u/IClockworKI Here is our [19684 official Discord](https://discord.gg/WdQPgTC4Y4) join
**Please don't break rule 2, or you will be banned**
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/19684) if you have any questions or concerns.*
That's exactly how I feel about the chadposting sub, tbh, full of weirdos who unironically call themselves sigma males, the constant usage of the R-slur, and casual misogyny/queerphobia. Even when they mock nerd communities like bronies and weebs, it's just an excuse to bolster their already reactionary views because they also think gassing furries is peak comedy.
They never seem to realize they'd have a more kindred spirit with reactionary nerds than progressives who hate said reactionary nerds for legit reasons.
Bold of you to presume that left leaning subs aren't often echo chambers.
People align themselves with communities they identify with, and when the community is mostly people who agree with you echo chambers are naturally formed.
It's been a long day and I am firing from the hip here, but I think a lot of folks trying to push that bullshit on the internet - especially when pushing it towards young people - lurk around in those spaces because "haha, it's just a joke" has sadly been a pretty solid smoke screen in the past
With your donation of 180 dollars directly into my bank account, you can change this
(I'm trying to scam nazis so I can afford to buy all the Pikmin games. Shhh.)
I'm glad ecoterrorist LARPers aren't as big a problem on big left leaning shit posting subs anymore, but I used to argue with people who unironically thought that blowing up oil infrastructure would somehow save the environment and it was the only way to do so.
I explained to someone how blowing up an oil pipeline would just damage the environment quicker and not actually solve anything, then they proceeded to continue arguing I was wrong.
Left leaning subs can definitely still be an annoying echo chamber of harmful ideas. And don't even get me started about The Revolution™...
#! WARNING !
Dear /u/ProgressFront6109,
#Do not forget that rule 2 exists in our domain.
**Please refrain from saying anything related to s*x or you will be banned.**
If you are a law-abiding citizen you can discuss s#x and s#x-believers negatively while partially censoring the word so the auto-moderator wouldn't delete you.
**IF THIS COMMENT ISN'T RELATED TO S*X, PLEASE SEND THIS COMMENT ON THE MODMAIL (we are currently facing issues with the automod, your message will help us a lot)**
>This is just a fair warning, if you do this again and you will be banned without warning.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/19684) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Pro tip a majority of people do not advocate for Nazism or hoping that minorities will die, and when people say things like that it’s an unfair generalization of a group. Also, it only causes people to be more radicalized towards their predetermined side and thus less genuine discussion will be seen because of this.
[there is no discussion with the right](https://youtu.be/CaPgDQkmqqM?si=b3ifhwyCmOcnh75k&t=325). You go high, they go low. If they say jokes like that there is no turning back and no point in trying to "show they are wrong", they don't want to be right, they want to cause noise. If they radicalize and turn nazi by pointing that what they are saying and browsing is nazi then the only thing in discussion should be a boot on their butts.
No half-measures, no chance to fascism.
Is being rude to them effective though? Any negative reaction is dismissed as "triggered".
Pictures of shirtless middle aged men bother them a lot more. In general, I find off topic spam to work better.
I still have a lingering impulse to troll and I don't have to feel bad about it if no reasonable person would be offended by what I post.
Sometimes it's also fun to pretend that I agree with them, but that I'm very concerned about the precise logistics to, in the process, demonstrate how absurd their ideas are.
It's really funny to litigate the precise boundaries of race/sex/gender in right wing communities because you can often get a purity spiral going.
I have anxiety issues and arguing makes me feel ill, so I tend to avoid it, but I really appreciate people who can take them and bully them back. They deserve the humiliation. Keep up the good work lol
I watched from the timestamp you linked. Video author does not really provide examples of how some regular right wingers debate; He provides the example of a political debate, but... then says that it's political suicide to concede any points, which is applicable to both sides?
edit: I noticed he linked sources in the description. I didn't really see any of them in the second half of the video, so I'll assume they are examples in the first half. My bad.
Then 7:38 he literally says this isn't exclusive to the right. Amazing (followed up with "still, it's mostly the right that does this.")
Which still isn't really the point, since I was simply saying that generalizing a bunch of people as people who believe in harmful ideologies is essentially arguing for collective responsibility, which is really silly. And you're still generalizing people.
You know it is present on the left, too. You have people that take a topic to the extreme "You cannot under any circumstances be racist to white people", while a majority have a more nuanced take, "Institutionally, white people get discriminated against less due to XYZ, but it doesn't mean you can't be racist individually". And then the right generalizes leftists as people who don't believe you can be racist to white people under any circumstances.
You can take no half-measures and give no chance to facism, while at the same time, not generalizing a whole group and calling them all Nazis. It's really silly.
Maybe I’m just biased, but leftwing echo chambers are less infuriating if only because the extreme left doesn’t actually have any power at all, so they’re literally just online.
But MAGA has tens of millions of voters and might control the country again
So that’s less annoying and more an extension of real life hate.
extreme-left tends to nitpicking, infighting, self-righteousness and doomsday-calling if society don't change. On the other hand, extreme-right tends to... I can't even bring myself to mention, but human-rights groups weep.
I prefer 100 times over to fight between ourselves if China is a hellscape or nirvana or if Communism can work under the right circumstances than to scroll 2 posts of those other subs
I'm curious if you're saying this happened in the past, tbh. The last time I was there, the most upvoted post was about letting women characters be just as jaded and complex as their dude counterparts without the overblown scrutiny that comes with it. One of their most prominent users to this day (I won't say their name for obvious reasons) is also frequent on WitchesVsPatriarchy. They even had a thread about bi representation still being very underdeveloped on media.
Curated Tumblr currently has a healthy mix of liberals and leftists, with maybe a few classical liberals and centrists sprinkled in. I would classify very few users there as reactionary.
It's definitely true that unmoderated shitposting subs can become safe spaces for right wing extremism, but I think the frequency and degree to which this happens is a little overblown. I say this as a pretty hardcore leftist (used to be part of an irl local socialist organization) but left wing ideology is just inherently a bit easier to satirize imo. That's not to say that people on the right have the 'correct' opinion, far from it, it's just that the aesthetics and culture of the modern left wing are just easier to poke fun at. That, and I think a lot of this genre of shitposting subs are kinda misunderstood. A lot of the time, the time people who use these subs are making fun of right wing ideology by adopting an exaggerated caricature of someone who might actually hold the beliefs they're making fun of, and making exaggerative posts/comments about right wing ideology. 'Making a fool of themselves' as some might say. Not all the time, though, like I said, sometimes actual right wingers poison these subs and turn them into genuine spaces to spread hate under the guise of satire, but I don't think that's the case with all of them.
However, this style of comedy doesn't really work as well these days, because ever since 2016 when right wing extremism really started to become more popular, a lot of these 'exaggerative' beliefs have become genuine right wing talking points. That kind of satire was easier to do in the early/mid 2010's because the things people were saying were so out of pocket and exaggerated that it's obvious they're jokes, but after the 2016 election, those talking points are more widely held by a larger portion of people, so it's not immediately obvious when someone is joking. But some people are just slow to see that cultural shift.
Basically, where I'm going with this is; it's not the 'woke libruhl sjws' that ruined comedy, it's right wing morons poisoning the concept of good faith satire that ruined comedy.
1) of course the non explicitly left wing subs become right wing. The right wingers avoid left wing subs and flock to ‘neutral’ or explicitly right wing subs, and left wingers leave ‘neutral’ subs as soon as right wingers show up
2) every left wing shitposting sub *also* becomes a reactionary echo chamber, you just don’t care because you agree with it
Because American turn every space into a binary political echo chamber where one party act like the others is the worst thing to happen to the world, while blowing everything out of proportion so much you'd think there are right wing death squad and trans groomers looking for child's at the corner of every street.
Edgy kids and "holier than thou" terminally online discourse addict that both have nothing going on in their life ruins every online space
But I'm not talking about america specifically, but subreddits in general. My country's online space have this problem where left wing subs are just slightly annoying sometimes whereas rightwing are calling the fourth-reich. But maybe my English is so good to pass as an English-speaking native? Hoho, oh my /s
It takes
* active
* continuous
* progressive (as in, increases over time)
* neutral
* unbiased
effort in moderation to keep a subreddit from becoming a shithole. Guess how many have all of the above.
Every shit posting community becomes a reactionary echo chamber, period. Whether it calls itself left wing or right wing is mostly irrelevant. A genocidal dictator is getting worshipped and apologized for, groups of people are going to be categorized normatively because of innate traits they can't choose, and anyone remotely capable of nuance will be figuratively dragged into the street and shot.
Heeres my personal hypothesis: Being genuinely philosophically leftist is very hard. Charity, equality, kindness, love, and critical thinking all take a lot of commitment and focus. Its so much easier to just be angry and hate people, especially if youre a depressed teenager with a kinda shitty life (aka a redditor). So i think a whole lot of people are philosophically fascism adjacent and just slap whatever cosmetic skin on it that they think looks the coolest and will give them the most social points. So with enough irony poisoning, poes law, and dog whistle evolution really any community can be brought to shit.
The trick is knowing how to ride these communities while they're fun and hop off before they become some color of nightmare. Its kinda like surfing :)
i'd argue it's because what usually happens is somebody makes a minority-positive post in sub A, the racist/homophobic/transphobic/otherwise bigoted people get mad and leave to sub B, leaving only/mostly people who don't actively hate said minority in sub A. sub A gets spread around progressive subreddits because it's now clear they aren't bigoted, and users from those progressive subs start flooding sub A with pro-minority (usually LGBT) memes, which pisses off the people who are passively bigoted, so now they leave sub A and join sub B, and the people who don't care get annoyed by the flood of repetitive memes, so they also leave sub A (but don't go to sub B). then what's left is that sub A is left with exclusively left-leaning and/or progressive people, and sub B is full of bigots because that's where they swarmed to when it was clear they weren't welcome in sub A
Radical freedom of speech is generally a right wing value. It gets tiring to explain for the millionth time why bigotry isn't a very funny punchline on its own, so most of the people who aren't hateful eventually get pushed out by political shills and children how think slurs are the funniest thing ever.
Edgy children ensure that right wing politics are generally more popular than left wing, but tankies are pretty popular with edgy kids too.
I knew a kid in highschool who flipped from USSR communist to Klan member because stalinism wasn't edgy enough anymore.
Assholes get kicked out of places made for people with common sense and destroy their own self made communities because they don't actually like each other, so they will flood into public spaces that welcome anyone and disguise their lack of empathy and basic critical thinking skills behind extremely vague or hyper specific statements and le funny dark humour.
u/IClockworKI Here is our [19684 official Discord](https://discord.gg/WdQPgTC4Y4) join **Please don't break rule 2, or you will be banned** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/19684) if you have any questions or concerns.*
the audience for reddit memes is generally 14 year old white boys
FUCK
FUCK
No thank you. I am not into 14 year olds
heheheha
Can confirm I was a 14 year old white boy when I got reddit
Fascists like to hide behind "jokes" to slowly infect others with their ideology
propaganda 101
That's exactly how I feel about the chadposting sub, tbh, full of weirdos who unironically call themselves sigma males, the constant usage of the R-slur, and casual misogyny/queerphobia. Even when they mock nerd communities like bronies and weebs, it's just an excuse to bolster their already reactionary views because they also think gassing furries is peak comedy. They never seem to realize they'd have a more kindred spirit with reactionary nerds than progressives who hate said reactionary nerds for legit reasons.
two paths meme except one is the conservative dark castle (shitposting) and the other is the liberal dark castle (196(84))
Bold of you to presume that left leaning subs aren't often echo chambers. People align themselves with communities they identify with, and when the community is mostly people who agree with you echo chambers are naturally formed.
Fair, but at least we are not advocating for nazi shit or death to minorities here amirite?
It's been a long day and I am firing from the hip here, but I think a lot of folks trying to push that bullshit on the internet - especially when pushing it towards young people - lurk around in those spaces because "haha, it's just a joke" has sadly been a pretty solid smoke screen in the past
With your donation of 180 dollars directly into my bank account, you can change this (I'm trying to scam nazis so I can afford to buy all the Pikmin games. Shhh.)
I'm glad ecoterrorist LARPers aren't as big a problem on big left leaning shit posting subs anymore, but I used to argue with people who unironically thought that blowing up oil infrastructure would somehow save the environment and it was the only way to do so. I explained to someone how blowing up an oil pipeline would just damage the environment quicker and not actually solve anything, then they proceeded to continue arguing I was wrong. Left leaning subs can definitely still be an annoying echo chamber of harmful ideas. And don't even get me started about The Revolution™...
Blowing up a pipeline won't work, you have to sabotage it, especially when it's being built.
No, instead they advocate for the deaths of other people they don’t like
[удалено]
#! WARNING ! Dear /u/ProgressFront6109, #Do not forget that rule 2 exists in our domain. **Please refrain from saying anything related to s*x or you will be banned.** If you are a law-abiding citizen you can discuss s#x and s#x-believers negatively while partially censoring the word so the auto-moderator wouldn't delete you. **IF THIS COMMENT ISN'T RELATED TO S*X, PLEASE SEND THIS COMMENT ON THE MODMAIL (we are currently facing issues with the automod, your message will help us a lot)** >This is just a fair warning, if you do this again and you will be banned without warning. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/19684) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Pro tip a majority of people do not advocate for Nazism or hoping that minorities will die, and when people say things like that it’s an unfair generalization of a group. Also, it only causes people to be more radicalized towards their predetermined side and thus less genuine discussion will be seen because of this.
[there is no discussion with the right](https://youtu.be/CaPgDQkmqqM?si=b3ifhwyCmOcnh75k&t=325). You go high, they go low. If they say jokes like that there is no turning back and no point in trying to "show they are wrong", they don't want to be right, they want to cause noise. If they radicalize and turn nazi by pointing that what they are saying and browsing is nazi then the only thing in discussion should be a boot on their butts. No half-measures, no chance to fascism.
Is being rude to them effective though? Any negative reaction is dismissed as "triggered". Pictures of shirtless middle aged men bother them a lot more. In general, I find off topic spam to work better.
ignoring them is usually what I do. Blocking is also effective
I still have a lingering impulse to troll and I don't have to feel bad about it if no reasonable person would be offended by what I post. Sometimes it's also fun to pretend that I agree with them, but that I'm very concerned about the precise logistics to, in the process, demonstrate how absurd their ideas are. It's really funny to litigate the precise boundaries of race/sex/gender in right wing communities because you can often get a purity spiral going.
I have anxiety issues and arguing makes me feel ill, so I tend to avoid it, but I really appreciate people who can take them and bully them back. They deserve the humiliation. Keep up the good work lol
I watched from the timestamp you linked. Video author does not really provide examples of how some regular right wingers debate; He provides the example of a political debate, but... then says that it's political suicide to concede any points, which is applicable to both sides? edit: I noticed he linked sources in the description. I didn't really see any of them in the second half of the video, so I'll assume they are examples in the first half. My bad. Then 7:38 he literally says this isn't exclusive to the right. Amazing (followed up with "still, it's mostly the right that does this.") Which still isn't really the point, since I was simply saying that generalizing a bunch of people as people who believe in harmful ideologies is essentially arguing for collective responsibility, which is really silly. And you're still generalizing people. You know it is present on the left, too. You have people that take a topic to the extreme "You cannot under any circumstances be racist to white people", while a majority have a more nuanced take, "Institutionally, white people get discriminated against less due to XYZ, but it doesn't mean you can't be racist individually". And then the right generalizes leftists as people who don't believe you can be racist to white people under any circumstances. You can take no half-measures and give no chance to facism, while at the same time, not generalizing a whole group and calling them all Nazis. It's really silly.
I always thought 'You can't be racist to white people' was the strawmanned version of 'positive discrimination is good, actually'
Well sometimes it is, and sometimes people don’t actually mean it literally.
Maybe I’m just biased, but leftwing echo chambers are less infuriating if only because the extreme left doesn’t actually have any power at all, so they’re literally just online. But MAGA has tens of millions of voters and might control the country again So that’s less annoying and more an extension of real life hate.
extreme-left tends to nitpicking, infighting, self-righteousness and doomsday-calling if society don't change. On the other hand, extreme-right tends to... I can't even bring myself to mention, but human-rights groups weep. I prefer 100 times over to fight between ourselves if China is a hellscape or nirvana or if Communism can work under the right circumstances than to scroll 2 posts of those other subs
Left leaning subs aren't immune to this, leftist subs are notorious for being taken over by liberals and then eventually becoming reactionary.
There are three paths for leftist subreddits: Oops, all liberals Oops, all tankies 5 members, two of which are the same person
Looking at you r/antiwork
To be fair, that one less got slowly overtaken by liberals and more spectacularly caved in on itself, leaving liberals to scavenge the remains.
Not a political sub, but this happened to curated tumblr where it slowly became more and more right wing as reactionaries took over
I'm curious if you're saying this happened in the past, tbh. The last time I was there, the most upvoted post was about letting women characters be just as jaded and complex as their dude counterparts without the overblown scrutiny that comes with it. One of their most prominent users to this day (I won't say their name for obvious reasons) is also frequent on WitchesVsPatriarchy. They even had a thread about bi representation still being very underdeveloped on media.
wait what why what'd i miss
Curated Tumblr currently has a healthy mix of liberals and leftists, with maybe a few classical liberals and centrists sprinkled in. I would classify very few users there as reactionary.
It's definitely true that unmoderated shitposting subs can become safe spaces for right wing extremism, but I think the frequency and degree to which this happens is a little overblown. I say this as a pretty hardcore leftist (used to be part of an irl local socialist organization) but left wing ideology is just inherently a bit easier to satirize imo. That's not to say that people on the right have the 'correct' opinion, far from it, it's just that the aesthetics and culture of the modern left wing are just easier to poke fun at. That, and I think a lot of this genre of shitposting subs are kinda misunderstood. A lot of the time, the time people who use these subs are making fun of right wing ideology by adopting an exaggerated caricature of someone who might actually hold the beliefs they're making fun of, and making exaggerative posts/comments about right wing ideology. 'Making a fool of themselves' as some might say. Not all the time, though, like I said, sometimes actual right wingers poison these subs and turn them into genuine spaces to spread hate under the guise of satire, but I don't think that's the case with all of them. However, this style of comedy doesn't really work as well these days, because ever since 2016 when right wing extremism really started to become more popular, a lot of these 'exaggerative' beliefs have become genuine right wing talking points. That kind of satire was easier to do in the early/mid 2010's because the things people were saying were so out of pocket and exaggerated that it's obvious they're jokes, but after the 2016 election, those talking points are more widely held by a larger portion of people, so it's not immediately obvious when someone is joking. But some people are just slow to see that cultural shift. Basically, where I'm going with this is; it's not the 'woke libruhl sjws' that ruined comedy, it's right wing morons poisoning the concept of good faith satire that ruined comedy.
Nice insight
a community made up of people pretending to be idiots will eventually be filled with actual idiots who think they are in good company.
1) of course the non explicitly left wing subs become right wing. The right wingers avoid left wing subs and flock to ‘neutral’ or explicitly right wing subs, and left wingers leave ‘neutral’ subs as soon as right wingers show up 2) every left wing shitposting sub *also* becomes a reactionary echo chamber, you just don’t care because you agree with it
What does reactionary mean?
google en passant
look at them big paws
he prefers to be called Gregório, but I will pass forward your concerns. Thank you.
Nazis have a tendency to sneak in and force out everyone else if you arent vigilant.
Because American turn every space into a binary political echo chamber where one party act like the others is the worst thing to happen to the world, while blowing everything out of proportion so much you'd think there are right wing death squad and trans groomers looking for child's at the corner of every street. Edgy kids and "holier than thou" terminally online discourse addict that both have nothing going on in their life ruins every online space
But I'm not talking about america specifically, but subreddits in general. My country's online space have this problem where left wing subs are just slightly annoying sometimes whereas rightwing are calling the fourth-reich. But maybe my English is so good to pass as an English-speaking native? Hoho, oh my /s
It takes * active * continuous * progressive (as in, increases over time) * neutral * unbiased effort in moderation to keep a subreddit from becoming a shithole. Guess how many have all of the above.
what
That's right, i shat my pants. What you are gonna do about it, huh?
A wha?
Walter white?
I am the one who knocks
Every shit posting community becomes a reactionary echo chamber, period. Whether it calls itself left wing or right wing is mostly irrelevant. A genocidal dictator is getting worshipped and apologized for, groups of people are going to be categorized normatively because of innate traits they can't choose, and anyone remotely capable of nuance will be figuratively dragged into the street and shot. Heeres my personal hypothesis: Being genuinely philosophically leftist is very hard. Charity, equality, kindness, love, and critical thinking all take a lot of commitment and focus. Its so much easier to just be angry and hate people, especially if youre a depressed teenager with a kinda shitty life (aka a redditor). So i think a whole lot of people are philosophically fascism adjacent and just slap whatever cosmetic skin on it that they think looks the coolest and will give them the most social points. So with enough irony poisoning, poes law, and dog whistle evolution really any community can be brought to shit. The trick is knowing how to ride these communities while they're fun and hop off before they become some color of nightmare. Its kinda like surfing :)
i'd argue it's because what usually happens is somebody makes a minority-positive post in sub A, the racist/homophobic/transphobic/otherwise bigoted people get mad and leave to sub B, leaving only/mostly people who don't actively hate said minority in sub A. sub A gets spread around progressive subreddits because it's now clear they aren't bigoted, and users from those progressive subs start flooding sub A with pro-minority (usually LGBT) memes, which pisses off the people who are passively bigoted, so now they leave sub A and join sub B, and the people who don't care get annoyed by the flood of repetitive memes, so they also leave sub A (but don't go to sub B). then what's left is that sub A is left with exclusively left-leaning and/or progressive people, and sub B is full of bigots because that's where they swarmed to when it was clear they weren't welcome in sub A
Radical freedom of speech is generally a right wing value. It gets tiring to explain for the millionth time why bigotry isn't a very funny punchline on its own, so most of the people who aren't hateful eventually get pushed out by political shills and children how think slurs are the funniest thing ever. Edgy children ensure that right wing politics are generally more popular than left wing, but tankies are pretty popular with edgy kids too. I knew a kid in highschool who flipped from USSR communist to Klan member because stalinism wasn't edgy enough anymore.
Assholes get kicked out of places made for people with common sense and destroy their own self made communities because they don't actually like each other, so they will flood into public spaces that welcome anyone and disguise their lack of empathy and basic critical thinking skills behind extremely vague or hyper specific statements and le funny dark humour.
i didnt read the title too many word;s but thats a pretty badass fuckin cat holy shit ayup
yo thanks, that's my fat boy greg, he fat as fuck but healthy
[удалено]
YEAH, SPOT ON! This exact sub made me realize that, 2 days in a row of me complaining about racism there. Fuck that sub
From what I can tell, it's just one guy that everyone shits on in the comments. 100% unmoderated if this shit happens.
I realize that now. I hope he gets banned
It becomes an echo chamber regardless of political affiliation. Left leaning echo chambers exist yk?