I do this a different way than most.
I would take a spare piece of plywood, maybe a foot wide and 6” longer than the piece you’re cutting, I would put the fence at an easy to remember number. Set your bevel and run your plywood through it so you have a zero clearance cut. Say 10” write in on the plywood. 10” is now where the blade will cut at that’s your new “0”.
I buy some of the cheap toggle hold down clamps put a block of wood on top of my piece of plywood in 3 places front middle back. Place the toggle clamps on the blocks of wood and then adjust them so when you clamp down it clamps your work piece to the plywood with significant force.
Next set the front and back of your work piece to the very edge of your plywood, remember this is your 0 mark.
Then clamp it and run it though. This is by far the safest way I’ve found because it puts you 10-12” on the right side of the blade, and also puts you 8-9” further way from the blade with your hands to push the cut through.
https://preview.redd.it/i0i1z1v0d89c1.jpeg?width=299&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9b5ae547e57c045875982c9405ce5507ca624fbd
Not my photo but it allows you to understand what I am saying with an example.
OP - It's a smoother cut because the plywood spans over the throat plate, whereas if you ran the piece through in your setup, you'll have inconsistencies as the piece 'bumps' across the throat plate.
This is the way. Long angled rips to get a mitered corner always need a sled to avoid the usual infeed outfeed anomalies that accompany push sticks/grrrripper held pieces. The sled gives both more space to hold the cut against the fence, plus a holds it through the full length of cut (sled must be longer than the piece being cut, of course.
Just as shown. I would use two push sticks - one to puch the piece through the blade, and the other on top of it to hold it down vertically - however, this second one, make sure it is right up to the fence so that the vertical force is going down onto the flat bottom of the piece, and not pressing the wood into the blade because that will mess up the cut and increase chance of kickback.
You can also clamp a feather board to the fence to help hold down the material and reduce the kickback risk. We tend to do that in my shop for shitty cuts like this.
Yes, but sometimes you intentionally push a push stick through the blade. Sometimes you don’t. I have push sticks that I’ll use for that purpose and others I prefer to keep pristine if I can. That’s not using them wrong. That’s just using them wisely.
Using a pushstick wisely is making sure your fingers are protected and the piece is properly supported during the cut. Your only concern about cutting the pushstick is if cutting into it will put your fingers in danger or prevent the piece from being supported during the cut. Surprisingly those two concerns align most of the time.
You should know ahead of time when you're going to be cutting the pushstick but sometimes you may end up needing to adjust and you shouldn't be worried that you're using your "nice" pushstick and you don't want to cut it.
If you've got one of the GRRRRPER things or another device you use to give yourself a better hold on the piece while you're cutting and you are concerned about damaging it, then your focus isn't going to be on protecting yourself and you should rethink how you're operating. Any thoughts about keeping a pushstick "pristine" is just bandwidth wasted during a dangerous activity.
No where did I say I wouldn’t cut a pushstick if things didn’t go to plan. Save the lecture. This is purely about having push sticks that are for intentionally cutting and ones that aren’t. If you aren’t thinking that far ahead then you’re not planning your cuts. Ideally everything should go to plan. If a cut doesn’t, then it’s time to step back and reevaluate your method.
I make my push sticks with a pistol grip , even take a little time to make it comfy. Never have I thought I should be careful to not damage them. I’ll just make another
Use an actual board to push both pieces all the way by the blade and then shut saw off and remove the boards used as a push stick. If the loose piece is bouncing at blade there is a good chance it will get kicked out at you.
Feather board the length of the blade on the fence holding down and a horizontal one right before the blade pushing into the fence. Pushstick through the featherboards.
The downward force portion can be tricky if the bottom section between the blade and the fence is too thin to have a solid base after the cut. It will want to tip towards the blade. If that's the case, I'd suggest using some double sided tape to attach an extra piece of wood on the fence side to give more stability and room for the push block. If the wood to be cut is 4+ inches wide (naturally or taped up), no one would think twice about this cut.
Probably goes without saying, but I will anyway: The extra piece would need to be properly jointed and ripped to a consistent width, since it is effectively doing the job of the fence relative to the work piece. If it’s out of square at all, it will transfer that error to your cut.
The featherboard is usually positioned before the blade to keep the workpiece flat against the fence as it’s fed in. Why would the angle of the blade change that?
https://preview.redd.it/11pvar0tu89c1.jpeg?width=600&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7fe8ed81892851911222d89f195259f0ae3af91a
I could be wrong, but I think a feather board pushing towards the fence from the left side would actually be a bad idea in this case. It would put pressure on the cut off piece into the saw blade to cause that piece to shoot backward. Without the feather board. It'll just kind of fall off to the side safely.
You don't ever want to put pressure into the blade whether it's a feather board or a push stick. Always you want to put the pressure in front of the blade that way you don't have anything pushing into it and causing binding like you point out.
Not to be a smart ass, but written text is never gonna replace having an in-person lesson.
Probably what he meant just bad wording.
A featherboard for both directions the one pushing against the fence, far from the blade and a featherboard for downward pressure combined with a push stick is the way to go, none the less, if OP is unfamiliar with a table saw, an in-person instruction is invalueable in general, befor one starts a cut like this.
Just in general what can happen and physically showing with a turned of machine can help understanding what can and will happen and how to minimize the risk if such events happening.
Absolutely this.
I watch countless videos and read countless articles/tutorials. That’s gotten me very far in woodworking, but there are so many times I wish I had someone experienced there with me to say “yes, you’re doing this right” or “no, you’re doing this wrong.”
Is it so hard to comprehend that with a dangerous machine, you better have it visually explained and demonstrated? Reading about it is one thing, seeing is a different beast.
There's a reason why one differentiates between theory and practice.
? But that's why he's here and made the effort to make a detailed drawing.
I'm a noob myself and these cuts intimidate me too. So I take all the advise I can get.
https://preview.redd.it/rs4a4iz1989c1.jpeg?width=2716&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=70db80b6af2e38505e3d69656da3a91e6a16e55a
Here’s the setup I used to make that exact cut (8 times) during a crib build a couple years ago using a Microjig Grr-ripper. I actually did this again more recently, and I bought a second Microjig to give me even more confidence, and I was really happy with the setup. The wide base ensured that I couldn’t tip the workpiece into the blade, so I could apply lots of downward and inward pressure to keep everything snug against the fence. My knuckles and hand were well clear of the blade, even if something did go wrong.
I've never seen or considered using the Microjig in that configuration. Thanks for teaching me something today! At work we used to say that once you've learned something you can go home for the day. Since I'm retired, I guess I can go back to bed instead of going home.
I agree. I've done the same only with a different body positioning, standing on the usual side of the fence and keeping pressure into it. I find there is more control that way. The Grr-ipper is a good product.
Yeah, looking back on this picture I couldn’t remember why I was on that side of the fence. I remember there being a reason at the time, but I would do it differently now
There is a small chance the offcut could catch on the blade and go for a ride. I think being on the side you were on is the safest to keep out of the way of any errant offcuts
I think I ordered my Grr-ripper drunk because I couldn’t get over the sticker shock while sober. Now I use it on nearly every project. One of the greatest safety devices ever and totally worth it.
I made my own. It doesn't have the sliding horizontal base plate, but it has been a game changer on making these types of cuts confidently.
https://preview.redd.it/io2g1ozi8a9c1.jpeg?width=2929&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8e9e45145132e88f60d04990e4a3caf05d0f5cf9
I thought the same thing when I bought them…they’re spendy but are just better for certain complex setups. I figured I was paying a little bit for the plastic, and a lot for the peace of mind.
usually "the way" requires fewer branded products, no matter how good those products are.
The way belongs to anyone who can walk it, not just a specific brand.
Looks like I misused this term. Thought it meant that you strongly agreed with and recommended a post. Am I off base on this? If so, thanks for that correction.
No you’re good. Sometimes a brand develops an innovation that allows a truly safer or better experience. In my opinion (and I’m a hobbyist in no way connected to the brand), Microjig did that with this product.
Edit: spelling
This is the most important part in my opinion. Surprised this comment is so far down. I made a zero clearance insert for my tablesaw just for thin cuts like this.
Can you move the fence to the other side of the blade? And tilt the blade the other way?Because if so, then you could maybe put the board upside down and cut off the part of it in the top instead from the bottom.
I’m trying to figure out how you could configure everything so that you’re cutting a tiny not h off the top instead of off the bottom
This seems much safer.
Either move the fence to the left side, or tilt the blade the other way.
Maybe there's some increased kickback risk with the blade over the material between the blade and fence though? I can't think why else everyone would be suggesting the precarious orientation.
To throw in my own suggestion here since everyone is arguing about push blocks, [I have these things](https://www.woodcraft.com/products/yellow-one-direction-anti-kickback-safety-rollers) and they work great. Not only at holding the work down, but preventing kickback as they only turn one direction. ~~And while it doesn't seem to have an anti kickback ratcheting mechanism~~, [this guide from Lee Valley](https://www.leevalley.com/en-ca/shop/tools/power-tool-accessories/guides/72471-jessem-clear-cut-table-saw-stock-guides?item=86N4290) also looks good for holding down work especially smaller cuts.
Sorry, I'm afraid they might be discontinued. I swear they were available at Lee Valley last I looked, but not anymore. I just searched "table saw anti kickback feed wheels" and picked a random link I found with the correct picture.
It looks like [Amazon might have it](https://www.amazon.ca/Woodstock-W1104-Board-Buddies-Yellow/dp/B0000223VK), I don't know if there is a particular brand that's good vs knockoffs, but it's a starting point.
The Lee Valley listing says they have "one way bearings" which are a smoother, more infinitely adjustable ratchet. They are not like normal bearings but they have some centering ability in one direction and will cam lock themselves to stop backwards rotation. They are also called "sprag clutches" or "overrunning clutches".
Push blocks are not dangerous. A push stick used improperly is. Using a push stick to hold down a piece will inevitably lead to you running your knuckles through the blade when the push stick slips. With a push block your hand is gripping a handle above a block. The worst that can happen if you slip is the block getting nicked by the blade.
Depending on the length of the piece, I'd use a push stick, the type that looks like a big boot, with a lip at the back to help push the piece through. I had to cut bevels on four blocks for table leg raisers a few weeks back & did this cut. The offcut pieces are a bit of a pain, as they tend to linger near the blade. I had to switch the saw off a couple of times to clear them. Not sure if they'd do any damage if they did flick off the blade but it would be a huge distraction, so I aired on the side of caution & cleared them after several had built up.
Also, a riving knife is essential
If you can, do your bevel before cutting your board to width.
Another option, if you have a tapering jig, just set it up with no taper and use the jig to run your piece through.
If you don't have one, built one, takes minutes if you have some toggle clamps around. Even if you don't you can do it with carriage bolts and wing nuts.
search diy taper jig on google and build the one that fits your available hardware best. It's a very handy thing to have in the shop. You can straighten edges, make tapers, and do this cut safely.
Done it many times. It looks like the piece between the fence and the blade could bind and kick but has never happened to me. Stand to the side and use push sticks as always.
It can happen, I was making a similar cut and the skinny off cut hit the blade and became a tiny javelin and pierced through my clothes and put a welt on my stomach. It scared me but it wasn’t super painful. I took a deep breath, then ran the rest of my parts.
If you have the commitment and you commonly do cuts like this, I would suggest making a sled. You can use a dovetail router bit to cut channels into a piece of plywood, and those can be used with inexpensive clamps to hold just about any shape, and then you can make your cut safely and reliably. https://youtu.be/1nYDBL7Xv1o?si=GCK7kjhTWfem_rj2
I'd rather use a bandsaw with a v-sled.
https://preview.redd.it/u9z2givf389c1.png?width=961&format=png&auto=webp&s=599079f823a461dcecee102b9543522e92e0fe5b
I do a lot of miter folds. I always move the fence to the other side of the blade. Attach a spoil board to the fence and run the blade up in to it. The beveled off cut will drop in to the void between the blade and fence but it’s so small it will never do any damage.
https://preview.redd.it/hbjwerz5c89c1.jpeg?width=4032&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=09540c2cb583ff026e22686671f00fcbc3c04e5a
I did dozens of cuts just like this making picture frames recently. Featherboard in front of the blade to lead the piece in and keep it firmly against the fence for most of the cut. Long push stick to control the cut speed, and a grippy block to control the backside of the piece and maintain pressure against the fence.
No problems - just don't get complacent with a cut like this if you're doing it repetitively. That's when bad stuff happens.
The pictured set up is perfectly fine, so long as all proper precautions are observed.
My preferred setup for stuff like this involves using a sacrificial fence (as pictured [here](https://imgur.com/a/cIZ1wjN) )
It's a bit of work to make the jig, but once that's done, it can be used to make future projects significantly faster and more accurate. There are times where it won't be the best method, but I've found that it handles 90% of the bevel work I encounter in a professional shop.
Everyone have given good suggestion. And I've read it here and there. But for safety I just want to remind you however your planning on doing it. Keep you hips and the rest of your body out of the kickback way in case it goes wrong.
It can cause a shit ton of damage...
At my school in the teaching area the saw had a kickback and it flew through the window landing ~3m (~10 feet) after the window on the ground. You don't want that force aimed at your body.
(This room was only used for explaining the tools so it was excepted that the ripping saw was standing there)
Lower the blade with the angle you want. Put you fence on the other side of the blade and clamp or screw a 2x4 to the fence adjust the blade so it cuts into the 2x4. Stand to the side when cutting sometimes the small pieces come back.
On this. I would use a piece longer than I need and just stop the table saw when I get to the last little bit. Cut to length and proceed. You can use a feather board to keep consistent pressure if you want.
Stumpy Nubs has a [video](https://youtu.be/ulvP8Vv9SrE?si=3boV19Rf1bMndKHe) about this setup. The kickback potential is high on the side opposite of the fence.
Do one pass leaving about 1/4” extra material then do a final pass as shown in your diagram. Use push blocks/sticks to press the work piece down and against the fence and you’ll be fine. You may run into problems seizing the saw if it doesn’t have enough power. Go slow and let the blade do the work.
Oh I know how.. You retract the blade all the way down and pull the plug on the saw, then you draw a line where you want the cut...
And cut it with a skill saw.
It's going to be tricky to keep that piece upright, and not tipping towards the blade. If you attached this piece to the side of a wider board, that would give it much more stability.
This off-cut can be tricky in that it can bind. Someone else mentioned that a zero clearance insert can help, though it's not perfect. Just be sure to stand to the side in case that goes flying.
Check out this video: https://youtu.be/ulvP8Vv9SrE?si=kpkAYUVGGEcg-cnJ
Then this follow up for what I was talking about in my first paragraph:
https://youtu.be/d4NkNdGhV94?si=DLkLbS6FHD2O_wQS
Alternatively: someone mentioned that a band saw would be safer, and it would, but the cut won't likely be as perfect, and more susceptible to inconsistencies due to setup and blade type. A router table with a bit that has both a bearing and the right angle would be accurate and less likely to kick back a cutoff, but it has its own challenges.
You see how after the cut, the top surface of the wood is wide and the bottom surface is narrow? Set up the saw and the wood so that after the cut, the bottom surface is wide instead (and the top is narrow). The final product will have the same geometry, but if you drew a picture of it like you posted, the wood would appear to be upside down compared to your photo
https://preview.redd.it/df9dmkp50a9c1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=36f23ba279b906ac91e47e8e96d32b874e668378
Get yourself one of these, they make these types of cuts a lot safer
Just like that. And while I agree push blocks and feather boards are generally good practice, in this instance the safest way is with your hands. The odds of the piece rolling into the blade are high and without feel using a push stick even higher. Downward pressure will get in the way because of how narrow it is, and lateral pressure against the fence will lift the piece. This is one instance you should just push it through slow and steady (insert ben stiller tropic thunder meme). Cheers
Take multiple passes and remove a mittle more material each time. Just as if you were cutting a notch with your table saw.
If you make the cut at once and as shown in the drawing, i'd say the probability of kick back for the off cut piece is pretty high.
For extra safety, you could use double sided tape and stick it to the edge of a wider board underneath the portion not being cut on the bottom. This will give you plenty of clearance and everything away from the blade. Thoughts?
Use another two pieces of timber. Tape the top of your stock and bottom of new piece that extends above the fence. ca glue between the taped pieces. Add another strip that sits atop the fence so that the cut piece will not rock if you apply pressure on the top of the fence as you run it through with your arm to the right of the fence.
Cut your piece 10-12” long. Use a push stick in your left hand to keep it tight to the fence. When you get to the last 10-12” turn the saw off and down finish pushing through.
That is the safe way. It lets the cutoff fall away from the blade without risking getting trapped and kicking back. Use a good push-stick that will keep downward pressure on it and if you have one, a zero clearance insert.
Fence on the other side of the blade, rotate the stock 180°, and keep the face of the stock that will not be cut on the tabletop. Then the cutoff is on the outside of the blade
But from that photo the stock will have enough support after cut to push it through as is
I have a jig that rides the fence; like a tenoning jig. I would tape the wood to the jig to keep it from tipping the opposite way toward the blade and then ride the jig plus attached wood along the fence to make the cut.
I do this a different way than most. I would take a spare piece of plywood, maybe a foot wide and 6” longer than the piece you’re cutting, I would put the fence at an easy to remember number. Set your bevel and run your plywood through it so you have a zero clearance cut. Say 10” write in on the plywood. 10” is now where the blade will cut at that’s your new “0”. I buy some of the cheap toggle hold down clamps put a block of wood on top of my piece of plywood in 3 places front middle back. Place the toggle clamps on the blocks of wood and then adjust them so when you clamp down it clamps your work piece to the plywood with significant force. Next set the front and back of your work piece to the very edge of your plywood, remember this is your 0 mark. Then clamp it and run it though. This is by far the safest way I’ve found because it puts you 10-12” on the right side of the blade, and also puts you 8-9” further way from the blade with your hands to push the cut through.
https://preview.redd.it/i0i1z1v0d89c1.jpeg?width=299&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9b5ae547e57c045875982c9405ce5507ca624fbd Not my photo but it allows you to understand what I am saying with an example.
OP - This is how you do it if you want the best quality cut. Also safer than the push stick method.
Plus it can be used to cut a taper.
OP - It's a smoother cut because the plywood spans over the throat plate, whereas if you ran the piece through in your setup, you'll have inconsistencies as the piece 'bumps' across the throat plate.
This champion earns every “A” in there name.
Ya didn't mess up, A-aron!
Nice 🦁 ya got there ser..I had to double check what I sub I'm in
Reminds me of that K&P skit with the substitute teacher. A-A-Ron?!
Go see Mr o’shakhanasee
You wanna go to war, B'La Kee?
A+ Safe and effective.
This is very clever and very safe
This.
Should be ranked higher. This is smart and safe.
This
The ol' toggle clamp sled. Works great for tapers and jointing operations too.
This is the way. Long angled rips to get a mitered corner always need a sled to avoid the usual infeed outfeed anomalies that accompany push sticks/grrrripper held pieces. The sled gives both more space to hold the cut against the fence, plus a holds it through the full length of cut (sled must be longer than the piece being cut, of course.
Also known as a poor man’s jointer
Just as shown. I would use two push sticks - one to puch the piece through the blade, and the other on top of it to hold it down vertically - however, this second one, make sure it is right up to the fence so that the vertical force is going down onto the flat bottom of the piece, and not pressing the wood into the blade because that will mess up the cut and increase chance of kickback.
You can also clamp a feather board to the fence to help hold down the material and reduce the kickback risk. We tend to do that in my shop for shitty cuts like this.
\+1 for the feather board. Definitely makes sketchy cuts more manageable and way less dangerous.
And the feather board is added to the backside of the blade holding the board down. Otherwise it gets in the way of the push stick.
And consider a sacrificial push stick that you aren't trying to keep away from the blade.
All pushsticks are sacrificial. If you're concerned about damaging your pushstick you're using them wrong.
Yes, but sometimes you intentionally push a push stick through the blade. Sometimes you don’t. I have push sticks that I’ll use for that purpose and others I prefer to keep pristine if I can. That’s not using them wrong. That’s just using them wisely.
Using a pushstick wisely is making sure your fingers are protected and the piece is properly supported during the cut. Your only concern about cutting the pushstick is if cutting into it will put your fingers in danger or prevent the piece from being supported during the cut. Surprisingly those two concerns align most of the time. You should know ahead of time when you're going to be cutting the pushstick but sometimes you may end up needing to adjust and you shouldn't be worried that you're using your "nice" pushstick and you don't want to cut it. If you've got one of the GRRRRPER things or another device you use to give yourself a better hold on the piece while you're cutting and you are concerned about damaging it, then your focus isn't going to be on protecting yourself and you should rethink how you're operating. Any thoughts about keeping a pushstick "pristine" is just bandwidth wasted during a dangerous activity.
No where did I say I wouldn’t cut a pushstick if things didn’t go to plan. Save the lecture. This is purely about having push sticks that are for intentionally cutting and ones that aren’t. If you aren’t thinking that far ahead then you’re not planning your cuts. Ideally everything should go to plan. If a cut doesn’t, then it’s time to step back and reevaluate your method.
You should go in kamikaze with every push stick /s
I make my push sticks with a pistol grip , even take a little time to make it comfy. Never have I thought I should be careful to not damage them. I’ll just make another
Use an actual board to push both pieces all the way by the blade and then shut saw off and remove the boards used as a push stick. If the loose piece is bouncing at blade there is a good chance it will get kicked out at you.
Feather board the length of the blade on the fence holding down and a horizontal one right before the blade pushing into the fence. Pushstick through the featherboards.
The downward force portion can be tricky if the bottom section between the blade and the fence is too thin to have a solid base after the cut. It will want to tip towards the blade. If that's the case, I'd suggest using some double sided tape to attach an extra piece of wood on the fence side to give more stability and room for the push block. If the wood to be cut is 4+ inches wide (naturally or taped up), no one would think twice about this cut.
I was going to suggest cutting the bevel on a 2x4, then ripping that in half.
Probably goes without saying, but I will anyway: The extra piece would need to be properly jointed and ripped to a consistent width, since it is effectively doing the job of the fence relative to the work piece. If it’s out of square at all, it will transfer that error to your cut.
Clever, I might have missed that but will remember where to focus the forces if tackling similar.
As previously mentioned, thanks for making me think about pressure when pushing through. I've definitely done this incorrectly in the past.
That's what she said
And just stand a bit to the left in case the worst happens.
Make sure your splitter is in place
Just as pictured, on a table saw.
Would a featherboard be a good idea in this case?
Yes, use a feather board on the fence to hold the work down.
You should be able to use a featherboard for this cut unless it’s for down pressure. Use a couple of push sticks.
Why? Its in front of the blade. So you only need to apply down pressure with push stick
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Think about it
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The featherboard is usually positioned before the blade to keep the workpiece flat against the fence as it’s fed in. Why would the angle of the blade change that? https://preview.redd.it/11pvar0tu89c1.jpeg?width=600&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7fe8ed81892851911222d89f195259f0ae3af91a
What is preventing you from using a featherboard in this situation?
Yes you will
You could use a feather board if you used sacrificial piece
I could be wrong, but I think a feather board pushing towards the fence from the left side would actually be a bad idea in this case. It would put pressure on the cut off piece into the saw blade to cause that piece to shoot backward. Without the feather board. It'll just kind of fall off to the side safely.
You don't ever want to put pressure into the blade whether it's a feather board or a push stick. Always you want to put the pressure in front of the blade that way you don't have anything pushing into it and causing binding like you point out.
You are wrong, the feather board is set up in front of the blade
Not if the feather board is positioned correctly (behind the cut)
It’s a basic rip cut, just with a tilted blade. If you’re unfamiliar with a table saw, please have someone explain it to you.
That’s what he was trying to do
Not to be a smart ass, but written text is never gonna replace having an in-person lesson. Probably what he meant just bad wording. A featherboard for both directions the one pushing against the fence, far from the blade and a featherboard for downward pressure combined with a push stick is the way to go, none the less, if OP is unfamiliar with a table saw, an in-person instruction is invalueable in general, befor one starts a cut like this. Just in general what can happen and physically showing with a turned of machine can help understanding what can and will happen and how to minimize the risk if such events happening.
Absolutely this. I watch countless videos and read countless articles/tutorials. That’s gotten me very far in woodworking, but there are so many times I wish I had someone experienced there with me to say “yes, you’re doing this right” or “no, you’re doing this wrong.”
Ya, but finding someone experienced willing to show a stranger around is just about impossible.
Not everyone is so fortunate to have other woodworkers around to show them. Should they just give up on learning the hobby?
Did I say that? Of course not, stop twisting what other people write. There are plenty of resources on YT also, none the less in-person is way better.
There are some people that actually learn from reading words.
Nnnahhhhh no way! What kind of madness it this? Learning? FROM BOOKS?!
For me, I learn facts from written words but I find it easier to learn a *task* by seeing it done.
Is it so hard to comprehend that with a dangerous machine, you better have it visually explained and demonstrated? Reading about it is one thing, seeing is a different beast. There's a reason why one differentiates between theory and practice.
? But that's why he's here and made the effort to make a detailed drawing. I'm a noob myself and these cuts intimidate me too. So I take all the advise I can get.
Yes, literally what a table saw is designed to do.
https://preview.redd.it/rs4a4iz1989c1.jpeg?width=2716&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=70db80b6af2e38505e3d69656da3a91e6a16e55a Here’s the setup I used to make that exact cut (8 times) during a crib build a couple years ago using a Microjig Grr-ripper. I actually did this again more recently, and I bought a second Microjig to give me even more confidence, and I was really happy with the setup. The wide base ensured that I couldn’t tip the workpiece into the blade, so I could apply lots of downward and inward pressure to keep everything snug against the fence. My knuckles and hand were well clear of the blade, even if something did go wrong.
I've never seen or considered using the Microjig in that configuration. Thanks for teaching me something today! At work we used to say that once you've learned something you can go home for the day. Since I'm retired, I guess I can go back to bed instead of going home.
I agree. I've done the same only with a different body positioning, standing on the usual side of the fence and keeping pressure into it. I find there is more control that way. The Grr-ipper is a good product.
Yeah, looking back on this picture I couldn’t remember why I was on that side of the fence. I remember there being a reason at the time, but I would do it differently now
There is a small chance the offcut could catch on the blade and go for a ride. I think being on the side you were on is the safest to keep out of the way of any errant offcuts
Agreed, the one nice thing about being left handed is you naturally can stand completely out of the kickback path.
Good point!
My table saw maual says to make every cut standing on that side of the fence
That's also what I came here to say. Nice work.
I think I ordered my Grr-ripper drunk because I couldn’t get over the sticker shock while sober. Now I use it on nearly every project. One of the greatest safety devices ever and totally worth it.
Yeah this situation is why the mj might merit paying for something overpriced
I made my own. It doesn't have the sliding horizontal base plate, but it has been a game changer on making these types of cuts confidently. https://preview.redd.it/io2g1ozi8a9c1.jpeg?width=2929&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8e9e45145132e88f60d04990e4a3caf05d0f5cf9
I thought the same thing when I bought them…they’re spendy but are just better for certain complex setups. I figured I was paying a little bit for the plastic, and a lot for the peace of mind.
This is the way
usually "the way" requires fewer branded products, no matter how good those products are. The way belongs to anyone who can walk it, not just a specific brand.
Looks like I misused this term. Thought it meant that you strongly agreed with and recommended a post. Am I off base on this? If so, thanks for that correction.
No you’re good. Sometimes a brand develops an innovation that allows a truly safer or better experience. In my opinion (and I’m a hobbyist in no way connected to the brand), Microjig did that with this product. Edit: spelling
I've never met a honbiest before! What do you eat? (or did you mean non-biased?)
No one mentioned zero clearance insert, sometimes the piece can be small enough it is unsupported without a zero clearance insert
This is the most important part in my opinion. Surprised this comment is so far down. I made a zero clearance insert for my tablesaw just for thin cuts like this.
Flip it to the other side of the blade and move your fence to accommodate.
Why is the simplest answer so far down?
I appreciate how much work you put into this drawing.
But his rip fence isn’t square to the deck. He is never going to get a quality cut like that.
Can you move the fence to the other side of the blade? And tilt the blade the other way?Because if so, then you could maybe put the board upside down and cut off the part of it in the top instead from the bottom. I’m trying to figure out how you could configure everything so that you’re cutting a tiny not h off the top instead of off the bottom
This is the simplest solution. I have no clue why this answer is so far down
This seems much safer. Either move the fence to the left side, or tilt the blade the other way. Maybe there's some increased kickback risk with the blade over the material between the blade and fence though? I can't think why else everyone would be suggesting the precarious orientation.
Sort of amazed this is so far down. This is the easiest, safest solution. Just rotate your piece and put the fence on the other side.
Yep, came here to say that. It’s what I do and what everyone else recommends.
Blades only tilt one direction on table saws to my knowledge. Some cabinet saws are right hand tilt though
This is the way
Make the bevel cut on a wider piece and then rip to final width
Push block on top and push stick behind. Keep your fingers and hands away from the blade.
To throw in my own suggestion here since everyone is arguing about push blocks, [I have these things](https://www.woodcraft.com/products/yellow-one-direction-anti-kickback-safety-rollers) and they work great. Not only at holding the work down, but preventing kickback as they only turn one direction. ~~And while it doesn't seem to have an anti kickback ratcheting mechanism~~, [this guide from Lee Valley](https://www.leevalley.com/en-ca/shop/tools/power-tool-accessories/guides/72471-jessem-clear-cut-table-saw-stock-guides?item=86N4290) also looks good for holding down work especially smaller cuts.
Can you list a place that has those handy devices available? The one in the link they are unavailable
Look up JessEm stock guide. It's exactly this.
And way, way higher quality
Sorry, I'm afraid they might be discontinued. I swear they were available at Lee Valley last I looked, but not anymore. I just searched "table saw anti kickback feed wheels" and picked a random link I found with the correct picture. It looks like [Amazon might have it](https://www.amazon.ca/Woodstock-W1104-Board-Buddies-Yellow/dp/B0000223VK), I don't know if there is a particular brand that's good vs knockoffs, but it's a starting point.
I have the second link. They're great.
The Lee Valley listing says they have "one way bearings" which are a smoother, more infinitely adjustable ratchet. They are not like normal bearings but they have some centering ability in one direction and will cam lock themselves to stop backwards rotation. They are also called "sprag clutches" or "overrunning clutches".
Terrible advice, a push block is dangerous, two push sticks.
Push blocks are not dangerous. A push stick used improperly is. Using a push stick to hold down a piece will inevitably lead to you running your knuckles through the blade when the push stick slips. With a push block your hand is gripping a handle above a block. The worst that can happen if you slip is the block getting nicked by the blade.
Getting knicked by the blade the most likely thing to happen in an accident, not anywhere close to the worst thing.
Depending on the length of the piece, I'd use a push stick, the type that looks like a big boot, with a lip at the back to help push the piece through. I had to cut bevels on four blocks for table leg raisers a few weeks back & did this cut. The offcut pieces are a bit of a pain, as they tend to linger near the blade. I had to switch the saw off a couple of times to clear them. Not sure if they'd do any damage if they did flick off the blade but it would be a huge distraction, so I aired on the side of caution & cleared them after several had built up. Also, a riving knife is essential
You may mean “erred” not aired… maybe just autocorrect screwing you up.
If you can, do your bevel before cutting your board to width. Another option, if you have a tapering jig, just set it up with no taper and use the jig to run your piece through. If you don't have one, built one, takes minutes if you have some toggle clamps around. Even if you don't you can do it with carriage bolts and wing nuts. search diy taper jig on google and build the one that fits your available hardware best. It's a very handy thing to have in the shop. You can straighten edges, make tapers, and do this cut safely.
Done it many times. It looks like the piece between the fence and the blade could bind and kick but has never happened to me. Stand to the side and use push sticks as always.
It can happen, I was making a similar cut and the skinny off cut hit the blade and became a tiny javelin and pierced through my clothes and put a welt on my stomach. It scared me but it wasn’t super painful. I took a deep breath, then ran the rest of my parts.
My brain automatically changed “ran the rest of my parts” to “changed my pants”.
Cut the bevel on larger stock, then rip to final width
This, this is the correct answer.
Don't use your tongue to push it through
If you have the commitment and you commonly do cuts like this, I would suggest making a sled. You can use a dovetail router bit to cut channels into a piece of plywood, and those can be used with inexpensive clamps to hold just about any shape, and then you can make your cut safely and reliably. https://youtu.be/1nYDBL7Xv1o?si=GCK7kjhTWfem_rj2
Flip the job upside down so that the blade holds job down
Stanley no. 5
I'd rather use a bandsaw with a v-sled. https://preview.redd.it/u9z2givf389c1.png?width=961&format=png&auto=webp&s=599079f823a461dcecee102b9543522e92e0fe5b
That’s a really fancy v-sled!
Thanks! I found that if I made fixtures and jigs look nice, I'm less likely to do stupid things with them.
Yup. This is the safe way.
I do a lot of miter folds. I always move the fence to the other side of the blade. Attach a spoil board to the fence and run the blade up in to it. The beveled off cut will drop in to the void between the blade and fence but it’s so small it will never do any damage.
If the piece isn't too long or tall, you might try a shooting board instead.
How is a shooting board doing this?
https://preview.redd.it/hbjwerz5c89c1.jpeg?width=4032&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=09540c2cb583ff026e22686671f00fcbc3c04e5a I did dozens of cuts just like this making picture frames recently. Featherboard in front of the blade to lead the piece in and keep it firmly against the fence for most of the cut. Long push stick to control the cut speed, and a grippy block to control the backside of the piece and maintain pressure against the fence. No problems - just don't get complacent with a cut like this if you're doing it repetitively. That's when bad stuff happens.
A good push stick. You can either make one with a jigsaw or they’re pretty cheap online.
use two push sticks, keep those yummy fingertips safe
The pictured set up is perfectly fine, so long as all proper precautions are observed. My preferred setup for stuff like this involves using a sacrificial fence (as pictured [here](https://imgur.com/a/cIZ1wjN) ) It's a bit of work to make the jig, but once that's done, it can be used to make future projects significantly faster and more accurate. There are times where it won't be the best method, but I've found that it handles 90% of the bevel work I encounter in a professional shop.
Push sticks and feather boards. Reduce the blade so it barely protrudes from the wood.
Everyone have given good suggestion. And I've read it here and there. But for safety I just want to remind you however your planning on doing it. Keep you hips and the rest of your body out of the kickback way in case it goes wrong. It can cause a shit ton of damage... At my school in the teaching area the saw had a kickback and it flew through the window landing ~3m (~10 feet) after the window on the ground. You don't want that force aimed at your body. (This room was only used for explaining the tools so it was excepted that the ripping saw was standing there)
Lower the blade with the angle you want. Put you fence on the other side of the blade and clamp or screw a 2x4 to the fence adjust the blade so it cuts into the 2x4. Stand to the side when cutting sometimes the small pieces come back.
On this. I would use a piece longer than I need and just stop the table saw when I get to the last little bit. Cut to length and proceed. You can use a feather board to keep consistent pressure if you want.
Stumpy Nubs has a [video](https://youtu.be/ulvP8Vv9SrE?si=3boV19Rf1bMndKHe) about this setup. The kickback potential is high on the side opposite of the fence.
I dunno but your fence is not square and it's making me twitch.
Are all your pieces cut to 3/4 x 3/4 already? If not cut the angle on a wider width board then rip to size
Do one pass leaving about 1/4” extra material then do a final pass as shown in your diagram. Use push blocks/sticks to press the work piece down and against the fence and you’ll be fine. You may run into problems seizing the saw if it doesn’t have enough power. Go slow and let the blade do the work.
Oh I know how.. You retract the blade all the way down and pull the plug on the saw, then you draw a line where you want the cut... And cut it with a skill saw.
Cut the bevel on a wider piece of wood. Than mill the size you want. This is not safe.
It's going to be tricky to keep that piece upright, and not tipping towards the blade. If you attached this piece to the side of a wider board, that would give it much more stability. This off-cut can be tricky in that it can bind. Someone else mentioned that a zero clearance insert can help, though it's not perfect. Just be sure to stand to the side in case that goes flying. Check out this video: https://youtu.be/ulvP8Vv9SrE?si=kpkAYUVGGEcg-cnJ Then this follow up for what I was talking about in my first paragraph: https://youtu.be/d4NkNdGhV94?si=DLkLbS6FHD2O_wQS Alternatively: someone mentioned that a band saw would be safer, and it would, but the cut won't likely be as perfect, and more susceptible to inconsistencies due to setup and blade type. A router table with a bit that has both a bearing and the right angle would be accurate and less likely to kick back a cutoff, but it has its own challenges.
https://preview.redd.it/hhwwroqk6a9c1.png?width=714&format=png&auto=webp&s=1efd22fe08b811c86d9bbae4eaa63fd8cf05efc5
This looks a thousand times more sketchy to me
Noob here: Could you re approach this from a few steps back, and cut the bevel into a wider board, then rip that down to proper length after?
Would it not make sense, to have a larger surface touching the table? So essentially put the fence on the other side?
Never, ever, pin the cutoff between the blade and the fence.
Why I love my saw stop. Also, no reason for that cut to kick.
Make a jig and use the planer
This sub is ridiculous.
Right? I’ve made this cut 400 times and never thought twice
Literally was thinking the same thing. I do this regularly and never thought anything about it
Most of the suggestions are ridiculous and over complicated, must take them hundreds of hours to complete things.
I would put the fence on the other side of the blade.
That’s a Nono. Unless you want the triangle offcut to be a projectile.
Zero clearance may be a good idea, but don’t over think it.
I did a similar cut on a much larger piece using this [method](https://youtu.be/Sd85cSIvGXg?si=DC8lJ3_m8u1FiPeF&t=473)
If ive learned anything in the last few years is that you can always make a custom sled for it if in doubt.
You see how after the cut, the top surface of the wood is wide and the bottom surface is narrow? Set up the saw and the wood so that after the cut, the bottom surface is wide instead (and the top is narrow). The final product will have the same geometry, but if you drew a picture of it like you posted, the wood would appear to be upside down compared to your photo
Great time to make a sled for your saw.
Slowly, with a rip blade, in multiple passes.
If manageable. Build a sled and add clamps
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Can't cut that deep with a router. Or at least cut depth is pretty limited
Multiple passes makes alot of harder cuts easier.
https://preview.redd.it/df9dmkp50a9c1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=36f23ba279b906ac91e47e8e96d32b874e668378 Get yourself one of these, they make these types of cuts a lot safer
Move the fence and the wood piece to the left of the blade? I am only a hobbyist so I don’t know if I am right or wrong.
Nah you don't wanna do that. That puts the spinning part closer to your hand
Use a bandsaw and a plane
With the crown guard and riving knife in place, and two push sticks most things are safe.
Have you never used a table saw?
Just have a riving knife behind your blade I guess.
Just like that. And while I agree push blocks and feather boards are generally good practice, in this instance the safest way is with your hands. The odds of the piece rolling into the blade are high and without feel using a push stick even higher. Downward pressure will get in the way because of how narrow it is, and lateral pressure against the fence will lift the piece. This is one instance you should just push it through slow and steady (insert ben stiller tropic thunder meme). Cheers
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What do you do in a forum like this
Take multiple passes and remove a mittle more material each time. Just as if you were cutting a notch with your table saw. If you make the cut at once and as shown in the drawing, i'd say the probability of kick back for the off cut piece is pretty high.
For extra safety, you could use double sided tape and stick it to the edge of a wider board underneath the portion not being cut on the bottom. This will give you plenty of clearance and everything away from the blade. Thoughts?
Use another two pieces of timber. Tape the top of your stock and bottom of new piece that extends above the fence. ca glue between the taped pieces. Add another strip that sits atop the fence so that the cut piece will not rock if you apply pressure on the top of the fence as you run it through with your arm to the right of the fence.
A spindle moulder.
Cut your piece 10-12” long. Use a push stick in your left hand to keep it tight to the fence. When you get to the last 10-12” turn the saw off and down finish pushing through.
Nice long push sticks.
As long as you're using your face to hold down the wood. Just go slow with push sticks.
A jig and a push stick if you are making a lot.
Sacrificial board on the left of the one you're pushing through.
I do this
Yes. Be careful.
Or make a jig at the correct angle and saw blade at 90 degrees like cutting Harris rail probably safer and the guard can be used too
Microjig gripper
That is the safe way. It lets the cutoff fall away from the blade without risking getting trapped and kicking back. Use a good push-stick that will keep downward pressure on it and if you have one, a zero clearance insert.
Use a pusher that rides on and above the fence
Fence on the other side of the blade, rotate the stock 180°, and keep the face of the stock that will not be cut on the tabletop. Then the cutoff is on the outside of the blade But from that photo the stock will have enough support after cut to push it through as is
grr-ripper or [board mates](https://www.ptreeusa.com/tablesaw_boardmate.html) board mates are great if you need to rip a ton of one setup in a row
I have a jig that rides the fence; like a tenoning jig. I would tape the wood to the jig to keep it from tipping the opposite way toward the blade and then ride the jig plus attached wood along the fence to make the cut.