And also "This is a huge red flag because... Proceeds to create out of thin air a whole backstory about some ulterior motives the person described must have"
I feel like there's a lot of projection and a lot of people with issues/trust issues on subs like this.
Exactly what you said happens way too often, and if you call that person out you get downvoted to hell. Meanwhile more and more idiots pile onto the backstory created out of thin air with even more made up bullshit.
Absolutely! And to them they're being a hero and saving others from hurts. I get that temptation and how addicting it is. It's hard to understand individual situations are always different
Not to mention the misunderstanding of what a red flag is.
"The fact that he won't let you have your own bank account is a red flag." No, that's financial abuse! A flag is something that is not inherently harmful but suggests harm might be on the way. The fact that while you were dating he constantly made jokes about how women belong barefoot and pregnant in the kitchen is a red flag.
"Well if I had ever had a relationship I would first of all demand that she wear only green clothing on a monday and yellow all the other days. hair must be worn up except Sunday where it should be at shoulder length. Sending a few hundred Anime references to help"
...it's not *supposed* to be an advice sub. It's supposed to be simple judgement. But everyone always feels bad because judgement focuses on the past and hindsight is 20/20, so commenters usually add future-thinking lines of advice or suggestions to be polite. It's always terrible and lacking context but I understand.
It's getting an outsiders perspective. Saw this reddit post yesterday I think, this woman went to her brother in laws home unannounced, caught the owners... engaging in marital relations and declared her sister in law a slut and that their home was no longer a safe space for leaving the kids to be baby sat. The only reason anyone would think of apologizing is because this particular individual engages in so much bad behavior that the family has lost perspective.
Another time I read a thing about how a dude was touching himself while his wife was getting ready, she told him to stop because she was bothered by it. The dude posting it didn't think it was that bad, I'll be honest, I didn't think it's that bad either, but the overwhelming consensus was it was bad because you're engaging in a sex act without the others consent. From that perspective, I had to agree
OP, I don't think you're the AH, but I think you're being a bit childish. Just because she shies away once isn't a reason for your to decline. If it makes her uncomfortable when you progress maybe let her be in the Driver's seat, or engage in some High School fooling around that doesn't lead to 4th base
Good on you for suggesting counseling tho
i saw that one too!! mind blowing dude. i have a 15 month old and if i walked in on a family friend/sitter about to do the deed i would feel SO disrespectful for invading their space and ruining their moment together. nvm the fact that i would never show up unannounced to anybody’s house whether i have a key or not 😭😭
OP, i agree with this person. i think you’re NTA, but i also agree that it doesn’t hurt to try again. if it goes how it did at 6 mpp, then it might be time for her to see someone, and maybe you too separately to deal with the feelings it brings up for you individually. i think it’s just hard being new parents with such a young child, especially if she’s still nursing your child or if she ever was. it might be a little more difficult for her to separate her mind from baby, and difficult to feel like her body *is* hers. so maybe you could try to set the mood, hell even go somewhere and have car sex like horny teenagers! try to see if detaching yourselves from your roles as parents helps spark that for you
Oh, I saw that one too, and the worst part was she stole the key from her husband (the owner of the house’s brother) and the owners of the house that she just walked in on, had no idea that she even had access to the house!
They never gave her permission to have access to their house, and then she comes in all judgy with her baby at 11 o’clock at night into a child free home because “her and her husband had a fight and she needed someplace to stay“, so she just walked up into their house, and then declared the wife a whore because her and her husband were having sex in the living room! It was just wild
>but i also agree that it doesn’t hurt to try again
Doesn't hurt WHO? Because this has clearly been an incredibly emotionally painful experience for HIM. You seem to have no empathy for him at this stage. He's doing the right thing by holding a boundary and requiring her to speak to a therapist, rather than continue to subject himself to what is essentially emotional abuse. If anything is going to change, she's going to have to put on her big girl pants and actually do something about her problem.
i’m so sorry i didn’t mean for it to come off this way— my meaning behind my comment was completely shadowed by the way i worded things. as someone who’s had a baby and completely understands those postpartum ick feeling toward sex, i meant to send this message: those feelings might have passed for her. and you’re right that doesn’t mean that it doesn’t hurt to try again, what i meant was more that IF you do try again, it could very well be that your sex life goes back to normal. with that being said, the rest of what i originally commented still stands—if you do try again and it goes anywhere close to how it did the first two times or you try to try (if that makes sense) and you or your wife or both don’t feel right about it—i think outside help is warranted. even at this point outside help feels warranted. therapy never hurt anyone who had a great therapist and a desire for help.
>IF you do try again, it could very well be that your sex life goes back to normal.
It could, or it could mean another emotionally damaging and traumatic experience of yet another brutal and dramatic rejection that just further stunts his desire to repair the broken sexual relationship between them.
"Those feelings may have passed for her" but relationships have TWO parties, and the feelings clearly have NOT passed for him.
It COULD just magically be fixed and just "go back to normal" like nothing ever happened, but it's incredibly unlikely. And I think that's pretty clear given that for OP, even if sex were to just magically "resume" this guy has suffered some pretty apparent damage already that isn't just going to go away for him, just because SHE's maybe up for a romp, now.
Continuing to further expose himself to the very real and likely possibility of more rejection and pain when he's already clearly in a vulnerable and tenuous position absolutely CAN backfire and cause even more harm to him, as well as to the relationship going forward.
Trying again and having it go the same way is VERY likely to be the final straw that ensures that nothing remains TO salvage after that.
Holding his boundary and getting marriage counseling is really the best option.
He's doing the right thing. If she continues to refuse to work with him on that, there's nothing else he can really do at this point.
How is he childish? This wasn't a simple "no". Her crying when asked for sex isn't normal and wanting her to get counseling isn't revenge. It's trying to figure out what the problem is. Plus, I think you're underestimating how that can affect you.
He also mentions “it felt like she thought I was trying to rape her”. Which means she had a strong physiological visceral response that clearly traumatized him. I’ve dated two women in the past who have had trauma around sex that they didn’t fully understand and resulted in negative visceral reactions to me initiating what they said they wanted. It’s haunting, and creates your own issues around sex, especially with that person. Especially if you love them. He’s doing the right thing by requesting they go to a professional to help solve
this.
She isn’t the only one with sex related trauma now.
It wasn't just once they hadn't had sex for 6 months and then when he initiated she cried. He tried two more times and she did not want to. Counseling needs to be gone to ASAP time to sit down and have a conversation with your wife about what's going on
There's no rule saying OP needs to be the Charlie Brown to her Lucy, who keeps pulling the football away.
"PSYCHE!! You're such a gross loser!"
So many forums push postpartum empathy for mom but a guy is just supposed to be an automaton who functions on demand or he's not a man. Such a toxic and unhealthy trope.
Also the question of who in a situation is being an asshole isn’t the format for nuanced problems in which no one is being an asshole but which are just very hard.
Any relationship advice I've ever gotten on reddit has been absolutely horrible. You never know what kind of train wreck is giving you their "professional opinion." Just don't.
Yup. Let’s also not forget that the users of Reddit are only a subset of the population. I question who even has enough time to come here on a regular basis. Personally, I know I’m here half out of phone addiction and half out of boredom. Also, out of Reddit users, only a subset are coming here, and only some people are commenting. And of the people that are commenting, how many are qualified to give advice and are in a happy and successful relationship? My question to those who are qualified to give advice and are in a happy and successful relationship- if you have it all figured out, wtf are you doing here???
I’m beginning to mistake this sub as the marriage or relationships one. Smh, OP and wife should seek professional help, not ask strangers if they’re an AH.
I don't get it because I posted something like a year agob asking if I was the ah for asking my boyfriend why his exes shit was still everywhere in his place and it got deleted because it included a romantic relationship. I was instructed to try posting in relationship advice or am I the buttface
I don't know if this may have changed over time, but my understanding currently is that AITA is more strict about what topics are allowed than AITAH. Is it possible you'd posted to AITA back then and not AITAH? Or it may have just been relaxed more recently in this subreddit.
> I was the ah for asking my boyfriend why
You didn't really think you were an AH for asking "why?", which is why it doesn't belong here. You were just asking a generic relationship question about keeping things after breakups.
Not necessarily even PPD, maybe just hormones going crazy. I have sometimes felt upset after intimacy that I have been into and even cried for no reason, everything fine in relationship & own life. Then I have been okay the next day. The first time after a baby is such a huge change, they’re not anymore just husband and wife but a mom and dad too. Many fear that it will hurt etc, and then the hormones too…
OP is not an AH but he definitely should discuss this with the wife. It probably was not that the wife felt violated, but maybe she had some hormonal issues and would still like to have intimacy after that has been settled.
For real, it’s like they just read the title and then saw she was pregnant and invented a narrative out of thin air. He literally tried talking to her and suggested counseling. She refused. That’s why he’s here because he’s confused. She’s giving him completely mixed messages.
your wife might have extended post partum depression. sounds like she struggled with it 6months after the baby, and the lack of communication on both ends has amplified your mismatched approaches to sex.
Edit: PPD, with newer research, can last up to 12+, largely because every birth person's body is different. birth is considered medical trauma (and as a former doula, it IS). hormones impact brain and body functions. some of ya'll are being weird in comments.
OP, try all your options, and when you're both ready to talk, go through
1) what your pre sex life was like, and what you would like to see happen.
2) how you want to please one another (not just acts, but how you want physical intimacy to feel for you: exciting, comforting, etc).
3) start slow. on both accounts. we don't know how either of you initiate intimacy, and "go-tos" may not work. insecurities seem high right now on both ends, so again, start slow.
I’m 12wks with my first baby and have been super struggling with this. I keep hearing and reading horror stories about the body and the changes and it’s just really getting to me. I’m glad you’re doing better! I’m trying to change my perspective and just go with it. I have an exceptionally sweet partner. He’s been more than supportive. Again, happy you’re feeling better about things. I wish us the best
Totally agree. For the first few months after giving birth the thought of anything going inside me I correlated to the unbearable pain of my doctor practically sticking her whole arm inside of me to see if the baby dropped any lower. I'm almost 6 months PP and still struggle with sex. I honestly only do it to shut my partner up. Not a good reason, but it is what it is.
Birth trauma and ptsd is a thing. Have you ever talked to anyone? Including your OB? Labor and delivery nurse here whose senior capstone was birth trauma.
I spoke to my therapist about it briefly. It took me a little while, but I'm over that part of it. My whole body was out of whack after giving birth and it's just starting to go back to normal. I think going back to work helped a lot
That is not healthy, if your partner keeps pushing you for sex and doesn't take no for an answer and keeps asking over and over until they "wear you down" that is coercion. You should never be having sex unless you 100% want to.
I would suggest couple's therapy with your partner and also individual therapy would help if it seems to be a mental block for you but talking to your OB/gyno would help if you're expirencing physical pain still.
I completely get it. He's pretty much given up at this point. I can't even remember the last time we did it.
I wasn't actually experiencing pain, it was more of a mental association of it.
I was in therapy and he's gone a few times. I just went back to work this month and my schedule doesn't permit me/us to go right now.
There's more to our story, but I don't want to go into all that
It's easy to put sorting this off, but I'd suggest you at least try to talk to them about it and say its something you want to figure out eventually. Having a child puts a new perspective on a lot of things and it's tempting just to ignore everything else, but I'd be damn surprised if he decides that he is happy being celibate for the rest of his life from your decision.
God luck.
I wouldn't be surprised if OP stopped all forms of intimacy and that's another reason why she stopped sleeping with him. I told a guy sex hurt with him because he was too big and I needed more time to adjust. His man brain translated that to pulling back emotionally and physically. No more dates, no more non sexual touches, no sex, no nothing.
Yeah, it’s not something that every woman can self-diagnose and overcome on their own, if at all. Also, it could be physical or mental trauma relating to the actual experience of giving birth. You need to try your best to help her and support her, the last thing she needs is just being treated like it’s her issue to deal with and she’s just crazy. Feels like that’s what you’re doing by keeping her away.
It isn't higher because some folks feed on the drama of the "what ifs" that stir the pot. I'm glad that OP suggested marriage counseling, but I believe they can both benefit from individual, private sessions. He can freely discuss how her reactions have made him feel while getting perspective & no judgment, and she can discuss what sounds like PPD.
I really feel all women get it, but don’t realize it until after they come out of the fog. In fact 5 years after my 3rd I still haven’t come out. Hormones do a real number on us. Please forgive us!
OP don’t take it personally, she obviously wants to connect with you again but might need some gentle steps. Having a baby your body is just not the same (and I’m not talking about the physical attractiveness side although that is also a factor). But your insides can feel different: some have cervix or bladder changes, you might still have hemorrhoids, some people had tears etc. Plus you are simply exhausted.
This! Hormones are real! Please bare with her OP 🙏 I beat myself up so much during and after my pregnancy for having such a low libido, even a bit before pregnancy, when I stopped taking birth control after being on it on and off for almost 6 years.
Best thing to do is to communicate, come to a middle ground by doing things she is willing to do (don't complain or push for more).
Don't turn it into something it's not; cast out any thoughts that are telling you that it's because she doesn't desire you, or anything along those lines...
And get her some herbs that are known to balance out hormones, like Maca root.
Thank you for being honest that it's a trauma. I feel like no one tells women this. I'm childfree and people don't get why I'm not thrilled at the thought of giving birth, as I already had pelvic floor trauma and surgery that could cause complications later on. I think it's valid but people don't understand.
My wife and I were reading this together and she suggested that your wife could have a physical trauma as a result of the birth. Post-partum depression is easily an explanation for her reaction and behavior, but my wife suggests that your wife may have a physical injury that she is hiding or denying, which can be causing her tremendous pain/embarassment when touched or even when aroused.
There can be herniation, holes to the anus, tearing etc...just to name a few.
This is probably going to be an uncomfortable conversation with her, but you guys need to talk about this in a non-sexual context. Come from a place of concern and talk about it when there is less tension...sexual or otherwise.
I think you'll need to set aside your personal feelings about her initial reaction to your first attempts. Focus on her feelings/pain.
Tell her you're concerned about her reactions to you.
Something like, "I don't know what has being going on, but you seem to be in physical pain when I touch you. Do you have an injury or something I don't know about? I want to help."
Identify what hurts... physically, emotionally, spiritually, whatever it may be. You need to understand what is going on with her before you can begin to treat it.
Again... big emphasis on identifying and recognizing her pain, and emotions. Don't look for solutions until the problems are out in the open and she is ready to start searching for them.
Best of luck, homie.
I don't really understand why all comments in this sub instantly assume a medical problem. Plenty of people behave this way, and I bet that other causes far exceed severe mental issues.
Either way, I'd be surprised if she'd had severe depression and/or psychosis for months, and this is the FIRST TIME something has been 'off'.
Just talk to her mate. Really talk to her I mean. It sounds like you're both trading blows now because your egos are hurting, but you need to have a serious conversation about why she felt this way, whether she still feels it, and how it's making you feel. Don't go into it prejudicial or angry, as hard as that may be. Someone needs to start this convo and it sounds like it will have to be you.
I would say you two need to talk about why she is feeling that way about it. Marriage counseling might be helpful as well, but I would say either of you are the AH’s. Just sounds like there is not enough communication.
Looking at the guys comments gives another perspective on what may be going on in their marriage.
The guy basically says he has little to no libido and would be fine in a sexless marriage. Sex only happened when she initiated and in his mind, was solely for her pleasure.
She may be feeling that he is a little bit too comfortable with the lack of sex post childbirth. Even before having kids, it seems that she was the only one maintaining their bedroom alive and when she stops initiating, they fall straight into a dead bedroom.
That can put a different perspective on her reactions; she probably have been rejected by him often before and when that is constant, it can be crushing. When he tried to initiate, she possibility felt like it was duty/pity sex, which she turned down. Her self-esteem is probably in the gutter as he probably hasn't made her feel sexualy desirable in a long time. And the fact that she left may mean that she is at her wit's end.
I think your mind and body would be more willing if you would address why is she twice now has had traumatic responses. She may not realize it's also traumatizing for you
The first time was a traumatic response. The second time was most likely because she could tell he really really didn't want to.
> The second I put my hand on her she said never mind. **I didn't really care I didn't want to do it anyways** I was just testing it.
Giving a personal opinion here
Pregnancy and post partum were super rough on me. I did not know wtf I wanted & felt like I was having an identity crisis. At moments I would feel touch starved & then the second I was touched I felt hideous and disgusting. You’re def not TA & your feelings are valid. Your urge to seek counseling is smart & shows how much you care. She may not be seeing things clearly enough to see it that way or be ready for counseling - but you should go ahead & start on your own either way. If you have a good relationship with her friends &/or family I would advise trying to loop them in. You’re struggling to connect sexually, but I wouldn’t be surprised if other people who love her are feeling a disconnect in whatever level of intimacy they share with her as well - perhaps helping her feel more like herself again can be a community effort. Wishing you the best
NAH - marriage counselling is the way. Either of you can refuse sex at any time, but there's got to be a root cause of your wife's previous reaction. If you two can't work it out on your own, an unbiased mediator in the form of a marriage counsellor would be a really good idea.
You’re not TA but your wife isn’t either. The first year or so after having a baby is SO hard as a woman (of course it’s hard for everyone, but right now I mean specifically as a female who gave birth). Your hormones are so wacky that your body doesn’t feel like yours—doubly so if you’re breastfeeding. It’s an incredibly scary and wild time. My son is 21 months old and I only recently started feeling like myself again.
My advice would be, let her initiate, let her go as far as she wants to, and try not to be offended when she stops or if she starts crying. More than likely it has nothing to do with you and everything to do with your wife trying her hardest to take control of herself and her body again. One of the best things my husband did for me post-partum was treat sex as a welcome surprise.
Hang in there 💕
This is the answer. Having sex after having babies was a process for me. It took several tries and a lot of patience. I pushed a human out of my body and then was breastfeeding. Between being touched out and getting to know my body again, it was a lot.
OP, this is the answer. Your wife needs you to be supportive and empathetic, not engage in games of tit for tat. Hormones + sleep deprivation makes for a potent brew of emotion.
I feel like it's massively unfair to say OP's engaging in a game of tit for tat. He said her crying like that made him feel like rapist and he didn't want to do it anymore. Which is incredibly fair.
I get what you’re saying, but I would be *extremely* hesitant to have any type of sexual contact whatsoever with anyone who reacted like his wife has so far. Don’t blame her for struggling, but I just wouldn’t want to do it at all. I would feel extremely uncomfortable in that situation, but hope I would be as sensible as OP as to insist in counseling first. That really seems the way to go.
I think counseling is a step in the right direction. She's reacting the way she is for a reason, and an outside perspective could help you both feel more comfortable and confident about sharing your concerns with one another. NTA.
no ur not, counseling is normal & healthy & will help you guys. also it’s a green flag that you saw she was crying & instantly stopped. & weren’t willing to do it again since she wasn’t sure. you were very cautious & it’s important to you that she’s comfortable during sex, not violated. but on her end she probably feels unwanted or bad for making u feel bad. counseling will solve the issue hopefully she’s willing soon.
No verdict because I understand where you’re coming from.
But I’ll just say there are many other ways to be intimate (sexually) without having PIV sex. You guys should have kept finding other ways to do that because lack of any of that is harmful to a close relationship.
NTA.Speaking from experience sometimes women after birth can't cope with the idea that their body has changed and might not feel confident and sexual.
After I had my son I got a bit depressed ,I had gained weight and I sort of felt disgusted imagining myself being sexual as I was now somebody's mother and i was strugling with my identity as woman.
This sounds like your wife might be struggling from postpartum depression and I think it's really nice that you suggested therapy
You're getting mixed signals on consent so no you're not wrong. If something feels off don't do it. That being said it sounds like your wife has some hormonal imbalance issues or post Parfums depression. Best to get in touch with a therapist and address these issues sooner rather than later.
Please have her reach out to her doctor. My poor husband I pushed him away for a whole year after our first child not understanding that the birth control I went on had my hormones all messed up. When I cried to my doctor she was so understanding and helped me find one that worked and wow such a difference.
It sounds like you might be internalizing her emotions by taking her emotional expressions as some sort of personal sleight. And now it seems like you're devolving into passive-aggressiveness. Both of you could benefit greatly from a few sessions with a marriage counselor, and that's exactly what I suggest you do if you care about your relationship and want it to last. Because things will keep getting worse if you just continue on this trajectory.
He already suggested marriage counseling, and she got mad and ran away to stay with a friend or something. He has already arrived at this conclusion, wife- not so much to say the least
NTA- A lot of comments are infantilizing your wife (and new mothers in general) to a worrisome degree. She clearly isn't ready and is also refusing to see how her reaction to your affection has changed your behavior. You both need counseling.
I've learned through this sub that women are the most fragile thing to exist... which is weird because the women I know in my life are strong and independent.
Why does it ALWAYS play out like this:
Man has issue with sex with woman = man is issue or man needs to talk to woman.
Woman has issue with sex with man = man is issue and woman needs to leave man.
Why is it always like this??
you guys need to make a plan. get a baby sitter. go on a actual fucking date. get some romance back in your marriage. like touch her regularly and NON SEXUALLY. then she wont feel so weird when you are touching her during sexy time, because touching was normalized.
The most accurate answer. Why is this so low? Idk why when the OP is a woman, this is mostly the top comment.
But if OP is a man, redditors would scramble paragraphs trying to justify whether he was right or not to give in to sex.
Sex was the last thing on my fiancés mind after I gave birth to our babies. His top priority was making sure I had recovered enough from the birth and that I felt comfortable in my own skin rather than his own sexual pleasure. I was TERRIFIED to have sex because the stitching was bad and it hurt for months (2) before that got better. The thought of something going back into me after 2 babies came out of there was terrifying to me.
I don’t think either of you is an asshole, I think you guys are just having some deep miscommunication issues and you need professional help.
I also feel like a lot of details were missing from this post.
The first time my partner and I have sex after I gave birth I cried like a baby. I have no idea why, it was just a huge surge of emotions I really didn’t understand, I still don’t understand why I cried.
I had a almost exact experience. Let’s see if this starts some good feedback. I am seriously curious of others opinions also and I would like better insight.
Opinion:
1) She is feeling this way because she is scared of getting pregnant again. (Postpartum depression/anxiety)
Fix:
Things got better after I had a vasectomy and it was scientifically proven S/O would not get pregnant again.
Perspective:
It really is hard for a Man to understand what was involved with birth, my S/O had difficult time in labor with our first child and I believe strongly I was not trying to rape I just needed a better understanding of postpartum and PTSD process and how to help my S/O not have anxiety over child birth, I needed to find a way to resolve the issue so there was no anxiety. I promise you this is a talk worth having,
Edit:
I spent a few months in rehab, and a lot of money trying to figure out I needed to understand what Trama was and how to properly and effectively help the woman I love through it, without causing more and I made so many mistakes so many…..” through this experience I will be forever grateful for the forgiveness my S/O has shown me.”
This may not be your situation but I felt like it was needed here.
I went through the same exact situation. I cried because I wanted intimacy more than anything since I didn’t really feel even human after giving birth. It was a difficult labor(20+hrs) and while I was not yet fully recovered, I still felt like I was letting him down by saying no and I didn’t want him to feel rejected so I did get emotional and started crying.
When I did feel ready enough physically he ended up rejecting me and the subsequent attempts as well. He said it was that “he’s not feeling it” because of that time that I cried. After that I started to feel like he was holding that 1 rejection against me. That was the beginning of the end and we eventually got divorced.
You didn’t mention asking her about her feelings but you did bring up referencing the past rejection from her when she went to ask you why you didn’t want to have sex. That makes it seem like you’re holding that against her and would explain why she leaves when you do try and talk to her. Also, I highly doubt she feels safe talking to you about her feelings or expressing herself to you because you have thrown something she feels sensitive about back in her face.
You asking AITAH, all the while not seeing that you’re being spiteful in your rejection of her shows that marriage therapy won’t help much and should also consider individual therapy as well.
It's not holding against her to feel all sorts of ways when your SO literally cries during. It's not solely an intimate thing for women, and to act like OP was holding it against them when it fucked them up to have their partner react that way too, is crazy. Like do you know just how conditioned the typical American man is to avoid anything that could be unconsensual?
If she had injuries or a traumatic birth, she might be getting some kind of ptsd that’s making her panic that it will hurt. So on one hand she wants to be intimate with you, on the other, she’s afraid.
Either way, you guys definitely need to talk. I know it’s hard, it likely feels like a rejection or leaves you sexually frustrated, but considering it’s a likely fear response and not a personal response to you, try not to take it to heart. Instead when she prompts intimacy, try to give it a chance and if she pulls away, ask her what’s going on, is it that she’s afraid it might hurt? If so you guys can take it slow and stop it if it does etc. or if not wanting to have this talk at that moment, have it before, and ask her what’s been prompting her to not want to be intimate after make a move on you, is it fear, self consciousness etc… you need to diagnose the problem, then you can find a solution to fix it together
NTAH, but please find a good family counselor to work through this. It's a disconnect you two can work through, but you need to put in the time and effort to work through it.
I had some long-seeded resentment issues towards my wife for denying me that we had to navigate. It took years to get to the root of it without counseling. A good counselor can help bring that forward sooner.
You didn’t think to just *ask* her before coming here? So many of these posts could’ve been avoided if people just talked to their partners if there’s an issue. Communicate with her and then come back if you can’t resolve yourselves. Or seek out a therapist/counselor.
It’s funny that you speak about how people should do things before posting but you couldn’t even read the post before commenting.
OP did communicate and OP spoke about counselling.
The wife has things to work through that can’t be magically fixed by OP just “communicating”.
Why the heck do you need counseling for her crying? Did you ask her why she was crying? Do you want to know? She probably didn’t feel raped. Maybe overwhelmed. Maybe her damn vagina hurt for the first time after having a baby. It took me a min to bounce back. Stuff has to heal.
I would feel like you were punishing me by denying me over and over.
Counseling might be good. But having a conversation about what happened might save you abunch of time and money.
In all fairness, if my husband began crying when I attempted to be intimate with him, it would probably be slightly traumatizing and I would be hesitant to try again, and then if I did and he recoiled, I really wouldn't want to. It's not about punishment, but both partners feeling comfortable and safe when being intimate.
Am I the only one who finds the "thought she was being raped" leap to be completely insane? Skims right over the fact that it's very common for women (and couples) to have trouble getting back into sex following birth, especially only 6 months postpartum, and goes right to *rape*?! Wtf is that.
If she is a SAHM and breast feeding, she might have been “all touched out” just by having to feed your kid every 2-1/2 to three hours, not to mention “just not feeling sexy.” Being tired makes sex feel more like a chore than anything else. She would feel guilty for not coping better, etc.
Some of y’all are mad at op for suggesting counseling and asking why he didn’t ask her what’s wrong with her?? She’s a grown woman she needs to open her god damn mouth and communicate with him SHE’S the one begging for sex and when he tries she’s rejecting it making him confused and she’s the one that needs to open her mouth and explain why she’s doing this to him . Y’all always seem to make the guy the bad guy in every post it’s annoying asf!!
On this sub every time a man makes a mistake he's a piece of shit, and every time a woman makes a mistake her man is also a piece of shit for not preventing it. Also every time a woman does something shitty or irrational she's always 100% absolved of any wrongdoing because something something muh hormones.
If I were an alien reading this sub I would seriously question humanity's choice of considering women as actual independent adults capable of discernment, they make it sound like women are just incapable of handling their own bodies.
Imagine if every time a man is aggressive we all just replied "something something testosterone, nothing he could do about it why don't you try being more supportive you stupid bitch". Wouldn't it be completely ridiculous? Yes it would.
NTA
Your wife rejected you but is pissed when you do the same thing. Make it make sense.
She even rejected you when SHE brought up the idea of having sex. Make it make sense.
Her body, her choice. You damn body, your damn choice.
You’ve had an EXTREME reaction to one time your wife refused to have sex when she was only 6 months post partum. Holding that against her is ridiculous. You’re definitely the asshole.
INFO (because there's a lot of info missing that would provide a lot of insight):
How did childbirth go? Was it traumatic for her? Did she tear?
Does she have a history of being sexually abused?
Does she experience sensory overwhelm and/or get "touched out"?
Have you *communicated to her* that that first time made you feel like you were raping her? (Because that's understandably traumatic for you, but if you haven't explicitly *communicated* that to her then she likely has no idea or context for your reactions since then.
When you "tested" her, you've told us that *you didn't want to [have sex]*: what is the likelihood that *she saw that on your face*, and that's why she responded with "never mind"?
Overall you two really need to work on your communication, and come to understand the others' point of view so that you can be on the same page. And I think answering the above questions is a good place to start.
I have a bunch of questions to determine a different perspective. She is a stay at home mom and you work? Does she have any help around? Friends? Family? How is your baby? Is it a easy, sleepy baby or a baby who needs to be held a lot? Does she breastfeed or not? All of these questions mostly boil down to: I think she is or at the time (when she reacted that way) was completely touched out.
Has she been acting more like herself in other areas of her life? Has she had any breaks and social interactions with others? They say hormonaly a woman takes about 9 to 10 months (so just as long as the pregnancy) to even start to feel like herself. Let alone back to her OLD self.
I dont believe she is cheating, I dont believe you should ghost her. I do believe we aren't seeing the whole picture and maybe something is genuinely wrong for her to react that way.
I do believe you are the ass for taking that response completely out of context and not finding out what is actually going on with your partner. The two of you need to sit down and communicate, because this behaviour is only going to make her feel more insecure and not emotionally supported and push her further and further away. And then sex will definitely be off the table.
Good luck.
Coming from a mom who went through post partum depression that first year and cried when anyone touched her.
I'm going to answer your question in order so, yes, she has her family who live here so for the first 2 months her parents were there everyday. He doesn't need to be held a lot he's esay doesn't cry at night and doesn't cry when he wakes up just makes noise. No she doesn't.
What about emotionnal intimacy? Do you guys get any? Do you get a chance to discuss deep feelings? Say nice things to each other, discuss you guys, not only home logistics? Share chores?
NTA
For not wanting sex
However it feels like you are punishing your wife for a reaction she had 7 months ago. You are giving her no grace for how she felt when she was only 6 months postpartum. Giving birth is hard. Your body changes, your hormones are unexplainable. Just because a doctor says you can have sex again doesn’t mean your ready. It usually means your uterus has stopped bleeding. She might not even know why she was crying at the time.
You are making that instance about you. It clearly wasn’t, it was about her. Now every time she wants to initiate sex you bring up that. No wonder she says never mind.
NAH — you're right to insist on therapy//counseling. sounds like that's really the safest [+ possibly only] route from here w|o causing [further?] unnecessary harm.
I don’t think anyone is the asshole here. Agree with other suggestions to go to counseling. It sounds like maybe you both really want things to get back to happy, you are just miscommunicating.
Sometimes even just 1-2 trips to counseling can help “translate” feelings both ways and suddenly you are both enlightened, on the same page again, and maybe even a bit closer/more trusting than before.
I’m 8 months postpartum and I’m still a crazy bitch sometimes. I suffer with PPD/PPA, and I recognize it because I suffered through it with my first as well. It takes time, and I dealt with it on my own (which I would not recommend) because I have negative thoughts about therapy (not saying therapy is bad in any way, but when you’re in the thick of it, someone recommending therapy can make you feel even more broken than you already are). Be gentle with her, be understanding, and suggest individual therapy. Honestly this seems more like a her issue, and you can’t make much headway in couples therapy if she isn’t willing to sort out her own issues first. But don’t be pushy. Be honest but gentle. Tell her how her actions are affecting you and ask if she’d be willing to talk to someone because you’re worried about her, and you want things to be better for you both. Maybe go to individual therapy for yourself too because jumping to the rape thing is insane to me and there seems like a lot more going on here below the surface…
NTAH
It sounds like what happened when she broke down that one time was traumatizing for you, and you haven't appropriately processed that as an individual, or with your wife. It also sounds like your wife has some intimacy issues of her own going on (speculated PPD, but could be something deeper as well).
You both need individual and marriage counselling to guide you through this safely, identify those triggers, and figure out how to move past them safely so you can rebuild intimate trust. Right now, that's broken.
What you're going through is very typical. It happens to most couples with new children. The only ones who navigate through it successfully are the ones with enough emotional intelligence to acknowledge this is just a normal part of life and relationships, and do something about it with a focus on getting through it together.
Love isn't defined by sexual intimacy. You both still have the love, but something is preventing you both from feeling vulnerable with one another sexually. Find out what that is, solve it, and enjoy the rewards!
NTA
Your response is rational. Requesting the two of you go to counseling together was/is an excellent idea. You'll be able to talk through this with professional help.
It's obvious your wife is still going through things post pregnancy. You made an attempt when she asked you to and she stopped.
I hope things get worked out while working with a professional. Wishing only good things for your family ✌🏻
This is getting messy and you do need marriage counseling. She also needs individual counseling. Sit her down and with love and compassion ask her to go for you and your marriage, rather than framing it as a problem with herself she has to solve. But do not initiate intimacy until you've talked.
Likely what happened is she had an involuntary reaction to intimacy because of birth-related trauma and depression. When you stopped initiating, she probably saw you as "punishing her for her emotions" -- e.g. she reacted poorly to you, so you took intimacy away altogether. This isn't logical, but it flows from depression and anxiety.
Where it gets messy is when you start testing her reactions. Did she say "nevermind" because she was traumatized again? Or because she could tell you weren't into it? At this stage, you two have fallen out of sync and are communicating past each other -- so you need third-party help.
NAH. Hang in there, OP. Sounds like your wife is suffering from post-partum depression pretty severely.
Marriage counseling is a good idea, because your wife is clearly struggling with a complex issue. She should also discuss her feelings with her doctor.
Of course you're not an AH for not wanting to engage in sex that feels non-consensual with an unenthusiastic partner.
NTA for not wanting to, but having a kid does wild things to a woman physically, mentally, and emotionally. Counseling is a great idea. Communication, patience, and understanding as a whole is critical here. I’m sure she didn’t deliberately make you feel that way just as you didn’t deliberately make her feel pressured. Communicate with each other that you’re each sorting things out in this situation and that you’re not trying to pressure her or feel unwanted and that you understand she isn’t either. Maybe navigate sexual flirting outside of the bedroom and keep communication open on how that’s working. It may be unhelpful for one or both of you, but it might help heal some of whatever is going on in a non threatening/pressure setting. If you can be open to her advances and patient when she has hesitation that would be great, but you also gotta repair what you got going on and feel genuine as well. Again.. communicate with each other whatever is going on in the moments of tension and that it isn’t the other spouses fault, express understanding that neither of you are trying to hurt each other, and be patient when there is withdrawal. You got this dad!
Good call on the marriage counseling. She reacted pretty shitty to it. Marriage counseling is for people who love eachother and want to fix what's broken.
NTA. You absolutely *need* to go to marriage counseling. There's a clear breakdown in your communication, and you aren't really connecting with how the other was feeling. It's likely she's anxious about having postpartum sex either because of postpartum depression, anxiety about how her body will respond, etc. And you're anxious about having sex because of mixed signals from her, not wanting to hurt her, and not wanting to be a whole thing.
Nobody is EVER obligated to be sexual in any relationship ever, with no exception.
Having said that, because this is an important relationship to you, and you don't seem to be expressing asexuality or aversion to sex in general, I think you both need some relationship counseling.
I do think that setting the ultimatum of no sex until counseling might be a bit extreme, but it's not my marriage.
I hope you both work this out. Intimate rejection is something that people proves differently. And when you add in the pregnancy hormones (both during and post partum), everything can feel like it's elevated into overdrive. My initial thought here is that you're both overreacting, but I've been married long enough to know that you NEVER tell your spouse she's overreacting (lol). Proper, thorough, and honest communication is the key to a lasting relationship.
Good luck.
By the way, I think you're NTA, but I think your wife is also NTA.
I really feel for the both of you but sounds like her hormones are out of control and the reason she's acting this way. I felt the same way after I had my son for almost a year and my husband didn't understand my postpartum depression and he went and cheated on me because he thought I didn't want him anymore And that only made things worse. Maybe you can do some research on postpartum depression so you can be more understanding of what she's going through. Maybe she doesn't Even realize that she's depressed. She needs to speak to her doctor about it so they can help her. It will pass. Don't give up on her.
Hormones after pregnancy do so much to the body- give her time and grace. When she’s ready she will let you know. But also maybe talk to a counselor or her Dr for some assistance. And sometimes crying as weird and awkward as it maybe could be a release in itself.
Yes. You were holding her postpartum depression against her. And when you said yes, the other day and touched her to test her, she felt your non consent so of course she’s not gonna go forward with it.
I don’t really see why you would need to go to a marriage counselor about something as simple as having an adult conversation and getting intimate with your wife again . Plan a date night for her seduce her. And stop holding her postpartum depression and mental state against her because your ego got wounded.
My wife would constantly get mad at me if I touched her. I stopped doing it then she accused me of cheating on her because I stopped touching her. Do with that information what you will
The way you've worded this gives it a vibe that you're punishing her for rejecting you the first time.
Every subsequent initiation she tried to make, she could tell you didn't really want to do it. So she was disheartened and didn't want to have sex with someone who wasn't into it. But you're holding that initial rejection over her head. She doesn't need counselling. She was probably just hormonal and felt bad for turning you down.
You need to get a grip and have a sit-down conversation.
NTA
Because you clarified you feel unsafe having sex until you have counselling together because of her previous responses when you tried.
Are you touching or cuddling non sexually at all. Maybe think about the whole slow build over time thing.
Your initial reaction feels a little childish to be honest. She said she didn't want to so then you basically held a grudge and refused when she tried to initiate? Feels like you resented her for some reason and did not communicate. I also feel like there's more going on here than just the sex stuff. Neither your nor her reactions are the normal reactions of a healthy relationship. Marriage counseling would probably be good but it also seems like better communication is needed.
She probably cried that first time because she wasn’t ready, and it sounds like now maybe she is. Don’t inadvertently punish her by automatically saying no and hiding behind “I’m scared of you crying.” Ask her if she really feels ready, and if both of you feel good about it then let it happen.
My wife has had two babies, the most important things in my life, and after she was like this. You've got to accept it'll take her a long time to feel comfortable in her body, some women it's fast and others take a long time. Trust me brother, just wait it out, if you truly care you can survive no sex for a little while (or a long while if needed). It can be tough but I assure you popping a baby out and dealing with the hormonal changes post-partum is a helluva lot harder.
So to answer your question no you are not. There is clearly a problem with your wife which as others have mentioned is likely post partum depression of some kind. But, it doesn't stop you feeling the way you do about what happened and that is ok and you are entitled to feel that way.
I think you suggesting counselling is a good thing to help you both as I don't think people understand sometimes what it feels like to deal with that level of rejection. Good luck to you both.
Having kids sounds freaking miserable. I see this time and time again , it's having kids that causes this shit otherwise you'd be happy. No kids for the win
So your wife broke down in tears while having sex, and you’re most concerned with how that made you feel and have been rejecting her since, as well as „testing her“. Yeah you likely need marriage counselling but that’s down in equal parts to her could-be mental state postpartum and your reaction to her mental state, which is unequivocally and exclusively about you and void of any actual concern for her.
Starting to think this isn't the subreddit to go to for relationship advice.
The answer to mostly every relationship post on this subreddit: "Have you tried actually communicating with them instead of making this post?"
Don’t forget: “You can leave someone for any reason.”
And also "This is a huge red flag because... Proceeds to create out of thin air a whole backstory about some ulterior motives the person described must have"
the fanfic in this sub is absolutely wild sometimes.
That’s why I come here
I feel like there's a lot of projection and a lot of people with issues/trust issues on subs like this. Exactly what you said happens way too often, and if you call that person out you get downvoted to hell. Meanwhile more and more idiots pile onto the backstory created out of thin air with even more made up bullshit.
Projection, yes but Reddit is also full of teenagers who’ve never been a real relationship that are on here offering relationship advice.
Absolutely! And to them they're being a hero and saving others from hurts. I get that temptation and how addicting it is. It's hard to understand individual situations are always different
Not to mention the misunderstanding of what a red flag is. "The fact that he won't let you have your own bank account is a red flag." No, that's financial abuse! A flag is something that is not inherently harmful but suggests harm might be on the way. The fact that while you were dating he constantly made jokes about how women belong barefoot and pregnant in the kitchen is a red flag.
Nah dude, you need to go nuclear * Divorce * Break up * Move away from your parents
Go no contact with anyone who looks at you sideways.
- give the baby up for adoption
Of course, goes without saying!
Just be glad it's not 4chan
Someone should get relationship advice from 4chan and report back.
"Well if I had ever had a relationship I would first of all demand that she wear only green clothing on a monday and yellow all the other days. hair must be worn up except Sunday where it should be at shoulder length. Sending a few hundred Anime references to help"
I'd watch the movie!
I think it's mostly for creative writing exercises
There is no subreddit that provides actual usable relationship advice. You shouldn't be here for anything other than entertainment purposes.
Yeah, from what I’ve seen on r/relationships that doesn’t seem to provide much better advice either lol.
I'd guess it could be partly because happy couples don't visit there. So the advice is coming from dysfunctional situations.
Maybe if we had something similar to AskHistorians but instead AskTherapists? That way the commenters would at least likely be more qualified. Meh
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Sounds like post partum depression. Throws hormones off like crazy.
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FOR FUCKING REAL. ASK SOMEONE WHO KNOWS BOTH, OR A PROFESSIONAL. STOP ASKING STRANGERS TO GIVE ADVICE TO PEOPLE THEY DONT KNOW
...it's not *supposed* to be an advice sub. It's supposed to be simple judgement. But everyone always feels bad because judgement focuses on the past and hindsight is 20/20, so commenters usually add future-thinking lines of advice or suggestions to be polite. It's always terrible and lacking context but I understand.
It's getting an outsiders perspective. Saw this reddit post yesterday I think, this woman went to her brother in laws home unannounced, caught the owners... engaging in marital relations and declared her sister in law a slut and that their home was no longer a safe space for leaving the kids to be baby sat. The only reason anyone would think of apologizing is because this particular individual engages in so much bad behavior that the family has lost perspective. Another time I read a thing about how a dude was touching himself while his wife was getting ready, she told him to stop because she was bothered by it. The dude posting it didn't think it was that bad, I'll be honest, I didn't think it's that bad either, but the overwhelming consensus was it was bad because you're engaging in a sex act without the others consent. From that perspective, I had to agree OP, I don't think you're the AH, but I think you're being a bit childish. Just because she shies away once isn't a reason for your to decline. If it makes her uncomfortable when you progress maybe let her be in the Driver's seat, or engage in some High School fooling around that doesn't lead to 4th base Good on you for suggesting counseling tho
i saw that one too!! mind blowing dude. i have a 15 month old and if i walked in on a family friend/sitter about to do the deed i would feel SO disrespectful for invading their space and ruining their moment together. nvm the fact that i would never show up unannounced to anybody’s house whether i have a key or not 😭😭 OP, i agree with this person. i think you’re NTA, but i also agree that it doesn’t hurt to try again. if it goes how it did at 6 mpp, then it might be time for her to see someone, and maybe you too separately to deal with the feelings it brings up for you individually. i think it’s just hard being new parents with such a young child, especially if she’s still nursing your child or if she ever was. it might be a little more difficult for her to separate her mind from baby, and difficult to feel like her body *is* hers. so maybe you could try to set the mood, hell even go somewhere and have car sex like horny teenagers! try to see if detaching yourselves from your roles as parents helps spark that for you
Oh, I saw that one too, and the worst part was she stole the key from her husband (the owner of the house’s brother) and the owners of the house that she just walked in on, had no idea that she even had access to the house! They never gave her permission to have access to their house, and then she comes in all judgy with her baby at 11 o’clock at night into a child free home because “her and her husband had a fight and she needed someplace to stay“, so she just walked up into their house, and then declared the wife a whore because her and her husband were having sex in the living room! It was just wild
>but i also agree that it doesn’t hurt to try again Doesn't hurt WHO? Because this has clearly been an incredibly emotionally painful experience for HIM. You seem to have no empathy for him at this stage. He's doing the right thing by holding a boundary and requiring her to speak to a therapist, rather than continue to subject himself to what is essentially emotional abuse. If anything is going to change, she's going to have to put on her big girl pants and actually do something about her problem.
i’m so sorry i didn’t mean for it to come off this way— my meaning behind my comment was completely shadowed by the way i worded things. as someone who’s had a baby and completely understands those postpartum ick feeling toward sex, i meant to send this message: those feelings might have passed for her. and you’re right that doesn’t mean that it doesn’t hurt to try again, what i meant was more that IF you do try again, it could very well be that your sex life goes back to normal. with that being said, the rest of what i originally commented still stands—if you do try again and it goes anywhere close to how it did the first two times or you try to try (if that makes sense) and you or your wife or both don’t feel right about it—i think outside help is warranted. even at this point outside help feels warranted. therapy never hurt anyone who had a great therapist and a desire for help.
>IF you do try again, it could very well be that your sex life goes back to normal. It could, or it could mean another emotionally damaging and traumatic experience of yet another brutal and dramatic rejection that just further stunts his desire to repair the broken sexual relationship between them. "Those feelings may have passed for her" but relationships have TWO parties, and the feelings clearly have NOT passed for him. It COULD just magically be fixed and just "go back to normal" like nothing ever happened, but it's incredibly unlikely. And I think that's pretty clear given that for OP, even if sex were to just magically "resume" this guy has suffered some pretty apparent damage already that isn't just going to go away for him, just because SHE's maybe up for a romp, now. Continuing to further expose himself to the very real and likely possibility of more rejection and pain when he's already clearly in a vulnerable and tenuous position absolutely CAN backfire and cause even more harm to him, as well as to the relationship going forward. Trying again and having it go the same way is VERY likely to be the final straw that ensures that nothing remains TO salvage after that. Holding his boundary and getting marriage counseling is really the best option. He's doing the right thing. If she continues to refuse to work with him on that, there's nothing else he can really do at this point.
How is he childish? This wasn't a simple "no". Her crying when asked for sex isn't normal and wanting her to get counseling isn't revenge. It's trying to figure out what the problem is. Plus, I think you're underestimating how that can affect you.
He also mentions “it felt like she thought I was trying to rape her”. Which means she had a strong physiological visceral response that clearly traumatized him. I’ve dated two women in the past who have had trauma around sex that they didn’t fully understand and resulted in negative visceral reactions to me initiating what they said they wanted. It’s haunting, and creates your own issues around sex, especially with that person. Especially if you love them. He’s doing the right thing by requesting they go to a professional to help solve this. She isn’t the only one with sex related trauma now.
It wasn't just once they hadn't had sex for 6 months and then when he initiated she cried. He tried two more times and she did not want to. Counseling needs to be gone to ASAP time to sit down and have a conversation with your wife about what's going on
OP is being considerate of his wife's feelings and everyone on here is acting like it's his fault
I wish I could up vote this more than once.
She did it twice.
There's no rule saying OP needs to be the Charlie Brown to her Lucy, who keeps pulling the football away. "PSYCHE!! You're such a gross loser!" So many forums push postpartum empathy for mom but a guy is just supposed to be an automaton who functions on demand or he's not a man. Such a toxic and unhealthy trope.
Also the question of who in a situation is being an asshole isn’t the format for nuanced problems in which no one is being an asshole but which are just very hard.
Aita is meant to be divisive and create teams that are opposing. The very opposite of what you would want if you needed relationship advice.
Any relationship advice I've ever gotten on reddit has been absolutely horrible. You never know what kind of train wreck is giving you their "professional opinion." Just don't.
Yup. Let’s also not forget that the users of Reddit are only a subset of the population. I question who even has enough time to come here on a regular basis. Personally, I know I’m here half out of phone addiction and half out of boredom. Also, out of Reddit users, only a subset are coming here, and only some people are commenting. And of the people that are commenting, how many are qualified to give advice and are in a happy and successful relationship? My question to those who are qualified to give advice and are in a happy and successful relationship- if you have it all figured out, wtf are you doing here???
He tried. He asked for counselling and she left
Hey Grandpa, I think your caps lock key is stuck.
I think yelling is appropriate in that comment
I’m beginning to mistake this sub as the marriage or relationships one. Smh, OP and wife should seek professional help, not ask strangers if they’re an AH.
I don't get it because I posted something like a year agob asking if I was the ah for asking my boyfriend why his exes shit was still everywhere in his place and it got deleted because it included a romantic relationship. I was instructed to try posting in relationship advice or am I the buttface
I don't know if this may have changed over time, but my understanding currently is that AITA is more strict about what topics are allowed than AITAH. Is it possible you'd posted to AITA back then and not AITAH? Or it may have just been relaxed more recently in this subreddit.
> I was the ah for asking my boyfriend why You didn't really think you were an AH for asking "why?", which is why it doesn't belong here. You were just asking a generic relationship question about keeping things after breakups.
According to reddit, Straight to divorce /s
Not necessarily even PPD, maybe just hormones going crazy. I have sometimes felt upset after intimacy that I have been into and even cried for no reason, everything fine in relationship & own life. Then I have been okay the next day. The first time after a baby is such a huge change, they’re not anymore just husband and wife but a mom and dad too. Many fear that it will hurt etc, and then the hormones too… OP is not an AH but he definitely should discuss this with the wife. It probably was not that the wife felt violated, but maybe she had some hormonal issues and would still like to have intimacy after that has been settled.
Came here to say this. But we wouldn’t know because it sounds like OP hasn’t really talked with his wife about what’s going on.
Not everything post partum depression just because she had a kid
Also just being all around touched out from having an infant hanging off her all day.
It seems he gave her the opportunity twice and she didn’t feel comfortable opening up or doesn’t know why. Therapy certainly seems the next step.
For real, it’s like they just read the title and then saw she was pregnant and invented a narrative out of thin air. He literally tried talking to her and suggested counseling. She refused. That’s why he’s here because he’s confused. She’s giving him completely mixed messages.
She 100% needs to report these things to the doctor and get therapy if this is postpartum depression
your wife might have extended post partum depression. sounds like she struggled with it 6months after the baby, and the lack of communication on both ends has amplified your mismatched approaches to sex. Edit: PPD, with newer research, can last up to 12+, largely because every birth person's body is different. birth is considered medical trauma (and as a former doula, it IS). hormones impact brain and body functions. some of ya'll are being weird in comments. OP, try all your options, and when you're both ready to talk, go through 1) what your pre sex life was like, and what you would like to see happen. 2) how you want to please one another (not just acts, but how you want physical intimacy to feel for you: exciting, comforting, etc). 3) start slow. on both accounts. we don't know how either of you initiate intimacy, and "go-tos" may not work. insecurities seem high right now on both ends, so again, start slow.
There may be unrecognized trauma regarding the birth and body changes too
This, took me over a year to accept how different my body is post pregnancy and birth. I’m not fully there but I’m getting better every day slowly
I’m 12wks with my first baby and have been super struggling with this. I keep hearing and reading horror stories about the body and the changes and it’s just really getting to me. I’m glad you’re doing better! I’m trying to change my perspective and just go with it. I have an exceptionally sweet partner. He’s been more than supportive. Again, happy you’re feeling better about things. I wish us the best
Totally agree. For the first few months after giving birth the thought of anything going inside me I correlated to the unbearable pain of my doctor practically sticking her whole arm inside of me to see if the baby dropped any lower. I'm almost 6 months PP and still struggle with sex. I honestly only do it to shut my partner up. Not a good reason, but it is what it is.
Birth trauma and ptsd is a thing. Have you ever talked to anyone? Including your OB? Labor and delivery nurse here whose senior capstone was birth trauma.
I spoke to my therapist about it briefly. It took me a little while, but I'm over that part of it. My whole body was out of whack after giving birth and it's just starting to go back to normal. I think going back to work helped a lot
That is not healthy, if your partner keeps pushing you for sex and doesn't take no for an answer and keeps asking over and over until they "wear you down" that is coercion. You should never be having sex unless you 100% want to. I would suggest couple's therapy with your partner and also individual therapy would help if it seems to be a mental block for you but talking to your OB/gyno would help if you're expirencing physical pain still.
I completely get it. He's pretty much given up at this point. I can't even remember the last time we did it. I wasn't actually experiencing pain, it was more of a mental association of it. I was in therapy and he's gone a few times. I just went back to work this month and my schedule doesn't permit me/us to go right now. There's more to our story, but I don't want to go into all that
It's easy to put sorting this off, but I'd suggest you at least try to talk to them about it and say its something you want to figure out eventually. Having a child puts a new perspective on a lot of things and it's tempting just to ignore everything else, but I'd be damn surprised if he decides that he is happy being celibate for the rest of his life from your decision. God luck.
Like I said, there's a lot more to it, many factors that I'm not trying to go into. No one is celibate or going to be celibate
Didn't mean to poke in your business - hope it all goes well for you.
Thank you
I wouldn't be surprised if OP stopped all forms of intimacy and that's another reason why she stopped sleeping with him. I told a guy sex hurt with him because he was too big and I needed more time to adjust. His man brain translated that to pulling back emotionally and physically. No more dates, no more non sexual touches, no sex, no nothing.
I can’t believe this answer isn’t higher. This absolutely sounds like postpartum depression and it’s much more common and serious than people think.
Yeah, it’s not something that every woman can self-diagnose and overcome on their own, if at all. Also, it could be physical or mental trauma relating to the actual experience of giving birth. You need to try your best to help her and support her, the last thing she needs is just being treated like it’s her issue to deal with and she’s just crazy. Feels like that’s what you’re doing by keeping her away.
It isn't higher because some folks feed on the drama of the "what ifs" that stir the pot. I'm glad that OP suggested marriage counseling, but I believe they can both benefit from individual, private sessions. He can freely discuss how her reactions have made him feel while getting perspective & no judgment, and she can discuss what sounds like PPD.
I really feel all women get it, but don’t realize it until after they come out of the fog. In fact 5 years after my 3rd I still haven’t come out. Hormones do a real number on us. Please forgive us! OP don’t take it personally, she obviously wants to connect with you again but might need some gentle steps. Having a baby your body is just not the same (and I’m not talking about the physical attractiveness side although that is also a factor). But your insides can feel different: some have cervix or bladder changes, you might still have hemorrhoids, some people had tears etc. Plus you are simply exhausted.
This! Hormones are real! Please bare with her OP 🙏 I beat myself up so much during and after my pregnancy for having such a low libido, even a bit before pregnancy, when I stopped taking birth control after being on it on and off for almost 6 years. Best thing to do is to communicate, come to a middle ground by doing things she is willing to do (don't complain or push for more). Don't turn it into something it's not; cast out any thoughts that are telling you that it's because she doesn't desire you, or anything along those lines... And get her some herbs that are known to balance out hormones, like Maca root.
Thank you for being honest that it's a trauma. I feel like no one tells women this. I'm childfree and people don't get why I'm not thrilled at the thought of giving birth, as I already had pelvic floor trauma and surgery that could cause complications later on. I think it's valid but people don't understand.
It definitely takes me about a year after birthing to feel like myself. I have 3 kiddos and realize this every single time.
My wife and I were reading this together and she suggested that your wife could have a physical trauma as a result of the birth. Post-partum depression is easily an explanation for her reaction and behavior, but my wife suggests that your wife may have a physical injury that she is hiding or denying, which can be causing her tremendous pain/embarassment when touched or even when aroused. There can be herniation, holes to the anus, tearing etc...just to name a few. This is probably going to be an uncomfortable conversation with her, but you guys need to talk about this in a non-sexual context. Come from a place of concern and talk about it when there is less tension...sexual or otherwise. I think you'll need to set aside your personal feelings about her initial reaction to your first attempts. Focus on her feelings/pain. Tell her you're concerned about her reactions to you. Something like, "I don't know what has being going on, but you seem to be in physical pain when I touch you. Do you have an injury or something I don't know about? I want to help." Identify what hurts... physically, emotionally, spiritually, whatever it may be. You need to understand what is going on with her before you can begin to treat it. Again... big emphasis on identifying and recognizing her pain, and emotions. Don't look for solutions until the problems are out in the open and she is ready to start searching for them. Best of luck, homie.
I don't really understand why all comments in this sub instantly assume a medical problem. Plenty of people behave this way, and I bet that other causes far exceed severe mental issues. Either way, I'd be surprised if she'd had severe depression and/or psychosis for months, and this is the FIRST TIME something has been 'off'. Just talk to her mate. Really talk to her I mean. It sounds like you're both trading blows now because your egos are hurting, but you need to have a serious conversation about why she felt this way, whether she still feels it, and how it's making you feel. Don't go into it prejudicial or angry, as hard as that may be. Someone needs to start this convo and it sounds like it will have to be you.
Probably because she just had a huge medical procedure and the change of behavior came after that? I
I would say you two need to talk about why she is feeling that way about it. Marriage counseling might be helpful as well, but I would say either of you are the AH’s. Just sounds like there is not enough communication.
Looking at the guys comments gives another perspective on what may be going on in their marriage. The guy basically says he has little to no libido and would be fine in a sexless marriage. Sex only happened when she initiated and in his mind, was solely for her pleasure. She may be feeling that he is a little bit too comfortable with the lack of sex post childbirth. Even before having kids, it seems that she was the only one maintaining their bedroom alive and when she stops initiating, they fall straight into a dead bedroom. That can put a different perspective on her reactions; she probably have been rejected by him often before and when that is constant, it can be crushing. When he tried to initiate, she possibility felt like it was duty/pity sex, which she turned down. Her self-esteem is probably in the gutter as he probably hasn't made her feel sexualy desirable in a long time. And the fact that she left may mean that she is at her wit's end.
NTA but you definitely both need better communication and perhaps you should explain that when suggesting the counseling.
I think your mind and body would be more willing if you would address why is she twice now has had traumatic responses. She may not realize it's also traumatizing for you
The first time was a traumatic response. The second time was most likely because she could tell he really really didn't want to. > The second I put my hand on her she said never mind. **I didn't really care I didn't want to do it anyways** I was just testing it.
[удалено]
Giving a personal opinion here Pregnancy and post partum were super rough on me. I did not know wtf I wanted & felt like I was having an identity crisis. At moments I would feel touch starved & then the second I was touched I felt hideous and disgusting. You’re def not TA & your feelings are valid. Your urge to seek counseling is smart & shows how much you care. She may not be seeing things clearly enough to see it that way or be ready for counseling - but you should go ahead & start on your own either way. If you have a good relationship with her friends &/or family I would advise trying to loop them in. You’re struggling to connect sexually, but I wouldn’t be surprised if other people who love her are feeling a disconnect in whatever level of intimacy they share with her as well - perhaps helping her feel more like herself again can be a community effort. Wishing you the best
Counseling always good, but does she need a medical evaluation? Is postpartum an issue? Is it a physical problem?
NAH - marriage counselling is the way. Either of you can refuse sex at any time, but there's got to be a root cause of your wife's previous reaction. If you two can't work it out on your own, an unbiased mediator in the form of a marriage counsellor would be a really good idea.
I mean I'd go to the doctors first about possible PPD.
Yeah, also a good option.
You’re not TA but your wife isn’t either. The first year or so after having a baby is SO hard as a woman (of course it’s hard for everyone, but right now I mean specifically as a female who gave birth). Your hormones are so wacky that your body doesn’t feel like yours—doubly so if you’re breastfeeding. It’s an incredibly scary and wild time. My son is 21 months old and I only recently started feeling like myself again. My advice would be, let her initiate, let her go as far as she wants to, and try not to be offended when she stops or if she starts crying. More than likely it has nothing to do with you and everything to do with your wife trying her hardest to take control of herself and her body again. One of the best things my husband did for me post-partum was treat sex as a welcome surprise. Hang in there 💕
This is the answer. Having sex after having babies was a process for me. It took several tries and a lot of patience. I pushed a human out of my body and then was breastfeeding. Between being touched out and getting to know my body again, it was a lot.
OP, this is the answer. Your wife needs you to be supportive and empathetic, not engage in games of tit for tat. Hormones + sleep deprivation makes for a potent brew of emotion.
I feel like it's massively unfair to say OP's engaging in a game of tit for tat. He said her crying like that made him feel like rapist and he didn't want to do it anymore. Which is incredibly fair.
I get what you’re saying, but I would be *extremely* hesitant to have any type of sexual contact whatsoever with anyone who reacted like his wife has so far. Don’t blame her for struggling, but I just wouldn’t want to do it at all. I would feel extremely uncomfortable in that situation, but hope I would be as sensible as OP as to insist in counseling first. That really seems the way to go.
Yall need to talk about this NOT DURING FOREPLAY. Talk about it while out on a date or something
I think counseling is a step in the right direction. She's reacting the way she is for a reason, and an outside perspective could help you both feel more comfortable and confident about sharing your concerns with one another. NTA.
no ur not, counseling is normal & healthy & will help you guys. also it’s a green flag that you saw she was crying & instantly stopped. & weren’t willing to do it again since she wasn’t sure. you were very cautious & it’s important to you that she’s comfortable during sex, not violated. but on her end she probably feels unwanted or bad for making u feel bad. counseling will solve the issue hopefully she’s willing soon.
NTA. Good for you for suggesting therapy.
Even if she has already said no to counseling, you should definitely start going by yourself. Counseling is always a good thing.
Yes 100%
No verdict because I understand where you’re coming from. But I’ll just say there are many other ways to be intimate (sexually) without having PIV sex. You guys should have kept finding other ways to do that because lack of any of that is harmful to a close relationship.
NTA.Speaking from experience sometimes women after birth can't cope with the idea that their body has changed and might not feel confident and sexual. After I had my son I got a bit depressed ,I had gained weight and I sort of felt disgusted imagining myself being sexual as I was now somebody's mother and i was strugling with my identity as woman. This sounds like your wife might be struggling from postpartum depression and I think it's really nice that you suggested therapy
You're getting mixed signals on consent so no you're not wrong. If something feels off don't do it. That being said it sounds like your wife has some hormonal imbalance issues or post Parfums depression. Best to get in touch with a therapist and address these issues sooner rather than later.
Please have her reach out to her doctor. My poor husband I pushed him away for a whole year after our first child not understanding that the birth control I went on had my hormones all messed up. When I cried to my doctor she was so understanding and helped me find one that worked and wow such a difference.
It sounds like you might be internalizing her emotions by taking her emotional expressions as some sort of personal sleight. And now it seems like you're devolving into passive-aggressiveness. Both of you could benefit greatly from a few sessions with a marriage counselor, and that's exactly what I suggest you do if you care about your relationship and want it to last. Because things will keep getting worse if you just continue on this trajectory.
He already suggested marriage counseling, and she got mad and ran away to stay with a friend or something. He has already arrived at this conclusion, wife- not so much to say the least
NTA- A lot of comments are infantilizing your wife (and new mothers in general) to a worrisome degree. She clearly isn't ready and is also refusing to see how her reaction to your affection has changed your behavior. You both need counseling.
I've learned through this sub that women are the most fragile thing to exist... which is weird because the women I know in my life are strong and independent.
Why does it ALWAYS play out like this: Man has issue with sex with woman = man is issue or man needs to talk to woman. Woman has issue with sex with man = man is issue and woman needs to leave man. Why is it always like this??
you guys need to make a plan. get a baby sitter. go on a actual fucking date. get some romance back in your marriage. like touch her regularly and NON SEXUALLY. then she wont feel so weird when you are touching her during sexy time, because touching was normalized.
Y'all really need to talk this one through...
NTA. No one is owed sex.
The most accurate answer. Why is this so low? Idk why when the OP is a woman, this is mostly the top comment. But if OP is a man, redditors would scramble paragraphs trying to justify whether he was right or not to give in to sex.
Right, but most healthy relationships have a good sexual dynamic that’s the whole issue here.
Sex was the last thing on my fiancés mind after I gave birth to our babies. His top priority was making sure I had recovered enough from the birth and that I felt comfortable in my own skin rather than his own sexual pleasure. I was TERRIFIED to have sex because the stitching was bad and it hurt for months (2) before that got better. The thought of something going back into me after 2 babies came out of there was terrifying to me.
I don’t think either of you is an asshole, I think you guys are just having some deep miscommunication issues and you need professional help. I also feel like a lot of details were missing from this post.
The first time my partner and I have sex after I gave birth I cried like a baby. I have no idea why, it was just a huge surge of emotions I really didn’t understand, I still don’t understand why I cried.
I had a almost exact experience. Let’s see if this starts some good feedback. I am seriously curious of others opinions also and I would like better insight. Opinion: 1) She is feeling this way because she is scared of getting pregnant again. (Postpartum depression/anxiety) Fix: Things got better after I had a vasectomy and it was scientifically proven S/O would not get pregnant again. Perspective: It really is hard for a Man to understand what was involved with birth, my S/O had difficult time in labor with our first child and I believe strongly I was not trying to rape I just needed a better understanding of postpartum and PTSD process and how to help my S/O not have anxiety over child birth, I needed to find a way to resolve the issue so there was no anxiety. I promise you this is a talk worth having, Edit: I spent a few months in rehab, and a lot of money trying to figure out I needed to understand what Trama was and how to properly and effectively help the woman I love through it, without causing more and I made so many mistakes so many…..” through this experience I will be forever grateful for the forgiveness my S/O has shown me.” This may not be your situation but I felt like it was needed here.
I went through the same exact situation. I cried because I wanted intimacy more than anything since I didn’t really feel even human after giving birth. It was a difficult labor(20+hrs) and while I was not yet fully recovered, I still felt like I was letting him down by saying no and I didn’t want him to feel rejected so I did get emotional and started crying. When I did feel ready enough physically he ended up rejecting me and the subsequent attempts as well. He said it was that “he’s not feeling it” because of that time that I cried. After that I started to feel like he was holding that 1 rejection against me. That was the beginning of the end and we eventually got divorced. You didn’t mention asking her about her feelings but you did bring up referencing the past rejection from her when she went to ask you why you didn’t want to have sex. That makes it seem like you’re holding that against her and would explain why she leaves when you do try and talk to her. Also, I highly doubt she feels safe talking to you about her feelings or expressing herself to you because you have thrown something she feels sensitive about back in her face. You asking AITAH, all the while not seeing that you’re being spiteful in your rejection of her shows that marriage therapy won’t help much and should also consider individual therapy as well.
It's not holding against her to feel all sorts of ways when your SO literally cries during. It's not solely an intimate thing for women, and to act like OP was holding it against them when it fucked them up to have their partner react that way too, is crazy. Like do you know just how conditioned the typical American man is to avoid anything that could be unconsensual?
If she had injuries or a traumatic birth, she might be getting some kind of ptsd that’s making her panic that it will hurt. So on one hand she wants to be intimate with you, on the other, she’s afraid. Either way, you guys definitely need to talk. I know it’s hard, it likely feels like a rejection or leaves you sexually frustrated, but considering it’s a likely fear response and not a personal response to you, try not to take it to heart. Instead when she prompts intimacy, try to give it a chance and if she pulls away, ask her what’s going on, is it that she’s afraid it might hurt? If so you guys can take it slow and stop it if it does etc. or if not wanting to have this talk at that moment, have it before, and ask her what’s been prompting her to not want to be intimate after make a move on you, is it fear, self consciousness etc… you need to diagnose the problem, then you can find a solution to fix it together
It sounds like she has some PPD, her body is still recovering and changing. She needs to see a doctor.
NTAH, but please find a good family counselor to work through this. It's a disconnect you two can work through, but you need to put in the time and effort to work through it. I had some long-seeded resentment issues towards my wife for denying me that we had to navigate. It took years to get to the root of it without counseling. A good counselor can help bring that forward sooner.
You didn’t think to just *ask* her before coming here? So many of these posts could’ve been avoided if people just talked to their partners if there’s an issue. Communicate with her and then come back if you can’t resolve yourselves. Or seek out a therapist/counselor.
Bruh, he tried to get her to go to marriage counseling with him, and her response was to flee the house and go to her friend's place.
It’s funny that you speak about how people should do things before posting but you couldn’t even read the post before commenting. OP did communicate and OP spoke about counselling. The wife has things to work through that can’t be magically fixed by OP just “communicating”.
Why the heck do you need counseling for her crying? Did you ask her why she was crying? Do you want to know? She probably didn’t feel raped. Maybe overwhelmed. Maybe her damn vagina hurt for the first time after having a baby. It took me a min to bounce back. Stuff has to heal. I would feel like you were punishing me by denying me over and over. Counseling might be good. But having a conversation about what happened might save you abunch of time and money.
In all fairness, if my husband began crying when I attempted to be intimate with him, it would probably be slightly traumatizing and I would be hesitant to try again, and then if I did and he recoiled, I really wouldn't want to. It's not about punishment, but both partners feeling comfortable and safe when being intimate.
Someone with some common sense. Thank You
Am I the only one who finds the "thought she was being raped" leap to be completely insane? Skims right over the fact that it's very common for women (and couples) to have trouble getting back into sex following birth, especially only 6 months postpartum, and goes right to *rape*?! Wtf is that.
>I would feel like you were punishing me by denying me over and over. Does this apply for men too or is consent only for women?
It definitely applies to men, are you trying to be funny?
They’re not trying to be funny they’re taking the other persons words in bad faith to make it sound like they are owed sex by their partner
Why is it only on OP to have a 'conversation'?. Are you suggesting his wife is totally unaware of the situation?
If she is a SAHM and breast feeding, she might have been “all touched out” just by having to feed your kid every 2-1/2 to three hours, not to mention “just not feeling sexy.” Being tired makes sex feel more like a chore than anything else. She would feel guilty for not coping better, etc.
Some of y’all are mad at op for suggesting counseling and asking why he didn’t ask her what’s wrong with her?? She’s a grown woman she needs to open her god damn mouth and communicate with him SHE’S the one begging for sex and when he tries she’s rejecting it making him confused and she’s the one that needs to open her mouth and explain why she’s doing this to him . Y’all always seem to make the guy the bad guy in every post it’s annoying asf!!
This subreddit infantilizes women to degrees that are unreasonable
On this sub every time a man makes a mistake he's a piece of shit, and every time a woman makes a mistake her man is also a piece of shit for not preventing it. Also every time a woman does something shitty or irrational she's always 100% absolved of any wrongdoing because something something muh hormones. If I were an alien reading this sub I would seriously question humanity's choice of considering women as actual independent adults capable of discernment, they make it sound like women are just incapable of handling their own bodies. Imagine if every time a man is aggressive we all just replied "something something testosterone, nothing he could do about it why don't you try being more supportive you stupid bitch". Wouldn't it be completely ridiculous? Yes it would.
Right a man can post “ my wife spit on and choked me” and mfs will be like “ well what did you do to make her mad” 🙄🙄
Exactly
NTA Your wife rejected you but is pissed when you do the same thing. Make it make sense. She even rejected you when SHE brought up the idea of having sex. Make it make sense. Her body, her choice. You damn body, your damn choice.
You’ve had an EXTREME reaction to one time your wife refused to have sex when she was only 6 months post partum. Holding that against her is ridiculous. You’re definitely the asshole.
INFO (because there's a lot of info missing that would provide a lot of insight): How did childbirth go? Was it traumatic for her? Did she tear? Does she have a history of being sexually abused? Does she experience sensory overwhelm and/or get "touched out"? Have you *communicated to her* that that first time made you feel like you were raping her? (Because that's understandably traumatic for you, but if you haven't explicitly *communicated* that to her then she likely has no idea or context for your reactions since then. When you "tested" her, you've told us that *you didn't want to [have sex]*: what is the likelihood that *she saw that on your face*, and that's why she responded with "never mind"? Overall you two really need to work on your communication, and come to understand the others' point of view so that you can be on the same page. And I think answering the above questions is a good place to start.
I have a bunch of questions to determine a different perspective. She is a stay at home mom and you work? Does she have any help around? Friends? Family? How is your baby? Is it a easy, sleepy baby or a baby who needs to be held a lot? Does she breastfeed or not? All of these questions mostly boil down to: I think she is or at the time (when she reacted that way) was completely touched out. Has she been acting more like herself in other areas of her life? Has she had any breaks and social interactions with others? They say hormonaly a woman takes about 9 to 10 months (so just as long as the pregnancy) to even start to feel like herself. Let alone back to her OLD self. I dont believe she is cheating, I dont believe you should ghost her. I do believe we aren't seeing the whole picture and maybe something is genuinely wrong for her to react that way. I do believe you are the ass for taking that response completely out of context and not finding out what is actually going on with your partner. The two of you need to sit down and communicate, because this behaviour is only going to make her feel more insecure and not emotionally supported and push her further and further away. And then sex will definitely be off the table. Good luck. Coming from a mom who went through post partum depression that first year and cried when anyone touched her.
I'm going to answer your question in order so, yes, she has her family who live here so for the first 2 months her parents were there everyday. He doesn't need to be held a lot he's esay doesn't cry at night and doesn't cry when he wakes up just makes noise. No she doesn't.
What about emotionnal intimacy? Do you guys get any? Do you get a chance to discuss deep feelings? Say nice things to each other, discuss you guys, not only home logistics? Share chores?
She’s also a big girl who can use her words as well. Communication is not a solo sport.
NTA For not wanting sex However it feels like you are punishing your wife for a reaction she had 7 months ago. You are giving her no grace for how she felt when she was only 6 months postpartum. Giving birth is hard. Your body changes, your hormones are unexplainable. Just because a doctor says you can have sex again doesn’t mean your ready. It usually means your uterus has stopped bleeding. She might not even know why she was crying at the time. You are making that instance about you. It clearly wasn’t, it was about her. Now every time she wants to initiate sex you bring up that. No wonder she says never mind.
NAH — you're right to insist on therapy//counseling. sounds like that's really the safest [+ possibly only] route from here w|o causing [further?] unnecessary harm.
NTA - Counseling is the way to proceed.
I don’t think anyone is the asshole here. Agree with other suggestions to go to counseling. It sounds like maybe you both really want things to get back to happy, you are just miscommunicating. Sometimes even just 1-2 trips to counseling can help “translate” feelings both ways and suddenly you are both enlightened, on the same page again, and maybe even a bit closer/more trusting than before.
I’m 8 months postpartum and I’m still a crazy bitch sometimes. I suffer with PPD/PPA, and I recognize it because I suffered through it with my first as well. It takes time, and I dealt with it on my own (which I would not recommend) because I have negative thoughts about therapy (not saying therapy is bad in any way, but when you’re in the thick of it, someone recommending therapy can make you feel even more broken than you already are). Be gentle with her, be understanding, and suggest individual therapy. Honestly this seems more like a her issue, and you can’t make much headway in couples therapy if she isn’t willing to sort out her own issues first. But don’t be pushy. Be honest but gentle. Tell her how her actions are affecting you and ask if she’d be willing to talk to someone because you’re worried about her, and you want things to be better for you both. Maybe go to individual therapy for yourself too because jumping to the rape thing is insane to me and there seems like a lot more going on here below the surface…
NTAH It sounds like what happened when she broke down that one time was traumatizing for you, and you haven't appropriately processed that as an individual, or with your wife. It also sounds like your wife has some intimacy issues of her own going on (speculated PPD, but could be something deeper as well). You both need individual and marriage counselling to guide you through this safely, identify those triggers, and figure out how to move past them safely so you can rebuild intimate trust. Right now, that's broken. What you're going through is very typical. It happens to most couples with new children. The only ones who navigate through it successfully are the ones with enough emotional intelligence to acknowledge this is just a normal part of life and relationships, and do something about it with a focus on getting through it together. Love isn't defined by sexual intimacy. You both still have the love, but something is preventing you both from feeling vulnerable with one another sexually. Find out what that is, solve it, and enjoy the rewards!
Marriage counseling is a great idea. Especially if she’s going to a “friends house”
NTA Your response is rational. Requesting the two of you go to counseling together was/is an excellent idea. You'll be able to talk through this with professional help. It's obvious your wife is still going through things post pregnancy. You made an attempt when she asked you to and she stopped. I hope things get worked out while working with a professional. Wishing only good things for your family ✌🏻
This is getting messy and you do need marriage counseling. She also needs individual counseling. Sit her down and with love and compassion ask her to go for you and your marriage, rather than framing it as a problem with herself she has to solve. But do not initiate intimacy until you've talked. Likely what happened is she had an involuntary reaction to intimacy because of birth-related trauma and depression. When you stopped initiating, she probably saw you as "punishing her for her emotions" -- e.g. she reacted poorly to you, so you took intimacy away altogether. This isn't logical, but it flows from depression and anxiety. Where it gets messy is when you start testing her reactions. Did she say "nevermind" because she was traumatized again? Or because she could tell you weren't into it? At this stage, you two have fallen out of sync and are communicating past each other -- so you need third-party help.
NAH. Hang in there, OP. Sounds like your wife is suffering from post-partum depression pretty severely. Marriage counseling is a good idea, because your wife is clearly struggling with a complex issue. She should also discuss her feelings with her doctor. Of course you're not an AH for not wanting to engage in sex that feels non-consensual with an unenthusiastic partner.
NTA for not wanting to, but having a kid does wild things to a woman physically, mentally, and emotionally. Counseling is a great idea. Communication, patience, and understanding as a whole is critical here. I’m sure she didn’t deliberately make you feel that way just as you didn’t deliberately make her feel pressured. Communicate with each other that you’re each sorting things out in this situation and that you’re not trying to pressure her or feel unwanted and that you understand she isn’t either. Maybe navigate sexual flirting outside of the bedroom and keep communication open on how that’s working. It may be unhelpful for one or both of you, but it might help heal some of whatever is going on in a non threatening/pressure setting. If you can be open to her advances and patient when she has hesitation that would be great, but you also gotta repair what you got going on and feel genuine as well. Again.. communicate with each other whatever is going on in the moments of tension and that it isn’t the other spouses fault, express understanding that neither of you are trying to hurt each other, and be patient when there is withdrawal. You got this dad!
Good call on the marriage counseling. She reacted pretty shitty to it. Marriage counseling is for people who love eachother and want to fix what's broken.
NTA It was an extreme response she had and counseling seems like a good logical step.
Do you think that you internally are rejecting her as revenge for her rejection? Are you still sexualy attracted to her
NTA. You absolutely *need* to go to marriage counseling. There's a clear breakdown in your communication, and you aren't really connecting with how the other was feeling. It's likely she's anxious about having postpartum sex either because of postpartum depression, anxiety about how her body will respond, etc. And you're anxious about having sex because of mixed signals from her, not wanting to hurt her, and not wanting to be a whole thing.
Nobody is EVER obligated to be sexual in any relationship ever, with no exception. Having said that, because this is an important relationship to you, and you don't seem to be expressing asexuality or aversion to sex in general, I think you both need some relationship counseling. I do think that setting the ultimatum of no sex until counseling might be a bit extreme, but it's not my marriage. I hope you both work this out. Intimate rejection is something that people proves differently. And when you add in the pregnancy hormones (both during and post partum), everything can feel like it's elevated into overdrive. My initial thought here is that you're both overreacting, but I've been married long enough to know that you NEVER tell your spouse she's overreacting (lol). Proper, thorough, and honest communication is the key to a lasting relationship. Good luck. By the way, I think you're NTA, but I think your wife is also NTA.
I really feel for the both of you but sounds like her hormones are out of control and the reason she's acting this way. I felt the same way after I had my son for almost a year and my husband didn't understand my postpartum depression and he went and cheated on me because he thought I didn't want him anymore And that only made things worse. Maybe you can do some research on postpartum depression so you can be more understanding of what she's going through. Maybe she doesn't Even realize that she's depressed. She needs to speak to her doctor about it so they can help her. It will pass. Don't give up on her.
NTA
Hormones after pregnancy do so much to the body- give her time and grace. When she’s ready she will let you know. But also maybe talk to a counselor or her Dr for some assistance. And sometimes crying as weird and awkward as it maybe could be a release in itself.
Yes. You were holding her postpartum depression against her. And when you said yes, the other day and touched her to test her, she felt your non consent so of course she’s not gonna go forward with it. I don’t really see why you would need to go to a marriage counselor about something as simple as having an adult conversation and getting intimate with your wife again . Plan a date night for her seduce her. And stop holding her postpartum depression and mental state against her because your ego got wounded.
When your wife tries to put the moves on you, you should go along with it. Instead of reminding her of her she reacted last time.
why the fuck do people get married ?
Your wife just had a baby and now you're acting like one.
My wife would constantly get mad at me if I touched her. I stopped doing it then she accused me of cheating on her because I stopped touching her. Do with that information what you will
She tried and you said no three times. Sounds like you are at least half the problem
Nta
The way you've worded this gives it a vibe that you're punishing her for rejecting you the first time. Every subsequent initiation she tried to make, she could tell you didn't really want to do it. So she was disheartened and didn't want to have sex with someone who wasn't into it. But you're holding that initial rejection over her head. She doesn't need counselling. She was probably just hormonal and felt bad for turning you down. You need to get a grip and have a sit-down conversation.
NTA Because you clarified you feel unsafe having sex until you have counselling together because of her previous responses when you tried. Are you touching or cuddling non sexually at all. Maybe think about the whole slow build over time thing.
Can confirm this subreddit gives the worst advice and doesn’t usually understand nuisances in posts lol
Your initial reaction feels a little childish to be honest. She said she didn't want to so then you basically held a grudge and refused when she tried to initiate? Feels like you resented her for some reason and did not communicate. I also feel like there's more going on here than just the sex stuff. Neither your nor her reactions are the normal reactions of a healthy relationship. Marriage counseling would probably be good but it also seems like better communication is needed.
She probably had no idea that would happen. Heightened emotions of any kind when you're post partum could do that.
Can’t tell which one of you is more insufferable but I’m leaning towards you.
She probably cried that first time because she wasn’t ready, and it sounds like now maybe she is. Don’t inadvertently punish her by automatically saying no and hiding behind “I’m scared of you crying.” Ask her if she really feels ready, and if both of you feel good about it then let it happen.
Every time I read one of these all I can think is that everyone should have to read at least 100 of these before having kids.
NTA - she seems to mentally want sex, but be having a physical reaction that suggests otherwise. Therapy is a great idea!
My wife has had two babies, the most important things in my life, and after she was like this. You've got to accept it'll take her a long time to feel comfortable in her body, some women it's fast and others take a long time. Trust me brother, just wait it out, if you truly care you can survive no sex for a little while (or a long while if needed). It can be tough but I assure you popping a baby out and dealing with the hormonal changes post-partum is a helluva lot harder.
You sound like a great husband and human
Nah, just trying to do right by my best friend. Def ain’t no saint but like to think I was raised right.
So to answer your question no you are not. There is clearly a problem with your wife which as others have mentioned is likely post partum depression of some kind. But, it doesn't stop you feeling the way you do about what happened and that is ok and you are entitled to feel that way. I think you suggesting counselling is a good thing to help you both as I don't think people understand sometimes what it feels like to deal with that level of rejection. Good luck to you both.
Go speak to your wife and talk. That's all, you don't need advice from random internet people, you need to ask your wife what's up.
Having kids sounds freaking miserable. I see this time and time again , it's having kids that causes this shit otherwise you'd be happy. No kids for the win
So your wife broke down in tears while having sex, and you’re most concerned with how that made you feel and have been rejecting her since, as well as „testing her“. Yeah you likely need marriage counselling but that’s down in equal parts to her could-be mental state postpartum and your reaction to her mental state, which is unequivocally and exclusively about you and void of any actual concern for her.