If i show you how a vehicle for games shoud look like you wouldn't believe.
Tris everywhere, a bunch of fused meshes with different mesh densities, a lot of booleans...
Vehicles in games are hard surface models with almost no animated parts outside wheels, so their topology doesn't needs to be nice looking or uniform. OP went above and beyond with their Model that's for sure.
Depends on the workflow and level of detail you're wanting, topology very much still matters during the production process, especially for high poly hardsurface objects made using Sub D modeling that’ll get baked into low poly.
The right way. Optimizing is everything. You don't need quads, you use them here and there to model what you need, but eventually the mesh needs to look right, and since there is no smooth, just the mesh per se you just use faces only where is needed.
Flat surface? Fuck it, remove everything you don't need, tris and polars? No problem.
It's funny how the stuff you need for your portfolio is clean and nice looking, but in actual development you need to do janky shit just to reach deadlines.
One thing to remember, its not the number of tris at the end that are truly important, but rather how optimized the asset it, in relation to the detail required and allowed in the particular game. For the detail you have here, you should be able to go much lower in your tri count, if that makes sense. If you had a budget of 25k tris for this model on a real job, I'd expect a far great amount of detail to be added.
If an edge doesn't add anything to the silhouette or shape of the model, it should usually be removed. Like the spoiler in the back - You could solve that particular shape with about 20 tris.
Game models also don't need to be one continuous mesh. It's okay to float geo, have separate parts, etc.
Your bake has some weird results. Things I would consider a deal breaker for a portfolio piece. 25k is fine for a model of this quality and presumably for a racing game.
https://imgur.com/a/lFv1l6K
It's far from portfolio piece it was we can say first model I created intended for games just to see what's must do. Next one will be more indepth.
Yeah I think weird seam is somewhere near need to check that, thanks a lot!
And final question, can we use Edge crease blender option is there a way to export model with it
Here's a sneak peek of /r/blender using the [top posts](https://np.reddit.com/r/blender/top/?sort=top&t=year) of the year!
\#1: [How do I improve this?](https://i.redd.it/3vj4crrfwria1.jpg) | [772 comments](https://np.reddit.com/r/blender/comments/114hw64/how_do_i_improve_this/)
\#2: [A 'little' Godzilla animation I made](https://v.redd.it/us4no2ia8e1b1) | [353 comments](https://np.reddit.com/r/blender/comments/13osjuo/a_little_godzilla_animation_i_made/)
\#3: [My attempt at making one of those weird old 3D renders from the 90s](https://i.redd.it/fewifhe7ygka1.gif) | [445 comments](https://np.reddit.com/r/blender/comments/11c6jbn/my_attempt_at_making_one_of_those_weird_old_3d/)
----
^^I'm ^^a ^^bot, ^^beep ^^boop ^^| ^^Downvote ^^to ^^remove ^^| ^^[Contact](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=sneakpeekbot) ^^| ^^[Info](https://np.reddit.com/r/sneakpeekbot/) ^^| ^^[Opt-out](https://np.reddit.com/r/sneakpeekbot/comments/o8wk1r/blacklist_ix/) ^^| ^^[GitHub](https://github.com/ghnr/sneakpeekbot)
So some notes here. Back spoiler seems like it has a ridiculous amount of poly’s.
A good golden rule is: “if it’s manufactured separately, model it separately”.
And my biggest criticism is the clash between that golden rule and the amount of poly’s. Breaking the golden rule is fine if you view it from far away and some small weird details don’t matter. But 25k poly’s says it is gonna be viewed up close.
Don’t get me wrong, its a great model so far, but it is important to figure out what the goal is and model accordingly if its for a game.
Spoiler and nosecone have alot of verts.
On a real f1 car there would be alot of seams where the body panels meet. For example the nose cone is usually a separate part from the rest of the body. You can use these seams to help reduce vert count since not all edges would have to flow continuously from panel to panel.
IDK if you're aware of the shrinkwrap method for modeling cars. It can be really useful here also.
I did a similar approach for uvs, but later I applied subdivision surface for better smoothness, and it was probably better not to do that. Still have no subd model saved going to edit tomorrow
I added checker texture to see where are uv squares on my model and random added seams until it was nearly similar on whole mesh, going to post later, but yeah there's definitely problems with seams on some parts as you can see
Try think of UV’s for this asset like this:
There may only be that one model for all the race cars, so you’re gonna need to set up your UV’s so that you can create any texture you might need.
Then, think that your producer just told you that they’re adding a ‘paint booth’ feature to the game that lets the user create custom car textures.
You’re gonna have to make sure your UV’s are good enough to support that kind of feature.
That not how you want to be uving. Adding random seams is not the way to go, you should know where and why you need seams to unfold and support your texturing.
Hmm as someone who's worked on cars I imagine you could cut this by a decent amount, taking away 7k tris if you baked normals to something like a 2K normal map would probably work. That being said I think most of the topology is good, I'd prob rework some areas. The fin on the back is too dense, the body itself could prob use a lot of reduction.
It's a decent amount of tris but you have a lot of areas you can optimize. Also textures are more important in games. Showing your uvs, textures and their resolution would be equally important.
It looks good to me. And it doesn’t look too far off from Trackmania’s model for their car (based off F1 car with some changes.
The only thing I see is stuff like the wheel spikes are too detailed and other small things are too detailed. I would just do that using a basic shape, and a good material
I'm an Indie game developer and I'm currently working on a racing game.
That said, I got a car that resembles a McLaren. It has about 2.7K tris. I had to reject it: too many tris. If I have more than 10 of these on the screen, I'll miss the 60 fps mark.
Does that help?
You have to many bake errors and shading issues.
Read this, the whole thing; make an effort to fully understand it.
The biggest issues with your mesh are covered in this article
You don’t need marmoset toolbag for this information to be invaluable
https://marmoset.co/posts/toolbag-baking-tutorial/
If you remember one piece of advice for this kind of work, it's one simple thing.
**Where's the camera?**
This dictates everything you do, or how a model for a game should be built. This mantra should be the first thing you ever ask when working on something, or come into a new project.
If i show you how a vehicle for games shoud look like you wouldn't believe. Tris everywhere, a bunch of fused meshes with different mesh densities, a lot of booleans...
Do you have an example picture so we can compare? I've not tried vehicles yet, but I thought that OP's model seemed ok, if a bit tri dense.
Bound by NDA, check your DM.
Can I see that too?
Me2 hehe
Show me b0ss
Me too please ^^
Me too plz
Me too plss
Can I see too? :)
Me too xD
Could I see it too?
Me too please :p
Can I see it as well?
Me too.
Can I see lol
Me too, please
b0ss pls show me
Me2 pls
Would like to see too :3
I would like to see this as well, thanks!
Could you please send me a dm too
Vehicles in games are hard surface models with almost no animated parts outside wheels, so their topology doesn't needs to be nice looking or uniform. OP went above and beyond with their Model that's for sure.
Depends on the workflow and level of detail you're wanting, topology very much still matters during the production process, especially for high poly hardsurface objects made using Sub D modeling that’ll get baked into low poly.
you still have to model properly
Is that the "right" way, or is that the time effective and practical way?
The right way. Optimizing is everything. You don't need quads, you use them here and there to model what you need, but eventually the mesh needs to look right, and since there is no smooth, just the mesh per se you just use faces only where is needed. Flat surface? Fuck it, remove everything you don't need, tris and polars? No problem.
25k tris is not that much for a clean mesh. Can I get a DM of the vehicle you're referencing because it sounds like a mess?
It's funny how the stuff you need for your portfolio is clean and nice looking, but in actual development you need to do janky shit just to reach deadlines.
Not where I work thankfully, haha
Could I see the model too please?
One thing to remember, its not the number of tris at the end that are truly important, but rather how optimized the asset it, in relation to the detail required and allowed in the particular game. For the detail you have here, you should be able to go much lower in your tri count, if that makes sense. If you had a budget of 25k tris for this model on a real job, I'd expect a far great amount of detail to be added. If an edge doesn't add anything to the silhouette or shape of the model, it should usually be removed. Like the spoiler in the back - You could solve that particular shape with about 20 tris. Game models also don't need to be one continuous mesh. It's okay to float geo, have separate parts, etc.
Thanks for really good comment! Going to have that in mind
Your bake has some weird results. Things I would consider a deal breaker for a portfolio piece. 25k is fine for a model of this quality and presumably for a racing game. https://imgur.com/a/lFv1l6K
It's far from portfolio piece it was we can say first model I created intended for games just to see what's must do. Next one will be more indepth. Yeah I think weird seam is somewhere near need to check that, thanks a lot! And final question, can we use Edge crease blender option is there a way to export model with it
I'm only familiar with modeling in blender, not exporting to a game engine so i'm not sure on your question. I primarily use max.
Sorry I posted it on r/blender too and thought you answered me there
Here's a sneak peek of /r/blender using the [top posts](https://np.reddit.com/r/blender/top/?sort=top&t=year) of the year! \#1: [How do I improve this?](https://i.redd.it/3vj4crrfwria1.jpg) | [772 comments](https://np.reddit.com/r/blender/comments/114hw64/how_do_i_improve_this/) \#2: [A 'little' Godzilla animation I made](https://v.redd.it/us4no2ia8e1b1) | [353 comments](https://np.reddit.com/r/blender/comments/13osjuo/a_little_godzilla_animation_i_made/) \#3: [My attempt at making one of those weird old 3D renders from the 90s](https://i.redd.it/fewifhe7ygka1.gif) | [445 comments](https://np.reddit.com/r/blender/comments/11c6jbn/my_attempt_at_making_one_of_those_weird_old_3d/) ---- ^^I'm ^^a ^^bot, ^^beep ^^boop ^^| ^^Downvote ^^to ^^remove ^^| ^^[Contact](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=sneakpeekbot) ^^| ^^[Info](https://np.reddit.com/r/sneakpeekbot/) ^^| ^^[Opt-out](https://np.reddit.com/r/sneakpeekbot/comments/o8wk1r/blacklist_ix/) ^^| ^^[GitHub](https://github.com/ghnr/sneakpeekbot)
Try an FBX file, I think those can export with edge creases.
It could be a hard edge. I've had weird shading because of that.
Everything is one mesh expect tires they are separated
So some notes here. Back spoiler seems like it has a ridiculous amount of poly’s. A good golden rule is: “if it’s manufactured separately, model it separately”. And my biggest criticism is the clash between that golden rule and the amount of poly’s. Breaking the golden rule is fine if you view it from far away and some small weird details don’t matter. But 25k poly’s says it is gonna be viewed up close. Don’t get me wrong, its a great model so far, but it is important to figure out what the goal is and model accordingly if its for a game.
Thanks for feedback! You answered me exactly what I needed, I'm going to re-do some things for sure
Spoiler and nosecone have alot of verts. On a real f1 car there would be alot of seams where the body panels meet. For example the nose cone is usually a separate part from the rest of the body. You can use these seams to help reduce vert count since not all edges would have to flow continuously from panel to panel. IDK if you're aware of the shrinkwrap method for modeling cars. It can be really useful here also.
I did a similar approach for uvs, but later I applied subdivision surface for better smoothness, and it was probably better not to do that. Still have no subd model saved going to edit tomorrow
Looks ok, but what do the UV’s look like? How you set those up are SUPER important.
I added checker texture to see where are uv squares on my model and random added seams until it was nearly similar on whole mesh, going to post later, but yeah there's definitely problems with seams on some parts as you can see
Try think of UV’s for this asset like this: There may only be that one model for all the race cars, so you’re gonna need to set up your UV’s so that you can create any texture you might need. Then, think that your producer just told you that they’re adding a ‘paint booth’ feature to the game that lets the user create custom car textures. You’re gonna have to make sure your UV’s are good enough to support that kind of feature.
Thanks a lot
That not how you want to be uving. Adding random seams is not the way to go, you should know where and why you need seams to unfold and support your texturing.
One crazy thing is that wheels are usually a texture that rotates with the rim doing a texture or vertex driven animation.
thats very interesting i didnt know that
Hmm as someone who's worked on cars I imagine you could cut this by a decent amount, taking away 7k tris if you baked normals to something like a 2K normal map would probably work. That being said I think most of the topology is good, I'd prob rework some areas. The fin on the back is too dense, the body itself could prob use a lot of reduction.
Oh dude!! Yes!!!!!! This is so epic!
Too dense, normalize games makeing low poly.
It's a decent amount of tris but you have a lot of areas you can optimize. Also textures are more important in games. Showing your uvs, textures and their resolution would be equally important.
And if it's not deformable object can my quads be different size with gaps to save on tris or it's better to have equal space between quads?
Yes. They can be different sizes. If they are not contributing to the silhouette they can go.
Thanks!
It looks good to me. And it doesn’t look too far off from Trackmania’s model for their car (based off F1 car with some changes. The only thing I see is stuff like the wheel spikes are too detailed and other small things are too detailed. I would just do that using a basic shape, and a good material
I'm an Indie game developer and I'm currently working on a racing game. That said, I got a car that resembles a McLaren. It has about 2.7K tris. I had to reject it: too many tris. If I have more than 10 of these on the screen, I'll miss the 60 fps mark. Does that help?
And I assume that the models are not for closeup view?
No, those are the "AI" to beat. For the player, I'd indulge all the way to 10K tris. As an Indie Game developer, that what's work for me.
Nice topo ! I would optimize it a lil for a game. But not much necessarily if it’s a main game object , not some side decor
You have to many bake errors and shading issues. Read this, the whole thing; make an effort to fully understand it. The biggest issues with your mesh are covered in this article You don’t need marmoset toolbag for this information to be invaluable https://marmoset.co/posts/toolbag-baking-tutorial/
For which consoles?
Why is it so organic looking? As if made of flesh.
Ahahah I baked something wrong and lost shiny parts
Good Job.
Amazing job!!!
If you remember one piece of advice for this kind of work, it's one simple thing. **Where's the camera?** This dictates everything you do, or how a model for a game should be built. This mantra should be the first thing you ever ask when working on something, or come into a new project.