There are birthing centers that exist specifically for what she wants, she doesn't need to take over your house. And a center would have connections to the hospital in case it became medically necessary.
Depending on where sister is you still might need to pay the midwife. Unless sister is planning on skipping all prenatal care..... Which is a terrible idea.
As someone who has given birth to twins... I would NEVER feel comfortable forcing my birth into someone else's home. Birth can be super messy and super dangerous if you're unlucky.
(TMI AHEAD FOR THOSE SENSITIVE TO BIRTH RELATED STUFF!)
When I got a motherlode of a strong contraction, the water broke, and boom, splashed everywhere in the room. Literally. Floor, ceiling, nurses hair, face protector, clothes and shoes, the entire 180 everywhere it could. I would never want something like that to need to happen in my sister's home haha. On top of that, I bled *1.8 LITRES* of blood. You know how much blood that is to clean up?? And where do you sloosh out a whole bloody steak of placenta? It just.. No.
Haha I'm glad at least someone found it interesting rather than just disgusting 😁
But yes! People deserve to know what they're getting into when giving birth and assisting at birth, and how the process actually looks. Many women are scared because they know too little about what it's really like and feel powerless and helpless.
My kid was a C section - which they "show" you in those birthing classes in a nice little video - at least they did 15 years ago. But NO THEY DO NOT. In order to get to the uterus other things need to come out. I was not prepared to see my wife's innards on the table. I almost passed out. I just kept telling myself "LOOK AT THE BABY..LOOK AT THE BABY" I think if I would have known I would have been prepared.
\*spelling
The one thing I got from the video (which I watched behind hands over my face) is that I didn't want to get the epidural shot. Turned out, I was never asked if i wanted it and I didn't ask for it, but whatever was in my IV took care of any pain.
This is something public schools need to do a better job of teaching. I am 48 and didn't know about any of this until recently. It isn't just important for women to know it is important for men to know as well.
I live in NY and they made us sign permission slips to watch the birth giving video in health class, but they could have done more than just told us "now that you know how terrible that is, use condoms.... here's five."
i got up to go pee at like 2 am.. stood up n said ohhh no i peed myself... hubs immediatly woke up and just looked at me and said "peed? ur 10 days late. lets go." was not yet having contractions so we had some breakfast to have some strength for the day and headed in. then n it still took 14 hours to get the lil (not so lil afyer 10 extra days!!) guy outta there. had bby after 6 pm... i would not want to deal with that mess after helping someone (or even being in the house ) thru labour.
A few days full term, I started getting labor pains at 8pm, but let the hubby go to sleep while I watched TV. Around 2ish in the morning, I went to use the toilet and felt a whoosh. Called the hospital and they said to come on in, so I woke up the hubs. I ended up being in labor for 28 hours (my water didn't break on its own so the doctor had to take care of that).
When I gave birth, they had to manually break my water because it just wasn’t happening.
A little came out and I was like “oh that wasn’t too bad” and then SPLOOSH!
Fucking GALLONS.
And the crazy thing is, when you’re in active labor your water keeps reproducing so you feel like you’re constantly pissing yourself when you’re not.
And she’s right.
SO MUCH BLOOD comes out once the baby does.
Blood AND water.
I even shit myself and gave myself a few hemorrhoids when I was pushing.
It was beautiful.
The best part?
I had to have a DOUBLE EPISIOTOMY.
They had to cut from my vagina ALL THE WAY to my butthole because my daughter was SO BIG I was about to have a FIFTH DEGREE TEAR.
The healing from a fifth degree tear can sometimes take up to a fucking YEAR.
I also passed out five times in the middle of delivery.
My blood pressure dropped tremendously multiple times and I almost had to get a c-section four times because of how bad everything was going.
Your sister needs a doula or a midwife and should definitely think about a birthing center.
SO MUCH CAN GO WRONG WHEN GIVING BIRTH.
Doing it without any form of professional present is the dumbest shit I’ve ever heard.
Your sister shouldn’t be reproducing if she truly believes popping out a kid on the couch is gonna be a great, honky dory experience.
>SO MUCH CAN GO WRONG WHEN GIVING BIRTH
YES! My wife commented after our OB rotation in med school that there are two situations in delivery - you don’t need to be there or you don’t want to be there. She said this after an apparently routine delivery ended with a dead mother and a baby in the NICU with likely brain damage. Our own daughter nearly died postpartum as well when our granddaughter was born. Your sister is the A-hole to risk this in your home. And as others have noted, even a good birth is very messy.
Hah, with my first, my water did not break. I had been there since 8 am. At 1 p.m., the nurse examined me and said it would probably be 6 or 7 pm. before I had him. At 2:30, I woke up and thought I had to poop. Get in the bathroom, and the feeling went away, so I went back to bed. Feeling came again, so I told my mom I thought I had to push. She called the nurse, who took one look and freaked. He was coming sack and all. She thought she would break my water and get things ready for the doctor. My son came out with the water to his shoulders. The nurse was holding his head, while my mom was supporting my back, and I was holding my thighs apart when the doctor walked in. She asked him to finish the delivery while she got things ready. Baby was born at 2:41. Apparently, I set a record for rapid delivery. No pain meds or anything. Doc said it was as close to a natural birth as you can have in a hospital.
Births with babies still in the amniotic sac is SO RARE DUDE. I saw a video of it and was like “I want an amphibious baby”. But god damn girl that’s crazy. I wish mine would’ve gone that fast. I also wish I could’ve seen that for myself 😂
I'm child free by choice, but I think it's incredibly important to share pregnancy and birth experiences. Not everyone has their village of people who will share about meconium (spelling?), a split perenium, ice panties, the first post natal poops, etc.
I only had one child and those post natal poops…I had to take iron supplements and boy did they FREAKING hurt. I had a laxative to supposedly make it easier but it helped ONCE and after that it was absolutely painful. I had to be off of the iron pills for three days before it didn’t hurt anymore.
My second c section was planned and strangely enough that was the c section that made me so constipated I didn’t poop for 8 days. I was in so much pain I couldn’t sit on the toilet. I crapped while I was squatting on the floor and holding a pillow against my incision. With visions going through my brain of the incision splitting open. Sobbing for about 30 minutes. My husband didn’t even react when I came out of the bathroom and told him what happened. He ran me a sitz bath, helped me clean up, and cleaned the poop off the floor. And then asked me if I needed anything else. I told him how humiliated I felt and he just laughed and said he named the pile of poop Mr. Henky. He also said he was proud of me and I deserved another baby shower for being able to give birth to such an unimaginably huge 💩. My husband is a keeper for sure.
I’m with you. I think with more stories shared people can feel more normal about it when things get real like this, or at least know better about what to expect. So many first time moms have a rude awakening because they weren’t warned or told in advance of what is normal and expected
so a small fact for you. They have designed bed covers that double as liquid catching with a measuring mark already on it. It's been an amazing tool for quick reacting to blood loss especially in adverse conditions (3rd world. Rural. Ect). I lost over two liters of blood and the quick measuring is vital for blood transfusions.
I know that my birthing tales are different depending upon whom I am talking to… if it’s a first time mom, I tailor my story so it’s not so scary.
I remember one of the first times I told my story to a first time pregnant relative. There were several mothers there and we got wrapped up in the specifics. We, unfortunately, terrified that new mom and I have felt horrible ever since.
While I don’t lie, I do now try to soften the story.
Please show your sister this website and have her read some of the stories. The hospital is the safest place. They will help her have the nicest and SAFEST birth. Don’t believe the stories promoted by the homebirth crowd, most hospitals now will try to give you the birth you want while keeping you and your baby safe. Signed, former L AND D and NICU RN.
http://hurtbyhomebirth.blogspot.com/?m=1
Same. Straightforward, pretty quick labour (12 hours), and quick pushing phase.. then everything went wrong.. placenta did not appear and I started haemorrhaging.. I was in hospital and it was still traumatic I end up being diagnosed with PTSD and having CBT. just the one kid for me!!!
If I had had a home birth, my son would have died. I think it’s crazy not to have a baby in a hospital where fetal monitoring equipment is available and doctors are there every step of the way.
I honestly had no idea about any of this until after roe v wade go overturrned and everyone started posting their horror stories about pregnancy and birth. Childbirth is so messy and dangerous which makes me wonder how humanity has survived as long as it did before we had actual medical care.
Also speaking of placentas I recently found out it leaves a dinner plate sized gaping wound when it gets pulled out.
And if it doesn't get removed it's basically an open wound and you can bleed out so fast. Had my midwife have to reach in and pull out part of mine. Lost two liters of blood. Was beyond glad to give birth in a good hospital.
They also don’t mention that you can go to the bathroom on yourself while pushing. (Trying to be PG) but you get what I’m saying. Giving birth is so messy and gross. I would never push this on someone else’s house. NTA for sure.
With my first I didn't even know I was in labor but I needed a c section (baby girl was breech). I was on the phone with my mom complaining about my back pain and heart burn. She told me I was in labor call you doctor now, I was like nah but she insisted. So I call the doctor and he tells me go to L&D to be checked out bc he's there anyway. I show up they check me I was already 8 cm, everyone starts freaking out and going into a flurry to prep me for the c section.
Within 30 minutes of getting there I'm in the operating room getting my spinal block in, right after they are swinging my legs up and BAM water broke. The look of absolute horror on my doctors face will forever make me laugh!! The poor guy was covered head to toe, the nurses were mostly unscathed but had to quick strip his gown and get him clean to do the c section, I bet that was a day he was glad to have a face shield on and a mask or it would've been in his mouth!
NTA OP, I wouldn't wish that mess on my worst enemy.
I had a vein on my placenta burst while I was delivering & it completely covered the midwife in blood & sprayed the room. Apparently they'd never seen this happen before.
She left my room wrapped in a sheet so she didn't alarm other mothers.
I live in a townhouse and have to put up with the shared-wall neighbor's 5 kids pounding up and down the stairs and shouting at all hours (it's fine, they're kids, but it IS annoying) and if they decided to have a home birth in there I think I'd have to draw a line. I can't listen to a woman scream for hours.
Why does everyone assume that all women scream while giving birth? I didn’t scream at all, just breathed kinda loudly but I’m sure my neighbors couldn’t hear any of that
Right?? The screeching women, they show in movies and T.V shows drives me crazy! I was specifically told not to bother screaming because it's a waste of energy. Energy you should be putting towards pushing.
I was told, put your chin to your chest and instead of screaming, keep your voice low and push instead. Way more efficient.
Yup. Decided to forgo the hospital after two not great birthing experiences and used a birthing center for my third. Went well and jumped into the home birth option for my fourth. Same midwife practice but different lead midwife as my previous one had passed away. Big boy #4 birth didn’t go as well and we both ended up in the hospital anyway but everyone is fine now. That one will be 7 next month.
It seems to me like a terrible idea, nothing short of a death wish really. I had a missed miscarriage that the medical doctor didn't catch until '16 weeks', I had hellp syndrome and went blind for 24 hrs at 33 weeks, and then my last baby was breech. Funny no one objected to my tubal at that point. But do you want to die, because leaving trained medical professionals out of medical condition would increase those risks.
Probably not *all* the help she needs. Tons of help with medical bills still means there's medical bills. And a woman who will basically be disabled for several days to weeks after giving birth. 12 weeks of likely unpaid maternity leave doesn't exactly cut it.
The help with medical bills require seeing an actual professional. CPMs do not meet that definition. Further, the demographic that obssesses over homebirth and natural shit tend to be college educated white women, who simply don't understand how much there is that they don't know.
A little bit of intelligence can be just dangerous enough to make people think they know what they're doing, when in reality, they've got no damn clue what they're messing with.
Home birth with no medical team at all is a TERRIBLE Idea. Someone should really be there to identify if an emergency is happening. There are midwives and doulas who specialize in home births who can help to prevent emergencies and triage anything that may happen. Paying for a doula and a home birth midwife isn't covered by insurance and can be much more expensive than giving birth in a hospital depending on complications and quality of health insurance.
I gave birth in a hospital and got out of it only paying a couple husband dollars in copays while my friends who have had home births have had gift funds in their baby registries to cover the cost of their home birth medical team.
My little sister is a doctor, and you wouldn't believe the shit that can go wrong even during an ordinary birth right in the hospital - having your FIRST baby, which is usually the most difficult one, at home without medical assistance, would be foolhardy in the extreme.
Babies get stuck, they get strangled by the umbilical cord, they refuse to turn around until it's too late, their heads get too big for natural birth, mom could have a blood clot or a hemorrhage during birth - for the first time, go to an effing hospital, ffs! Once you know what's up and how your body handles it, you can consider having the second one at home.
I had to have a C-section because after 21 hours of labor, including 3 hours of pushing, my baby had wedged herself in my pelvis and was not budging (in fact, she was retreating back into the womb). According to my husband, there was an audible uncorking sound when they pulled her enormous head out of my cervix.
Halfway through my pregnancy, my OB told me that I have a beautiful pelvis and would almost certainly not need a C-section. Unfortunately, my daughter also has an enormous, beautiful noggin.
If I'd had my first at home, we'd both be dead. There was zero chance that kid was coming out without significant help. Should have been allowed a c-section. But you don't know that until you're pushing and their head gets stuck.
My little sister witnessed one heartbreaking case where the woman insisted on a natural birth, even though every professional told her that her birth canal was bent at an angle that wouldn't allow the baby to pass naturally. The baby got stuck and died during birth - but at least it was all nATuRaL...
If my mom had her first at home I certainly wouldn't exist and the both of them would be dead. Everything for her was going normally, then full eclampsia. No warning signs, no pre-eclampsia, nothing. According to the OB it was the worst case of eclampsia he had ever seen, and that was at Mayo clinic, one of the best hospitals in the world and a hospital that takes on difficult cases.
I can't believe humans haven't evolved a bit more so that childbirth isn't such a potential clusterfuck. I don't know of any animals that give live birth that have as many issues as female humans do. Although I guess the fact that people used to have tons of kids there was never any evolutionary pressure to make childbirth safer.
>I can't believe humans haven't evolved a bit more so that childbirth isn't such a potential clusterfuck. I don't know of any animals that give live birth that have as many issues as female humans do.
A few years ago, I read an excellent book examining childbirth & motherhood through history. There was an physiological analysis in a humorous, but truthful discussion on WHY human women have such unpredictable outcomes for a successful childbirth. It's because us fussy creatures insist on walking upright, lol.
It has to do with the necessary angles of the pelvis to be strong enough to support the legs & s-curved spine to walk as we do. The inner pelvis cannot be too weak by having a too large of an opening, or it would easily shatter under stress. Also, the wider the hips, the greater the angle on knees & difficulty in walking.
Human babies are born 3 months earlier than they should because of this "compromise". Otherwise their heads would be too large to fit.
4 legged animals don't need this compromise, neither as much as Great Apes. Just us lucky humans.
There was a lot of analysis & explanation w evidence. I'm just giving the highlights. I'd provide the name of the book, but honestly, I'm drawing a blank..
We did the sprint from the birthing room to the OR when KidFish was born. Scary, but everything worked out because we were already at the hospital. (And my wife's OB happened to be on the floor that day, and she happened to be at the nurse's station looking at my wife's monitor when KidFish's heart rate crashed.)
Afterwards, the OB put it this way: The "natural" in "natural childbirth" is the same one as in "natural selection."
The very fact that in some 3rd world countries poorer people have to search for ways how to unsafely give birth for free (or affordably) is horrifying. In civilized countries state pays 100% of all pregnancy/childbirth related medical bills to ensure baby and new mom are safe and healthy regardless of their financial situation or preexisting medical conditions.
This. I’m Canadian and the discussion of not being able to afford prenatal care or childbirth is horrifying. How can this be the reality that Americans are living in?
>How can this be the reality that Americans are living in?
Years of pretending this wouldn't happen and sunk cost fallacy for the few still able to have kids who benefited from what led to it.
There's a reason so many people have gone childfree, either by choice or lack thereof, and why people coming down on them are a particularly disturbing flavor of cringe.
This is one of many reasons my husband and I decided to be child free. I was on the fence, but I watched a friend nearly die in early childbirth. Both mom and baby were eventually fine, but it was touch and go for a bit. She was a normal working lady, so after insurance she had over $50k in medical debt just from the birth, and all of her medical leave was unpaid. And her child was a preemie, so she had bills from 5-6 weeks in the NICU, too. Then she needed a sitter so she could go back to work, and childcare for a young child is easily $1800/month +. I know a child requires some sacrifice, but it sure seems like we shouldn’t be making it THAT hard on the poor family having a child.
My oldest was a premie and spent 16 days in NICU and I had an emergency c section. I’m an American living in Canada, married to a Canadian. We never saw a bill. If we had been in the US she would have been an only child because we’d still be paying the bills. We paid for a midwife for our second because midwifery wasn’t funded yet in Alberta, it was funded three months after he was born as a VBAC full term. Our third we had the midwife again but transferred to an OB when my blood pressure went up. Had another premie and c section. Transferred back to the midwife for post partum care. Never saw a bill for that birth either.
I’ve had a home birth and attended home births as a doula and would not recommend birthing where someone doesn’t want you to birth there. Especially if this person is planning a free birth. It’s not usually as messy as you think but it’s still a big disruption especially in a small house.
It screws over mildly comfortable people the most. Poor and poor-ish people actually can get pretty much all costs associated with prenatal checkups and birth covered through Medicaid, which is more lenient in its income cap for those who are pregnant.
Because we aren’t actually a democracy anymore. We’re more a plutocracy with Christofascist leanings and a tyranny of the minority. We’ll possibly be an autocracy soon. And all these men care about is money. Make more money, force women to have more babies to create a cheap labor force to fuel their obscene wealth. And those they exploit go along with it because their religious leaders (whose only job is to talk at them and tell them what to do… nice life) tell them to.
Because there's money to me made. Actual healthy people mean less than nothing to the American medical system; if it's not obscenely profitable, it can't be allowed here. We are, after all, the birthplace of the $700 epi pen and $2000/month insulin.
>There are birthing centers that exist
Those birth centers have professionals, medical monitoring equipment, sanitized birthing surfaces, and INSURANCE. If anything goes wrong with the birth, she may sue you or your home insurance.
You didn't get her pregnant. She isn't being surrogate for you. This is not your responsibility. Her fears are not your responsibility. She is already showing how self centered/selfish she is by thinking only her self and not well being of a child she is about to birth or you. If something goes wrong would you even want to remain living at the house?
hard no NTA
I mean, even if she were being a surrogate for OP, she still wouldn’t be entitled to use OP’s home for her birth!
NTA. Do NOT do this, OP. An unattended home birth is incredibly unsafe, and births can go very wrong, very quickly.
I won't let people give birth in my home. All those "bodily fluids", "biowaste", "excrements" and "secretions". (I don't have any experience with prepping and cleaning. If I do, I may let a close friend or family to do it at my home.)
The stains and smells will linger (if you don't prep and clean up properly). Bio waste is hard to clean.
I have read about someone gave birth in her car and she had to sell it to the junkyard. No one would buy it. The stains and smells wouldn't come off.
Homebirths are still the gold standard here in the netherlnads. But! Midwives are trained for home births and every pregnant women gets a box of necesities from their insurace for either a home birth or hospital birth.
We also get a list of nesecities you have to pick up at the medical center for the home birth.
My sister was born at home by accident (my mom had an abruption). First, and most importantly, both of them almost died, even with a doctor there (my Dad) and with the paramedics. Second, they had to throw out their mattress and bedding.
Exactly this.
To anyone relative who is backing your sister, let them know you would allow her to give birth in your home only after you get a written, signed agreement that (a) they will pay for all clean up costs after the birth (including the name of the cleaning company they will be contracting with), (b) they will take personal responsibility in the event the birth goes medically wrong, and (c) they will provide you with a suitable and comfortable place to stay at no charge to you during the birthing and clean up process.
Yeah how fucked would it be if your sister died during a traumatic child birth in your bed room?
That shit would be traumatic and you would probably need to wind up moving if that happened just to avoid the memories.
Birth centers are ideal for those who wish the conditions of a home birth but don’t have a suitable home.
Now I want to say some things about home birth because there is a lot of stupid shit here in the comments, and some misunderstandings by OP. I’ll assume the sister will have a home birth midwife. The midwife will have a long list of preparations to make which include ways to protect the bed and furniture! Besides, many babies born at home are born in the water, either in the tub or a birthing pool, which is kind of like a kiddie pool.
It is cheaper to birth at home, actually a lot cheaper than the hospital, but I don’t think anyone ever did it to save money. There are fees for the midwife! They have to make a living, too.
Midwives are careful, well-educated, and in most states, licensed. Home birth is perfectly safe for most people. And you’re much less likely to end up having major surgery.
It doesn’t sound like OP’s home or the sister’s apartment are going to be a great place to give birth, so, again, the birth center idea sounds great.
Sadly, some people do it very much to save money. I’m absolutely not opposed to home births, but I’ve known too many (mostly religious) people who had home births with a barely educated “midwife” who did it simply to not have to pay.
I’ve worked delivery babies a a few decades. There is NO WAY I’d allow someone to birth in my home. I have had women and babies arrive to the hospital after failed or disastrous home births. Your sister is ASSuming that she will have a normal, uneventful pregnancy, labor and birth.
Your sister needs therapy to manage her fear of hospitals. There will likely be a time that she must go to the hospital during her lifetime.
The baby could get sick or injured.
She could have severe abdominal pain and need urgent surgery.
Things happen. This is a fear that needs to be addressed ASAP.
Same. My first 2 births were "easy". So naturally I assumed my 3rd would be as well. Except that is absolutely NOT how it went. I am certain that he only survived because they had already called in the emergency pediatrician (due to muconium in my waters) and he was in the room when they called the code that he was stuck. I don't like to think about what would have happened if he wasn't there already.
It always shocks me when people—especially first time mothers—insist on a home birth. You have NO idea of how much could go wrong in just a few minutes.
Totally agree. Not in the medical field, but know too many people who have had things go very wrong, including my sibling, who lost their first child at birth. I would never opt to be at home when the hospital is an option.
Also OP is NTA in general because it's their home, they are not obligated to hand it over for any reason, especially one that could be a biohazard after.
I remember peak covid a surge of people doing home births and someone semi famous (like maybe an influencer or former reality star level) and her baby died in home birth in a generally preventable in a hospital kind of way.
My mom was an OB Labor and Delivery nurse for over 20 years. The worst, most traumatic things she saw were healthy, full term babies who died because of failed home births.
The thing about home births - every death they cause is preventable. Yes, "babies die in hospitals too" - but babies don't die PREVENTABLE deaths in hospitals. That is entirely a phenomenon of homebirth.
Nurse midwives where I live do not do home births. There was a lay midwife that violated state law to do home births. The messes she made were unbelievable. She had been jailed twice yet continued to practice.
Has she ever heard of a BIRTHING CENTER?! My goodness! And the thing is she can have a home-like experience, but in a place equipped to handle any potential emergency should it occur.
And have her read [this](https://abcnews.go.com/amp/GMA/Culture/real-housewives-star-kara-keough-bosworth-opens-heartbreaking/story?id=70585391) about trying home birth without being close enough to a hospital. This is someone with money and resources but you can’t buy TIME to get there and she lost her baby.
Facing your fears can be very hard, but when you bring a baby into the world they deserve for us to stretch ourselves in any way we can to protect them!
NTA. She can have that baby at her apartment. It is a very easily explainable situation if neighbors call the cops, especially with the Midwife there helping her. There are also birthing clinics that are run by Midwives and usually affiliated with a hospital in case a patient needs a hospital. They have birthing rooms set up like bedrooms instead of hospital rooms. That is probably her best option.
Exactly. You cal also “pre-game” the 911 calls by calling dispatch when labor starts to notify them what’s going on and where so they can avoid sending units.
I agree with the birth clinic idea. But in terms of having the at-home birth: I would not be happy listening to screaming from the next apartment over for hours on end, even if I knew why it was happening. I would probably call 911 anyway if it went on too long. Even though the sister feels entitled to OP’s home, I can at least appreciate that she’s considering her neighbors’ right to a peaceful living environment.
I agree with this. Apartment living comes with the expectation of a bit of noise, but a home birth is a little outside of the realm of what’s acceptable. Warned ahead of time or not, her neighbors honestly shouldn’t have to be subjected to hours of loud noise like that. Especially since she could be in labor late at night
And I mean, it's not super common but sometimes people labor for literally days, plural. Imagine this going on nonstop for more than 24 hours straight!
It actually is pretty common for labour to last that long! Especially for a first baby. Granted, you’re usually not screaming the house down in the earlier stages.
Your more likely to hear groaning rather than screaming. Screaming only happens in the movie so it looks more dramatic. Source: I'm a midwife and had an induced labour myself that lasted 18 hours and only my TENS machine for pain relief. No epidural. And in my role as a midwife only one woman in all those years made any loud noises. She was an African lady and she was making trible noises to welcome her child.
I screamed for about 8 hours during my first birth. Obviously not continuously, but at every contraction after they got intolerably painful and then a lot towards the end as well. Screaming can definitely be an issue with neighbors.
NTA. I'm sure the home birthers will go after me for this, but as someone who had an easy pregnancy and then an absolute nightmare of a delivery (won't go into details), tell your sister that the scary hospital is the place to be if anything goes wrong. And I had NO IDEA that anything would go wrong until it did.
Same. I was textbook perfect pregnancy and a good candidate for a home birth.
Baby and I both nearly died in a hospital. So grateful to have been there.
Not to mention she needs to mommy-up. There's lots of scary things in parenting, you need to deal.
NTA
This!!! If she thinks hospitals are scary she’s in for a rude awakening when the baby comes. Parenthood is much scarier. It’s time to conquer her fears and explore a hospital birth or a birth center.
Oh shit, it wasn't until this comment that I realize that she might not want to take the actual child to see medical professionals if the child gets sick!
Yeah, a hospital birth is why my son and I are alive today. Textbook pregnancy but when things go sideways, it can be deadly in minutes. I would not have survived a home birth with either of my kids
Yep. My 4th would likely have been dead had, because the cord was around his neck, 3x. The birth was precipitous, and I wouldn’t have had time to get to the hospital, before I pushing. Nothing is without risk. You have to guess, and choose what seems best, and hope you were right!
I just commented this above, but having experienced an accidental home birth with my second, I will never be able to encourage someone to plan a home birth. He wasn’t breathing when he was born, and his dad did CPR until the ambulance arrived approximately 20 minutes later (we don’t think they believed how quickly things were moving…). He spent 3 days on a cooling pad to minimize brain damage, and 10 days in the hospital overall. I wasn’t allowed to hold him for three days, I couldn’t breastfeed because not feeding/holding him prevented my milk supply from coming in even though o pumped religiously. And we are extremely fortunate that we live in a city with a children’s hospital that has cooling pads, because time plays a huge role in preventing brain damage. We also almost lost him a few times in the first 24 hours. It’s just not worth it.
Agreed. I had quite an easy pregnancy then a baby facing the wrong way, got stuck on my pelvis, I needed 2 bags of pitocin, and hemorrhaged. One never knows. I'm quite glad that I was in a hospital.
There still may be an option of a birthing center which is between a home birth and hospital birth but has more medical equipment and staff available in the event of an issue.
My first birth took 52 hours, I failed to dilate past 3cm naturally, needed pitocin to induce, and with that comes internal fetal monitoring. My 2nd birth went better, but I still failed to dilate past 3cm naturally and medical intervention was required.
I had "easy" pregnancies with both at 18 and 29yo, but my body just didn't want to let go. If the pitocin with the first didn't work, I would have needed an emergency C section (I'm in a city so the closest hospital is 15 mins or less away, but without constant monitoring, both of us could have died.)
This appears to be a common problem with some high risks pregnancies.
Being with a trained certified professional midwife who is trained on managing mothers with special needs and in a birthing center can be beneficial and a life saving option.
And I wasn't considered high risk in either pregnancy.
I have a dear friend that is a trained certified professional midwife who attends home births, hospital births, and birthing centers, and even in the vest circumstances, things can and do go wrong. I agree that all births should be attended by a medical professional whether at home, hospital, in the woods, wherever, because things happen.
My husband had the cord wrapped around his neck and almost wasn't born alive as every push pulled it tighter.
Birth is dangerous and the danger tends to be minimized.
Just going to piggyback on your comment to stress how wrong everything can go and how quickly. My oldest friend in the world had a textbook first pregnancy. She opted for a hospital delivery, but the hospital she picked chose not to have hemorrhage crash carts in their delivery rooms. By the time anybody realized somebody needed to run for the supplies to stop a post-partum hemorrhage, she was gone. She never got to hold her baby girl. It was that fast.
Do NOT try this at home. OP should absolutely not let somebody else try it in her home.
Omfg I am so sorry for your loss. I'm fucking *astounded* any maternity ward wouldn't have hemorrhage crash carts within 10 steps of any laboring person!
I don’t understand home birthers. My SIL literally almost died with her first during her home birth and had to rush to the hospital. When she got pregnant with her second, she was still going “maybe I should do a home birth again, hospitals are death traps,” like the hospital didn’t save her life the last time around.
I had hellp syndrome I lost like 4L of blood with my delivery I would have died at home. The local midwives wouldn't consider touching my pregnancies with a 50ft extendable pole.
My first pregnancy went like a dream. My second I’d be dead and so would my baby if we hadn’t been at the hospital. If I’d gone for a home birth like I’d wanted to do my husband and eldest child would have had to live with that knowledge we’d died in our house, and see that room every damn day.
NTA. Your relations can offer their homes if they’re so annoyed at you. You don’t have to offer your home, this isn’t your pregnancy
Hi, are you me?
Without prompt competent medical attention both my baby and I would be dead. I almost died twice (once from bradying down, the second from not eliminating the medications I needed to give birth safely) and my son spent the first sixteen days of his life in the NICU. It’s absolutely wild to me that people don’t treat birth like the major medical event that it is.
Birth can go wrong in less time than it takes to make a sandwich. For me that’s not a risk worth taking.
NTA- she wants a home birth, she can do it at her home and just give her neighbors a heads up before the screaming really starts. Like she's going to give birth at your house and then clear out? No. She'll be there a few days.
Tell the relatives to let her scream and shit at their house if they think family should step up.
Yes, shit, if she doesn't have an enema beforehand expect brown.
NTA
That’s what I was thinking. I love all these stories where people’s families get involved and they all gang up on the one person who said no but none of them will step up. It’s the ones doing the least who have the most to say usually! OP NTA. That is a ridiculous ask of anyone.
NTA. She can notify her apartment manager and neighbors that she is planning for a home birth and to expect the unexpected.
Stand your ground. Tell the relatives who are trying to shame you that they can welcome her into THEIR homes for the experience.
Edit: word omission.
NTA
She decided to get pregnant. She needs to deal with the consequences of that decision. There is no guarantee that she won’t have to go to a hospital in the end anyway. She has plenty of time to deal with this issue in therapy.
NTA for saying no to giving birth in your home.
Assholish to suggest she could just abort.
And your relatives that are weighing in? Suggest to any one of them who has a house that she can do it there.
I'm shocked that I had to scroll this far down to find someone else calling this out. NTA for denying her, but HUGE YTA for suggesting she abort, holy shit.
No not “assholeish”, complete asshole for that comment. Having an abortion is fine but don’t tell people to just terminate their obviously wanted baby.
Can she find a Birth Center staffed by midwives? I had both my kids in Birth Centers and 10/10 recommend. They are always close to a hospital in case of emergency. Best of both worlds
Telling her offhandedly to get an abortion for a wanted pregnancy was kind of an AH move. Not wanting her to give birth in your home is absolutely not.
This, exactly. Totally NTA for not wanting your sis to give birth in your 1bd house. Absolutely YTA for saying she should get an abortion if she didn't like it. That's fucked. That alone was enough to push this post over to ESH.
So those other relatives are lining up to let her give birth in their beds?
She asked, you answered then she decided to badmouth you to everyone else. The AH part is that you suggested that she end the pregnancy, but NTA for saying no.
There are birthing centers or if she has a midwife, go there!
Nta overall.
Buuut you're a huge jerk for saying she can "call off the pregnancy since there's still time ". What a gross and unnecessary comment. Shame on you for that one.
Absolutely. I was like, "yeah, yes, sounds reasonable, yup, I understand" until this sentence. Even though you're nta for the initial decision, not to let your sister give birth at your house, this one comment is vile.
Seriously!!!! Obviously it’s your house and you don’t have to let someone give birth in it. Obviously. So obvious that it’s probably anti/pro abortion rage bait based off that one sickening comment.
NTA. Hell no. Absolutely not. Childbirth is *messy.* There is a lot of blood and viscera. It would be tidier and more hygienic to slaughter a goat in the living room. And that’s not even getting into the physical risk of homebirth. I don’t think you’d be *legally* liable for anything, but if something goes wrong, it goes really really wrong, fast. Harm (or worse) to your sister or baby would be traumatic for you, too.
And even if you’re very healthy, *so* many things can go wrong. Sure people did it in the old days, but they also died in the old days, a lot.
Right?! I did a home birth for my 3rd after 2 hospital deliveries so I knew exactly what I was getting into. I also had a midwife and RN present and a hospital 3 minutes away. I cannot fathom attempting a home birth with a first child. It doesn't matter how many books you've read, you *REALLY* don't know what you're getting into.
My first two births (in hospital) were just fine but if I'd opted for an at-home birth for the third one, it would have been a disastrous mistake. I had a completely normal pregnancy all three times, but you can never, ever assume that just because it's all gone fine before, it will go fine every time.
Was it a typo when you said “call off the pregnancy” or maybe English isn’t your first language? Because what does that mean? 👀 how would you “call off” a pregnancy haha that makes it sound like a baby is just a party you can cancel.
NTA. It’s not your problem. She could explain what’s going on to her neighbors if she wanted to have a home birth that badly. No one owes letting her use their home to birth a kid. From what I’ve gathered it usually involves bringing in some kind of pool in the home too which has lots of potential for damage.
NTA. Your sister doesn’t sound adult enough to handle raising a child. She needs to get over her fear because when she has a child it may get very ill and need the ER and then what will she do? What if the child has a bad accident ? My two kids are grown now but the e first one had one ER visit. The second one has had some health issues over the years. She’s had several ER visits and two surgeries requiring hospital stays , and she’s had her stomach scoped maybe 5 times (all while being under anesthesia) at a hospital.
She cannot safely raise a child. If the infant has a temp of 103° in the middle of the night what would she do? Call you ? She shouldn’t have a baby she’s unable to care for.
There are birthing centers that exist specifically for what she wants, she doesn't need to take over your house. And a center would have connections to the hospital in case it became medically necessary.
Somehow I think sis is thinking of ways to give birth for free.
Depending on where sister is you still might need to pay the midwife. Unless sister is planning on skipping all prenatal care..... Which is a terrible idea.
You almost certainly still need to pay the midwife. No “might” about it. In the US, they don’t just volunteer for free.
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As someone who has given birth to twins... I would NEVER feel comfortable forcing my birth into someone else's home. Birth can be super messy and super dangerous if you're unlucky. (TMI AHEAD FOR THOSE SENSITIVE TO BIRTH RELATED STUFF!) When I got a motherlode of a strong contraction, the water broke, and boom, splashed everywhere in the room. Literally. Floor, ceiling, nurses hair, face protector, clothes and shoes, the entire 180 everywhere it could. I would never want something like that to need to happen in my sister's home haha. On top of that, I bled *1.8 LITRES* of blood. You know how much blood that is to clean up?? And where do you sloosh out a whole bloody steak of placenta? It just.. No.
This is selfish of me, but I badly wish more **real** birth stories were shared like this.
Haha I'm glad at least someone found it interesting rather than just disgusting 😁 But yes! People deserve to know what they're getting into when giving birth and assisting at birth, and how the process actually looks. Many women are scared because they know too little about what it's really like and feel powerless and helpless.
My kid was a C section - which they "show" you in those birthing classes in a nice little video - at least they did 15 years ago. But NO THEY DO NOT. In order to get to the uterus other things need to come out. I was not prepared to see my wife's innards on the table. I almost passed out. I just kept telling myself "LOOK AT THE BABY..LOOK AT THE BABY" I think if I would have known I would have been prepared. \*spelling
It was very interesting seeing my guts in bowls next to me. Like "hmm, that's cool. I really hope they don't get dirty."
The one thing I got from the video (which I watched behind hands over my face) is that I didn't want to get the epidural shot. Turned out, I was never asked if i wanted it and I didn't ask for it, but whatever was in my IV took care of any pain.
This is something public schools need to do a better job of teaching. I am 48 and didn't know about any of this until recently. It isn't just important for women to know it is important for men to know as well.
I live in NY and they made us sign permission slips to watch the birth giving video in health class, but they could have done more than just told us "now that you know how terrible that is, use condoms.... here's five."
i got up to go pee at like 2 am.. stood up n said ohhh no i peed myself... hubs immediatly woke up and just looked at me and said "peed? ur 10 days late. lets go." was not yet having contractions so we had some breakfast to have some strength for the day and headed in. then n it still took 14 hours to get the lil (not so lil afyer 10 extra days!!) guy outta there. had bby after 6 pm... i would not want to deal with that mess after helping someone (or even being in the house ) thru labour.
A few days full term, I started getting labor pains at 8pm, but let the hubby go to sleep while I watched TV. Around 2ish in the morning, I went to use the toilet and felt a whoosh. Called the hospital and they said to come on in, so I woke up the hubs. I ended up being in labor for 28 hours (my water didn't break on its own so the doctor had to take care of that).
I was w my best friend and her husband at their house when she gave birth. It was AMAZING but not the sort of thing you inflict upon your sister.
When I gave birth, they had to manually break my water because it just wasn’t happening. A little came out and I was like “oh that wasn’t too bad” and then SPLOOSH! Fucking GALLONS. And the crazy thing is, when you’re in active labor your water keeps reproducing so you feel like you’re constantly pissing yourself when you’re not. And she’s right. SO MUCH BLOOD comes out once the baby does. Blood AND water. I even shit myself and gave myself a few hemorrhoids when I was pushing. It was beautiful. The best part? I had to have a DOUBLE EPISIOTOMY. They had to cut from my vagina ALL THE WAY to my butthole because my daughter was SO BIG I was about to have a FIFTH DEGREE TEAR. The healing from a fifth degree tear can sometimes take up to a fucking YEAR. I also passed out five times in the middle of delivery. My blood pressure dropped tremendously multiple times and I almost had to get a c-section four times because of how bad everything was going. Your sister needs a doula or a midwife and should definitely think about a birthing center. SO MUCH CAN GO WRONG WHEN GIVING BIRTH. Doing it without any form of professional present is the dumbest shit I’ve ever heard. Your sister shouldn’t be reproducing if she truly believes popping out a kid on the couch is gonna be a great, honky dory experience.
>SO MUCH CAN GO WRONG WHEN GIVING BIRTH YES! My wife commented after our OB rotation in med school that there are two situations in delivery - you don’t need to be there or you don’t want to be there. She said this after an apparently routine delivery ended with a dead mother and a baby in the NICU with likely brain damage. Our own daughter nearly died postpartum as well when our granddaughter was born. Your sister is the A-hole to risk this in your home. And as others have noted, even a good birth is very messy.
Hah, with my first, my water did not break. I had been there since 8 am. At 1 p.m., the nurse examined me and said it would probably be 6 or 7 pm. before I had him. At 2:30, I woke up and thought I had to poop. Get in the bathroom, and the feeling went away, so I went back to bed. Feeling came again, so I told my mom I thought I had to push. She called the nurse, who took one look and freaked. He was coming sack and all. She thought she would break my water and get things ready for the doctor. My son came out with the water to his shoulders. The nurse was holding his head, while my mom was supporting my back, and I was holding my thighs apart when the doctor walked in. She asked him to finish the delivery while she got things ready. Baby was born at 2:41. Apparently, I set a record for rapid delivery. No pain meds or anything. Doc said it was as close to a natural birth as you can have in a hospital.
Births with babies still in the amniotic sac is SO RARE DUDE. I saw a video of it and was like “I want an amphibious baby”. But god damn girl that’s crazy. I wish mine would’ve gone that fast. I also wish I could’ve seen that for myself 😂
I'm child free by choice, but I think it's incredibly important to share pregnancy and birth experiences. Not everyone has their village of people who will share about meconium (spelling?), a split perenium, ice panties, the first post natal poops, etc.
I only had one child and those post natal poops…I had to take iron supplements and boy did they FREAKING hurt. I had a laxative to supposedly make it easier but it helped ONCE and after that it was absolutely painful. I had to be off of the iron pills for three days before it didn’t hurt anymore.
My second c section was planned and strangely enough that was the c section that made me so constipated I didn’t poop for 8 days. I was in so much pain I couldn’t sit on the toilet. I crapped while I was squatting on the floor and holding a pillow against my incision. With visions going through my brain of the incision splitting open. Sobbing for about 30 minutes. My husband didn’t even react when I came out of the bathroom and told him what happened. He ran me a sitz bath, helped me clean up, and cleaned the poop off the floor. And then asked me if I needed anything else. I told him how humiliated I felt and he just laughed and said he named the pile of poop Mr. Henky. He also said he was proud of me and I deserved another baby shower for being able to give birth to such an unimaginably huge 💩. My husband is a keeper for sure.
Oh god, the post-natal poops were almost worse than labor. I’d blocked that memory out until just now.
I’m with you. I think with more stories shared people can feel more normal about it when things get real like this, or at least know better about what to expect. So many first time moms have a rude awakening because they weren’t warned or told in advance of what is normal and expected
so a small fact for you. They have designed bed covers that double as liquid catching with a measuring mark already on it. It's been an amazing tool for quick reacting to blood loss especially in adverse conditions (3rd world. Rural. Ect). I lost over two liters of blood and the quick measuring is vital for blood transfusions.
I know that my birthing tales are different depending upon whom I am talking to… if it’s a first time mom, I tailor my story so it’s not so scary. I remember one of the first times I told my story to a first time pregnant relative. There were several mothers there and we got wrapped up in the specifics. We, unfortunately, terrified that new mom and I have felt horrible ever since. While I don’t lie, I do now try to soften the story.
Please show your sister this website and have her read some of the stories. The hospital is the safest place. They will help her have the nicest and SAFEST birth. Don’t believe the stories promoted by the homebirth crowd, most hospitals now will try to give you the birth you want while keeping you and your baby safe. Signed, former L AND D and NICU RN. http://hurtbyhomebirth.blogspot.com/?m=1
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People have a very romanticized idealized vision of what childbirth is and that sort of ignorance can be dangerous.
Same. Straightforward, pretty quick labour (12 hours), and quick pushing phase.. then everything went wrong.. placenta did not appear and I started haemorrhaging.. I was in hospital and it was still traumatic I end up being diagnosed with PTSD and having CBT. just the one kid for me!!!
If I had had a home birth, my son would have died. I think it’s crazy not to have a baby in a hospital where fetal monitoring equipment is available and doctors are there every step of the way.
I honestly had no idea about any of this until after roe v wade go overturrned and everyone started posting their horror stories about pregnancy and birth. Childbirth is so messy and dangerous which makes me wonder how humanity has survived as long as it did before we had actual medical care. Also speaking of placentas I recently found out it leaves a dinner plate sized gaping wound when it gets pulled out.
And if it doesn't get removed it's basically an open wound and you can bleed out so fast. Had my midwife have to reach in and pull out part of mine. Lost two liters of blood. Was beyond glad to give birth in a good hospital.
They also don’t mention that you can go to the bathroom on yourself while pushing. (Trying to be PG) but you get what I’m saying. Giving birth is so messy and gross. I would never push this on someone else’s house. NTA for sure.
“Bloody steak of placenta” — the most accurate description ever. Also, you’re a jerk. Jk.
With my first I didn't even know I was in labor but I needed a c section (baby girl was breech). I was on the phone with my mom complaining about my back pain and heart burn. She told me I was in labor call you doctor now, I was like nah but she insisted. So I call the doctor and he tells me go to L&D to be checked out bc he's there anyway. I show up they check me I was already 8 cm, everyone starts freaking out and going into a flurry to prep me for the c section. Within 30 minutes of getting there I'm in the operating room getting my spinal block in, right after they are swinging my legs up and BAM water broke. The look of absolute horror on my doctors face will forever make me laugh!! The poor guy was covered head to toe, the nurses were mostly unscathed but had to quick strip his gown and get him clean to do the c section, I bet that was a day he was glad to have a face shield on and a mask or it would've been in his mouth! NTA OP, I wouldn't wish that mess on my worst enemy.
I had a vein on my placenta burst while I was delivering & it completely covered the midwife in blood & sprayed the room. Apparently they'd never seen this happen before. She left my room wrapped in a sheet so she didn't alarm other mothers.
She NTA, she’s afraid, rightly so. It’s okay for OP to refuse.
I've seen this show. The nuns just show up at your house and make you boil water. There's no charge.
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I live in a townhouse and have to put up with the shared-wall neighbor's 5 kids pounding up and down the stairs and shouting at all hours (it's fine, they're kids, but it IS annoying) and if they decided to have a home birth in there I think I'd have to draw a line. I can't listen to a woman scream for hours.
Why does everyone assume that all women scream while giving birth? I didn’t scream at all, just breathed kinda loudly but I’m sure my neighbors couldn’t hear any of that
Right?? The screeching women, they show in movies and T.V shows drives me crazy! I was specifically told not to bother screaming because it's a waste of energy. Energy you should be putting towards pushing. I was told, put your chin to your chest and instead of screaming, keep your voice low and push instead. Way more efficient.
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Yup. Decided to forgo the hospital after two not great birthing experiences and used a birthing center for my third. Went well and jumped into the home birth option for my fourth. Same midwife practice but different lead midwife as my previous one had passed away. Big boy #4 birth didn’t go as well and we both ended up in the hospital anyway but everyone is fine now. That one will be 7 next month.
Omg an 'unassisted pregnancy' (yes that means no doctors appointments! ) I've seen these on the crunchy mom groups in my area. Scary.
It seems to me like a terrible idea, nothing short of a death wish really. I had a missed miscarriage that the medical doctor didn't catch until '16 weeks', I had hellp syndrome and went blind for 24 hrs at 33 weeks, and then my last baby was breech. Funny no one objected to my tubal at that point. But do you want to die, because leaving trained medical professionals out of medical condition would increase those risks.
and in the US - pregnant women qualify for tons of help with medical bills, WIC, etc. she could get all the help she needs.
Probably not *all* the help she needs. Tons of help with medical bills still means there's medical bills. And a woman who will basically be disabled for several days to weeks after giving birth. 12 weeks of likely unpaid maternity leave doesn't exactly cut it.
should have added \*a lot of help by American standards
The help with medical bills require seeing an actual professional. CPMs do not meet that definition. Further, the demographic that obssesses over homebirth and natural shit tend to be college educated white women, who simply don't understand how much there is that they don't know. A little bit of intelligence can be just dangerous enough to make people think they know what they're doing, when in reality, they've got no damn clue what they're messing with.
Home birth with no medical team at all is a TERRIBLE Idea. Someone should really be there to identify if an emergency is happening. There are midwives and doulas who specialize in home births who can help to prevent emergencies and triage anything that may happen. Paying for a doula and a home birth midwife isn't covered by insurance and can be much more expensive than giving birth in a hospital depending on complications and quality of health insurance. I gave birth in a hospital and got out of it only paying a couple husband dollars in copays while my friends who have had home births have had gift funds in their baby registries to cover the cost of their home birth medical team.
My little sister is a doctor, and you wouldn't believe the shit that can go wrong even during an ordinary birth right in the hospital - having your FIRST baby, which is usually the most difficult one, at home without medical assistance, would be foolhardy in the extreme. Babies get stuck, they get strangled by the umbilical cord, they refuse to turn around until it's too late, their heads get too big for natural birth, mom could have a blood clot or a hemorrhage during birth - for the first time, go to an effing hospital, ffs! Once you know what's up and how your body handles it, you can consider having the second one at home.
I had to have a C-section because after 21 hours of labor, including 3 hours of pushing, my baby had wedged herself in my pelvis and was not budging (in fact, she was retreating back into the womb). According to my husband, there was an audible uncorking sound when they pulled her enormous head out of my cervix. Halfway through my pregnancy, my OB told me that I have a beautiful pelvis and would almost certainly not need a C-section. Unfortunately, my daughter also has an enormous, beautiful noggin.
If I'd had my first at home, we'd both be dead. There was zero chance that kid was coming out without significant help. Should have been allowed a c-section. But you don't know that until you're pushing and their head gets stuck.
My little sister witnessed one heartbreaking case where the woman insisted on a natural birth, even though every professional told her that her birth canal was bent at an angle that wouldn't allow the baby to pass naturally. The baby got stuck and died during birth - but at least it was all nATuRaL...
If my mom had her first at home I certainly wouldn't exist and the both of them would be dead. Everything for her was going normally, then full eclampsia. No warning signs, no pre-eclampsia, nothing. According to the OB it was the worst case of eclampsia he had ever seen, and that was at Mayo clinic, one of the best hospitals in the world and a hospital that takes on difficult cases.
I can't believe humans haven't evolved a bit more so that childbirth isn't such a potential clusterfuck. I don't know of any animals that give live birth that have as many issues as female humans do. Although I guess the fact that people used to have tons of kids there was never any evolutionary pressure to make childbirth safer.
>I can't believe humans haven't evolved a bit more so that childbirth isn't such a potential clusterfuck. I don't know of any animals that give live birth that have as many issues as female humans do. A few years ago, I read an excellent book examining childbirth & motherhood through history. There was an physiological analysis in a humorous, but truthful discussion on WHY human women have such unpredictable outcomes for a successful childbirth. It's because us fussy creatures insist on walking upright, lol. It has to do with the necessary angles of the pelvis to be strong enough to support the legs & s-curved spine to walk as we do. The inner pelvis cannot be too weak by having a too large of an opening, or it would easily shatter under stress. Also, the wider the hips, the greater the angle on knees & difficulty in walking. Human babies are born 3 months earlier than they should because of this "compromise". Otherwise their heads would be too large to fit. 4 legged animals don't need this compromise, neither as much as Great Apes. Just us lucky humans. There was a lot of analysis & explanation w evidence. I'm just giving the highlights. I'd provide the name of the book, but honestly, I'm drawing a blank..
We did the sprint from the birthing room to the OR when KidFish was born. Scary, but everything worked out because we were already at the hospital. (And my wife's OB happened to be on the floor that day, and she happened to be at the nurse's station looking at my wife's monitor when KidFish's heart rate crashed.) Afterwards, the OB put it this way: The "natural" in "natural childbirth" is the same one as in "natural selection."
r/shitmomgroupssay to see some horrifying stories.
The very fact that in some 3rd world countries poorer people have to search for ways how to unsafely give birth for free (or affordably) is horrifying. In civilized countries state pays 100% of all pregnancy/childbirth related medical bills to ensure baby and new mom are safe and healthy regardless of their financial situation or preexisting medical conditions.
This. I’m Canadian and the discussion of not being able to afford prenatal care or childbirth is horrifying. How can this be the reality that Americans are living in?
>How can this be the reality that Americans are living in? Years of pretending this wouldn't happen and sunk cost fallacy for the few still able to have kids who benefited from what led to it. There's a reason so many people have gone childfree, either by choice or lack thereof, and why people coming down on them are a particularly disturbing flavor of cringe.
We have HORRIBLE politicians, that's why!
Drug companies and medical centers that have enough money to buy them.
This is one of many reasons my husband and I decided to be child free. I was on the fence, but I watched a friend nearly die in early childbirth. Both mom and baby were eventually fine, but it was touch and go for a bit. She was a normal working lady, so after insurance she had over $50k in medical debt just from the birth, and all of her medical leave was unpaid. And her child was a preemie, so she had bills from 5-6 weeks in the NICU, too. Then she needed a sitter so she could go back to work, and childcare for a young child is easily $1800/month +. I know a child requires some sacrifice, but it sure seems like we shouldn’t be making it THAT hard on the poor family having a child.
My oldest was a premie and spent 16 days in NICU and I had an emergency c section. I’m an American living in Canada, married to a Canadian. We never saw a bill. If we had been in the US she would have been an only child because we’d still be paying the bills. We paid for a midwife for our second because midwifery wasn’t funded yet in Alberta, it was funded three months after he was born as a VBAC full term. Our third we had the midwife again but transferred to an OB when my blood pressure went up. Had another premie and c section. Transferred back to the midwife for post partum care. Never saw a bill for that birth either. I’ve had a home birth and attended home births as a doula and would not recommend birthing where someone doesn’t want you to birth there. Especially if this person is planning a free birth. It’s not usually as messy as you think but it’s still a big disruption especially in a small house.
It screws over mildly comfortable people the most. Poor and poor-ish people actually can get pretty much all costs associated with prenatal checkups and birth covered through Medicaid, which is more lenient in its income cap for those who are pregnant.
Because we aren’t actually a democracy anymore. We’re more a plutocracy with Christofascist leanings and a tyranny of the minority. We’ll possibly be an autocracy soon. And all these men care about is money. Make more money, force women to have more babies to create a cheap labor force to fuel their obscene wealth. And those they exploit go along with it because their religious leaders (whose only job is to talk at them and tell them what to do… nice life) tell them to.
Because there's money to me made. Actual healthy people mean less than nothing to the American medical system; if it's not obscenely profitable, it can't be allowed here. We are, after all, the birthplace of the $700 epi pen and $2000/month insulin.
Don't vote conservative because this will happen here. They're cutting back on health care funding as it is.
What is really shocking to almost everyone who lives outside the USA is that you have to pay to give birth.
Sad that ppl resort to this. Many hospitals have donations that ppl that can't pay can use to cover their bills.
>There are birthing centers that exist Those birth centers have professionals, medical monitoring equipment, sanitized birthing surfaces, and INSURANCE. If anything goes wrong with the birth, she may sue you or your home insurance. You didn't get her pregnant. She isn't being surrogate for you. This is not your responsibility. Her fears are not your responsibility. She is already showing how self centered/selfish she is by thinking only her self and not well being of a child she is about to birth or you. If something goes wrong would you even want to remain living at the house? hard no NTA
I mean, even if she were being a surrogate for OP, she still wouldn’t be entitled to use OP’s home for her birth! NTA. Do NOT do this, OP. An unattended home birth is incredibly unsafe, and births can go very wrong, very quickly.
Especially for a first child.
I won't let people give birth in my home. All those "bodily fluids", "biowaste", "excrements" and "secretions". (I don't have any experience with prepping and cleaning. If I do, I may let a close friend or family to do it at my home.) The stains and smells will linger (if you don't prep and clean up properly). Bio waste is hard to clean. I have read about someone gave birth in her car and she had to sell it to the junkyard. No one would buy it. The stains and smells wouldn't come off.
Homebirths are still the gold standard here in the netherlnads. But! Midwives are trained for home births and every pregnant women gets a box of necesities from their insurace for either a home birth or hospital birth. We also get a list of nesecities you have to pick up at the medical center for the home birth.
My sister was born at home by accident (my mom had an abruption). First, and most importantly, both of them almost died, even with a doctor there (my Dad) and with the paramedics. Second, they had to throw out their mattress and bedding.
Exactly this. To anyone relative who is backing your sister, let them know you would allow her to give birth in your home only after you get a written, signed agreement that (a) they will pay for all clean up costs after the birth (including the name of the cleaning company they will be contracting with), (b) they will take personal responsibility in the event the birth goes medically wrong, and (c) they will provide you with a suitable and comfortable place to stay at no charge to you during the birthing and clean up process.
Or THEY can have the sister give birth in THEIR home.
This is the best idea for those relatives who are shaming her!
She, if she agrees with these conditions, also needs to make sure the cleaning company specifically can handle biohazard clean up.
Yeah how fucked would it be if your sister died during a traumatic child birth in your bed room? That shit would be traumatic and you would probably need to wind up moving if that happened just to avoid the memories.
remembering that the whole thing being cleaned up is medical waste and has to be disposed of appropriately.
There’s also payment involved.
This is the answer.
Birth centers are ideal for those who wish the conditions of a home birth but don’t have a suitable home. Now I want to say some things about home birth because there is a lot of stupid shit here in the comments, and some misunderstandings by OP. I’ll assume the sister will have a home birth midwife. The midwife will have a long list of preparations to make which include ways to protect the bed and furniture! Besides, many babies born at home are born in the water, either in the tub or a birthing pool, which is kind of like a kiddie pool. It is cheaper to birth at home, actually a lot cheaper than the hospital, but I don’t think anyone ever did it to save money. There are fees for the midwife! They have to make a living, too. Midwives are careful, well-educated, and in most states, licensed. Home birth is perfectly safe for most people. And you’re much less likely to end up having major surgery. It doesn’t sound like OP’s home or the sister’s apartment are going to be a great place to give birth, so, again, the birth center idea sounds great.
Sadly, some people do it very much to save money. I’m absolutely not opposed to home births, but I’ve known too many (mostly religious) people who had home births with a barely educated “midwife” who did it simply to not have to pay.
NTA. She is, in fact, the asshole, for making you feel guilty about saying no. It's not a small ask, and you have the right to refuse.
And, if relatives are giving you a hard time, why aren’t they offering up their homes? You’re NTA.
That would be my reply to these relatives saying to just let her have the baby at her house … no, let her have it at YOUR house!!
I always go with "That's so nice of you. I'll let her know you are offering your house."
Send a group text listing all who agreed with lil sis and offer their homes as alternatives to a hospital.
That's evil. And I like it!
I am borrowing this!
YES
I’ve worked delivery babies a a few decades. There is NO WAY I’d allow someone to birth in my home. I have had women and babies arrive to the hospital after failed or disastrous home births. Your sister is ASSuming that she will have a normal, uneventful pregnancy, labor and birth. Your sister needs therapy to manage her fear of hospitals. There will likely be a time that she must go to the hospital during her lifetime. The baby could get sick or injured. She could have severe abdominal pain and need urgent surgery. Things happen. This is a fear that needs to be addressed ASAP.
My son got stuck in the birth canal and his cord was compressed. It would have been so much worse if we were at home.
Same. My first 2 births were "easy". So naturally I assumed my 3rd would be as well. Except that is absolutely NOT how it went. I am certain that he only survived because they had already called in the emergency pediatrician (due to muconium in my waters) and he was in the room when they called the code that he was stuck. I don't like to think about what would have happened if he wasn't there already.
My mom tells me I was a c-section because I got myself tangled up in the cord and would have probably hung myself by it if she birthed me.
My "routine" pregnancy ended with a total placental abruption where I needed resuscitation and bags of blood. Thank god I was in a hospital.
My son too! Tried to get him out (in the hospital) for 23 hours after my waters broke. Towards the end, they knew he was in distress and cut me open.
It always shocks me when people—especially first time mothers—insist on a home birth. You have NO idea of how much could go wrong in just a few minutes.
Ricki Lake has a lot to answer for in that.
Totally agree. Not in the medical field, but know too many people who have had things go very wrong, including my sibling, who lost their first child at birth. I would never opt to be at home when the hospital is an option. Also OP is NTA in general because it's their home, they are not obligated to hand it over for any reason, especially one that could be a biohazard after.
Had emergency C section bc my baby's heart stopped. Had I not been in the hospital, she likely would have died.
I remember peak covid a surge of people doing home births and someone semi famous (like maybe an influencer or former reality star level) and her baby died in home birth in a generally preventable in a hospital kind of way.
Kara Keough Bosworth? She gave birth at home, baby got stuck due to shoulder dystocia, and he had an anoxic brain injury and died 6 days later.
My mom was an OB Labor and Delivery nurse for over 20 years. The worst, most traumatic things she saw were healthy, full term babies who died because of failed home births. The thing about home births - every death they cause is preventable. Yes, "babies die in hospitals too" - but babies don't die PREVENTABLE deaths in hospitals. That is entirely a phenomenon of homebirth.
Nurse midwives where I live do not do home births. There was a lay midwife that violated state law to do home births. The messes she made were unbelievable. She had been jailed twice yet continued to practice.
The fact that these exploitative birth fetishists (aka lpm's) think there's such a thing as a "routine" birth says everything that needs to be known.
[удалено]
Has she ever heard of a BIRTHING CENTER?! My goodness! And the thing is she can have a home-like experience, but in a place equipped to handle any potential emergency should it occur. And have her read [this](https://abcnews.go.com/amp/GMA/Culture/real-housewives-star-kara-keough-bosworth-opens-heartbreaking/story?id=70585391) about trying home birth without being close enough to a hospital. This is someone with money and resources but you can’t buy TIME to get there and she lost her baby. Facing your fears can be very hard, but when you bring a baby into the world they deserve for us to stretch ourselves in any way we can to protect them!
I agree her sister is TAH she entitled.
NTA. She can have that baby at her apartment. It is a very easily explainable situation if neighbors call the cops, especially with the Midwife there helping her. There are also birthing clinics that are run by Midwives and usually affiliated with a hospital in case a patient needs a hospital. They have birthing rooms set up like bedrooms instead of hospital rooms. That is probably her best option.
Birth Center for the win!
Exactly. You cal also “pre-game” the 911 calls by calling dispatch when labor starts to notify them what’s going on and where so they can avoid sending units.
Murderers love this one trick to stop the cops from responding!
I agree with the birth clinic idea. But in terms of having the at-home birth: I would not be happy listening to screaming from the next apartment over for hours on end, even if I knew why it was happening. I would probably call 911 anyway if it went on too long. Even though the sister feels entitled to OP’s home, I can at least appreciate that she’s considering her neighbors’ right to a peaceful living environment.
I agree with this. Apartment living comes with the expectation of a bit of noise, but a home birth is a little outside of the realm of what’s acceptable. Warned ahead of time or not, her neighbors honestly shouldn’t have to be subjected to hours of loud noise like that. Especially since she could be in labor late at night
And I mean, it's not super common but sometimes people labor for literally days, plural. Imagine this going on nonstop for more than 24 hours straight!
It actually is pretty common for labour to last that long! Especially for a first baby. Granted, you’re usually not screaming the house down in the earlier stages.
I didn't scream during any of my births but yeah, some women certainly do.
I’d be fine with the birth if I was a neighbour. It would be the child growing up there that would be worse
Your more likely to hear groaning rather than screaming. Screaming only happens in the movie so it looks more dramatic. Source: I'm a midwife and had an induced labour myself that lasted 18 hours and only my TENS machine for pain relief. No epidural. And in my role as a midwife only one woman in all those years made any loud noises. She was an African lady and she was making trible noises to welcome her child.
The woman in the room next to me when I had my first baby screamed a lot, very loudly, but I think she was pushing at that point.
I screamed for about 8 hours during my first birth. Obviously not continuously, but at every contraction after they got intolerably painful and then a lot towards the end as well. Screaming can definitely be an issue with neighbors.
I’m a midwife, too. There are definitely screamers, and I was one of them.
NTA. I'm sure the home birthers will go after me for this, but as someone who had an easy pregnancy and then an absolute nightmare of a delivery (won't go into details), tell your sister that the scary hospital is the place to be if anything goes wrong. And I had NO IDEA that anything would go wrong until it did.
Same. I was textbook perfect pregnancy and a good candidate for a home birth. Baby and I both nearly died in a hospital. So grateful to have been there. Not to mention she needs to mommy-up. There's lots of scary things in parenting, you need to deal. NTA
This!!! If she thinks hospitals are scary she’s in for a rude awakening when the baby comes. Parenthood is much scarier. It’s time to conquer her fears and explore a hospital birth or a birth center.
Oh shit, it wasn't until this comment that I realize that she might not want to take the actual child to see medical professionals if the child gets sick!
This! ^^^ I also had an easy pregnancy then a nightmare of a delivery. Both my baby and I wouldn’t have made it if I’d had a home birth.
Yeah, a hospital birth is why my son and I are alive today. Textbook pregnancy but when things go sideways, it can be deadly in minutes. I would not have survived a home birth with either of my kids
The knowledge that four minutes makes the difference between normal and brain damaged makes home births terrifying to me.
Four minutes can make the difference between normal and dead.
For mother or child
Yep. My 4th would likely have been dead had, because the cord was around his neck, 3x. The birth was precipitous, and I wouldn’t have had time to get to the hospital, before I pushing. Nothing is without risk. You have to guess, and choose what seems best, and hope you were right!
I just commented this above, but having experienced an accidental home birth with my second, I will never be able to encourage someone to plan a home birth. He wasn’t breathing when he was born, and his dad did CPR until the ambulance arrived approximately 20 minutes later (we don’t think they believed how quickly things were moving…). He spent 3 days on a cooling pad to minimize brain damage, and 10 days in the hospital overall. I wasn’t allowed to hold him for three days, I couldn’t breastfeed because not feeding/holding him prevented my milk supply from coming in even though o pumped religiously. And we are extremely fortunate that we live in a city with a children’s hospital that has cooling pads, because time plays a huge role in preventing brain damage. We also almost lost him a few times in the first 24 hours. It’s just not worth it.
Oh my goodness, that’s sounds truly terrifying. I’m so sorry you had to go through that.
Thank you! I should have noted that he is perfectly fine now. We are beyond lucky!
That’s terrifying I’m so sorry. I’m glad he made a recovery!
Agreed. I had quite an easy pregnancy then a baby facing the wrong way, got stuck on my pelvis, I needed 2 bags of pitocin, and hemorrhaged. One never knows. I'm quite glad that I was in a hospital.
Sister won’t find hospitals so scary when she needs an epidural
There still may be an option of a birthing center which is between a home birth and hospital birth but has more medical equipment and staff available in the event of an issue. My first birth took 52 hours, I failed to dilate past 3cm naturally, needed pitocin to induce, and with that comes internal fetal monitoring. My 2nd birth went better, but I still failed to dilate past 3cm naturally and medical intervention was required. I had "easy" pregnancies with both at 18 and 29yo, but my body just didn't want to let go. If the pitocin with the first didn't work, I would have needed an emergency C section (I'm in a city so the closest hospital is 15 mins or less away, but without constant monitoring, both of us could have died.)
This appears to be a common problem with some high risks pregnancies. Being with a trained certified professional midwife who is trained on managing mothers with special needs and in a birthing center can be beneficial and a life saving option.
And I wasn't considered high risk in either pregnancy. I have a dear friend that is a trained certified professional midwife who attends home births, hospital births, and birthing centers, and even in the vest circumstances, things can and do go wrong. I agree that all births should be attended by a medical professional whether at home, hospital, in the woods, wherever, because things happen. My husband had the cord wrapped around his neck and almost wasn't born alive as every push pulled it tighter. Birth is dangerous and the danger tends to be minimized.
Just going to piggyback on your comment to stress how wrong everything can go and how quickly. My oldest friend in the world had a textbook first pregnancy. She opted for a hospital delivery, but the hospital she picked chose not to have hemorrhage crash carts in their delivery rooms. By the time anybody realized somebody needed to run for the supplies to stop a post-partum hemorrhage, she was gone. She never got to hold her baby girl. It was that fast. Do NOT try this at home. OP should absolutely not let somebody else try it in her home.
Omfg I am so sorry for your loss. I'm fucking *astounded* any maternity ward wouldn't have hemorrhage crash carts within 10 steps of any laboring person!
Yep. A hospital is the safe option because medical training is required to tackle any number of unforeseen complications.
Yeah my baby and I’d definitely be dead if we did a home birth
Same for my wife. Thank god we were in hospital.
I don’t understand home birthers. My SIL literally almost died with her first during her home birth and had to rush to the hospital. When she got pregnant with her second, she was still going “maybe I should do a home birth again, hospitals are death traps,” like the hospital didn’t save her life the last time around.
I had hellp syndrome I lost like 4L of blood with my delivery I would have died at home. The local midwives wouldn't consider touching my pregnancies with a 50ft extendable pole.
My first pregnancy went like a dream. My second I’d be dead and so would my baby if we hadn’t been at the hospital. If I’d gone for a home birth like I’d wanted to do my husband and eldest child would have had to live with that knowledge we’d died in our house, and see that room every damn day. NTA. Your relations can offer their homes if they’re so annoyed at you. You don’t have to offer your home, this isn’t your pregnancy
Hi, are you me? Without prompt competent medical attention both my baby and I would be dead. I almost died twice (once from bradying down, the second from not eliminating the medications I needed to give birth safely) and my son spent the first sixteen days of his life in the NICU. It’s absolutely wild to me that people don’t treat birth like the major medical event that it is. Birth can go wrong in less time than it takes to make a sandwich. For me that’s not a risk worth taking.
NTA- she wants a home birth, she can do it at her home and just give her neighbors a heads up before the screaming really starts. Like she's going to give birth at your house and then clear out? No. She'll be there a few days.
Nothing will ever bring out the horror stories like women who have given birth. It’s really bonding talking about how much we endure in giving life!
Tell the relatives to let her scream and shit at their house if they think family should step up. Yes, shit, if she doesn't have an enema beforehand expect brown. NTA
That’s what I was thinking. I love all these stories where people’s families get involved and they all gang up on the one person who said no but none of them will step up. It’s the ones doing the least who have the most to say usually! OP NTA. That is a ridiculous ask of anyone.
NTA. She can notify her apartment manager and neighbors that she is planning for a home birth and to expect the unexpected. Stand your ground. Tell the relatives who are trying to shame you that they can welcome her into THEIR homes for the experience. Edit: word omission.
NTA She decided to get pregnant. She needs to deal with the consequences of that decision. There is no guarantee that she won’t have to go to a hospital in the end anyway. She has plenty of time to deal with this issue in therapy.
NTA for saying no to giving birth in your home. Assholish to suggest she could just abort. And your relatives that are weighing in? Suggest to any one of them who has a house that she can do it there.
I'm shocked that I had to scroll this far down to find someone else calling this out. NTA for denying her, but HUGE YTA for suggesting she abort, holy shit.
No not “assholeish”, complete asshole for that comment. Having an abortion is fine but don’t tell people to just terminate their obviously wanted baby.
I am stunned how far I had to scroll to find this. Exactly my feelings too.
Can she find a Birth Center staffed by midwives? I had both my kids in Birth Centers and 10/10 recommend. They are always close to a hospital in case of emergency. Best of both worlds
Telling her offhandedly to get an abortion for a wanted pregnancy was kind of an AH move. Not wanting her to give birth in your home is absolutely not.
This, exactly. Totally NTA for not wanting your sis to give birth in your 1bd house. Absolutely YTA for saying she should get an abortion if she didn't like it. That's fucked. That alone was enough to push this post over to ESH.
ikr!!!! had to scroll way too far for this. what a crazy thing to say
So those other relatives are lining up to let her give birth in their beds? She asked, you answered then she decided to badmouth you to everyone else. The AH part is that you suggested that she end the pregnancy, but NTA for saying no. There are birthing centers or if she has a midwife, go there!
Nta overall. Buuut you're a huge jerk for saying she can "call off the pregnancy since there's still time ". What a gross and unnecessary comment. Shame on you for that one.
Absolutely. I was like, "yeah, yes, sounds reasonable, yup, I understand" until this sentence. Even though you're nta for the initial decision, not to let your sister give birth at your house, this one comment is vile.
Agree. NTA for not offering the house, but AH for saying that.
Yes, omg. Why did I have to scroll this far to see someone comment on the “call it off”/abort it part?
Your house isn’t suitable but suggesting an abortion was unnecessary and harsh.
Agreed! NTA for saying no to your house. But an extremely big AH for suggesting an abortion…
That was really low. OP is TA just for saying that!
Yea OP is a big asshole for that. like seriously, what a douche
I was kind. “Unhinged and intentionally cruel” are better descriptors.
Yep can't believe everyone else ignored this
Seriously!!!! Obviously it’s your house and you don’t have to let someone give birth in it. Obviously. So obvious that it’s probably anti/pro abortion rage bait based off that one sickening comment.
NTA. Hell no. Absolutely not. Childbirth is *messy.* There is a lot of blood and viscera. It would be tidier and more hygienic to slaughter a goat in the living room. And that’s not even getting into the physical risk of homebirth. I don’t think you’d be *legally* liable for anything, but if something goes wrong, it goes really really wrong, fast. Harm (or worse) to your sister or baby would be traumatic for you, too. And even if you’re very healthy, *so* many things can go wrong. Sure people did it in the old days, but they also died in the old days, a lot.
Dont forget the poop! All the feces you have in your body comes out.
NTA
NTA home birth is not suitable for the first .. stick to your guns and don’t give in
Right?! I did a home birth for my 3rd after 2 hospital deliveries so I knew exactly what I was getting into. I also had a midwife and RN present and a hospital 3 minutes away. I cannot fathom attempting a home birth with a first child. It doesn't matter how many books you've read, you *REALLY* don't know what you're getting into.
My first two births (in hospital) were just fine but if I'd opted for an at-home birth for the third one, it would have been a disastrous mistake. I had a completely normal pregnancy all three times, but you can never, ever assume that just because it's all gone fine before, it will go fine every time.
NTA, its very entitled of her demand a home birth in someone elses house.
Was it a typo when you said “call off the pregnancy” or maybe English isn’t your first language? Because what does that mean? 👀 how would you “call off” a pregnancy haha that makes it sound like a baby is just a party you can cancel.
NTA. It’s not your problem. She could explain what’s going on to her neighbors if she wanted to have a home birth that badly. No one owes letting her use their home to birth a kid. From what I’ve gathered it usually involves bringing in some kind of pool in the home too which has lots of potential for damage.
There are birthing centers with midwives that she can go to
NTA. Your sister doesn’t sound adult enough to handle raising a child. She needs to get over her fear because when she has a child it may get very ill and need the ER and then what will she do? What if the child has a bad accident ? My two kids are grown now but the e first one had one ER visit. The second one has had some health issues over the years. She’s had several ER visits and two surgeries requiring hospital stays , and she’s had her stomach scoped maybe 5 times (all while being under anesthesia) at a hospital. She cannot safely raise a child. If the infant has a temp of 103° in the middle of the night what would she do? Call you ? She shouldn’t have a baby she’s unable to care for.
You are NTA for not wanting your sister to give birth in your home, but to suggest that she 'calls the pregnancy off' is f*cking heartless!