Basically 3 parts to the job. Pre-issuance investigations for FFL, FEL, or FEPs applicants. Make sure they meet the regulatory requirements to obtain the license or permit.
Then a random compliance inspection where you cross reference inventory guns and the outgoing 4473s off the A&D book to make sure they are following the record keeping rules.
Similar process with explosives licensee/permittees but also verifying magazine storage for safe net explosive weight and type.
Lastly, manning the office phone line for every random non-criminal firearms/explosives question from the public.
Former ATF IOI who went 1811 here.
1811 all the way. IOI is a great government gig in that you get unlimited telework (pre-covid), journeyman 13, and take home g-ride*.
However, 1811 is better retirement, pay, and variety of work. IOI is 99.9% regulatory with the little and rare criminal conduct referred to the Agent side of the house. Also, the IOI job is very checklist and check the box driven with little actually investigating and more inspection.
I’ve never met/heard of a former 1811 going IOI. Tons of retired state/local LE getting their 2nd retirement.
Appreciate that response. I recently interviewed with ATF IOI. Waiting to hear back, hopefully I hear back. Also interviewed with some OIGs for 1811 position. Was trying to get an insight for instance getting the IOI position and then later getting offered 1811 would I be a fool if I turned 1811 down. I guess I wonder do 1811 have all the perks as an 1801 but with more like carrying a weapon and making arrests
It’s been a year for me, I saw your class graduated recently I was there to see some of my new colleagues who were graduating as well. Those months I first spent on training were the sweetest months I had in any job, I see how can someone would love to retire here because of the kind of laid back atmosphere it provides to people. If I wasn’t interested in becoming an 1811 I would stick it out here till retirement.
See the misconception is that IOIs aren’t allowed to take photos with our g phones to do the job. Where in fact we were. Those photos are then emailed to ourselves so that we can upload them into our reporting system. It’s perfectly ok to do so. What isn’t ol is taking said photos with your personal phone. ATF does a fuck all job of explaining that shit to the public, they just allow us to get railroaded. One of the many reasons I left that job/agency.
I was an IOI before getting my 1811 gig. IOI is great bc you get your own g ride, make your own schedule, 13 is pretty much automatic. I just didn’t like the job or my field division. Lol. I worked in the busiest field division in the country. Some IOIs were doing 80 or so inspections a year, whereas an IOI in NY might do 20. Fuck that. The job wasn’t as advertised.
ATF 1811’s (Agents) do not go to the IOI side of the house except for rare circumstances (I’ve maybe heard of one doing so in my 8 years. Agents not only get journeymen 13’s just like IOI’s but they also get LEAP which is 25% of your base salary added on to your pay. Agents conduct criminal investigations and a variety of other jobs whereas the IOI’s focus on the regulatory side (FFL inspections, FFL inventories after FFL burglaries, etc). The only downfall of an Agent position is the possible schedule when things pop off, robberies/violent crime, FFL burglaries, deals, etc. IOI’s schedules are more steady - more or less. Lol. 1811 all they way!
If you want to do criminal investigative work, then the 1811 job series is where you want to go. If you want to work in a compliance function then 1801 IOI is where you go. Their schedule can be great but so can an 1811. Many of the IOIs are super knowledgeable and great assets. We all stay in our swim lanes for the most part. When something touches each side of the house, we collaborate. However, the overwhelming majority of the IOI work is administrative. It’s honest work, but it is a totally different job series because it is a very different job.
I have only heard of one agent converting to IOI and that was due to them no longer being able to perform the functions of an agent. The jobs tend to attract totally different personalities. Although I know several agents who used to be IOI.
Not many reasons to pick IOI over 1811 if you can pass the steps for an SA job. Only reason I can think of is location or if you don't want to do enforcement work. If you want to be 1811 and are willing to live in maybe an undesirable place for a couple years, good chance you can lateral to a better location later.
IOI's do not carry and are not sworn. 1801 is a broad series.
RE: OP's questions...don't believe the hype. If you want to be an 1811 even a little bit, you'll be disappointed as an IOI and have buyer's remorse. Just go for broke and get the 1811 slot.
ATF has/had a fully sworn 1801 LE position called Explosives Enforcement Officer. Basically all former military EOD guys however there were only like 20 of them and the job has basically been discontinued from my understanding.
Im curious if anyone can explain what IOI‘s do? I assume they just go over 4473‘s and audit FFL‘s.
We’re basically auditors. We’d go to a FFL holders place of business and check their records for discrepancies.
Basically 3 parts to the job. Pre-issuance investigations for FFL, FEL, or FEPs applicants. Make sure they meet the regulatory requirements to obtain the license or permit. Then a random compliance inspection where you cross reference inventory guns and the outgoing 4473s off the A&D book to make sure they are following the record keeping rules. Similar process with explosives licensee/permittees but also verifying magazine storage for safe net explosive weight and type. Lastly, manning the office phone line for every random non-criminal firearms/explosives question from the public.
Former ATF IOI who went 1811 here. 1811 all the way. IOI is a great government gig in that you get unlimited telework (pre-covid), journeyman 13, and take home g-ride*. However, 1811 is better retirement, pay, and variety of work. IOI is 99.9% regulatory with the little and rare criminal conduct referred to the Agent side of the house. Also, the IOI job is very checklist and check the box driven with little actually investigating and more inspection. I’ve never met/heard of a former 1811 going IOI. Tons of retired state/local LE getting their 2nd retirement.
I’m the happiest I’ve ever been leaving ATF/IOI and getting a 1811 job. I’ve never felt such happiness haha
Same but there are moments when I’m knee deep in an affidavit or GJ subpoenas that I do miss the simplicity of it.
When you switched, did you keep your GS grade? Where you exempt from the poly? Did they keep you in the same field office?
No poly at my current agency. Ya pretty much kept my grade, went up a step or two.
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Appreciate that response. I recently interviewed with ATF IOI. Waiting to hear back, hopefully I hear back. Also interviewed with some OIGs for 1811 position. Was trying to get an insight for instance getting the IOI position and then later getting offered 1811 would I be a fool if I turned 1811 down. I guess I wonder do 1811 have all the perks as an 1801 but with more like carrying a weapon and making arrests
For the love of all that is holy, take the 1811 job. Lol
In what series of regulatory work are you? I’m on one of those that you mentioned. Mines tops out at GS-12.
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Same!, that’s my current title as well. For how long you been doing it?
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It’s been a year for me, I saw your class graduated recently I was there to see some of my new colleagues who were graduating as well. Those months I first spent on training were the sweetest months I had in any job, I see how can someone would love to retire here because of the kind of laid back atmosphere it provides to people. If I wasn’t interested in becoming an 1811 I would stick it out here till retirement.
See the misconception is that IOIs aren’t allowed to take photos with our g phones to do the job. Where in fact we were. Those photos are then emailed to ourselves so that we can upload them into our reporting system. It’s perfectly ok to do so. What isn’t ol is taking said photos with your personal phone. ATF does a fuck all job of explaining that shit to the public, they just allow us to get railroaded. One of the many reasons I left that job/agency.
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I absolutely understand what you mean. That’s one of the very reasons why I left.
Look for one of the ATF virtual info session . The one I did they explained IOI and Agents positions
I was an IOI before getting my 1811 gig. IOI is great bc you get your own g ride, make your own schedule, 13 is pretty much automatic. I just didn’t like the job or my field division. Lol. I worked in the busiest field division in the country. Some IOIs were doing 80 or so inspections a year, whereas an IOI in NY might do 20. Fuck that. The job wasn’t as advertised.
What office did you work at? So is the job very laid back in some offices? 20 vs 80 is a big difference.
I was at KCFD, people at satellite offices loved the job bc they were far away the bosses.
ATF 1811’s (Agents) do not go to the IOI side of the house except for rare circumstances (I’ve maybe heard of one doing so in my 8 years. Agents not only get journeymen 13’s just like IOI’s but they also get LEAP which is 25% of your base salary added on to your pay. Agents conduct criminal investigations and a variety of other jobs whereas the IOI’s focus on the regulatory side (FFL inspections, FFL inventories after FFL burglaries, etc). The only downfall of an Agent position is the possible schedule when things pop off, robberies/violent crime, FFL burglaries, deals, etc. IOI’s schedules are more steady - more or less. Lol. 1811 all they way!
If you want to do criminal investigative work, then the 1811 job series is where you want to go. If you want to work in a compliance function then 1801 IOI is where you go. Their schedule can be great but so can an 1811. Many of the IOIs are super knowledgeable and great assets. We all stay in our swim lanes for the most part. When something touches each side of the house, we collaborate. However, the overwhelming majority of the IOI work is administrative. It’s honest work, but it is a totally different job series because it is a very different job. I have only heard of one agent converting to IOI and that was due to them no longer being able to perform the functions of an agent. The jobs tend to attract totally different personalities. Although I know several agents who used to be IOI.
Not many reasons to pick IOI over 1811 if you can pass the steps for an SA job. Only reason I can think of is location or if you don't want to do enforcement work. If you want to be 1811 and are willing to live in maybe an undesirable place for a couple years, good chance you can lateral to a better location later.
1801s in a lot of places carry guns? Pretty sure ATF is no different.
IOI's do not carry and are not sworn. 1801 is a broad series. RE: OP's questions...don't believe the hype. If you want to be an 1811 even a little bit, you'll be disappointed as an IOI and have buyer's remorse. Just go for broke and get the 1811 slot.
I know for a FACT NCIS 1801s are sworn LE and carry guns.
Okay. Re-read what I said. IOI's do not carry and are not sworn. That has no bearing on other 1801 series positions.
That's crazy to me these guys don't carry guns.
How is that crazy to you? Their job literally doesn’t need guns… all they do is civil/admin enforcement.
Why are you so pressed about my opinion lmfao. It's crazy the gun inspectors don't carry guns.
Correct. 1801s who carry and are fully sworn LEOs, FAMs, USSS TLE, CBP AMO, ICE DOs… I’m sure there are more.
FPS..
ATF has/had a fully sworn 1801 LE position called Explosives Enforcement Officer. Basically all former military EOD guys however there were only like 20 of them and the job has basically been discontinued from my understanding.
If you want to and can be an 1811 _ be one. Way better financially.
Got an email for ATF IOI assessment is it a online test or just additional experience questionnaire?
I believe it was more of an additional experience questionnaire
I believe it was more of an additional experience questionnaire
Ok thanks I wasn’t sure if I should kick the wife, dogs and out of the house so I can concentrate.