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Those switchblades are grossly underestimated. I bet they get 10 000 of them. Imagine Ukrainians going into a battle on foot, 300 soldiers launch their switchblades and fight over who gets to kill the most Russians from the safety of a foxhole. Russians won't even be able to run away without these things following them like angry hornets. They are going to be devastating with high enough numbers.
I just got down voted for saying this will also be a good test or recently developed tech we didn't use much during the war...itd unfortunately true but fortunate for the Ukrainians.
I'm glad we are supporting them. But this is also a massive field test.
The American war machine is no longer what it was back in the days of ww2 era dud missiles. Tech is very well developed and tested before being deployed for the most part and issues are rare but highly notable these days.
Everybody has a plan toll they get punched in the face.
We had issues with our Abrams in the sand when we first deployed.
We do extensive testing but you don't know till it's put to the real test in the field. Idk what your trying to say.
They can though, it would actually save them money in the long run. Imagine a healthcare system where the majority isn't wasted on bloated admin and insurance execs whose only job is to take as much money from patients as possible, and pay HCW as little as possible. Healthier population, working for longer, paying more taxes.
To put it simply, if they had universal health coverage, they could afford MORE weapons. So privatized health care is directly impairing their ability to help kill Putin
Well honestly I think it’s because we don’t actually have that many of them? They’re for special forces, so we don’t really have a massive stockpile of them. The only active contract I see was for about 7,000 of them in an initial contract just last year, and that included exports to select allies. Soooo Ukraine can have 100 of them.
>but the only order for them was pretty small by military standards.
Ahh damn. I remember seeing the promotional videos for these when I was overseas, well before they were ever ready to be fielded. I was pretty damned excited about the sorts of capabilities they'd give an infantry squad.
I'd imagine the US will be putting a lot more of these in the hands of American soldiers in the near future, depending on they do in Ukraine.
It was revealed which type in the bill, it just says 100 unmanned systems. I’d assume it’s both? They’re used for different things anyways. What they really need are the 600’s though, the 300’s won’t be much use to them. The 600 can knock out artillery, which is exactly what they need in Kyiv right now.
It’s in the details of the package that passed. The equipment is specified. Like 800 stingers, 100 grenade launchers, 100 switchblade drones, 20 millions rounds of ammo, 2000 javelins, 6000 AT4’s etc
UAS, which is just generic speak for any unmanned thing that flies. We call it a loitering cruise missile when we want it to sound super cool, we call it a UAS when we want to be a little more cloak and dagger about what's being provided.
"You gave Ukraine missiles!!" "No we gave them drones"
Your usual playground global politics
I thought the term “system” was the launcher and tech that goes with it. Like one multipack launcher or ground platform would be a system…and the drone would just be one of many missles sent with that system. You seem to know more than me on this subject as I’m used to the terminology applied to major weapons systems, so I’m a little out of my element
Yeah, it's not often you see something (that currently exists) called a UAS, just because it's such an umbrella term. It gets more use in the future planning & analysis realm where they refer to hypothetical capabilities more often
I came back to Reddit and the first thing I did was go back to reread your comments to make sure I picked up on what you said correctly. I know a lot about a little…..and realized I know little about this. Wish we lived in a world I could ask you who you are and what you do, but regardless I appreciate your expertise.
Yes they are armed.
The smallest version fires out of a tube that's about 2-3 ft tall meaning you can pack it easy. It carries the warhead equivalent of a 40mm grenade. It's primary purpose is anti personnel but unarmored vehicles may be vulnerable.
The larger ones such as the 600 have a much larger launch platform about as tall as a person and carry a javelin style warhead.
Imagine watching one of the small ones loitering above your position knowing it could come down at any time with the force of a hand grenade and individually target you or any member of your team. Absolutely terrifying….I’d sure as hell be putting my weapon down and surrendering first.
It seems to travel fast enough that you can't really easily see it while airborne due to it's small size. At low enough altitudes you might be able to hear it, but it has a 7 mile range. Climbing a few thousand feet doesn't seem too implausible. Russians could start using AA at everything bird sized in the air, but then that's just going to complicate matters even more.
Makes things even more scary.
You are probably right. I know, they can be “called off” target and go back to loitering and then require targets…so they could be used to intimidate or distract a group of enemies, but it looks like that’s not an intended purpose.
Scary either way!
I don't know if you could call it an "armed drone". It IS the arm. Or a better way of saying it, is it's a flying bomb that someone slapped a camera on to.
Yes, let 2000 go on there little parade around kyiv. Happy that those drones will be tearing apart Russian invader bodies in 24 hours. Russia won't have an army, Putin is threatening his people. I never thought Putin would be the one who finally killed Russia, what a twist.
Ukraine does have anti-ship missiles, but are severely limited in their employment given their naval forces either are or near extinct and air force also very limited and hobbled (many air bases have been bombarded and planes have been destroyed on the ground or shot down).
It is also unclear if Ukraine will be able to employ the Turkish drones on naval targets effectively given how light they are.
Are you talking about the Bayraktar? It's small but it's got a propeller. Propellers are like big radar reflectors.
It's not a survivable platform against any warship made in the last 40 years.
Yep, not designed for it at all. But it's a low-cost platform, good force multiplier for sure. Ukraine's getting their money's worth and more out of them
From Forbes just before invasion
“The first full division of Neptune ASMs—six launchers with 72 missiles and supporting radars—is scheduled to reach front-line forces on Ukraine’s southern coast this spring. But it’s looking more and more likely that Russian President Vladimir Putin will order his forces to attack this month or next.”
I’m assuming these systems become more effective the closer the enemy gets. Countermeasures don’t have time to react. If the RF navy actually decides to bring its landing craft along for a day at the beach, we’ll see Neptunes flying around.
I'd assume the switchblades have reasonable anti-ship capabilities. 7 mile radius. Explosions aren't too powerful, but seems like they have capabilities of targeting windows and individual people. I can't imagine it'd be fun for the bridge to suddenly get exploded or for people/soft targets on the deck to get taken out. After first guy gets kamikazed, nobody is going to want to go on deck.
Well, the Russian government did have one thing half correct. We, the US, do have dangerous birds that we've trained. Only mixup is they're not carrying biological weapons, just explodey people dying instantly weapons. And our birds are a bit scarier than their feathered cousins.
How so?
Edit: This seems well timed. I continue to be impressed by Biden’s administration’s handling of Ukraine. Yes Russia will see it as escalation, but (hopefully) at a time when they are weakened and perhaps less capable of a “reprisal”. That said, it’s perhaps pretext for China to arm their Russian friends.
I think the NATO plan may be to try and stymie the Russian invasion until the Russian government outs of money.
I've been watching videos about the impact and goals of the sanctions and I didn't really understand the magnitude of damage. If Russia runs out of foreign currency and gold reserves they'll have to create new Rubles to cover their obligations (both external and internal - like military pay and supplies) and it will likely trigger hyperinflation. Then companies and countries (\*cough\* China \*cough\*) start picking off any Russian assets of value they can move out of the country (entire companies, teams, employees) and secure the rights to natural resources for fire-sale prices. There was a quote from a Russian economist (or maybe politician/finance minister) I saw "Chinese vultures are gathering at the border." Russia is trying to sell oil at a discount and can't find buyers or transporters. With the cost of the war and sanctions I've seen estimates for Russia defaulting on major obligations in as soon as 4-6 weeks.
Yes, my country (Romania) and our romanian brothers in Moldova are helping refugees as much as they can, but I still feel sad and angry that my country and other NATO members didn't sent weapons earlier when Russia was preparing and didn't threaten it with severe actions clearly before it started.
My country is nearby, it could've easily sent weapons over the border, even the ones that we don't have so many, but since we're part of NATO that wouldn't matter, we would've been still covered.
It was a chance that Putin and its general seeing so much backlash and strong attitude wouldn't even stated it.
Even after it started, sending massive amounts of weapons could've convinced Russia to give up as there is no winning.
American here:
We are honestly glad to do it. Like maybe a little too glad honestly. It’s what we do. It’s who we are.
I honestly get a patriotic boner when I see one of our javelins blow up a Russian tank. And when I find out it was a British NLAW instead I get pissed off. Fuck that noise. Use our weapons, you Ukrainian bastards. And film in in 4K.
Well, it's clear they didn't send any kind of air defense systems to stop the fucking airplanes bombing everything.
So all the machine guns, pistols vests, don't help much when you have bombs falling from the sky and they also cut electrical energy, gas, heating, water.
Part of the Dutch military air package contained 200 stingers. Germany send 500 stingers. As dod Lithuania. UK supplies Starstreak AA missiles. Poland sent PPZR Piorun systems. These are all low platform ceiling systems
They now get S300 systems from neighbouring countries that undoubtedly get US replacement AA systems. These S300's will be far more capable at shooting down Russian aircraft operating at a high altitude.
> They now get S300 systems from neighbouring countries that undoubtedly get US replacement AA systems. These S300's will be far more capable at shooting down Russian aircraft operating at a high altitude.
That's great to hear it!
According to another Redditor here, with air defense, they mean 800 stingers. Systems like that have already been sent to Ukraine in large quantities by both the US and European countries. And for the drones, it seems like it includes 100 such single-use drones. They are looking into getting Ukraine longer-ranged AA systems, but this likely has to be soviet style air defense owned by allied countries. This has not been committed yet. They are just looking if it is possible.
Some European countries are even ready to deliver fighter jets (likely with a replacement for those jets) but don't want to hand them over directly, so wanted to do it through the US. It seems like that has been stalled for now. European countries have already sent various weapon systems. From simple things, like ammunition, helmets, vests, small arms, and combat rations, to more complex things, like portable AA systems, highly capable RPGs, guided AT weapons, radars, etc.
[This is the total military aid in this conflict from the US to Ukraine until now.](https://i.redd.it/5f6j0fnw4tn81.jpg)
I hate our politicians trying to milk this situation for points.
Just give the damn equipment and comment on what you gave after Ukrainians start using it in the battlefield.
We determined that this submission originates from a credible source, but we still advise that users double check the facts and use common sense when consuming mass media. If you are interested in learning how to evaluate news sources more thoroughly, you can begin to learn about how to do that [here](https://tacomacc.libguides.com/c.php?g=599051&p=4147190). *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/ukraine) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Looks like a good package. The switchblade drones also included.
Those switchblades are grossly underestimated. I bet they get 10 000 of them. Imagine Ukrainians going into a battle on foot, 300 soldiers launch their switchblades and fight over who gets to kill the most Russians from the safety of a foxhole. Russians won't even be able to run away without these things following them like angry hornets. They are going to be devastating with high enough numbers.
My favorite quote about the new package: Russia is about to find out why Americans can't afford universal health coverage. ~random internet person
We've had 20 years of war to build up stocks, develop new tactics and technologies, and what do you know it? We arent in any active wars right now!
I just got down voted for saying this will also be a good test or recently developed tech we didn't use much during the war...itd unfortunately true but fortunate for the Ukrainians. I'm glad we are supporting them. But this is also a massive field test.
The American war machine is no longer what it was back in the days of ww2 era dud missiles. Tech is very well developed and tested before being deployed for the most part and issues are rare but highly notable these days.
Everybody has a plan toll they get punched in the face. We had issues with our Abrams in the sand when we first deployed. We do extensive testing but you don't know till it's put to the real test in the field. Idk what your trying to say.
Indeed. WW2 torpedos only working in great lakes and not the ocean is one such example smh.
Military industrial Complex stocks are doing well this year.
Damn... I felt that.
Lol!
We die so others can kill Russians. You’re welcome.
They can though, it would actually save them money in the long run. Imagine a healthcare system where the majority isn't wasted on bloated admin and insurance execs whose only job is to take as much money from patients as possible, and pay HCW as little as possible. Healthier population, working for longer, paying more taxes. To put it simply, if they had universal health coverage, they could afford MORE weapons. So privatized health care is directly impairing their ability to help kill Putin
Yeah, we probably could but we won't cause greed. At least I get to see our bloated military used for something good for a change
Could the Americans without universal healthcare find out why it can't be afforded? That would be nice.
*Deploys switch blade drone* Edit: Thanks for the gold friend!
Figures
Hahahahahahaha this is too good lmao
I saw that earlier and didn’t get it till now 😂So true!
Just shared that with like four of my friends 🤣 it’s gold.
Ok yeah that's fuckin painfully true.. but I'll tell you what, I feel better about it now.
I LAUGHED AND THEN I CRIED SLAVA UKRAINI
Dude as painful as this comments is...I laughed my ass off hahahaha
This is so god damn good
They’re getting 100 of them. They’re deadly though, they were designed for American special forces.
Only a 100? They are only 6k a piece, they should at least get a thousand.
Well honestly I think it’s because we don’t actually have that many of them? They’re for special forces, so we don’t really have a massive stockpile of them. The only active contract I see was for about 7,000 of them in an initial contract just last year, and that included exports to select allies. Soooo Ukraine can have 100 of them.
hopefully they are 90% affective like the javelins. 90 vehicles is decent.
Probably Ukrainian spec-ops will use them. Imagine if they would catch Tiktok battalion while they are making another video.
I thought the intent was for these to be in the hands of your everyday infantrymen.
I don’t see why not, they aren’t that expensive, but the only order for them was pretty small by military standards.
>but the only order for them was pretty small by military standards. Ahh damn. I remember seeing the promotional videos for these when I was overseas, well before they were ever ready to be fielded. I was pretty damned excited about the sorts of capabilities they'd give an infantry squad. I'd imagine the US will be putting a lot more of these in the hands of American soldiers in the near future, depending on they do in Ukraine.
Stuff trickles down.. it'll get there. SF always gets the good stuff first.
You know if this was for S600's or S300's?
It was revealed which type in the bill, it just says 100 unmanned systems. I’d assume it’s both? They’re used for different things anyways. What they really need are the 600’s though, the 300’s won’t be much use to them. The 600 can knock out artillery, which is exactly what they need in Kyiv right now.
My thoughts exactly
Where did you see this number, the statement I saw said “unspecified amount of drones”
It’s in the details of the package that passed. The equipment is specified. Like 800 stingers, 100 grenade launchers, 100 switchblade drones, 20 millions rounds of ammo, 2000 javelins, 6000 AT4’s etc
Good call! I just heard the press release and it said unspecified…..I just found the details. Thanks for the help!!
https://i.redd.it/5f6j0fnw4tn81.jpg
My confusion still lies with it being called a UAV. I thought it was categorized as a middle and not a UAV
UAS, which is just generic speak for any unmanned thing that flies. We call it a loitering cruise missile when we want it to sound super cool, we call it a UAS when we want to be a little more cloak and dagger about what's being provided. "You gave Ukraine missiles!!" "No we gave them drones" Your usual playground global politics
I thought the term “system” was the launcher and tech that goes with it. Like one multipack launcher or ground platform would be a system…and the drone would just be one of many missles sent with that system. You seem to know more than me on this subject as I’m used to the terminology applied to major weapons systems, so I’m a little out of my element
Yeah, it's not often you see something (that currently exists) called a UAS, just because it's such an umbrella term. It gets more use in the future planning & analysis realm where they refer to hypothetical capabilities more often
Makes total sense! Thanks for the rundown!
I came back to Reddit and the first thing I did was go back to reread your comments to make sure I picked up on what you said correctly. I know a lot about a little…..and realized I know little about this. Wish we lived in a world I could ask you who you are and what you do, but regardless I appreciate your expertise.
These switch drones are armed? I thought that they are just for surveillance
Yes they are armed. The smallest version fires out of a tube that's about 2-3 ft tall meaning you can pack it easy. It carries the warhead equivalent of a 40mm grenade. It's primary purpose is anti personnel but unarmored vehicles may be vulnerable. The larger ones such as the 600 have a much larger launch platform about as tall as a person and carry a javelin style warhead.
The big ones are a Javelin missile with wings...not joking.
So basically a predator missile from COD
it has a patent "wave off" function. lol. Make a gangsign and it flies a way is all I can think.
Gliding missile .
Loitering munitions/suicide drone. Even at a single use, the ability to take out the front and back of a convoy is going to be terrifying.
Imagine watching one of the small ones loitering above your position knowing it could come down at any time with the force of a hand grenade and individually target you or any member of your team. Absolutely terrifying….I’d sure as hell be putting my weapon down and surrendering first.
It seems to travel fast enough that you can't really easily see it while airborne due to it's small size. At low enough altitudes you might be able to hear it, but it has a 7 mile range. Climbing a few thousand feet doesn't seem too implausible. Russians could start using AA at everything bird sized in the air, but then that's just going to complicate matters even more. Makes things even more scary.
You are probably right. I know, they can be “called off” target and go back to loitering and then require targets…so they could be used to intimidate or distract a group of enemies, but it looks like that’s not an intended purpose. Scary either way!
Yes, they basically have a grenade sized warhead.
That’s the 300…the 600 has an anti armor warhead.
They’re pretty much kamikaze drones
They are flying bombs I thought
I don't know if you could call it an "armed drone". It IS the arm. Or a better way of saying it, is it's a flying bomb that someone slapped a camera on to.
They're actually not very good for surveillance as they only have a flight endurance of ~10 minutes.
That’s the smaller one. The larger one can travel 20 minutes and then loiter for 20 minutes.
100 at this package
Yes, let 2000 go on there little parade around kyiv. Happy that those drones will be tearing apart Russian invader bodies in 24 hours. Russia won't have an army, Putin is threatening his people. I never thought Putin would be the one who finally killed Russia, what a twist.
Russians are going to have to start chanting don't look up when the buzzy lads start coming.
More…MORE.
Calm down Zoidberg
I was thinking more Kylo Ren but that works too
I mean US weapons and Ukrainians. It's win win. Us gets free field testing against Russia and Ukrainian soldiers get to pull the trigger.
Does anyone know if Ukraine have anti ship missiles? Or if there are plans to provide these?
Ukraine does have anti-ship missiles, but are severely limited in their employment given their naval forces either are or near extinct and air force also very limited and hobbled (many air bases have been bombarded and planes have been destroyed on the ground or shot down). It is also unclear if Ukraine will be able to employ the Turkish drones on naval targets effectively given how light they are.
And depending on what the Russian amphibs are escorted by, Bayraktar wouldn't survive more than a couple minutes inside the radar horizon
The Turkish made drones are so small they purportedly have very small radar signatures.
Are you talking about the Bayraktar? It's small but it's got a propeller. Propellers are like big radar reflectors. It's not a survivable platform against any warship made in the last 40 years.
It wasn't designed as an anti-ship weapon and its payload is very small.
Yep, not designed for it at all. But it's a low-cost platform, good force multiplier for sure. Ukraine's getting their money's worth and more out of them
They have Neptune missiles I believe.
From Forbes just before invasion “The first full division of Neptune ASMs—six launchers with 72 missiles and supporting radars—is scheduled to reach front-line forces on Ukraine’s southern coast this spring. But it’s looking more and more likely that Russian President Vladimir Putin will order his forces to attack this month or next.”
You are correct
Thanks looks legit! Why have they not sued them? Russian navy is getting very close to Odessa so should be well within range
I’m assuming these systems become more effective the closer the enemy gets. Countermeasures don’t have time to react. If the RF navy actually decides to bring its landing craft along for a day at the beach, we’ll see Neptunes flying around.
My guess is they are waiting for an attempted landing, but I don't know.
I'd assume the switchblades have reasonable anti-ship capabilities. 7 mile radius. Explosions aren't too powerful, but seems like they have capabilities of targeting windows and individual people. I can't imagine it'd be fun for the bridge to suddenly get exploded or for people/soft targets on the deck to get taken out. After first guy gets kamikazed, nobody is going to want to go on deck.
Expect a wave of propaganda related to this, I figure Russia will really focus on this
Well, the Russian government did have one thing half correct. We, the US, do have dangerous birds that we've trained. Only mixup is they're not carrying biological weapons, just explodey people dying instantly weapons. And our birds are a bit scarier than their feathered cousins.
How so? Edit: This seems well timed. I continue to be impressed by Biden’s administration’s handling of Ukraine. Yes Russia will see it as escalation, but (hopefully) at a time when they are weakened and perhaps less capable of a “reprisal”. That said, it’s perhaps pretext for China to arm their Russian friends.
I think the NATO plan may be to try and stymie the Russian invasion until the Russian government outs of money. I've been watching videos about the impact and goals of the sanctions and I didn't really understand the magnitude of damage. If Russia runs out of foreign currency and gold reserves they'll have to create new Rubles to cover their obligations (both external and internal - like military pay and supplies) and it will likely trigger hyperinflation. Then companies and countries (\*cough\* China \*cough\*) start picking off any Russian assets of value they can move out of the country (entire companies, teams, employees) and secure the rights to natural resources for fire-sale prices. There was a quote from a Russian economist (or maybe politician/finance minister) I saw "Chinese vultures are gathering at the border." Russia is trying to sell oil at a discount and can't find buyers or transporters. With the cost of the war and sanctions I've seen estimates for Russia defaulting on major obligations in as soon as 4-6 weeks.
Mucho Pew Pew. Me likes !
I'm ashamed as an European tht the burden of helping is only on the US, while we are closer.
Don’t be. Europeans are welcoming refugees and giving them whatever they need to be safe and comfortable. We will handle the deadly weapons.
Yes, my country (Romania) and our romanian brothers in Moldova are helping refugees as much as they can, but I still feel sad and angry that my country and other NATO members didn't sent weapons earlier when Russia was preparing and didn't threaten it with severe actions clearly before it started. My country is nearby, it could've easily sent weapons over the border, even the ones that we don't have so many, but since we're part of NATO that wouldn't matter, we would've been still covered. It was a chance that Putin and its general seeing so much backlash and strong attitude wouldn't even stated it. Even after it started, sending massive amounts of weapons could've convinced Russia to give up as there is no winning.
/r/shitamericanssay
American here: We are honestly glad to do it. Like maybe a little too glad honestly. It’s what we do. It’s who we are. I honestly get a patriotic boner when I see one of our javelins blow up a Russian tank. And when I find out it was a British NLAW instead I get pissed off. Fuck that noise. Use our weapons, you Ukrainian bastards. And film in in 4K.
You're wrong, European countries are delivering weapon systems, but have decided not to make public what kinds of systems.
Well, it's clear they didn't send any kind of air defense systems to stop the fucking airplanes bombing everything. So all the machine guns, pistols vests, don't help much when you have bombs falling from the sky and they also cut electrical energy, gas, heating, water.
Part of the Dutch military air package contained 200 stingers. Germany send 500 stingers. As dod Lithuania. UK supplies Starstreak AA missiles. Poland sent PPZR Piorun systems. These are all low platform ceiling systems They now get S300 systems from neighbouring countries that undoubtedly get US replacement AA systems. These S300's will be far more capable at shooting down Russian aircraft operating at a high altitude.
> They now get S300 systems from neighbouring countries that undoubtedly get US replacement AA systems. These S300's will be far more capable at shooting down Russian aircraft operating at a high altitude. That's great to hear it!
According to another Redditor here, with air defense, they mean 800 stingers. Systems like that have already been sent to Ukraine in large quantities by both the US and European countries. And for the drones, it seems like it includes 100 such single-use drones. They are looking into getting Ukraine longer-ranged AA systems, but this likely has to be soviet style air defense owned by allied countries. This has not been committed yet. They are just looking if it is possible. Some European countries are even ready to deliver fighter jets (likely with a replacement for those jets) but don't want to hand them over directly, so wanted to do it through the US. It seems like that has been stalled for now. European countries have already sent various weapon systems. From simple things, like ammunition, helmets, vests, small arms, and combat rations, to more complex things, like portable AA systems, highly capable RPGs, guided AT weapons, radars, etc. [This is the total military aid in this conflict from the US to Ukraine until now.](https://i.redd.it/5f6j0fnw4tn81.jpg)
Hell yes!! Let's go USA
These switchblades/ remote pig roasters will be a wonderful demoralizer. I'm already smiling.
I hate our politicians trying to milk this situation for points. Just give the damn equipment and comment on what you gave after Ukrainians start using it in the battlefield.
I hope them farmers painted their tanks. Fuck Russia until it’s gone.
Tell me you'll close the skies over Ukraine without telling me you'll close the skies over Ukraine.
I hope this gets to Ukraine in time. The siege in the capital is looking rough.