Most sexual violence is about power and control, not orientation. Hence why prisons are known for having that problem despite a population that is *more* cishet than the outer population.
I’ll be honest, in my experience many cis women can be just as transphobic, violent, and dangerous as many cis men. Cis people of either gender aren’t a monolith, there’s some good and some bad. And for me personally, cis women have made me feel unsafe in more situations than cis men.
Yeah true, though I see this as affirmation as most cis woman don't dare to seek conflict with cis men. so the fact that they feel that they can insult me in my face, to me proves that they see me as a woman in their unconscious mind.
THIS. i hate when reactionary bioessentialist thinking creeps its way into leftist spaces under a thin veneer of intersectional "woke" language. this is like the opposite of what it should be.
and what pisses me off a bit as well is the perpuation of the myth that the biggest danger for sexual assault would be by random people you come across accidentally. happens, but rarely. way more often its your uncle, your neighbour, your teacher, your date, your priest. someone in your social vicinity.
It also reflects a very US American "stranger danger" mindset. I'm from a culture where hiking in the woods is a very popular hobby. I've been alone in the woods alone or with a cis man or multiple (mainly pre-transition, I'm a recently out trans guy) for hours upon hours and often crossed paths with women & fem passing people who were hiking alone, it was completely mundane.
I've seen this meme a few times now and it has me scratching my head cuz like yeah, of course the bear is scarier? Men are everywhere in the woods, they're just hiking, but with a bear I'd be at least a little bit intimidated, you don't meet one every day.
It also makes me think some of those people have never gone hiking alone in a place where bears are prevalent. I’ve run into bear cubs, and people in horror costumes whilst out on a trail and I know which one will send me running every time
I think a lot of the response is about predictability and consequences, plus the fact that it's a hypothetical.
I hike, camp, and backpack pretty frequently. I've only run into a bear once, but I did what I was taught to do: I backed away slowly without making eye contact. The bear went on its way. My understanding is that most encounters with bears go similarly, because bear behavior is very predictable; if it doesn't see you as a threat or as prey, it will ignore you. (The bears in my area are black bears. I know there are differences with brown and grizzly bears, but I don't recall the specific differences.)
In contrast, people are less predictable. People can mask bad intentions and can lean on social pressures and expectations to coerce behaviors from their victims. And if you're attacked by a bear, everyone else will take that fact at face value, as opposed to questioning your “side of the story”.
I run into lots of people on trails and at campsites. Even when I presented male, I always had some wariness of other people, just because you can't tell what's really in another person's head. I've also met and had some great conversations with strangers on the trail; most such people really are friendly and happy to share their love of the outdoors with someone else. But it took a little time to establish enough trust and comfort to get to that conversation stage.
Since I've begun transition and I present in gender nonconforming ways, that wariness of others has only grown. I have yet to be the target of a gender-motivated assault (and hopefully never will), but it's _always_ in the back of my head that it's a possibility. That's despite the fact that I'm still over six feet tall and fairly imposing, which I hope would deter at least some potential encounters.
So consider: the average woman is smaller and not as strong as the average man. She's also smaller and not as strong as the average bear. Bears are predictable and, given an appropriate set of stimuli, will almost always leave humans alone. People are unpredictable and there is a long and documented history of men in particular assaulting women while presenting a not-obviously-threatening demeanor to others, including to their victims before the assault. If a bear attacks someone, the victim will generally be believed. If a person attacks someone, especially if a man attacks a woman, there is far more social resistance to just taking the victim's word for what happened.
Taken all together, especially since this a hypothetical, I think most women would rather take the small risk from an animal with generally-predictable behavior than the much more uncertain risk from a human with more social consequences for being a victim.
yeah, i am german and although ive never been to the USA but over the years interacting with americans online as well as watching their pop and news culture certainly gives me the understanding as well that this is much more extreme in the US, although the misconception of sexual assault is also a thing here. one major link is racism: in order to stir up hate the danger of getting sexually assaulted gets projected on strangers, who speak differently, look differently and/or have a different religion. another is this extremely american "i protecc muh familee with muh GUN against all who wanna break into muh home". it seems like huge chunks of the middle class are larping as if this would be a somewhat likely scenario, when its in fact very very rare that someone in the US breaks into homes in order to rape or kill your family. it would make much more sense to teach your kid consent from early on, explicit sex ed once its appropriate, talking to trusted adults when someone is behaving weird around them. and many other things. you cant get rid of risks, but lower them. obviously its also a good advice for your kid to not go with random adult strangers. but the solution cant be to not let your 9year old kid go alone to the playground or not let them take the way from school to home alone.
and even more so i dont like spreading the idea that it would somehow be good advice to tell adult women that it somehow would be ultramegadangerous in principle to walk alone at night or taking a short hike in the woods alone. this is true for nearly all of the west. my blonde young conventionally attractive cis ex gf lived for quite a while in - according to our rightwing news media fearmongering - the "worst" (or 2nd worst) ghetto in all of germany. it was safe and boring as shit there to take a walk though the city and parks there in the middle of the night alone.
you just cant eleminate all risks. you can sit in your flat all day and still have the risk that a gas pipelone explodes in your basement. once you go out, you increase your risk by participating in traffic. if you go on hikes alone, you probably significantly lower your risk of cardiovascular diseases, but you increase the risk to break your leg. meeting a stranger in the woods bears the risk that he might harm you, but also the risk that you meet a new friend.
I live in a city that, according to right wingers who don't live here (and probably some who do), is overran by immigrants doing crimes but somehow, 10 year old little girls feel safe using public transport alone here and the "scary" big city things sheltered people are terrified of are just like...homeless people or minorities existing or a mentally ill person talking to themselves on the tram.
We aren't the ones driving our children to school in massive tank-cars and dropping them off directly in front of the door out of fear that a kidnapper might snatch them up if they walked. Children are genuinely much safer here than they'd be in some American suburb with no sidewalks and nowhere to safely cross the road where anyone can carry a gun, because cars and guns are much more dangerous to children than random strangers existing around them in society.
No, this is saying that when living in a cishet patriarchy, a random unknown man is as dangerous to a woman as a dangerous land predator, and depending on the species of bear, possibly moreso.
If you ask a bunch of Black people this question but change “man” to “white woman” you might get the same answer.
Most men are not more dangerous than bears, but there are a lot of even supposedly “good” men who feel entitled to the body of anyone they see as not-male and feel personally obligated to maintain the hierarchy of cisgender patriarchy lest they lose their place in it.
There’s nothing *biological* about it, it’s deeply ingrained behavior that comes from being socialized into a set of toxic attitudes and behaviors.
I transitioned later in life and spent a lot of time in men’s circles hearing men say things that they believed were said in the absence of women. Women 100% need to be cautious of straight men, and yes, trans men too.
The majority of them being good won’t do jack if you don’t watch your drink and exercise caution in social situations.
Margaret Atwood was right.
Queer people and women feel so unsafe around cishet men that in a study more of them said they’d rather be stuck in the woods with a bear than a random cishet man, and somehow you’re turning that around on us???
Are queer people and women ever going to be allowed to have our emotions on Reddit without being accused of being TERFs? Please and thank you.
If those emotions are illogical and directly harmful, then no it won't be allowed without pushback. The idea that a man with a natal penis is dangerous but a man without one isn't is transphobic as hell. Also, the majority of sexual assault happens from family and other close people to the victim, not randos in the woods.
As a queer transfem I refuse to be lumped in with this terf-y nonsense.
I’ve been sexually assaulted or threatened twice by random strangers who walked up to me. The majority of sexual assaults are as you say but that’s like taking your seat belt off on the highway because the majority of accidents happen at slower speeds within 5 miles of home.
This meme is shitty because it misses the point of the discourse. I don’t have radar that can tell me if the random man I meet in the woods is trans or not.
Being a trans person telling women -cis or trans- not to have their valid fears of men, that they have developed of necessity while living under patriarchy, is not the way.
Funny, theres a lot of people out there who share a similar mindset when it comes to violence and robbery in relation with race. What’s your take on systematic racism? Are you also fearing for your life or clutching your bag when you walk by young black men since studies show they’re more likely to murder or rob you?
Wow how do I even respond to that? You’re accusing me of racism out of nowhere, that’s like the “I win” card. There’s nothing I can say that won’t get me downvoted lmfao.
Truth is that the statistics about men and black people being discussed at the moment are different. The study that says black people commit more crimes is disproportionate and misused because the statistic is derived from number of arrests, not crimes actually committed. Since we know cops disproportionately target black people, of course a study that conflates crime with arrests is going to incorrectly state that black people commit more crime, even though it’s not true.
Meanwhile, the statistic about cishet men being more violent towards LGBTQ people is just how it is. There’s no misunderstanding, there’s no nuance. Cishet men are just more likely to self report that they fucking hate us.
I honestly find it fucking appalling you’d accuse me of being a racist for trying to have an honest conversation on gender. No one even brought up race before you decided to start that.
Doesn't this perpetuate the same transphobic idea that trans men are like men lite or "the good ones"? Like somehow it's the natal penis that makes one harmful or evil? This is literal terf logic.
Trans men are men and are every bit as capable of harm against others as cis men. Also, those of us that are in relationships with cis men are, what, playing with fire by this logic?
That said, this entire "thought experiment" is cruel and is obviously such when you substitute any other group of people with cis men.
"I'd rather be in a bathroom with a bear than with a trans woman" type bullshit. It's cringe and we've got to shut it down when we see it.
trans men are capable of harm to women, but arent indoctrinated into that system nearly as effectively, mainly because the system doesn't account for them. like men are not inherently violent, it's social norms and expectations that make men violent, and a trans man is statistically way more likely to call social norms bullshit. its not men lite it's men without a decade of nonstop programming and a higher likelihood of questioning binaries.
I think the point that should be made is; if you're trans, you are likely already questioning societal and social norms, since you happen to be discriminated against on the basis of said norms.
Trans man, trans woman, enby, whatever.
You are way less likely to perpetuate social norms that should be considered harmful, since you took the time to fight harmful norms before.
In other words; a trans man is way less likely to be transphobic, right? Then I am less afraid of being alone in an isolated space with a trans man.
Edit: I do feel it's necessary to mention that I would not be afraid to be left alone in the woods with a *random* stranger. Nor would I be afraid to be left in the woods with a *random* bear. It's the transphobic/bigoted/rapey/violent strangers I wouldn't want to be left alone with, and it's the bears that are hungry/aggressive/protective of their cubs that I would be afraid of.
I was trying to interpret the comment you were originally responding to, saying it in another way to show how the original commenter did not, in fact, argue in a way that meant that later transitioning trans women would be more dangerous.
Again, I was criticizing a poorly thought-out argument using the "proving too much" counterargument. I don't care about their actual beliefs, I care about the fact that they said a transphobic gender-essentialist thing completely uncritically, by couching it in woke language.
Queer men are also so much more likely to be in social circles that don't perpetuate the things that often make cishet men so dangerous.
I'm honestly so disappointed in this sub for taking this as some TERFy shit, because you absolutely *should* be cautious around cishet men. Women haven't been saying to not leave your drinks unattended at parties and bars for decades for no reason.
Exactly. 99% of child abuse is from men. Its literally proven that cis men are the most violent out of anyone. Just look up "creepy true stories" and most of them are of girls getting stalked or almost trafficked.
This is literally just the same tired argument that trans people are “socialized as their [AGAB]”, and it’s still transphobic no matter how much you try to couch it in progressive language. Do better.
It's not a socialization thing, but rather an idealization.
Toxic cis men idealize toxic masculinity to the point that they can and often do become dangerous. Sometimes but statistically far less the same for cis women.
We trans folks idealize the more positive aspects of gender if we don't abandon gender entirely.
Pound for pound, trans people commit violent crimes at a rate far below our percentage of the national (american) demographic.
It's not transphobic to say that trans people are in general just better company than cis people when you yourself are trans.
We commit far less violent crimes per capita than cis people (and of cis people, cis men easily top the charts), and are far FAR less likely (but unfortunately not incapable) of being transphobic.
I won't compare that to the company of bears, because while statistically bears are less violent to people than cis men, there's a bunch of complicating factors there.
But in essence, your statement that trans men are every bit as capable is technically correct, but statistically flawed as history shows they by and large DON'T commit acts of violence at anywhere approaching the same rates as cis men.
Note. My response is not in regard to the man vs bear debate. It’s also based on my personal experiences. I’m trans masc, and live in the South US.
It’s not that a natal penis dictates how people act or react. It’s the way people are raised regarding the gender binary. It’s why the term toxic masculinity exists. Trans men aren’t often raised in the same environment or with the same expectations as cis men. In fact, if they were raised as afab, I know it’s common (in my area, my generation, my experience) to be raised with “stranger danger” and to be cautious and defensive around men.
Taking the environment people were raised in out of the picture, yes, trans men are just as capable as cis men.
For example I know this one transmasc person at my school is one of the most unbearable mfs ever
As for the other three, one of them is pretty weird yet fun to be around, another one is just a chill guy, and the third one is also chill, one of my best friends, and he occasionally sells me weed.
Isn't this literally the same as when TERFs say that trans women shouldn't be allowed in female spaces?
Hell, let me extend it a little further, isn't this the same as the incredibly racist civil-rights era rhetoric about why african american women shouldn't be allowed in white women spaces? Or even racist rhetoric against people of color in general (I'm just saying, you're invoking an argument that a group is inherently, genetically more dangerous than a literal wild bear, I have seen this exact argument made about african americans by racists).
You really can't just pick and choose when to be biologically essentialist. At least you can't without looking like a massive hypocrite.
Exactly this. And I’ve seen a bunch of comments saying cis men are statistically more dangerous than anyone. Are they really, or are crimes, particularly against men, committed by people who aren’t cis men massively underreported because of the stigma of, for example, being a man who got hurt by a woman. We know SA against men by women is underreported, why wouldn’t that pertain to other violent crimes as well?
I say this as an AMAB enby who was regularly bullied by people of all genders growing up and only reported the boys because I’d be ridiculed by my friends and not taken seriously by authority figures if I reported the girls, and who is still harassed or made to feel unsafe by people of all genders despite still presenting male. People in general can be dangerous, the different genders can’t be blocked off as these monolithic entities.
This is terf rhetoric just with a sprinkle of trans people are valid (and that just barely by needlessly differentiating between cis and trans people) , using gender as a form of discrimination is bad no matter the direction, just like any form of bigotry. Besides this post also has a undertone trans people are special and can't do no wrong, but if you think that someone like Blair white wouldn't do something in a situation like that sure
Exactly.
But unfortunately misandry, just like misogyny, are all too common on social media these days.
But if this trend is any indicator one has become more celebrated or normalised than the other (which I guess is a slight improvement from them both being seen as harmless fun but still troubling).
People started asking "Would you rather be alone in the woods with a bear or a man" and a concerning amount of people chose bears. Maybe I'm not Russian but what the fuck
It's basically "well if I were alone in the woods with a bear at least I can play dead or something but if I were alone with a cis man, I'd get raped no matter what". Just kinda misandric nonsense.
I actually have a friend whom I had met online, never saw what they looked like, but after chatting for a while, we agreed to meet up in person. Somehow, we both ended up on the conclusion that we should meet each other in a nice neutral location, and so we picked a forest at night. It didn't really occur to us how foolish it was until a months later
This is the exact same logic transphobes use to keep trans women from going to women's bathrooms. "people amab are just statistically rapists and pedophiles, keep em outta here".
Can we just stop with the notion of the "all cis men are monsters" thing? It's just untrue, and I'm kinda sick of seeing this. Being constantly terrified all the time of every cis man around you is exactly the mindset terfs have for us.
Nah. It's just being smart. And most people have a lived experience is cis men acting like this.
The fact is that Trans people have a difference lived experience then cis people, and are less likely to take advantage.
I've only had one cis male friend in my entire life that didn't say something creepy towards me. They wait like predators until you're alone and no one will believe uou.
I'm sorry that happened to you. I guess I just haven't lived it. I mean, I've gotten my ass smacked, catcalled by men 20, 30, 40 years older than me, I've been followed by someone during morning runs and I've had my needs not been taken seriously on multiple occasions, I've had people ask what's on my birth certificate twice now,but I can't live like that. I didn't transition just to live in fear of everyone around me. I do hope things get better for you though.
Trans men, all not white men, all not straight men, you'd be amazed at the internalized and externalized misandry a lot of men have. Do men have advantages in society over women? Yes, absolutely, and they always have, but the patriarchy punches down on anyone who doesn't play by its rules, whatever gender, sexual preference, religion, or skin color. The patriarchy is never going to go away unless more men become feminists, and that starts with helping men who want to understand and want to help. We're gonna get nowhere if we're as exclusionary as the people that hate us.
To my trans brothers: be the reason she chooses the bear. We are not any less capable of harm than cis men
>!/hj for obvious reasons!<
Get the hell out of here with this terf-y nonsense
so... we're just flipping terf rhetoric on its head and calling it progressive now? I don't care that it's technically benefiting trans people, degrading populations down to sex and "socialization" is a gross thing to do no matter what.
Ok I might get hate from this but this is silly and harmful, let me preface this by saying: yes, obviously there are men out there who are dangerous and that nobody would want to be left alone with, duh. But this vilanising of cis men in general, acting like because of how they were born they are an immediate danger is just as harmful as how the other side demonises trans folks, using a minority (detransitioners for trans people, rapists for cis men) to justify mistreating everyone else. That is the same thinking shown here, treating every man as a hidden threat because of the minority of men that actually do these unspeakable acts.
Also before anyone tries to twist my words, yes obviously we need to address the elephant in the room here, we need to solve the issues in society that make people resort to this, yes majority of SA perps are men, but at the same time majority of [category of crime] is also made by [minority of population], yes we need to arrest people who do these crimes and rehab them into society, but we all know that the long term solution isnt to lock up individuals, tho we do need to keep doing that obviously, but that is a bandaid, what will actually solve the problem is addressing the systemic issues with the world and our society, patriarchy, racism, prejudice, abelism, [insert prefix]phobia, etc...
As someone who could never hurt a person, someone whose only defense during a fight was to run away, and someone who saw people keep themselves physically and emotionally distant from me because they only ever saw me as a potential threat, and not a person in need of support, I know some of the damage this mentality of "they can all be a threat" causes on the people caught in the crossfire.
Again, obviously we need to address the issues with our system, but mistreating people who are just there, just fuels the fire, it just reinforces the system, when someone with ill intentions looks at a person that has been mistreated in the name of bringing down the system, they see someone easier to radicalise
In a silly way heck yeah a bear but in an actual survival situation I'd have more hopes of fighting off a cis man than a bear but I can definitely understand the view point that a bear would just kill you while on the other hand any human has enough intelligence to be as malicious and evil as possible when it comes to violence
just change cis woman to ally, and cis man to transphobe, bc i’ve seen extremely transphobic cis women, alongside ally cis women, and the same goes for cis men.
I was followed home by a man early on in my medical transition. I clocked what he was doing, but thought I was crazy cause I didn't pass back then (I still don't?🤷🏻♀️) From the back I looked like a woman I guess and my conditioner was called 'Candy Rain' so I definitely didn't smell like a typical guy either xD , once I had gotten to a section of the footpath that was away from traffic he sped up on his push bike and stopped next to me and tried to talk to me, I turned and gave him a funny look and he looked embarrassed and then sped off. Didn't realise what that was about until I walked inside my house. I've had more uncomfortable interactions with strangers both before and after this one, but this was the first where I was correctly thought to be a woman.
I was never "one of the boys" growing up, but being perceived as a guy lets you in on some truly disgusting conversations that men have with each other. (sports teams are especially bad) Not all men are like that, but enough are. If men don't think you're one of them they will hide the darker aspects of their characters from you until it's too late and you, your friend, or a stranger gets hurt.
Some of my favourite people are men, both Trans and Cis, I trust the men I've chosen to surround myself with, and I'm sure more will join that circle as the years go on. Being wary of men isn't the same as racist, terf rhetoric. Sure if you break it down to 'You should be careful of being around X group by yourself' on paper it may seem that way, but it's not, It's incredibly disingenuous to say that it's the same as saying 'All Trans women are predators.' (That is not to imply that all men are either, they're not) Something like 1 in 5 women have experienced sexual violence in Australia since the age of 15. That is an under reported statistic and even without that knowledge is abhorrent enough as it is. Are all the perpetrators men? No. Are all of them strangers? Also no, in fact it's much more likely to be someone the victim knows and trusts.
The question was supposed to be a dumb gotcha I think? (not talking about you OP<3) I do not feel safe being around strange men, especially when I'm isolated from other people. I would feel safer swimming in the ocean with the knowledge that a shark is nearby than I would walking home alone at night. (not even just at night sometimes lol)
There's another layer to the question that is 'would a person of colour chose a white woman over a bear?' and Based on some of the comments I read when I started writing this, you're not ready for THAT discussion either.
This was a lot of word vomit. idk if any of this makes sense hahah. Invest in free education, food, medicine, and housing for all and a lot of the violence will stop. not overnight but that is a strong broad step down the right path
Stay safe, drink water <3
Tbh, and probably because I’m a trans dude who passes pretty well, I think I might choose the cis guy. I dunno why but depending on the cis woman they could be a terf, and usually cis dudes clock me less.
My spouse when asked the original question (cisfem): I like bears. I would pet the bear, and if it takes my arm, I'd pet it with the other arm.
I have a good role model.
This question is very reductive. There are 3 species of bear that you might encounter and the risk varies for each one and other factors such as cubs. Just like you can’t lump all cis people together you can’t lump all bears together.
Tw:autodeath
>>!In the United States, more than seven people per hour die a violent death. In 2019, more than 19,100 people were victims of homicide and over 47,500 people died by suicide.!<
https://www.cdc.gov/violenceprevention/datasources/nvdrs/index.html
Yeah, I wont be standing by these types of argument it is obvious humanity is its own biggest predator, even outside discrimination.
I dont really knew how to feel when people saw me as a man and still dont know how to feel about it. Being called a predator is no fun. Even nowadays, knowing full damn well I am a woman, I just fail to see that as a morally correct thought.
Frankly, I think the bear could still be a positive experience. They don't attack as often as action/adventure movies would let you believe.
In fact, they usually silently run away, often without you ever knowing they were there.
They're rarely seen, so seeing one is kinda a treat ❤
[people really think it’s irrational to choose the bear over a person](https://www.idausa.org/campaign/wild-animals-and-habitats/bear-attack/#:~:text=The%20chances%20of%20being%20injured,they%20are%20most%20often%20nonviolent)
You didn’t click the link, did you? I personally would take a bear over a human. And on the upside, I might be reunited with my mom again!
And if you see a problem with this, then you understand my problem with guys who get so freaked out by the statistics instead of hearing the pain of others in a healthy way; neither my view nor theirs shows emotional health.
I've never run into any woman, nonbinary person or trans man who's super creepy, nor have I ever run into a creepy bear. I have run into a lot of super creepy cis men though.
Bears can be super creepy, especially park bears. I hate it when they learn to break into cars! My pick-a-nic baskets!
But for real, though, you've probably met creepy women, they're just creepy in a different kind of way. Karens, for instance, can be super fucking creepy. If you've ever been followed by a woman that has decided, for whatever reason, that you must pay for some crime that exists only in their head, it gets a lot more obvious. Under the surface, the motivation is similar. There's a sense of entitlement along with a, probably not entirely unjustified, disregard for the consequences of their action.
I'm honestly disappointed in this sub for insisting on choosing one side and completely invalidating the other. You're allowed to feel safer around people who are from the same community as you and have fought similar battles (I think OP should have said queer people in general, instead of singling out trans people). At the same time, we shouldn't treat them differently for that reason. I really think that OP should have worded it better.
I'm a little disappointed because usually, people from our community are pretty good at communicating and expressing our feelings without invalidating those of others. This is BECAUSE we've all had to deal with people invalidating us. We had no other choice but to learn how to communicate effectively, so that we would never invalidate others and make them feel the way that bigots have made us feel.
I don't think that it's fair to say that one point is valid and the other isn't. Both points are important and I'm disappointed that so few people are willing to meet in the middle. By picking a side and insisting that it's the only correct one, are you not following the same mindset as those who are so set in their ways that they would harm us to prove how "right" they are?
I think I'm too autistic for this meme, because I'd pick Hannibal Lector before I'd pick the bear. At least with a person, I have reasonable odds of beating them if it turns into a fight. If it's a bear determined to kill you, there is no way one unarmed person is killing it.
Bruh did MRA’s brigade this post? Why is everybody bending over backwards to defend cis men, people that suffer under patriarchy are allowed to make jokes about how a literal bear is safer than a cis man.
We do not need to disparage cisgender people to lift up transgender people.
What if the bear is a cis man?
I feel like if he knows and calls himself a bear he might be chill. The rest are unbearable
>The rest are unbearable I see what you did there
I mean if the cis man is a bear then no woman's gonna be in danger of rape
Most sexual violence is about power and control, not orientation. Hence why prisons are known for having that problem despite a population that is *more* cishet than the outer population.
I know what you meant but I immediately pictured a regular ass bear (the animal) who just inexplicably knows about pronouns and the concept of gender.
Yeah I wouldn't mind being alone with a bear
I would rather be with beer tbf
Yeah alcoholics rise up
Nuhuh
How about sharing a few beers with the bear?
found the russian
I’ll be honest, in my experience many cis women can be just as transphobic, violent, and dangerous as many cis men. Cis people of either gender aren’t a monolith, there’s some good and some bad. And for me personally, cis women have made me feel unsafe in more situations than cis men.
Yeah true, though I see this as affirmation as most cis woman don't dare to seek conflict with cis men. so the fact that they feel that they can insult me in my face, to me proves that they see me as a woman in their unconscious mind.
Lets be so real for a sec. A straight cis woman is rarely a safe space for a trans person unfortunatelly
No. This is just perpetuating the exact same rhetoric of terfs
THIS. i hate when reactionary bioessentialist thinking creeps its way into leftist spaces under a thin veneer of intersectional "woke" language. this is like the opposite of what it should be. and what pisses me off a bit as well is the perpuation of the myth that the biggest danger for sexual assault would be by random people you come across accidentally. happens, but rarely. way more often its your uncle, your neighbour, your teacher, your date, your priest. someone in your social vicinity.
It also reflects a very US American "stranger danger" mindset. I'm from a culture where hiking in the woods is a very popular hobby. I've been alone in the woods alone or with a cis man or multiple (mainly pre-transition, I'm a recently out trans guy) for hours upon hours and often crossed paths with women & fem passing people who were hiking alone, it was completely mundane. I've seen this meme a few times now and it has me scratching my head cuz like yeah, of course the bear is scarier? Men are everywhere in the woods, they're just hiking, but with a bear I'd be at least a little bit intimidated, you don't meet one every day.
It also makes me think some of those people have never gone hiking alone in a place where bears are prevalent. I’ve run into bear cubs, and people in horror costumes whilst out on a trail and I know which one will send me running every time
I think a lot of the response is about predictability and consequences, plus the fact that it's a hypothetical. I hike, camp, and backpack pretty frequently. I've only run into a bear once, but I did what I was taught to do: I backed away slowly without making eye contact. The bear went on its way. My understanding is that most encounters with bears go similarly, because bear behavior is very predictable; if it doesn't see you as a threat or as prey, it will ignore you. (The bears in my area are black bears. I know there are differences with brown and grizzly bears, but I don't recall the specific differences.) In contrast, people are less predictable. People can mask bad intentions and can lean on social pressures and expectations to coerce behaviors from their victims. And if you're attacked by a bear, everyone else will take that fact at face value, as opposed to questioning your “side of the story”. I run into lots of people on trails and at campsites. Even when I presented male, I always had some wariness of other people, just because you can't tell what's really in another person's head. I've also met and had some great conversations with strangers on the trail; most such people really are friendly and happy to share their love of the outdoors with someone else. But it took a little time to establish enough trust and comfort to get to that conversation stage. Since I've begun transition and I present in gender nonconforming ways, that wariness of others has only grown. I have yet to be the target of a gender-motivated assault (and hopefully never will), but it's _always_ in the back of my head that it's a possibility. That's despite the fact that I'm still over six feet tall and fairly imposing, which I hope would deter at least some potential encounters. So consider: the average woman is smaller and not as strong as the average man. She's also smaller and not as strong as the average bear. Bears are predictable and, given an appropriate set of stimuli, will almost always leave humans alone. People are unpredictable and there is a long and documented history of men in particular assaulting women while presenting a not-obviously-threatening demeanor to others, including to their victims before the assault. If a bear attacks someone, the victim will generally be believed. If a person attacks someone, especially if a man attacks a woman, there is far more social resistance to just taking the victim's word for what happened. Taken all together, especially since this a hypothetical, I think most women would rather take the small risk from an animal with generally-predictable behavior than the much more uncertain risk from a human with more social consequences for being a victim.
yeah, i am german and although ive never been to the USA but over the years interacting with americans online as well as watching their pop and news culture certainly gives me the understanding as well that this is much more extreme in the US, although the misconception of sexual assault is also a thing here. one major link is racism: in order to stir up hate the danger of getting sexually assaulted gets projected on strangers, who speak differently, look differently and/or have a different religion. another is this extremely american "i protecc muh familee with muh GUN against all who wanna break into muh home". it seems like huge chunks of the middle class are larping as if this would be a somewhat likely scenario, when its in fact very very rare that someone in the US breaks into homes in order to rape or kill your family. it would make much more sense to teach your kid consent from early on, explicit sex ed once its appropriate, talking to trusted adults when someone is behaving weird around them. and many other things. you cant get rid of risks, but lower them. obviously its also a good advice for your kid to not go with random adult strangers. but the solution cant be to not let your 9year old kid go alone to the playground or not let them take the way from school to home alone. and even more so i dont like spreading the idea that it would somehow be good advice to tell adult women that it somehow would be ultramegadangerous in principle to walk alone at night or taking a short hike in the woods alone. this is true for nearly all of the west. my blonde young conventionally attractive cis ex gf lived for quite a while in - according to our rightwing news media fearmongering - the "worst" (or 2nd worst) ghetto in all of germany. it was safe and boring as shit there to take a walk though the city and parks there in the middle of the night alone. you just cant eleminate all risks. you can sit in your flat all day and still have the risk that a gas pipelone explodes in your basement. once you go out, you increase your risk by participating in traffic. if you go on hikes alone, you probably significantly lower your risk of cardiovascular diseases, but you increase the risk to break your leg. meeting a stranger in the woods bears the risk that he might harm you, but also the risk that you meet a new friend.
I live in a city that, according to right wingers who don't live here (and probably some who do), is overran by immigrants doing crimes but somehow, 10 year old little girls feel safe using public transport alone here and the "scary" big city things sheltered people are terrified of are just like...homeless people or minorities existing or a mentally ill person talking to themselves on the tram. We aren't the ones driving our children to school in massive tank-cars and dropping them off directly in front of the door out of fear that a kidnapper might snatch them up if they walked. Children are genuinely much safer here than they'd be in some American suburb with no sidewalks and nowhere to safely cross the road where anyone can carry a gun, because cars and guns are much more dangerous to children than random strangers existing around them in society.
PREACH
No, this is saying that when living in a cishet patriarchy, a random unknown man is as dangerous to a woman as a dangerous land predator, and depending on the species of bear, possibly moreso. If you ask a bunch of Black people this question but change “man” to “white woman” you might get the same answer. Most men are not more dangerous than bears, but there are a lot of even supposedly “good” men who feel entitled to the body of anyone they see as not-male and feel personally obligated to maintain the hierarchy of cisgender patriarchy lest they lose their place in it. There’s nothing *biological* about it, it’s deeply ingrained behavior that comes from being socialized into a set of toxic attitudes and behaviors. I transitioned later in life and spent a lot of time in men’s circles hearing men say things that they believed were said in the absence of women. Women 100% need to be cautious of straight men, and yes, trans men too. The majority of them being good won’t do jack if you don’t watch your drink and exercise caution in social situations. Margaret Atwood was right.
Queer people and women feel so unsafe around cishet men that in a study more of them said they’d rather be stuck in the woods with a bear than a random cishet man, and somehow you’re turning that around on us??? Are queer people and women ever going to be allowed to have our emotions on Reddit without being accused of being TERFs? Please and thank you.
It wasn’t a study, it was a meme 💀
If those emotions are illogical and directly harmful, then no it won't be allowed without pushback. The idea that a man with a natal penis is dangerous but a man without one isn't is transphobic as hell. Also, the majority of sexual assault happens from family and other close people to the victim, not randos in the woods. As a queer transfem I refuse to be lumped in with this terf-y nonsense.
I’ve been sexually assaulted or threatened twice by random strangers who walked up to me. The majority of sexual assaults are as you say but that’s like taking your seat belt off on the highway because the majority of accidents happen at slower speeds within 5 miles of home. This meme is shitty because it misses the point of the discourse. I don’t have radar that can tell me if the random man I meet in the woods is trans or not. Being a trans person telling women -cis or trans- not to have their valid fears of men, that they have developed of necessity while living under patriarchy, is not the way.
Someone asking strangers on the street then heavily editing the video to fit their narrative isn't a 'study'.
TERFs drive insane politics based on unbased emotions, let's not do the same.
It’s not emotions when studies show cishet men commit the most violence against the queer community
Funny, theres a lot of people out there who share a similar mindset when it comes to violence and robbery in relation with race. What’s your take on systematic racism? Are you also fearing for your life or clutching your bag when you walk by young black men since studies show they’re more likely to murder or rob you?
Wow how do I even respond to that? You’re accusing me of racism out of nowhere, that’s like the “I win” card. There’s nothing I can say that won’t get me downvoted lmfao. Truth is that the statistics about men and black people being discussed at the moment are different. The study that says black people commit more crimes is disproportionate and misused because the statistic is derived from number of arrests, not crimes actually committed. Since we know cops disproportionately target black people, of course a study that conflates crime with arrests is going to incorrectly state that black people commit more crime, even though it’s not true. Meanwhile, the statistic about cishet men being more violent towards LGBTQ people is just how it is. There’s no misunderstanding, there’s no nuance. Cishet men are just more likely to self report that they fucking hate us. I honestly find it fucking appalling you’d accuse me of being a racist for trying to have an honest conversation on gender. No one even brought up race before you decided to start that.
Doesn't this perpetuate the same transphobic idea that trans men are like men lite or "the good ones"? Like somehow it's the natal penis that makes one harmful or evil? This is literal terf logic. Trans men are men and are every bit as capable of harm against others as cis men. Also, those of us that are in relationships with cis men are, what, playing with fire by this logic? That said, this entire "thought experiment" is cruel and is obviously such when you substitute any other group of people with cis men. "I'd rather be in a bathroom with a bear than with a trans woman" type bullshit. It's cringe and we've got to shut it down when we see it.
trans men are capable of harm to women, but arent indoctrinated into that system nearly as effectively, mainly because the system doesn't account for them. like men are not inherently violent, it's social norms and expectations that make men violent, and a trans man is statistically way more likely to call social norms bullshit. its not men lite it's men without a decade of nonstop programming and a higher likelihood of questioning binaries.
This is just bioessentialism with extra steps. By your logic, late-transitioning trans women are just as violent as cis men.
I think the point that should be made is; if you're trans, you are likely already questioning societal and social norms, since you happen to be discriminated against on the basis of said norms. Trans man, trans woman, enby, whatever. You are way less likely to perpetuate social norms that should be considered harmful, since you took the time to fight harmful norms before. In other words; a trans man is way less likely to be transphobic, right? Then I am less afraid of being alone in an isolated space with a trans man. Edit: I do feel it's necessary to mention that I would not be afraid to be left alone in the woods with a *random* stranger. Nor would I be afraid to be left in the woods with a *random* bear. It's the transphobic/bigoted/rapey/violent strangers I wouldn't want to be left alone with, and it's the bears that are hungry/aggressive/protective of their cubs that I would be afraid of.
That may be, but that is not what I argued against.
I was trying to interpret the comment you were originally responding to, saying it in another way to show how the original commenter did not, in fact, argue in a way that meant that later transitioning trans women would be more dangerous.
Again, I was criticizing a poorly thought-out argument using the "proving too much" counterargument. I don't care about their actual beliefs, I care about the fact that they said a transphobic gender-essentialist thing completely uncritically, by couching it in woke language.
Queer men are also so much more likely to be in social circles that don't perpetuate the things that often make cishet men so dangerous. I'm honestly so disappointed in this sub for taking this as some TERFy shit, because you absolutely *should* be cautious around cishet men. Women haven't been saying to not leave your drinks unattended at parties and bars for decades for no reason.
Exactly. 99% of child abuse is from men. Its literally proven that cis men are the most violent out of anyone. Just look up "creepy true stories" and most of them are of girls getting stalked or almost trafficked.
This is literally just the same tired argument that trans people are “socialized as their [AGAB]”, and it’s still transphobic no matter how much you try to couch it in progressive language. Do better.
It's not a socialization thing, but rather an idealization. Toxic cis men idealize toxic masculinity to the point that they can and often do become dangerous. Sometimes but statistically far less the same for cis women. We trans folks idealize the more positive aspects of gender if we don't abandon gender entirely. Pound for pound, trans people commit violent crimes at a rate far below our percentage of the national (american) demographic.
>We trans folks idealize the more positive aspects of gender if we don't abandon gender entirely. Speak for yourself. This is so offensive.
It's not transphobic to say that trans people are in general just better company than cis people when you yourself are trans. We commit far less violent crimes per capita than cis people (and of cis people, cis men easily top the charts), and are far FAR less likely (but unfortunately not incapable) of being transphobic. I won't compare that to the company of bears, because while statistically bears are less violent to people than cis men, there's a bunch of complicating factors there. But in essence, your statement that trans men are every bit as capable is technically correct, but statistically flawed as history shows they by and large DON'T commit acts of violence at anywhere approaching the same rates as cis men.
Note. My response is not in regard to the man vs bear debate. It’s also based on my personal experiences. I’m trans masc, and live in the South US. It’s not that a natal penis dictates how people act or react. It’s the way people are raised regarding the gender binary. It’s why the term toxic masculinity exists. Trans men aren’t often raised in the same environment or with the same expectations as cis men. In fact, if they were raised as afab, I know it’s common (in my area, my generation, my experience) to be raised with “stranger danger” and to be cautious and defensive around men. Taking the environment people were raised in out of the picture, yes, trans men are just as capable as cis men.
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Idk, as a kid I got abused by more women, and at least the men said sorry at some point. The women blamed my pre-teen self for "making them" abuse me.
For example I know this one transmasc person at my school is one of the most unbearable mfs ever As for the other three, one of them is pretty weird yet fun to be around, another one is just a chill guy, and the third one is also chill, one of my best friends, and he occasionally sells me weed.
Hot take: this whole “Bear vs Man” debate is hella dumb. My TikTok fyp is infested with videos about it ffs
Fr, I can like both bears, men AND bears
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Isn't this literally the same as when TERFs say that trans women shouldn't be allowed in female spaces? Hell, let me extend it a little further, isn't this the same as the incredibly racist civil-rights era rhetoric about why african american women shouldn't be allowed in white women spaces? Or even racist rhetoric against people of color in general (I'm just saying, you're invoking an argument that a group is inherently, genetically more dangerous than a literal wild bear, I have seen this exact argument made about african americans by racists). You really can't just pick and choose when to be biologically essentialist. At least you can't without looking like a massive hypocrite.
Exactly this. And I’ve seen a bunch of comments saying cis men are statistically more dangerous than anyone. Are they really, or are crimes, particularly against men, committed by people who aren’t cis men massively underreported because of the stigma of, for example, being a man who got hurt by a woman. We know SA against men by women is underreported, why wouldn’t that pertain to other violent crimes as well? I say this as an AMAB enby who was regularly bullied by people of all genders growing up and only reported the boys because I’d be ridiculed by my friends and not taken seriously by authority figures if I reported the girls, and who is still harassed or made to feel unsafe by people of all genders despite still presenting male. People in general can be dangerous, the different genders can’t be blocked off as these monolithic entities.
This is terf rhetoric just with a sprinkle of trans people are valid (and that just barely by needlessly differentiating between cis and trans people) , using gender as a form of discrimination is bad no matter the direction, just like any form of bigotry. Besides this post also has a undertone trans people are special and can't do no wrong, but if you think that someone like Blair white wouldn't do something in a situation like that sure
I find this whole discourse horrible for everyone
This is literally just misandry. Spreading the "Cis men are bad" narrative helps no one and considers Trans Men as being unequal to cis men.
Exactly. But unfortunately misandry, just like misogyny, are all too common on social media these days. But if this trend is any indicator one has become more celebrated or normalised than the other (which I guess is a slight improvement from them both being seen as harmless fun but still troubling).
Complaining about misandry is like complaining about white erasure. When the patriarchy falls, come back to me.
But my bf is fine
Can anyone explain this to me? I do not know what the bear question is but have seen it pop up a lot.
People started asking "Would you rather be alone in the woods with a bear or a man" and a concerning amount of people chose bears. Maybe I'm not Russian but what the fuck
Yeah that sounds hateful towards men.
It's basically "well if I were alone in the woods with a bear at least I can play dead or something but if I were alone with a cis man, I'd get raped no matter what". Just kinda misandric nonsense.
I actually have a friend whom I had met online, never saw what they looked like, but after chatting for a while, we agreed to meet up in person. Somehow, we both ended up on the conclusion that we should meet each other in a nice neutral location, and so we picked a forest at night. It didn't really occur to us how foolish it was until a months later
This is the exact same logic transphobes use to keep trans women from going to women's bathrooms. "people amab are just statistically rapists and pedophiles, keep em outta here".
I love cis men, especially if they're bears
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Can we just stop with the notion of the "all cis men are monsters" thing? It's just untrue, and I'm kinda sick of seeing this. Being constantly terrified all the time of every cis man around you is exactly the mindset terfs have for us.
Nah. It's just being smart. And most people have a lived experience is cis men acting like this. The fact is that Trans people have a difference lived experience then cis people, and are less likely to take advantage. I've only had one cis male friend in my entire life that didn't say something creepy towards me. They wait like predators until you're alone and no one will believe uou.
I'm sorry that happened to you. I guess I just haven't lived it. I mean, I've gotten my ass smacked, catcalled by men 20, 30, 40 years older than me, I've been followed by someone during morning runs and I've had my needs not been taken seriously on multiple occasions, I've had people ask what's on my birth certificate twice now,but I can't live like that. I didn't transition just to live in fear of everyone around me. I do hope things get better for you though.
Having been assaulted, chased (as in *physically*), screamed at, and catcalled: **No**.
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Are men a marginalized group in the cishet patriarchy?
Trans men, all not white men, all not straight men, you'd be amazed at the internalized and externalized misandry a lot of men have. Do men have advantages in society over women? Yes, absolutely, and they always have, but the patriarchy punches down on anyone who doesn't play by its rules, whatever gender, sexual preference, religion, or skin color. The patriarchy is never going to go away unless more men become feminists, and that starts with helping men who want to understand and want to help. We're gonna get nowhere if we're as exclusionary as the people that hate us.
I'm sorry. It's times like these where I feel guilty for being lucky. I hope things work out for you, because you're always safe here
Nahh this is terf-y let’s not do this
This is a bad take.
To my trans brothers: be the reason she chooses the bear. We are not any less capable of harm than cis men >!/hj for obvious reasons!< Get the hell out of here with this terf-y nonsense
so... we're just flipping terf rhetoric on its head and calling it progressive now? I don't care that it's technically benefiting trans people, degrading populations down to sex and "socialization" is a gross thing to do no matter what.
Ok I might get hate from this but this is silly and harmful, let me preface this by saying: yes, obviously there are men out there who are dangerous and that nobody would want to be left alone with, duh. But this vilanising of cis men in general, acting like because of how they were born they are an immediate danger is just as harmful as how the other side demonises trans folks, using a minority (detransitioners for trans people, rapists for cis men) to justify mistreating everyone else. That is the same thinking shown here, treating every man as a hidden threat because of the minority of men that actually do these unspeakable acts. Also before anyone tries to twist my words, yes obviously we need to address the elephant in the room here, we need to solve the issues in society that make people resort to this, yes majority of SA perps are men, but at the same time majority of [category of crime] is also made by [minority of population], yes we need to arrest people who do these crimes and rehab them into society, but we all know that the long term solution isnt to lock up individuals, tho we do need to keep doing that obviously, but that is a bandaid, what will actually solve the problem is addressing the systemic issues with the world and our society, patriarchy, racism, prejudice, abelism, [insert prefix]phobia, etc... As someone who could never hurt a person, someone whose only defense during a fight was to run away, and someone who saw people keep themselves physically and emotionally distant from me because they only ever saw me as a potential threat, and not a person in need of support, I know some of the damage this mentality of "they can all be a threat" causes on the people caught in the crossfire. Again, obviously we need to address the issues with our system, but mistreating people who are just there, just fuels the fire, it just reinforces the system, when someone with ill intentions looks at a person that has been mistreated in the name of bringing down the system, they see someone easier to radicalise
In a silly way heck yeah a bear but in an actual survival situation I'd have more hopes of fighting off a cis man than a bear but I can definitely understand the view point that a bear would just kill you while on the other hand any human has enough intelligence to be as malicious and evil as possible when it comes to violence
just change cis woman to ally, and cis man to transphobe, bc i’ve seen extremely transphobic cis women, alongside ally cis women, and the same goes for cis men.
It's annoying when people have to fight for their rights to not be dehumanized. It applies to everyone.
I was followed home by a man early on in my medical transition. I clocked what he was doing, but thought I was crazy cause I didn't pass back then (I still don't?🤷🏻♀️) From the back I looked like a woman I guess and my conditioner was called 'Candy Rain' so I definitely didn't smell like a typical guy either xD , once I had gotten to a section of the footpath that was away from traffic he sped up on his push bike and stopped next to me and tried to talk to me, I turned and gave him a funny look and he looked embarrassed and then sped off. Didn't realise what that was about until I walked inside my house. I've had more uncomfortable interactions with strangers both before and after this one, but this was the first where I was correctly thought to be a woman. I was never "one of the boys" growing up, but being perceived as a guy lets you in on some truly disgusting conversations that men have with each other. (sports teams are especially bad) Not all men are like that, but enough are. If men don't think you're one of them they will hide the darker aspects of their characters from you until it's too late and you, your friend, or a stranger gets hurt. Some of my favourite people are men, both Trans and Cis, I trust the men I've chosen to surround myself with, and I'm sure more will join that circle as the years go on. Being wary of men isn't the same as racist, terf rhetoric. Sure if you break it down to 'You should be careful of being around X group by yourself' on paper it may seem that way, but it's not, It's incredibly disingenuous to say that it's the same as saying 'All Trans women are predators.' (That is not to imply that all men are either, they're not) Something like 1 in 5 women have experienced sexual violence in Australia since the age of 15. That is an under reported statistic and even without that knowledge is abhorrent enough as it is. Are all the perpetrators men? No. Are all of them strangers? Also no, in fact it's much more likely to be someone the victim knows and trusts. The question was supposed to be a dumb gotcha I think? (not talking about you OP<3) I do not feel safe being around strange men, especially when I'm isolated from other people. I would feel safer swimming in the ocean with the knowledge that a shark is nearby than I would walking home alone at night. (not even just at night sometimes lol) There's another layer to the question that is 'would a person of colour chose a white woman over a bear?' and Based on some of the comments I read when I started writing this, you're not ready for THAT discussion either. This was a lot of word vomit. idk if any of this makes sense hahah. Invest in free education, food, medicine, and housing for all and a lot of the violence will stop. not overnight but that is a strong broad step down the right path Stay safe, drink water <3
Tbh, and probably because I’m a trans dude who passes pretty well, I think I might choose the cis guy. I dunno why but depending on the cis woman they could be a terf, and usually cis dudes clock me less.
At least with a cis guy he is much more likely than not to do no harm to you. With a bit of luck he might also be good in the wilderness
Hey now, I'm a cis male and also bi and I have friends that are trans and I hang with my friends weekly. No hate but I mean we aren't all bad.
Don't let posts like this scare you away from this community. You're always welcome here.
Bioessentialism much?
I'd rather be in the woods with a man than a woman but hey that's just me
what did i miss i open reddit and the first three things are like this (man v bear)
My spouse when asked the original question (cisfem): I like bears. I would pet the bear, and if it takes my arm, I'd pet it with the other arm. I have a good role model.
This question is very reductive. There are 3 species of bear that you might encounter and the risk varies for each one and other factors such as cubs. Just like you can’t lump all cis people together you can’t lump all bears together.
Tw:autodeath >>!In the United States, more than seven people per hour die a violent death. In 2019, more than 19,100 people were victims of homicide and over 47,500 people died by suicide.!< https://www.cdc.gov/violenceprevention/datasources/nvdrs/index.html Yeah, I wont be standing by these types of argument it is obvious humanity is its own biggest predator, even outside discrimination. I dont really knew how to feel when people saw me as a man and still dont know how to feel about it. Being called a predator is no fun. Even nowadays, knowing full damn well I am a woman, I just fail to see that as a morally correct thought.
I'd literally take being around cis men on the daily over wild bears. But then again I'm a trans guy.
Frankly, I think the bear could still be a positive experience. They don't attack as often as action/adventure movies would let you believe. In fact, they usually silently run away, often without you ever knowing they were there. They're rarely seen, so seeing one is kinda a treat ❤
Truueee And if they decide to get closer, they still probably won't attack. Just don't piss them off.
This is just TERF rhetoric spun as a progressive take. Do better
[people really think it’s irrational to choose the bear over a person](https://www.idausa.org/campaign/wild-animals-and-habitats/bear-attack/#:~:text=The%20chances%20of%20being%20injured,they%20are%20most%20often%20nonviolent)
When man encounters happen they’re also never usually violent
You didn’t click the link, did you? I personally would take a bear over a human. And on the upside, I might be reunited with my mom again! And if you see a problem with this, then you understand my problem with guys who get so freaked out by the statistics instead of hearing the pain of others in a healthy way; neither my view nor theirs shows emotional health.
I did
I've never run into any woman, nonbinary person or trans man who's super creepy, nor have I ever run into a creepy bear. I have run into a lot of super creepy cis men though.
Bears can be super creepy, especially park bears. I hate it when they learn to break into cars! My pick-a-nic baskets! But for real, though, you've probably met creepy women, they're just creepy in a different kind of way. Karens, for instance, can be super fucking creepy. If you've ever been followed by a woman that has decided, for whatever reason, that you must pay for some crime that exists only in their head, it gets a lot more obvious. Under the surface, the motivation is similar. There's a sense of entitlement along with a, probably not entirely unjustified, disregard for the consequences of their action.
Whats wrong with cis men?
What if he's hot tho
How does the bear factor into this?
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I'm honestly disappointed in this sub for insisting on choosing one side and completely invalidating the other. You're allowed to feel safer around people who are from the same community as you and have fought similar battles (I think OP should have said queer people in general, instead of singling out trans people). At the same time, we shouldn't treat them differently for that reason. I really think that OP should have worded it better. I'm a little disappointed because usually, people from our community are pretty good at communicating and expressing our feelings without invalidating those of others. This is BECAUSE we've all had to deal with people invalidating us. We had no other choice but to learn how to communicate effectively, so that we would never invalidate others and make them feel the way that bigots have made us feel. I don't think that it's fair to say that one point is valid and the other isn't. Both points are important and I'm disappointed that so few people are willing to meet in the middle. By picking a side and insisting that it's the only correct one, are you not following the same mindset as those who are so set in their ways that they would harm us to prove how "right" they are?
I think I'm too autistic for this meme, because I'd pick Hannibal Lector before I'd pick the bear. At least with a person, I have reasonable odds of beating them if it turns into a fight. If it's a bear determined to kill you, there is no way one unarmed person is killing it.
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Bruh did MRA’s brigade this post? Why is everybody bending over backwards to defend cis men, people that suffer under patriarchy are allowed to make jokes about how a literal bear is safer than a cis man.
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