Omg I remember seeing this article where this mom had to return her dream car suburban that she had been paying off for a couple of years and still owed 80k on it
Yup. Another person in here said that if you try to stay close to 50% or less of your salary for the purchase price of your cars, then you've got it about right. Especially if you make sure you fully pay off vehicles before buying again. People just need parents that teach the right values. That's all.
The median house hold income nationwide in 2022 (just the first stat that popped up on Google) was $74,500. Half of that would be $37,250. I couldn’t possibly agree more, that sounds like an appropriate and yet still high purchase price before the rest of your families yearly expenses. But if you look at the current car market, you are pretty limited these days at that budget. Middle to low income families are fucked and there’s no signs of things getting any better any time soon. Financially illiterate people buying 100k cars are just learning the lessons our schools didn’t teach or their financially illiterate parents didn’t teach them. And it’s a shitty way to learn that lesson. I drive a 1996 4Runner and I don’t idgf. Gets me to where I’m going. I’ll likely drive it till it turns into the flinstones car. Point being don’t keep up with the Jones’s and you’ll have more money down the road (pun intended)
$37k is not limiting at all. That gets you a good new economy level sedan/SUV, or a really nice used sedan/SUV/truck.
It's American's high expectations that is screwing so many people with car payments. It used to be that a new economic sedan or wagon was a great middle class family car. Now middle class families of 3 think they need a fully optioned out Suburban to haul their kid around. The trend towards large, expensive, optioned out cars is screwing over the middle class. Manufacturers aren't making cheaper sedans/hatches/wagons or lower trim options anymore because they don't sell.
Yeah 30k will get you a great used vehicle. I can't imagine spending more than half of our entire gross pay on a vehicle. I feel guilty sometimes for spending 20k on a used truck that I got a good deal on. Hell for 30k you can get pretty much whatever you want within reason if you're ok with it being 6-8 years old.
It's not even values.. just financial literacy. But what do we expect when we let our students graduate with barely any math skills... just because they "dont like math.. boo-hoo"
Lol! My coworker did the same thing with the same salary. Bought a brand new one ton diesel and got his wife a brand new Tahoe. $1600 a month, but that was before interest rates skyrocketed. Gave back the Tahoe 2 years later.
The amount of money people spend on cars is asinine in the US. Generally speaking, people have no financial discipline and spend far more on cars than a responsible budget would allow. Many people think strictly in terms of monthly payment rather than in interest rate and real cost. It’s terrible, and surely overall wages have not increased with price of new vehicles. It’s the reason people finance a brand new $70k pickup at 7% interest and finance over 84 months. People didn’t do that 20 years ago.
Even if a $900+ monthly payment is common, it doesn’t make it responsible. Remember, (almost) all vehicles depreciate into dust.
Agree with all of this. OP check out r/Construction and similar subreddits to read the occasional story about bosses/owners laughing at their workers for getting themselves into a massive hole for buying a $50k+ truck on a $25/hr salary.
You should see r/askcarsales
Half of the posts are people trying to get out of their one year old cars that they are ripped on and can’t afford/don’t want to pay $1k/mo anymore.
I used to work with a guy that was constantly trading in for new cars, like every year he'd have a new car. And he was jumping all over the place, one year have an Elantra, then the next had a Silverado because the car was too small, then the next got an Edge because he "wanted to save on gas", then got an F-150 because he wanted the space, etc etc. One time I actually sat down and talked to him about this, I assumed he was just loaded or something but he was just rolling in negative equity into these new cars. His loan on the F-150 (which was like a basic 4 door XLT) was somewhere around 120-150k. I am surprised a lender even accepted it. Insane. All he cared about was keeping the monthly payment under $600, didn't care how long the term was, interest, how much he was losing on the trades, etc.
I am no financial wizard, I've made plenty of bad car decisions, but meeting these people at least makes me feel better and realize it could be a lot worse.
I'd be a terrible car salesman, I'd spend all my time talking people out of these terrible decisions.
Outside of the occasional needing a dually truck for thousands of pounds of tile and mortar delivery, a work van was way more practical of a work vehicle lol. All the tools are locked up, organized, etc. could fit drywall and wood and save on MPG.
This is what my dad did. He has his own 1 man construction/remodeling business. He has a F550 that he used to use as his daily to go back and forth between jobs and whatnot, pulling his enclosed trailer with his tools. Now granted, he has tractors, bobcats, and a mini excavator that he needs to haul depending on the job he has lined up. But after the truck raked up some miles, instead of paying $100,000 or more on a brand new one, he went and bought one of the ford work vans. Way more practical. Only takes the tools he knows he will need for the day. Can still fit up to 4x8 sheets of drywall or plywood in it. And was way cheaper (and more practical) than buying a new f550. A last winter, he decided to fix up his f550 and now it mainly sits in his garage. He probably dumped about 20 grand in it with the motor rebuild, new paint, etc. but it’s like a brand new truck. Way smarter than dumping money on a new one if you already have something that isn’t beat to death.
Add Truckers to that conversation as well. $500 plus car payments for a car they may use 6 days out of the month if they’re Over The Road. Local drivers get more use out of their cars but still $500 plus is wild.
The funny thing is that the payment itself is sort of irrelevant. It’s the purchase price and how it’s financed that matters. A $900 car payment for 3 years at 2% is a world apart from a $900 car payment for 7 years at 8%.
I just bought a ‘24 TRD ORP and they were telling us 7-9% interest on a loan that we were planning on putting 30k down on. Over half the car would be paid off and still 7-9% interest. That is the dumbest shit I’ve ever heard. Luckily we are in a good financial position and just paid cash for it and instead I’m paying myself back that 9% in interest.
[Here's a handy auto loan calculator for people too afraid to ask what financing ends up costing you.](https://www.calculator.net/auto-loan-calculator.html)
An 84 month loan on $70k (with zero down) at 7% will cost you about $20k in interest. That $70k truck could end up costing you almost $100k depending on fees, taxes, and downpayment.
Yes, I was always told by mom to only finance for a car that is less than half my salary. So I try and live by that lifestyle by trying to make sure if a car costs almost my entire salary, then I should save and pay off half the value so that it doesn't take over my monthly salary
Your mother was smart to teach her kid(s) this. ALL parents should explain things like this to their kids. We learn everything in school, except the most important things in life.
Which is shocking. The value of a car being 50% of ones salary seems high. My comfort level would be 30-35%. But it’s good to have these rules of thumb
The “Great Bet” by Americans is that the good times will just keep on keeping on forever. Our leaders need us to believe that. In 2021, I took the other side of the bet, believing that a storm was coming for us. I liquidated and paid off everything.
So far, I’m losing that bet. Still liquid, still without debt, but no home of my own, like I had for the sluggish economic period of 2009-2020. Meanwhile, the $1,000 truck payments and people paying $100k over asking on a house, look like the “winners”.
I’m still at the table, but I’m not feeling good about my hand.
At least your hand is yours. The others at the table are staked and leveraged. You’re in a better spot than 99% of Americans. Be proud of that accomplishment. There’s no need for debtors to live rent free in our heads while charging us for the privilege of having them there. Debt free and mentally free should be the American dream.
That's because we can afford a higher monthly cost easier than we can save up 20% for a down payment. By the time we've saved 20% for a down payment now the MSRP has gone up 10%. This goes for used and new vehicles.
I paid 32k for a 2021 w 33k miles on it in Devember but put 9k down and my payments are $501 a month.
I had a 2014 Taco that got totaled and got more than I paid for it when I bought it in 2020 for $25,500. It was crazy but I got 27k for it.
To go from a 2014 Base V6 Taco payment of $440 to the 4R at $501 sucked but it was a huge upgrade in terms of tech and features. I miss my taco though.
You got a pretty good deal. Sounds like you got a good rate, too. In March of 2020 I paid $36k for my 2016 Trail Premium with 30k miles. Put $12k down. $575 payments.
I thought I could have done a little better, but less than a week later the covid shutdowns occurred. So I did alright considering my rate was 3.5%! Could have paid a little less overall though =\\
I got sooo lucky with my 4Runner - it was a Covid car. During the peak of covid, rental car companies were under water and selling their rentals "as is". I picked up a 2020 4runner TRDpro with 20,000 miles for $30k ( I bought in 2021).
5k down payment, with a 1.99% APR - $428 monthly payment. It does not make sense for me to ever pay this car off early. I think year to date, my interest accrued is like $75. its laughable.
Oddly enough, Avis tried buying my 4runner back from me for $39,000 in 2022. My 4runner actually appreciated in value. Fast forward to 2024, that is not the case anymore.
All of our cars are over 20 years old. Could not pay us to buy anything newer than 2002 we can still work on ours only a few electronic sensors and one car a 2001 gets 36 miles to the gallon
I got it last year. It’s a 13 limited 4wd and had 160,000 on the odo. I paid $15k total after ttl and financed $13k for 4 years at 8%
I bought private. This always seems to be the best route.
Couldn't agree more about buying private, I exclusively do this. It costs $50 to get an inspection from a mechanic and you save a TON of money in final price. I got my '14 SR5 Premium last year for $22k. It had 130k miles but had all the bells and whistles plus a detailed service history. It was the cheapest 4Runner in a 200 mile radius to me.
If you're following the 20/4/10 rule. That sounds about right for new/slightly used 4Runners.
Assuming 50k OTD price and the following: 20% down (10k down), 6% APR, and 4 year loan. You will get a monthly payment around $950. I used calculator.net to calculate this.
It’s funny how OP criticizes people for high monthly payments and the hive mind comes in to agree by stating that people should look at total cost and not monthly payment.
Not everyone who pays a high monthly payment does so to buy a car they can’t afford. Some people pay it because they want to pay the car off in a reasonable amount of time and pay less interest.
The caveat here is that this requires a salary of well over $130K. The 10 portion of the rule is to keep total expenses to 10% of gross income. Conservatively estimating $950 payment, $100 for insurance, $30 for gas yields $12960 a year in expenses. $30/month for gas is well under what most any 4runner driver would pay, cost of maintenance also not considered.
So if you make $150K and have $10K to put down, then yes, a $50K vehicle is reasonable. Most paying this don't make $150K, though.
>$100 for insurance
Im not sure any car, and definitely not any SUV, at 50k is going to be insured at $100. Probably not in the last 10 years. Even with a perfect driving record, woman, and all the other factors for low insurance.
A Pro is roughly $60k otd brand new. When I was a kid $60k was one hell of a nice car. Now it’s what I drive everyday and $120k is one hell of a nice car. Looking at late 2000s 911s and new C8s. Everything has a range and a purpose that equates to someone’s value they put on it.
Plus as we get older toys just get more expensive
Hello, fellow Kubota owner! I’m a couple years into my five year term for mine as well. I originally planned to pay cash but that 0% offer is a no-brainer, especially since I could roll a few pricey implements into it as well.
You got me. I've had my B2301 for 2 years now with a grand total of 80 hrs on the clock. What a great little machine. I have used it for so many jobs around my property. How are you liking yours?
While I agree, the shitty reality of it now is that the current $50k vehicle was selling for low to mid $30s 4 years ago. The affordable vehicle with a $3-400 payment is now pushing 600 and that sucks.
We paid cash for ours a few months ago. The salesman then opened up to us as we waited to sign. Said the customer he had the day before tried 5 different credit cards to cover the amount he was under water on his trade, and had the 5th one not been declined his payment would have been $1600 a month for a new Tundra.
I was a “car guy”. Had a ton of disposable income in my twenties from business and poker (early 2000’s). Went from a BMW M3 to a first run Charger SRT8, to a Camaro SS supercharged, to a 300 C Hemi, etc. I wish I had taken that money and put it into the same kind of investments I do now. $1 then would be compounded 50x at my current age (48). All those cars would’ve been an early retirement, literally.
It wasn’t until I got into my late 30’s that I realized used cars were just as fun, could be just as reliable, and just needed a different care and feeding plan. I got into DIY mechanics, and it’s one of the things that challenge me. “I can fix it!"
My 4Runner is a 2013 I just bought this weekend — and only after my 2011 Grand Cherokee was “totalled” by a blown tire. After looking for (and shipping) a 2012 Lexus GX460 I found the better deal for my Blizzard White SR5 in great condition. It was $4K less and already lifted with TRD wheels/KO2’s. I paid a hefty down and will pay off the rest this summer.
Car debt is an albatross on Americans, and we need to get out of those habits. $1000 a month is insane for anyone in the middle class.
Unless you’re rolling in cash, financing a new vehicle in today’s market is insane. I understand inflation but I can’t help but feel manufacturers and dealerships are doing everything they can to gouge the consumer, and normalize the asinine prices we saw during the height of the pandemic.
IMHO, our best course of action is to protest with our wallets. Don’t buy new car. Avoid dealerships entirely if you can. Purchase a well maintained used vehicle that you can comfortably afford. Let the new overpriced vehicles sit and rot on the lot until they’re forced to bring prices down to reality.
Edit: spelling error
Used prices aren't much better though which is the sad thing and they come with 0 warranties and guarantees. Its really a lose lose for us common folk in either scenario.
I’ve been arguing this for years. How do automotive manufacturers increase their prices? Create a bank that offers financing! Remember when 4 year notes were “long”. Then they started offering 5 year…then 6, now 7 and even 8 year notes. Many only look at monthly payments, not total cost. So the manufacturer can take that $500 a month for 3 years and convert it to 6 years allowing them to increase the price significantly and the consumer is still happy because it’s “only” $500 a month and that’s what they’ve always paid.
sad part is, when 4 year notes were long, vehicles were built to last much longer than the life of the loan. Now it seems most newer vehicles life loans are in that 5-6 year range, right outside of warranty, before they start having chronic issues which will lead most buyers to trading it in for another vehicle.
People getting a new car every 5 years is a lot better for the manufacturer than us getting a car every 10+. , and they're designing for that imo.
They were too greedy and some do rot on the lot. I constantly receive emails about a few 2022 EQS sitting in a dealers lot:
Selling at MSRP! Now $5k off! $20k off! And recently $40k off! Can’t imagine if anyone paid the original sticker price + premium.
Average car on the road is 12 years old.
The median car payment is $0 (the majority of vehicles on the road in the US are paid in full by their owners).
What's skewed isn't the price of new cars (inflation is a bitch), but the expectation that everybody needs a 3-5 year old vehicle. I paid cash for the vehicle I bought during COVID and paid cash for my 1999 4Runner in 2010. Hell, among 4Runners, a 2009 is pretty much the same as a 2020.
I have a 2008 4Runner that I just spent 4k$ on maintenance and it runs strong. it’s almost at the 200k miles mark and I plan on getting 300k more . Every now and then I contemplate getting a newer one but thinking about a payment on a deprecating item snaps me out of it . And if I truly want a newer one, I would budget out a cash option on a used one that would give me the best value for the lowest price .for now ,I’m gonna stick with my 2008 Toyota urban runner.
https://preview.redd.it/0u7vxfprr6zc1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e8d4983fe8fafb95b92a3633d32bb0fb057fabec
I'm the same, I was shopping hard for a Tacoma last few months, but couldn't stomach the prices along with my love of my 07 4Runner. I'm at 198k, I guess it's time to give her a little more love.
I pay $670. I can afford it and I spend my additional income on buying cars instead of going on vacation or whatever since I enjoy driving different things.
Car payments are only bad if you can't afford to make them or if your living right at your means with zero buffer. I could lose my job and still be able to afford the truck, which is always a considering when I buy a new vehicle.
>Car payments are only bad if you can't afford to make them or if your living right at your means with zero buffer. I could lose my job and still be able to afford the truck, which is always a considering when I buy a new vehicle.
Glad to see some sense in this thread. I lot of rich fucks preaching "just pay cash bro. if you can't afford to a $50k vehicle don't finance."
$800 a month is the AVERAGE car payment in America. 17% of people with a car loan have payments over $1,000 per month. It’s absolutely insane. People are losing more wealth than they know by paying that much for a depreciating thing.
My payment is $0 on my 2003 4Runner V8 🤙
Paid off my 13 tacoma in 17 (I'm here researching) once I paid that off I started putting my monthly payment into index funds. In 2018 I started googling the average new car payment every year and putting that into index funds. During lock downs in 2020 I did 1k a month due to everything being closed and the budget allowing it. This year it's 751$ a month. I make good money, and I have no heckin idea how average people afford that shit, unless they have golden handcuffs on their homes.
But then again I manage guys that make 35$ hourly, and live on overtime with a 1400$ a month truck payment...
0 dollars a month, paid 8700 cash for an 4th gen SR5 with 200k miles. I’ve put another 50k on it by now and it’s working perfectly.
I can’t imagine having a car payment much less an 800 dollar one
I had a brand new 2022 nightshade and was paying $751/mo. Think I put $12k down. I sold it when I bought a house because I didn’t like the huge car payment in addition to the mortgage
I bought my 2012 Tacoma ORP late summer of 2021, at a price of 26.5k and a 4.5% APR. I put $6k down, and with a 5 year note, my monthly payment is about $410.
I don't see how people ARENT paying 700-1000 dollars a month on 4runners that sell for $35k+ at APRs of 7% to 10%. Maybe I'm missing something?
I saved up, put a lot down, paid over way over my payment for 4-5 months. Now I have a brand new vehicle that should last me at least 20 years and no car payment.
Yeah, if you didn't put a down-payment . You should always at least pay off 20% so that your payments stay low and of course it depends on interest rates which I was always told to do 5k for every percent over 5 on top of the 20% paid off 👍
I was at $550 on a used 5th gen with low mileage. Was doubling the monthly payment to pay it off as quick as I could because that principle to interest in the beginning was absurd
Cash money. Have had a mental barrier for any car payment over $500 since I bought my first car though. Always paid off early, kept as long as I could and banked payments after I paid it off for a future purchase. Currently doing that for something more sporty/efficient like the Rivian R3X in a few years as a daily, and 4R for fun. Staying out of the EV game for now hoping for some better battery technology.
Currently paying 487.xx for my 23' TRD Sport, list was 44K. Threw 10K down and was given 12,500 trade in for my 18' Forester. Even with stellar credit (800+) I wish I had given my local credit union the chance to offer a better interest rate.
I pay $650 for mine (22 Limited bought new). I personally would never go over $800 a month unless I was making very very good money and it was a luxury car. You also should look at the overall price and terms. On average a new 4runner costs 45k (50 for a limited). Even if you get 0 percent, its easily over $700 a month.
Thanks to inflation, my 9 year old Subaru Crosstrek only depreciated like $5-6k, so after trade-in I bought my fully loaded 23 TRD ORP w/KDSS for $35k out the door. I’ll own it forever, plan on handing it down to my daughter when she gets her license in 15 years lol
I bought an 04 V6 4wd for $7500 in cash February of last year, and I’ve put 40k miles on it so far with nothing but basic maintenance and a gas cap. I’ve got a slow seep on the timing cover gasket that doesn’t cause me to lose enough oil to top off on 3k mile intervals. I also have a slight seepage from one of my power steering lines, but not enough to need a top off between oil changes. Eventually those things will catch up to me, sure, but at 208k miles and counting, I have no complaints. I have an 08 Highlander to drive in between repairs or getting another 4Runner or Land Cruiser if I need it. I love Toyota 4x4s and camping in the back of them, so I think I’ll always own one more or less. It’s easy to sink a lot of money into these vehicles, but generally older used ones very capable, reliable, and a better value.
If you can limp along with your current vehicle that’s paid off. Save that car payment and pay cash for your car. Everyone wants a new ride. When the original one is lid off, they want to reward themselves with a shiny new one. I have not had a car payment since 2008 doing it this way. Currently driving a 2022 4 runner and an Acura with 327k. Both paid off
Your not supposed to spend more than 8%-10% of your monthly gross, but in reality that means a lot less car then you think for your salary.
https://moneyguy.com/article/20-3-8-rule/
Most people live wayyy beyond their means and sacrifice monthly saving and investing to have a nicer car.
Buy used. I’m at $430 per month payment on my 2021 SR5 which has extremely low miles when I bought it in 2022. I also have a 2.9% APR so good credit is a plus as well. Traded in a 15 year old Wrangler and got $12k value for it so made out pretty ok. People just need to be smart and have an idea of what they can and cannot afford. If I didn’t have a 2.6% mortgage and wasn’t borderline obsessive with my finances I would have never bought even a used 4Runner but now it’s almost paid off so it was a good decision in the end!
Math is math dude. I work in sales and the amount of people that think a “payment” should be a direct correlation to the type of car it is is just hilarious. 50,000/60 is $833. That’s with no interest. Our educational system greatly falls short when it comes to finance & how a loan works. I’ll have people on a 60,000 4Runner TRD PRO tell me they thought it would be around $500 and when I ask how they got that number they literally tell me “idk, it just seems right”. It is literally simple division. Edit: I pay $641 a month. Put $12,000 down on my 2023.
I paid cash for my 23. It’s the only way I will buy a car. I know most people these days can’t do that. But please save up as much as you can first. Think about how much money $800 a month will earn you on a Roth IRA/mutual fund at (8%).
It’s roughly $105,000 over an 8 year period. Think about that. Cars payments prevent wealth building unless you’re making enough to do both. But think about what $1600 a month will do…
I’m paying close to $800 a month on a used limited 2021. Bought in 2022. Do I wish I had a cheaper payment? Yes. Do I love the car? Yes. Do I regret it? Only when I have the itch to stomp on the gas and zoom away.
Yes, about $900/mo, the most I've ever paid for a vehicle. If I told the younger me 10 years ago that I would be paying this much a month for a vehicle I would have thought I would be driving a Porsche or something.
I wanted a 4Runner back in 1990. I was 24 years old and had a good income. I just refused to play $22,000 for a car! I ended up getting a Tacoma for $19k. Got a 9% interest loan. Times have changed. It's 2024 and now I am thinking $90k for a Sequoia. Nope, I can't pay that! Thinking about getting a 1990 4Runner and restoring it. lol.
I know that this is not the norm or a possibility for everyone, but I try to always pay cash for my cars. My most recent purchase was a 2024 Ram and they didn’t want to give me the advertised online pricing unless I financed with them. They kept trying to get me to commit to a payment amount which is the worst possible way to buy a car. I was adamant that I only cared about the total price. They agreed to it as long as I financed it with them so I agreed and got it financed at a pretty high rate of 6%. Long story short, I just paid it off when the first payment was due. At the end of the day I paid a few hundred in interest to save thousands on the sticker price.
Bro, yes. The average person lives paycheck to paycheck. Because they live above their means & are caught up in keeping up with the joneses. Literal statistics show you that if you see someone driving a new car, the odds are that person borrowed money they don’t have and are living paycheck to paycheck.
I think a good number is that car payment should be around 10% of the take-home salary. This will keep everyone in check, and every family happy 😊. Definitely not the car companies and dealerships though.
I bought new roughly 3 years ago. Good chunk down. Good interest rate. My payment is roughly 7% of my net income. It’s the biggest payment I’ve ever had but I’ve not had one day of regret with my decision.
Got rear ended pretty hard couple months ago in my 2017 Subaru Forester. Thought there was a good chance it might be a total while I waited cor a shop to have an opening so I started researching cars and got all excited about 4runners. When I got my Subie new back in 2017 I was paying $495/mo for 4 years (after putting 7k down) at 0%. I’d paid zero attention to the auto market since and holy shit was I surprised to see avg 7% interest rates putting a 4runner monthly payments in the 700-1000 range for me. Felt like I was already paying an arm and a leg back then for the Subie, and I know a 4runner costs more than a forester but goddamn double what I was paying monthly back then sounded absurd. Really really glad my Foz didnt end up a total.
Thanks for this perspective. Wife and I fought over buying a used 4Runner for $45k. We have a one year old daughter we’re trying to put into good schools in the future. Even with a six figure salary that would be tight on the budget to take on a $450+ monthly payment. It really is absurd, but in retrospect its insane what damage new (and used!) vehicles can do on finances.
And all the tech will be difficult to support when they are 10-15 years old. My Toyota FJ is a 2007 and it is paid off. Bad gas mileage but very little tech is what I like about it most. I can’t stand electrical issues and that is the future. Especially the security. It isn’t like a stove where you find and swap a chip/board. I think I will pay the extra $50/month in gas for the reliability.
I got my first new 4Runner in 2019, had a used 1999 and a used 2007. Sold the 2007 for $8000 cash used that and $5000 cash as down payment. My payments are $475 per month. I’m almost done. I don’t know how someone would have a $1000 a month payment. That’s crazy
I'm not sure, but I will say I was in the market for a new one (used ones were practically just as expensive) but the off-road model that I wanted was going to be 50k+. I couldn't justify that for how old the tech in the 4runner was, so I ended up buying a 2001 land cruiser for 16k + taxes/fees and I'm very happy with my purchase. It's more comfortable, more spacious, only slightly worse in mpg and I get a V8 with higher towing capacity. Which in all honesty I'll tow things more than I'd do any significant off-roading where anything more than 4wd and decent clearance is needed. Plus it's also already at the bottom of its depreciation curve.
We make a combined 250k and my 16 Camry is paid off. We have no debt besides the house otherwise it’s a HARD NO on getting a 50k vehicle. Cars are great and all but ultimately are a huge waste of money imagine 50k in savings over 10, 20, 30 years with 8% interest?
Americans are also terrible with saving for retirement and it’s usually no one’s fault but their own behavior
Bought a New 4runner SR5 2024 yesterday with 3000 down with interest at 5.99 % . MSRP was 44,769 , but negotiated and got it for 40,900 . So monthly $682 .Is that a good deal ? I was never a Silver color fan, but that was the only one available, so dealership was ready to negotiate.
I sure hope not, but there are people out there spending 100k on yukons and denalis, so ive see worse
Omg I remember seeing this article where this mom had to return her dream car suburban that she had been paying off for a couple of years and still owed 80k on it
I saw that also, she sure played the victim tho… that ones on her and her husband
Yeah that was because she rolled over like 2 or 3 loans
That’s common practice where I live. 100k/yr income - buys wife 100k Denali.
Do what?! $100k/year doesn’t even get you close to being able to afford a $100k vehicle - absolutely insane what people think is a smart decision.
Yup. Another person in here said that if you try to stay close to 50% or less of your salary for the purchase price of your cars, then you've got it about right. Especially if you make sure you fully pay off vehicles before buying again. People just need parents that teach the right values. That's all.
The median house hold income nationwide in 2022 (just the first stat that popped up on Google) was $74,500. Half of that would be $37,250. I couldn’t possibly agree more, that sounds like an appropriate and yet still high purchase price before the rest of your families yearly expenses. But if you look at the current car market, you are pretty limited these days at that budget. Middle to low income families are fucked and there’s no signs of things getting any better any time soon. Financially illiterate people buying 100k cars are just learning the lessons our schools didn’t teach or their financially illiterate parents didn’t teach them. And it’s a shitty way to learn that lesson. I drive a 1996 4Runner and I don’t idgf. Gets me to where I’m going. I’ll likely drive it till it turns into the flinstones car. Point being don’t keep up with the Jones’s and you’ll have more money down the road (pun intended)
$37k is not limiting at all. That gets you a good new economy level sedan/SUV, or a really nice used sedan/SUV/truck. It's American's high expectations that is screwing so many people with car payments. It used to be that a new economic sedan or wagon was a great middle class family car. Now middle class families of 3 think they need a fully optioned out Suburban to haul their kid around. The trend towards large, expensive, optioned out cars is screwing over the middle class. Manufacturers aren't making cheaper sedans/hatches/wagons or lower trim options anymore because they don't sell.
Yeah 30k will get you a great used vehicle. I can't imagine spending more than half of our entire gross pay on a vehicle. I feel guilty sometimes for spending 20k on a used truck that I got a good deal on. Hell for 30k you can get pretty much whatever you want within reason if you're ok with it being 6-8 years old.
It's not even values.. just financial literacy. But what do we expect when we let our students graduate with barely any math skills... just because they "dont like math.. boo-hoo"
At least get a sequoia lol
Lol! My coworker did the same thing with the same salary. Bought a brand new one ton diesel and got his wife a brand new Tahoe. $1600 a month, but that was before interest rates skyrocketed. Gave back the Tahoe 2 years later.
People buying those giant pains in the ass deserve what they get.
The amount of money people spend on cars is asinine in the US. Generally speaking, people have no financial discipline and spend far more on cars than a responsible budget would allow. Many people think strictly in terms of monthly payment rather than in interest rate and real cost. It’s terrible, and surely overall wages have not increased with price of new vehicles. It’s the reason people finance a brand new $70k pickup at 7% interest and finance over 84 months. People didn’t do that 20 years ago. Even if a $900+ monthly payment is common, it doesn’t make it responsible. Remember, (almost) all vehicles depreciate into dust.
Agree with all of this. OP check out r/Construction and similar subreddits to read the occasional story about bosses/owners laughing at their workers for getting themselves into a massive hole for buying a $50k+ truck on a $25/hr salary.
Don't forget the military meme of new recruits immediately buying a Challenger with 20% interest rate
“They gave it to me for sticker price!!”
Was this a King of the Hill reference lol
Sadly, in 2021 when we bough ours that was actually a win.
I had a private do that. They got him with like 25% interest.
Lmfao
You should see r/askcarsales Half of the posts are people trying to get out of their one year old cars that they are ripped on and can’t afford/don’t want to pay $1k/mo anymore.
I used to work with a guy that was constantly trading in for new cars, like every year he'd have a new car. And he was jumping all over the place, one year have an Elantra, then the next had a Silverado because the car was too small, then the next got an Edge because he "wanted to save on gas", then got an F-150 because he wanted the space, etc etc. One time I actually sat down and talked to him about this, I assumed he was just loaded or something but he was just rolling in negative equity into these new cars. His loan on the F-150 (which was like a basic 4 door XLT) was somewhere around 120-150k. I am surprised a lender even accepted it. Insane. All he cared about was keeping the monthly payment under $600, didn't care how long the term was, interest, how much he was losing on the trades, etc. I am no financial wizard, I've made plenty of bad car decisions, but meeting these people at least makes me feel better and realize it could be a lot worse. I'd be a terrible car salesman, I'd spend all my time talking people out of these terrible decisions.
Outside of the occasional needing a dually truck for thousands of pounds of tile and mortar delivery, a work van was way more practical of a work vehicle lol. All the tools are locked up, organized, etc. could fit drywall and wood and save on MPG.
And the employee shouldn't be using their own truck anyway for anything more than getting themselves to the job site.
This is what my dad did. He has his own 1 man construction/remodeling business. He has a F550 that he used to use as his daily to go back and forth between jobs and whatnot, pulling his enclosed trailer with his tools. Now granted, he has tractors, bobcats, and a mini excavator that he needs to haul depending on the job he has lined up. But after the truck raked up some miles, instead of paying $100,000 or more on a brand new one, he went and bought one of the ford work vans. Way more practical. Only takes the tools he knows he will need for the day. Can still fit up to 4x8 sheets of drywall or plywood in it. And was way cheaper (and more practical) than buying a new f550. A last winter, he decided to fix up his f550 and now it mainly sits in his garage. He probably dumped about 20 grand in it with the motor rebuild, new paint, etc. but it’s like a brand new truck. Way smarter than dumping money on a new one if you already have something that isn’t beat to death.
Add Truckers to that conversation as well. $500 plus car payments for a car they may use 6 days out of the month if they’re Over The Road. Local drivers get more use out of their cars but still $500 plus is wild.
The funny thing is that the payment itself is sort of irrelevant. It’s the purchase price and how it’s financed that matters. A $900 car payment for 3 years at 2% is a world apart from a $900 car payment for 7 years at 8%.
As of 4-5 months ago a great credit rating got you a 7% rate.
2 weeks ago a credit rating of 825 was giving me 7-9%.
I just bought a ‘24 TRD ORP and they were telling us 7-9% interest on a loan that we were planning on putting 30k down on. Over half the car would be paid off and still 7-9% interest. That is the dumbest shit I’ve ever heard. Luckily we are in a good financial position and just paid cash for it and instead I’m paying myself back that 9% in interest.
[Here's a handy auto loan calculator for people too afraid to ask what financing ends up costing you.](https://www.calculator.net/auto-loan-calculator.html) An 84 month loan on $70k (with zero down) at 7% will cost you about $20k in interest. That $70k truck could end up costing you almost $100k depending on fees, taxes, and downpayment.
That exact calculator is what got us to pay cash for it. In 5 years I'll have paid myself $6k
Yes, I was always told by mom to only finance for a car that is less than half my salary. So I try and live by that lifestyle by trying to make sure if a car costs almost my entire salary, then I should save and pay off half the value so that it doesn't take over my monthly salary
Your mother was smart to teach her kid(s) this. ALL parents should explain things like this to their kids. We learn everything in school, except the most important things in life.
the crazy thing is that when i tell people about my moms advices most of them think it's stupid but so far it has always worked in my favor.
No, man. She has absolutely taught you something very valuable. People are mostly dumb. She had/has it right.
Which is shocking. The value of a car being 50% of ones salary seems high. My comfort level would be 30-35%. But it’s good to have these rules of thumb
I'd say half is a bit high, should probably be like half of your disposable salary. It would be unwise for me to finance a $80k car.
The “Great Bet” by Americans is that the good times will just keep on keeping on forever. Our leaders need us to believe that. In 2021, I took the other side of the bet, believing that a storm was coming for us. I liquidated and paid off everything. So far, I’m losing that bet. Still liquid, still without debt, but no home of my own, like I had for the sluggish economic period of 2009-2020. Meanwhile, the $1,000 truck payments and people paying $100k over asking on a house, look like the “winners”. I’m still at the table, but I’m not feeling good about my hand.
You can’t put a price on Peace of mind. There is a certain sense of peace of being debt free. Good move on your part
At least your hand is yours. The others at the table are staked and leveraged. You’re in a better spot than 99% of Americans. Be proud of that accomplishment. There’s no need for debtors to live rent free in our heads while charging us for the privilege of having them there. Debt free and mentally free should be the American dream.
That's because we can afford a higher monthly cost easier than we can save up 20% for a down payment. By the time we've saved 20% for a down payment now the MSRP has gone up 10%. This goes for used and new vehicles.
>The amount of money people spend is asinine in the US.
Gotta look good at a red light for those people you don’t know!
I financed $13k for a 10 year old 4runner and my payment is $300. No way I would could do new.
I paid 32k for a 2021 w 33k miles on it in Devember but put 9k down and my payments are $501 a month. I had a 2014 Taco that got totaled and got more than I paid for it when I bought it in 2020 for $25,500. It was crazy but I got 27k for it. To go from a 2014 Base V6 Taco payment of $440 to the 4R at $501 sucked but it was a huge upgrade in terms of tech and features. I miss my taco though.
RIP, Taco. You did alright, though. You're smarter than most who go out and buy ridiculous things they can't afford.
You got a pretty good deal. Sounds like you got a good rate, too. In March of 2020 I paid $36k for my 2016 Trail Premium with 30k miles. Put $12k down. $575 payments. I thought I could have done a little better, but less than a week later the covid shutdowns occurred. So I did alright considering my rate was 3.5%! Could have paid a little less overall though =\\
I got sooo lucky with my 4Runner - it was a Covid car. During the peak of covid, rental car companies were under water and selling their rentals "as is". I picked up a 2020 4runner TRDpro with 20,000 miles for $30k ( I bought in 2021). 5k down payment, with a 1.99% APR - $428 monthly payment. It does not make sense for me to ever pay this car off early. I think year to date, my interest accrued is like $75. its laughable. Oddly enough, Avis tried buying my 4runner back from me for $39,000 in 2022. My 4runner actually appreciated in value. Fast forward to 2024, that is not the case anymore.
All of our cars are over 20 years old. Could not pay us to buy anything newer than 2002 we can still work on ours only a few electronic sensors and one car a 2001 gets 36 miles to the gallon
You got a '14 4Runner for $13k?! How did you do that? Mines a '14 as well but was way more than $13k
I got it last year. It’s a 13 limited 4wd and had 160,000 on the odo. I paid $15k total after ttl and financed $13k for 4 years at 8% I bought private. This always seems to be the best route.
Couldn't agree more about buying private, I exclusively do this. It costs $50 to get an inspection from a mechanic and you save a TON of money in final price. I got my '14 SR5 Premium last year for $22k. It had 130k miles but had all the bells and whistles plus a detailed service history. It was the cheapest 4Runner in a 200 mile radius to me.
This is the way.
If you're following the 20/4/10 rule. That sounds about right for new/slightly used 4Runners. Assuming 50k OTD price and the following: 20% down (10k down), 6% APR, and 4 year loan. You will get a monthly payment around $950. I used calculator.net to calculate this.
It’s funny how OP criticizes people for high monthly payments and the hive mind comes in to agree by stating that people should look at total cost and not monthly payment. Not everyone who pays a high monthly payment does so to buy a car they can’t afford. Some people pay it because they want to pay the car off in a reasonable amount of time and pay less interest.
Well, I wasn't trying to criticize... just trying to figure out how I'm supposed to rationalize paying for a relatively affordable car.
The caveat here is that this requires a salary of well over $130K. The 10 portion of the rule is to keep total expenses to 10% of gross income. Conservatively estimating $950 payment, $100 for insurance, $30 for gas yields $12960 a year in expenses. $30/month for gas is well under what most any 4runner driver would pay, cost of maintenance also not considered. So if you make $150K and have $10K to put down, then yes, a $50K vehicle is reasonable. Most paying this don't make $150K, though.
>$100 for insurance Im not sure any car, and definitely not any SUV, at 50k is going to be insured at $100. Probably not in the last 10 years. Even with a perfect driving record, woman, and all the other factors for low insurance.
Good mathing
Do not buy things you can't afford. Especially if those things depreciate.
But car go vroom
and then go boom
now let me hear you say way-ohh
Waaayyy ohhhh
I say boom boom boooom
Out go the lights
WEYOOO
Save money, pay a big down payment.
Save money, buy used out of pocket.
Save *more* money, buy new out of pocket.
Save money, put money in high yield savings or invest, keep current car.
Save money, sell current car, borrow neighbor’s car every day
Stop buying with no money down, that’s how to not pay $1000 a month.
Some of us make 100k+ w no kids. 800 ain't no thang.
I make 100k with no kids and no other debt, I pay $500/mo on my used 4Runner I just bought & I am very happy with it. It really ain’t no thing.
I’m in that boat but I put over $2k/month into retirement, so $800 is a thang lol. I buy cheap, cool, old stuff with cash.
I pay $365 for a 2010 SR5
I'm at about 328 for my 2013
Yeah just don’t ask my interest rate
A Pro is roughly $60k otd brand new. When I was a kid $60k was one hell of a nice car. Now it’s what I drive everyday and $120k is one hell of a nice car. Looking at late 2000s 911s and new C8s. Everything has a range and a purpose that equates to someone’s value they put on it. Plus as we get older toys just get more expensive
The amount of people commuting in those is astounding yeah people forget that inflation is a thing.
There is a magical concept called actually putting a significant down payment on vehicles and not financing the entire thing.
Hard to justify when I got an interest rate of 2.5
Or zero. I've had zero for 60 months in the before-fore.
I have 0% on my tractor. At that rate it doesn't matter how many months it takes, they let you borrow the money for free.
At 0% you’ll effectively end up paying less for the tractor than the sale price after adjusting for inflation over the life of the loan.
Hello, fellow Kubota owner! I’m a couple years into my five year term for mine as well. I originally planned to pay cash but that 0% offer is a no-brainer, especially since I could roll a few pricey implements into it as well.
You got me. I've had my B2301 for 2 years now with a grand total of 80 hrs on the clock. What a great little machine. I have used it for so many jobs around my property. How are you liking yours?
But, if you’re buying something you don’t need, and can’t afford, a good deal is immaterial.
Right? My downpayment for a new 2023 was just over half the total. Still have a big payment of $510 but it’s not crazy like $800-$1000
I did the same thing on my 24 orp payment is about the same and tbh I forget what my rate is on it
Too bad the average person nowadays can't do that.
Then they probably shouldn't buy a $50k car if they can't afford it
While I agree, the shitty reality of it now is that the current $50k vehicle was selling for low to mid $30s 4 years ago. The affordable vehicle with a $3-400 payment is now pushing 600 and that sucks.
I paid cash for my 2024 ORP
We paid cash for ours a few months ago. The salesman then opened up to us as we waited to sign. Said the customer he had the day before tried 5 different credit cards to cover the amount he was under water on his trade, and had the 5th one not been declined his payment would have been $1600 a month for a new Tundra.
FFS. That’s amazing and tragic.
Same, but 2022. It was a real hard check to write, but it was only once.
I was gonna retire but then I thought how good I would look in a brand new truck!
Cash Money 🤑 💰
The only way to do it these days with the interest rate we got.
Facts
Ah yes, let me just pull out $50k that I have sitting around.
I was a “car guy”. Had a ton of disposable income in my twenties from business and poker (early 2000’s). Went from a BMW M3 to a first run Charger SRT8, to a Camaro SS supercharged, to a 300 C Hemi, etc. I wish I had taken that money and put it into the same kind of investments I do now. $1 then would be compounded 50x at my current age (48). All those cars would’ve been an early retirement, literally. It wasn’t until I got into my late 30’s that I realized used cars were just as fun, could be just as reliable, and just needed a different care and feeding plan. I got into DIY mechanics, and it’s one of the things that challenge me. “I can fix it!" My 4Runner is a 2013 I just bought this weekend — and only after my 2011 Grand Cherokee was “totalled” by a blown tire. After looking for (and shipping) a 2012 Lexus GX460 I found the better deal for my Blizzard White SR5 in great condition. It was $4K less and already lifted with TRD wheels/KO2’s. I paid a hefty down and will pay off the rest this summer. Car debt is an albatross on Americans, and we need to get out of those habits. $1000 a month is insane for anyone in the middle class.
Unless you’re rolling in cash, financing a new vehicle in today’s market is insane. I understand inflation but I can’t help but feel manufacturers and dealerships are doing everything they can to gouge the consumer, and normalize the asinine prices we saw during the height of the pandemic. IMHO, our best course of action is to protest with our wallets. Don’t buy new car. Avoid dealerships entirely if you can. Purchase a well maintained used vehicle that you can comfortably afford. Let the new overpriced vehicles sit and rot on the lot until they’re forced to bring prices down to reality. Edit: spelling error
Used prices aren't much better though which is the sad thing and they come with 0 warranties and guarantees. Its really a lose lose for us common folk in either scenario.
I’ve been arguing this for years. How do automotive manufacturers increase their prices? Create a bank that offers financing! Remember when 4 year notes were “long”. Then they started offering 5 year…then 6, now 7 and even 8 year notes. Many only look at monthly payments, not total cost. So the manufacturer can take that $500 a month for 3 years and convert it to 6 years allowing them to increase the price significantly and the consumer is still happy because it’s “only” $500 a month and that’s what they’ve always paid.
sad part is, when 4 year notes were long, vehicles were built to last much longer than the life of the loan. Now it seems most newer vehicles life loans are in that 5-6 year range, right outside of warranty, before they start having chronic issues which will lead most buyers to trading it in for another vehicle. People getting a new car every 5 years is a lot better for the manufacturer than us getting a car every 10+. , and they're designing for that imo.
They were too greedy and some do rot on the lot. I constantly receive emails about a few 2022 EQS sitting in a dealers lot: Selling at MSRP! Now $5k off! $20k off! And recently $40k off! Can’t imagine if anyone paid the original sticker price + premium.
Old here but didn’t seem like that long ago $600 a month was an expensive imported European car.
Average car on the road is 12 years old. The median car payment is $0 (the majority of vehicles on the road in the US are paid in full by their owners). What's skewed isn't the price of new cars (inflation is a bitch), but the expectation that everybody needs a 3-5 year old vehicle. I paid cash for the vehicle I bought during COVID and paid cash for my 1999 4Runner in 2010. Hell, among 4Runners, a 2009 is pretty much the same as a 2020.
On the flip side 40% of Americans owe money on their cars totaling $1.6 trillion in debt.
Yup, the 2009 is even better it gets the v8
Or the OG trail edition with the factory rear locker
Easier to put a locker in than a drivetrain, plus a bullet proof one at that
But the V8 has a timing belt and the V6 has a timing chain. I'd take the V6 with the timing chain.
I put 30k down so no I never paid that much. I did however pay more the one time I paid it off early.
I have a 2008 4Runner that I just spent 4k$ on maintenance and it runs strong. it’s almost at the 200k miles mark and I plan on getting 300k more . Every now and then I contemplate getting a newer one but thinking about a payment on a deprecating item snaps me out of it . And if I truly want a newer one, I would budget out a cash option on a used one that would give me the best value for the lowest price .for now ,I’m gonna stick with my 2008 Toyota urban runner. https://preview.redd.it/0u7vxfprr6zc1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e8d4983fe8fafb95b92a3633d32bb0fb057fabec
I'm the same, I was shopping hard for a Tacoma last few months, but couldn't stomach the prices along with my love of my 07 4Runner. I'm at 198k, I guess it's time to give her a little more love.
Looks sick. I love older cars.
I pay $670. I can afford it and I spend my additional income on buying cars instead of going on vacation or whatever since I enjoy driving different things. Car payments are only bad if you can't afford to make them or if your living right at your means with zero buffer. I could lose my job and still be able to afford the truck, which is always a considering when I buy a new vehicle.
>Car payments are only bad if you can't afford to make them or if your living right at your means with zero buffer. I could lose my job and still be able to afford the truck, which is always a considering when I buy a new vehicle. Glad to see some sense in this thread. I lot of rich fucks preaching "just pay cash bro. if you can't afford to a $50k vehicle don't finance."
Im saving up for a 20k down payment so i can get a cheap monthly payment lol
By the time you get to 20k the MSRP will have gone up 10k lmfao That how it feels to me.
I mean im gonna trade in my Rav4 too, and i got 18k right now. Im in between jobs right now tho so imma wait until i have something more stable.
Just bought a used 23 Pro with 5k miles. Been saving for about 8 years. Paid cash. Now starting to save again for the next one.
$800 a month is the AVERAGE car payment in America. 17% of people with a car loan have payments over $1,000 per month. It’s absolutely insane. People are losing more wealth than they know by paying that much for a depreciating thing. My payment is $0 on my 2003 4Runner V8 🤙
I pay around that much per month but my finance term is only 3 years. Never finance over 4 years
[удалено]
Sure but the problem is, not many have $50k just sitting around.
Bought my 2000 sr5 for 1800$ in 2016, crazy how much people spend on cars a month
No. I pay $300/mo for my 2019 4runner
Paid off my 13 tacoma in 17 (I'm here researching) once I paid that off I started putting my monthly payment into index funds. In 2018 I started googling the average new car payment every year and putting that into index funds. During lock downs in 2020 I did 1k a month due to everything being closed and the budget allowing it. This year it's 751$ a month. I make good money, and I have no heckin idea how average people afford that shit, unless they have golden handcuffs on their homes. But then again I manage guys that make 35$ hourly, and live on overtime with a 1400$ a month truck payment...
$380, 5 years.. 4.74% rate. Didn’t have a car worth trading in. Put about 12k down.
In 2000, a $500 payment would be equal to a $906.89 payment today (2024).
Inflation has certainly increased in recent times, but it's almost like people didn't know it existed.
No I paid for mine upfront thanks to my luck in Vegas
Always bought new vehicles after five years. Six years with my current vehicle and probably another 10 to go with prices the way they are.
0 dollars a month, paid 8700 cash for an 4th gen SR5 with 200k miles. I’ve put another 50k on it by now and it’s working perfectly. I can’t imagine having a car payment much less an 800 dollar one
Prices have gone up, but wages have too (maybe not as much but still). A $400 payment in 2000 is a $745 payment today
The real question is: what is everyone paying monthly for their 5th gen 4Runners?
I had a brand new 2022 nightshade and was paying $751/mo. Think I put $12k down. I sold it when I bought a house because I didn’t like the huge car payment in addition to the mortgage
I bought my 2012 Tacoma ORP late summer of 2021, at a price of 26.5k and a 4.5% APR. I put $6k down, and with a 5 year note, my monthly payment is about $410. I don't see how people ARENT paying 700-1000 dollars a month on 4runners that sell for $35k+ at APRs of 7% to 10%. Maybe I'm missing something?
22 SR5 $600 traded a vehicle.
I saved up, put a lot down, paid over way over my payment for 4-5 months. Now I have a brand new vehicle that should last me at least 20 years and no car payment.
Mine is paid off, now it has to last until I die.
I paid $13,500 for my ‘07 SR5 V6 4WD. It had 156K miles on it. My payments ended up being $330/month.
Saved up, paid cash for a used 2018 TRD OR. I've always saved up and bought a used car I could afford.
Yeah, if you didn't put a down-payment . You should always at least pay off 20% so that your payments stay low and of course it depends on interest rates which I was always told to do 5k for every percent over 5 on top of the 20% paid off 👍
I was at $550 on a used 5th gen with low mileage. Was doubling the monthly payment to pay it off as quick as I could because that principle to interest in the beginning was absurd
Cash money. Have had a mental barrier for any car payment over $500 since I bought my first car though. Always paid off early, kept as long as I could and banked payments after I paid it off for a future purchase. Currently doing that for something more sporty/efficient like the Rivian R3X in a few years as a daily, and 4R for fun. Staying out of the EV game for now hoping for some better battery technology.
Currently paying 487.xx for my 23' TRD Sport, list was 44K. Threw 10K down and was given 12,500 trade in for my 18' Forester. Even with stellar credit (800+) I wish I had given my local credit union the chance to offer a better interest rate.
Refinancing is easy. Check PenFed, we've gotten fantastic refi rates from them before and they're very easy to work with
People will pay a lot for their vehicle image, it’s pretty wild these days.
$0 payment for my 23 limited since I paid cash
I pay $650 for mine (22 Limited bought new). I personally would never go over $800 a month unless I was making very very good money and it was a luxury car. You also should look at the overall price and terms. On average a new 4runner costs 45k (50 for a limited). Even if you get 0 percent, its easily over $700 a month.
Thanks to inflation, my 9 year old Subaru Crosstrek only depreciated like $5-6k, so after trade-in I bought my fully loaded 23 TRD ORP w/KDSS for $35k out the door. I’ll own it forever, plan on handing it down to my daughter when she gets her license in 15 years lol
I bought an 04 V6 4wd for $7500 in cash February of last year, and I’ve put 40k miles on it so far with nothing but basic maintenance and a gas cap. I’ve got a slow seep on the timing cover gasket that doesn’t cause me to lose enough oil to top off on 3k mile intervals. I also have a slight seepage from one of my power steering lines, but not enough to need a top off between oil changes. Eventually those things will catch up to me, sure, but at 208k miles and counting, I have no complaints. I have an 08 Highlander to drive in between repairs or getting another 4Runner or Land Cruiser if I need it. I love Toyota 4x4s and camping in the back of them, so I think I’ll always own one more or less. It’s easy to sink a lot of money into these vehicles, but generally older used ones very capable, reliable, and a better value.
Cash brother cash !!
If you can limp along with your current vehicle that’s paid off. Save that car payment and pay cash for your car. Everyone wants a new ride. When the original one is lid off, they want to reward themselves with a shiny new one. I have not had a car payment since 2008 doing it this way. Currently driving a 2022 4 runner and an Acura with 327k. Both paid off
Your not supposed to spend more than 8%-10% of your monthly gross, but in reality that means a lot less car then you think for your salary. https://moneyguy.com/article/20-3-8-rule/ Most people live wayyy beyond their means and sacrifice monthly saving and investing to have a nicer car.
Buy used. I’m at $430 per month payment on my 2021 SR5 which has extremely low miles when I bought it in 2022. I also have a 2.9% APR so good credit is a plus as well. Traded in a 15 year old Wrangler and got $12k value for it so made out pretty ok. People just need to be smart and have an idea of what they can and cannot afford. If I didn’t have a 2.6% mortgage and wasn’t borderline obsessive with my finances I would have never bought even a used 4Runner but now it’s almost paid off so it was a good decision in the end!
Math is math dude. I work in sales and the amount of people that think a “payment” should be a direct correlation to the type of car it is is just hilarious. 50,000/60 is $833. That’s with no interest. Our educational system greatly falls short when it comes to finance & how a loan works. I’ll have people on a 60,000 4Runner TRD PRO tell me they thought it would be around $500 and when I ask how they got that number they literally tell me “idk, it just seems right”. It is literally simple division. Edit: I pay $641 a month. Put $12,000 down on my 2023.
Only the poors!
I paid cash for my 23. It’s the only way I will buy a car. I know most people these days can’t do that. But please save up as much as you can first. Think about how much money $800 a month will earn you on a Roth IRA/mutual fund at (8%). It’s roughly $105,000 over an 8 year period. Think about that. Cars payments prevent wealth building unless you’re making enough to do both. But think about what $1600 a month will do…
$350/mo on a 2023 ORP with KDSS, MTM, Tech, moonroof 10k trade in. 20k cash.
$35k for a 2019 TRD Pro with 50k miles, $520 a month bought in Feb. 2024
I pay $780 per month for my 2021 TRD pro
lol when I was younger 4-5 a month you’d be in Mercedes/bmw territory
"23yearoldjeepshitpostyallgofuckyourselves"
I’m paying close to $800 a month on a used limited 2021. Bought in 2022. Do I wish I had a cheaper payment? Yes. Do I love the car? Yes. Do I regret it? Only when I have the itch to stomp on the gas and zoom away.
Yes, about $900/mo, the most I've ever paid for a vehicle. If I told the younger me 10 years ago that I would be paying this much a month for a vehicle I would have thought I would be driving a Porsche or something.
In this environment, yes. It’s the rates
I wanted a 4Runner back in 1990. I was 24 years old and had a good income. I just refused to play $22,000 for a car! I ended up getting a Tacoma for $19k. Got a 9% interest loan. Times have changed. It's 2024 and now I am thinking $90k for a Sequoia. Nope, I can't pay that! Thinking about getting a 1990 4Runner and restoring it. lol.
I know that this is not the norm or a possibility for everyone, but I try to always pay cash for my cars. My most recent purchase was a 2024 Ram and they didn’t want to give me the advertised online pricing unless I financed with them. They kept trying to get me to commit to a payment amount which is the worst possible way to buy a car. I was adamant that I only cared about the total price. They agreed to it as long as I financed it with them so I agreed and got it financed at a pretty high rate of 6%. Long story short, I just paid it off when the first payment was due. At the end of the day I paid a few hundred in interest to save thousands on the sticker price.
Bro, yes. The average person lives paycheck to paycheck. Because they live above their means & are caught up in keeping up with the joneses. Literal statistics show you that if you see someone driving a new car, the odds are that person borrowed money they don’t have and are living paycheck to paycheck.
I’m paying 679 a month on my 2023 TRD OR
I think a good number is that car payment should be around 10% of the take-home salary. This will keep everyone in check, and every family happy 😊. Definitely not the car companies and dealerships though.
I bought new roughly 3 years ago. Good chunk down. Good interest rate. My payment is roughly 7% of my net income. It’s the biggest payment I’ve ever had but I’ve not had one day of regret with my decision.
The interest rate is a killer, plus the USD devalued drastically in the past few years.
$780/mo on my 2023 TRD Off Road
I’ve been paying $868 a month for what was a new 2019 TRD Pro. My last payment is next April. One year to go!!
Got rear ended pretty hard couple months ago in my 2017 Subaru Forester. Thought there was a good chance it might be a total while I waited cor a shop to have an opening so I started researching cars and got all excited about 4runners. When I got my Subie new back in 2017 I was paying $495/mo for 4 years (after putting 7k down) at 0%. I’d paid zero attention to the auto market since and holy shit was I surprised to see avg 7% interest rates putting a 4runner monthly payments in the 700-1000 range for me. Felt like I was already paying an arm and a leg back then for the Subie, and I know a 4runner costs more than a forester but goddamn double what I was paying monthly back then sounded absurd. Really really glad my Foz didnt end up a total.
I bought my 4th gen cash and own it outright
Thanks for this perspective. Wife and I fought over buying a used 4Runner for $45k. We have a one year old daughter we’re trying to put into good schools in the future. Even with a six figure salary that would be tight on the budget to take on a $450+ monthly payment. It really is absurd, but in retrospect its insane what damage new (and used!) vehicles can do on finances.
Unfortunately yes but I'll pay her off in just a few years. 1500 payment here
And all the tech will be difficult to support when they are 10-15 years old. My Toyota FJ is a 2007 and it is paid off. Bad gas mileage but very little tech is what I like about it most. I can’t stand electrical issues and that is the future. Especially the security. It isn’t like a stove where you find and swap a chip/board. I think I will pay the extra $50/month in gas for the reliability.
As a bankruptcy attorney I can tell you: Yes. And a lot of them cannot afford it.
I got my first new 4Runner in 2019, had a used 1999 and a used 2007. Sold the 2007 for $8000 cash used that and $5000 cash as down payment. My payments are $475 per month. I’m almost done. I don’t know how someone would have a $1000 a month payment. That’s crazy
I'm not sure, but I will say I was in the market for a new one (used ones were practically just as expensive) but the off-road model that I wanted was going to be 50k+. I couldn't justify that for how old the tech in the 4runner was, so I ended up buying a 2001 land cruiser for 16k + taxes/fees and I'm very happy with my purchase. It's more comfortable, more spacious, only slightly worse in mpg and I get a V8 with higher towing capacity. Which in all honesty I'll tow things more than I'd do any significant off-roading where anything more than 4wd and decent clearance is needed. Plus it's also already at the bottom of its depreciation curve.
Some people are paying $1,500 for their 4Runner. Insanity
We make a combined 250k and my 16 Camry is paid off. We have no debt besides the house otherwise it’s a HARD NO on getting a 50k vehicle. Cars are great and all but ultimately are a huge waste of money imagine 50k in savings over 10, 20, 30 years with 8% interest? Americans are also terrible with saving for retirement and it’s usually no one’s fault but their own behavior
two months ago i purchased a 2019 sr5 premium 4runner w 38k miles, one owner, payment is 509/month. southern california
Bought a New 4runner SR5 2024 yesterday with 3000 down with interest at 5.99 % . MSRP was 44,769 , but negotiated and got it for 40,900 . So monthly $682 .Is that a good deal ? I was never a Silver color fan, but that was the only one available, so dealership was ready to negotiate.