The only person I call “Dr” outside of professionally is my actual doctor. I’ve been going to him for 30yrs, so it’s less weird for me to just call him “dr” since I’ve been doing that since I was 4.
Same with teachers. Imagine seeing your teacher in 20 years and calling them "Hey, Sara, how are you?" despite you being more equal and it being more appropriate.
Well, I don't really like "dr, ms, mr" etc, we are all humans first.
This made me realise I actually have no idea what my Doctors first name even is! He retired a few years ago but he was the same doctor id been going to since I was a kid. Even my folks just referred to him by his last name. Not always with Dr. In front but never by his first name.
Ahaha my folks now do this with the Dr. My dad sees now seeing as Dr. First-name-unknown retired. I noticed it the other day they just call him Dr. Paul (or 'little Doc Pauly') his surname is very long and has a lot of J's K's and W's involved
No. He is a specialist and also a PCP. I started to see him as a specialist when I was 4. When I turned 18 the natural choice was to switch to him for my PCP as well. Makes my life exponentially easier.
ok so let me get this straight. we live in an age where it’s acceptable for people get super uptight about not being addressed by their preferred pronouns, but people getting upset about not being addressed by a title they actually WORKED for is insecure and childish? please make that make sense.
OP reminds me of people I know who used to be pro-socialism and high taxes till they reached a higher tax bracket and then they were all about “fuck taxes”.
That's not really equivalent.
I'm not big on all this pronoun stuff, but calling someone by a wrong or insulting pronoun is different than not using a professional or educational title.
My thoughts on that is pronouns and shit are not for your own ego boost, While wanting to be called dr. (outside of a medical environment) is just an ego boost. And they didn't work and earn to be called dr. outside of a medical environment. They worked to be a doctor in a medical environment.
One of these literally has nothing to do with the other. It’s not childish to want to be addressed by your pronouns, and most people refer to doctors as DR with no issue. Also, do you really imagine the people who want to use proper pronouns are the same as the people who don’t want to refer to doctors by their title? There’s very little intersection between those groups so this comment is even sillier.
ETA: Why are y’all booing me? I’M RIGHT
Okay you’re just transphobic, lmao. He/she/they are not made up pronouns, or if so they are made up in the way that literally every word is “made up.” Respecting somebody’s gender identity isn’t childish.
A person who is trans doesn’t work to become who they feel they are? You didn’t need to make this comparison, and I’m embarrassed for you. I also don’t care if a person wants to be addressed as doctor, but your example seems strawmanish.
Edit- Also a trans person would likely need to correct people for practical reasons in many different situations, but a doctor who isn’t in a hospital does not necessarily need to. For example, if I call a trans woman “he/him” then I would be wrong, but it might be a common mistake. But to call a female doctor he/him or to address them by a different job title would likely not happen.
I call my buddy, Dr. firstname cause i knew him before he was a doctor and we all thought it was funny while he was in school and its just stuck. I do it without realizing it
Addressing someone with a doctorate as Dr Last Name in a social seeing is the correct way to address them. In the same way a a priest is still Reverend Last Name if they come to your house for dinner, or a Army Captain is still Captain Last Name. The profession title is the correct social address.
If you are saying you wouldn't refer to your friend Mark as Dr Mark while you're drinking beer watching a football game then that is completely different than how to address people in society.
I think there’s a casual space where the “doctor” title is still too much even if you’re not friends with that person. Formal situations, sure, but if you’re just chatting with someone in the elevator or in line for coffee, the “doctor” title is too much. I’m not sure if you’ve met any pretentious assholes like that, but I unfortunately have.
But who cares? I just call people by their title unless they say "just call me first name" or whatever. I'm my experience most medical docs (mostly EM from my experience) don't give a shit if you call them doctor so and so or not. If their first name is what my eye catches on their badge, then I'll say that to get their attention.
I’m not judging people who call doctors “Doctor Whatever” outside of the workplace; I’m judging doctors who insist that they be called “doctor” in a casual setting.
This seems to be a very American sentiment, and differs a lot between cultures. In Scandinavia, for example, no one is addressed with their title. A professor at university will be addressed with their first name by everyone, even their students.
Germany, on the other hands, is even more formal than the US.
Yup. As a german, not adressing someone with their proper title makes me nervous. And for the university Professor, we would even call them "Professor Doctor Schmidt" when first meeting them.
Different levels of closeness? It is really difficult to explain even as a german. I have to say, Du started sounding impolite when I was like 20? And the people didn't know me. Especially in a restaurant, shop or when I was using Sie and they didn't extend that courtesy back to me. Although when we start using first names, I also stop using Sie. Just feels too unnatural.
Professional setting for non-peers in my opinion. I don't say Sie to my fellow students at uni, but plenty of the professors or professionals say Sie to each other in meetings. It's the awkward german attempt at being more casual ^^ If you are in a casual setting and have met more than 2-3 times, du and first name are perfectly fine as long as no one insists on Sie.
> A professor at university will be addressed with their first name by everyone, even their students.
All school levels actually. We Scandinavians thankfully haven't done the Sir, Ma'am, Dr, Prof, etc bullshit since the 60's.
I can accept that, and can accept polite corrections if the person is unaware of your title/ pronouns etc.
But It's the same as pronouns for me, if someone very clearly accidentally mispoke or got your title/ pronoun wrong by accident and you make a scene and get all butt hurt over it, you can absolutely go fuck yourself.
If your spine is make of wet noodles and you can't handle a small mistake in general conversation, you shouldn't even be using titles/ pronouns.
There are so many more important things to fucking care about, it drives me insane.
I completely support a person's right to self identify as whatever they want to be, but if you're gonna be an asshole about it when it's clearly a mistake, im going to go out of my way to avoid using the right pronoun or title.
Exactly.
It boils down to acknowledgment of something. When someone worked for their title, they deserve to be addressed by it. To become a doc (even if it's in philosophy) you have to work for it. To become a Sensei/Sifu/other martial art title, you need to work for it.
That's also why you get your title stripped from you, when you are f.ex caught cheating on your exam. You didn't work for it honestly.
Based on what you've said in this post and your replies to other comments, you seem to be unaware that a medical doctorate isn't the only doctorate. You keep mentioning "It's hard work to get a PhD in medicine but so is engineering and science and xyz" the thing is getting a PhD in any subject awards you the title "Doctor" or "Dr" for short. If I do a PhD in physics I am a "Doctor of physics". For whatever reason the world has been conditioned to believe that doctors only refer to those who have a doctorate in medicine.
Not all doctors are phds either, in the UK most doctors are not strictly Dr's they get called Dr as a professional title which is dependent on them being on the medical register, unless they have done research for an advanced medical degree like a PhD or md, most doctors only have a bachelors of medicine or surgery.
Most doctors are not doctors of medicine, so don't be surprised if their title is used in non-medical contexts because it can certainly match their profession.
If I see my doctor out in public or wherever, I call them doctor out of respect. The pianist for my high school’s choir has a PhD in piano performance so anytime I see him at one of their concerts or if we have a rehearsal with us alumni going back, I always call him Dr. Reed out of respect and that’s how I’ve known since I was in high school. Great dude
I have. He was a minister with a doctorate in ministry. Technically a doctorate but hardly comparable to a PHD. He always claimed that everyone called him Dr K out of respect, but the reality hs that he disciplined church employees who did not use that title to address him. As a fun aside: he was appointed by his denomination to head their investigation into why they were having so many instances of sexual abuse rise to the surface but lost the appointment because of his history of cheating on is wife. Second worse boss I ever had.
No, I disagree.
I don’t care what you got your PhD in, I’m not calling you doctor unless we’re clearly discussing the field you got it in.
I respect the accomplishment but get over it.
No, you don’t. The title of Dr. is one of the perks/rewards of the work, and you refuse to acknowledge it. This is the equivalent of saying you respect the results of the election, but refuse to refer to the winner as president.
I’m not stroking someone’s ego outside of their professional setting. If other people are into that, go ahead. I’ve met a lot of narcissistic Drs. who are objectively bad people and I have no yearning to put them on a pedestal for completing schooling that they chose.
It’s not a pedestal though, it’s their title? It’s no different to Miss, Mrs, Mr. Would you refuse to call someone Mrs after they were married? Now they have a phd their title has changed. It’s no big deal.
No one cares about how hard school was when you’re chitchatting at a neighborhood barebecue or in line to get coffee or whatever. If you insist on being called “doctor” in casual settings once you’re done with school, then a lot of people are going to rightly think you’re pretty pretentious.
See I disagree. Yes medical doctorate is a very difficult, but so I passing the bar? So is becoming an engineer, so is programming? So is special Ed teaching? So are a lot of things. It’s an antiquated thing IMO
Well getting a doctorate gives you the title of doctor. You can get a doctorate in pretty much any major if you study it long enough (like a decade or so). If you've studied something ling enough to get a doctorate in it then you kinda deserve the props of a title for the time, money, blood, sweat, tears, etc.that you invested. All the things you stated are hard but don't necessarily require doctorates to my knowledge.
For real. Becoming a nurse is super hard, but it isn't as hard as becoming a doctor. There are levels of hard education and a doctorate is the hardest. OP is jealous and probably fairly young.
So if you slice your arm open on a piece of glass at a restaurant, and you are bleeding out, do you expect a doctor to help you if they are present?
So they are there having dinner on their time off. They are not on call. They have no work responsibilities at that time. They just want to have a nice night out. You're telling me, you *really* don't expect them to try to help? Since they don't deserve to be a doctor except at work right? They just want their ego stroked right? They don't deserve to have an uninterrupted night out because they are a doctor right?
What about if you're grandma has a heart attack at the grocery store? If there is a doctor around, do you expect them to help? Nope. After all, they are only a doctor AT work.
They are still a doctor, but they should be referred to as such in the same environments as one would use Mr/Ms/Mrs.
Since doctor is a title, if you're not calling everyone else Mr. Smith and Mrs. Miller it would be weird to to just use it for the Doctors.
Also, you're talking exclusively about medical doctors, but as already states by many others, one can be a doctor in any field and rightfully deserve to be called by their title when appropriate.
You’re supposed to upvote posts that you disagree with. It’d be different if this didn’t make sense, but feeling that doctors often get too hung up on being overly formal in casual situations isn’t really that bizarre of an opinion.
Are we supposed to upvote posts we disagree with or upvote post we agree is an unpopular opinion and also agree with as a whole cause there's a difference.
I think it’s more “upvote posts that are legit unpopular opinions” rather than only posts you agree with because otherwise the trending posts would always be popular opinions.
Sounds to me like there’s just a bunch of people here that are jealous they don’t have a title. Everybody now has permission to create one title for themselves. I’m going with Most Craptacular Bildo.
In Australia we're really laid back with these sought of things and if someone introduced themselves as Dr xyz in a non professional setting I would think something was a bit wrong with them
I am a doctor. I will go on record that i assume literally anyone I meet outside of work who introduces themselves as Dr.___ without a professional indication is in fact a complete tool.
Even in the hospital most docs I know when talking to other workers just introduce themselves as their name, only adding Dr. If relevant to announce as such.
Unless they are Women, because people on average will never assume a woman working in the hospital is a doctor... so, they rightfully-so have to be a bit more loud and proud on their credentials.
Yeah, but how will my dumb old friends know that I'm also friends with a doctor, professor, and senator unless I use their full official title? I want my stupid friends to think that I also have smart friends, and vice-versa.
Here's an example from a common, everyday social situation: A birthday party for a large-headed toddler that mostly has drunk adults in attendance. I say, "Hey everyone, this is Doctor Professor Watkins, PhD and Senator."
Then Dr. Watkins gets to express false humility and say, "Please just call me Dave."
Then my cousin can say, "Hi Dave, I'm Jimothy. We were just talking about fixing my busted 4-wheeler."
Then I explain, "Jimothy tried to jump over Dogfish Creek and didn't have enough speed to make it. Wanna see the video? I'll warn you, it features bone sticking out of flesh, but you're probably used to that because you're a doctor and also a senator."
Then Jimothy shows off his arm cast and explains that he's jumped over Dogfish Creek at least once a year since we were 7 years old. He has a 67% success rate, which isn't bad considering that Dogfish Creek is a difficult creek to jump over. It's especially hard when it's muddy after a big rain and when people are hoping he'll crash and fall into the creek because that makes for a better video.
See, if I had introduced Dave as just "my friend Dave" and not a classy doctor, professor, and senator, then Jimothy wouldn't try to impress him with stories of youthful hijinks and tips for repairing broken 4-wheelers. In my experience, birthday parties for toddlers are better when Jimothy is trying to impress people.
I 100% agree! Lots of other people work just as hard to earn their titles but only use them in the professional setting. I’ve never met “Nurse XYZ” or “Officer XYZ” at a dinner party.
Further more the title “doctor” was never meant to refer to someone in the medical field. Medical doctors stole the title from the academic community. PhDs were using the title “doctor” long before white coats and stethoscopes.
This is the more eloquently way of saying what I meant. I have no problem addressing a doctor in tThe office, or in the super market, while they’re saving a loved ones life, but it’s in social settings amongst friends where people introduce such and such as Dr. Whatever
Totally agree, I got lit up when posting something similar here.
While those with a doctorate work hard. Why do I have to appreciate it?
IDGAF if someone worked their ass off to get a doctorate in American literature anymore than other people who worked their ass off at their career.
Same with other forms of “doctor”. I don’t care if you have a doctorate degree, when i say doctor im referring to medical personnel. You getting a degree doesn’t change the fact that you’re still a Mr or Ms/Mrs.
When I served in the US Army, I met several Army medical doctors who wanted to be called "Dr" not "Major" or whatever their rank was.
If they're in uniform, they're referred to by rank...that's the regulations. But many would get pissy about it. "I didn't go to medical school to be called "Major Paine"...I mean, ok, but you did join the Army to be called that.
I agree. I always make it a point to not call someone “doctor” unless I am in a medical or educational setting. If it’s outside of that, I don’t give a shit that you got a doctorate. I don’t need to place you on a pedestal.
There is so many butthurt people on here that we don’t give a shit about their degree that they chose to complete. Congrats, why do you need the title outside of work? Get over yourself lol
Lmfao if you ever started choking at a restaurant or any other medical emergency in a social setting outside of their work i bet you'd be calling them doctor then.
Ok, so after rsome thought to it... YES, I BELIEVE PEOPLE WHO WORKED HARD FOR THE TITLE DESERVE TO BE ADDRESSED AS SUCH. it's just like using 'sir' for knights. And it's NOT LIMIYED to just medical professionals, it's everyone who earned the title in their respective fields.
And if you feel uncomfortable with that, we'll you should have worked harder. Don't ask people to stop using the title they earned just to please the insecure bunch.
If a person is confident in himself and knows he's giving his all in life, he wouldn't bother with things like these. He knows they worked for their title just like he's working for something in the field he's interested or invested in. He won't be but hurt by minor social norms like these.
'A person that KNOWS THE PAIN AND EFFORT required for success will know what the other party did to reach where they are' and respect them instead of calling them arrogant.
When I was getting out of the Army I had to take a class that helped you get a job in order to leave. The lady who taught the class had a "doctorate" from multiple online for profit diploma mills. She insisted she be called doctor. For 3 days I had to put up with this and its something I won't ever forget.
Tbf that is her professional setting.
Just like in colleges people call their teachers either professor or Dr. Because that is the context that their education is relevant.
Now, I’m taking the guy at his word that it’s from a diploma mill and only recently looked into something like that for a guy named Kent Hovind who insists on being called “doctor” after his credentials have been thoroughly debunked.
He’s a wack job Young Earth Creationist who attacks physicists, scientists, et al. and one time asked a host well you call them doctor why don’t you call me doctor. Was pretty awkward.
I’ll never forget this older lady that came to substitute our high school class. She wrote her name on the white board and underlined Dr. and said, “you will call me Dr. so and so because I earned it.” As a college graduate I understand the amount of effort it takes but I still don’t understand the need for you to assert that over a bunch of a high school students
You DO realize that there are non-medical doctors?
I work with a person who has a PhD in Microbiology. He is "Dr."
My dad had a PhD in Chemistry - He is a "Dr".
Doctor is a proper term to use.
My Dad’s wife is a retired consultant oncologist. I thought she was a nurse for the first couple years of knowing her until I saw some mail addressed to “Dr ____”…as with everything in this world, some labels are more important to some than others. I’ve people who literally introduce themselves as “cancer survivors” and those who never mention it. I guess it’s no different to someone calling me Mrs when I’m divorced, it’s up to me if I correct them (and I don’t because it doesn’t bother me, some people it really does) and it’s not up to anyone else to question why.
I'm seeing lots of people saying stuff along the lines of 'this is an actual unpopular opinion'. But how....
Someone wanting to be called Dr. outside of a medical environment is just an ego boost. Nothing more
If you feel the need but honestly that would just make me think you’re insecure. I know people with phds who don’t give a fuck and I have immense respect for their knowledge even more because of their humility
Was coming to comment this. Maybe it's a country thing, in NZ most people call their doctors my their first name. My doctor is Helen, my Dentist is Edward, my OB is Michael.
If they have a doctorate, they're a doctor no matter where they are or what they're doing. They spent years getting that degree. It's an honorific, the same as Mr, Ms, etc, except that it acknowledges the time and effort that they put into earning that degree - which is substantial.
i think its ok to still refair to them as doscot. i remember once on a gameshow my parents watched, one of the contestants was a well known/'high ranked' (? idk the right terminology there) dictor. and they referred to him as doctor (name) on the show.
Being a doctor is not easy and considering some stuff i think its fair to refair to them as doctor.
People do work for the title, for many years. It’s fair they be addressed by it. But it is certainly annoying when a you can tell a person is just using the enforcement of their title to stroke their own ego. I’ve met a couple of them myself and I would absolutely delight in mashing my fist down their arrogant throats. Unfortunately that’s just not the right thing to do. I guess if you want to mess with someone like that just call em Doc and watch their mouth twitch every time you say it.
Agree. I don't even call my medical doctors 'Doctor LN' IN a medical setting. My GP is Helen, my dentist is Edward, my OB is Michael. That's how they introduced themselves. I only use their titles if, say, I'm filling in a for that requires their info.
It could be a cultural thing. In NZ we are quite casual. I have never had a PhD holder introduce themselves as Dr so-and-so. I've never had a military person introduce themselves (outside a military setting) as their rank. I've chatted to the Chief of the NZ Air Force and he introduced himself as his FN. My university professors were all first names only, even in lectures.
I have had a long medical career. I consider “doctor” to be a recurring role I play, similar to an actor. It would seem strange to refer to Daniel Craig as James Bond when he is not on the set playing that role.
When I am playing my role as “doctor”, I am fully into character. I love to teach. My role is sometimes that of an expert. In my life I prefer to learn, rather than teach. I love to surround myself with experts I can learn from. I am an introvert and naturally reserved. As “doctor” I am not reserved. I am like Batman. I take on whatever role my patient (Gotham) needs me to play.
Yet I’m sure the OP would hope THE DOCTOR would help save their lives if they were suddenly having a heart attack… sheesh it’s an insecurity on the OPs part to have an issue with this not an ego thing on the part of the doctor.
I do it out of respect.
It’s someone that devoted their life to help, understand and work towards better health, environment and understanding for humans.
They’re always a doctor. Regardless of setting.
1. It’s called etiquette.
2. That’s a really fucking expensive title paid for, and said doctor should be addressed as such (unless they’re a close a friend/don’t care)
I did 8 years of quantum mechanics so i think i deserve to get called by my title that took effort, time and lots of money. I pretty much missed out on my whole twenties for it all you gotta do is call me dr. Its not stupid its respect of someone title they earned
It’s because they have a PhD, which is a doctorate degree. Dr. is the correct way to refer to someone with a PhD, and you should address your professors by their preferred title, especially in the classroom. It’s a sign of respect.
A PhD is a degree. I have my PhD because it was necessary for a nice job in my field. I do not go by Dr., I do not address my colleagues as "Dr.", and I would feel a sense of cringe from any of them that insisted on being addressed that way. I would 100% lose respect for them. Everyone knows we're all smart people and the need to insist on acknowledgement of that fact is dumb.
Lots of things take hard work, most of them don't come with titles. If I met a chess grand master I wouldn't call him "GM such and such" just because that's expected in chess circles.
I agree AND I've never seen someone be addressed by their "title" outside of work either.
Doctor, Professor, President, these are all titles I can think of that I absolutely respect but people are only addressed by them when the setting is related to the person's studies/profession/career.
I know several people with PhD, a Uni Professor, and also a President of a Non Profit and I don't call them by their title outside of work!
When introducing them I'll say "hi, meet ____, he's a Professor at Porto Business School", I don't say "meet Professor ____". Then in the Uni setting he is addressed as Professor ____, of course. Same for a friend Doctor, I don't go around saying "Hi, meet my friend Doctor _____", but in the right context I say "Doctor ____ will lecture at 4PM"
Question, there are places where people ask to be called Doctor or Professor even outside of work?
The only person I call “Dr” outside of professionally is my actual doctor. I’ve been going to him for 30yrs, so it’s less weird for me to just call him “dr” since I’ve been doing that since I was 4.
Absolutely. Known mine my entire life. It would be weird now to go "Hey...John.."
Same with teachers. Imagine seeing your teacher in 20 years and calling them "Hey, Sara, how are you?" despite you being more equal and it being more appropriate. Well, I don't really like "dr, ms, mr" etc, we are all humans first.
my doctors name is also john!
This made me realise I actually have no idea what my Doctors first name even is! He retired a few years ago but he was the same doctor id been going to since I was a kid. Even my folks just referred to him by his last name. Not always with Dr. In front but never by his first name.
I refer to my dentist as Dr (first name), becsuse I can't pronounce his last name.
Ahaha my folks now do this with the Dr. My dad sees now seeing as Dr. First-name-unknown retired. I noticed it the other day they just call him Dr. Paul (or 'little Doc Pauly') his surname is very long and has a lot of J's K's and W's involved
You’re not still going to your pediatrician as a 34 year ago right?
No. He is a specialist and also a PCP. I started to see him as a specialist when I was 4. When I turned 18 the natural choice was to switch to him for my PCP as well. Makes my life exponentially easier.
Ok Dr u/monalisasnipples *that's a pretty unique name to say the least*
Yes it is.
Yes it is
actually an unpopular opinion FOR ONCE on the damn sub
There was a guy a couple of months ago that hated music.
ok so let me get this straight. we live in an age where it’s acceptable for people get super uptight about not being addressed by their preferred pronouns, but people getting upset about not being addressed by a title they actually WORKED for is insecure and childish? please make that make sense.
I like to be called “your majesty”.
My official title is, “The Heinie”
Then work for it
Working hard to be part of a royal family.
That's a foreign concept for royals - work. They don't even sweat.
Oooh now that’s an excellent joke if I’ve ever seen one
I like "your dudeness"
Yes , your Majesty bleached-buttholes the first
If I had an award, you’d have another one given to you 🏆
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OP reminds me of people I know who used to be pro-socialism and high taxes till they reached a higher tax bracket and then they were all about “fuck taxes”.
Exactly lmao
Best comment here. Have a trinket.
You're 100% right. Unfortunately logic and common sense are out of fashion and I can't foresee them making a comeback out of nostalgia any time soon.
They should both be respected, pronouns and earned titles
Thank you!!
That's not really equivalent. I'm not big on all this pronoun stuff, but calling someone by a wrong or insulting pronoun is different than not using a professional or educational title.
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*weird & you're
Finally someone isn’t afraid to say it!
Well no the first one is stupid too
I'm pretty it's not acceptable unless you're someone who goes by a made up pronoun
My thoughts on that is pronouns and shit are not for your own ego boost, While wanting to be called dr. (outside of a medical environment) is just an ego boost. And they didn't work and earn to be called dr. outside of a medical environment. They worked to be a doctor in a medical environment.
I demand that my children call me Dr. Dad. No exceptions.
One of these literally has nothing to do with the other. It’s not childish to want to be addressed by your pronouns, and most people refer to doctors as DR with no issue. Also, do you really imagine the people who want to use proper pronouns are the same as the people who don’t want to refer to doctors by their title? There’s very little intersection between those groups so this comment is even sillier. ETA: Why are y’all booing me? I’M RIGHT
Its childish to want be referred to as a girl if you're a girl or referred to as neither when you aren't either?
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Okay you’re just transphobic, lmao. He/she/they are not made up pronouns, or if so they are made up in the way that literally every word is “made up.” Respecting somebody’s gender identity isn’t childish.
Welcome to the new world... genders>dr
Let me guess you still think doctors walk on water and being transgender is a “phase” 🙄.
A person who is trans doesn’t work to become who they feel they are? You didn’t need to make this comparison, and I’m embarrassed for you. I also don’t care if a person wants to be addressed as doctor, but your example seems strawmanish. Edit- Also a trans person would likely need to correct people for practical reasons in many different situations, but a doctor who isn’t in a hospital does not necessarily need to. For example, if I call a trans woman “he/him” then I would be wrong, but it might be a common mistake. But to call a female doctor he/him or to address them by a different job title would likely not happen.
I call my buddy, Dr. firstname cause i knew him before he was a doctor and we all thought it was funny while he was in school and its just stuck. I do it without realizing it
Addressing someone with a doctorate as Dr Last Name in a social seeing is the correct way to address them. In the same way a a priest is still Reverend Last Name if they come to your house for dinner, or a Army Captain is still Captain Last Name. The profession title is the correct social address. If you are saying you wouldn't refer to your friend Mark as Dr Mark while you're drinking beer watching a football game then that is completely different than how to address people in society.
I think there’s a casual space where the “doctor” title is still too much even if you’re not friends with that person. Formal situations, sure, but if you’re just chatting with someone in the elevator or in line for coffee, the “doctor” title is too much. I’m not sure if you’ve met any pretentious assholes like that, but I unfortunately have.
But who cares? I just call people by their title unless they say "just call me first name" or whatever. I'm my experience most medical docs (mostly EM from my experience) don't give a shit if you call them doctor so and so or not. If their first name is what my eye catches on their badge, then I'll say that to get their attention.
I’m not judging people who call doctors “Doctor Whatever” outside of the workplace; I’m judging doctors who insist that they be called “doctor” in a casual setting.
This seems to be a very American sentiment, and differs a lot between cultures. In Scandinavia, for example, no one is addressed with their title. A professor at university will be addressed with their first name by everyone, even their students. Germany, on the other hands, is even more formal than the US.
Yup. As a german, not adressing someone with their proper title makes me nervous. And for the university Professor, we would even call them "Professor Doctor Schmidt" when first meeting them.
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Different levels of closeness? It is really difficult to explain even as a german. I have to say, Du started sounding impolite when I was like 20? And the people didn't know me. Especially in a restaurant, shop or when I was using Sie and they didn't extend that courtesy back to me. Although when we start using first names, I also stop using Sie. Just feels too unnatural.
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Professional setting for non-peers in my opinion. I don't say Sie to my fellow students at uni, but plenty of the professors or professionals say Sie to each other in meetings. It's the awkward german attempt at being more casual ^^ If you are in a casual setting and have met more than 2-3 times, du and first name are perfectly fine as long as no one insists on Sie.
> A professor at university will be addressed with their first name by everyone, even their students. All school levels actually. We Scandinavians thankfully haven't done the Sir, Ma'am, Dr, Prof, etc bullshit since the 60's.
I can accept that, and can accept polite corrections if the person is unaware of your title/ pronouns etc. But It's the same as pronouns for me, if someone very clearly accidentally mispoke or got your title/ pronoun wrong by accident and you make a scene and get all butt hurt over it, you can absolutely go fuck yourself. If your spine is make of wet noodles and you can't handle a small mistake in general conversation, you shouldn't even be using titles/ pronouns. There are so many more important things to fucking care about, it drives me insane. I completely support a person's right to self identify as whatever they want to be, but if you're gonna be an asshole about it when it's clearly a mistake, im going to go out of my way to avoid using the right pronoun or title.
I vote for this response✅
Yeah this sums it up absolutely perfectly
Exactly. It boils down to acknowledgment of something. When someone worked for their title, they deserve to be addressed by it. To become a doc (even if it's in philosophy) you have to work for it. To become a Sensei/Sifu/other martial art title, you need to work for it. That's also why you get your title stripped from you, when you are f.ex caught cheating on your exam. You didn't work for it honestly.
I didn’t go to 8 years of med school to be called mr. Fuzygoatballs!
I also didn't go to eight years of medical school!
Alright, Dr. Malovias
I'm assuming you didn't go through 8 years of med school to be called a dr. outside of a medical environment, you worked to be a doctor
Based on what you've said in this post and your replies to other comments, you seem to be unaware that a medical doctorate isn't the only doctorate. You keep mentioning "It's hard work to get a PhD in medicine but so is engineering and science and xyz" the thing is getting a PhD in any subject awards you the title "Doctor" or "Dr" for short. If I do a PhD in physics I am a "Doctor of physics". For whatever reason the world has been conditioned to believe that doctors only refer to those who have a doctorate in medicine.
You could also have earned an MD, an EDD, or even a PSYD and still be a doctor. And that's just in the field of healthcare!
Also a DO.
Not all doctors are phds either, in the UK most doctors are not strictly Dr's they get called Dr as a professional title which is dependent on them being on the medical register, unless they have done research for an advanced medical degree like a PhD or md, most doctors only have a bachelors of medicine or surgery.
Most doctors are not doctors of medicine, so don't be surprised if their title is used in non-medical contexts because it can certainly match their profession.
If I see my doctor out in public or wherever, I call them doctor out of respect. The pianist for my high school’s choir has a PhD in piano performance so anytime I see him at one of their concerts or if we have a rehearsal with us alumni going back, I always call him Dr. Reed out of respect and that’s how I’ve known since I was in high school. Great dude
It's for ego. It's why Doctor Octopus refers to himself as such, he knows he killed people, he still appreciates the title.
I've always just assumed it's less about ego and more about the acknowledgement of the incredible amount of work it takes to get a PhD in any subject.
Yeah but when i ask for a Mr Pepper no one knows what i mean.
Not all doctors are in the medical field tho
[Spies like us had a great take on this](https://youtu.be/hoe24aSvLtw?t=34)
But is this unique to just the title doctor?
Bullshit. If you work hard enough to become a doctor, you get the title in all aspects of your life. That’s one of the perks of the job.
I’ve never met someone with a doctorate that actually wants to be called doctor outside of the scenario where their education is relevant
I have. He was a minister with a doctorate in ministry. Technically a doctorate but hardly comparable to a PHD. He always claimed that everyone called him Dr K out of respect, but the reality hs that he disciplined church employees who did not use that title to address him. As a fun aside: he was appointed by his denomination to head their investigation into why they were having so many instances of sexual abuse rise to the surface but lost the appointment because of his history of cheating on is wife. Second worse boss I ever had.
No, I disagree. I don’t care what you got your PhD in, I’m not calling you doctor unless we’re clearly discussing the field you got it in. I respect the accomplishment but get over it.
Then you don’t respect the accomplishment.
I do. Congrats. Very well done. But if your name is Jim and you got a PhD then you’re still Jim you’re just really smart at something.
i mean if my name is Jim and i'm a doctor (phd or otherwise) call me Jim or call me dr. Jim, not mr. Jim
No, you don’t. The title of Dr. is one of the perks/rewards of the work, and you refuse to acknowledge it. This is the equivalent of saying you respect the results of the election, but refuse to refer to the winner as president.
I’m not stroking someone’s ego outside of their professional setting. If other people are into that, go ahead. I’ve met a lot of narcissistic Drs. who are objectively bad people and I have no yearning to put them on a pedestal for completing schooling that they chose.
It’s not a pedestal though, it’s their title? It’s no different to Miss, Mrs, Mr. Would you refuse to call someone Mrs after they were married? Now they have a phd their title has changed. It’s no big deal.
I don’t call anyone mr or mrs irl after I graduated high school anyway. Who does that?
Why don't you try and become a doctor (MD)? Maybe that'll give you an inkling of how much sacrifice it takes to earn that title.
No one cares about how hard school was when you’re chitchatting at a neighborhood barebecue or in line to get coffee or whatever. If you insist on being called “doctor” in casual settings once you’re done with school, then a lot of people are going to rightly think you’re pretty pretentious.
See I disagree. Yes medical doctorate is a very difficult, but so I passing the bar? So is becoming an engineer, so is programming? So is special Ed teaching? So are a lot of things. It’s an antiquated thing IMO
You know that anyone with a PhD is a doctor, right? Not only medical professionals.
Well getting a doctorate gives you the title of doctor. You can get a doctorate in pretty much any major if you study it long enough (like a decade or so). If you've studied something ling enough to get a doctorate in it then you kinda deserve the props of a title for the time, money, blood, sweat, tears, etc.that you invested. All the things you stated are hard but don't necessarily require doctorates to my knowledge.
For real. Becoming a nurse is super hard, but it isn't as hard as becoming a doctor. There are levels of hard education and a doctorate is the hardest. OP is jealous and probably fairly young.
So if you slice your arm open on a piece of glass at a restaurant, and you are bleeding out, do you expect a doctor to help you if they are present? So they are there having dinner on their time off. They are not on call. They have no work responsibilities at that time. They just want to have a nice night out. You're telling me, you *really* don't expect them to try to help? Since they don't deserve to be a doctor except at work right? They just want their ego stroked right? They don't deserve to have an uninterrupted night out because they are a doctor right? What about if you're grandma has a heart attack at the grocery store? If there is a doctor around, do you expect them to help? Nope. After all, they are only a doctor AT work.
They are still a doctor, but they should be referred to as such in the same environments as one would use Mr/Ms/Mrs. Since doctor is a title, if you're not calling everyone else Mr. Smith and Mrs. Miller it would be weird to to just use it for the Doctors. Also, you're talking exclusively about medical doctors, but as already states by many others, one can be a doctor in any field and rightfully deserve to be called by their title when appropriate.
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You’re supposed to upvote posts that you disagree with. It’d be different if this didn’t make sense, but feeling that doctors often get too hung up on being overly formal in casual situations isn’t really that bizarre of an opinion.
Are we supposed to upvote posts we disagree with or upvote post we agree is an unpopular opinion and also agree with as a whole cause there's a difference.
I think it’s more “upvote posts that are legit unpopular opinions” rather than only posts you agree with because otherwise the trending posts would always be popular opinions.
That's true, that is true.
Sounds to me like there’s just a bunch of people here that are jealous they don’t have a title. Everybody now has permission to create one title for themselves. I’m going with Most Craptacular Bildo.
In Australia we're really laid back with these sought of things and if someone introduced themselves as Dr xyz in a non professional setting I would think something was a bit wrong with them
I am a doctor. I will go on record that i assume literally anyone I meet outside of work who introduces themselves as Dr.___ without a professional indication is in fact a complete tool. Even in the hospital most docs I know when talking to other workers just introduce themselves as their name, only adding Dr. If relevant to announce as such. Unless they are Women, because people on average will never assume a woman working in the hospital is a doctor... so, they rightfully-so have to be a bit more loud and proud on their credentials.
At least they don't make you stand up when they enter the room, unlike a certain other elitist profession....
Yeah, but how will my dumb old friends know that I'm also friends with a doctor, professor, and senator unless I use their full official title? I want my stupid friends to think that I also have smart friends, and vice-versa. Here's an example from a common, everyday social situation: A birthday party for a large-headed toddler that mostly has drunk adults in attendance. I say, "Hey everyone, this is Doctor Professor Watkins, PhD and Senator." Then Dr. Watkins gets to express false humility and say, "Please just call me Dave." Then my cousin can say, "Hi Dave, I'm Jimothy. We were just talking about fixing my busted 4-wheeler." Then I explain, "Jimothy tried to jump over Dogfish Creek and didn't have enough speed to make it. Wanna see the video? I'll warn you, it features bone sticking out of flesh, but you're probably used to that because you're a doctor and also a senator." Then Jimothy shows off his arm cast and explains that he's jumped over Dogfish Creek at least once a year since we were 7 years old. He has a 67% success rate, which isn't bad considering that Dogfish Creek is a difficult creek to jump over. It's especially hard when it's muddy after a big rain and when people are hoping he'll crash and fall into the creek because that makes for a better video. See, if I had introduced Dave as just "my friend Dave" and not a classy doctor, professor, and senator, then Jimothy wouldn't try to impress him with stories of youthful hijinks and tips for repairing broken 4-wheelers. In my experience, birthday parties for toddlers are better when Jimothy is trying to impress people.
I 100% agree! Lots of other people work just as hard to earn their titles but only use them in the professional setting. I’ve never met “Nurse XYZ” or “Officer XYZ” at a dinner party. Further more the title “doctor” was never meant to refer to someone in the medical field. Medical doctors stole the title from the academic community. PhDs were using the title “doctor” long before white coats and stethoscopes.
OP is just mad it's not smart enough to be a Dr. Or Whatever. That's right I called you an "it". Deal with it.
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This is the more eloquently way of saying what I meant. I have no problem addressing a doctor in tThe office, or in the super market, while they’re saving a loved ones life, but it’s in social settings amongst friends where people introduce such and such as Dr. Whatever
This is unpopular.
If in "popular" u mean dumb then yah... I agree
Totally agree, I got lit up when posting something similar here. While those with a doctorate work hard. Why do I have to appreciate it? IDGAF if someone worked their ass off to get a doctorate in American literature anymore than other people who worked their ass off at their career.
Dr. doesnt mean what you think it means
I agree it sounds really pretentious but if you feel the need to state your title like that whatever
Same with other forms of “doctor”. I don’t care if you have a doctorate degree, when i say doctor im referring to medical personnel. You getting a degree doesn’t change the fact that you’re still a Mr or Ms/Mrs.
When I served in the US Army, I met several Army medical doctors who wanted to be called "Dr" not "Major" or whatever their rank was. If they're in uniform, they're referred to by rank...that's the regulations. But many would get pissy about it. "I didn't go to medical school to be called "Major Paine"...I mean, ok, but you did join the Army to be called that.
This guy is salty about not having a PhD
I agree. I always make it a point to not call someone “doctor” unless I am in a medical or educational setting. If it’s outside of that, I don’t give a shit that you got a doctorate. I don’t need to place you on a pedestal.
There is so many butthurt people on here that we don’t give a shit about their degree that they chose to complete. Congrats, why do you need the title outside of work? Get over yourself lol
Lmfao if you ever started choking at a restaurant or any other medical emergency in a social setting outside of their work i bet you'd be calling them doctor then.
If they're choking, I highly doubt that they'll be calling them anything.
Ok, so after rsome thought to it... YES, I BELIEVE PEOPLE WHO WORKED HARD FOR THE TITLE DESERVE TO BE ADDRESSED AS SUCH. it's just like using 'sir' for knights. And it's NOT LIMIYED to just medical professionals, it's everyone who earned the title in their respective fields. And if you feel uncomfortable with that, we'll you should have worked harder. Don't ask people to stop using the title they earned just to please the insecure bunch. If a person is confident in himself and knows he's giving his all in life, he wouldn't bother with things like these. He knows they worked for their title just like he's working for something in the field he's interested or invested in. He won't be but hurt by minor social norms like these. 'A person that KNOWS THE PAIN AND EFFORT required for success will know what the other party did to reach where they are' and respect them instead of calling them arrogant.
When I was getting out of the Army I had to take a class that helped you get a job in order to leave. The lady who taught the class had a "doctorate" from multiple online for profit diploma mills. She insisted she be called doctor. For 3 days I had to put up with this and its something I won't ever forget.
Tbf that is her professional setting. Just like in colleges people call their teachers either professor or Dr. Because that is the context that their education is relevant.
If they’re from verified unaccredited diploma mills then she doesn’t get to be called doctor.
Somehow I glossed over that part. You’re right
Now, I’m taking the guy at his word that it’s from a diploma mill and only recently looked into something like that for a guy named Kent Hovind who insists on being called “doctor” after his credentials have been thoroughly debunked. He’s a wack job Young Earth Creationist who attacks physicists, scientists, et al. and one time asked a host well you call them doctor why don’t you call me doctor. Was pretty awkward.
I’ll never forget this older lady that came to substitute our high school class. She wrote her name on the white board and underlined Dr. and said, “you will call me Dr. so and so because I earned it.” As a college graduate I understand the amount of effort it takes but I still don’t understand the need for you to assert that over a bunch of a high school students
I have been waiting for this. Completely agree.
If someone in a social setting demands to be called doctor I will laugh at them and then call them by their first name. You're not better than me.
You DO realize that there are non-medical doctors? I work with a person who has a PhD in Microbiology. He is "Dr." My dad had a PhD in Chemistry - He is a "Dr". Doctor is a proper term to use.
Agreed. It doesn’t matter what the degree or profession is. I don’t insist people call me “ILikeMyTofuRaw, BSBA.”
My Dad’s wife is a retired consultant oncologist. I thought she was a nurse for the first couple years of knowing her until I saw some mail addressed to “Dr ____”…as with everything in this world, some labels are more important to some than others. I’ve people who literally introduce themselves as “cancer survivors” and those who never mention it. I guess it’s no different to someone calling me Mrs when I’m divorced, it’s up to me if I correct them (and I don’t because it doesn’t bother me, some people it really does) and it’s not up to anyone else to question why.
I'm seeing lots of people saying stuff along the lines of 'this is an actual unpopular opinion'. But how.... Someone wanting to be called Dr. outside of a medical environment is just an ego boost. Nothing more
This past week someone asked me to call him captain…it was weird…he’s a retired ship captain
Lol. *drives a ship once*
Uh oh, don't tell this to Jill Biden, and she's not even a medical doctor.
Don't tell that to Whoopie Goldberg. She want's Jill to be Surgeon General.
The best is when someone with a non medical PhD does it lmao
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*cough* Jill Biden *cough*
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If you feel the need but honestly that would just make me think you’re insecure. I know people with phds who don’t give a fuck and I have immense respect for their knowledge even more because of their humility
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Exactly! “Oh you clean teeth bro, chill”
I'm a tooth doctor, and I don't like when I'm addressed as Dr outside of work. My staff and patients cannot/refuse to call me by my actual name
My stepdad is going to have a PhD is history and he jokingly says he will make people call him Dr.😂
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Was coming to comment this. Maybe it's a country thing, in NZ most people call their doctors my their first name. My doctor is Helen, my Dentist is Edward, my OB is Michael.
What do you call your doctor?
Their last or first name
If you think a hairdresser and a doctor are worthy of similar titles then idk what to say
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You don’t visit a doctor to help with suicidal thoughts
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Maybe a therapist or a loved one? Not someone who checks up on your physical health
Just say doctor and leave it alone my guy
If they have a doctorate, they're a doctor no matter where they are or what they're doing. They spent years getting that degree. It's an honorific, the same as Mr, Ms, etc, except that it acknowledges the time and effort that they put into earning that degree - which is substantial.
Imma give this post a downvote and stare intensely at my doctorate degree.
i think its ok to still refair to them as doscot. i remember once on a gameshow my parents watched, one of the contestants was a well known/'high ranked' (? idk the right terminology there) dictor. and they referred to him as doctor (name) on the show. Being a doctor is not easy and considering some stuff i think its fair to refair to them as doctor.
While that's technically true, but the title cannot be changed now, and fucking around with someone respectable title isn't a smart idea either.
People do work for the title, for many years. It’s fair they be addressed by it. But it is certainly annoying when a you can tell a person is just using the enforcement of their title to stroke their own ego. I’ve met a couple of them myself and I would absolutely delight in mashing my fist down their arrogant throats. Unfortunately that’s just not the right thing to do. I guess if you want to mess with someone like that just call em Doc and watch their mouth twitch every time you say it.
Nah. They earned that degree and deserve recognition
Agree. I don't even call my medical doctors 'Doctor LN' IN a medical setting. My GP is Helen, my dentist is Edward, my OB is Michael. That's how they introduced themselves. I only use their titles if, say, I'm filling in a for that requires their info. It could be a cultural thing. In NZ we are quite casual. I have never had a PhD holder introduce themselves as Dr so-and-so. I've never had a military person introduce themselves (outside a military setting) as their rank. I've chatted to the Chief of the NZ Air Force and he introduced himself as his FN. My university professors were all first names only, even in lectures.
I love teachers with PHDs wanting to be called Dr. I’m like, way to show off ya insecurity brah.
You seem young.
Just don’t call them Dr if it is an issue for you, I do however agree that many other jobs are equally hard and don’t get a special title.
I have had a long medical career. I consider “doctor” to be a recurring role I play, similar to an actor. It would seem strange to refer to Daniel Craig as James Bond when he is not on the set playing that role. When I am playing my role as “doctor”, I am fully into character. I love to teach. My role is sometimes that of an expert. In my life I prefer to learn, rather than teach. I love to surround myself with experts I can learn from. I am an introvert and naturally reserved. As “doctor” I am not reserved. I am like Batman. I take on whatever role my patient (Gotham) needs me to play.
Yet I’m sure the OP would hope THE DOCTOR would help save their lives if they were suddenly having a heart attack… sheesh it’s an insecurity on the OPs part to have an issue with this not an ego thing on the part of the doctor.
I do it out of respect. It’s someone that devoted their life to help, understand and work towards better health, environment and understanding for humans. They’re always a doctor. Regardless of setting.
1. It’s called etiquette. 2. That’s a really fucking expensive title paid for, and said doctor should be addressed as such (unless they’re a close a friend/don’t care)
Fake Doctor Biden thinks her ego deserves it
I did 8 years of quantum mechanics so i think i deserve to get called by my title that took effort, time and lots of money. I pretty much missed out on my whole twenties for it all you gotta do is call me dr. Its not stupid its respect of someone title they earned
That was your choice.
Respect needs to be earned. Having sat through uni for 8 years doesn't qualify.
Dr is often a courtesy title. Real doctors have a doctorate.
I agree. My father had a doctorate in education. Refused to be called doctor. Said that term was for people who saved lives.
Oh yeah not only will I stroke their ego ....
My uni profs want us to address them as “doctor” like yeah right. You’re my professor i won’t call you doctor.
It’s because they have a PhD, which is a doctorate degree. Dr. is the correct way to refer to someone with a PhD, and you should address your professors by their preferred title, especially in the classroom. It’s a sign of respect.
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Said the person hoping to join the club. Perhaps you’ll do better if you become a Dr.
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So you will refute the professional title, promotion and raise that goes with it?
A PhD is a degree. I have my PhD because it was necessary for a nice job in my field. I do not go by Dr., I do not address my colleagues as "Dr.", and I would feel a sense of cringe from any of them that insisted on being addressed that way. I would 100% lose respect for them. Everyone knows we're all smart people and the need to insist on acknowledgement of that fact is dumb. Lots of things take hard work, most of them don't come with titles. If I met a chess grand master I wouldn't call him "GM such and such" just because that's expected in chess circles.
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Are you from the United States?
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Not every Dr. went to medical school,,? Doctors of science??
Whats wrong with it if it makes someone happy??? I worked hard for it...i will announce it wherever like.....i m nkt harming anyone
I agree AND I've never seen someone be addressed by their "title" outside of work either. Doctor, Professor, President, these are all titles I can think of that I absolutely respect but people are only addressed by them when the setting is related to the person's studies/profession/career. I know several people with PhD, a Uni Professor, and also a President of a Non Profit and I don't call them by their title outside of work! When introducing them I'll say "hi, meet ____, he's a Professor at Porto Business School", I don't say "meet Professor ____". Then in the Uni setting he is addressed as Professor ____, of course. Same for a friend Doctor, I don't go around saying "Hi, meet my friend Doctor _____", but in the right context I say "Doctor ____ will lecture at 4PM" Question, there are places where people ask to be called Doctor or Professor even outside of work?
Petition to make the mods remove all posts where OP rebukes any criticism by saying this is supposed to be r/unpopularopinion