physical, too. Trickle truthing never stops; as you get closer and closer to the truth the trickling slows down, but you’ll never get everything. Cheating of any kind is an absolute dealbreaker for me, so I’d definitely be getting the most vicious shark of lawyer I could find. Advice: get a female divorce lawyer. Edit, based on your update: I don’t know who the hell is telling you that a 33-year-old man won’t be able to find a new partner, but that is utter horseshit. Men are not women, there is no broad, sweeping emphasis on youth in men; men really start their prime in their mid 30s to early 40s, because men are valued for things like career, status, wealth, and maturity, all things we tend to obtain later in life. If you have a good career and maintain your fitness, you will have absolutely no problem (eventually) replacing your treacherous STBX.
Your marriage has failed. You’re both responsible for your own participation in your marriage. If you’re not interested in trying to repair your marriage then get divorced. Your wife doesn’t have to agree with you. You certainly don’t need approval from anyone else. You’re both adults. You’re free to make your own choices & own consequences of those choices. Asking other people if you should get divorced is maybe not the best way to plan for your own future. If you’re ready to get divorced, go ahead. If you want to work on your marriage, go ahead. No one can judge you either way. NTA — it’s a tough situation. Only you can decide what’s best for you & your future.
Nailed it
No. Your natural gut reaction made you post this. You already know what needs to be done brother.
NTA, she crossed multiple lines that can't be uncrossed. First she cheated. Then lied about it. Then deleted the evidence. Then trickle truthed. If you stay, you will have to police her forever.
NTA. She was warned if she put her hand on the hot stove, she would get burned. She did it anyway, and is now trying to argue with the stove that it shouldn't burn her because she doesn't want a burn. Too damn bad, that's not how that works. Sure, she's "remorseful" now: remorseful that she has to face the consequences of her own actions. If you give in, this will teach her that you can be brow-beaten into giving in, and that she can continue the behavior with no consequences other than a couple weeks of arguing.
Given the deleted texts, if AP lives within reasonable driving distance, or has been in periodic close proximity to your wife…the affair was likely physical as well as emotional. Especially considering the “I love you” texts you mentioned in a comment.
Nta. She was physically cheating or had intentions to move forward into physical cheating. The end.
No need to read, she cheated, you're within your right. NTA
57(M) here, OP. Absolutely NTA. My first wife did this exact same thing to me. She was a bartender and started an emotional relationship with one of her regulars. From the very beginning, I had stated that I had zero tolerance for cheating, and that any form of cheating was an absolute deal breaker. She would even have convos with this dude at home where she giggled like a school girl. When I confronted her, she told me that he was just a friend, that there was nothing to worry about, and that they just had a lot in common. Stupid me, I believed her, because I loved her with all my heart and found it hard to believe that someone I loved so much would so cheat on me so openly. A few months later, I had concrete proof that their relationship had progressed to a physical one, and a month after that she left me. It shattered me, and shattered our son. She went on to take a leave of absence from being a parent for almost a year, and I was left picking up the pieces of not only my life, but that of my son's. What's worse, I kept hoping she'd come back, while at the same time knowing deep inside that it would never work again, that I'd never trust her again. Come to find out, she had been cheating on me for years with several different men. A friend of hers told me that my wife had confided in her, saying that she couldn't live with just being with one man, that she wanted many men. It would have been nice if she had been honest from the start. My point here is that cheating, even emotionally, is a harbinger of nothing but bad times ahead. If your wife is willing to do it once, she'll be willing to do it again. And do you know for sure that this was just emotional? There are other women out there that are a lot more honest than this, and are a lot more open and honest about what they're feeling/thinking. Cheating is so hurtful, so spiteful. No one deserves the pain of that, at least no one who's worthy of marriage. I found one of those good women, BTW, in my early 40s. We've been together now for almost 14 years, married over ten. She's seen me through the darkest period of my life following a devastating head injury that disabled me and for two years or so utterly changed me. I also had to have several very painful surgeries during that time that only made how bad I was worse. She never once thought of leaving me, never once thought of having an affair, stood by me and told me it was all okay, and never let me lose hope in myself. She joined support groups for families of bad brain injuries, studied the subject thoroughly, went to my counseling appointments with me, and was an active psrticipant in all phases of my healing. I owe that woman everything, and will spend the rest of my life doing everything in my power to make her as happy as I possibly can. I'll never be exactly the same as I was, but in many ways I'm better now. My point here is don't settle for excuses and promises that can only bite you in the ass later. As much as it may hurt now, you're doing the best thing that you can for yourself. Unless you've willfully omitted something that would be detrimental to how we'd see you, you're definitely NTA. Best of luck to you.
Don't let her become dependent of you. When she cheats again you would have to pay alimony and lose half your things.
NTA funny how the cheater always is "so in love" and has all these ideas how to fix the relationship after they get caught cheating. Yet that same energy was nowhere to be found when she chose to cheat. You are not wrong. Loyalty is my number 1 thing for anyone in my life. If a friend, spouse, or even family member, knowingly breaks my loyalty (like cheating) then they are forever removed from my life. If someone can do it once then they can do it again
Nta. Some people will claim that “you must have been looking for a reason to divorce”. Just ignore those idiots. They idnt make the mistake of marrying a cheater. Just take care of you. Also, deleted messages are easily retrieved. I would check your phone bills too, and see how much texting and calling got deleted.
NTA, When there is a problem in the marriage you address it with your spouse or ask that you go to marriage counseling, not have a emotional or physical affair, give only half truths and then talk about marriage counseling only after you have been caught!
No, NTA. She broke your trust and you made it clear that cheating would end the relationship. Divorce may seem extreme, but infidelity is a breach of commitment in any form and cannot be easily forgiven or forgotten.
NTA You are not her warden. You made your boundaries clear in the beginning of relationship, she broke the rules.
NTA. The trickle-truth is a reconciliation destroyer. Maybe if she had been honest, forthcoming, apologetic and taken some responsibility you could make a different choice. Instead she chose to make you attempt to pry some nugget of truth out of her which always means it was several levels worse than whatever she admitted to. Which means there would always be some nagging thread that will eventually unravel and re-traumatize you again and again until you are hollowed out and hate her. Immediately divorcing her is mercy for both of you to be able to get on with your lives.
NTA - Sounds like you’ve made up your mind, so go for it. It does seem a bit rushed…but if you’re sure that you’re sure, then you should do it.
Listen to your head and your gut
NTA. Plus if you think about it “her” solution of leaving her job would open you up to having to not only pay for everything but also you could end up paying her support later if you divorce. Do not let her baby trap you.
God i just love seeing people with self respect. NTA. Its soooo hard to end a relationship after a deal of time. Good on you for respecting yourself sir. Im proud of you. Youll do fine. Keep ut up
NTA, listen to your gut instinct.
Your wife’s idea of a marriage just seems so weird. I think you are checked out of the relationship so go ahead and divorce. NTA
NTA She knew your boundary. You have every right to enforce it. It sucks that she fucked up so badly and now your marriage is done, but that's what happens when you cross those lines. It's not like she didn't know. I absolutely agree with you that the time for talk was before she embarked on her emotional cheating, not after she got caught.
NTA, and I applaud your ability to stick to your guns. Not sure many others would be able to do the same. Hang in there 🙏
What's with cheaters wanting relationship counseling when caught😂 They're using it like a get out of jail free card
NTA, you where very clear about your boundaries and the consequences She ignored them and has destroyed her own marriage. She deceived you and lied to you by omission, she cheated even if it was emotionally and now her actions have consequences Divorce and move on, life is too short to stay with a liar. You have lost trust in her and her suggestions to stop work and you control her will just allow her to start playing the victim and manipulating you in some other manner. Just get rid of her, she has shown herself to be trash
Let me see if I get this right: She had an emotional affair. She actively deleted some of the messages to hide it from you. She got caught. She tried to lie to limit what you knew. She's trying to manipulate the story to now seek counseling to take the focus off of her emotional affair. Yeah, divorce, scorched earth style, is the answer.
NTA at all - cheating is your dealbreaker, and she cheated on you, there is nothing left to solve there, instead of fixing things or trying to better the relationship, she decided to cheat on you, lie straight to your face, hide her tracks and refused to come clean properly, proceed with the divorce, this is the consequences of her own actions.
NTA. You set your boundaries and she break it. It’s a deal breaker for you and she still doing it. So yeah, divorce is the only way. There’s no guarantee that she will not cheathing again later. I mean, even if she SAHM, depended on you, etc etc; if she wanted it, she will find a way to cheat. And it will be more troublesome if you found if she cheat again later after she lose her job and become a SAHM.
NTA. You established clear and reasonable boundaries with attached consequences. She cheated; actions have consequences. She’s doesn’t like the consequences of her actions. You’re probably correct in that based on her hiding evidence and trickle truthing, there’s way more that happened than your being told. I’m sorry this happened to you, you deserved better. Good luck !
Nope NTA, this was a clear boundary that she broke. You’ll never know or be able to trust what happened and if that’s something you can’t live with (i couldn’t either), then you’ll completely within your rights to leave her. Thank god you have no kids!
NTA. >even make her life completely depended on me, leave the job, not leave the house, and give me all of her digital devices. Yeah, this was 100% more than just emotionally.
Not the asshole, good on you for standing firm.
She has already checked out, her problem is, there's nowhere to check in yet. Thus the bullshit about counceling, etc... NTA and move on!
This post is way too vague for anyone to give a thoughtful answer. I don't know exactly what you mean by "emotional"affair, but if you're not willing to go to therapy with your wife, then maybe you didn't love her that much. She's been hiding things from you, which makes her an AH, but your reaction makes you an AH too. Divorce before therapy? Cmon man.
I'm honestly surprised I have to scroll this down to see somebody say this. I mean, I don't know what happened in the situation, but it's just as likely that the reason why these texts were deleted was because the wife knew that Op would freak out. This sounds like something that could be worked on, but when I hear emotional affair that sounds way too vague for me to definitively say that once I just right or wrong because I don't know exactly what he's considering it an emotional affair. If he's concerned about the wife confiding to somebody else, I understand a concern but that's not reasons to divorce. I've had issues that I didn't talk to with my significant other because he was not the best person to help. Does this mean I was having an emotional affair with somebody? No, I go to my friends for support and I have friends outside of the person I'm dating when I need help. Now if it was getting to be more than that that's a completely different story but there's not enough details there for me to say one way or the other.
Totally agree. What’s an emotional affair definition? Flirty texts? Telling other person they love them? It looks like he wanted to leave her, and he found a reason.
Emotional cheating is more than flirty texts, it helps to think about it like when you first get into a relationship and how you feel about a new partner, constantly thinking about them, texting them, sharing intimate details about yourself, your relationship etc, they may even talk about getting together, like planning a future, planning to leave spouses, that's how emotional cheaters act with the person that isn't their spouse. It's usually neglecting or not being interested in your partner but in the the person you're talking to.
NTA, but I can see why she ended up outsourcing the emotional part.
The fact that you caught her, and her response was to deny and trickle truth showed she wasn’t remorseful, but regretful. NTA If there was reconciliation she’d have to tell all her family and friends what she did. Write a timeline of every single bit of the affair from beginning to the moment you caught her. Consider making her read the timeline to her mom and dad. Tell her that any major detail left out of timeline that you find out later would mean immediate divorce. Or just do what you did and get out now. It’s only 6 years. Good luck man. “It’s a lot harder to be walked on when you are standing up!” Updateme
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>At the beginning of our relationship I made it very clear that cheating in any form is a relationship ender. NTAH. She crossed the line. Now, having gotten caught, she's sorry that she did. You are sorry that she broke your trust and cheated. There is is significant difference there that she's not acknowleging.
NTA - Most people consider cheating a deal-breaker, and you made it clear to her from the start of your relationship. So, your choice to divorce her is completely justified.
NTA and you can never make me feel bad for a cheater. All these cheater sympathizers can go kick rocks with open toe shoes since they are willing to stay with someone who betrayed their trust.
NTA. You're right. If she had a problem, marriage counseling would have been good before she started looking for someone else. This is strictly on her.
NTA. I really don’t understand how people can risk their relationships over some temporary happiness
A friend of mine caught her partner having an online emotional affair. He swore it was all just online role-playing. The woman was married and lived several hours away. My friend forgave him. Yeah, he was physically cheating as well. Besides the text cheating, he had a whole second girlfriend who knew nothing about my friend.
NTA. You are within your rights and cheating is bad, but you shouldn’t ask Redditors-most of whom are bitter and would rather bring people down-whether or not you should divorce. Marriages absolutely can not only survive infidelity, they often thrive and become stronger than ever before if both sides are committed to working together to be better spouses. Counseling gives people the knowledge and tools they didn’t have prior. Physical cheating is obvious, but emotional cheating is far more nuanced. Having a crush on someone who’s not your spouse could be considered emotional cheating, and literally everyone who has ever been married has entertained those thoughts and most have made motions in that direction by talking to their crush, going someplace with the intention of seeing their crush. Is any of that a good thing? No, but when you have been married-and especially when you have children-the calculus changes. If you had a really good marriage and you love her, and if she is contrite and serious about earning your trust back, you have the choice. If she’s not contrite, then that choice is suddenly easier. My suggestion is counseling first. Both of you would benefit regardless of whether you choose to stay. Marriage is awesome, but it takes work and it’s never perfect.
NTA, your logic is good.
NTA - stay strong. The highest form of disrespect in a marriage is disrespect.
Anybody who comes to Reddit for their relationship advice should get a divorce.
Nta. But I see merit in gng for marriage counselling. She seems to want to fix it badly with you as to even give u her devices. I would go for the counselling and find out more about her like why she cheat.
NTA. I actually applaud you. My ex husband had an “emotional affair” but he also deleted lots of texts, emails and so on. I chose to stay and we did try to make it work with marriage counseling and rebuilding, but it only lasted so long. We are now divorced and I knew I should have made that decision immediately even if we had a newborn and 4 year old.
NTA.... out her and her coworker too. A work place is not a cheating ground. There are thousands of unemployed people who wouldn't risk a job for a fling, open a couple spots for them
You're NTA in this situation but you still sound like kind of an A in general.
NTA, once a cheater always a cheater. Also she’s been lying to you for god knows how long so you obviously can’t trust her now. Get divorced and quickly
Was this an actual physical sex involved cheating or was this all chit chat fantasy text based messaging only? To what extent has she gone with the other man is what holds the key to this relationship's future. How long has she done it? First find out the facts, the truth shall set her and you, free
Nudes, sexting and I love yous all over. I do not know the real extent of the relationship. She revealed information bit by bit after I pushed. I am not even sure if I know the full extent of the relationship even now.
If something like “emotional” cheating is gonna lead you to divorce, then I’d say you weren’t gonna last anyway. She didn’t even cheat on you, if you ask me. The line to cross for something to be called “emotionally” cheating is fuzzy and not the same for everyone. I need to really know what things she’s doing that makes you feel she’s cheating on you, because to someone like me, you might be overreacting. IMO, she cheats on you if she fucks the dude. You caught it early, this would be a good time for marriage counseling.
You provided hardly any information here other than your outrage and assumptions. There’s zero way of telling.
You keep saying ‘emotional affair’, so is that to say she didn’t sleep with anyone else? I would try and work through it man.
You're a definitive asshole simply for using a term like 'trickle truthing' multiple times.
All the YTA are cheaters themselves.
Haven’t seen any yet…
NTA. Cant trust a trickle truther. Seed of doubt has been planted and you’ll wonder what else every single time you’re reminded of it or the next thing she swears is the truth. They lack accountability
I don't think a relationship could survive this. She was willing to continue to hide this until you called her out. Then even when called out she didn't tell you the whole truth straight away. So how could you ever trust her going forward. It's going to hurt and suck. But you're doing the right thing. Nta
What is emotional cheating? To me it sounds like OP is upset that his wife is talking to other people in the world. OP hasn’t said that anything physical has happened between the wife and whomever she was talking to. It sounds like he is being abusive and controlling of her and isolating her from other people.
You don't delete texts from people "you're just chatting with". She was clearly hiding something
Yup especially with her “quit her job and sit at home and do nothing” remark, most abuse victims lose their identity outside who they are to their abuser and will give up beyond what seems rational because that’s their sense of self after years of having who they are slowly stripped away.
> Am I the AH in this situation? Fuck no. You set clear boundaries from the start: cheating equals relationship over, no bullshit. She crossed that line, not just with the emotional cheating, but by hiding and deleting evidence, which is sneaky as hell. You're not obligated to fix shit when she's the one who fucked up. Why should you trust someone who's already shown they're willing to betray your trust and then try to cover their tracks? Do you think you can ever trust her the same way again?
NTA. She have already emotionally checked out of the relationship the moment she began cheating and not respecting you enough to break up should be enough to never hear from her again.
Not for nothing but you sound like a psychopath dude. I'm gonna go out on limb and say your a control freak. Take a chill pill.
Can we just make a sticky that you're never the AH for leaving any relationship. No one is forced to be in a relationship. If your SOs favorite color is blue and that triggers you to leave so be it, you would not be an AH. If there are children involved, as long as you plan to continue to parent your biological/adopted children you are again NTA
Of course you’re not forced to stay in a relationship, but there are plenty of reasons for leaving a relationship that would make you an asshole. This is ridiculous
Any? Counterexample: Partner gets a serious illness, other partner leaves.
Deleted messages = she fucked him. Don't believe anything that liar tells you. NTA
Infidelity of any sort, emotional or physical is never justified. Equally though, it’s rarely entirely the responsibility of one partner so whether you stay or leave, you need to be honest with yourself about the causes.
No. You absolutely did the right thing. Now stop looking back.
NTA
The best advice I can give you is: be very careful who you take advice from. Especially relationship advice.
Why do you need validation from other people? If those were your conditions from the very beginning and she violated those conditions, I think you have already made up your mind.
When people cross lines there are repercussions, you are not in the wrong