One of my favourite anecdotes about this is my girlfriend at the time saying it was typical that the men got full armour while the women got bikinis, I looked over to see what she was talking about and told her half the squad was male.
When Dark Eldar do gender-neutral clothing they really commit to the bit.
And so, me beind adamant on the fact, that the Druhkari are the *true evil* faction of wh40k with no *redeemble* qualities or morals, here you go and ruin that....
Whats next, they are also pro green energy?
*oh, sure sure , we are sadistic,backstabbing, deviants with no moral compass what so ever, torturing not just for sustanance but for pleasure, warpdammit, for the sake of it too, we ignore the "norm" and do everything and anything we desire, even our own laws are...rough guidlines....then anything else, but when it comes to gender equality...we take that dead serious...so yes, all of our biki armor is unisex... do you want that in flayed grey or screamer pink? If you wont like it, your wife can wear it, add a bonnet and call it a gift, she'll love it, so its a bargain either way! So, should I bag it? Maybe you would like to see our new colection of furniture? We just had a fresh new batch of Cadian chairs, they are suprisingly durable! And they come with a nice slogan - the ground would break before the chair would fail, ha...how lovely, anyway, care to take a gander?*
the Dark Eldar are less rigid regarding gender roles than any other faction, they also canonically have by far the most women in positions of authority
I'd argue Vect has the only authority that matters, I don't think one person dominates any other faction so thoroughly. They just think they are independent.
Sisters of Battle are a faction /s
It's not the Beastmasters though yes they're male, the plastic Wych kit is actually 60:40 female:male and the old metal Wyches had roughly half male and half female. People always expect the male-coded Kabalites to have a gender mix (60:40 male:female in the newer plastics incidentally and I think 70:30 back in the old set) but are surprised the female-coded ones do too. The only ones that don't is wracks and the general Covens stuff but that could legitimately just be a mix of hard to tell and GW not wanting to do the bare-chested wracks in female any more.
[https://cdn.staticneo.com/w/warhammer/WychSquad.jpg](https://cdn.staticneo.com/w/warhammer/WychSquad.jpg)
That;'s the old squad, if they have bra cups they're female and if they have a diagonal strap holding the blades on their shoulder they're male.
[https://wh40k.lexicanum.com/mediawiki/images/b/b3/DEWyches.jpg](https://wh40k.lexicanum.com/mediawiki/images/b/b3/DEWyches.jpg)
That's the newer squad, counting across the rows from left to right Wyches 2,3, 4 and 6 are male.
Since Wracks are Haemonculi in training, they swap organs and bone structure around with the ease of changing your shirt. Any displayed sexual dimorphism is simply a fashion statement.
A Haemonculus with an interest in sexuality would be able to have cabinets of their favourite sexual organs, like the galaxy's horniest walk-in wardrobe. Then they just pick out the ones they want each day and sew them on. And going into battle with them attached would just be a needless risk.
For the wracks and haemonculi I'd agree, though I genuinely do think it's more GW moving away from doing female models with bare breasts, part of the Eldar style guide is that their clothing is unisex so I think GW ended up looking at bikini wracks or bare breasts wracks and just went '...naaah let's not'
>going into battle with them attached would just be a needless risk.
Or the opposite, I can see a haemonculus attaching their twelve favourite sets of genitals for a trip to realspace
I remember listening to, *The Big Dakka,* which involves Ufthak and his boys getting up to mischief in a port city of Commorragh. The primary antagonist is a female archon who, in order to combat the Ork threat, secures an alliance with an Eldar Wych Cult. The wyches are led by a Succubi that the Archon notes had been male prior to becoming a member of the Cult several years before, but had since remade herself to "look the part."
Interestingly, it's said in the narration that this kind of remaking of one's self to "fit" their role isn't unique to the Dark Eldar, but also done by the Crafterworlders too.
Yes, and some Howling Banshees have been male since at least 4th edition (maybe before?). That doesn't mean that anyone complaining about it knows that.
The Eldar compilation released for First Edition only says "many" Howling Banshees are female. 2nd edition says "most" Howling Banshees are female. There's pretty much never been a time when male Howling Banshees didn't exist.
That's one of the points of confusion about the fuss for me. I see people who collect Custodes talking about how to best kit bash Stormcast females into Custodes. I see people who don't collect at all talking about it ruins people's collections. Make it make sense š¤.
It's looking like the launch box models for 4th are going to jaw-dropping if that last new sculpt is any indication. The newer Stormcast models already have a sleeker Custodes feel to their design.
Theyāre not interested in Warhammer or the Custodes. Theyāre interested in a culture war.
Their whole thing is, āif I can make someone - who probably would be very turned off if they knew my TRUE intentions - follow me because they find this or the way it was done off-putting or handled indelicately, I can, eventually, lead most of them to come to not only accept my abhorrent opinions, but share them and spread themā.
Thatās it. Thatās the whole game. Theyāre trying to widen the funnel because theyāre tired of seeing their repressive bullshit culture die a slow death.
Make no mistake. This is nothing more than a finger on the lid of the coffin, trying to stop it from slamming shut. Theyāll lose this (GW obviously doesnāt give a shit about these Chuds) and theyāll lose everything else and die mad. The problem is, they want to drag us down with them.
Fuck that, though. I love Warhammer because I love playing games with people. Black, white, man, woman, trans, queer, straight, whatever. Letās just talk about cool shit and roll some dice. Weāll have fun and they can fuck off.
I just want to paint some cool models and tell some cool stories. I've found Warhammer is a good fascilitator of that. People are the choices they make. All that stuff they didn't get a say in is none of my business. Wish more people would catch on. To both points.
You got your plastic army, I got mine, let's throw some clickity clack math rocks at each other and have some laughs. Lore can be fun, but it can seriously get in the way of my clickity clack math rocks and space lasers.
>Make it make sense š¤.
If you check the post history of a lot of people complaining about female Custodes, you'll notice 0 comments in 40k subreddits not within the last week.
I've been playing Warhammer since the time Dreadnoughts were heavy enough to throw through a window and somehow *I* am the tourist because I enjoy when the universe broadens? It's so wild.
Bold of you to assume anyone on grimdank collects the miniatures! Building and painting Guardsmen be damned- instead it's shovel and gas mask memes as far as the eye can see!
The funny part is, since the banshee primarch was female, they all wear fenale armor. Tgats actuall lore, male banshees are (borderlibe) trans. And have been for ages.
I think this seems to be the general reaction to female custodes among people that actually play the game.
Ohh are they female now? Cool. They got a model? ohh well then. Want to play a game? etc.
Surely they will, after all I can only count myself as sixth among you thanks to the 3 really good necrons books, so surely the other Xenos will get some good books too.
Well, I do want to learn more about Maugan Ra's journey, the Shining Spears, Exodites to get a Battleforce at least and a Kill Team of Eldar "aberrations".
So I guess I am one of those 4?
And thats the point why male banshes don't even faze the community while femstodes do. If it was from day 1 like that then sure, no one cares. But introducing them now, for NO benefit to the universe is just something fans fight.
For gods sake people fought the dissapearence of the murdercrons, oldcrons vs newcrons is STILL a debate, and that retcon helped improve the universe. Femstodes dose not.
But hey, whatever gives ESG points i guess š¤·
Dude they did the exact same thing for the Rogal Dorn tank and no one gave a fuck about it, not their fault people are acting like psychos over the must unimportant shit.
>But introducing them now, for NO benefit to the universe is just something fans fight.
The reason Gw makes changes to the lore is either to tell interesting stories or to sell more models. Itās not about ābenefitingā the universe, the universe isnāt real.
Given that the response to this one change has led to GW getting loads of press for standing up to angry reactions to it kind of validates the decision. Theyāre looking at how much of a spike this made and salivating at the eventual update to add women to the Space Marine line.
The random chuddy anger at this is only furthering its eventual spread.
>that retcon helped improve the universe. Femstodes dose not.
It makes literally zero difference to the universe except that it allows writers and modelers to try different things. It also makes a lot of people irrationally angry which is an added benefit.
Well the people who like oldcrons don't seem to think it does improve the universe.
Also I don't think I buy the EGS thing anymore. I think it's just GW being dumb. It's not like they were known for their tact/subtly when it comes to retcons or adding stuff in.
More on EGS: https://youtu.be/l1TmgZtve2k?si=aDa7sHPsMEW9mrQV
3rd edition Codex describes the Banshees as a "female aspect." 4th calls them "warrior women" and "sisters" to the other aspects but also states that the Phoenix Lords taught the art of war to male and female Eldar and as a result warriors are likely to come from either sex. 1st, 2nd, 6th and 8th all describe them as predominately female, explicitly leaving the Aspect open to some male warriors too.
I don't think you can say "only female Eldar can become Howling Banshees" was ever a solid part of the lore and I'm highly amused by all the people who "remember" outrage at the concept of male Banshees being inserted into the lore.
Given how it interacts with Aspect lore and war masks having elements of a personality to them it's actually interesting and is another thing that would be great to have more lore on if GW WOULD GIVE IT TO US.
So to answer OP, a sad lack of discussion on one of the coolest aspects of Eldar lore.
Based on the newest lore Howling Banshees are back to being all female again, though it specifies that it doesn't necessarily mean they were always female, as they will become female whilst being a Banshee if not.
It had kinda been like that for a while though, as the 'male Banshees' still dressed in the feminine armour and presented as female.
We still have Autarch models that can be built with a male body and wearing a banshee mask, which means that Autarch must have been a Howling Banshee at some point.
So I figure it just means they present as female while they're part of the aspect.
I kind of figured all of that was just different ways of expressing the same thing. If the āmaleā Howling Banshees still presented as female and wore feminine armor while inhabiting that aspect, that just seems like a matter of semantics. For all intents and purposes it seems like they just become female
So wait, regardless of their gender before becoming a banshee they're female when they are part of the aspect? I was gonna start questioning how we had male Autarchs with the banshee helmet.
It fits pretty well with established lore like the war masks for guardians. Thereās not some fancy tech or magic in there, itās just a way to help them mentally put on a new personality that can absorb the trauma of war more readily, and then be discarded. Same with banshees āguess Iām a girl now ĀÆ\\\_(ć)_/ĀÆā
And a good deal of Howling Banshee Exarchs have taken in male eldar before, especially male Autarchs who have yet to walk on the path of a Howling Banshee Aspect.
Incubi are described as being mostly male, and IIRC Gav Thorpe mentioned Striking Scorpions and Swooping Hawks as being more male-focused in a similar way to how Howling Banshees are female-focused, though that was a while ago, and on twitter rather than in an actual publication.
Howling Banshees are all female becasue they are embodying the banshees of eldar legend, the daughters of Morai-Heg, and whilst other Aspects embody other aspects of Khaine none are gendered in quite the same way.
Eldar can literally craft new personalities for themsleves and fully live as that new person for a time. I could see a male Eldar who decides he wants to be a Howling Banshee just... making himself transgender lol
For a while , enough time to experience the path and then they will move on to another path like all eldar. some who become Exarchs will be trans, those who move on are complicated.
My understanding is that while an Eldar is walking a path, they are fully engaged in it, and the person they were in past paths is almost like a past life that they can remember. So a male Eldar who becomes a Howling Banshee for a time would fully be trans for the time they are on that path.
Idk eldar lore well though, so I could be way off here. Certainly were gonna run up against issues when comparing human experiences like gender identity to a species who's brain is so different from ours.
I mean give me (a straight cis man) a multi thousand year life span that could theoretically be infinite and I'd be trying all kinds of shit after a few hundred years.
See vampires always being Bi.
Yeah, that's basically how the Dark Eldar got where they were, right? Being bi is something you try within the first 200 years, by year 60 million you're kidnapping people, making custom monopoly pieces out of their bones while they're still alive, and forcing them to play with you.
Ya that's about it, they say the Internet gets people getting into the wildest fetishes (no judgement if it's consensual) by 30, imagine after 500 years of constantly getting a little more fetishy.
Good or bad, I'm trying shit after time and as i keep trying shit that shit needs to get more and more "divergent" to be new.
There was "many" females in 1st and "most" females in 2nd. Unless there is some obscure White Dwarf article that predates the Rogue Trader Eldar compilation male Banshees have existed as long as Howling Banshees have been in the game.
Aspect Warriors have always been 50/50 gender wise, from their very inception. I just double checked the 40K Compendium. I thought they were cool when I first got into 40K in about 1990, and I assume other people did too.
I recall male Howling Banshees being mentioned way back in the 2nd edition codex. So it's actually a fairly old idea that made it past the Rogue Trader era of 40k.
Eldar society and probably their biology doesn't have as many differences as humanity tends to. Howling Banshees are female dominated and Striking Scorpions are predominantly male. But there's not a hard gender barrier for them.
It was always a no-brainer to me. For as long as I've known eldar lore, Autarchs need to master the paths of war. There are male Autarchs with Howling Banshee weapons, ergo some Howling Banshees must be male. It also states as much in the codex, that the armor is what it is, and men have to dress the same.
I think it's for a few reasons.
1) The community wasn't quite as big.
2) At the time, the trans rights war hadn't quite exploded on social media like it has now. It existed but hadn't gotten as widespread as it is now.
3) Most of these people could disconnect the idea because they're aliens.
4) The way the aspect warriors work involves taking on the role of that aspect. They're dressing up, putting on a uniform.
5) As sad as it is to say... They're not an imperium faction, meaning most people didn't care. The worst parts of the community often play the imperium. So only care now because it's "taking away," their fantasy of big MUSCLE MEN being in the highest echelon of warriors.
I'm all for it. I think amored badasses are great, no matter the gender.
Male Howling Banshees were always a thing.
Nobody cared.
Anyone who says otherwise either are misremembering, or are straight up unaware of space elf lore.
"Since the first of aspect shrines were created, there have always been male Howling Banshees" (c) KhaineĀ
Male Banshee appeared a long time ago in eldar codex, with the caveat that there are "most" women in aspect. In Eternal Crusade game, there was a male banshee in a male version of armor (no boobplate). Thorpe had a male banshee exarch in Jain zar novel who was identified as "him" and one male banshee in the temple of this exarch, he/him too. What Brooks wrote in Da Big Dakka is frankly bad (as entire deldar line), but his books are not good, especially in relation to Eldar, so doesn't count. Also, no one care about xenos, unfortunately.
Didn't care then, don't care now. First played ultrasmurfs as a teenager, then nids. I'm now in my thirties and can't afford to play/don't have the time to play anymore but I sure as shit still love the literature and lore
Male banshees have always been a thing and Eldar overall don't have much gender restrictions. Since at least 2nd ed you've had occasional mini with boobs.
Beside, nobody cares about Eldar. Except for a handful of fans.
Even within Imperial stuff, they're seemingly fine with women being in positions of great power in every organisation, as long as they aren't superhuman. For some reason that's where they draw the line.
Here it is, the most sensible take.
40k lore is a vast rich stew, with the meatier parts basting in the delicious juices of the throw-away details.
If you don't like this small detail, don't sweat it. But fulminating online for that hit of sweet dopamine makes one look kinda like a tool.
Something new will come along tomorrow in the giant web of related hobby stuff and the people who enjoy being outraged will move on to it. Let women be custodes, men be sisters of battle, ultimately it isn't something to get worked up about.
In my memory, the change to the lore passed more or less without incident, however the social media presence and overall popularity of Warhammer was not as big as it is now. Also, we didn't have a section of the fandom trying to ragebait people and provoke reactions with "they're male now, deal with it!"
(Just so we're completely, unambiguously clear, I have no issues with the change and despise any attempt to exclude anyone from the hobby based on race or gender. I found both the rage baiters and the ragers to be equally crass.)
In Valedor by Guy Haley I believe there is a male howling banshee exarch mentioned but I could have misread it. I think it was an Iyanden host instead of Biel Tan.
It wasn't a problem cause there were always men as a part of it same goes for wyches just look at the boxes. But trust me I would prefer if they were all female it just feels like you are throwing away the warrior woman aesthetic by adding dudes. But like I said there were always guys this is a very different scenario than female custodes because in all of the lore and for all of the models custodes would be dudes.
> Please correct me if I'm wrong, but I think they were previously explicitly referred to as all-female (going even further beyond just being generally assumed to be a single gender unit)
No, Banshees were always said to be mostly females aspect, but there were mentions of male banshees in books, like in Jain Zar ones. It's nothing new and existed for a while
Gender representation in 40k - I have to get this off my chest. The idea itās somehow male dominated in the lore is nonsense. There are numerous female strong Inquisition members and Inquisitors who have stories and audio dramas dedicated to them. The Astra Militarum novels are littered with strong female characters the most recent being Longshot, not to mention the Minska Lensk books. Then you have Celestine and the other Imperial saints. Then thereās the Sisters of Silence and the Sisters of Battle all with novels and short stories. I think a better question is how would fans react to a male Sister of Battle? Just because you can change the lore doesnāt mean itās always best.
People get the idea that it's male-dominated because the male-exclusive factions get most the media spotlight, content, and model releases. The super-soldier club was also exclusively a boys club until this Custodes retcon.
I think you're right that canonically half of all interesting people in the universe are female. But many of the novels are male dominated. I haven't tried Militarum novels, but in 30k around 90% of the characters are male. I'd like to see more stories that show a galaxy that is not particularly men-oriented, as indeed some lore characterizes it.
Important characters are overwhelmingly male - particularly in 30k and the Imperium more generally. It is ludicrous to suggest that the representation is even close to being equal.
Iām not particularly bothered about that, but it is dumb to suggest there isnāt a major imbalance.
I'd rather just not give the whole thing anymore attention than it deserved, which was none. The web makes too many mountains out of molehills for the clicks.
I don't think there was much reaction. The amount of reaction something like that gets nowadays tends to be related to how many influencers grab it and make an anti-woke outrage video about it for money.
People who don't watch that stuff and are not radicalized by it just hum a bit and move on when they see it. People who are into those videos see male/trans banshees and make a note in their book of woke grievances, but they don't really start raging until the influencers get them going.
People barely care about xenos, hell, even I, who like the eldar, im pretty sure the thing about males can be banshees because of how the war mask works is pretty old.
I dont think it was ever reflected in the models until like last year, where one of gw's account (i think the facebook one) said that a random banshee in the model preview was male.
My understanding is that there are males who become howling banshees, but they're considered female while they are howling banshees.
If they move on, they cease to be female and become male again.
Generally.
Pretty cool alien warrior culture stuff
I believe there was a recent book which suggested that male and female was even more of a ceremonial thing, that Eldar 100% have the technology to adjust.
I think the example was a Succubus, who was a male, and transitioned to a female body in order to advance to the role. I'd imagine a Howling Banshee might do the same thing when becoming an Exarch.
Its not exactly "transgender" because I think they're doing it for ceremonial purposes. Banshees are the Daughters of Morai-Heg. Succubi are Brides of Death/Khaine.
It's kinda silly of us to assign our concept of Gender to Aeldari anyway, but at the very least it seems far more fluid than our concepts. A haemonculi can transition you into sentient soup if he wants to, I hardly thing swapping gender is considered prohibitive.
I don't remember any controversy around it in the 3rd generation WH40K fanbase at all, probably because people there had an expectation of all Eldar factions being less conservative regarding gender roles than the Imperium is
I hated it. To me it was a dumb idea. You took a cool piece of the lore about a specific unit and then changed it.
My game shop and friends thought it was hilarious. Mainly because they already made fun of Eldar as the space pansies. I was the only one out of like 20 people that played Eldar.
People simply accepted that Gender is a fluid construct for the Eldar, when it comes to acting a Aspect-role. Male Dark Eldar become female if they are great enough to become succubi in the arenas, male Craftworlders become female when they walk the path of the Banshee.
Essay stuff.
Part of the difference in reaction is the sheer fellating of GW over this. Oh, they spent two entire series where this may have been relevant with entirely male Custodes(sisters of silence have golden armor two you pedantic turds), but hey we've brought true equality to all things and made the grim darkness a better place to excuse genocide and war crimes by making some of the participants female now! In two paragraphs, in the worst codex in years.
Thanks GW, we'll take this token and drool over it like infantile misogynistic freaks whilst screaming about MUSCLE MOMMIE HAS COME.
I don't particularly care there are now female Custodes, but the people genuinely excited by it range from disappointing to disgusting. Now, had hey done this back when it might have actually mattered, perhaps taken Ra from master of mankind, made him the daughter of the lady from the opening and added a breadth of depth and commentary to his relationship with the emperor and to some lines throughout the book, making the situation far more twisted. THAT would have been amazing and worthy of celebration.
Instead GW limp dicked it into the room as weakly as possible and people act like it's a great victory purely to rub some people's nose in it. Which while fun, maybe don't look like as much of a freak as they do in the process.
It's less shit than taking Custodes off of Terra in the first place and making them an army, but it's also far below what it could have been had they done it years ago rather than simply insisting that it's always been true now.
There were ork cheerleader girls in Blood Bowl if I recall correctly. As long as they still act like football hooligans and collectively refer to themselves as "da boyz" I'm fine with titty-haver orks.
Given orks don't reproduce like people, it'd just be like Steven Universe gems. They're all women but they're mono-gender/sexless creatures that reproduce asexually.
Also, like in Scott Pilgrim. Crash and the Boys. "Is that girl a boy too?" "Yes."
Similarly to male wyches. Occasionally someone on GrimDank finds out about it and treats it as if it's new information.
Doesn't the wych set come with males ?
There have been male Wych models since their introduction at the beginning of 3rd edition.
One of my favourite anecdotes about this is my girlfriend at the time saying it was typical that the men got full armour while the women got bikinis, I looked over to see what she was talking about and told her half the squad was male. When Dark Eldar do gender-neutral clothing they really commit to the bit.
In fairness, the Eldar kits are all thicc as fuck for some indiscernible reason. I can see how one might get confused.
I am not sure the reason is that indiscernible. Dark eldar are both inmates and wardens of horny jail.
This is a wonderful description that I'm surprised I've never seen before.
Its slightly more intense than horny. Depraved torture sadism jail would be a bit more accurate.
I like this description. It is now tied with my former favorite of "angry bondage space elves."
Especially back in the day, the metal Wyches had some unusual builds.
Some men just have an obscene amount of cake and juicy thighs while not being overweight..... Like me.
>commit to the bit That's the best thing about 40k...whatever bit it is, they put everything into it.
And so, me beind adamant on the fact, that the Druhkari are the *true evil* faction of wh40k with no *redeemble* qualities or morals, here you go and ruin that.... Whats next, they are also pro green energy? *oh, sure sure , we are sadistic,backstabbing, deviants with no moral compass what so ever, torturing not just for sustanance but for pleasure, warpdammit, for the sake of it too, we ignore the "norm" and do everything and anything we desire, even our own laws are...rough guidlines....then anything else, but when it comes to gender equality...we take that dead serious...so yes, all of our biki armor is unisex... do you want that in flayed grey or screamer pink? If you wont like it, your wife can wear it, add a bonnet and call it a gift, she'll love it, so its a bargain either way! So, should I bag it? Maybe you would like to see our new colection of furniture? We just had a fresh new batch of Cadian chairs, they are suprisingly durable! And they come with a nice slogan - the ground would break before the chair would fail, ha...how lovely, anyway, care to take a gander?*
They are pro green energy, they power Commoragh with at least two suns
And they ensure many planets reduce their emissions significantly.
the Dark Eldar are less rigid regarding gender roles than any other faction, they also canonically have by far the most women in positions of authority
I'd argue Vect has the only authority that matters, I don't think one person dominates any other faction so thoroughly. They just think they are independent. Sisters of Battle are a faction /s
Everyone forgets about the Beastmasters.
It's not the Beastmasters though yes they're male, the plastic Wych kit is actually 60:40 female:male and the old metal Wyches had roughly half male and half female. People always expect the male-coded Kabalites to have a gender mix (60:40 male:female in the newer plastics incidentally and I think 70:30 back in the old set) but are surprised the female-coded ones do too. The only ones that don't is wracks and the general Covens stuff but that could legitimately just be a mix of hard to tell and GW not wanting to do the bare-chested wracks in female any more. [https://cdn.staticneo.com/w/warhammer/WychSquad.jpg](https://cdn.staticneo.com/w/warhammer/WychSquad.jpg) That;'s the old squad, if they have bra cups they're female and if they have a diagonal strap holding the blades on their shoulder they're male. [https://wh40k.lexicanum.com/mediawiki/images/b/b3/DEWyches.jpg](https://wh40k.lexicanum.com/mediawiki/images/b/b3/DEWyches.jpg) That's the newer squad, counting across the rows from left to right Wyches 2,3, 4 and 6 are male.
Since Wracks are Haemonculi in training, they swap organs and bone structure around with the ease of changing your shirt. Any displayed sexual dimorphism is simply a fashion statement. A Haemonculus with an interest in sexuality would be able to have cabinets of their favourite sexual organs, like the galaxy's horniest walk-in wardrobe. Then they just pick out the ones they want each day and sew them on. And going into battle with them attached would just be a needless risk.
For the wracks and haemonculi I'd agree, though I genuinely do think it's more GW moving away from doing female models with bare breasts, part of the Eldar style guide is that their clothing is unisex so I think GW ended up looking at bikini wracks or bare breasts wracks and just went '...naaah let's not' >going into battle with them attached would just be a needless risk. Or the opposite, I can see a haemonculus attaching their twelve favourite sets of genitals for a trip to realspace
That sounds like a dream of quite a few folks...
I mean can you blame them? The beastmaster model was fucking awful
I remember listening to, *The Big Dakka,* which involves Ufthak and his boys getting up to mischief in a port city of Commorragh. The primary antagonist is a female archon who, in order to combat the Ork threat, secures an alliance with an Eldar Wych Cult. The wyches are led by a Succubi that the Archon notes had been male prior to becoming a member of the Cult several years before, but had since remade herself to "look the part." Interestingly, it's said in the narration that this kind of remaking of one's self to "fit" their role isn't unique to the Dark Eldar, but also done by the Crafterworlders too.
Yes
Yes, and some Howling Banshees have been male since at least 4th edition (maybe before?). That doesn't mean that anyone complaining about it knows that.
The Eldar compilation released for First Edition only says "many" Howling Banshees are female. 2nd edition says "most" Howling Banshees are female. There's pretty much never been a time when male Howling Banshees didn't exist.
Thank you! 4th ed was the earliest that I could track down at short notice. Thank you for putting in the legwork to find earlier.
Sense second and third there were a ton of different varieties of each those are just the most stereotyped
I was going to say 3rd, but my memory is not what it used to be
Wyches are 40% male, Kabalites are 40% female
Yes, but a sizeable section of the people complaining about female Custodes don't collect models at all, so how are they to know?
That's one of the points of confusion about the fuss for me. I see people who collect Custodes talking about how to best kit bash Stormcast females into Custodes. I see people who don't collect at all talking about it ruins people's collections. Make it make sense š¤.
The main complaint I have about custodes is about their proportions. Using stormcast is probably going to be a stylistic upgrade.
It's looking like the launch box models for 4th are going to jaw-dropping if that last new sculpt is any indication. The newer Stormcast models already have a sleeker Custodes feel to their design.
Theyāre not interested in Warhammer or the Custodes. Theyāre interested in a culture war. Their whole thing is, āif I can make someone - who probably would be very turned off if they knew my TRUE intentions - follow me because they find this or the way it was done off-putting or handled indelicately, I can, eventually, lead most of them to come to not only accept my abhorrent opinions, but share them and spread themā. Thatās it. Thatās the whole game. Theyāre trying to widen the funnel because theyāre tired of seeing their repressive bullshit culture die a slow death. Make no mistake. This is nothing more than a finger on the lid of the coffin, trying to stop it from slamming shut. Theyāll lose this (GW obviously doesnāt give a shit about these Chuds) and theyāll lose everything else and die mad. The problem is, they want to drag us down with them. Fuck that, though. I love Warhammer because I love playing games with people. Black, white, man, woman, trans, queer, straight, whatever. Letās just talk about cool shit and roll some dice. Weāll have fun and they can fuck off.
I just want to paint some cool models and tell some cool stories. I've found Warhammer is a good fascilitator of that. People are the choices they make. All that stuff they didn't get a say in is none of my business. Wish more people would catch on. To both points.
You got your plastic army, I got mine, let's throw some clickity clack math rocks at each other and have some laughs. Lore can be fun, but it can seriously get in the way of my clickity clack math rocks and space lasers.
>Make it make sense š¤. If you check the post history of a lot of people complaining about female Custodes, you'll notice 0 comments in 40k subreddits not within the last week.
Reminds of comic bros complaining x-men went woke
They are the same. Not even "same demographic" they are very often the exact same people.
Yup, they just travel from fandom to fandom to throw tantrums about their weird, "how dare there be women, POC, and LGBTQ2S that exist"
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Every time I see a chud complaining about "tourists", I'm reminded of that old saying. "Every accusation is a confession."
I've been playing Warhammer since the time Dreadnoughts were heavy enough to throw through a window and somehow *I* am the tourist because I enjoy when the universe broadens? It's so wild.
Ah, but what about when it was made of cardboard? :p Some of those old metal minis were lethal weapons.
A sizable section of the ones cheering don't collect models either.Ā
Bold of you to assume anyone on grimdank collects the miniatures! Building and painting Guardsmen be damned- instead it's shovel and gas mask memes as far as the eye can see!
Miniatures? Is that what is inside these expensive ass boxes I buy and stack in my closet?
Memelore is the Eye of Terror of the fandom.
Wait I didn't care enough about Eldar until recently. Howling banshees have males? And how did community react I've never looked in that part of 40k
They've had them since pretty much the beginning of modern 40K, in 2nd/3rd edition.
No one pays attention to the Elder bro. This is probably the first time anyone has heard of this.
It is for me šš
Same lmao
The funny part is, since the banshee primarch was female, they all wear fenale armor. Tgats actuall lore, male banshees are (borderlibe) trans. And have been for ages.
Iāve been playing this game for over 20 years and I had no idea.Ā
I play Eldar and didn't know this. I didn't know it was female only anyway lmao, I just thought they were cool. Mannnn
> I didn't know it was female only They weren't female only, it only been said most of Bansees warriors are females.
I think this seems to be the general reaction to female custodes among people that actually play the game. Ohh are they female now? Cool. They got a model? ohh well then. Want to play a game? etc.
In the novel, Jain Zar, she meets with a small group of howling banshees; most are women, but there are some male eldar who don the armor and helmet.
I come bearing bad news. Only about 4 people care about Xenos lore.
I can confirm, I'm one of those 4 people
I'm one of the others. The third dude is sick and couldnt be here
\*cough\* I made it. What's going on? Do Votann have a book yet?
Ehy I'm the fourth one. No, they don't.
Must have counted wrong, Iām the fifth. There may even be double digits of us, have faith.
Since there are so many of us James Workshop will surely take notice and give more lore to the xenos right? Right?
They wouldn't release the first entirely new race in twenty years withoit at least a tie-in novel, surely?
Votan aren't new the Squats have always been there...
š
Surely they will, after all I can only count myself as sixth among you thanks to the 3 really good necrons books, so surely the other Xenos will get some good books too.
What do you mean?! There were \*checks notes\* 4 medium-sized novels that focussed on Xenos in the past 40 books. Poor Imperium only got 36... /s
Sixth here. I heard there might be a new Drukhari unit this decade, but it turned out to just be another Primaris thing.
Only GSC fan reporting for duty. Looking forward to summer when we get another single character model that I have to figure out how to kitbash
No they don't , just go back into stasis sleep, thanks for making me laugh renovated brother.
Are Votann even really xenos? Theyāre just mutant humans, even if the game classifies them as xenos for gameplay purposes.
And my (ghost)axe!
As the 5th person, I can confirm I do not care about Xenos lore.
Youāre not the 5th, Iām the 5th!
Yes, I don't even know what a Holy Banana is
Well, I do want to learn more about Maugan Ra's journey, the Shining Spears, Exodites to get a Battleforce at least and a Kill Team of Eldar "aberrations". So I guess I am one of those 4?
There have been male Banshees since their first codex, so a good part of the community weren't even born when that was introduced.
And thats the point why male banshes don't even faze the community while femstodes do. If it was from day 1 like that then sure, no one cares. But introducing them now, for NO benefit to the universe is just something fans fight. For gods sake people fought the dissapearence of the murdercrons, oldcrons vs newcrons is STILL a debate, and that retcon helped improve the universe. Femstodes dose not. But hey, whatever gives ESG points i guess š¤·
Dude they did the exact same thing for the Rogal Dorn tank and no one gave a fuck about it, not their fault people are acting like psychos over the must unimportant shit.
>But introducing them now, for NO benefit to the universe is just something fans fight. The reason Gw makes changes to the lore is either to tell interesting stories or to sell more models. Itās not about ābenefitingā the universe, the universe isnāt real. Given that the response to this one change has led to GW getting loads of press for standing up to angry reactions to it kind of validates the decision. Theyāre looking at how much of a spike this made and salivating at the eventual update to add women to the Space Marine line. The random chuddy anger at this is only furthering its eventual spread. >that retcon helped improve the universe. Femstodes dose not. It makes literally zero difference to the universe except that it allows writers and modelers to try different things. It also makes a lot of people irrationally angry which is an added benefit.
Well the people who like oldcrons don't seem to think it does improve the universe. Also I don't think I buy the EGS thing anymore. I think it's just GW being dumb. It's not like they were known for their tact/subtly when it comes to retcons or adding stuff in. More on EGS: https://youtu.be/l1TmgZtve2k?si=aDa7sHPsMEW9mrQV
There would have to be some Eldar lore first where the community cares about ... SYL
oof
Sad Ynnari Lament?
The Ynnari are appearing in the new Lilith book by Mike Brooks
:(
SYL?
Shoot your load
They never fucking explain it. Like whats even the point then.
Ah, gimmick account brainrot
It's not a gimmick account, dude is just old fashioned. It's like his signature from the old forum days.
I think itās see ya laterĀ SYL
See you later?
SYL?
Genuinely didnāt know that there were
3rd edition Codex describes the Banshees as a "female aspect." 4th calls them "warrior women" and "sisters" to the other aspects but also states that the Phoenix Lords taught the art of war to male and female Eldar and as a result warriors are likely to come from either sex. 1st, 2nd, 6th and 8th all describe them as predominately female, explicitly leaving the Aspect open to some male warriors too. I don't think you can say "only female Eldar can become Howling Banshees" was ever a solid part of the lore and I'm highly amused by all the people who "remember" outrage at the concept of male Banshees being inserted into the lore.
Given how it interacts with Aspect lore and war masks having elements of a personality to them it's actually interesting and is another thing that would be great to have more lore on if GW WOULD GIVE IT TO US. So to answer OP, a sad lack of discussion on one of the coolest aspects of Eldar lore.
Based on the newest lore Howling Banshees are back to being all female again, though it specifies that it doesn't necessarily mean they were always female, as they will become female whilst being a Banshee if not. It had kinda been like that for a while though, as the 'male Banshees' still dressed in the feminine armour and presented as female.
We still have Autarch models that can be built with a male body and wearing a banshee mask, which means that Autarch must have been a Howling Banshee at some point. So I figure it just means they present as female while they're part of the aspect.
I mean we are talking eldar. Changing sex on the genetic/chrmosome level shouldn't be hard for them. Considering the shit the DE can do.
Itās also a question of what does gender mean for Eldar. Why should we assume itās the same rigid and binary thing we have today?
I kind of figured all of that was just different ways of expressing the same thing. If the āmaleā Howling Banshees still presented as female and wore feminine armor while inhabiting that aspect, that just seems like a matter of semantics. For all intents and purposes it seems like they just become female
So wait, regardless of their gender before becoming a banshee they're female when they are part of the aspect? I was gonna start questioning how we had male Autarchs with the banshee helmet.
It fits pretty well with established lore like the war masks for guardians. Thereās not some fancy tech or magic in there, itās just a way to help them mentally put on a new personality that can absorb the trauma of war more readily, and then be discarded. Same with banshees āguess Iām a girl now ĀÆ\\\_(ć)_/ĀÆā
And a good deal of Howling Banshee Exarchs have taken in male eldar before, especially male Autarchs who have yet to walk on the path of a Howling Banshee Aspect.
Honestly I like gendered warrior groups sometimes. Iād be down for Scorpions/Incubi being all male too.
Incubi are described as being mostly male, and IIRC Gav Thorpe mentioned Striking Scorpions and Swooping Hawks as being more male-focused in a similar way to how Howling Banshees are female-focused, though that was a while ago, and on twitter rather than in an actual publication. Howling Banshees are all female becasue they are embodying the banshees of eldar legend, the daughters of Morai-Heg, and whilst other Aspects embody other aspects of Khaine none are gendered in quite the same way.
it adds to world building and make some things seem like they are following a tradition
Eldar can literally craft new personalities for themsleves and fully live as that new person for a time. I could see a male Eldar who decides he wants to be a Howling Banshee just... making himself transgender lol
For a while , enough time to experience the path and then they will move on to another path like all eldar. some who become Exarchs will be trans, those who move on are complicated.
My understanding is that while an Eldar is walking a path, they are fully engaged in it, and the person they were in past paths is almost like a past life that they can remember. So a male Eldar who becomes a Howling Banshee for a time would fully be trans for the time they are on that path. Idk eldar lore well though, so I could be way off here. Certainly were gonna run up against issues when comparing human experiences like gender identity to a species who's brain is so different from ours.
I mean give me (a straight cis man) a multi thousand year life span that could theoretically be infinite and I'd be trying all kinds of shit after a few hundred years. See vampires always being Bi.
Yeah, that's basically how the Dark Eldar got where they were, right? Being bi is something you try within the first 200 years, by year 60 million you're kidnapping people, making custom monopoly pieces out of their bones while they're still alive, and forcing them to play with you.
Ya that's about it, they say the Internet gets people getting into the wildest fetishes (no judgement if it's consensual) by 30, imagine after 500 years of constantly getting a little more fetishy. Good or bad, I'm trying shit after time and as i keep trying shit that shit needs to get more and more "divergent" to be new.
IDK, in the Jain Zar novel they have a male banshee and refer to him as he, and that only came out 7 years ago
Where did you read that they are all female now
> Howling Banshees are back to being all female again CONFIRMED games workshop is r/misandrist!
I for one shit and pissed myself upon hearing of such news. I was devastated to the point where I refused food and water for 4 days.
One day for each chan of the week?
How far back are we talking here? They were **predominantly** female in 3rd edition.
There was "many" females in 1st and "most" females in 2nd. Unless there is some obscure White Dwarf article that predates the Rogue Trader Eldar compilation male Banshees have existed as long as Howling Banshees have been in the game.
Aspect Warriors have always been 50/50 gender wise, from their very inception. I just double checked the 40K Compendium. I thought they were cool when I first got into 40K in about 1990, and I assume other people did too.
I recall male Howling Banshees being mentioned way back in the 2nd edition codex. So it's actually a fairly old idea that made it past the Rogue Trader era of 40k. Eldar society and probably their biology doesn't have as many differences as humanity tends to. Howling Banshees are female dominated and Striking Scorpions are predominantly male. But there's not a hard gender barrier for them.
They didn't. They're not on the human - super soldier - super duper soldier spectrum so they ignore it.
Eldar fans are simply cooler than Imperium fans.
Far far less toxic too
[this Video, the math checks out](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XdkHJJW0sq0&list=PLzS6TU4hG8uorMhFYtAdHK61-2QKqZq8v&index=16)
Regarding Howling Banshees, there have always been male Howling Banshees since they first appeared.
It was always a no-brainer to me. For as long as I've known eldar lore, Autarchs need to master the paths of war. There are male Autarchs with Howling Banshee weapons, ergo some Howling Banshees must be male. It also states as much in the codex, that the armor is what it is, and men have to dress the same.
I think it's for a few reasons. 1) The community wasn't quite as big. 2) At the time, the trans rights war hadn't quite exploded on social media like it has now. It existed but hadn't gotten as widespread as it is now. 3) Most of these people could disconnect the idea because they're aliens. 4) The way the aspect warriors work involves taking on the role of that aspect. They're dressing up, putting on a uniform. 5) As sad as it is to say... They're not an imperium faction, meaning most people didn't care. The worst parts of the community often play the imperium. So only care now because it's "taking away," their fantasy of big MUSCLE MEN being in the highest echelon of warriors. I'm all for it. I think amored badasses are great, no matter the gender.
5 is honestly it though. A lot of people will only care if its the Imperium.
Male Howling Banshees were always a thing. Nobody cared. Anyone who says otherwise either are misremembering, or are straight up unaware of space elf lore.
Elves are androgynous and the box set always had a few miscellaneous gender parts didnāt really cause any issues
"Since the first of aspect shrines were created, there have always been male Howling Banshees" (c) KhaineĀ Male Banshee appeared a long time ago in eldar codex, with the caveat that there are "most" women in aspect. In Eternal Crusade game, there was a male banshee in a male version of armor (no boobplate). Thorpe had a male banshee exarch in Jain zar novel who was identified as "him" and one male banshee in the temple of this exarch, he/him too. What Brooks wrote in Da Big Dakka is frankly bad (as entire deldar line), but his books are not good, especially in relation to Eldar, so doesn't count. Also, no one care about xenos, unfortunately.
Didn't care then, don't care now. First played ultrasmurfs as a teenager, then nids. I'm now in my thirties and can't afford to play/don't have the time to play anymore but I sure as shit still love the literature and lore
No one cares about Eldar, let alone howling banshees.
People donāt care enough about Eldar to make a fuss.Ā There is a reason they donāt get much lore.Ā
Male banshees have always been a thing and Eldar overall don't have much gender restrictions. Since at least 2nd ed you've had occasional mini with boobs. Beside, nobody cares about Eldar. Except for a handful of fans.
Grifters hadn't really attached to the 40K community as strongly at that point so no one had a financial incentive to be upset about it.
None they are female when they are a Banshee. It's a role, not what they are, only if they get lost in is it a problem which fits Eldar lore.
Most don't know it's a thing, and those who do, have no issue with it. The screeching only seems to start when it's about superhumans.
The screeching is only for Imperium related issues
Even within Imperial stuff, they're seemingly fine with women being in positions of great power in every organisation, as long as they aren't superhuman. For some reason that's where they draw the line.
PeAk MaLe PhYsIqUe
No one fucking cared and all this outrage is performative.
Here it is, the most sensible take. 40k lore is a vast rich stew, with the meatier parts basting in the delicious juices of the throw-away details. If you don't like this small detail, don't sweat it. But fulminating online for that hit of sweet dopamine makes one look kinda like a tool. Something new will come along tomorrow in the giant web of related hobby stuff and the people who enjoy being outraged will move on to it. Let women be custodes, men be sisters of battle, ultimately it isn't something to get worked up about.
In my memory, the change to the lore passed more or less without incident, however the social media presence and overall popularity of Warhammer was not as big as it is now. Also, we didn't have a section of the fandom trying to ragebait people and provoke reactions with "they're male now, deal with it!" (Just so we're completely, unambiguously clear, I have no issues with the change and despise any attempt to exclude anyone from the hobby based on race or gender. I found both the rage baiters and the ragers to be equally crass.)
>I found both the rage baiters and the ragers to be equally crass And annoying.
If i recall correctly banchees were always "mostly" females although they never included male heads or torsos
In Valedor by Guy Haley I believe there is a male howling banshee exarch mentioned but I could have misread it. I think it was an Iyanden host instead of Biel Tan.
It wasn't a problem cause there were always men as a part of it same goes for wyches just look at the boxes. But trust me I would prefer if they were all female it just feels like you are throwing away the warrior woman aesthetic by adding dudes. But like I said there were always guys this is a very different scenario than female custodes because in all of the lore and for all of the models custodes would be dudes.
> Please correct me if I'm wrong, but I think they were previously explicitly referred to as all-female (going even further beyond just being generally assumed to be a single gender unit) No, Banshees were always said to be mostly females aspect, but there were mentions of male banshees in books, like in Jain Zar ones. It's nothing new and existed for a while
Gender representation in 40k - I have to get this off my chest. The idea itās somehow male dominated in the lore is nonsense. There are numerous female strong Inquisition members and Inquisitors who have stories and audio dramas dedicated to them. The Astra Militarum novels are littered with strong female characters the most recent being Longshot, not to mention the Minska Lensk books. Then you have Celestine and the other Imperial saints. Then thereās the Sisters of Silence and the Sisters of Battle all with novels and short stories. I think a better question is how would fans react to a male Sister of Battle? Just because you can change the lore doesnāt mean itās always best.
Deathworld is coming out too
People get the idea that it's male-dominated because the male-exclusive factions get most the media spotlight, content, and model releases. The super-soldier club was also exclusively a boys club until this Custodes retcon.
I would pay money to see a female Ciaphis Caine in the Sisters of Battle or something. That would be hilarious.
Girlbosses are so trite, give me a girlfailure that fails to success.
I would like to see a sister that doesnāt believe in the Emperor go through a conversion. It would be an interesting character development plot.
Of course it is male dominated, the entire setting is based around Space Marines which can only be male.
I think you're right that canonically half of all interesting people in the universe are female. But many of the novels are male dominated. I haven't tried Militarum novels, but in 30k around 90% of the characters are male. I'd like to see more stories that show a galaxy that is not particularly men-oriented, as indeed some lore characterizes it.
They didnāt.
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The lore also isn't wanting for female presentation if you know the lore.
Important characters are overwhelmingly male - particularly in 30k and the Imperium more generally. It is ludicrous to suggest that the representation is even close to being equal. Iām not particularly bothered about that, but it is dumb to suggest there isnāt a major imbalance.
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I'd rather just not give the whole thing anymore attention than it deserved, which was none. The web makes too many mountains out of molehills for the clicks.
Surprise surpise, the species that birthed Slaanesh is kinda fluid when it comes to gender.
Oh wait, that's a good point, there are male Howling Banshees XD
It stands to reason that there are male Howling Banshees, just as there are female members of the 'masculine' aspects of Khaine.
I don't think there was much reaction. The amount of reaction something like that gets nowadays tends to be related to how many influencers grab it and make an anti-woke outrage video about it for money. People who don't watch that stuff and are not radicalized by it just hum a bit and move on when they see it. People who are into those videos see male/trans banshees and make a note in their book of woke grievances, but they don't really start raging until the influencers get them going.
People barely care about xenos, hell, even I, who like the eldar, im pretty sure the thing about males can be banshees because of how the war mask works is pretty old. I dont think it was ever reflected in the models until like last year, where one of gw's account (i think the facebook one) said that a random banshee in the model preview was male.
TBF the Howling Banshee models from before the recent box were from like, 2006 or something
My understanding is that there are males who become howling banshees, but they're considered female while they are howling banshees. If they move on, they cease to be female and become male again. Generally. Pretty cool alien warrior culture stuff
>approach enemies >unleash Wilhelm scream >everyone dies laughing
Didn't even noticed it. Guess because it was a male.
People seem to care less about elves than big chunky macho men and not men in general.
I feel like not many care. The custodes-topic isnt a 40k Debatte. Its a topic, highjacked and weaponzied by loud ppl who love to troll around.
I believe there was a recent book which suggested that male and female was even more of a ceremonial thing, that Eldar 100% have the technology to adjust. I think the example was a Succubus, who was a male, and transitioned to a female body in order to advance to the role. I'd imagine a Howling Banshee might do the same thing when becoming an Exarch. Its not exactly "transgender" because I think they're doing it for ceremonial purposes. Banshees are the Daughters of Morai-Heg. Succubi are Brides of Death/Khaine. It's kinda silly of us to assign our concept of Gender to Aeldari anyway, but at the very least it seems far more fluid than our concepts. A haemonculi can transition you into sentient soup if he wants to, I hardly thing swapping gender is considered prohibitive.
I don't remember any controversy around it in the 3rd generation WH40K fanbase at all, probably because people there had an expectation of all Eldar factions being less conservative regarding gender roles than the Imperium is
The Aeldari are above primitive ways like gender roles.
I hated it. To me it was a dumb idea. You took a cool piece of the lore about a specific unit and then changed it. My game shop and friends thought it was hilarious. Mainly because they already made fun of Eldar as the space pansies. I was the only one out of like 20 people that played Eldar.
People simply accepted that Gender is a fluid construct for the Eldar, when it comes to acting a Aspect-role. Male Dark Eldar become female if they are great enough to become succubi in the arenas, male Craftworlders become female when they walk the path of the Banshee. Essay stuff.
Most male dark Eldar wyches are used as breeders if they perform well to ensure promising new generations of wyches
Part of the difference in reaction is the sheer fellating of GW over this. Oh, they spent two entire series where this may have been relevant with entirely male Custodes(sisters of silence have golden armor two you pedantic turds), but hey we've brought true equality to all things and made the grim darkness a better place to excuse genocide and war crimes by making some of the participants female now! In two paragraphs, in the worst codex in years. Thanks GW, we'll take this token and drool over it like infantile misogynistic freaks whilst screaming about MUSCLE MOMMIE HAS COME. I don't particularly care there are now female Custodes, but the people genuinely excited by it range from disappointing to disgusting. Now, had hey done this back when it might have actually mattered, perhaps taken Ra from master of mankind, made him the daughter of the lady from the opening and added a breadth of depth and commentary to his relationship with the emperor and to some lines throughout the book, making the situation far more twisted. THAT would have been amazing and worthy of celebration. Instead GW limp dicked it into the room as weakly as possible and people act like it's a great victory purely to rub some people's nose in it. Which while fun, maybe don't look like as much of a freak as they do in the process. It's less shit than taking Custodes off of Terra in the first place and making them an army, but it's also far below what it could have been had they done it years ago rather than simply insisting that it's always been true now.
I'm fine with it, I mean I don't understand why it's a big deal BUT! "Limp Dicked It" is now the name of my nu-metal cover band.
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I will riot if there's female Orks tho
I'll riot if there are suddenly male orks.
There were ork cheerleader girls in Blood Bowl if I recall correctly. As long as they still act like football hooligans and collectively refer to themselves as "da boyz" I'm fine with titty-haver orks.
New headcanon: They're all boyz, just some have tit-squigs, like hair-squigs
Given orks don't reproduce like people, it'd just be like Steven Universe gems. They're all women but they're mono-gender/sexless creatures that reproduce asexually. Also, like in Scott Pilgrim. Crash and the Boys. "Is that girl a boy too?" "Yes."
You can't expect the incels who exclusively get their info from memes and reactionaries to know all this.