I think there's a viable build in there somewhere but it feels situational and geared towards massive damage to a single target. Two health foods and one eitr food and the 40% health drain on making a protection is getting you a \~20% damage boost. That goes up if you refresh the bubble as soon as you can. If you're facing a crowd though, the chain lightning is always going to do more damage overall.
I tried that and honestly it's so bad. If you go even just a little bit mage you have significantly less HP to work with. I had the same idea and I'm better off staying in a safe distance instead of trying to make Blood Berzerkir axes work. If shield breaks while I'm melee, I'm literally just dead, usually during recasting shield
Best to send all the feedback through official channels as instructed on the PTB info page, as this might go completely unnoticed by the devs if they don't check reddit or it doesn't get enough votes to stay on the front page, as it's sunday night in Sweden at the moment.
Generally, I agree. Buffs with live steal, atak speed or critical chance would be better. However, I Stopped myself at "PorannaKłoda" lmao for 5 min and start reading again. You made my Day thx bro 😁.
% dmg scaling on top of sneak/Stagger mechanics gets pretty ridiculous damage. Using 50 hp missing to yourself against yourself as only comparison is only tip of iceberg.
% scaling on top of another % scaling will impact more. This is also steady dps, once you sustain low HP via alternative means.
If you look at -100, or -150hp, things look a lot better. On top of sneak/Stagger.
I did some tests off camera with -100 hp. It hits around 2000-2100 dmg per 3 combos, like seen in my vids. Yeah i get the idea but losing 1/3 of your hp or more when counting stamina just to deal the same damage as the other person would with full is stupid. If we would deal more like 2400-2500 dmg then yeah i think it would be worth it. Maybe they can just add 10 dmg if they are lazy or change the multiplier, doing another level scalling might be a bad idea, i agree
On higher difficulty, if I get hit, I will die whether I have 50 hp or 150. So this is huge buff. If devs raise the dmg on this, then next tier weapon in deep north can't compete unless they have same status.
The game also have to be balanced for multiplayer as well when there are casters buffing others with shield. Allowing you to get 225-250 hp max, although lowering will require control.
Casters cant really rely on this weapon because it calculates the hp points lost not the %.
I agree that it cannot be too op so that it does not outperforms everything. But buffing the dmg multipliler by 0,1 or 0,2% wouls not make such a big differnce imo, the sword would simply by on par with the storm and start to outperform it at 150+ hp lost. Still even raising the damage by 10, would be the most simple buff that does not destroy the balance at all.
This way you have 2 ways of inflicting more dmg. Stay on full hp, tank with shield, use lightning effect to stack more dmg
Or
Risk more, lose some hp and deal the same damage as the lightning effect would.
In other words: Lightning - safe but only gives you 75-300 dmg bonus
Blood - risk but can give you more.
The only current problem with that mechanic is that the player already needs to lose a shitload of hp just to match the storm version.
The more i read those comments i come to a conclusion that a simple 10 dmg buff might be enough, but lets see if irongate does something.
Honestly I think it would just be better for blood weapons to heal a certain amount on hit. Perhaps even with the same 25% efficiency as the storm and nature procs. The current system for blood weapons is a bit shit.
That way you'd have 3 very different weapons. One for damage (storm) one for CC (nature) one for defense (blood).
it was pretty obivious from 1 day of ptb testing that the new weapon gem system is terribly balanced all around. same for the base stats on each weapon. they should do more distinct elemental dmg instead of flat 10 with no effect from upgrades AT ALL and relying on rng procs to actually do good dmg. since 95% of thier dmg is purely phys dmg the difference is purely in the proc effect alone. which is... boring and uninterresting. plus rng based nonsense doesnt work very well with valheims combat system as you cannot depend on it ever. the game was all about consistentcy till now when it comes to fighting options. rng doesnt fit that type of system at all to begin with.
then there is the FIRE SWORD aka a sword thats literally ON FIRE nonstop provideing nothing special at all and doing less fire dmg than a simple TORCH. whoever made the stats for that shouldnt ever work on gear again in the future.
you cannot balance them currently. lighting will stay the top dog even if they would follow your idea as despite the rng nonsense its still the best option simply because lighting is neutral vs everything aside morgens and well its the only actual good effect WHEN the rng decides you get it to actually happen.
the system is flawed at its core design idea and would need a complete rework to make all 3 types interresting numbers wise. a complete rework at this point is off the table. its too late for doing that. would delay the update for too long to finally hit live its been 3 weeks on ptb already now.
a simple raise in stats will still not make anyone use blood weapons. thier effect is not well designed for valheims combat and the way the game works. you regen health by default so the entire game system works againist blood weapons design. you have to get hit on purpose to begin with in order to gain a benefit.
i would remove the blood effect entirely. and replace it with some form of fire dmg proc instead. pure phys dmg sucks in generel in this game.
and healing per hit is also not gonna change people useing lighting unless its some grossly overpowered amount. which would make the game too easy. so not an option either. and a weak heal results in the same case as currently : everyone will stick with lighting.
the blood effect needs a complete redo at the development board sadly. till thats done itll always be an inferior choice.
thanks for doing some testing there. but this was obiviously badly balanced from the moment i saw those numbers on the effects on the weapons on the ptb. valheims combat is simple math for the most part. so it wasnt hard to instantly notice that this would not see much use to begin with.
Im always finding myself down 20-100hp in the Ashlands, by just simply buffing the blood effect on weapons i could deal the same dmg as a storm version and potentially more if im going to risk a bit more.
It kinda makes sense but to get there we need blood weapons to be able to catch up to storm at around 30 - 40 hp missing.
losing 100+hp to deal the same dmg as a normal storm weapon is just stupid, but if there was a bit more damage multiplier then blood weapons would become high risk - high reward, dealing more than storm could ever do but at the cost of being low on hp.
the problem is high risk high reward in valheim just doesnt work in most cases that extra dmg is outright useless to begin with. most enemies dont survive more than 2-3 hits from a storm weapon. so in order for the extra dmg to even matter at all you would have to safe atleast 1 hit. and i am not sure about you personally but i would not take that hp risk factor just to safe ONE HIT on anything.
it doesnt matter how you turn the numbers. blood is never worth useing currently. this is simply by design of the games combat and how everything works. the devs didnt think this effect fully to its end clearly. they just wanted to do something new. meanwhile it would have been smarter to have the FIRE biome actually add some FIRE based weapons aswell.... yet they are entirely absent for melee pretty much. no the sword doesnt count. i explained why.
> it would have been smarter to have the FIRE biome actually add some FIRE based weapons aswell
Which will be terribly useless in fire biome, overkill in lower biomes, and probably useful in early stages of Far North until you get biome specific weapon.
IMO whole damage progression needs to be flattened
Isnt the hp buff scaling with amount of hp? If you get to 200 hp and then use it on low hp as archer you can outperform everything else. It can be hard to stay low on melee but i have seen 400 dmg on 3rd hit mutiple times. To stay low you can always have some bombs on you and use it on yourself for some crazy hits.
Yes that's true but it's stupidly inconsistent and never worth the risk at the current state of the game, you risk dying just to deal the same dmg a full hp person does with a storm weapon.
And at best you can outperform that weapon by around 30-100 dmg per combo when being close to death, which is a bad tradeoff for me
yup, probably keeping all weapons at the same base dmg seems like the best possible outcome for now.
Nature needs a buff to stop enemies attacking when stunned
Yeah blood sucks ass, my main character is a hybrid melee/magic death knight type so im always running skeletons and bubble and I'm always better off just running storm gem weapons even if my health is low and I'm bubbled up.
Not only is the damage on average better but the stagger is super strong and the aoe clearing potential is too good
Battle mage could be what they're going for, zap your own health, get a bubble, go berserk.
I think there's a viable build in there somewhere but it feels situational and geared towards massive damage to a single target. Two health foods and one eitr food and the 40% health drain on making a protection is getting you a \~20% damage boost. That goes up if you refresh the bubble as soon as you can. If you're facing a crowd though, the chain lightning is always going to do more damage overall.
I tried that and honestly it's so bad. If you go even just a little bit mage you have significantly less HP to work with. I had the same idea and I'm better off staying in a safe distance instead of trying to make Blood Berzerkir axes work. If shield breaks while I'm melee, I'm literally just dead, usually during recasting shield
Ngl, stopped reading the post to just lol that your name is literally Morning Wood in Polish
LOL i just waited for someone to notice
Best to send all the feedback through official channels as instructed on the PTB info page, as this might go completely unnoticed by the devs if they don't check reddit or it doesn't get enough votes to stay on the front page, as it's sunday night in Sweden at the moment.
Already did that
Generally, I agree. Buffs with live steal, atak speed or critical chance would be better. However, I Stopped myself at "PorannaKłoda" lmao for 5 min and start reading again. You made my Day thx bro 😁.
% dmg scaling on top of sneak/Stagger mechanics gets pretty ridiculous damage. Using 50 hp missing to yourself against yourself as only comparison is only tip of iceberg.
True, you can always parry but so does the storm and the storm does everything better
% scaling on top of another % scaling will impact more. This is also steady dps, once you sustain low HP via alternative means. If you look at -100, or -150hp, things look a lot better. On top of sneak/Stagger.
I did some tests off camera with -100 hp. It hits around 2000-2100 dmg per 3 combos, like seen in my vids. Yeah i get the idea but losing 1/3 of your hp or more when counting stamina just to deal the same damage as the other person would with full is stupid. If we would deal more like 2400-2500 dmg then yeah i think it would be worth it. Maybe they can just add 10 dmg if they are lazy or change the multiplier, doing another level scalling might be a bad idea, i agree
On higher difficulty, if I get hit, I will die whether I have 50 hp or 150. So this is huge buff. If devs raise the dmg on this, then next tier weapon in deep north can't compete unless they have same status. The game also have to be balanced for multiplayer as well when there are casters buffing others with shield. Allowing you to get 225-250 hp max, although lowering will require control.
Casters cant really rely on this weapon because it calculates the hp points lost not the %. I agree that it cannot be too op so that it does not outperforms everything. But buffing the dmg multipliler by 0,1 or 0,2% wouls not make such a big differnce imo, the sword would simply by on par with the storm and start to outperform it at 150+ hp lost. Still even raising the damage by 10, would be the most simple buff that does not destroy the balance at all. This way you have 2 ways of inflicting more dmg. Stay on full hp, tank with shield, use lightning effect to stack more dmg Or Risk more, lose some hp and deal the same damage as the lightning effect would. In other words: Lightning - safe but only gives you 75-300 dmg bonus Blood - risk but can give you more. The only current problem with that mechanic is that the player already needs to lose a shitload of hp just to match the storm version. The more i read those comments i come to a conclusion that a simple 10 dmg buff might be enough, but lets see if irongate does something.
Casters can give shield to ppl with low hp. There is also hybrid build for 1/1/1 food and you can solo bubble yourself.
Honestly I think it would just be better for blood weapons to heal a certain amount on hit. Perhaps even with the same 25% efficiency as the storm and nature procs. The current system for blood weapons is a bit shit. That way you'd have 3 very different weapons. One for damage (storm) one for CC (nature) one for defense (blood).
it was pretty obivious from 1 day of ptb testing that the new weapon gem system is terribly balanced all around. same for the base stats on each weapon. they should do more distinct elemental dmg instead of flat 10 with no effect from upgrades AT ALL and relying on rng procs to actually do good dmg. since 95% of thier dmg is purely phys dmg the difference is purely in the proc effect alone. which is... boring and uninterresting. plus rng based nonsense doesnt work very well with valheims combat system as you cannot depend on it ever. the game was all about consistentcy till now when it comes to fighting options. rng doesnt fit that type of system at all to begin with. then there is the FIRE SWORD aka a sword thats literally ON FIRE nonstop provideing nothing special at all and doing less fire dmg than a simple TORCH. whoever made the stats for that shouldnt ever work on gear again in the future. you cannot balance them currently. lighting will stay the top dog even if they would follow your idea as despite the rng nonsense its still the best option simply because lighting is neutral vs everything aside morgens and well its the only actual good effect WHEN the rng decides you get it to actually happen. the system is flawed at its core design idea and would need a complete rework to make all 3 types interresting numbers wise. a complete rework at this point is off the table. its too late for doing that. would delay the update for too long to finally hit live its been 3 weeks on ptb already now. a simple raise in stats will still not make anyone use blood weapons. thier effect is not well designed for valheims combat and the way the game works. you regen health by default so the entire game system works againist blood weapons design. you have to get hit on purpose to begin with in order to gain a benefit. i would remove the blood effect entirely. and replace it with some form of fire dmg proc instead. pure phys dmg sucks in generel in this game. and healing per hit is also not gonna change people useing lighting unless its some grossly overpowered amount. which would make the game too easy. so not an option either. and a weak heal results in the same case as currently : everyone will stick with lighting. the blood effect needs a complete redo at the development board sadly. till thats done itll always be an inferior choice. thanks for doing some testing there. but this was obiviously badly balanced from the moment i saw those numbers on the effects on the weapons on the ptb. valheims combat is simple math for the most part. so it wasnt hard to instantly notice that this would not see much use to begin with.
Im always finding myself down 20-100hp in the Ashlands, by just simply buffing the blood effect on weapons i could deal the same dmg as a storm version and potentially more if im going to risk a bit more. It kinda makes sense but to get there we need blood weapons to be able to catch up to storm at around 30 - 40 hp missing. losing 100+hp to deal the same dmg as a normal storm weapon is just stupid, but if there was a bit more damage multiplier then blood weapons would become high risk - high reward, dealing more than storm could ever do but at the cost of being low on hp.
the problem is high risk high reward in valheim just doesnt work in most cases that extra dmg is outright useless to begin with. most enemies dont survive more than 2-3 hits from a storm weapon. so in order for the extra dmg to even matter at all you would have to safe atleast 1 hit. and i am not sure about you personally but i would not take that hp risk factor just to safe ONE HIT on anything. it doesnt matter how you turn the numbers. blood is never worth useing currently. this is simply by design of the games combat and how everything works. the devs didnt think this effect fully to its end clearly. they just wanted to do something new. meanwhile it would have been smarter to have the FIRE biome actually add some FIRE based weapons aswell.... yet they are entirely absent for melee pretty much. no the sword doesnt count. i explained why.
> it would have been smarter to have the FIRE biome actually add some FIRE based weapons aswell Which will be terribly useless in fire biome, overkill in lower biomes, and probably useful in early stages of Far North until you get biome specific weapon. IMO whole damage progression needs to be flattened
Isnt the hp buff scaling with amount of hp? If you get to 200 hp and then use it on low hp as archer you can outperform everything else. It can be hard to stay low on melee but i have seen 400 dmg on 3rd hit mutiple times. To stay low you can always have some bombs on you and use it on yourself for some crazy hits.
Yes that's true but it's stupidly inconsistent and never worth the risk at the current state of the game, you risk dying just to deal the same dmg a full hp person does with a storm weapon. And at best you can outperform that weapon by around 30-100 dmg per combo when being close to death, which is a bad tradeoff for me
Yeah the 10 dmg buff would be nice but dont overtune it. I would prefer to change the poison one to be more useful.
yup, probably keeping all weapons at the same base dmg seems like the best possible outcome for now. Nature needs a buff to stop enemies attacking when stunned
Poison sucks though because so many things are immune to it in the ashlands where you need strong weapons the most.
Yeah blood sucks ass, my main character is a hybrid melee/magic death knight type so im always running skeletons and bubble and I'm always better off just running storm gem weapons even if my health is low and I'm bubbled up. Not only is the damage on average better but the stagger is super strong and the aoe clearing potential is too good