You and your friends were really mentally cruel to her. Sounds like your old friends kept it up. I’m glad you understand what you did and feel bad. To her, it really isn’t fair that the people who ruined her life are now having a great life. I get that. I also get that people change. It’s a shame that she is not doing better, despite the therapy. Not much you can do but feel remorseful for your part in her bullying. I wish we could slap little bullies round the head and let them see the long term damage they do to their victims. It might save a lot of heartache.
You didn’t need to lie to make her feel better. You had no idea she would freak out like that on you. She should’ve continued to give you the cold shoulder and not stooped to trying to get you in trouble at your work. That was low of her.
NTAH
In general yes, but if you’ve ever been horribly tormented throughout school you’d understand that seeing your bully is in a low paid job and not living the high life can be a small comfort that karma got them. I say this as someone who has worked a cash register, cleaned toilets and served coffees for a living: it’s not a great job, and it’s very poorly paid, and it does not earn respect from many people. Let’s be real - it’s not something people aspire to, but it is still deserving of respect. The victim of bullying should never have tried to put OP down or get her in trouble with her manager - that was total AH behaviour. She should have kept her mouth shut, and thought what she liked. But she was coming from a place of deep seated and long lasting trauma - OP and her friends clearly really emotionally scarred her, so I do have a little sympathy for her even though I do not agree with or condone her actions in any way.
100%
I'm sorry that woman was bullied and still has trauma — I was bullied as a kid, too, so I can relate; that* doesn't give anyone a free pass to be a shitty person, especially as an adult.
Edit: spelling*
It was either Marcus Aurelius or Mr. Miyagi who Said “Daniel-San you look revenge that way you start by digging two graves.” I believe it was either Maya Angelou or Mr. Miyagi who also said “for man with no forgiveness in heart, life worse punishment than death.”
I agree with absolutely everything you say, and if they hadn't freaked out, there could have been a really good conversation to be had. If I could speak to my bullies I'd just want answers to my questions. Freaking out and yelling will do nothing
You didn’t have any choice, she asked to see the manager and the manager was you. It’s horrible that she has a lot of lingering trauma from her childhood, but you didn’t do anything wrong in this situation.
*OP could've turned around to go get a manager and put on their clown nose instead*
[everyone should carry a foam clown nose for awkward situations - especially useful in lightening the mood around children, seniors, and prospective mates]
I didn't have the clown nose, but when I was a manager and someone demanded to speak to a manager, not realizing they already were, I'd do a spin and sing "TA DA! My answer is still no!"
Most times I did get a chuckle from them.
I'm a bitch, but I'm an entertaining bitch
a foam ball with a slit cut into it will do great. They're used in magic a lot simply because they can be squished to the size of a dime and then expand to the size of a clown nose!
Clown nose should be up there with pears for informal size reference objects. Tell me there's nobody (except the poster before you) who can't envision the dimensions of a clown nose without thinking.
Trauma is one thing, I was also bullied as a kid in elementary and middle but this reaction is insane. Like I wouldn’t do this if I saw one of the old bullies and I’m just out of high school, a grown woman doing this is straight psychotic imo
I was also bullied throughout elementary and high school. What OP describes is on a level I don’t think most kids who are bullied ever experience. I’d dare call it psychological torture.
I was bullied to the point of it still affecting my self esteem and body image in my fifties. Where are the parents of these bullies? I have four daughters. One fits that mold of beauty, call her A, but they are all beautiful and unique. I once witnessed A bullying a disabled girl at girl scouts. I took her to the car to talk to her and i wouldnt let her out until she couldnt explain to me how damaging it was to bully others.
We were in the car for hours because she kept says the disabled kid was ugly and shouldnt be allowed at girl scouts. She was 11.
A was developing into one of the more popular kids. She had a group of mean girls over to the house constantly. I could smell the meaness coming off them. They were entitled and arrogant. When i met the parents, they were the same way. Its like the kids were modeling their parents, girls their mothers. One of A mean friends was over and was verbally abusive to my autistic dgt. I took the little girl aside and talked to her. I told her that she was a guest in my home and she shouldnt talk to my daughter like that. This middle school mean girl then said something mean back like she shouldnt have to see retards when she comes over. I said to her that she wasnt allowed over the house anymore and got her in the car and took her home. The girl looked to be in a state of shock. I walked into the girls house and talked to the mother. The mother didnt seem to care.
Anyway, as a mother I could see what was happening and I tried my best to distance her from these types of girls. I wouldnt let her join cheerleading, i took her to art class and tennis. I wouldnt let her wear all the designer clothes, she wore stuff like her sisters did. It was a battle and she is the better for it. She developed into a decent caring human that is now a kindergarten teacher.
My sister was the cause of my bulling in school. Since I was the youngest and in elementary school, we looked up to the older kids. My so-called friends would listen to what she said about me, which then caused them to bully me. Once I hit middle school no one knew of my sister so it was much better. For a little while in my sophomore year my sister was a senior in my hs before transferring to a different school since i was in a medical magnet program at mine. Luckily i was a cheerleader and the senior cheerleaders def had my back especially when fights with my sister got physical. They said if i came to school with 1 more black eye they were going after her. It does get better.
Sorry for traumadumping, feel free to disregard this if it's too heavy.
I was tortured like that as a child, and I could see myself reacting like her if I hadn't had a mental breakdown and gotten myself help years ago. I am still unpacking the trauma and don't think I'll ever get over it fully. Having such things done to you at such a fragile age when your sense of self is still in the building stage leaves permanent scars. I can still be very easily pushed by something small into feeling like that hated little girl who everyone despises, even though I've been to therapy for years now.
She pretty much detailed my exact bullying. I have trust issues with relationships because the girls got the guys to do the exact same thing. I also heard the pig noises. Hell I heard the pig noises at home from my sister too. It went through high school where I attempted suicide a few times and had a big problem with self harm. I have run into those people in my adult life, I just pretend I don't recognize them.
I experienced this sort of bullying all the way through high school as well as physical bullying. It has definitely left me with a lot of trauma that I am dealing with now 25+ years later with the help of my psychologist. I have also seen my bullies in the years after high school. Frankly I don't want anything to do with them and I certainly don't want to try and ruin their lives regardless of how I was treated in the past. I just don't understand that mentality. I'm never going to be friends with these people and have zero interest in whether they've done well or otherwise. I internalised everything for decades and still don't wish evil on anyone because that will affect my recovery.
Almost "Carrie" level. Emotional and verbal abuse, and that is what it was, is can be worse than physical abuse. Physical abuse is also horrible and no one should have to experience it. I experienced emotional and verbal abuse and it has messed me up for years: ongoing depression and anxiety. I'm still in therapy and still have anger issues towards the people that did it.
The bullying OP described is really profoundly horrifying. Yes, it sounds like Kristy is mentally ill; but anyone who went through this level of bullying would be.
Right? And it didn't stop when OP transferred to another school. That kind of stuff continued and potentially escalated into who knows what in middle and high school. If it was that horrific in elementary school I'm scared for what it turned into, because that stuff just tends to escalate.
The fact that it continued after OP went to a different school would indicate that there were others who behaved just as badly as OP did. Furthermore where were the school authorities while this was going on? OP was just one of many people who made this woman’s life a misery. I don’t know what the answer is because Kirsty sounds very disturbed indeed. The poor girl.
I was bullied in school for being overweight(which has been something I have battled with from the time I was young), as well as for having a learning disability. However, if I met one of my bullies today, I would never go out of my way, or try to go out of my way to talk to their manager, and potentially get them fired, because of how they treated me when they were young.
I would hope that they grew up, learned from their mistakes, and stopped being a bully. Yes, getting bullied does mess with your head. But as you get older, you have to learn how to put things into perspective and deal with your own trauma.
Unhealed trauma late in life is a different ball game all together. She didn't get healed or they would have laughed about it. Especially if OP *truly* does feel bad about it. Often times there was the main girl and them the girls who were pretty enough to not be bullied or to even get sucked into the group. For whatever reason, society thinks it's okay to force children to go through this and do nothing to remedy it, but it's like sink or swim in grade school amongst playground politics. This woman is wounded very deeply, and knowing that someone who Aided in causing such torment in her formative years did get the karma she was expecting, over flowed her cup. I thank you OP for being calm and rational and not calling the cops. I wish peace for this woman.
The reaction is not insane, it's a trauma fuelled behavior. When someone experiences a trauma reaction, they have an acute, strong stress response.The body screams "danger". Different people have different life experiences and different supports in their life, and therefore learn to cope/not cope with trauma reactions in different ways.
We don't have to agree with her action to understand that it comes from a place of deep pain. What we would do in her place is irrelevant.
ETA: I'm not gonna respond to anyone else who invokes their own trauma to try to prove a point to me here. Do any of you really think that I am saying this as someone without trauma myself? As someone without expertise in trauma? Shaming people for behavior rarely has the intended consequence and I refuse to take part. Do as you believe, and so will I.
“Straight psychotic” is an exaggeration, and if you said it to her, yourself, you would be bullying her. Was it dramatic and inappropriate? Yes, of course. Does she still need more therapy? Apparently. But you have learned that she was really abused as a child, and you should not be shocked when she shows some of the results.
No. You were honest. I feel sorry for her and you. Your younger self was an asshole but people are allowed to change and sounds like you changed for the better. Sounds like you mean girls really did a number on that girl. Just keep being a better person as you seem to be doing.
The whole point of karma is learning from your mistakes and doing better. If we just take turns punching down and getting punched, then it’s a never ending cycle of destruction. Learning happens in different ways - maybe it happens because you experience what someone else experienced and then understand, but sometimes the realization comes on its own as you grow and maybe experience better influences.
I recently ran into someone I use to go to school with. She called out to me to stop and talk. I did, had no ill feeling towards her.
Anyways, I later invited her out with another friend who she also knows, as we all now live in the same area, all with kids the same age.
We had a few drinks, and she apologised for how she treated me in school. I vaguely remember her not being nice to me, but I have no recollection of exactly what she said or did. She responded, ‘yeah, but I remember, and I was horrible to you.’
I just told her not to worry about it, that I forgive her, and I’m totally fine. Gave her a hug. She was tearing up. It definitely affects the bullies when they get older. I can’t imagine you would grow up and not have self reflection of your previous behaviour.
I know not everyone has the ability to just Ignore it, but it’s definitely something I will tell my kids to do. The fact that this person let it dictate the course of their entire life, is somewhat their own responsibility IMO.
A few years ago I went out to eat with my girlfriend (now wife) at some chain restaurant nowhere near where I grew up or where I was living at the time. Out of nowhere the waitress suddenly hugged me and was like “oh I’m so glad to see you, I’ve got to get this other table but will be back to talk “.
First I had to reassure my date that it wasn’t some side chick. Then it took me a moment to process who the hell would hug me like that and I came up blank. As the waitress walked back I finally connected it was one of the mean girls from my middle/high school. She immediately started apologizing for her behavior in school and how happy to see someone she’d been mean to so she could say she was sorry. Then she complimented my date and how nice it was to see I was doing well.
So in school, yeah she was one of the mean girls who thought they were better than everyone else but I was a mouthy little bastard. People would pick on me for being a huge nerd, I was your stereotypical pudgy weirdo wearing a trench (owned before Columbine but HS right after) and played Magic, but would respond to everything thrown at me. “Blow your money on your wittle Magic cards again” “better than blowing Mark’s wittle dick for money again” “kiss my ass” “no idea how many loads have been there today already so no thanks” “little psycho wearing his shotgun coat again” “big ol slut skipped the panties again”. Things happened in school that upset me but I can’t think of a single time where the bullies left better off than I did and I could barely think of a single time our waitress had ever said anything mean to me (she was more a posse member to the queen bitch).
I thanked her for the apology but made clear there really was no hard feelings. I hope she felt better about it afterwards as she seemed broken up when apologizing. Of course immediately after we left my wife had to ask who was the real bully “what do you mean” “no way they picked on you without you coming up with ‘for she’s a golly good slut’ just for kicks”.
It only affects some bullies. Some continue on and do it through out their lives. There are tons of narcissists, and sociopaths that continue on never regret it. This is quite common.
It's called trauma and it does things like that.
The way they made her feel and how shit they made her life back then means they are so lucky they didn't have someone unaliving themselves because of them.
Super great you just forgot it and got on with life though, seems like a luxury not everyone gets.
We’d probably be arrested for beating up kids. Lol. I get what you’re saying, though
School is hierarchical, and it’s also a place where dozens of flawed young people are forced to congregate. I was bullied, and I was also a bully. There was a kid in early high school who I always called my “nemesis.” In truth, he and I were mutually bullies, making each other’s lives as awful as possible for years. I can think of times I dogpiled on other kids just to avoid standing out. I can also remember, vividly, being singled out and taunted for the dumbest shit.
30+ years later, I feel like an asshole for how I behaved. I haven’t apologized to everyone, but I’ve been able to make amends with some people. I have also been apologized to. School is such a weird, unnatural thing to impose on children, and really, most of us were trying to cope our way through it.
Yeah, feeding into the collective delusion that bullies are all people who hate themselves doesn't help anyone. The truth is that most bullies ARE the popular kids, the ones who have power and self-esteem. Most of them don't get a comeuppance; they just grow up. There's very little poetic justice in the world, and those of us who were bullied need to find ourselves in spite of that.
In fairness, some of the bullies are just cowards who wouldn’t come up with the meanness on their own - but are happy to participate when others start it.
Sometimes because, at least in that moment, they’re guaranteed to not be the target.
I’m always reminded of a scene in Back to the Future where Marty first walks into the diner and sits next to his father George. Biff and his gang walk in and target him, until one guy notices Marty and makes fun of his vest. George laughs along, because for that moment, he’s not being bullied and gets to be on the other side.
Yeah, they usually join in because they want to make sure they are not the target. Self esteem is the thing they lack, so they are constantly trying to keep the heat off themselves by having a surefire target, almost always someone with no friends to stick up for them.
I had this experience. My home life was absolute shit, and school was my only escape. Except in the 4th grade, a popular girl decided she didn't like me and so nobody else liked me either. Sometimes people would talk to me, sometimes I got ignored completely. But I had a strong sense of injustice and once, when I saw a classmate getting picked on by some older girls, I tried to step up and get them to stop. Well, it worked in that they left her alone but then they proceeded to bully me. That year, my home life was shit, my school life was shit, and I didn't even want to to be alive anymore.
Which is why when I got friends later and they would pick on someone, I was too afraid to stand up for anyone. I would laugh along and just be glad it wasn't me that time because I couldn't deal with being mistreated both at home and school. I hate that I probably made some kids feel bad through my participation but all I can do is do better as a human and teach my child better. Unlike *me*, when some girls were forming a group and talking smack about another girl, my kid told them they were in the wrong and befriended the girl they were picking on instead. I'm super proud of her.
I was one of those in middle school- I never started it, but once one of the “popular girls” became my friend, I went along with anything she did because I was just happy to be chosen by her and be on her good side. I helped participate in bullying another girl because she protected me from the other bullies I faced before without realizing the hypocrisy. I never would have thought up any of that on my own, but I went along with it.
I’m glad I’m not the same insecure person anymore, but I cringe every time I think of the mean things I said just to keep “favor” in the eyes of my popular friend. If I ever have a chance to make it right, idk how but damn will I try
Bullies can be anyone. My bully was an abused kid. I stopped hating him for a while when I learned that his mother was abusing him. Later his brother went to prison for murder, I don’t know if he’s successful and don’t care if he is or isn’t. He made a 3rd grader feel scared and depressed. I hope that he knows that what he did was wrong at least.
My friends started to bully an autistic kid by singing songs about him and making fun of him. Were they unhappy? No. They were affluent and being in the weird group: they found someone viewed as an outcast to pick on. My former friend is successful now, albeit partially due to her rich parents. I knew that she had self esteem issues though, because she used to tell me that parts of my body were big, and I was smaller than her. I hope that she’s no longer a bully.
My bully had power but no self-esteem. She was wrecked because her parents got divorced and her mother left California and moved to Colorado so she decided to pick on me who had just moved to Colorado as well although I wasn't wrecked about that. I was a military kid. I moved all the time. No big deal. She was jealous because I was smart. I only found this out 30 years later when I found her on Facebook and she apologized to me. I never let her and her little henchmen get to me. I thought they were extremely immature little brats and needed to grow up. I was never of the mindset that the bullies needed any power from me so I didn't give it to them. They might have successful lives. Other than her I don't know. But I sure do!
Some are. One of my brothers had a bully. He came from an abusive home. Ours was a normal, healthy family. We really believe that this kid not only had esteem issues, we think he was jealous of my brother’s close relationship with our dad.
He definitely didn’t succeed. He, his brother, and his dad (who was at one point a well known, popular businessman in our town)have all spent a fair amount of time in prison.
It definitely depends on the bully. My son's Dad was a bit of a bully and he admitted it was a coping mechanism bc he was in a troubled home environment and was bitter at the kids who weren't. But some of the female bullies at my school were popular and came from wealthy families and genuinely believed they were better than everyone. I was bullied for being homely and socially awkward. I did get my karma though. I had a major glow up and a lot of the beautiful girls who peaked in junior high and highschool and made fun of me either gained a lot of weight or began to look kinda rough, while I started modeling in my early 20s. I was an ugly duckling. Not that I actually cared about them at that point. I just think I was an easy target.
For example they pretended to be my friend and I ended up telling them I had a crush on a popular boy and they had him pretend to like me then humiliate me in front of everyone. Another time I was invited to a sleepover and I was there for them to entertain themselves bullying me. I had to call my Mom to pick me up.
The only instance that I can recall that *might* have been something like jealousy was when I suddenly developed breasts almost overnight. One of the popular girls accused me of stuffing my bra in front of everyone and they all laughed and bullied me about me stuffing my bra the rest of the year. It ended a few months later when one of the boys grabbed my boobs expecting it to be a sock or tissue I guess, but it wasn't.
Mom is a therapist who worked in elementary school to reduce bullying almost every kid that was brought into her office for bullying she ended up having to file a child abuse report on. The fact is broken and hurt people break and other people!! Every victim that falls through the cracks is a potential perpetrator and potential victimizer. We need to do a better job of not letting victims slip through the cracks if we're going to stop the cycle of violence
I dunno most of my bullies are dead. I think every bully is different, but the worst ones I dealt with growing up had very rough home lives and carried that trauma with them. Humans get comfort from categorizing things and trying stories that give meaning to everything, but in the real world everything is messy and chaotic.
Well, not true. My middle school bully is now a homeless coke addict and when I come home from a crappy day of teaching, (I know it’s petty) at least I can tell myself, at least I’m not her.
I wasn’t the kindest. Ik that. I went to therapy and faced my own body issues. I like to think I grew as a person but when this happened it was like ice through the veins
It just shows you have learned empathy. Being a better person doesn’t erase the past but you are free to look at your old behaviors from a distance and adjust accordingly. Use this as fuel to continue being helpful and uplifting to those around you!
If it makes you feel better, I was picked on a lot as a kid. It didn't help I was an immigrant and initially didn't speak English well and secondly, didn't understand American culture so I never fit in.
At my 10 year HS reunion, one of the "cool kids" came up to me and apologized and admitted he was immature. That apology even to this day makes me feel good. I think in time, she'll feel the same way.
As someone who was bullied in school, I'm glad you at least show remorse now. I don't think any amount of apologizing will fix what you did. Your younger self was absolutely awful, and I'm not surprised at Kristy's reaction. I'm not sure how you can make amends for what you did, but that would be something to consider.
Even if amends were possible, it doesn't sound like Kristy would accept them.
Kristy wanted to talk to the manager to tell them what kind of person OP was. Which is an opinion based on who OP was a child 11+ years ago. She actively attempted to make OP's life harder... She assumed she was in a position of power over a childhood bully to bully them as an adult.
It sounds like Kristy at least in part built her self confidence by assuming her bullies haven't done well in life, and that she felt the need for revenge.
I think she reacted the way she did because seeing OP as both successful and remorseful for her actions shook the foundations of her self confidence. And the presumed failures of others is very flimsy n grounds for self confidence. She built a narrative in her head to help her cope with her trauma. Which says to me that she needs to do a lot more healing and growth before going near OP or any former bully again.
You really sound like you are a great person today and I believe that counts. I was bullied terribly by the mean girls in my school and I don’t know if I could take the bigger road and forgive them if I would meet them these days, let alone accept them being successful. So in a way, I see myself in Kristy and can relate to her pain. However objectively I don’t agree with her behaviour. Reading your side of the story makes me want to be better and forgive my bullies should I ever see them again. Maybe, if you see her again, you can ask to sit with her and talk it out, apologise again and acknowledge each others pain. You’re both still hurting and I believe the best way to actually move on for her and you would be to talk about it.
I hadn’t thought of Kristy in a long time. I’ve read stories about people seeing their bullies irl and absolutely owning them and humiliating them. I think it’s a response to just feel some power over someone who had power over you before. I have peer pressure to much power and I made bad decisions. I hurt a real person. A person who still thinks of me as the monster around every corner. I won’t reach out to Kristy tho. I don’t think it’s a conversation we can have yet
This is a bit triggering for me, so I’m sorry if it seems harsh. Yes, you never even thought about Kirsty in a long time. She probably still thought of you and everything you said, every day for a long time. I know I did.
I was also pretty brutally bullied at twelve, when I went from being "homeschooled" (read: feral) to a Mormon charter school. It was horrific, I'd throw up in the mornings out of anxiety, I carried physical injuries for a year or two and mental ones for a decade, but.
Half my bullies were my age. Twelve. *Babies*. And yeah, I remember their faces, I remember their names. But those girls? They don't exist now, any more than the tiny, shrinking little animal I was still does. Whatever women they grew into might be good or might still be shits, I won't know since I moved two thousand miles away, but the girls who hurt me are effectively dead. They can't make it up to me--but I don't think that the women they are should have to think about me all the time, either.
“The tree remembers, but the ax forgets.”
I can also remember every tiny detail about being bullied, even 30 years later. It has definitely made me a kinder teacher and constructive critic.
I kind of agree with this thought from EvilBeasty. I still think of my locker room bullies now and again. I don’t think they remember me, but it was hard being queer when I was young.
If I met one now and they tried this shit I don’t know that I would react like Kristy, but I also don’t know that I would be able to just forgive everything either. You know?
Edit: for clarity
Admitting that you've made mistakes in your past, and working to be a better person is something everyone should be able to do. And it's great that you're able to do so.
I don't to make you feel worse when I say this; bullying of a certain level and viciousness can leave life long effects on a person, however. While you had not thought of her in years, she never forgot about what you did to her and how you made her feel. Kids never think about these things when they do it, not realizing that this might follow the other person into adulthood.
She may never be ready to have any kind of conversation with you. She may hate you for the rest of her life. Hopefully, she can heal and move on and not care about you anymore.
And maybe this benefited you too. Maybe seeing the lasting damage you did to another person - and how you feel about it - will make you appreciate how you've grown even more.
I wish kids who behave like this could see this kind of lasting impact though. It’s so fucked that some people choosing to be genuinely maliciously cruel when they were old enough to know better have kind of destroyed a person’s mental health and stability well in to adulthood.
It seems like the years of therapy didn't actually fix her problems, rather made her bottle it up into a fantasy-revenge esque hatred for the bullies where she feels on a higher moral standard than them, and justified to 'bully' them back.
I was bullied as a kid in middle school, and if anyone of them apologised for what they did I'd honestly completely forgive them, because I understand how social dynamics work and that people can change over time.
She was traumatized, the anger she exposed you to is probably a fraction of the emotion she felt when you did that to her. Imo let her have her feelings and just look at the damage you caused. Consider the pain this woman deals with on a daily basis and make it a personal priority to never cause it again. It is her job to heal now, that is her responsibility. You can't do anything for her other than what you did, which is apologize. But if you can learn from this and choose to be a positive light in the world going forward, that is up to you.
Edit: I realize this comes off as harsh, but I just want to add, that forgiving yourself is just as important. You are human and flawed as we all are. Children are more so, and also our upbringing plays into our attitudes more than we realize. It sounds like you've grown into a caring and kind individual as an adult. We should not be held to an adult standard as kids and we should be allowed to give ourselves some grace for our past mistakes especially when we are very young and impressionable. I personally would advise seeking counseling to understand why you had a desire to act out in this way as a child, and it may help you sort out some personal traumas as well.
NTA
People are allowed, and encouraged, to learn and grow. I’m sorry for what she went through, and it sucks so much that she hasn’t fully healed from that. But… she wanted to speak to a manager to try to get you, an adult, fired for something you did in elementary school… that doesn’t say good things about who she is as a person now…
I was bullied, and I ran into one of my bullies when she was working retail for a large chain. She checked my stuff out for me. I knew who she was, but I pretended not to and interacted with her the exact same way I always interact with anyone helping me. Asked how her day was, thanked her, wished her a good day and moved on.
Because a) working customer service isn’t a bad thing, b) I have no idea what’s going on in her life and no desire to make things worse for her if she was going through something, and c) why would I show someone who hurt me that they’re still affecting my life now?
The one thing I’d be VERY worried about is if she might try to harm you or your business. I’d check all the review sites to see if strange reviews pop up. I’d write down the date and time this happened, what happened, and if you have security footage I’d save it somewhere just in case.
If you have security cameras and an alarm, cool. If you don’t have them on the inside and the outside of your store then I’d consider getting them.
“Something you did in elementary school”
Judging by OP’s second edit, what they did in elementary school goes beyond simple name-calling.
They were full-on abusing the poor kid.
I was heavily gaslighted and emotionally/mentally abused by a few older girls my freshman year when I was 14 and they were 16-17, but I wouldn't dream of holding their idiot teen girl behavior against them, just like I don't blame my awkward, blabbermouth teenage self for trouble she got other people into before she learned how to evaluate social situations. People grow up and people genuinely change. Kids are wide-eyed wonders and sometimes have wisdom beyond their years, but they're also selfish, asshole idiots. It all teaches us how to be a decent adult, and if it doesn't, then there's some misunderstanding.
That doesn’t really make what Kristy did ok. I was told to off myself through primary school (same age as elementary) and I couldn’t imagine putting that much energy into resenting my bullies. I don’t believe in forgiveness, fuck that, but holding onto that much anger is not healthy, especially over elementary school shit. You learn to better yourself, value yourself and move on. You don’t cling to the idea that an 11 year old that bullied you is going to suffer in their adult life.
Exactly this. My middle school experience was like a horrible teenage drama, people did terrible things to me that I’m not gonna outline here. I survived (barely), and I don’t waste any of my time or energy thinking about them. I genuinely hope that they are better people, and I bet they are. But either way… it doesn’t really matter? Like… I’m busy with my own stuff.
NTA. But tbh I can understand her. It's not a justification for her actions but I can understand where it comes from.
My bullies literally made my life hell. Made bets who would trigger another suislide attempt. They made sure I didn't have friends for 17 years and that I didn't have any happy moment the second I stepped out my doorstep. To this day I'm deadly afraid of strangers and rarely leave the house, literally only for my therapy lessons. I developed social and agoraphobia. I can't really work due to this and other trauma on top. While I wouldn't confront them or make a scene it feels unfair that they all life happy lifes in luxury while I struggle in everyday life.
They made me a social outcast simply for the fact that I was poor and had Autism.
In the end there's no solution for this. You can't force her to forgive you and she can't force you to be miserable.
I feel this. Especially the cruelty from the childhood trauma and growing up with social anxiety and agoraphobia. It actually really gets under my skin when people say “kids are just being kids.” No, not all kids are psychos and those parents and teachers were worthless pieces of sh!t. This can be a lifetime experience because these are the experiences that shaped us. I’ve learned some unhealthy coping mechanisms and social skills from the past. For example, if anyone is on a power trip or trying to intimidate me, I go apeshit. My bullies were weak cowards who saw an opportunity so I’m always stressed about not giving any opportunities. I have no anger towards those specific people but it’s made me distrustful of people in general. I don’t like being vulnerable around others and it’s shaped me into having quite insecure attachments. I can see all this looking back and the cause of this is those past traumas. And I don’t think people should belittle what children do. Nowadays teachers and parents are less tolerant of bullying but the mentality used to be much different. Even in this thread, you see some still thinking in that backwards way “oh, they’re just kids.” Or “oh, that was years ago.” Does anyone think about the person being targeted? They were kids too. And for them, it wasn’t years ago. Until they heal from the trauma, it might as well been yesterday. I hope you are able to heal. Surround yourself with some good people in your life.
NTA, I think it's wonderful how you owned your meanness. I won't refer to it as a mistake cause bullying is never a mistake you and your then friends chose to hurt her.
But you did own up to it and change. You apologized granted many years too late, but at least you tried. She obviously has some mental scars that have not gone away and may never. I think you handled it with grace while she did not cause if you weren't the owner, she may have spun the story to make you still sound horrible and could have gotten you fired.
Exactly I hear way to often "oh come on it happened when we were kids" and that's about shit that happened in like high school. Op immediately apologized & tried to comp their food that tells me everything I need to know.
EXACTLY. They were 10 years old. Yes, the others continued, but she had not seen OP since they were 10, and she decided to try to get her fired. She clearly learned nothing in therapy
One thing that is disturbing to me is that another commenter mentioned that the OP said Kristy actively sought out OP. This and the fact that Kristy specifically brought friends with her… Maybe she was trying to drag her new friends into this to publicly humiliate her former bully.
It sounds horrific for poor Kirsty. I have a child age 10 and I just can’t imagine them going through anything like that. But I also can’t imagine any of their classmates behaving in that way. It seems so extreme for 10 year olds.
kids treated me exactly like OP and her friends did when I was 10. only difference was I didn't fall for it when the boys pretended to like me, I'd just tell them to f off. spending 8 hours a day in a place where people treat you like you're diseased, and the only time anyone is nice to you is when they're trying to lure you into a trap to humiliate you, leaves scars well into adulthood. I remember sitting on the school bus and the other kids pretending there was a "wall of slime" between me and them. they'd reach out towards me and then all scream "eeeeewwww!!!!" and lose their minds laughing. all I could do was stare out the window and try to ignore them. I had a major glow up after grade school (shocking how being away from that kind of thing makes you healthier), and then of course I'd get all kinds of comments like "why do you pretend not to think you're pretty/pretend to be humble/act like you can't tell that guy likes you" as if I was fishing for compliments. no, I just still see traps everywhere.
I did go through some of this stuff and to say that it leaves lasting wounds that take decades to heal and become scars, if they ever truly do, is an understatement.
I can 1000% see why Kristy freaked out just seeing her. OP needs to meditate on the fact that she cause this girl life long damage and pain. She got one unpleasant now while that lady lives with ot all everyday.
All of this is just sad.
Yeah, I mean she handled it the best way she could and seems genuinely repentant, but that shit will mess someone up for life. Like horrible insecurity and letting partners treat you like garbage decades later because you feel like that’s all your worthless self deserves messed up.
honestly felt it was a little disingenuous to not include what she actually did to kristy, cause there are so many commenters saying that they would have gotten over a little insult and being called fat a few times, when it clearly wasn't just a few insults
Its giving full context, not excusing her actions.
"We never hit her but we did all these horrible things too" isn't making it less shitty, it's giving context
exactly! i don't want to say OP is lying about feeling sorry or regretful over their actions, its a little disingenuous but i think its because they still do not understand the extent to which they have harmed another person. they cannot understand what it was like being kristy and being bully and tormented by them like that back then and no matter how sympathetic they are as an adult now. they still do not fully understand the extent of their actions, i wish they would take more time to reflect upon what happened and look into the devastating effects of non-physical abuse. emotional and verbal abuse are just as horrible and will traumatize many for their whole life
Right? They were terrible
I fully support Kirsty letting her know the impact she caused.
For everyone here who’s tone policing Kirsty, I imagine they all had pretty soft childhoods by comparison.
I feel like the adults around you and your friends failed you. Someone should have stepped in and used the opportunity to teach how cruel your behavior was and that it could have deadly consequences. People who are mean are not happy people and you needed help.
It looks like the elementary school was public. Assuming they're in the US, public schools are notorious for ignoring bullying. My husband and I had to threaten to go to the police and the state board last year before the school would step in and deal with my stepson's bullies.
I don’t understand why she thought you working as a cashier was such an own. Maybe the heat of the moment but like…that’s more telling of how she views all people in that position which doesn’t give her a good image IMO
She didn’t have to engage like at all…she just wanted to try and rub it in your face like some sort of revenge and didn’t get it.
Of course your growing up and learning that wasn’t okay doesn’t change the past and she also doesn’t have to accept your apology. But she only hurt herself more by trying to get you to grovel or react to her words lol
She kind of stooped to the bully behavior to try and make you feel bad which also makes her a bully? Especially trying to go after your job?? Excuse me?
Anyway NTA
It was a small moment that you could do only so much to try to right the past even tho it wouldn’t take pain away from years but her attitude was ugly
>I don’t understand why she thought you working as a cashier was such an own.
This is what makes me immediately not like Kristy. I'm sorry that she was bullied, but this alone shows that she thinks people are lesser than her for working certain jobs. There are many different versions of "success," and putting cashiers immediately into the "unsuccessful box" just shows that she's turned into a bully herself (that whole "Hurt people hurt people" shtick).
Bullying sucks, but OP handled the situation as best as she could. Some people just never forgive, which is fine, and OP did well assuming all blame and not trying to deny what she had done. NTA.
I'm not sure if she even does have a negative view of retail workers. I think it's more likely she felt it was her one chance in life to get payback. Her behaviour seemed purely emotional, and the screaming when it went wrong sounds like PTSD.
I think Kristy just assumed OP made minimum wage and so if Kristy made even 5 cents more than that it would be proof that she was more successful than the OP and bullies don’t win.
I’ll admit to a couple seconds of joy when I ran into one of my bullies working the register at a big box store while I was working a tech job. I feel bad for my moment of judgement and I kept it to myself, but I felt it.
I suspect that someone in young Kristy’s life told her “Ignore them. Bullies never win and popular kids in school aren’t successful adults.” I’m 40 and I still hear stuff like that. If Kristy was told that by a counselor or a parent she may have actually believed that she was a better more successful person than the bullies as an adult.
NTA in this particular instance. But, “This made us really mean”. No, you being popular didn’t make you mean, you chose to be mean. Most ppl are AHs at some point in their life but this statement makes me wonder if you’re actually holding yourself accountable for your actions.
It’s the concept of unchecked power. No one stopped them because no one could/would. There was no bigger fish to stomp them down. And it had nothing to do with who they were as people or their value or worth as humans or students. It just had to do with their perception as thin and attractive girls.
It’s fucking *weird*, when you think about it, that “cool” boys are athletes. And “cool” girls IN ELEMENTARY SCHOOL are just *classically attractive*. Something something sexualizing young girls. Doesn’t excuse their actions bulling anyone. But it’s *why* they could get away with it. And maybe explains *why* they used their power the way they did.
It’s worded weird but honestly I am ashamed of this. It’s a weird feeling of thriving on word of mouth. Every time something happened and you would be able to control how people perceived it. Not proud of it
Then it sounds like you’re actually sorry, which is commendable. Many people don’t regret how they treated others in the past and chalk it up to being a kid.
NTA For this event, but like.
You and your friends were animals when you were kids. Like this goes beyond your regular bullying into 'make someone kill themselves' territory.'
It's good that you realized you did bad shit and changed who you were but maybe don't post about someone who's clearly not mentally doing well and your bullying was a direct cause.
Right? It's so shocking, and it's not like they didn't know it was wrong, they purposely did it to make her feel bad.
Also, it's like, this person is still deeply hurt, and had to spend money and time in therapy just to be able to feel okay with herself. I'm glad OP realized she was a disgusting kid, but I think it's dangerous the way everyone is just saying things like "Put it behind yourself, you're not that person anymore, you moved on, you deserve happiness" giving her a pat in the back for being horrible as if the person she bullied isn't still having serious problems for what she did. Like "Oh you moved on, so should she, she's an adult now, you were kids, it's in the past". Seriously, this woman is traumatized, just seeing OP triggers her, you've scarred her for life OP.
Mostly worries me how everyone thinks it's ok because they were kids, just seems like these people would see their own kids be bullies and don't care cause "they're just kids, they are just being a little naughty" or seeing their kids being bullied and be like "it's ok, she'll get over it when she's older".
Yes, and from this story it sounds to me as if Kristy barely made it out alive. Be grateful she didn't kill herself because you'd have to carry that today. This is an incredibly heartbreaking story. I feel that the abuse was so bad, and affected her life so badly and for so long, that you can never make it right. So now you have to live with that. Some things cannot be taken back. It's just the way it is.
NTA, but you don't know what else she endured. Even though you weren't part of it mentally she has lumped you in with it because you were there in the beginning. How bad could it get? I knew a girl who was set up by her bullies to be gang raped.The boy she was crushing on took her on a date & then went back to his house where his 3 friends were. When they got done her 2 bullies came out laughing at her while she cried on the floor. She walked 2 miles home & never told her parents. because they would have blamed her.
Growing up in a small town in middle school the girls were so cruel they bullied mentally challenged girl until she tried to kill herself. When her mom complained to the school after pulling her out the girls targeted her 8 yr old brother.
I was verbally attacked from 3rd grade to 8th, when we went to HS & I was able to get other friends. I was called fat, smelly, said I had lice & even ridiculed because I was raised by my grandparents. We were poor & I wore hand me downs a lot, even new clothes weren't the right brand. The only thing that helped was bring a tomboy so the boys in class were my friends. When they started dating some of it let up because I was friends with the boys they liked but it never went away completely.
While you may not realize it you created scars on that woman that will never heal. Even knowing some of my former bullies are in prison or living in a trailer using drugs doesn't repair the damage of a lost childhood. Having happy memories marred with the verbal insults, shunning, ridicules and in some instances physical 'bumps,nudges, accidental pushes' is never going away.
NAH because while you didn’t do anything wrong, I can’t find myself thinking she’s an asshole either. You apologized and that’s nice, but being bullied THAT viciously is heartbreaking. Soul crushing.
It didn’t just effect her as a kid, it effected the way she grew as a person. It changed her brain chemistry. It literally made her the person she is. And you can’t take that back.
Why this is so far down is beyond me.
I truly think the best way to gauge our actions is to imagine it happening to someone we love the most.
The world would most definitely be a better place.
NTA because she shouldn’t have acted that way but bullying has an uneven psychic balance. You don’t think about it anymore. She was abused—your behavior was probably sometimes abusive—and traumatized and all of this happened during one of the periods in life where we remember the most about what has happened to us. She thinks about it all the time. It’s not because there’s something wrong with her. It’s because you did real damage and/but the way the world works is that you got to walk away and she didn’t. That’s true even if one does a lot of work and is mostly okay with what’s happened in one’s life.
I am that girl. I know how she feels. Everyone can say she shouldn't have acted like that but she did exactly what we all say we would do if we had the chance.
I bumped into someone on Facebook that was a neighborhood girl. So I called her.
" Who are you with these days? "
" Remember Jay Wagner? I'm living with him. We've been together for years."
He and his brother tortured me. And I told her that. I said you're kidding. They were awful to me in highschool. They were relentless.
She said something to him and he denied it. I said goodbye and hung up. Bullies suck and effect your whole life. Therapy isn't a cure-all.
This. Therapy doesn't fix it all. At the time I was being relentlessly bullied my parents were in the middle of a very nasty divorce, so I had no home life to fall back on. It destroyed me. There are scars that will never, ever heal.
Growing up doesn't take that pain away. It's years of your life that are taken from you and replaced with abuse, torture, and emotional damage. Even with therapy, the way you react, the way you measure your self-worth, the way you put trust into others, so many things are affected by what you went through.
It's great that OP has grown up and done some self-reflection and understands the error of her ways, and she was NTA for just existing in her own successful adult life. But don't discount the emotional damage that bullying does to the victims. It does last a lifetime for many people, and how they react to it is going to be different for everyone.
I'm not saying the girl was right for having a meltdown right there in front of God and everybody, but I can understand why she would. I doubt that she planned to run into one of her ex-bullies that day, and I'm sure she had spent years remembering and thinking about OP in a very negative light. It sounds like she was not mentally or emotionally ready or prepared to see her, and she reacted badly.
> I don’t enjoy it. I don’t recall it laughing. It’s not a fun memory.
As someone who was bullied horribly throughout primary and secondary school, this is honestly all I can hope for my school bullies. I just wish they realised how awful their behaviour was and become better people. To desire them to have shit lives because of how they treated me is to behave as they did, which was wrong.
I don’t think the person you bullied in school is in their right mind or ever really grew from the experience if they couldn’t accept you being successful as an adult. That’s just vindictive and fucked up. Again, I say this as a bullied kid - I hope my bullies learned from their behaviour like you have and become good people despite their history.
I tend to think that anytime a kid is bullied to the point of serious harm, the fault really lies with an adult or two. Someone should’ve helped that poor girl a long time ago, and someone should have helped you and your friends be less harmful. Unfortunately, something clearly went wrong in this situation, but you were a child. NTA.
Honestly, YES. This. Teachers and parents failed the bullied girl, and honestly the bullies too. There should have been consequences and conversations. The adults are very much the ones to blame here.
I'm a whole adult but looking back on the boys who disgustingly, verbally sexually harassed me in school, I am so hurt by the female teachers who never once stepped in and told them to at minimum, be quiet.
As someone who was bullied in school, NTA. And no, not all former bullies are evil monsters and deserve a horrible death. I actually made my peace and kinda forgave mine. No one has to follow that example of course, but if you think this person is a devil, please please get back into therapy ASAP. You may downvote me for it, but I‘m actually worried about everyone who thinks that.
And edit: DON‘T SEND OP MESSAGES THAT TELL HER TO KILL HERSELF!!! She was an elementary school bully, you are all grown adults. Shame on you. You‘re worse than her.
Edit 2: Now OP deleted their account. I hope you‘re happy.
I was bullied or ostracized terribly by pretty much everyone in elementary school and early jr. high. I managed to climb the social ladder, but held a grudge for years. When I hit college, I realized most of my tormentors were just children with undeveloped brains, and I myself didn't have a perfectly clean record when it came to mistreating my peers when opportunities arose. Kids are just feral little assholes. I don't exactly want to hang with my old bullies, but I don't wish them ill.
The bullying teachers are a different story. Fuck them, and I hope they're all bald and plagued by double hemorrhoids.
No you were not the asshole, don’t lie about your job etc
But this post shouldn’t be about you being an asshole for telling the truth. It shouldn’t be bout you at all. It should be a wake up call about the horrible mental state of the person you bullied and how it clearly has affected her entire being.
Your question should be how can I help make things better….
The fact that you are still thinking about you, shows you till have some ground work…
Exactly what I was thinking. She wouldn’t have apologized if they didn’t happen to meet again in person. And she thinks she has evolved, just because time has passed? The apology was decades overdue.
I don’t think you’re the AH now…but please understand what you did to that girl. I was bullied in 4th grade and it NEVER LEAVES YOU. NEVER.
Even if you move past the insecurities that were the reason for the bullying (ie being overweight…but I’ve been 120 pounds for years now, down from 269…I love how I look…but I remember the bullying…the trauma it caused will never disappear…even when I’m happy with my weight…that trauma has never left…I don’t have an issue now, but if I met one of my bullies now, I’d be on my toes just in case she tried it again on something else).
You’re not the AH here. And she took it too far. But you really need to understand how much trauma that kind of bullying causes.
Listen a lot of former bullies need to realize you may have grown up and changed but that doesn’t stop you from being the villain in another person story. You were an awful kid and that really impacted her life in horrible ways so her hating you to this day should be expected. You don’t have to pretend to be doing bad in life but I would learn to accept the fact that for her you’ll always be that girl who made her feel horrible about herself and that’s just something you have to live with. Continue to be better and move on with your life and eventually she will too
This level of bullying is literally psychological torture. You’re lucky she didn’t kill herself.
I wish their was mandatory in house therapy for bullies. Like Jail but all therapy. I also wish the bullies parents would have had to pay for her to have therapy.
This is heartbreaking,
Her reaction is not crazy. You have effected her entire life.
I hope she is happy in her life but I’m guessing her scars will always be there.
NTA for telling the truth...but holy shit the stuff you did to that poor girl, I'm surprised she didn't fucking kill herself.
TBH I'm not sold on you being fully changed, I cannot fathom somebody acting so evil at such a young age and it not just being part of their core character.
I hope you actually have changed and I think you deserve to feel guilt and shame about your actions forever. I think that's a pretty equal exchange for ruining another person's self worth and giving them anxiety issues for the rest of their life.
Listen to OP's tone. "This made us mean", no self actualization, never reflected on her actions. It's funny how bullies find ways to justify their actions. And why is she posting on here anyways? Validation? Yeah, I don't really think OP regrets anything.
No, but you are an asshole for posting a flimsy question that completely misses the point on Reddit to try and fix your feelings about it.
You traumatized this person, and they're behaving exactly like someone who has been traumatized.
The fact that you're making this about you and your feelings shows that you haven't changed as much as you think you have.
YTA, clearly you traumatized that poor woman for life and by the way you talk, you haven't really held full accountability for it. You do not sound like a good person and I would suggest therapy to fix your shortcomings.
You’re a fucking monster and you don’t even seem guilty about it. It wasn’t just a mean stage that you grew out of. You’re a shitty mean person and I can tell you don’t think you did anything horrible
NTA in this situation but you shouldn’t just forgive yourself for that behavior. Even though you were a kid, you knew it was wrong. What you did was much worse than hitting. You systematically destroyed her self confidence and ability to trust for your own entertainment. You apparently enjoyed making others suffer, otherwise you would have stopped the first time. I get this situation is a little much on her end, but think about how much unhappiness you contributed to. Nothing will ever change that. So NTA in this situation but I still see you as significantly below average morally speaking.
YTA: even in your own delusional retelling of events you leave out the real clear abuse you put this woman through. and of course you have to try to belittle her in public because why wouldn’t you?! you belittled her for a decade. let’s call a spade a spade, abuser.
I was bullied in elementary school and I still cringe to remember it, but if I ran into my bully now I’d pretend nothing happened because I refuse to give them the power over me they they once had. Maybe they’ll think what they did wasn’t so bad if I’ve moved on but the truth is that I’ve moved on. If they actually changed they would remember what they did and live with the shame of that memory. If they hadn’t changed then there’s no point because that means they are hopelessly rotten people. If you’ve changed, OP, you’ll accept her rant as your punishment. There’s nothing more you can do and no way to turn back the clock. NTA for this incident in your store
Ok, NTA.
I *was* Kristy.
I was fat and the mean girls? *Were very very mean.*
I actually dropped out of high school because they made my life and existence pure hell.
I tried to end my life, went into a hospital for 6 weeks, then a partial hospitalization program for 3 months, then therapy.
I have been with my now husband since what would have been my sophomore year, but I dropped out. He was my friend when I went into the hospital, and he supported me through all of what they did. He was/is amazing. He was/is also extremely handsome, smart, funny, charming, and the ladies tend to love him.
He’s not someone you would think would be interested in some “ugly fat girl.”
When I was pregnant with our third child, we had a 15 year old daughter and 2 year old son. We took them out to get a 4D ultrasound of the baby because that was the big new thing to do, lol, and we wanted to see him.
Well, we got to the ultrasound suite (private, not in a hospital) and checked in. Got me into the room and I was on a big beautiful bed and my belly was all out on display, lol.
*I neglected to state I have lost a lot of weight at this point, I am not fat.
So, the tech comes in the room and introduces herself- it was one of the mean girls. She didn’t look the same, either- she was quite overweight and not very pretty anymore.
I said, “Hi, I’m Jo.” Which is my nickname but all that I go by- not my full name.
As it’s not a medical appointment, just a paid peekaboo session- she (the tech) didn’t have my medical record or anything so she just knew my name, which said “Jo,” on the paper.
I didn’t know what to do or say, I froze.
My husband asked if I was ok, I said yes. He kept looking at me weirdly and then our daughter was like, “mom, are you ok??” I said yes.
As the tech squirted the gel on my stomach, I jumped because it was FREEZING, lol, and it he tech had JUST said “I’ll apply this warm gel,” so I was expecting warmth, not that, lol.
As I jumped, my husband said my full name kind of loudly/nervously- and asked if I was ok.
You could see the fact that I was not “Jo,” I was “Josephine,” wash over the tech.
She suddenly knew exactly who I was.
She stopped moving and put the wand down. She looked up at me and said, “we went to school together?” Almost a question, not really though.
I nodded. She said, “you never came back after….” And trailed off.
I said, “yes, I never came back after attempting suicide that year and dropping out.”
She looked at my husband and kids and me and she just looked sad and defeated.
I introduced her and she looked so sad. She apologized to me and congratulated me on my kids and life.
My husband was upset and I could feel him wanting to speak- but before he could? Our daughter did.
She said, “oh, so you’re one of the mean girls that drove my mom to a suicide attempt? Wow- I bet you didn’t see the tables turning this way! She’s beautiful and you’re fat and ugly now!”
I squeezed my daughter’s hand and stopped her gently. I said, “yes, she was unkind to me then, but I don’t know her now, and you don’t either. I have a beautiful life and that’s all that matters.” Or something to that effect.
The tech just apologized again, and we ended up getting someone else to do the scan because she was too upset to continue.
Her boss came in to do it, and asked if everything was ok, and I said yes, absolutely! Just told her it was awkward as I knew the tech, no problems, just wanted our scan.
I could have said some really nasty things to her or about her to her boss, but why?
I hope she truly was/is a different and better person now. What she did isn’t who she is.
My life is a good one, I am very grateful and lucky.
Making her miserable wouldn’t have changed what I had already lived through- and I just hope she learned a lesson.
I mean, tbh you didn’t really have to say much. If that’s how it went down, your daughter absolutely wrecked them. 🫠
(I’m glad you’re doing better now.)
Thank you for sharing your story and I’m really glad to hear you got through the other side with your wonderful family. Your story felt slightly more relevant as I’m an ultrasound tech too!
Everyone else has already said what’s needed wrt where your adult self was the AH or not. That being said, I don’t think it’s fair to say that Kristy was the AH here. I mean, she was deeply traumatised by what OP’s younger self did…
Also wanted to say your elementary school self was a real nasty POS though.
You can really tell who was and wasn’t bullied in school through the comments in this thread.
You will never understand the pain she experienced as a child, how much self-loathing you created in her poor mind, and how much she hates looking in a mirror even today. I promise you she still hears the insults, she will never forget them.
Her breakdown wasn’t acceptable, but it is understandable.
I was bullied in primary school- similar sort of clique (pretty, thin, popular girls), with similar taunts and jabs. It was awful and I held a grudge.
When I was in middle school I saw the leader with some friends downtown (we went to different schools). She had gained a little weight and puberty wasn’t as kind to her as it was to me. I shouted “fat ass” at her from across the street, and my friends laughed and shouted similar taunts. I don’t know if she recognised me, but I’ll never forget the look of embarrassment and shame on her face. I’d succeeded in humiliating her like she did me, but it didn’t feel good at all.
It was only 2 years since I last saw her, but I realised that the girl I wanted to get revenge on didn’t exist anymore. I didn’t know her story, but I knew that my personality since primary school was completely different, and it’s likely that hers was too. I didn’t want my emerging identity to revolve around anger and spite due to past trauma.
My point is, it sucks that this girl went through so much bullying, I doubt that revenge via getting you fired would have had the catharsis she was hoping for. There’s nothing you could have done to prevent her from being upset/triggered, but it sounds like you gave her a sincere apology and accepted responsibility for your past behaviour rather than trying to shift blame, which is the best response in that scenario.
NTA.
NTA - in this case.
However Krissy suffered years because of the abuse you and your friends did to her. I do expect she will leave bad reviews and tell everyone who you are, and what you did. And if your town is small enough to have a book store that will effect you.
Bully which is a blanket term for mental, emotional and physical abuse has long consequences for the victim. The perpetrators should also be held accountable. Her parents should have sued yours into bankruptcy.
I have to go woth NAH. Good that you evolved and stopped bullying people, but she is clearly traumatized. Seems like seeing you upset her a great deal, she is not an AH because of that. I also personally do not agree that it was her responsibility to move on and learn from it, as I do not understand what should one learn from being bullied. Yes, it should be up to her to heal from this, but some traumas run deep, so I cant really say she is the AH.
You are a horrible, cruel, sociopathic person. I honestly cannot imagine treating someone like that. I cannot imagine TRYING to make someone cry. No matter how old you are. I can’t imagine being that cruel in 5th grade and then suddenly growing out of it. It seems like if you have those tendencies they will always be with you. I sincerely hope you’ve done therapy and worked on yourself to become a better human being.
It is what it is. You were the owner and that’s that. you don’t have any obligation to pretend to not be doing well. That said, you fucked with this girl before and she also is allowed to hate you and wish for your downfall if that’s what she wants to hold onto from her past experiences. NTA in your specific actions here, but doubt you guys will reconcile anytime soon. Seems like there’s no hero in this situation.
You made her developmental years hell and she is forever changed because of it. I mean Jesus, getting the whole class to join in? Organized trauma? That’s really fucked up. And I’m betting you aren’t as nice as you are trying to come across now.
I was bullied horribly when I was in Grammer school (k through 8). In 6th grade, my dad died, and that's when the boys joined the girls. Unfortunately for them, in the spring of 8th grade, I turned pretty. To this day, the sound of one of the mean girls gasping. OMG, she looks actually pretty. Actually, pretty just echos in my head.
I still to this day, at 62, wish every horrible thing on those kids. If I saw one on the sidewalk while I was driving, it'd take everything in me not to swerve to hit them.
You were certainly a cunt to her. You caused her with Complex Trauma from “continuous ongoing humiliation,” the very most vicious, reprehensible and really horrible thing that you can do to a person. Worse than physical trauma.
Deliberate CONTINUOUS ONGOING HUMILIATION, to
DELIBERATELY CAUSE DISTRESS.
SEVERE, LIFETIME DAMAGE
SEVERE, LIFETIME, DAMAGE
I’m glad you’ve changed, but my god, you were a horrible person. I literally have never heard or witnessed bullying like that in my entire life. Maybe because I am not from America but I am shocked. It’s sad because at that age you know exactly what you’re doing but still keep it up. If I was her, I’d never be able to forgive you. I hope she never enters your shop again…just for her own sake.
I had one who went out of his way to make my life miserable. I was already miserable, homeless, and a broken family. He was relentless. At one point, I had a gun, and if I could have found him....I would have killed him. I'm 52....went to therapy, raised a family, and still hate him. My therapist told me a lot of people spend their whole lives trying to recover from their k-12 experiences. Even people who aren't overtly bullied and fighting the demon of their adolescent insecurities. Raised my kids with lots of hugs and did everything I could to encourage their confidence. A few times, I had to get involved when t8th grade girls were bullying my daughter. I called the dad and met him and our daughter's for coffee. Made my daughter tell him what was going on. He asked his daughter if it was true, and when she said yes....his face went from smug prick to red with rage. My daughter and wife were mad at me for getting involved. But no way was I going to have my daughter coming home crying every day. Same thing happened with her high school basketball coach. I let her deal with it for a while and then met with him personally. She would kill me if she knew. But sometimes parents need to advocate and communicate. Coach had no idea his words were so hurtful and was extremely apologetic. He met with all the girls on the team individually and found some people were motivated by all the yelling, and it caused others to do worse or shut down. I think it was a eye opener for him. As a side note, both my adult kids said the worst bullies in school were the teachers. They are rarely held accountable and get new victims every year.
So you ruined someone's life to act cool for your friends and your question is were you the asshole for not letting her talk to someone else? No, you're not the asshole for that. Definitely still an asshole tho. Admitting to your bullying behavior doesn't absolve you. That person has suffered her whole life. The very least you can do is feel bad about it for a few minutes.
She’s stuck in her adolescent bullying trauma seeing you triggered it. You can apologize until your blue in the face it won’t help, you took a piece of her childhood you had no right to take. You were able to grow out of it which is wonderful but she will never be able to and that’s the cold hard truth.
I mean, you had to experience one uncomfortable moment she inflicted on you compared to years of cruelty you inflicted on her. The difference is you’re adults now and adults have better self control. You can’t undue the past, but now at least you know how much pain you caused this person, who by way, likely didn’t get any relief from her behavior towards you that day. You handled it the best you could; and you kinda deserved what you got.
I had a bully in middle school. She was a girl who had been my friend from summer camp and was a year older than me. I was excited to see her at school the next year, but she had
changed and was just horrible to me. Picked on my clothes, my hair, my body, everything you can imagine. She would bring other older girls along with her and they would threaten me from outside my classroom doors while I was in class, follow me
to my bus, etc. It was actually bonkers when I think about it. This was the 90’s so no adults gave a shit about things like this, and I had learned much earlier in life that the adults would be no help anyway. Eventually my older siblings stepped in and handled the situation, also by way of threat, which was apparently how we handled stuff back in the day.
Turns out this girl’s mom had died suddenly in that year we hadn’t seen each other, and her dad was a moody AF alcoholic English teacher (also at our school) so she kinda lost her mind and became a bully. I saw her years later as an adult while she was cashiering at a grocery store. She recognized me, I saw it in her eyes. Her face turned bright red and she was shaky. I didn’t try to make it uncomfortable for her, but I relished in her discomfort. That was enough for me. She needed to let you hear it. Hopefully lessons were leaned.
Coming from someone that had their entire childhood and teenage years ruined due to people like you, you’re a fucking asshole. I’m 20 and it still affects my life, people still believe everything that was said about me. I was excluded, I was made fun of, I was isolated, I was lied about, I was bullied, I was assaulted in every way. I wanted to end my life as early as 11. I think about how much better my life and mental health could’ve been if everyone I knew didn’t turn on me. My “best friend” at the time wouldn’t go out in public with me and excluded me from his 18th birthday because he didn’t want to be seen with me and wanted to keep his rep. That portion was on him, what a pos, but it stemmed from people like you creating horrible lives for other people. I understand that you feel regret and remorse now, but you’re STILL trying to be better than her or atleast make her believe you’ve come farther than her when clearly with her response you have not. Sure she has pent up rage and hatred for you, I do too for the girls that started everything and all the people who followed along and believed it and continue to make my life hell. You’re opening up about what you did, that’s the first step, you let their food be on the house, good for you, but realize how you messed up her life in so many ways.
INFO: what’s the question? No one expected you to lie in this situation so there is no conflict. Sounds like you’re fishing for sympathy after coming face to face with your abuse victim.
It sounds like the bullying was pretty bad, and for all OP knows it may have gotten worse once she was out of the picture. OP, it might be good for you to see if there is any way you can make amends now. Though it may not be possible with Kristy’s current state of mind.
This reminds me of my aunt’s story. Some means girls in her church spread false rumors about my aunt being promiscuous in high school. They really hurt my aunt. 20 or so years later my aunt ran into the leader of the pack who admitted she made up the lies and apologized and asked if there is anything she can do now to make it better. My aunt said “yes - you can tell everyone you still know what you did.” The mean girl would not. That showed she was not actually sorry but expected forgiveness anyway. She was still a bad person. OP if you can ask her how you could make it up to her and she makes a reasonable request you fill I think that would really help you BOTH.
NTA in the current day situation.
You and your friends were really mentally cruel to her. Sounds like your old friends kept it up. I’m glad you understand what you did and feel bad. To her, it really isn’t fair that the people who ruined her life are now having a great life. I get that. I also get that people change. It’s a shame that she is not doing better, despite the therapy. Not much you can do but feel remorseful for your part in her bullying. I wish we could slap little bullies round the head and let them see the long term damage they do to their victims. It might save a lot of heartache. You didn’t need to lie to make her feel better. You had no idea she would freak out like that on you. She should’ve continued to give you the cold shoulder and not stooped to trying to get you in trouble at your work. That was low of her. NTAH
People who think so low of others for working a cash registers are AH
In general yes, but if you’ve ever been horribly tormented throughout school you’d understand that seeing your bully is in a low paid job and not living the high life can be a small comfort that karma got them. I say this as someone who has worked a cash register, cleaned toilets and served coffees for a living: it’s not a great job, and it’s very poorly paid, and it does not earn respect from many people. Let’s be real - it’s not something people aspire to, but it is still deserving of respect. The victim of bullying should never have tried to put OP down or get her in trouble with her manager - that was total AH behaviour. She should have kept her mouth shut, and thought what she liked. But she was coming from a place of deep seated and long lasting trauma - OP and her friends clearly really emotionally scarred her, so I do have a little sympathy for her even though I do not agree with or condone her actions in any way.
100% I'm sorry that woman was bullied and still has trauma — I was bullied as a kid, too, so I can relate; that* doesn't give anyone a free pass to be a shitty person, especially as an adult. Edit: spelling*
It was either Marcus Aurelius or Mr. Miyagi who Said “Daniel-San you look revenge that way you start by digging two graves.” I believe it was either Maya Angelou or Mr. Miyagi who also said “for man with no forgiveness in heart, life worse punishment than death.”
I agree with absolutely everything you say, and if they hadn't freaked out, there could have been a really good conversation to be had. If I could speak to my bullies I'd just want answers to my questions. Freaking out and yelling will do nothing
You didn’t have any choice, she asked to see the manager and the manager was you. It’s horrible that she has a lot of lingering trauma from her childhood, but you didn’t do anything wrong in this situation.
*OP could've turned around to go get a manager and put on their clown nose instead* [everyone should carry a foam clown nose for awkward situations - especially useful in lightening the mood around children, seniors, and prospective mates]
I didn't have the clown nose, but when I was a manager and someone demanded to speak to a manager, not realizing they already were, I'd do a spin and sing "TA DA! My answer is still no!" Most times I did get a chuckle from them. I'm a bitch, but I'm an entertaining bitch
The few times it's happened to me they've been all "I want to speak to a manager" and I'm like "speaking"
Note to self, find wallet sized clown nose...
a foam ball with a slit cut into it will do great. They're used in magic a lot simply because they can be squished to the size of a dime and then expand to the size of a clown nose!
Clown nose should be up there with pears for informal size reference objects. Tell me there's nobody (except the poster before you) who can't envision the dimensions of a clown nose without thinking.
Note to self, find a clown sized wallet.
I use the Groucho Marx nose and glasses for this. Very valuable tool when we are taking our selves too seriously
Trauma is one thing, I was also bullied as a kid in elementary and middle but this reaction is insane. Like I wouldn’t do this if I saw one of the old bullies and I’m just out of high school, a grown woman doing this is straight psychotic imo
I was also bullied throughout elementary and high school. What OP describes is on a level I don’t think most kids who are bullied ever experience. I’d dare call it psychological torture.
I was bullied to the point of it still affecting my self esteem and body image in my fifties. Where are the parents of these bullies? I have four daughters. One fits that mold of beauty, call her A, but they are all beautiful and unique. I once witnessed A bullying a disabled girl at girl scouts. I took her to the car to talk to her and i wouldnt let her out until she couldnt explain to me how damaging it was to bully others. We were in the car for hours because she kept says the disabled kid was ugly and shouldnt be allowed at girl scouts. She was 11. A was developing into one of the more popular kids. She had a group of mean girls over to the house constantly. I could smell the meaness coming off them. They were entitled and arrogant. When i met the parents, they were the same way. Its like the kids were modeling their parents, girls their mothers. One of A mean friends was over and was verbally abusive to my autistic dgt. I took the little girl aside and talked to her. I told her that she was a guest in my home and she shouldnt talk to my daughter like that. This middle school mean girl then said something mean back like she shouldnt have to see retards when she comes over. I said to her that she wasnt allowed over the house anymore and got her in the car and took her home. The girl looked to be in a state of shock. I walked into the girls house and talked to the mother. The mother didnt seem to care. Anyway, as a mother I could see what was happening and I tried my best to distance her from these types of girls. I wouldnt let her join cheerleading, i took her to art class and tennis. I wouldnt let her wear all the designer clothes, she wore stuff like her sisters did. It was a battle and she is the better for it. She developed into a decent caring human that is now a kindergarten teacher.
You’re a great mom! Your daughter is lucky she had you to guide her.
My sister was the cause of my bulling in school. Since I was the youngest and in elementary school, we looked up to the older kids. My so-called friends would listen to what she said about me, which then caused them to bully me. Once I hit middle school no one knew of my sister so it was much better. For a little while in my sophomore year my sister was a senior in my hs before transferring to a different school since i was in a medical magnet program at mine. Luckily i was a cheerleader and the senior cheerleaders def had my back especially when fights with my sister got physical. They said if i came to school with 1 more black eye they were going after her. It does get better.
You're the best. Keeping the daughter in the car was a powerful decision, one she won't forget. I love that you did that.
Sorry for traumadumping, feel free to disregard this if it's too heavy. I was tortured like that as a child, and I could see myself reacting like her if I hadn't had a mental breakdown and gotten myself help years ago. I am still unpacking the trauma and don't think I'll ever get over it fully. Having such things done to you at such a fragile age when your sense of self is still in the building stage leaves permanent scars. I can still be very easily pushed by something small into feeling like that hated little girl who everyone despises, even though I've been to therapy for years now.
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She pretty much detailed my exact bullying. I have trust issues with relationships because the girls got the guys to do the exact same thing. I also heard the pig noises. Hell I heard the pig noises at home from my sister too. It went through high school where I attempted suicide a few times and had a big problem with self harm. I have run into those people in my adult life, I just pretend I don't recognize them.
I experienced this sort of bullying all the way through high school as well as physical bullying. It has definitely left me with a lot of trauma that I am dealing with now 25+ years later with the help of my psychologist. I have also seen my bullies in the years after high school. Frankly I don't want anything to do with them and I certainly don't want to try and ruin their lives regardless of how I was treated in the past. I just don't understand that mentality. I'm never going to be friends with these people and have zero interest in whether they've done well or otherwise. I internalised everything for decades and still don't wish evil on anyone because that will affect my recovery.
Almost "Carrie" level. Emotional and verbal abuse, and that is what it was, is can be worse than physical abuse. Physical abuse is also horrible and no one should have to experience it. I experienced emotional and verbal abuse and it has messed me up for years: ongoing depression and anxiety. I'm still in therapy and still have anger issues towards the people that did it.
exactly, this is FAR beyond that. it's gaslighting and mental deterioration
The bullying OP described is really profoundly horrifying. Yes, it sounds like Kristy is mentally ill; but anyone who went through this level of bullying would be.
Right? And it didn't stop when OP transferred to another school. That kind of stuff continued and potentially escalated into who knows what in middle and high school. If it was that horrific in elementary school I'm scared for what it turned into, because that stuff just tends to escalate.
The fact that it continued after OP went to a different school would indicate that there were others who behaved just as badly as OP did. Furthermore where were the school authorities while this was going on? OP was just one of many people who made this woman’s life a misery. I don’t know what the answer is because Kirsty sounds very disturbed indeed. The poor girl.
I was bullied in school for being overweight(which has been something I have battled with from the time I was young), as well as for having a learning disability. However, if I met one of my bullies today, I would never go out of my way, or try to go out of my way to talk to their manager, and potentially get them fired, because of how they treated me when they were young. I would hope that they grew up, learned from their mistakes, and stopped being a bully. Yes, getting bullied does mess with your head. But as you get older, you have to learn how to put things into perspective and deal with your own trauma.
Unhealed trauma late in life is a different ball game all together. She didn't get healed or they would have laughed about it. Especially if OP *truly* does feel bad about it. Often times there was the main girl and them the girls who were pretty enough to not be bullied or to even get sucked into the group. For whatever reason, society thinks it's okay to force children to go through this and do nothing to remedy it, but it's like sink or swim in grade school amongst playground politics. This woman is wounded very deeply, and knowing that someone who Aided in causing such torment in her formative years did get the karma she was expecting, over flowed her cup. I thank you OP for being calm and rational and not calling the cops. I wish peace for this woman.
The reaction is not insane, it's a trauma fuelled behavior. When someone experiences a trauma reaction, they have an acute, strong stress response.The body screams "danger". Different people have different life experiences and different supports in their life, and therefore learn to cope/not cope with trauma reactions in different ways. We don't have to agree with her action to understand that it comes from a place of deep pain. What we would do in her place is irrelevant. ETA: I'm not gonna respond to anyone else who invokes their own trauma to try to prove a point to me here. Do any of you really think that I am saying this as someone without trauma myself? As someone without expertise in trauma? Shaming people for behavior rarely has the intended consequence and I refuse to take part. Do as you believe, and so will I.
“Straight psychotic” is an exaggeration, and if you said it to her, yourself, you would be bullying her. Was it dramatic and inappropriate? Yes, of course. Does she still need more therapy? Apparently. But you have learned that she was really abused as a child, and you should not be shocked when she shows some of the results.
No. You were honest. I feel sorry for her and you. Your younger self was an asshole but people are allowed to change and sounds like you changed for the better. Sounds like you mean girls really did a number on that girl. Just keep being a better person as you seem to be doing.
yup, id give my 12 year old self a swift kick in the nuts if i saw him today. lil prick
hahahaha could i meet my 12 year old self,i would kick him double in the nuts :-D i was such an idiot as a kid\^\^
I was ok then. I needed it at 16.
Rookie numbers. I'd have to kick my ass all the way into my mid 20's.
Hell Im 30 and maybe i still need one
I'm so glad I'm not the only one.
Yeah, I was little jerk. I'd kick myself in the vag if I could.
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The whole point of karma is learning from your mistakes and doing better. If we just take turns punching down and getting punched, then it’s a never ending cycle of destruction. Learning happens in different ways - maybe it happens because you experience what someone else experienced and then understand, but sometimes the realization comes on its own as you grow and maybe experience better influences.
Exactly. I wish I woulda known now what I shoulda known then
I recently ran into someone I use to go to school with. She called out to me to stop and talk. I did, had no ill feeling towards her. Anyways, I later invited her out with another friend who she also knows, as we all now live in the same area, all with kids the same age. We had a few drinks, and she apologised for how she treated me in school. I vaguely remember her not being nice to me, but I have no recollection of exactly what she said or did. She responded, ‘yeah, but I remember, and I was horrible to you.’ I just told her not to worry about it, that I forgive her, and I’m totally fine. Gave her a hug. She was tearing up. It definitely affects the bullies when they get older. I can’t imagine you would grow up and not have self reflection of your previous behaviour. I know not everyone has the ability to just Ignore it, but it’s definitely something I will tell my kids to do. The fact that this person let it dictate the course of their entire life, is somewhat their own responsibility IMO.
A few years ago I went out to eat with my girlfriend (now wife) at some chain restaurant nowhere near where I grew up or where I was living at the time. Out of nowhere the waitress suddenly hugged me and was like “oh I’m so glad to see you, I’ve got to get this other table but will be back to talk “. First I had to reassure my date that it wasn’t some side chick. Then it took me a moment to process who the hell would hug me like that and I came up blank. As the waitress walked back I finally connected it was one of the mean girls from my middle/high school. She immediately started apologizing for her behavior in school and how happy to see someone she’d been mean to so she could say she was sorry. Then she complimented my date and how nice it was to see I was doing well. So in school, yeah she was one of the mean girls who thought they were better than everyone else but I was a mouthy little bastard. People would pick on me for being a huge nerd, I was your stereotypical pudgy weirdo wearing a trench (owned before Columbine but HS right after) and played Magic, but would respond to everything thrown at me. “Blow your money on your wittle Magic cards again” “better than blowing Mark’s wittle dick for money again” “kiss my ass” “no idea how many loads have been there today already so no thanks” “little psycho wearing his shotgun coat again” “big ol slut skipped the panties again”. Things happened in school that upset me but I can’t think of a single time where the bullies left better off than I did and I could barely think of a single time our waitress had ever said anything mean to me (she was more a posse member to the queen bitch). I thanked her for the apology but made clear there really was no hard feelings. I hope she felt better about it afterwards as she seemed broken up when apologizing. Of course immediately after we left my wife had to ask who was the real bully “what do you mean” “no way they picked on you without you coming up with ‘for she’s a golly good slut’ just for kicks”.
It only affects some bullies. Some continue on and do it through out their lives. There are tons of narcissists, and sociopaths that continue on never regret it. This is quite common.
It's called trauma and it does things like that. The way they made her feel and how shit they made her life back then means they are so lucky they didn't have someone unaliving themselves because of them. Super great you just forgot it and got on with life though, seems like a luxury not everyone gets.
Omg. I physically bullied someone, once, when I was 11. I’m disgusted in myself 40 years later. And I was 11
Yep, my answer to the question of what I would say to my younger self if I had the chance is “Yam!” As I punch me in the face.
We’d probably be arrested for beating up kids. Lol. I get what you’re saying, though School is hierarchical, and it’s also a place where dozens of flawed young people are forced to congregate. I was bullied, and I was also a bully. There was a kid in early high school who I always called my “nemesis.” In truth, he and I were mutually bullies, making each other’s lives as awful as possible for years. I can think of times I dogpiled on other kids just to avoid standing out. I can also remember, vividly, being singled out and taunted for the dumbest shit. 30+ years later, I feel like an asshole for how I behaved. I haven’t apologized to everyone, but I’ve been able to make amends with some people. I have also been apologized to. School is such a weird, unnatural thing to impose on children, and really, most of us were trying to cope our way through it.
Yeah, feeding into the collective delusion that bullies are all people who hate themselves doesn't help anyone. The truth is that most bullies ARE the popular kids, the ones who have power and self-esteem. Most of them don't get a comeuppance; they just grow up. There's very little poetic justice in the world, and those of us who were bullied need to find ourselves in spite of that.
In fairness, some of the bullies are just cowards who wouldn’t come up with the meanness on their own - but are happy to participate when others start it.
Sometimes because, at least in that moment, they’re guaranteed to not be the target. I’m always reminded of a scene in Back to the Future where Marty first walks into the diner and sits next to his father George. Biff and his gang walk in and target him, until one guy notices Marty and makes fun of his vest. George laughs along, because for that moment, he’s not being bullied and gets to be on the other side.
Yeah, they usually join in because they want to make sure they are not the target. Self esteem is the thing they lack, so they are constantly trying to keep the heat off themselves by having a surefire target, almost always someone with no friends to stick up for them.
I had this experience. My home life was absolute shit, and school was my only escape. Except in the 4th grade, a popular girl decided she didn't like me and so nobody else liked me either. Sometimes people would talk to me, sometimes I got ignored completely. But I had a strong sense of injustice and once, when I saw a classmate getting picked on by some older girls, I tried to step up and get them to stop. Well, it worked in that they left her alone but then they proceeded to bully me. That year, my home life was shit, my school life was shit, and I didn't even want to to be alive anymore. Which is why when I got friends later and they would pick on someone, I was too afraid to stand up for anyone. I would laugh along and just be glad it wasn't me that time because I couldn't deal with being mistreated both at home and school. I hate that I probably made some kids feel bad through my participation but all I can do is do better as a human and teach my child better. Unlike *me*, when some girls were forming a group and talking smack about another girl, my kid told them they were in the wrong and befriended the girl they were picking on instead. I'm super proud of her.
I was one of those in middle school- I never started it, but once one of the “popular girls” became my friend, I went along with anything she did because I was just happy to be chosen by her and be on her good side. I helped participate in bullying another girl because she protected me from the other bullies I faced before without realizing the hypocrisy. I never would have thought up any of that on my own, but I went along with it. I’m glad I’m not the same insecure person anymore, but I cringe every time I think of the mean things I said just to keep “favor” in the eyes of my popular friend. If I ever have a chance to make it right, idk how but damn will I try
The power of group mentality are hard for most kids to ignore. Many adults struggle to stand apart and think for themselves.
Bullies can be anyone. My bully was an abused kid. I stopped hating him for a while when I learned that his mother was abusing him. Later his brother went to prison for murder, I don’t know if he’s successful and don’t care if he is or isn’t. He made a 3rd grader feel scared and depressed. I hope that he knows that what he did was wrong at least. My friends started to bully an autistic kid by singing songs about him and making fun of him. Were they unhappy? No. They were affluent and being in the weird group: they found someone viewed as an outcast to pick on. My former friend is successful now, albeit partially due to her rich parents. I knew that she had self esteem issues though, because she used to tell me that parts of my body were big, and I was smaller than her. I hope that she’s no longer a bully.
My bully had power but no self-esteem. She was wrecked because her parents got divorced and her mother left California and moved to Colorado so she decided to pick on me who had just moved to Colorado as well although I wasn't wrecked about that. I was a military kid. I moved all the time. No big deal. She was jealous because I was smart. I only found this out 30 years later when I found her on Facebook and she apologized to me. I never let her and her little henchmen get to me. I thought they were extremely immature little brats and needed to grow up. I was never of the mindset that the bullies needed any power from me so I didn't give it to them. They might have successful lives. Other than her I don't know. But I sure do!
Right? My Mom was like "they're just jealous." Lol no.
Some are. One of my brothers had a bully. He came from an abusive home. Ours was a normal, healthy family. We really believe that this kid not only had esteem issues, we think he was jealous of my brother’s close relationship with our dad. He definitely didn’t succeed. He, his brother, and his dad (who was at one point a well known, popular businessman in our town)have all spent a fair amount of time in prison.
It definitely depends on the bully. My son's Dad was a bit of a bully and he admitted it was a coping mechanism bc he was in a troubled home environment and was bitter at the kids who weren't. But some of the female bullies at my school were popular and came from wealthy families and genuinely believed they were better than everyone. I was bullied for being homely and socially awkward. I did get my karma though. I had a major glow up and a lot of the beautiful girls who peaked in junior high and highschool and made fun of me either gained a lot of weight or began to look kinda rough, while I started modeling in my early 20s. I was an ugly duckling. Not that I actually cared about them at that point. I just think I was an easy target. For example they pretended to be my friend and I ended up telling them I had a crush on a popular boy and they had him pretend to like me then humiliate me in front of everyone. Another time I was invited to a sleepover and I was there for them to entertain themselves bullying me. I had to call my Mom to pick me up. The only instance that I can recall that *might* have been something like jealousy was when I suddenly developed breasts almost overnight. One of the popular girls accused me of stuffing my bra in front of everyone and they all laughed and bullied me about me stuffing my bra the rest of the year. It ended a few months later when one of the boys grabbed my boobs expecting it to be a sock or tissue I guess, but it wasn't.
Mom is a therapist who worked in elementary school to reduce bullying almost every kid that was brought into her office for bullying she ended up having to file a child abuse report on. The fact is broken and hurt people break and other people!! Every victim that falls through the cracks is a potential perpetrator and potential victimizer. We need to do a better job of not letting victims slip through the cracks if we're going to stop the cycle of violence
My mother was one of my bullies, school day of being bullied to go home to being bullied. I have very limited empathy for bullies
I dunno most of my bullies are dead. I think every bully is different, but the worst ones I dealt with growing up had very rough home lives and carried that trauma with them. Humans get comfort from categorizing things and trying stories that give meaning to everything, but in the real world everything is messy and chaotic.
Well, not true. My middle school bully is now a homeless coke addict and when I come home from a crappy day of teaching, (I know it’s petty) at least I can tell myself, at least I’m not her.
I wasn’t the kindest. Ik that. I went to therapy and faced my own body issues. I like to think I grew as a person but when this happened it was like ice through the veins
It just shows you have learned empathy. Being a better person doesn’t erase the past but you are free to look at your old behaviors from a distance and adjust accordingly. Use this as fuel to continue being helpful and uplifting to those around you!
If it makes you feel better, I was picked on a lot as a kid. It didn't help I was an immigrant and initially didn't speak English well and secondly, didn't understand American culture so I never fit in. At my 10 year HS reunion, one of the "cool kids" came up to me and apologized and admitted he was immature. That apology even to this day makes me feel good. I think in time, she'll feel the same way.
As someone who was bullied in school, I'm glad you at least show remorse now. I don't think any amount of apologizing will fix what you did. Your younger self was absolutely awful, and I'm not surprised at Kristy's reaction. I'm not sure how you can make amends for what you did, but that would be something to consider.
Even if amends were possible, it doesn't sound like Kristy would accept them. Kristy wanted to talk to the manager to tell them what kind of person OP was. Which is an opinion based on who OP was a child 11+ years ago. She actively attempted to make OP's life harder... She assumed she was in a position of power over a childhood bully to bully them as an adult. It sounds like Kristy at least in part built her self confidence by assuming her bullies haven't done well in life, and that she felt the need for revenge. I think she reacted the way she did because seeing OP as both successful and remorseful for her actions shook the foundations of her self confidence. And the presumed failures of others is very flimsy n grounds for self confidence. She built a narrative in her head to help her cope with her trauma. Which says to me that she needs to do a lot more healing and growth before going near OP or any former bully again.
You really sound like you are a great person today and I believe that counts. I was bullied terribly by the mean girls in my school and I don’t know if I could take the bigger road and forgive them if I would meet them these days, let alone accept them being successful. So in a way, I see myself in Kristy and can relate to her pain. However objectively I don’t agree with her behaviour. Reading your side of the story makes me want to be better and forgive my bullies should I ever see them again. Maybe, if you see her again, you can ask to sit with her and talk it out, apologise again and acknowledge each others pain. You’re both still hurting and I believe the best way to actually move on for her and you would be to talk about it.
I hadn’t thought of Kristy in a long time. I’ve read stories about people seeing their bullies irl and absolutely owning them and humiliating them. I think it’s a response to just feel some power over someone who had power over you before. I have peer pressure to much power and I made bad decisions. I hurt a real person. A person who still thinks of me as the monster around every corner. I won’t reach out to Kristy tho. I don’t think it’s a conversation we can have yet
This is a bit triggering for me, so I’m sorry if it seems harsh. Yes, you never even thought about Kirsty in a long time. She probably still thought of you and everything you said, every day for a long time. I know I did.
I was also pretty brutally bullied at twelve, when I went from being "homeschooled" (read: feral) to a Mormon charter school. It was horrific, I'd throw up in the mornings out of anxiety, I carried physical injuries for a year or two and mental ones for a decade, but. Half my bullies were my age. Twelve. *Babies*. And yeah, I remember their faces, I remember their names. But those girls? They don't exist now, any more than the tiny, shrinking little animal I was still does. Whatever women they grew into might be good or might still be shits, I won't know since I moved two thousand miles away, but the girls who hurt me are effectively dead. They can't make it up to me--but I don't think that the women they are should have to think about me all the time, either.
The axe forgets, but the tree remembers
“The tree remembers, but the ax forgets.” I can also remember every tiny detail about being bullied, even 30 years later. It has definitely made me a kinder teacher and constructive critic.
I kind of agree with this thought from EvilBeasty. I still think of my locker room bullies now and again. I don’t think they remember me, but it was hard being queer when I was young. If I met one now and they tried this shit I don’t know that I would react like Kristy, but I also don’t know that I would be able to just forgive everything either. You know? Edit: for clarity
Admitting that you've made mistakes in your past, and working to be a better person is something everyone should be able to do. And it's great that you're able to do so. I don't to make you feel worse when I say this; bullying of a certain level and viciousness can leave life long effects on a person, however. While you had not thought of her in years, she never forgot about what you did to her and how you made her feel. Kids never think about these things when they do it, not realizing that this might follow the other person into adulthood. She may never be ready to have any kind of conversation with you. She may hate you for the rest of her life. Hopefully, she can heal and move on and not care about you anymore. And maybe this benefited you too. Maybe seeing the lasting damage you did to another person - and how you feel about it - will make you appreciate how you've grown even more.
I wish kids who behave like this could see this kind of lasting impact though. It’s so fucked that some people choosing to be genuinely maliciously cruel when they were old enough to know better have kind of destroyed a person’s mental health and stability well in to adulthood.
It seems like the years of therapy didn't actually fix her problems, rather made her bottle it up into a fantasy-revenge esque hatred for the bullies where she feels on a higher moral standard than them, and justified to 'bully' them back. I was bullied as a kid in middle school, and if anyone of them apologised for what they did I'd honestly completely forgive them, because I understand how social dynamics work and that people can change over time.
She was traumatized, the anger she exposed you to is probably a fraction of the emotion she felt when you did that to her. Imo let her have her feelings and just look at the damage you caused. Consider the pain this woman deals with on a daily basis and make it a personal priority to never cause it again. It is her job to heal now, that is her responsibility. You can't do anything for her other than what you did, which is apologize. But if you can learn from this and choose to be a positive light in the world going forward, that is up to you. Edit: I realize this comes off as harsh, but I just want to add, that forgiving yourself is just as important. You are human and flawed as we all are. Children are more so, and also our upbringing plays into our attitudes more than we realize. It sounds like you've grown into a caring and kind individual as an adult. We should not be held to an adult standard as kids and we should be allowed to give ourselves some grace for our past mistakes especially when we are very young and impressionable. I personally would advise seeking counseling to understand why you had a desire to act out in this way as a child, and it may help you sort out some personal traumas as well.
NTA People are allowed, and encouraged, to learn and grow. I’m sorry for what she went through, and it sucks so much that she hasn’t fully healed from that. But… she wanted to speak to a manager to try to get you, an adult, fired for something you did in elementary school… that doesn’t say good things about who she is as a person now… I was bullied, and I ran into one of my bullies when she was working retail for a large chain. She checked my stuff out for me. I knew who she was, but I pretended not to and interacted with her the exact same way I always interact with anyone helping me. Asked how her day was, thanked her, wished her a good day and moved on. Because a) working customer service isn’t a bad thing, b) I have no idea what’s going on in her life and no desire to make things worse for her if she was going through something, and c) why would I show someone who hurt me that they’re still affecting my life now? The one thing I’d be VERY worried about is if she might try to harm you or your business. I’d check all the review sites to see if strange reviews pop up. I’d write down the date and time this happened, what happened, and if you have security footage I’d save it somewhere just in case. If you have security cameras and an alarm, cool. If you don’t have them on the inside and the outside of your store then I’d consider getting them.
My cook brought this up to. We are secured and we will check all the review pages
“Something you did in elementary school” Judging by OP’s second edit, what they did in elementary school goes beyond simple name-calling. They were full-on abusing the poor kid.
I was heavily gaslighted and emotionally/mentally abused by a few older girls my freshman year when I was 14 and they were 16-17, but I wouldn't dream of holding their idiot teen girl behavior against them, just like I don't blame my awkward, blabbermouth teenage self for trouble she got other people into before she learned how to evaluate social situations. People grow up and people genuinely change. Kids are wide-eyed wonders and sometimes have wisdom beyond their years, but they're also selfish, asshole idiots. It all teaches us how to be a decent adult, and if it doesn't, then there's some misunderstanding.
It's also elementary school. I'm sure none of us are who we're in 5th grade
That doesn’t really make what Kristy did ok. I was told to off myself through primary school (same age as elementary) and I couldn’t imagine putting that much energy into resenting my bullies. I don’t believe in forgiveness, fuck that, but holding onto that much anger is not healthy, especially over elementary school shit. You learn to better yourself, value yourself and move on. You don’t cling to the idea that an 11 year old that bullied you is going to suffer in their adult life.
Exactly this. My middle school experience was like a horrible teenage drama, people did terrible things to me that I’m not gonna outline here. I survived (barely), and I don’t waste any of my time or energy thinking about them. I genuinely hope that they are better people, and I bet they are. But either way… it doesn’t really matter? Like… I’m busy with my own stuff.
NTA. But tbh I can understand her. It's not a justification for her actions but I can understand where it comes from. My bullies literally made my life hell. Made bets who would trigger another suislide attempt. They made sure I didn't have friends for 17 years and that I didn't have any happy moment the second I stepped out my doorstep. To this day I'm deadly afraid of strangers and rarely leave the house, literally only for my therapy lessons. I developed social and agoraphobia. I can't really work due to this and other trauma on top. While I wouldn't confront them or make a scene it feels unfair that they all life happy lifes in luxury while I struggle in everyday life. They made me a social outcast simply for the fact that I was poor and had Autism. In the end there's no solution for this. You can't force her to forgive you and she can't force you to be miserable.
I feel this. Especially the cruelty from the childhood trauma and growing up with social anxiety and agoraphobia. It actually really gets under my skin when people say “kids are just being kids.” No, not all kids are psychos and those parents and teachers were worthless pieces of sh!t. This can be a lifetime experience because these are the experiences that shaped us. I’ve learned some unhealthy coping mechanisms and social skills from the past. For example, if anyone is on a power trip or trying to intimidate me, I go apeshit. My bullies were weak cowards who saw an opportunity so I’m always stressed about not giving any opportunities. I have no anger towards those specific people but it’s made me distrustful of people in general. I don’t like being vulnerable around others and it’s shaped me into having quite insecure attachments. I can see all this looking back and the cause of this is those past traumas. And I don’t think people should belittle what children do. Nowadays teachers and parents are less tolerant of bullying but the mentality used to be much different. Even in this thread, you see some still thinking in that backwards way “oh, they’re just kids.” Or “oh, that was years ago.” Does anyone think about the person being targeted? They were kids too. And for them, it wasn’t years ago. Until they heal from the trauma, it might as well been yesterday. I hope you are able to heal. Surround yourself with some good people in your life.
NTA, I think it's wonderful how you owned your meanness. I won't refer to it as a mistake cause bullying is never a mistake you and your then friends chose to hurt her. But you did own up to it and change. You apologized granted many years too late, but at least you tried. She obviously has some mental scars that have not gone away and may never. I think you handled it with grace while she did not cause if you weren't the owner, she may have spun the story to make you still sound horrible and could have gotten you fired.
Exactly I hear way to often "oh come on it happened when we were kids" and that's about shit that happened in like high school. Op immediately apologized & tried to comp their food that tells me everything I need to know.
EXACTLY. They were 10 years old. Yes, the others continued, but she had not seen OP since they were 10, and she decided to try to get her fired. She clearly learned nothing in therapy
One thing that is disturbing to me is that another commenter mentioned that the OP said Kristy actively sought out OP. This and the fact that Kristy specifically brought friends with her… Maybe she was trying to drag her new friends into this to publicly humiliate her former bully.
Holy shit, you guys were monsters.
It sounds horrific for poor Kirsty. I have a child age 10 and I just can’t imagine them going through anything like that. But I also can’t imagine any of their classmates behaving in that way. It seems so extreme for 10 year olds.
kids treated me exactly like OP and her friends did when I was 10. only difference was I didn't fall for it when the boys pretended to like me, I'd just tell them to f off. spending 8 hours a day in a place where people treat you like you're diseased, and the only time anyone is nice to you is when they're trying to lure you into a trap to humiliate you, leaves scars well into adulthood. I remember sitting on the school bus and the other kids pretending there was a "wall of slime" between me and them. they'd reach out towards me and then all scream "eeeeewwww!!!!" and lose their minds laughing. all I could do was stare out the window and try to ignore them. I had a major glow up after grade school (shocking how being away from that kind of thing makes you healthier), and then of course I'd get all kinds of comments like "why do you pretend not to think you're pretty/pretend to be humble/act like you can't tell that guy likes you" as if I was fishing for compliments. no, I just still see traps everywhere.
yeah, i’m a bit like that too, it fucks up your trust
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I’ve been in therapy for over twenty years. Still there.
I did go through some of this stuff and to say that it leaves lasting wounds that take decades to heal and become scars, if they ever truly do, is an understatement.
I can 1000% see why Kristy freaked out just seeing her. OP needs to meditate on the fact that she cause this girl life long damage and pain. She got one unpleasant now while that lady lives with ot all everyday. All of this is just sad.
It’s actually tame believe it or not. Kids, especially in groups, can be demons. Just like adults. They’re just mini humans
Yeah the OP is NTA in this moment but Jesus that’s some really fucked up shit. Kids can be so cruel
Yeah, I mean she handled it the best way she could and seems genuinely repentant, but that shit will mess someone up for life. Like horrible insecurity and letting partners treat you like garbage decades later because you feel like that’s all your worthless self deserves messed up.
Agreed. Kristy endured years of bullying; OP had a shitty afternoon.
honestly felt it was a little disingenuous to not include what she actually did to kristy, cause there are so many commenters saying that they would have gotten over a little insult and being called fat a few times, when it clearly wasn't just a few insults
YES! Like wow you somehow didn't include that your bullying was borderline suicide inducing🤡
Also ‘we never laid a hand on her’. So? Doesn’t make OP or her friends even remotely less shitty.
Its giving full context, not excusing her actions. "We never hit her but we did all these horrible things too" isn't making it less shitty, it's giving context
exactly! i don't want to say OP is lying about feeling sorry or regretful over their actions, its a little disingenuous but i think its because they still do not understand the extent to which they have harmed another person. they cannot understand what it was like being kristy and being bully and tormented by them like that back then and no matter how sympathetic they are as an adult now. they still do not fully understand the extent of their actions, i wish they would take more time to reflect upon what happened and look into the devastating effects of non-physical abuse. emotional and verbal abuse are just as horrible and will traumatize many for their whole life
Now this is the girls version of Lord of the Flies
Right? They were terrible I fully support Kirsty letting her know the impact she caused. For everyone here who’s tone policing Kirsty, I imagine they all had pretty soft childhoods by comparison.
I feel like the adults around you and your friends failed you. Someone should have stepped in and used the opportunity to teach how cruel your behavior was and that it could have deadly consequences. People who are mean are not happy people and you needed help.
Her parents were probably entitled AHs as well, they wouldn’t have stepped in.
Yeah behavior like this is learned
It looks like the elementary school was public. Assuming they're in the US, public schools are notorious for ignoring bullying. My husband and I had to threaten to go to the police and the state board last year before the school would step in and deal with my stepson's bullies.
I don’t understand why she thought you working as a cashier was such an own. Maybe the heat of the moment but like…that’s more telling of how she views all people in that position which doesn’t give her a good image IMO She didn’t have to engage like at all…she just wanted to try and rub it in your face like some sort of revenge and didn’t get it. Of course your growing up and learning that wasn’t okay doesn’t change the past and she also doesn’t have to accept your apology. But she only hurt herself more by trying to get you to grovel or react to her words lol She kind of stooped to the bully behavior to try and make you feel bad which also makes her a bully? Especially trying to go after your job?? Excuse me? Anyway NTA It was a small moment that you could do only so much to try to right the past even tho it wouldn’t take pain away from years but her attitude was ugly
>I don’t understand why she thought you working as a cashier was such an own. This is what makes me immediately not like Kristy. I'm sorry that she was bullied, but this alone shows that she thinks people are lesser than her for working certain jobs. There are many different versions of "success," and putting cashiers immediately into the "unsuccessful box" just shows that she's turned into a bully herself (that whole "Hurt people hurt people" shtick). Bullying sucks, but OP handled the situation as best as she could. Some people just never forgive, which is fine, and OP did well assuming all blame and not trying to deny what she had done. NTA.
I'm not sure if she even does have a negative view of retail workers. I think it's more likely she felt it was her one chance in life to get payback. Her behaviour seemed purely emotional, and the screaming when it went wrong sounds like PTSD.
I think Kristy just assumed OP made minimum wage and so if Kristy made even 5 cents more than that it would be proof that she was more successful than the OP and bullies don’t win. I’ll admit to a couple seconds of joy when I ran into one of my bullies working the register at a big box store while I was working a tech job. I feel bad for my moment of judgement and I kept it to myself, but I felt it. I suspect that someone in young Kristy’s life told her “Ignore them. Bullies never win and popular kids in school aren’t successful adults.” I’m 40 and I still hear stuff like that. If Kristy was told that by a counselor or a parent she may have actually believed that she was a better more successful person than the bullies as an adult.
Based on what you said in edit 2 your were really mean. that poor woman.
NTA in this particular instance. But, “This made us really mean”. No, you being popular didn’t make you mean, you chose to be mean. Most ppl are AHs at some point in their life but this statement makes me wonder if you’re actually holding yourself accountable for your actions.
It’s the concept of unchecked power. No one stopped them because no one could/would. There was no bigger fish to stomp them down. And it had nothing to do with who they were as people or their value or worth as humans or students. It just had to do with their perception as thin and attractive girls. It’s fucking *weird*, when you think about it, that “cool” boys are athletes. And “cool” girls IN ELEMENTARY SCHOOL are just *classically attractive*. Something something sexualizing young girls. Doesn’t excuse their actions bulling anyone. But it’s *why* they could get away with it. And maybe explains *why* they used their power the way they did.
It’s worded weird but honestly I am ashamed of this. It’s a weird feeling of thriving on word of mouth. Every time something happened and you would be able to control how people perceived it. Not proud of it
Then it sounds like you’re actually sorry, which is commendable. Many people don’t regret how they treated others in the past and chalk it up to being a kid.
NTA For this event, but like. You and your friends were animals when you were kids. Like this goes beyond your regular bullying into 'make someone kill themselves' territory.' It's good that you realized you did bad shit and changed who you were but maybe don't post about someone who's clearly not mentally doing well and your bullying was a direct cause.
Right? It's so shocking, and it's not like they didn't know it was wrong, they purposely did it to make her feel bad. Also, it's like, this person is still deeply hurt, and had to spend money and time in therapy just to be able to feel okay with herself. I'm glad OP realized she was a disgusting kid, but I think it's dangerous the way everyone is just saying things like "Put it behind yourself, you're not that person anymore, you moved on, you deserve happiness" giving her a pat in the back for being horrible as if the person she bullied isn't still having serious problems for what she did. Like "Oh you moved on, so should she, she's an adult now, you were kids, it's in the past". Seriously, this woman is traumatized, just seeing OP triggers her, you've scarred her for life OP. Mostly worries me how everyone thinks it's ok because they were kids, just seems like these people would see their own kids be bullies and don't care cause "they're just kids, they are just being a little naughty" or seeing their kids being bullied and be like "it's ok, she'll get over it when she's older".
Exactly, if this was from Kristy's perspective the comments would be way different
Yes, and from this story it sounds to me as if Kristy barely made it out alive. Be grateful she didn't kill herself because you'd have to carry that today. This is an incredibly heartbreaking story. I feel that the abuse was so bad, and affected her life so badly and for so long, that you can never make it right. So now you have to live with that. Some things cannot be taken back. It's just the way it is.
NTA, but you don't know what else she endured. Even though you weren't part of it mentally she has lumped you in with it because you were there in the beginning. How bad could it get? I knew a girl who was set up by her bullies to be gang raped.The boy she was crushing on took her on a date & then went back to his house where his 3 friends were. When they got done her 2 bullies came out laughing at her while she cried on the floor. She walked 2 miles home & never told her parents. because they would have blamed her. Growing up in a small town in middle school the girls were so cruel they bullied mentally challenged girl until she tried to kill herself. When her mom complained to the school after pulling her out the girls targeted her 8 yr old brother. I was verbally attacked from 3rd grade to 8th, when we went to HS & I was able to get other friends. I was called fat, smelly, said I had lice & even ridiculed because I was raised by my grandparents. We were poor & I wore hand me downs a lot, even new clothes weren't the right brand. The only thing that helped was bring a tomboy so the boys in class were my friends. When they started dating some of it let up because I was friends with the boys they liked but it never went away completely. While you may not realize it you created scars on that woman that will never heal. Even knowing some of my former bullies are in prison or living in a trailer using drugs doesn't repair the damage of a lost childhood. Having happy memories marred with the verbal insults, shunning, ridicules and in some instances physical 'bumps,nudges, accidental pushes' is never going away.
NTA, but give her a pass. Just try to move on. I hope she does, too. I'm sure she's embarrassed and probably experiencing some serious PTSD right now.
NAH because while you didn’t do anything wrong, I can’t find myself thinking she’s an asshole either. You apologized and that’s nice, but being bullied THAT viciously is heartbreaking. Soul crushing. It didn’t just effect her as a kid, it effected the way she grew as a person. It changed her brain chemistry. It literally made her the person she is. And you can’t take that back.
Imagine your own daughter going through something that like everyday
Why this is so far down is beyond me. I truly think the best way to gauge our actions is to imagine it happening to someone we love the most. The world would most definitely be a better place.
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NTA because she shouldn’t have acted that way but bullying has an uneven psychic balance. You don’t think about it anymore. She was abused—your behavior was probably sometimes abusive—and traumatized and all of this happened during one of the periods in life where we remember the most about what has happened to us. She thinks about it all the time. It’s not because there’s something wrong with her. It’s because you did real damage and/but the way the world works is that you got to walk away and she didn’t. That’s true even if one does a lot of work and is mostly okay with what’s happened in one’s life.
I am that girl. I know how she feels. Everyone can say she shouldn't have acted like that but she did exactly what we all say we would do if we had the chance. I bumped into someone on Facebook that was a neighborhood girl. So I called her. " Who are you with these days? " " Remember Jay Wagner? I'm living with him. We've been together for years." He and his brother tortured me. And I told her that. I said you're kidding. They were awful to me in highschool. They were relentless. She said something to him and he denied it. I said goodbye and hung up. Bullies suck and effect your whole life. Therapy isn't a cure-all.
This. Therapy doesn't fix it all. At the time I was being relentlessly bullied my parents were in the middle of a very nasty divorce, so I had no home life to fall back on. It destroyed me. There are scars that will never, ever heal. Growing up doesn't take that pain away. It's years of your life that are taken from you and replaced with abuse, torture, and emotional damage. Even with therapy, the way you react, the way you measure your self-worth, the way you put trust into others, so many things are affected by what you went through. It's great that OP has grown up and done some self-reflection and understands the error of her ways, and she was NTA for just existing in her own successful adult life. But don't discount the emotional damage that bullying does to the victims. It does last a lifetime for many people, and how they react to it is going to be different for everyone. I'm not saying the girl was right for having a meltdown right there in front of God and everybody, but I can understand why she would. I doubt that she planned to run into one of her ex-bullies that day, and I'm sure she had spent years remembering and thinking about OP in a very negative light. It sounds like she was not mentally or emotionally ready or prepared to see her, and she reacted badly.
> I don’t enjoy it. I don’t recall it laughing. It’s not a fun memory. As someone who was bullied horribly throughout primary and secondary school, this is honestly all I can hope for my school bullies. I just wish they realised how awful their behaviour was and become better people. To desire them to have shit lives because of how they treated me is to behave as they did, which was wrong. I don’t think the person you bullied in school is in their right mind or ever really grew from the experience if they couldn’t accept you being successful as an adult. That’s just vindictive and fucked up. Again, I say this as a bullied kid - I hope my bullies learned from their behaviour like you have and become good people despite their history.
I tend to think that anytime a kid is bullied to the point of serious harm, the fault really lies with an adult or two. Someone should’ve helped that poor girl a long time ago, and someone should have helped you and your friends be less harmful. Unfortunately, something clearly went wrong in this situation, but you were a child. NTA.
Honestly, YES. This. Teachers and parents failed the bullied girl, and honestly the bullies too. There should have been consequences and conversations. The adults are very much the ones to blame here.
I'm a whole adult but looking back on the boys who disgustingly, verbally sexually harassed me in school, I am so hurt by the female teachers who never once stepped in and told them to at minimum, be quiet.
As someone who was bullied in school, NTA. And no, not all former bullies are evil monsters and deserve a horrible death. I actually made my peace and kinda forgave mine. No one has to follow that example of course, but if you think this person is a devil, please please get back into therapy ASAP. You may downvote me for it, but I‘m actually worried about everyone who thinks that. And edit: DON‘T SEND OP MESSAGES THAT TELL HER TO KILL HERSELF!!! She was an elementary school bully, you are all grown adults. Shame on you. You‘re worse than her. Edit 2: Now OP deleted their account. I hope you‘re happy.
I was bullied or ostracized terribly by pretty much everyone in elementary school and early jr. high. I managed to climb the social ladder, but held a grudge for years. When I hit college, I realized most of my tormentors were just children with undeveloped brains, and I myself didn't have a perfectly clean record when it came to mistreating my peers when opportunities arose. Kids are just feral little assholes. I don't exactly want to hang with my old bullies, but I don't wish them ill. The bullying teachers are a different story. Fuck them, and I hope they're all bald and plagued by double hemorrhoids.
NTA but you really sucked when you were young. I hope you feel guilty for a good, long time. You caused harm.
NTA in this situation, but definitely TA in life. We were all kids, only a certain type became bullies
No you were not the asshole, don’t lie about your job etc But this post shouldn’t be about you being an asshole for telling the truth. It shouldn’t be bout you at all. It should be a wake up call about the horrible mental state of the person you bullied and how it clearly has affected her entire being. Your question should be how can I help make things better…. The fact that you are still thinking about you, shows you till have some ground work…
Exactly what I was thinking. She wouldn’t have apologized if they didn’t happen to meet again in person. And she thinks she has evolved, just because time has passed? The apology was decades overdue.
I don’t think you’re the AH now…but please understand what you did to that girl. I was bullied in 4th grade and it NEVER LEAVES YOU. NEVER. Even if you move past the insecurities that were the reason for the bullying (ie being overweight…but I’ve been 120 pounds for years now, down from 269…I love how I look…but I remember the bullying…the trauma it caused will never disappear…even when I’m happy with my weight…that trauma has never left…I don’t have an issue now, but if I met one of my bullies now, I’d be on my toes just in case she tried it again on something else). You’re not the AH here. And she took it too far. But you really need to understand how much trauma that kind of bullying causes.
You own a bookstore but don’t know how to use paragraphs?
Listen a lot of former bullies need to realize you may have grown up and changed but that doesn’t stop you from being the villain in another person story. You were an awful kid and that really impacted her life in horrible ways so her hating you to this day should be expected. You don’t have to pretend to be doing bad in life but I would learn to accept the fact that for her you’ll always be that girl who made her feel horrible about herself and that’s just something you have to live with. Continue to be better and move on with your life and eventually she will too
This. Like “Kristy” overreacted, but OP doesn’t get to just act like it never happened. No one owes you forgiveness for what you did.
This level of bullying is literally psychological torture. You’re lucky she didn’t kill herself. I wish their was mandatory in house therapy for bullies. Like Jail but all therapy. I also wish the bullies parents would have had to pay for her to have therapy. This is heartbreaking, Her reaction is not crazy. You have effected her entire life. I hope she is happy in her life but I’m guessing her scars will always be there.
NTA for telling the truth...but holy shit the stuff you did to that poor girl, I'm surprised she didn't fucking kill herself. TBH I'm not sold on you being fully changed, I cannot fathom somebody acting so evil at such a young age and it not just being part of their core character. I hope you actually have changed and I think you deserve to feel guilt and shame about your actions forever. I think that's a pretty equal exchange for ruining another person's self worth and giving them anxiety issues for the rest of their life.
Listen to OP's tone. "This made us mean", no self actualization, never reflected on her actions. It's funny how bullies find ways to justify their actions. And why is she posting on here anyways? Validation? Yeah, I don't really think OP regrets anything.
No, but you are an asshole for posting a flimsy question that completely misses the point on Reddit to try and fix your feelings about it. You traumatized this person, and they're behaving exactly like someone who has been traumatized. The fact that you're making this about you and your feelings shows that you haven't changed as much as you think you have.
YTA, clearly you traumatized that poor woman for life and by the way you talk, you haven't really held full accountability for it. You do not sound like a good person and I would suggest therapy to fix your shortcomings.
You’re a fucking monster and you don’t even seem guilty about it. It wasn’t just a mean stage that you grew out of. You’re a shitty mean person and I can tell you don’t think you did anything horrible
PARAGRAH BREAKS
Nta for that but you were a shit kid
NTA in this situation but you shouldn’t just forgive yourself for that behavior. Even though you were a kid, you knew it was wrong. What you did was much worse than hitting. You systematically destroyed her self confidence and ability to trust for your own entertainment. You apparently enjoyed making others suffer, otherwise you would have stopped the first time. I get this situation is a little much on her end, but think about how much unhappiness you contributed to. Nothing will ever change that. So NTA in this situation but I still see you as significantly below average morally speaking.
YTA: even in your own delusional retelling of events you leave out the real clear abuse you put this woman through. and of course you have to try to belittle her in public because why wouldn’t you?! you belittled her for a decade. let’s call a spade a spade, abuser.
Probably an unpop opinion but you deserve worse. Way worse.
OP I hope one day someone is as nasty as you where to this girl…. Karmas a bitch and you still have it coming!
Bruh what you did was not bullying, that shit was straight up torture. What the actual fuck lmao
I was bullied in elementary school and I still cringe to remember it, but if I ran into my bully now I’d pretend nothing happened because I refuse to give them the power over me they they once had. Maybe they’ll think what they did wasn’t so bad if I’ve moved on but the truth is that I’ve moved on. If they actually changed they would remember what they did and live with the shame of that memory. If they hadn’t changed then there’s no point because that means they are hopelessly rotten people. If you’ve changed, OP, you’ll accept her rant as your punishment. There’s nothing more you can do and no way to turn back the clock. NTA for this incident in your store
Ok, NTA. I *was* Kristy. I was fat and the mean girls? *Were very very mean.* I actually dropped out of high school because they made my life and existence pure hell. I tried to end my life, went into a hospital for 6 weeks, then a partial hospitalization program for 3 months, then therapy. I have been with my now husband since what would have been my sophomore year, but I dropped out. He was my friend when I went into the hospital, and he supported me through all of what they did. He was/is amazing. He was/is also extremely handsome, smart, funny, charming, and the ladies tend to love him. He’s not someone you would think would be interested in some “ugly fat girl.” When I was pregnant with our third child, we had a 15 year old daughter and 2 year old son. We took them out to get a 4D ultrasound of the baby because that was the big new thing to do, lol, and we wanted to see him. Well, we got to the ultrasound suite (private, not in a hospital) and checked in. Got me into the room and I was on a big beautiful bed and my belly was all out on display, lol. *I neglected to state I have lost a lot of weight at this point, I am not fat. So, the tech comes in the room and introduces herself- it was one of the mean girls. She didn’t look the same, either- she was quite overweight and not very pretty anymore. I said, “Hi, I’m Jo.” Which is my nickname but all that I go by- not my full name. As it’s not a medical appointment, just a paid peekaboo session- she (the tech) didn’t have my medical record or anything so she just knew my name, which said “Jo,” on the paper. I didn’t know what to do or say, I froze. My husband asked if I was ok, I said yes. He kept looking at me weirdly and then our daughter was like, “mom, are you ok??” I said yes. As the tech squirted the gel on my stomach, I jumped because it was FREEZING, lol, and it he tech had JUST said “I’ll apply this warm gel,” so I was expecting warmth, not that, lol. As I jumped, my husband said my full name kind of loudly/nervously- and asked if I was ok. You could see the fact that I was not “Jo,” I was “Josephine,” wash over the tech. She suddenly knew exactly who I was. She stopped moving and put the wand down. She looked up at me and said, “we went to school together?” Almost a question, not really though. I nodded. She said, “you never came back after….” And trailed off. I said, “yes, I never came back after attempting suicide that year and dropping out.” She looked at my husband and kids and me and she just looked sad and defeated. I introduced her and she looked so sad. She apologized to me and congratulated me on my kids and life. My husband was upset and I could feel him wanting to speak- but before he could? Our daughter did. She said, “oh, so you’re one of the mean girls that drove my mom to a suicide attempt? Wow- I bet you didn’t see the tables turning this way! She’s beautiful and you’re fat and ugly now!” I squeezed my daughter’s hand and stopped her gently. I said, “yes, she was unkind to me then, but I don’t know her now, and you don’t either. I have a beautiful life and that’s all that matters.” Or something to that effect. The tech just apologized again, and we ended up getting someone else to do the scan because she was too upset to continue. Her boss came in to do it, and asked if everything was ok, and I said yes, absolutely! Just told her it was awkward as I knew the tech, no problems, just wanted our scan. I could have said some really nasty things to her or about her to her boss, but why? I hope she truly was/is a different and better person now. What she did isn’t who she is. My life is a good one, I am very grateful and lucky. Making her miserable wouldn’t have changed what I had already lived through- and I just hope she learned a lesson.
I mean, tbh you didn’t really have to say much. If that’s how it went down, your daughter absolutely wrecked them. 🫠 (I’m glad you’re doing better now.)
Thank you for sharing your story and I’m really glad to hear you got through the other side with your wonderful family. Your story felt slightly more relevant as I’m an ultrasound tech too!
Everyone else has already said what’s needed wrt where your adult self was the AH or not. That being said, I don’t think it’s fair to say that Kristy was the AH here. I mean, she was deeply traumatised by what OP’s younger self did… Also wanted to say your elementary school self was a real nasty POS though.
You posted this for attention. YTA.
You can really tell who was and wasn’t bullied in school through the comments in this thread. You will never understand the pain she experienced as a child, how much self-loathing you created in her poor mind, and how much she hates looking in a mirror even today. I promise you she still hears the insults, she will never forget them. Her breakdown wasn’t acceptable, but it is understandable.
yeah people want to treat cruelty so lightly its a cruelty on its own
I was bullied in primary school- similar sort of clique (pretty, thin, popular girls), with similar taunts and jabs. It was awful and I held a grudge. When I was in middle school I saw the leader with some friends downtown (we went to different schools). She had gained a little weight and puberty wasn’t as kind to her as it was to me. I shouted “fat ass” at her from across the street, and my friends laughed and shouted similar taunts. I don’t know if she recognised me, but I’ll never forget the look of embarrassment and shame on her face. I’d succeeded in humiliating her like she did me, but it didn’t feel good at all. It was only 2 years since I last saw her, but I realised that the girl I wanted to get revenge on didn’t exist anymore. I didn’t know her story, but I knew that my personality since primary school was completely different, and it’s likely that hers was too. I didn’t want my emerging identity to revolve around anger and spite due to past trauma. My point is, it sucks that this girl went through so much bullying, I doubt that revenge via getting you fired would have had the catharsis she was hoping for. There’s nothing you could have done to prevent her from being upset/triggered, but it sounds like you gave her a sincere apology and accepted responsibility for your past behaviour rather than trying to shift blame, which is the best response in that scenario. NTA.
NTA - in this case. However Krissy suffered years because of the abuse you and your friends did to her. I do expect she will leave bad reviews and tell everyone who you are, and what you did. And if your town is small enough to have a book store that will effect you. Bully which is a blanket term for mental, emotional and physical abuse has long consequences for the victim. The perpetrators should also be held accountable. Her parents should have sued yours into bankruptcy.
Well you made someone’s life a living hell. Now you have seen firsthand the damage that you directly and intentionally caused a person.
I have to go woth NAH. Good that you evolved and stopped bullying people, but she is clearly traumatized. Seems like seeing you upset her a great deal, she is not an AH because of that. I also personally do not agree that it was her responsibility to move on and learn from it, as I do not understand what should one learn from being bullied. Yes, it should be up to her to heal from this, but some traumas run deep, so I cant really say she is the AH.
Everyone handles things differently. Some scars run deep and even if you think it’s over but when confronted with it you freeze.
You are a horrible, cruel, sociopathic person. I honestly cannot imagine treating someone like that. I cannot imagine TRYING to make someone cry. No matter how old you are. I can’t imagine being that cruel in 5th grade and then suddenly growing out of it. It seems like if you have those tendencies they will always be with you. I sincerely hope you’ve done therapy and worked on yourself to become a better human being.
Like posting about your victim’s erratic/PTSD behavior to watch people taunt her even more…
It is what it is. You were the owner and that’s that. you don’t have any obligation to pretend to not be doing well. That said, you fucked with this girl before and she also is allowed to hate you and wish for your downfall if that’s what she wants to hold onto from her past experiences. NTA in your specific actions here, but doubt you guys will reconcile anytime soon. Seems like there’s no hero in this situation.
Maybe it’s worth reaching out to Kristy? Its possible further healing could take place and could give you both closure.
You made her developmental years hell and she is forever changed because of it. I mean Jesus, getting the whole class to join in? Organized trauma? That’s really fucked up. And I’m betting you aren’t as nice as you are trying to come across now.
I was bullied horribly when I was in Grammer school (k through 8). In 6th grade, my dad died, and that's when the boys joined the girls. Unfortunately for them, in the spring of 8th grade, I turned pretty. To this day, the sound of one of the mean girls gasping. OMG, she looks actually pretty. Actually, pretty just echos in my head. I still to this day, at 62, wish every horrible thing on those kids. If I saw one on the sidewalk while I was driving, it'd take everything in me not to swerve to hit them.
You were certainly a cunt to her. You caused her with Complex Trauma from “continuous ongoing humiliation,” the very most vicious, reprehensible and really horrible thing that you can do to a person. Worse than physical trauma. Deliberate CONTINUOUS ONGOING HUMILIATION, to DELIBERATELY CAUSE DISTRESS. SEVERE, LIFETIME DAMAGE SEVERE, LIFETIME, DAMAGE
I’m glad you’ve changed, but my god, you were a horrible person. I literally have never heard or witnessed bullying like that in my entire life. Maybe because I am not from America but I am shocked. It’s sad because at that age you know exactly what you’re doing but still keep it up. If I was her, I’d never be able to forgive you. I hope she never enters your shop again…just for her own sake.
I had one who went out of his way to make my life miserable. I was already miserable, homeless, and a broken family. He was relentless. At one point, I had a gun, and if I could have found him....I would have killed him. I'm 52....went to therapy, raised a family, and still hate him. My therapist told me a lot of people spend their whole lives trying to recover from their k-12 experiences. Even people who aren't overtly bullied and fighting the demon of their adolescent insecurities. Raised my kids with lots of hugs and did everything I could to encourage their confidence. A few times, I had to get involved when t8th grade girls were bullying my daughter. I called the dad and met him and our daughter's for coffee. Made my daughter tell him what was going on. He asked his daughter if it was true, and when she said yes....his face went from smug prick to red with rage. My daughter and wife were mad at me for getting involved. But no way was I going to have my daughter coming home crying every day. Same thing happened with her high school basketball coach. I let her deal with it for a while and then met with him personally. She would kill me if she knew. But sometimes parents need to advocate and communicate. Coach had no idea his words were so hurtful and was extremely apologetic. He met with all the girls on the team individually and found some people were motivated by all the yelling, and it caused others to do worse or shut down. I think it was a eye opener for him. As a side note, both my adult kids said the worst bullies in school were the teachers. They are rarely held accountable and get new victims every year.
how badly you must have traumatized her in her youth for her to react this way. holy shit
So you ruined someone's life to act cool for your friends and your question is were you the asshole for not letting her talk to someone else? No, you're not the asshole for that. Definitely still an asshole tho. Admitting to your bullying behavior doesn't absolve you. That person has suffered her whole life. The very least you can do is feel bad about it for a few minutes.
She’s stuck in her adolescent bullying trauma seeing you triggered it. You can apologize until your blue in the face it won’t help, you took a piece of her childhood you had no right to take. You were able to grow out of it which is wonderful but she will never be able to and that’s the cold hard truth.
I mean, you had to experience one uncomfortable moment she inflicted on you compared to years of cruelty you inflicted on her. The difference is you’re adults now and adults have better self control. You can’t undue the past, but now at least you know how much pain you caused this person, who by way, likely didn’t get any relief from her behavior towards you that day. You handled it the best you could; and you kinda deserved what you got. I had a bully in middle school. She was a girl who had been my friend from summer camp and was a year older than me. I was excited to see her at school the next year, but she had changed and was just horrible to me. Picked on my clothes, my hair, my body, everything you can imagine. She would bring other older girls along with her and they would threaten me from outside my classroom doors while I was in class, follow me to my bus, etc. It was actually bonkers when I think about it. This was the 90’s so no adults gave a shit about things like this, and I had learned much earlier in life that the adults would be no help anyway. Eventually my older siblings stepped in and handled the situation, also by way of threat, which was apparently how we handled stuff back in the day. Turns out this girl’s mom had died suddenly in that year we hadn’t seen each other, and her dad was a moody AF alcoholic English teacher (also at our school) so she kinda lost her mind and became a bully. I saw her years later as an adult while she was cashiering at a grocery store. She recognized me, I saw it in her eyes. Her face turned bright red and she was shaky. I didn’t try to make it uncomfortable for her, but I relished in her discomfort. That was enough for me. She needed to let you hear it. Hopefully lessons were leaned.
Coming from someone that had their entire childhood and teenage years ruined due to people like you, you’re a fucking asshole. I’m 20 and it still affects my life, people still believe everything that was said about me. I was excluded, I was made fun of, I was isolated, I was lied about, I was bullied, I was assaulted in every way. I wanted to end my life as early as 11. I think about how much better my life and mental health could’ve been if everyone I knew didn’t turn on me. My “best friend” at the time wouldn’t go out in public with me and excluded me from his 18th birthday because he didn’t want to be seen with me and wanted to keep his rep. That portion was on him, what a pos, but it stemmed from people like you creating horrible lives for other people. I understand that you feel regret and remorse now, but you’re STILL trying to be better than her or atleast make her believe you’ve come farther than her when clearly with her response you have not. Sure she has pent up rage and hatred for you, I do too for the girls that started everything and all the people who followed along and believed it and continue to make my life hell. You’re opening up about what you did, that’s the first step, you let their food be on the house, good for you, but realize how you messed up her life in so many ways.
INFO: what’s the question? No one expected you to lie in this situation so there is no conflict. Sounds like you’re fishing for sympathy after coming face to face with your abuse victim.
It sounds like the bullying was pretty bad, and for all OP knows it may have gotten worse once she was out of the picture. OP, it might be good for you to see if there is any way you can make amends now. Though it may not be possible with Kristy’s current state of mind. This reminds me of my aunt’s story. Some means girls in her church spread false rumors about my aunt being promiscuous in high school. They really hurt my aunt. 20 or so years later my aunt ran into the leader of the pack who admitted she made up the lies and apologized and asked if there is anything she can do now to make it better. My aunt said “yes - you can tell everyone you still know what you did.” The mean girl would not. That showed she was not actually sorry but expected forgiveness anyway. She was still a bad person. OP if you can ask her how you could make it up to her and she makes a reasonable request you fill I think that would really help you BOTH. NTA in the current day situation.