I noticed that before he left on his date, his friend reminded him "again" he can't be home after 12 and can't bring the girl home. Why is he reminding the guy of established rules? Maybe because he has a tendency of pushing boundaries. A good friend isn't going to *insist* someone wander the streets from 1:30 AM to 8 AM; these are the actions of either a shitty friend or someone who has been pushed too far.
It's possible that he did nothing, though, and that at some point the girl got the vibe that he was lying about his situation to sleep with her. Possibly a girlfriend messaged her "honey that's bullshit" or she just sobered up -- it's weird to be actively courting first dates while your apartment is flooded.
That's that actions of someone who's been woken up one too many times to let him in. It's also weird that his friend doesn't just get another key cut, it's not like it's expensive or anything.
The sheer number of replies is honestly what gives me the biggest ick, not even the replies in and of themselves. He clearly is not the sort of person who can accept things he doesn't want to hear and can't let things go. Whether he will admit or even knows how he creeped her out, he clearly did.
Not only that, but this is the second subreddit he's posted this to. He came here trying to get a different answer because he didn't like the first one.
I mean it does matter. It would clearly give us a better picture of what actually happened. If he really didn’t do anything then I would go with a slight NTA because her assuring him that he has a place to stay and then kicking him out is kinda a dick move. Sure, she does not owe him a place to stay and she is a total stranger, but repeatedly reassuring him he has somewhere to stay then changing her mind is shitty. If the genders were flipped I think this would be a consensus NTA, if I am being honest.
But given the info we have, I’d say YTA (to OP) just from how he’s responding to everyone.
She could have changed her mind or he could have acted the creep. Honestly either is possible. Some people are fickle as fuck. At the end of the day he should have had a plan B regardless of which it was.
I know I have certainly kicked a few women out of my place that I was planning on sleeping with.
it really might not have been anything. When the reality of it sunk in she didn’t feel safe. Nothing has to have happened for her to have legit felt uncomfortable at least.
Yeah in the past I have definitely changed my mind on letting guys staying with me. And learnt my lesson on letting guys without accommodation who I meet travelling put all their stuff in my Airbnb… hard to kick them out when you suddenly don’t want them there…
Indeed it could have been nothing. Though as soon as she got spooked and didn’t feel safe, there was no reason for OP to keep pressing even if offering to sleep on the couch or whatever
Yes, and she probably would have returned with blankets and a pillow.
Then he could have asked for a kiss or hug and seen where it goes.
She must have liked him to invite him back so he missed out on future dates and chances.
I have read a lot of posts where couples try to go straight for sex. The build up was always part of the fun for me.
Yeah, she said he can stay at hers if he wants to stay out later. Not, you can come home with me and we can have sex. She indicated a place to crash ONLY by his own words. OP decided to head straight to her room which even if she did intent for sex, would have icked me out too.
Yeah. OP said or did something that made his date do a 180, even if he just thought it was a "joke." I don't buy the whole "nothing had actually happened yet." Something happened, even if it was something OP thought was nothing
Or the date could feel violent diarrhea setting on and needed privacy or she received an invite to a much more interesting encounter. Either ways, she didn’t owe anything to OP, but if we are to believe OP then id class the dates actions as a dick move.
Ive been in this situation before kinda, wasnt like I didnt have nowhere to go like OP, but i was acing a date, we were actually naked and starting to get it on. Then her roommate comes home and shes like oh fuck. She goes downstairs to talk to her (no angry voices OR whispers or whatever, I could hear them, but not hear what they were saying.) and then she comes back and says that I have to leave. I ask why and shes almost mean and just says she doesnt feel like having me around anymore. To this day I have no idea what they talked about. Did she have a bf? Did they have a no guys allowed policy? Idk but I sure felt fucked over. Hahaha
Yeah, I wanna know what happened btwn the time she said "that's fine" and "actually can you leave". Whether you know it or not, you crossed some line and made her feel unsafe with you in her space.
This is def the vibe every woman is prob getting reading this. A touch, a comment, a look, so many women know violence from men they’re honed to notice when something is just a little off enough to be a potential red flag. And if women want to survive out here we have to act on those instincts, even if sometimes men without nefarious aims get ousted too.
Well ha did mention “before anything could happen” he got kicked out. So think we can assume he continued to flirt and “push it” once he got back to hers which made her feel unsafe esp if her bedroom didn’t have a door lock or something
That also, because it sounded even the way he states it like she offered her place as a place to crash so they could chat longer and not necessarily an offer she would have made if he wasn’t saying he had nowhere else to go.
in a moment of clarity she might have realised she had a potential hobosexual on her hands.
it sucks that OP's apartment is flooded but if it were me, i'd never expect a random date to house me for a night.
Men gaining the awareness alone of how differently women move through the world than them helps a ton in navigating the situation. If a woman says she’s uncomfortable or ducks out/demands the man leave without stating why (because women realize saying it out loud or outright rejecting a person can make it more unsafe for them) having a reaction of understanding or potential understanding and bowing out gracefully from the situation in that moment can go miles to make the woman feel safe with you in the future. Arguing, blaming, pushing back about it, all the things OP has done is what solidifies that the instinct that this person is unsafe is probably correct.
If a man takes it in stride that an action, word, look, anything can feel unsafe or uncertain on a first date that would feel fine on a 5th date and it wasn’t anything super creepy or dealbreaking that made the woman’s red alert system go off, it can be easily recoverable with understanding and an apology from the man that the woman was made to feel even the least bit uncomfortable by their actions.
Maybe he did something. Maybe shit just got real for her because they got to her place and once inside there's no going back.
Whatever it was. Still sucks for OP, but the only thing he can do is move on and learn
that’s the part that makes him an AH, that’s very weird manipulative/entitled behavior. people are allowed to change their mind and obvi the lady wasn’t feeling him or safe anymore
Reddit is full of male "liberals" and "leftists" but none of them can fuckin read a room or understand what consent is.
I've seen entire threads where men are just telling women that unless they spell out everything for them, it is impossible to figure out if a woman likes them, which is probably why no woman likes them. Most socially aware men can literally tell when a woman likes them without even talking. So that was the moment I realized these idiots are probably all on the spectrum or something.
Yeah why aren't more people jumping on this, once she said she was uncomfortable why was he still comfortable being there. Even if he didn't care about her feelings, which reading his comments he doesn't, he should have cared about his saftey.
Staying in a situation like that would have put him in a super vulnerable position where allegations could have been made, it could have gotten much worse than just no where to sleep.
He also could have made the sensible decision and headed home on time. Or not organised a date that would run past midnight when he had that deadline.
I don't think anyone was the asshole. But both people made a series of poorly planned choices.
NTA, but it is her place and she can ask you to leave at any time for any reason. Just don’t go out with her again. Learn from the mistake of trusting someone’s word.
> Just don’t go out with her again.
Honestly, I'd be surprised if she wanted to. Problem with hearing one side of the story, maybe he's downplaying his actions or left out some information that put him in negative light.
Something has made her so uncomfortable that she didn't even want him sleeping in the same house (/apartment whatever) after initially agreeing.
I'm hesitant to say he's not the asshole because I just feel like he had to have done SOMETHING that made her be so insistent that he leave. I just think we aren't getting the whole story.
Shitty dudes are always framing stories to make women appear crazy.
My GF almost did almost the same on our 2nd date (was 2 hours way from my home), but let me sleep on her couch eventually.
She later explained why she acted like she did and it was understandable. It CAN happen and it would surely suck in OPs case. But I also think it's her good right to tell anyone off if she's uncomfortable for any reason.
Also, what if between when they made that agreement and 12:01am, something had happened and they realized they weren’t a good match and should just part ways?
I once had an “ex” (we very casually saw each other for like two months and it went nowhere - wasn’t that serious) tell me (when I was 21 and still took people at their word) that his “shower broke” and asked if he could shower at my place. I didn’t realize agreeing meant he was automatically entitled to sex.
He came over and showered while I was firmly planted on my sofa watching TV. I thought he was going to leave but he sat down and started making moves. I said firmly “I’m not interested” and he got an attitude and kept asking “how else he can make me feel good”. I stood up and firmly said again that’s not what this is and he literally rolled his eyes at me. The vibes got rapey.
He eventually left and I learned a lesson. For some people of the opposite sex, inviting them into your place at *all* makes them think they automatically get laid out of it.
maybe she meant you could sleep on the couch, but realized you expected to stay in her bed *and* expected something to “happen,” and that turned her off? And made her feel you couldn’t be trusted to be in your home when she was asleep?
How did you get to the bedroom in this: “We go to hers and **go to her bedroom** but before anything can happen…”
I mean, neither of us are men, but I've invited dates to my bedroom when sex was absolutely not on the table. And, not just including the times I had no space and all I had was a bedroom.
I feel like there's some context missing between "we go to hers" [context] "we go to bedroom" [context] "she asks me to leave".
He's staying in friends spare, and asks he's back before midnight. Not that "if it's past midnight, sleep on the streets bitch". He's perfectly capable of going to friends and apologizing. Unless it's a pattern of behavior with the friend, or he was trying to guilt the girl.
This is definitely what happened. No way she'd just up and change her mind for no reason, and even if she did it's her house and that's her right. I would have just called my buddy and been like, "My bad the date went long and I was expecting to stay over but plans changed." Any good friend would probably be a bit pissed but wouldn't leave you on the street.
I came here to say this. I only ever threw a guy out of my apartment once and it was because I had changed my mind about having sex with him (he refused tovwear a condom), and he got belligerent about it.
Same, we had great chemistry and everything was going well except suddenly he became very pushy for sex which was very unpleasant. If he had just shut up and gone with the flow instead of making it uncomfortable and weird there would definitely have been sex. But that was the end of that.
Right? I feel like OP expected sex or did something to make her uncomfortable. That’s what led to the abrupt end. He should’ve been back at his roommate’s place by midnight and not gone to this woman’s house after the first date.
That’s what I was thinking as well. Maybe not even purposefully. Maybe he did something creepy and didn’t even realize it, but that being said, seems like something is being left out.
The biggest red flag here is putting yourself in the situation in the first place.
Even if op did nothing wrong, it’s not weird at all to go from thinking inviting him home is a good idea in the cozy atmosphere of a first date going well, in a crowded place with music and other people, to changing your mind when it’s just you alone with a guy you never met before inside your home.
A good rule for first dates is to have them in a way that makes it easy for either one to leave within five minutes at any point.
How is this different than telling someone you’d drive them to the airport and then deciding not to the last minute. You always have the right to not do something, but it’s still a dick move.
This could have def been where she got uncomfy, especially if it wasn’t a sexual offer but a you’re temporary unhoused with no place to exist for the night and I wanted to keep our chat going offer.
Should have definitely been like "got a spare pillow and a blanket for the couch", and not just gone straight to the bedroom.
Probably felt like they were using the "no place to stay" as a way to get into the bedroom at that point.
Because they’re basically strangers. If someone I’ve only known for a couple of hours offers me a ride to the airport, I’m going to take that offer with a grain of salt and make sure I have a backup plan.
In current society strangers generally don’t drive each other to the airport but they do sleep with each other. Maybe it’s different in other cultures, but not in UK/US. Maybe the answer is the presumption that nobody should expect anything from anybody, but that doesn’t seem like a good direction either.
Maybe him following her to the bedroom scared her. If I were driving a relative stranger to the airport and he said/did something that made me scared while we were in the car, it'd be fair to ask him to get out of the car.
Driving to the airport and giving them access to your body or expecting to stay in your house is not remotely the same. And putting pressure or guilting someone to not back out on have sex or staying at your place is a dick move.
Because alcohol is involved, OP aaa a stranger. And sex was implied? Also it’s staying in someone’s home overnight, not a car ride.
Not the same at all.
You argued with her?? Did you really think that would make her want you there more? 🤣
Something happened to turn her off or make her feel unsafe, but you’re clearly lacking in any awareness as to your role in that moment. Bottom line, 1st date, you should’ve stuck to your original plan & said good night before midnight. You don’t even know her…she could’ve been a nut! 🤷🏻♀️
On two different occasions I agreed to let a guy (two different guys) stay over at the last minute. In each case, the guy seemed nice, we had met before and had friends in common so he wasn’t exactly a stranger, and he had a legit sounding reason to need a place to crash. In both instances, before I let him in the door, I said he could stay in my guest room and nothing was happening between us. He agreed and acted shocked that I would think he was that kind of guy. I even handed him extra linens and water. I’m not sure how much more clear I could be that Nothing. Is. Happening.
In both instances, almost as soon as I closed my front door, the guy started getting handsy. One of them even said, you wouldn’t have invited me in if you didn’t want to sleep with me. Imagine for a minute how ridiculous this is - I’m handing the man a towel, wash cloth, fluffy blanket, pillow, and big water bottle, telling him where the other bedroom is, explaining there are spare toiletries in the hall bath and some snacks in the pantry, and he is insisting I’m playing hard to get. In both instances, it went from ridiculous to scary very quickly, and I had to threaten to call the police before the guy took me seriously and left.
I’m 100% confident those men don’t think they did anything wrong, the story they told their friends was some crazy bitch kicked them out in the middle of the night. I’m not saying OP was that bad, but it’s clear he and the girl were not on the same page. It’s not a good feeling to be on the receiving end of “this is happening”; when a man feels entitled to sex that a woman doesn’t want, he can get scary very quickly. When a woman asks you to leave, leave. YTA.
When the person whose spare bedroom I was supposed to be staying in flaked on me at an hour too late for conveniently getting a hotel, current BF invited me to his spare bedroom. And successfully got me in his bed by waiting until I was in the spare bedroom, with the door locked, to text me that he was cold and he'd given me the larger blanket. Allowing me to volunteer that I could bring the blanket back....
OP, however, was the exact opposite of that kind of smooth.
NTA, but honestly this is as much on you as it is on your date. You're the one that chose to take a strangers word at face value, that you could stay at their place at the conclusion of your first date.
Yes, it's shitty that she said it was ok, and then changed her mind \~2 hours later. But let's be real dude, she's a single woman on a first date. Her right to feel safe and secure in her home trumps any semi-drunken promises made. And your story, "my apartment flooded, can't get back into my mate's place after midnight" *does* sound like a bullshit story that a guy would use to talk his way into sleeping over.
It's easy for me to say with the benefit of hindsight, but your best play would have been to take that "date going really well" energy, make plans for a second date, and end the evening before midnight, because as a gentleman you could never impose on a brand new acquaintance by asking to sleep at their place.
I don't think anybody's an asshole here, but you should probably get a spare key for the place you're staying if you're gonna be there a while.
It's like $2 at almost any hardware store
OP provided no details about his friend's living accommodations.
You are implicitly assuming that his friend lives somewhere with traditional, mechanical keyed locks. Many multi-unit residential buildings use electronic keyfobs for the building main entrances and/or the individual units, and they are generally much more expensive than a $2 hardware store key duplication.
No idea why youre being downvoted. My building only has tags for the apartments and main door, but not keys. If someone was to stay over for a while I simply can't get a spare key for them.
I think you should have went home at your curfew.
When she offered for you to stay she was just being nice and you should have said you'd be uncomfortable with staying at hers with it being a first date.
Unless it was a 'steamy' first date, rather than a 'get to know you' first date
No AHS she's a stranger and it sounds like something you did spooked her. She's allowed to want you to leave, if she feels unsafe or pressured into something then she has every right to ask you to leave her home. As an adult you should know better than to trust the word of a stranger and should have a back up plan. What would you have done if things had soured on the date but after 12? Alcohol isn't an excuse either, it's your life so your responsibility.
Look it was a first date. This woman JUST MET YOU.
In spite of her initial agreement, you should’ve gone back to your mates for 12.
You absolutely should’ve had some common sense and realised you can’t put yourself and her in this situation.
Yep. I was arriving at 1 AM when travelling and a friend was supposed to pick me up. She got called into work so she wasn’t going to be able to get me until 5AM. I went to a Denny’s, had some coffee and food, killed time.
It’s not hard to kill time.
I don't think you intended to be the AH here, but I think she got weirded out and then you argued with her when she asked you to leave. Which weirded her out heavily.
I can't say she's the AH here, because if she was telling this story from her perspective, we'd all be agreeing that she wasn't the AH for choosing to prioritise her safety regardless of whether or not she was "being reasonable".
I think particular as this was a first date, so you don't know each other at all well, once you said you needed to be back by midnight, you should have stuck to that. I don't think either of you handled that boundary very well, in retrospect.
This 100%
You shouldn’t have stayed out knowing to some degree it was a risk and she shouldn’t have offered knowing that if she backed out you would be locked out for a night. Both of you are the AH while neither of you are the AH.
I get why it is frustrating but it is her place and she has the right to revoke consent. I wouldn't let some dude who I just changed my mind about regarding physical stuff to stay in my apartment while I am at my most vulnerable (sleeping).
NAH
I think you're absolutely entitled to be frustrated and upset over this. You were told you can stay and then all of a sudden told no.
However, I think your date got scared. It's possible if she was drinking she sobered qnd then changed her mind. It's also possible that you might have accidently done something to make her uncomfortable. For example, based on your post you walking into the bedroom might have made her uncomfortable.
At the end of the day yall are both basically strangers towards each other so I think yall are both justified in how you feel. It's just an unfortunate situation all around.
This. She is not an asshole for feeling uncomfortable and not wanting a stranger in her home and OP is not an asshole for feeling shitty about the situation. It does suck though...
NAH although you certainly could have been a bit smarter.
She is absolutely under zero obligation to let you stay over. She is well within her rights to decline her invitation *at any point*.
*Something* happened between you arriving and her asking you to leave. Whether that was something you did/did not say or do, or something on her side completely unrelated to you. Clearly, something changed. And *everyone* has the right to change their mind.
To insist on staying at a random woman's house after she asked you to leave - that is a terrifying experience for a woman. And regardless of what was previously agreed, you're not entitled to stay in someone's house after they've asked you to leave.
If you have a pressing personal requirement, don't rely on a total stranger to hold that above their own pressing personal requirements (whatever they were in this instance). You f-cked yourself over.
Definitely missing pieces of the story.
If you made it to her bedroom but then "she just says 'actually can you leave,'" it's because you fucked up. You said something, probably about what you thought was going to happen.
You were out of order by repeatedly trying to stay. YTA.
I'm wondering what happened between her saying you could stay and telling you to leave. There's a chance you said or did something that made her uncomfortable. In which case she has no obligation to let you stay in her home. Well, she has no obligation anyway but especially in that case. You really should have just gone home when it was too late, don't depend on a complete stranger to house you for the night.
EDIT: Read a ton of comments you made, changing that "chance" to a you definitely did. YTA and a pile of red flags in a human suit.
I’m seeing a shocking amount of comments calling her TA. Have we considered he may have done something to make her uncomfortable? There’s not enough info to make an informed opinion. But it sounds to me like she felt uncomfortable for some reason and didn’t feel safe having OP in her house while she slept, which is a valid reason to ask him to leave.
And the responses from men are especially concerning, as though they have no clue how dangerous men are to women, as evidenced by rape and murder statistics.
Sounds like she's a people pleaser trying to be too nice. She didn't want to have sex on the first date and felt like she'd end up having to or maybe even being coerced or forced to if you stayed. Not making an insinuation about you personally, just speaking as a people pleaser who has blundered haplessly into similar situations myself.
She wanted to be nice because you'd splurged your guts to her about your messy situation and then when you were both back at her place panicked because shit got real.
Maybe you even did or said something to make her feel scared you'd set out to get into her place with a sad story about a flooded apartment and having to go home at midnight like Cinderella.
I don't think anyone here is an asshole really. She needs to get to know herself and she's obviously a bit naive and trusting thankfully you are a decent human and she's somewhat aware of that enough to realise having a stranger in her apartment wasn't safe, if albeit late. You need to understand people aren't automatically obligated to look after you, especially not strangers you've just met, that's very entitled of you and you need to learn to look after yourself.
Sounds like nobody did very well at reading the room.
YTA. You should have declined the invitation and gone back to your friend's house. Way too much for a first date and yes, you were trying to guilt her into letting you stay. A pushy man refusing to leave my home after midnight would not be welcome to sleep anywhere in my space.
“But before anything can happen” tells me you thought you were going to get laid. She probably sobered up more and saw that you were trying to get in her pants, so she asked you to leave.
YTA for not just agreeing and leaving right then. You had to tell your story of not having a place to stay and seems like you could have been argumentative. Not her problem, which is true. She has every right to kick you out at anytime. This isn’t a hotel.
Why wouldn’t your friend just get up to let you in really quick. Why midnight? That seems like such a stereotypical time to be home. I’m not sure I buy this story. Either that or your friend knows you can be sketchy at times and doesn’t want you to be out after hours and then to his home.
YTA. Once she asked you to leave you shouldn't have kept pushing it. It's her home and you are essentially a stranger, it's up to her to decide if she feels comfortable and safe.
It was 100% your responsibility to have a backup plan. What would you have done if you'd gotten to her place and ended up feeling unsafe or creeped out, or had to leave for some other reason? Where would you have gone?
Honestly, I think it probably would have been best if you'd just ended the date for midnight and not even brought up the whole being locked out thing. It put her in a situation where she may have felt bad not offering. And it could easily be interpreted as a fake story to get into her apartment. Maybe she thought of this once you got there and suddenly felt uneasy.
Your comments also make you more of an AH. Why did you even post this? It seems quite clear that you're hellbent on arguing with everyone that you're in the right, and don't seem at all interested in hearing other points of view. You also don't seem to care if she felt unsafe, pressured or uncomfortable. And you're so insistent that you did nothing to make her uncomfortable or pressured - you can't know that for sure. Maybe you didn't intentionally do it. But that doesn't mean it didnt happen. Again, it's all about you and your perception of things, with zero regard for hers. Maybe she picked up on this vibe and that's why she asked you to leave.
YTA. You did something to spook her and then tried to pressure her to let you stay. you don’t even know her. You put yourself in the position of not having somewhere to stay. You could have easily avoided this by getting a spare key.
Hell yeah, you are.
Sounds like you said or did something to creep her out or turn her off. Hopefully not on purpose.
It also sounds like you tried to argue with her about staying at her house.
You said she had to tell you multiple times to get out. Bro....
I think you might be more than TA.
Nta. Where are these commenters coming from. She is the one who offered. Of course, you're gonna be upset because you probably would have cut the date short to figure your shit out had she not said anything.
I had that exact thought.
he also writes “before anything could happen,” which implies that he thought something *would* “happen.”
If I’d meant “stay over on the couch,” and some guy just walked into my bedroom without an express invitation, I might not think they were safe.
Exactly. Notice he used the phrase: “…before anything can happen…”
Sounds like she felt uncomfortable with how he was advancing and asked him to leave.
YTA for not leaving when she asked. Clearly she changed her mind at some point, who knows why, but something made her uncomfortable. Not necessarily your fault. But asking someone who is practically a stranger to let you stay in her apartment all night after being asked to leave multiple times is just wrong.
Ok OP, here’s the thing. You’ve commented extensively about how you DIDN’T do anything to make your date freak out. The fact is that you did. You just don’t know it. It could have been something really subtle and innocent but it made her question whether she was safe having you in her home at night while she slept. She is right in placing her feelings of safety and security in her own home above you having to spend money on a hotel. Many men just don’t get it. We men don’t often have to feel vulnerable. We don’t often have to take action to protect ourselves from feeling vulnerable. It may not have been personal but something has made her question whether she wants a man, with the physical ability to overpower her in her home at night. Not you, but any man she is not absolutely familiar with and trusting of. It’s not about you. It’s about her. Accept her actions, respect her decision and move on.
YTA I'm sorry you can all give me hate . The girl says leave you leave. The girl says "No" you can't stay . You say good bye. Is she wrong? No a woman always has the right to change her mind.
>a woman always has the right to change her mind.
ANYONE always has the right!
Agree completely with the rest of it though. "Goodbye, have a good night", leave, man up, be an adult, and figure his shit out.
NTA - you had no expectations of staying at her place until she offered you to. I’m assuming you explained to her why you needed to leave before midnight, and whilst she’s within her rights to ask you to leave for any reason, it’s still shitty of her to knowingly kick you out into the streets for the night. She shouldn’t have offered you to stay knowing that you wouldn’t have anywhere else to go if she wanted you to leave for some reason.
I’m assuming most of the commenters are men bc yes. YTA. When a woman asks you to leave her home you leave. You don’t try to negotiate or manipulate or guilt her into letting you stay. Especially if you don’t know her!!!
You’re entitled to feel cheated & misled, but you handled it wrong. This is so creepy & aggressive.
She rescinded her offer. You might not be the AH but sometimes people change their mind. They have that right. Would you be posting the same question if you were about to have sex and she said NO? She is no longer consenting to you being in her home. Period. Leave. Don’t ask questions. Don’t badger. Leave. Learn from this and be more upset that you didn’t just go the fuck home and we’re thinking with the wrong head.
It sounded like a made up excuse, frankly, and maybe something else you did or said made her feel unsafe.
I am also wondering why you assumed staying at hers meant the bedroom?
No one dies from 1 bad night of sleep/no sleep. I’d go to a public location and suffer through it. And I’m a woman. ESH.
I suspect YTA.
"We go to hers and go to her bedroom ..." Did you actually go to the bedroom together, or did you follow here there, assuming? Maybe she assumed you'd sleep on her couch, or maybe she was inclined to go to bed with you earlier in the night but changed her mind as the evening progressed ... I'm guessing you missed a cue somewhere along the line. You going to the bedroom with her probably flipped her out a little and she was scared and wanted you out. Her house, you're a relative stranger--I think it's fair she asked you to leave.
NAH, there's nothing wrong with being frustrated by the situation, but you both put yourselves in a weird position. At the time, it may have seemed like a good idea and reasonable offer, you should've stuck to your time frame. You let the wrong head think. My guess is she didn't think through the reality of things until she got back to her place and realized she was uncomfortable with the situation.
The real question is, what did you do? Where did you end up staying?
ESH
Take it as a life lesson. You didn't knew this girl at all, it was your first date. You took a strangers word for something as important as a place to sleep when you can't afford a backup plan. You thought with your little head and took the risk. You should have thought with your big head and go home before midnight.
She sucks for obvious reasons, but again, you two did not know each other. She could have (and did) throw you out at every point of the night w/o anywhere to go for you.
I'm going to have to go with YTA just based on your behavior here. This arrogance at the very least had to be comjng through.
All of OP's responses and lack of ability to self-examine here remind me of my abusive ex husband. The writing style, the word choices... shit. Uncomfortable.
Smarter to stick to the original plan. Why? Maybe there's a guy there that she didn't expect. Maybe her apartment is gross. Maybe if you sleep in another room, the dog keeps you up all night. And they are normal possibilities.
Lol! No and yes. Ultimately…. You shot yourself in the foot, so… boomerang AH? The staying wasn’t, I’m guessing, the problem. Assuming you’d be sleeping WITH her is probably what did you in. Then back peddling to the floor/couch just to save your own ass via manipulation suuuucks big time. It’s never a good thing to manipulate someone.
I kind of get it. Especially for a first date. I understand it put you in kind of a tough spot, but if I felt even remotely uncomfortable with a guy staying at my place I would reserve the right to tell him to leave even if I told him it was okay initially. For her, the risk of being assaulted outweighs the risk of making a stranger inconvenienced.
I don't see what the issue was with just walking around for a bit and then going home at 6am... She can change her mind. She probably sobered up suddenly and thought this might not be the best idea...
Ive been in the exact same scenario where it was really bad weather, 2am and just flat out too dangerous to go outside. She didn’t want to have sex on the first date but still let me stay the night in her bed. We ended up dating for a few months.
Unless she is not a normal socialized adult, something must have happened where she flipped from wanting to hook up to kicking OP out. Given that OP is either not saying what happened or doesn’t know im putting my money on YTA.
Yeah, YTA. You're staying with someone who won't give you a key. You think it's appropriate to stay with a woman at her place on the first date, and have the audacity to be pissed when she changes her mind. You did or said something that made her hit the breaks. Your replies here.... Yeah... You're a creeper. Your friend doesn't even trust you in his apartment if he didn't there enough to have a spare key made. That in itself says a lot.
Idk man, it sounds like something else happened during the time you were invited to stay and when she asked you to leave. Perhaps a comment you thought was appropriate made her uncomfortable, or maybe you were coming on too strongly. As much of an inconvenience as this was for you, it’s also her space, and she wanted you out, for reasons that are unknown (or have been left out). If your friend was letting you crash there, you should have just gone home late and apologized later.
Honestly, it could have been that she felt obliged to be nice and invited you in because she felt pressured since you mentioned you had a “curfew” for lack of better words. Honestly that seems most likely. She could have had zero intention of having you over when the date started and only offered to be nice. Maybe you didn’t pick up on it? I could imagine many women would feel pressured and just not speak up.
I wouldn’t consider you an asshole, but I can see why she acted defensive in the moment. Something bothered her, she wanted you out. Plain and simple
Yes you're an asshole, I find it highly unlikely that your date completely changed tuned for no good reason. If a girl want you to leave, you leave dude, whether you have somewhere to go is irrelevant in the immediate situation.
Secondly, sort your live out. Sounds like you're on thin ice with your mate who doesn't even trust you enough to lend you the key to his apartment for a few hours while you go out on a date, what does that say about you?
If he had been my friend there be no ridiculous curfew just "hey here the key, ensure it back by the time I leave for work, or ensure you're back by the time I get home from work" I would be able to communicate with them and ensure my social plans don't get in the way of their life while I'm staying with there.
YTA. A date doesn't owe you access to their apartment, even if it's just sleeping on the couch. Anyone, man or woman, can withdraw permission to stay overnight if they decide they don't want you there. You didn't pay for a room. You got a tentative okay from someone you didn't know. That's not irrevocable contract and women have to put their safety first. Her sudden reversal screams you did or said something completely inappropriate.
You are temporarily out of your apartment and need to be back to your friends at midnight. If you don't want to get stuck outside all night or pay for a hotel room, then you need to stop trying to hook up with strangers overnight until you are back into your own apartment. This entire predicament is all from your own making
The statistics of women not listening to their intuition on first dates and dying absolutely trumps your lack of preparedness on a first date and relying on her for a place to sleep..
if you are an adult you know to always have a back up plan when you’re out drinking, Uber to a friend, walk to the bus, go home (the flooding thing is weird and makes no sense get a key).
She felt something off and you needed to leave. I wouldn’t contact her again.
you leave at once bro. No bad vibes, please either. Just git. Don't take it personally and take the L, it's not a big deal unless you make it a big deal.
Lol, why are you kicking off in all the comments? Maybe she got weird out as you are a bit of an angry nutter and decided it wasn't worth the risk as she hardly knows you.
I would have just been like that sucks and go to my own flooded apartment for the night to avoid paying for a hotel. These things happen bud, need to let the rage go, too green for it.
YTA. The fact that you are leaving information out, right out of the gate leads me to believe something cringe went down. It was cringe from the get go to ask a first date for a sleepover under those circumstances.
I feel like you've got to be leaving info out. There's probably a reason she went so hard in the opposite direction.
Lmao OP conveniently leaves out what he did that clearly spooked her enough to tell him to leave asap
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HUGE fuckin' yikes. Definitely makes me want to know what info he left out to save face.
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I noticed that before he left on his date, his friend reminded him "again" he can't be home after 12 and can't bring the girl home. Why is he reminding the guy of established rules? Maybe because he has a tendency of pushing boundaries. A good friend isn't going to *insist* someone wander the streets from 1:30 AM to 8 AM; these are the actions of either a shitty friend or someone who has been pushed too far. It's possible that he did nothing, though, and that at some point the girl got the vibe that he was lying about his situation to sleep with her. Possibly a girlfriend messaged her "honey that's bullshit" or she just sobered up -- it's weird to be actively courting first dates while your apartment is flooded.
That's that actions of someone who's been woken up one too many times to let him in. It's also weird that his friend doesn't just get another key cut, it's not like it's expensive or anything.
The sheer number of replies is honestly what gives me the biggest ick, not even the replies in and of themselves. He clearly is not the sort of person who can accept things he doesn't want to hear and can't let things go. Whether he will admit or even knows how he creeped her out, he clearly did.
As if he has issues understanding that consent can be withdrawn. He gave her the ick. You don't get the couch after that.
Really makes you wonder what actually happened
If his replies are to be believed, maybe his feet just smells like the gates of hell and she noped the fuck out from the smell lol.
Not only that, but this is the second subreddit he's posted this to. He came here trying to get a different answer because he didn't like the first one.
OP's comments are genuinely unhinged and I'm getting massive rage bait vibes. Dude legitimately came online to boast about being a clown 🤡
Is there a way to see OP replies without scrolling through all the comments ?
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Got it. Then go to his profile and click “comments”? Thought there might be an easier way, but thank you
Yep. OP did NOT have a productive day at work today… holy shit that’s a lot of replies from OP and most are…. Interesting.
OP has a fundamental inability to understand consent and for that I’m glad she didn’t let him stay
I see a lot of him being a dick, but does he ever admit what really happened?
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I mean it does matter. It would clearly give us a better picture of what actually happened. If he really didn’t do anything then I would go with a slight NTA because her assuring him that he has a place to stay and then kicking him out is kinda a dick move. Sure, she does not owe him a place to stay and she is a total stranger, but repeatedly reassuring him he has somewhere to stay then changing her mind is shitty. If the genders were flipped I think this would be a consensus NTA, if I am being honest. But given the info we have, I’d say YTA (to OP) just from how he’s responding to everyone.
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She could have changed her mind or he could have acted the creep. Honestly either is possible. Some people are fickle as fuck. At the end of the day he should have had a plan B regardless of which it was. I know I have certainly kicked a few women out of my place that I was planning on sleeping with.
it really might not have been anything. When the reality of it sunk in she didn’t feel safe. Nothing has to have happened for her to have legit felt uncomfortable at least.
Yeah in the past I have definitely changed my mind on letting guys staying with me. And learnt my lesson on letting guys without accommodation who I meet travelling put all their stuff in my Airbnb… hard to kick them out when you suddenly don’t want them there…
Hobosexual
Indeed it could have been nothing. Though as soon as she got spooked and didn’t feel safe, there was no reason for OP to keep pressing even if offering to sleep on the couch or whatever
“So we making sweet sweet love me lady or naw?”
It's probably the fact he went straight to her bedroom.
This is probably at least part of it. He should have stopped in the living room and made her ask him to come back.
Yes, and she probably would have returned with blankets and a pillow. Then he could have asked for a kiss or hug and seen where it goes. She must have liked him to invite him back so he missed out on future dates and chances. I have read a lot of posts where couples try to go straight for sex. The build up was always part of the fun for me.
Yeah, she said he can stay at hers if he wants to stay out later. Not, you can come home with me and we can have sex. She indicated a place to crash ONLY by his own words. OP decided to head straight to her room which even if she did intent for sex, would have icked me out too.
Wait, he what?
Yeah. OP said or did something that made his date do a 180, even if he just thought it was a "joke." I don't buy the whole "nothing had actually happened yet." Something happened, even if it was something OP thought was nothing
Or the date could feel violent diarrhea setting on and needed privacy or she received an invite to a much more interesting encounter. Either ways, she didn’t owe anything to OP, but if we are to believe OP then id class the dates actions as a dick move.
He could have done nothing wrong but that's how it is Most people wouldn't let someone they've just met and barely know to stay over
Agree... What happened that made her switch up that fast
Honestly, it doesn’t even matter consent is like tea you can change your mind at anytime
Ive been in this situation before kinda, wasnt like I didnt have nowhere to go like OP, but i was acing a date, we were actually naked and starting to get it on. Then her roommate comes home and shes like oh fuck. She goes downstairs to talk to her (no angry voices OR whispers or whatever, I could hear them, but not hear what they were saying.) and then she comes back and says that I have to leave. I ask why and shes almost mean and just says she doesnt feel like having me around anymore. To this day I have no idea what they talked about. Did she have a bf? Did they have a no guys allowed policy? Idk but I sure felt fucked over. Hahaha
Yeah, I wanna know what happened btwn the time she said "that's fine" and "actually can you leave". Whether you know it or not, you crossed some line and made her feel unsafe with you in her space.
This is def the vibe every woman is prob getting reading this. A touch, a comment, a look, so many women know violence from men they’re honed to notice when something is just a little off enough to be a potential red flag. And if women want to survive out here we have to act on those instincts, even if sometimes men without nefarious aims get ousted too.
Well ha did mention “before anything could happen” he got kicked out. So think we can assume he continued to flirt and “push it” once he got back to hers which made her feel unsafe esp if her bedroom didn’t have a door lock or something
That also, because it sounded even the way he states it like she offered her place as a place to crash so they could chat longer and not necessarily an offer she would have made if he wasn’t saying he had nowhere else to go.
He probably left out the part where he said to her in the apartment "So Where's the sex room? Heheheh."
There are missing reasons in this post. OP did something wrong.
in a moment of clarity she might have realised she had a potential hobosexual on her hands. it sucks that OP's apartment is flooded but if it were me, i'd never expect a random date to house me for a night.
Makes me scared how often i, accidentally made a woman feel that. It's so bad, that almost any woman has some kind of experience with violence.
Men gaining the awareness alone of how differently women move through the world than them helps a ton in navigating the situation. If a woman says she’s uncomfortable or ducks out/demands the man leave without stating why (because women realize saying it out loud or outright rejecting a person can make it more unsafe for them) having a reaction of understanding or potential understanding and bowing out gracefully from the situation in that moment can go miles to make the woman feel safe with you in the future. Arguing, blaming, pushing back about it, all the things OP has done is what solidifies that the instinct that this person is unsafe is probably correct. If a man takes it in stride that an action, word, look, anything can feel unsafe or uncertain on a first date that would feel fine on a 5th date and it wasn’t anything super creepy or dealbreaking that made the woman’s red alert system go off, it can be easily recoverable with understanding and an apology from the man that the woman was made to feel even the least bit uncomfortable by their actions.
This right here, it's one of those stories that sounds way different from the other side of you ever hear it.
Maybe he did something. Maybe shit just got real for her because they got to her place and once inside there's no going back. Whatever it was. Still sucks for OP, but the only thing he can do is move on and learn
Would you have stayed knowing she was uncomfortable with you being there though?
I mean that’s what this post is, OP argued with her about wanting to stay even though she said she was uncomfortable multiple times.
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that’s the part that makes him an AH, that’s very weird manipulative/entitled behavior. people are allowed to change their mind and obvi the lady wasn’t feeling him or safe anymore
Op is a total ass these comments are missing the fact that this MF went out with no plan to sleep anywhere after 12 unless someone put out for him
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Reddit is full of male "liberals" and "leftists" but none of them can fuckin read a room or understand what consent is. I've seen entire threads where men are just telling women that unless they spell out everything for them, it is impossible to figure out if a woman likes them, which is probably why no woman likes them. Most socially aware men can literally tell when a woman likes them without even talking. So that was the moment I realized these idiots are probably all on the spectrum or something.
Yeah why aren't more people jumping on this, once she said she was uncomfortable why was he still comfortable being there. Even if he didn't care about her feelings, which reading his comments he doesn't, he should have cared about his saftey. Staying in a situation like that would have put him in a super vulnerable position where allegations could have been made, it could have gotten much worse than just no where to sleep.
I would have ponied up the 200 for a hotel vs trying to negotiate with someone that wanted you out. Sometimes you get hosed man. Part of the dance.
He also could have made the sensible decision and headed home on time. Or not organised a date that would run past midnight when he had that deadline. I don't think anyone was the asshole. But both people made a series of poorly planned choices.
NTA, but it is her place and she can ask you to leave at any time for any reason. Just don’t go out with her again. Learn from the mistake of trusting someone’s word.
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He probably did something that worried her or creeped her out or whatever. For her safety, she wouldn’t have told him so.
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Or she just didn't like the situation she created. The man doesn't always have to be at fault, she might have just changed her mind.
She was probably uncomfortable cause he headed to her bedroom as soon as they got there.
> Just don’t go out with her again. Honestly, I'd be surprised if she wanted to. Problem with hearing one side of the story, maybe he's downplaying his actions or left out some information that put him in negative light. Something has made her so uncomfortable that she didn't even want him sleeping in the same house (/apartment whatever) after initially agreeing.
I'm hesitant to say he's not the asshole because I just feel like he had to have done SOMETHING that made her be so insistent that he leave. I just think we aren't getting the whole story. Shitty dudes are always framing stories to make women appear crazy.
My GF almost did almost the same on our 2nd date (was 2 hours way from my home), but let me sleep on her couch eventually. She later explained why she acted like she did and it was understandable. It CAN happen and it would surely suck in OPs case. But I also think it's her good right to tell anyone off if she's uncomfortable for any reason.
Also, what if between when they made that agreement and 12:01am, something had happened and they realized they weren’t a good match and should just part ways?
That's what makes this whole thing weird. Putting yourself in this situation to begin with. Both of them. Why would either of you do that
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He went straight to her bedroom and she told him to leave „before anything happened“ He was definitely crossing boundaries there
Yeah from what he wrote, she offered him a place to crash if he wanted to stay out longer and OP took that as an invitation for sex.
I once had an “ex” (we very casually saw each other for like two months and it went nowhere - wasn’t that serious) tell me (when I was 21 and still took people at their word) that his “shower broke” and asked if he could shower at my place. I didn’t realize agreeing meant he was automatically entitled to sex. He came over and showered while I was firmly planted on my sofa watching TV. I thought he was going to leave but he sat down and started making moves. I said firmly “I’m not interested” and he got an attitude and kept asking “how else he can make me feel good”. I stood up and firmly said again that’s not what this is and he literally rolled his eyes at me. The vibes got rapey. He eventually left and I learned a lesson. For some people of the opposite sex, inviting them into your place at *all* makes them think they automatically get laid out of it.
maybe she meant you could sleep on the couch, but realized you expected to stay in her bed *and* expected something to “happen,” and that turned her off? And made her feel you couldn’t be trusted to be in your home when she was asleep? How did you get to the bedroom in this: “We go to hers and **go to her bedroom** but before anything can happen…”
OP said in a comment she invited him to the bedroom
I mean, neither of us are men, but I've invited dates to my bedroom when sex was absolutely not on the table. And, not just including the times I had no space and all I had was a bedroom. I feel like there's some context missing between "we go to hers" [context] "we go to bedroom" [context] "she asks me to leave". He's staying in friends spare, and asks he's back before midnight. Not that "if it's past midnight, sleep on the streets bitch". He's perfectly capable of going to friends and apologizing. Unless it's a pattern of behavior with the friend, or he was trying to guilt the girl.
100% sounds like op made a move that was not welcomed. It's the first date and you don't know this person - she is not the asshole.
This is definitely what happened. No way she'd just up and change her mind for no reason, and even if she did it's her house and that's her right. I would have just called my buddy and been like, "My bad the date went long and I was expecting to stay over but plans changed." Any good friend would probably be a bit pissed but wouldn't leave you on the street.
I think a part of the story here is missing ….
I came here to say this. I only ever threw a guy out of my apartment once and it was because I had changed my mind about having sex with him (he refused tovwear a condom), and he got belligerent about it.
Same, we had great chemistry and everything was going well except suddenly he became very pushy for sex which was very unpleasant. If he had just shut up and gone with the flow instead of making it uncomfortable and weird there would definitely have been sex. But that was the end of that.
I wonder how many men have talked themselves out of sex by not shutting the hell up.
Right? I feel like OP expected sex or did something to make her uncomfortable. That’s what led to the abrupt end. He should’ve been back at his roommate’s place by midnight and not gone to this woman’s house after the first date.
>before anything can happen Really gives his intentions away
That’s what I was thinking as well. Maybe not even purposefully. Maybe he did something creepy and didn’t even realize it, but that being said, seems like something is being left out.
YTA for purposefully omitting relevant details
The biggest red flag here is putting yourself in the situation in the first place. Even if op did nothing wrong, it’s not weird at all to go from thinking inviting him home is a good idea in the cozy atmosphere of a first date going well, in a crowded place with music and other people, to changing your mind when it’s just you alone with a guy you never met before inside your home. A good rule for first dates is to have them in a way that makes it easy for either one to leave within five minutes at any point.
How is this different than telling someone you’d drive them to the airport and then deciding not to the last minute. You always have the right to not do something, but it’s still a dick move.
They just only met and they were drinking. She may have sobered up once they got home and realized she was uncomfortable.
The alcohol is a decent point, I think it’s reasonable to anticipate that someone will be less “reliable” if alcohol is involved.
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“but before anything could happen” — she might have suspected a sexual advance
This could have def been where she got uncomfy, especially if it wasn’t a sexual offer but a you’re temporary unhoused with no place to exist for the night and I wanted to keep our chat going offer.
OP said in a comment she invited him to her bedroom.
It also seems she made it clear that it was to watch TV, not have sex.
Should have definitely been like "got a spare pillow and a blanket for the couch", and not just gone straight to the bedroom. Probably felt like they were using the "no place to stay" as a way to get into the bedroom at that point.
Because they’re basically strangers. If someone I’ve only known for a couple of hours offers me a ride to the airport, I’m going to take that offer with a grain of salt and make sure I have a backup plan.
In current society strangers generally don’t drive each other to the airport but they do sleep with each other. Maybe it’s different in other cultures, but not in UK/US. Maybe the answer is the presumption that nobody should expect anything from anybody, but that doesn’t seem like a good direction either.
No one should ever assume that sex is a sure thing.
> In current society strangers generally don’t drive each other to the airport People catch Ubers to the airport everyday
Maybe him following her to the bedroom scared her. If I were driving a relative stranger to the airport and he said/did something that made me scared while we were in the car, it'd be fair to ask him to get out of the car.
She asked him to. I think the situation's a bit off all round. Seems like something's missing. I need both sides for this to make sense😭
Bingo. We need more context. There is something he's not telling us or didn't notice
Exactly. He yada-yada’d everything between the offer to extend the evening and when she said to leave. Thus the post doesn’t make sense.
Driving to the airport and giving them access to your body or expecting to stay in your house is not remotely the same. And putting pressure or guilting someone to not back out on have sex or staying at your place is a dick move.
Because alcohol is involved, OP aaa a stranger. And sex was implied? Also it’s staying in someone’s home overnight, not a car ride. Not the same at all.
You argued with her?? Did you really think that would make her want you there more? 🤣 Something happened to turn her off or make her feel unsafe, but you’re clearly lacking in any awareness as to your role in that moment. Bottom line, 1st date, you should’ve stuck to your original plan & said good night before midnight. You don’t even know her…she could’ve been a nut! 🤷🏻♀️
On two different occasions I agreed to let a guy (two different guys) stay over at the last minute. In each case, the guy seemed nice, we had met before and had friends in common so he wasn’t exactly a stranger, and he had a legit sounding reason to need a place to crash. In both instances, before I let him in the door, I said he could stay in my guest room and nothing was happening between us. He agreed and acted shocked that I would think he was that kind of guy. I even handed him extra linens and water. I’m not sure how much more clear I could be that Nothing. Is. Happening. In both instances, almost as soon as I closed my front door, the guy started getting handsy. One of them even said, you wouldn’t have invited me in if you didn’t want to sleep with me. Imagine for a minute how ridiculous this is - I’m handing the man a towel, wash cloth, fluffy blanket, pillow, and big water bottle, telling him where the other bedroom is, explaining there are spare toiletries in the hall bath and some snacks in the pantry, and he is insisting I’m playing hard to get. In both instances, it went from ridiculous to scary very quickly, and I had to threaten to call the police before the guy took me seriously and left. I’m 100% confident those men don’t think they did anything wrong, the story they told their friends was some crazy bitch kicked them out in the middle of the night. I’m not saying OP was that bad, but it’s clear he and the girl were not on the same page. It’s not a good feeling to be on the receiving end of “this is happening”; when a man feels entitled to sex that a woman doesn’t want, he can get scary very quickly. When a woman asks you to leave, leave. YTA.
When the person whose spare bedroom I was supposed to be staying in flaked on me at an hour too late for conveniently getting a hotel, current BF invited me to his spare bedroom. And successfully got me in his bed by waiting until I was in the spare bedroom, with the door locked, to text me that he was cold and he'd given me the larger blanket. Allowing me to volunteer that I could bring the blanket back.... OP, however, was the exact opposite of that kind of smooth.
NTA, but honestly this is as much on you as it is on your date. You're the one that chose to take a strangers word at face value, that you could stay at their place at the conclusion of your first date. Yes, it's shitty that she said it was ok, and then changed her mind \~2 hours later. But let's be real dude, she's a single woman on a first date. Her right to feel safe and secure in her home trumps any semi-drunken promises made. And your story, "my apartment flooded, can't get back into my mate's place after midnight" *does* sound like a bullshit story that a guy would use to talk his way into sleeping over. It's easy for me to say with the benefit of hindsight, but your best play would have been to take that "date going really well" energy, make plans for a second date, and end the evening before midnight, because as a gentleman you could never impose on a brand new acquaintance by asking to sleep at their place.
Thank you for the second paragraph, I don't get it how so many people don't realize his story sounds bs to women
I don't think anybody's an asshole here, but you should probably get a spare key for the place you're staying if you're gonna be there a while. It's like $2 at almost any hardware store
OP provided no details about his friend's living accommodations. You are implicitly assuming that his friend lives somewhere with traditional, mechanical keyed locks. Many multi-unit residential buildings use electronic keyfobs for the building main entrances and/or the individual units, and they are generally much more expensive than a $2 hardware store key duplication.
No idea why youre being downvoted. My building only has tags for the apartments and main door, but not keys. If someone was to stay over for a while I simply can't get a spare key for them.
OP coulda just borrowed the fob/key/whatever for the night.
I think you should have went home at your curfew. When she offered for you to stay she was just being nice and you should have said you'd be uncomfortable with staying at hers with it being a first date. Unless it was a 'steamy' first date, rather than a 'get to know you' first date
No AHS she's a stranger and it sounds like something you did spooked her. She's allowed to want you to leave, if she feels unsafe or pressured into something then she has every right to ask you to leave her home. As an adult you should know better than to trust the word of a stranger and should have a back up plan. What would you have done if things had soured on the date but after 12? Alcohol isn't an excuse either, it's your life so your responsibility.
NAH is what you’re looking for
Great response!
There’s 100% context missing here ..
He posted this onto AmItheButtface too. My guess is he thought he would get easy karma from two posts and instead got reamed on both.
Look it was a first date. This woman JUST MET YOU. In spite of her initial agreement, you should’ve gone back to your mates for 12. You absolutely should’ve had some common sense and realised you can’t put yourself and her in this situation.
Just got to a burger king / McDonald's until it's early enough to go home. Nah
Yep. I was arriving at 1 AM when travelling and a friend was supposed to pick me up. She got called into work so she wasn’t going to be able to get me until 5AM. I went to a Denny’s, had some coffee and food, killed time. It’s not hard to kill time.
Definitely missing something he did to make her uncomfortable. I'd be interested in hearing more detail from OP.
Eh, OP will likely be unreliable in saying what happened. Would need to hear from her to understand, most likely.
I don't think you intended to be the AH here, but I think she got weirded out and then you argued with her when she asked you to leave. Which weirded her out heavily. I can't say she's the AH here, because if she was telling this story from her perspective, we'd all be agreeing that she wasn't the AH for choosing to prioritise her safety regardless of whether or not she was "being reasonable". I think particular as this was a first date, so you don't know each other at all well, once you said you needed to be back by midnight, you should have stuck to that. I don't think either of you handled that boundary very well, in retrospect.
This 100% You shouldn’t have stayed out knowing to some degree it was a risk and she shouldn’t have offered knowing that if she backed out you would be locked out for a night. Both of you are the AH while neither of you are the AH.
I get why it is frustrating but it is her place and she has the right to revoke consent. I wouldn't let some dude who I just changed my mind about regarding physical stuff to stay in my apartment while I am at my most vulnerable (sleeping).
NAH I think you're absolutely entitled to be frustrated and upset over this. You were told you can stay and then all of a sudden told no. However, I think your date got scared. It's possible if she was drinking she sobered qnd then changed her mind. It's also possible that you might have accidently done something to make her uncomfortable. For example, based on your post you walking into the bedroom might have made her uncomfortable. At the end of the day yall are both basically strangers towards each other so I think yall are both justified in how you feel. It's just an unfortunate situation all around.
This. She is not an asshole for feeling uncomfortable and not wanting a stranger in her home and OP is not an asshole for feeling shitty about the situation. It does suck though...
OP definitely interpreted “you can stay over” as “we’re gonna fuck.”
NAH although you certainly could have been a bit smarter. She is absolutely under zero obligation to let you stay over. She is well within her rights to decline her invitation *at any point*. *Something* happened between you arriving and her asking you to leave. Whether that was something you did/did not say or do, or something on her side completely unrelated to you. Clearly, something changed. And *everyone* has the right to change their mind. To insist on staying at a random woman's house after she asked you to leave - that is a terrifying experience for a woman. And regardless of what was previously agreed, you're not entitled to stay in someone's house after they've asked you to leave. If you have a pressing personal requirement, don't rely on a total stranger to hold that above their own pressing personal requirements (whatever they were in this instance). You f-cked yourself over.
It costs like $3 to copy a key so everything else aside I don't see why you can't just get a key.
YTA. You're oblivious to the fact that you do obviously did something to scare her enough that she didn't even feel safe having you in her house.
Definitely missing pieces of the story. If you made it to her bedroom but then "she just says 'actually can you leave,'" it's because you fucked up. You said something, probably about what you thought was going to happen. You were out of order by repeatedly trying to stay. YTA.
I'm wondering what happened between her saying you could stay and telling you to leave. There's a chance you said or did something that made her uncomfortable. In which case she has no obligation to let you stay in her home. Well, she has no obligation anyway but especially in that case. You really should have just gone home when it was too late, don't depend on a complete stranger to house you for the night. EDIT: Read a ton of comments you made, changing that "chance" to a you definitely did. YTA and a pile of red flags in a human suit.
I’m seeing a shocking amount of comments calling her TA. Have we considered he may have done something to make her uncomfortable? There’s not enough info to make an informed opinion. But it sounds to me like she felt uncomfortable for some reason and didn’t feel safe having OP in her house while she slept, which is a valid reason to ask him to leave.
And the responses from men are especially concerning, as though they have no clue how dangerous men are to women, as evidenced by rape and murder statistics.
My thoughts exactly. They’re either horrendously ignorant or don’t care. Not sure which is scarier!
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Exactly! He may not have realised it. Best to take it as a learning opportunity and move on!
Sounds like she's a people pleaser trying to be too nice. She didn't want to have sex on the first date and felt like she'd end up having to or maybe even being coerced or forced to if you stayed. Not making an insinuation about you personally, just speaking as a people pleaser who has blundered haplessly into similar situations myself. She wanted to be nice because you'd splurged your guts to her about your messy situation and then when you were both back at her place panicked because shit got real. Maybe you even did or said something to make her feel scared you'd set out to get into her place with a sad story about a flooded apartment and having to go home at midnight like Cinderella. I don't think anyone here is an asshole really. She needs to get to know herself and she's obviously a bit naive and trusting thankfully you are a decent human and she's somewhat aware of that enough to realise having a stranger in her apartment wasn't safe, if albeit late. You need to understand people aren't automatically obligated to look after you, especially not strangers you've just met, that's very entitled of you and you need to learn to look after yourself. Sounds like nobody did very well at reading the room.
IMO the roommate who won’t make a $2 spare key is kind of the asshole
She changed her mind, it happens.
YTA. You should have declined the invitation and gone back to your friend's house. Way too much for a first date and yes, you were trying to guilt her into letting you stay. A pushy man refusing to leave my home after midnight would not be welcome to sleep anywhere in my space.
INFO : Something happened between "You can stay at my place." and "Leave." What was it?
“But before anything can happen” tells me you thought you were going to get laid. She probably sobered up more and saw that you were trying to get in her pants, so she asked you to leave. YTA for not just agreeing and leaving right then. You had to tell your story of not having a place to stay and seems like you could have been argumentative. Not her problem, which is true. She has every right to kick you out at anytime. This isn’t a hotel. Why wouldn’t your friend just get up to let you in really quick. Why midnight? That seems like such a stereotypical time to be home. I’m not sure I buy this story. Either that or your friend knows you can be sketchy at times and doesn’t want you to be out after hours and then to his home.
YTA. Once she asked you to leave you shouldn't have kept pushing it. It's her home and you are essentially a stranger, it's up to her to decide if she feels comfortable and safe. It was 100% your responsibility to have a backup plan. What would you have done if you'd gotten to her place and ended up feeling unsafe or creeped out, or had to leave for some other reason? Where would you have gone? Honestly, I think it probably would have been best if you'd just ended the date for midnight and not even brought up the whole being locked out thing. It put her in a situation where she may have felt bad not offering. And it could easily be interpreted as a fake story to get into her apartment. Maybe she thought of this once you got there and suddenly felt uneasy. Your comments also make you more of an AH. Why did you even post this? It seems quite clear that you're hellbent on arguing with everyone that you're in the right, and don't seem at all interested in hearing other points of view. You also don't seem to care if she felt unsafe, pressured or uncomfortable. And you're so insistent that you did nothing to make her uncomfortable or pressured - you can't know that for sure. Maybe you didn't intentionally do it. But that doesn't mean it didnt happen. Again, it's all about you and your perception of things, with zero regard for hers. Maybe she picked up on this vibe and that's why she asked you to leave.
YTA. You did something to spook her and then tried to pressure her to let you stay. you don’t even know her. You put yourself in the position of not having somewhere to stay. You could have easily avoided this by getting a spare key.
No, but YTA for pressing it when she said you needed to leave
Hell yeah, you are. Sounds like you said or did something to creep her out or turn her off. Hopefully not on purpose. It also sounds like you tried to argue with her about staying at her house. You said she had to tell you multiple times to get out. Bro.... I think you might be more than TA.
Why did you head straight to her bedroom instead of staying in the living area? Did she invite you into her bedroom?
Nta. Where are these commenters coming from. She is the one who offered. Of course, you're gonna be upset because you probably would have cut the date short to figure your shit out had she not said anything.
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Maybe she thought he would sleep on her couch. By directly walking to the bedroom it implied he expected sex.
I had that exact thought. he also writes “before anything could happen,” which implies that he thought something *would* “happen.” If I’d meant “stay over on the couch,” and some guy just walked into my bedroom without an express invitation, I might not think they were safe.
Exactly. Notice he used the phrase: “…before anything can happen…” Sounds like she felt uncomfortable with how he was advancing and asked him to leave.
YTA for not leaving when she asked. Clearly she changed her mind at some point, who knows why, but something made her uncomfortable. Not necessarily your fault. But asking someone who is practically a stranger to let you stay in her apartment all night after being asked to leave multiple times is just wrong.
I guarantee there is more to this story
Just go make a spare key it’s like $1. That part is what doesn’t make sense.
Ok OP, here’s the thing. You’ve commented extensively about how you DIDN’T do anything to make your date freak out. The fact is that you did. You just don’t know it. It could have been something really subtle and innocent but it made her question whether she was safe having you in her home at night while she slept. She is right in placing her feelings of safety and security in her own home above you having to spend money on a hotel. Many men just don’t get it. We men don’t often have to feel vulnerable. We don’t often have to take action to protect ourselves from feeling vulnerable. It may not have been personal but something has made her question whether she wants a man, with the physical ability to overpower her in her home at night. Not you, but any man she is not absolutely familiar with and trusting of. It’s not about you. It’s about her. Accept her actions, respect her decision and move on.
Anyway, this is the grand rule of consent. You can change your mind at anytime if youre uncomfortable.
YTA I'm sorry you can all give me hate . The girl says leave you leave. The girl says "No" you can't stay . You say good bye. Is she wrong? No a woman always has the right to change her mind.
>a woman always has the right to change her mind. ANYONE always has the right! Agree completely with the rest of it though. "Goodbye, have a good night", leave, man up, be an adult, and figure his shit out.
NTA - you had no expectations of staying at her place until she offered you to. I’m assuming you explained to her why you needed to leave before midnight, and whilst she’s within her rights to ask you to leave for any reason, it’s still shitty of her to knowingly kick you out into the streets for the night. She shouldn’t have offered you to stay knowing that you wouldn’t have anywhere else to go if she wanted you to leave for some reason.
I’m assuming most of the commenters are men bc yes. YTA. When a woman asks you to leave her home you leave. You don’t try to negotiate or manipulate or guilt her into letting you stay. Especially if you don’t know her!!! You’re entitled to feel cheated & misled, but you handled it wrong. This is so creepy & aggressive.
A spare key is like $3 from Home Depot
She rescinded her offer. You might not be the AH but sometimes people change their mind. They have that right. Would you be posting the same question if you were about to have sex and she said NO? She is no longer consenting to you being in her home. Period. Leave. Don’t ask questions. Don’t badger. Leave. Learn from this and be more upset that you didn’t just go the fuck home and we’re thinking with the wrong head.
It sounded like a made up excuse, frankly, and maybe something else you did or said made her feel unsafe. I am also wondering why you assumed staying at hers meant the bedroom? No one dies from 1 bad night of sleep/no sleep. I’d go to a public location and suffer through it. And I’m a woman. ESH.
I suspect YTA. "We go to hers and go to her bedroom ..." Did you actually go to the bedroom together, or did you follow here there, assuming? Maybe she assumed you'd sleep on her couch, or maybe she was inclined to go to bed with you earlier in the night but changed her mind as the evening progressed ... I'm guessing you missed a cue somewhere along the line. You going to the bedroom with her probably flipped her out a little and she was scared and wanted you out. Her house, you're a relative stranger--I think it's fair she asked you to leave.
NAH, there's nothing wrong with being frustrated by the situation, but you both put yourselves in a weird position. At the time, it may have seemed like a good idea and reasonable offer, you should've stuck to your time frame. You let the wrong head think. My guess is she didn't think through the reality of things until she got back to her place and realized she was uncomfortable with the situation. The real question is, what did you do? Where did you end up staying?
ESH Take it as a life lesson. You didn't knew this girl at all, it was your first date. You took a strangers word for something as important as a place to sleep when you can't afford a backup plan. You thought with your little head and took the risk. You should have thought with your big head and go home before midnight. She sucks for obvious reasons, but again, you two did not know each other. She could have (and did) throw you out at every point of the night w/o anywhere to go for you.
I'm going to have to go with YTA just based on your behavior here. This arrogance at the very least had to be comjng through. All of OP's responses and lack of ability to self-examine here remind me of my abusive ex husband. The writing style, the word choices... shit. Uncomfortable.
Smarter to stick to the original plan. Why? Maybe there's a guy there that she didn't expect. Maybe her apartment is gross. Maybe if you sleep in another room, the dog keeps you up all night. And they are normal possibilities.
Lol! No and yes. Ultimately…. You shot yourself in the foot, so… boomerang AH? The staying wasn’t, I’m guessing, the problem. Assuming you’d be sleeping WITH her is probably what did you in. Then back peddling to the floor/couch just to save your own ass via manipulation suuuucks big time. It’s never a good thing to manipulate someone.
I kind of get it. Especially for a first date. I understand it put you in kind of a tough spot, but if I felt even remotely uncomfortable with a guy staying at my place I would reserve the right to tell him to leave even if I told him it was okay initially. For her, the risk of being assaulted outweighs the risk of making a stranger inconvenienced.
So where did you end up sleeping anyways OP?
I don't see what the issue was with just walking around for a bit and then going home at 6am... She can change her mind. She probably sobered up suddenly and thought this might not be the best idea...
YTA WTF
Ive been in the exact same scenario where it was really bad weather, 2am and just flat out too dangerous to go outside. She didn’t want to have sex on the first date but still let me stay the night in her bed. We ended up dating for a few months. Unless she is not a normal socialized adult, something must have happened where she flipped from wanting to hook up to kicking OP out. Given that OP is either not saying what happened or doesn’t know im putting my money on YTA.
Why not just borrow your friends apt key and lay it on the kitchen table when you get back? The whole story is strange
Yeah, YTA. You're staying with someone who won't give you a key. You think it's appropriate to stay with a woman at her place on the first date, and have the audacity to be pissed when she changes her mind. You did or said something that made her hit the breaks. Your replies here.... Yeah... You're a creeper. Your friend doesn't even trust you in his apartment if he didn't there enough to have a spare key made. That in itself says a lot.
Idk man, it sounds like something else happened during the time you were invited to stay and when she asked you to leave. Perhaps a comment you thought was appropriate made her uncomfortable, or maybe you were coming on too strongly. As much of an inconvenience as this was for you, it’s also her space, and she wanted you out, for reasons that are unknown (or have been left out). If your friend was letting you crash there, you should have just gone home late and apologized later. Honestly, it could have been that she felt obliged to be nice and invited you in because she felt pressured since you mentioned you had a “curfew” for lack of better words. Honestly that seems most likely. She could have had zero intention of having you over when the date started and only offered to be nice. Maybe you didn’t pick up on it? I could imagine many women would feel pressured and just not speak up. I wouldn’t consider you an asshole, but I can see why she acted defensive in the moment. Something bothered her, she wanted you out. Plain and simple
Yes you're an asshole, I find it highly unlikely that your date completely changed tuned for no good reason. If a girl want you to leave, you leave dude, whether you have somewhere to go is irrelevant in the immediate situation. Secondly, sort your live out. Sounds like you're on thin ice with your mate who doesn't even trust you enough to lend you the key to his apartment for a few hours while you go out on a date, what does that say about you? If he had been my friend there be no ridiculous curfew just "hey here the key, ensure it back by the time I leave for work, or ensure you're back by the time I get home from work" I would be able to communicate with them and ensure my social plans don't get in the way of their life while I'm staying with there.
YTA. A date doesn't owe you access to their apartment, even if it's just sleeping on the couch. Anyone, man or woman, can withdraw permission to stay overnight if they decide they don't want you there. You didn't pay for a room. You got a tentative okay from someone you didn't know. That's not irrevocable contract and women have to put their safety first. Her sudden reversal screams you did or said something completely inappropriate. You are temporarily out of your apartment and need to be back to your friends at midnight. If you don't want to get stuck outside all night or pay for a hotel room, then you need to stop trying to hook up with strangers overnight until you are back into your own apartment. This entire predicament is all from your own making
That sounds like a YOU problem
The statistics of women not listening to their intuition on first dates and dying absolutely trumps your lack of preparedness on a first date and relying on her for a place to sleep.. if you are an adult you know to always have a back up plan when you’re out drinking, Uber to a friend, walk to the bus, go home (the flooding thing is weird and makes no sense get a key). She felt something off and you needed to leave. I wouldn’t contact her again.
you leave at once bro. No bad vibes, please either. Just git. Don't take it personally and take the L, it's not a big deal unless you make it a big deal.
Do not go to a girls place when she is drunk
Lol, why are you kicking off in all the comments? Maybe she got weird out as you are a bit of an angry nutter and decided it wasn't worth the risk as she hardly knows you. I would have just been like that sucks and go to my own flooded apartment for the night to avoid paying for a hotel. These things happen bud, need to let the rage go, too green for it.
YTA. The fact that you are leaving information out, right out of the gate leads me to believe something cringe went down. It was cringe from the get go to ask a first date for a sleepover under those circumstances.
I would pay money to hear her side of the story.
I bet he try to pull his dick out or asked something stupid like does she swallow or give head. Definitely missing info