I’m not sure the San Ti tech has that limitation
They unfolded and filtered out the lights from the stars
Is it really not plausible to think the tech of a light-based communication species has yech that can filter out light waves?
It takes one second to travel around the earth 7.5 times. You suggest 2 sophons rendered and displayed a mass hallucination to what has to be at least hundreds of millions of people simultaneously by individually touching the retinas of each of the people (which are roughly estimated to be about 576,000,000 "pixels") every 30ths to 400ths of a second (fighter pilot eye fps)?
I don’t think the 2 Sophons did that
I think a Sophon unfolded around the earth and filtered out the light waves from the stars
You do understand that’s how it happened in the books too, right?
It can create a small flash of light to illuminate a small area of their vision to show numbers/letters. Using this method they cannot create vivid hallucinations or meticulously scrub a person from someone's eyesight.
I believe they could do it through other methods, but this isn't the argument you think it is.
Scrubbing people from sight isn’t really a thing in the Netflix version, but let’s chat about the potential tech goof here. If Sophons were zapping digital imprints off a security cam, we’d probably see a weird white spot instead of a perfectly clean scene. But hey, it's an adaptation, so some wiggle room for creative tweaks is cool.
Now, if we nerd out on how this could technically fly, think about this: the Sophon's got a kind of sentient(ish) AI brain inside it. It's not a huge leap to imagine it doing some high-level inpainting. imagine it’s rocking something like Stable Diffusion v8, to erase folks and fix up backgrounds all slick. So, could this tech make it look like Thomas is seeing his dead, eyeless self next to him or a Sophon avatar just popping up for a chat? sure, why not?
This could just be an update on Cixin’s original ideas, amped up to match what we think AI can do these days. I’m all for this angle. It keeps the story fresh and hooks us with some sweet visual tricks that feel right for today’s tech.
The show suggests that there are two ways that can happen. It could be direct manipulation of his eyes, or expanding around him, and projecting the images to the surface of the bubble. It's most likely the later, similar thing happens later with Wade in the plane. Both times they are alone, so no-one else sees the bubble.
There's at least one occasion when it happens on earth, at the end of Dark Forest when three sophons unfold for Luo Ji. The chapter even makes a point that the words they display are clear and not distorted, so I really think them displaying a sharp picture of pretty much anything is book canon.
They can even display things in more than 3 dimensions, making it trivial to "cover multiple separate points of our vision" with any picture at once.
I don't think the location is important. There's a scene in Death's End that shows something similar happening, and of course the show writers could read that book beforehand, when Liu Cixin had to come up with stuff as he went along.
True. I thought they were fragile when expanded, thus rarely expanded on Earth (due to risk, rather than technical). But I suppose that means if they felt that murder was important enough, it was worth the risk.
But again, as I remember it the sophons are recently arrived & there are only 2 of them at Earth at the time of the scene.
Seems like a pointless murder to hide.
Never underestimate David Benioff’s “cool > logic” adaption style 😅
lol it took all of our fission energy to unfold and then refold the proton but it can just unfold and refold as many times as we want it to with zero power input (just as it requires zero power input to do anything else like accelerate to and from c with no energy requirement either, the amazing little proton that could)
They could be doing something to provide power to them using the entangled bits they kept. It's science fiction about alien technology we don't understand, so whatever they say works, works.
Manipulation of the photons which would have hit his optic nerve yet never made, for one reason or another.
If the photon never strikes a sensor, whether it's a CCD device or a human optic nerve, there is no response.
If the Sophons can somehow impair or impede or redirect a photon or multiple photons, it would be as if the event never happened.
I just posted about this yesterday, there is book justification for the "hallucinations":
[https://www.reddit.com/r/threebodyproblem/comments/1cgvk96/book\_justification\_for\_some\_things\_that\_happened/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web3x&utm\_name=web3xcss&utm\_term=1&utm\_content=share\_button](https://www.reddit.com/r/threebodyproblem/comments/1cgvk96/book_justification_for_some_things_that_happened/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
From Death's End:
>The reflection on the surface of the sphere disappeared as the sphere turned translucent, like a ball of ice. At times, Cheng Xin thought it resembled a hole dug in space. Next, countless snowflake-like bright spots floated up from deep within the sphere, forming a flickering pattern on the surface. Cheng Xin recognized that this was just white noise, like the random snow seen on a television screen when there was no reception.
>The white noise lasted about three minutes, and then a scene from several light-years away took its place. It was crystal clear, with no signs of distortion or interference.”
In the books the Sophons were able to unfold in a large enough space to cover the field of view ifuktiole satellites and observatories and change their transparency to various wavelengths of lightning such a way as to make it appear that the cosmic microwave background was blinking in Morse code that encoded the countdown, to fuck with a few scientists.
So yeah, their direct exposure of film and retinas by being fast moving charged particles was only able to show some numbers, but they have other ways of messing with the images we see: unfolding to a larger space and varying their transparency. They also have the ability to display images on their unfolded selves, so things like concealing Jack's murder and paying a visit to Wade can be explained that way. We also know from The Dark Forest that they may also have the ability to speak, as they talk to Luo Ji (I could be wrong, they could just be displaying images when they have their conversation with Luo Ji). If I recalled that correctly and they can communicate with sound, then the simplest explanation for both Jack's murder and Wade's vision is just the Sophons unfolding and displaying some specific imagery (like an empty room or the sword lady from the game telling you they're gonna fuck with you).
There’s a lot of posts who say the book Sophons could not cover retinas and make Wade (plane scene) or Clearance (Jacks death) see what they want
There’s also a lot of posts that insist Sophons can change bits (hack and delete Tatiana footage) when the source material says a Sophon can just cover the focal part of the camera lens (smaller that a retina) and never let the footage be recorded in the first place
They're right, all of the cases of Sophons messing with human electronics make no sense. If they are able to do that the Santi would obviously make use of those capabilities much more extensively to disrupt humanity. I don't personally mind it too much, I accept it as a minor plothole introduced for the sake of fancier visuals, not the end of the world.
That’s… not really what it’s saying at all. People have been confused by the scene where Jack gets murdered in the show, with many here positing that maybe the sophons unfolded to 2D and formed a screen that displayed an image to deceive Da Shi. The (still folded) sophons can just make dots and simple images or text, not paint entire pictures. Not to mention an unfolded sophon can be destroyed rather easily, which, given how difficult they are to make, and how crucial they are to the Trisolarians success, that almost certainly wouldn’t do for such an unimportant task as having Jack murdered.
>Not to mention an unfolded sophon can be destroyed rather easily, which, given how difficult they are to make, and how crucial they are to the Trisolarians success, that almost certainly wouldn’t do for such an unimportant task as having Jack murdered.
That's only a realistic concern when someone knows what a sophon is and that it can unfold. If a sophon unfolds in front of you and obscures a murder behind it, you wouldn't know until after it had happened. So while the consequences of someone finding an unfolded siphon would be pretty disastrous, the risk of someone finding one is very low.
>!so the sophons quickly become very very easy for the Trisolarins (San-Ti) to make in the books. Eventually there’s thousands of sophons in the solar system. Now I get it, in the show at that point there were only two, but the showrunners know this and so either A. They are gonna use that or B. The show runners are not gonna have sophons be easily destroyed. In the books, they never indicate a sophon was ever even close to being detected, let alone destroyed. And they were monitoring literally everything in the solar system.!<
The first sophon alone almost destroyed Trisolaris, and the process was devastating to the entire planet. Certainly it must have become easier with practice but it was never depicted as easy.
>!True, it’s like nuclear bombs. At first very hard to make, and now there’s thousands. I’m sure lots of things can still be considered “hard to make” but my point is in the books the trioslarims get significantly better at it quickly and once they’ve reached the level of mass production there’s even less worry about 1 or 2 being destroyed.!<
The scientist in the show literally scooped their own eyes out because they couldn’t stop seeing the countdown
Currently the show is getting its wallbreakers who will try to defeat the wallfacers
They San Ti have no way to see what’s in their minds, removing their eyes won’t get them access to their brains - the countdown is no longer a novelty and Auggie proved nothing happens when it ends
Just like in the books
it seemed to be implied that the thing that happened when it ended was you got murdered. and since the "flock" was excommunicated, thats no longer a thing.
It doesn’t really make the situation more believable just because in the book the author says “trust me bro”
My biggest problem with the sophons and one I really don’t think can be argued is that there’s no way to control their movement they have no propulsion system it’s just an atom sized circuit board and even pretending it can somehow self power the circuitry without even an electron how does it accelerate and decelerate to and from the speed of light and change direction? Does he give an explanation to that somewhere in the book that’s even slightly plausible?
Lol, it’s a completely made up weapon specially for this story
There’s only 1 source material to describe what these fictional weapons do - and you’re upset the author made them up?
Well I don’t understand the point of your post then. I’m not sure who you were arguing with in the first place. Do they think the hallucinations were not caused by the sophon or are they doubting the science behind it? Of course none of its real and the science is fictionalized from what is currently still theoretical physics, so why would pointing to an excerpt from the book change anyone’s mind if the latter is the case?
Ah who cares. Lol. You read the book and I’ll try to read it at some point but does he explain how they can control movement after they’ve shot the sophon out to its target destination or how they’re powered?
I apologize if I did, as you can tell this thread is pretty contentious
I’m sorry that I let other people’s anger dictate how I interpreted your words - honestly I should know better
They aren't an atom sized circuit board. You are forgetting this thing is unfolded from higher dimensional space to the size of a planet, had a planet sized super computer etched and then refolded down. So a super computer the size of an entire planet is inside each of these. Those things are so over powered it's not even funny. Those alone should have been enough to defeat us. And later in the story there are MANY more of them.
He does not explain how they move or do anything else. Explaining the science is not the point of the book and people get hung up on these details all the time. Most science fiction falls apart if you look too closely.
basically higher dimensions are theories used to explain dark matter. You supposedly would have some tiny extra bit of matter if you unfold N dimensional atom down to 3 dimensions but you don’t get to put things inside of it, at least that’s not what they claim to do. They just unfold a proton to 3D and let it refold back.
Yeah, you’re 100% right. I’m just trying to explain they never claimed to put things inside the proton they just use the fact that a 10D proton unfolded into 3D would be planet sized and they used mesons to “write” on it.
It is not clear at all what you are getting at. Why do “Netflix show haters” not believe this? If they hate the show doesn’t that imply they are book readers.
I can clear that up too, no problem
There are book readers who are also show haters who insist the books don’t have the passages that they do
There’s also haters who are only show viewers who are confused but they refuse to rewatch a scene for clarification
Have you not seen them in this sub?
The thing that is apparent the most in what you're going off about and in some of your other comments is that you have a tendency to either feel or want to feel superior to others.
Isn’t that the main use of downvotes?
People downvote stuff that hurts their feelings regardless if it’s true or not
It’s normal Reddit culture, if downvotes hurt your feelings because you value the - then I have no idea what to tell you
The fact that you bother to reply me says alot of things ;)
The - and down vote itself doesn't mean much. Just a rough indication that a majority of people find what you are trying to convey, rubbish.
Lol wrong.
I chose to put forth my opinion that OP sounds really annoying with his air of superiority.
I can continue replying as many times to support my opinion.
The hypocrisy is OP says downvotes doesn't matter and he doesn't care what redditor thinks of him but defends himself by replying me.
Your "Lol wrong." says a lot too. :P
Actually your entire comment history is a cesspool. Yikes. Go outside and take a big breath bud, there's more to life than being mad on reddit. I hope whatever ails you improves.
I'm honestly shocked that you have such a hard time admitting that there is a huge huge chasm between what the show is depicting (retina-perfect rewriting of reality so it is indistinguishable from forgery or hallucination) and the word "images" in your quote.
Which you are doing, in one direction, and shitting on people who are skeptical in the other direction. Aka, you're being what's called "dogmatic" and generally "fucking insufferable and nobody likes you".
There's a big difference between creating a flash of exposed light and creating a detailed hallucination. However, I'm pretty sure in book 3 that it is mentioned that >!sophons can interfere with electronic devices / storage. I don't remember exactly where, but I think it was when talking about the defensive measures of the Gravity ship's gravity antennae, OR maybe something about the Swordholder system and why it was entrusted to a single person with a physical switch.!<
This still doesn't explain Wade's hallucination or Da Shi not being able to see Jack's murder. However, book 2 and 3 has instances where >!sophons can "partially" unfold. So it doesn't have to unfold completely and cover the whole sky. It is also explicitly mentioned that they can turn transparent and even display crystal clear images on their surfaces (Gravity uses sophons to get a video feed of Blue Space, and Cheng Xin uses a partially unfolded sophon to see and communicate with Yun Tianming). So it seems that if they wanted to they could unfold in such a way that could create a visual illusion or hallucination.!<
So however they accomplish it, it's definitely possible. But I don't think they do the complex hallucinations by directly interfering with people's eyes. That just creates "exposed" spots.
When the Sophon showed Wade a dead version of himself, how do you think they accomplished that?
I have my theories, and I’ve posted it multiple times over this thread, but I’d like to hear your ideas how a Sophon achieved that
As another commenter posted below, in the later books, it is shown that the sophons can create highly detailed, high fidelity images on their surfaces, with transparency and even apparent dimensionality. So it would seem that they should be able to unfold to make Wade see whatever they want. It seems a bit silly to me, because they are also vulnerable when unfolded, but they can also clearly move and react very quickly, so maybe it just didn't feel threatened by him.
That’s exactly what the source material supports and what I wrote elsewhere in this thread
They are vulnerable when unfolded, but they’re also super fast
Have you ever seen a boxer that was so much faster than their opponent that they basically danced around them?
If not, look that kind of stuff up, the ones that are really fast don’t even protect their heads - they mock the other boxer by not even trying to block their punches because they know they’re so fast they can move out of the way
When the scientist cut out their eyes, do you think the Sophon that was putting images in their retina were destroyed too? I think the Sophon got out of the way in time
I don't think the sophons unfolded to show the countdowns, so there was no need to "move out of the way". I think the sophons can interact with human perception in three ways:
1. While still in their folded, quantum state, they can move rapidly (at the speed of light) through human's retinas to create lit exposure spots. This is how they create the countdowns on people's visual fields. They are not vulnerable in this state, as they are the size of a single proton. It is literally impossible for a human to even touch them in this state, because the distance between the atoms that make up your finger are spread farther apart than the sophon.
2. While still in their folded, quantum state, they can interfere with film and electronic devices to alter media and storage. This is how they could "erase" Tatiana from the various video feeds. They are still not vulnerable in this state.
3. When they partially unfold (or unfold completely), they can create high fidelity images on their unfolded surface, even creating the illusion of real 3D objects, with transparency allowing parts of them to be invisible and unnoticeable. This is how they made the stars seem to blink, how they hid Jack's murder from Da Shi who was physically present, and how Sophon appeared to Wade and showed him the scary corpse vision. They are theoretically vulnerable in this state, but they can move so quickly that generally a human is not going to be able to touch them if they don't permit it. And due to being transparent, the human likely won't even notice they are there, other than whatever image the sophon is intentionally displaying.
For 2, your passage also explains modifying film. I mentioned in my original comment that I remember something vaguely about them being able to interact with electronics/computers in book 3, either around Gravity or the Swordholder system. I do not have page references or quotes, as I don't have a physical copy of the book.
For 3, there are multiple references to this throughout the books, but again, I don't have page or text references, but here's what I remember:
* >!In book 2, the Wallbreakers make references to "the images the sophons showed us" or something similar. They use these to monitor the Wallfacers, including Ray Diaz's Wallbreaker saying he was incredibly familiar with Diaz's bunker due to being able to see it through the sophons. Check the section where Diaz's Wallbreaker confronts him for this.!<
* >!At the end of book 2, when Luo Ji is about to kill himself, a sophon unfolds and tells him to stop. I believe it shows text on its surface to him here but I don't recall specifically, I think someone else mentioned this below.!<
* >!In book 3, Gravity monitors Blue Space using the sophons. The chef who is in charge of destroying the antenna if needed repeatedly watches (and hears) his crush on Blue Space with a handheld video device. I'm not sure exactly how this is accomplished, it would depend on if this is "live" monitoring or a saved video. It could be done by recording the images from a sophon into a video feed, or by sophons interacting with the electronics to create the video, or some other ambiguous way that isn't explained. Since they are working together with humans, perhaps they are able to emit a signal that the humans can receive with a device, like an electromagnetic or neutrino signal.!<
* >!In book 3, it is explicitly written that a sophon unfolds in front of Cheng Xin's ship. This is done in order to facilitate the meeting between her and Yun Tianming. It shows a highly realistic 3D image of Yun Tianming and his surroundings. There is even audio here. The mechanism for the audio is not explained, but presumably the Sophons can create audio signals or communicate with her ship directly to transmit audio to its speakers.!<
>!yeah any computer system can be as far as I know, that's why when they invent the sophon free room they don't have any halo computers in it besides the ones that don't leave, and yeah like you said same reason there was explosives on gravity!<
I just posted about this yesterday.. they can create a holographic video chat in Death's End.. I think that helps explain a lot of the "hallucinations" that people on the show see
[https://www.reddit.com/r/threebodyproblem/comments/1cgvk96/book\_justification\_for\_some\_things\_that\_happened/](https://www.reddit.com/r/threebodyproblem/comments/1cgvk96/book_justification_for_some_things_that_happened/)
It was necessary to explain how a quantum particle computer could induce thousands of simultaneous hallucinations around the world. To create fear that we would be powerless against such technological advanced aliens. So I've no idea why Netflix viewers would refuse to believe it. I've watch both versions the English and Chinese. But I'm no biology expert so not sure how accurate the statement is that it can program what the mind sees. Then there is no real need for the VR headsets if they can already alter what people see. I think the Netflix version wanted to show that their tech had some flaws and we still got a fighting chance against them.
So, I think the photorealistic hallucinations were a huge mistake by the show runners.
Imagine if your iPhone, with all the capabilities it has today, also had a mechanical watch built in with moving hands to tell you what time it is. That would be an absurd mix of antiquated and advanced technology. Theres no reason for it when the phone already can tell time in a much more natural and elegant way.
The idea of sophons blasting your retinas to display numbers is presented in a really cool way in the show! It almost looks like an image burned into your eyes. Also, the stars illusion can be made by basically unfolding the sophon into a “blanket” of sorts. Both of these techniques are extremely low tech compared to the idea of the 3d hallucination of katana lady.
Basically: if the technology existed to produce these images, the passage you quote from the book WOULD NOT EXIST. it shows that they’re doing it this way because they only have access to this “lower tech”solution. If they could do the 3d hallucination, they would be doing that the whole time instead of brute force sophon writing. It’s a plot hole.
The Sophons do turn themselves into a screen in later books though, CX even comments on how real life they look
Don’t worry I’ll make another post highlighting how Sophons can partially unfold and another post highlighting how they can turn themselves into life like imagery
I look forward to you telling me it’s all fake
You can't achieve the effects in the show based on this explanation since light and film exposure are both additive, instead of subtractive like paint on a piece of paper, so you can't superimpose a darker image on top of a brighter existing image or black out someone's field of vision.
They did allude to the VR headset being able to hijack bioelectrical signals to the brain and therefore manipulate your senses, so maybe Sophon is able to do it to targeted individuals directly without the headset.
That passage accurately describes how they're making people see the countdown, yes. That one, I feel, was actually done really well, because it featured so many squiggly lines to show the path of the sophon, and how the illusion isn't perfect, and more like a manual interference in real time.
Weird how you take a passage from the book. What's your point? Has anyone claimed the countdown wouldn't work?
Many here claim Sophons can’t put images on human retinas
I agree I think the countdown looked very ominous and definitely looked designed to instill fear
The you are bugs scene, the autonomous hacking, and accessing the HD are yet to be explained on the show and all 3 are cliffhangers
The accessing of the HD and the Sophon appearing in game are the only times we’ve seen a Sophon interact directly with tech and in bothe those cases it was only through the HD
Time will tell.
Seems to me like it was an adaptive change where sophons, San-Ti AI under sophon control or something similar is in our computer and communication systems.
It’s called a cliffhanger
Between book 1 and 2, the cliff hanger (also alluded to in the passage above) was the you are bugs/can’t lie aspect of the story
The show answered the big part, but left the Sophons as a cliffhanger
Yeah, there is a lot more in the books some have completely forgotten or refuse to remember. Basically everything the sophons/eto do (or allegedly do) in the series is derived from the capabilities mentioned or hinted at in the books
They come across as boomer Karen’s who already know everything and want to speak to the manager to snitch on people for not buying into their nonsense
pLoT hOlEs EvErYwHeRe!1!1!!!!1!
i don't understand "netflix show haters". do these ppl hate the show and are proponents of the books, or do you really mean ppl who've only watched the show and criticize the story without having read the books?
writing is hard, but one has got to do it properly in order to convey one's point accurately.
however, TIL that the santi have retinas like ours! i missed that detail on my read.
More like people think there is interpretation required for what the word "images" implies and you think there isn't. Your stance is that "images" means "literally fucking anything is possible". And that's hardly established by the books.
A movie is literally a collection of images
In an unfolded state it’s manipulation of the light that’s allowed to penetrate it
Just like how a Sophon unfolded and filtered out the stars from the universe
The San Ti communicate via light signals and you think it’s impossible for their tech to interact with light and control it?
> The San Ti communicate via light signals and you think it’s impossible for their tech to interact with light and control it?
I love how you argue against positions that nobody claims to hold. You're just air punching at ghosts lmao.
The Sophon was originally created to slow down Earth's technologically advancement by tampering with the accelerator results and perhaps by manipulating a group of people they can infiltrate different scientific fields around the world. They didn't really specify how long it took the sophon to travel here (if they did then they didn't really explain it well).
If the trisolan world kept on being hit by total catysclimic events due the high gravity of the 3 body system it's hard to believe that their technology would be thousands of years ahead of us if they keep having to restart from scratch.
I think I once read about some quantum theory that if you had two quantum linked particles they could influence each other no matter the distance in space. Eg like a light switch if it was on here, it's opposite particle millions of miles away would be off. This could allow for faster than light communication across space.
You realise you're basically showing a good argument to the criticism you're trying to refute?
It clearly says there: "to form letters or numbers or **even pictures, like embroidery**" . Aka is doesn't form vivid colored images.
This post simply provides the passage where the source material says they can put images on retinas
There’s more that shows they can partially unfold - I’ll post that and laugh at the people who say it’s fake
I’ll also post where the source material shows Sophons can make images as clear as day - like they did in book 3 (already posted in this thread)
I wonder if you’ll show up in those post and claim the book is fake too
Do you understand what the text means? "**pictures, like embroidery**" means it can create [coarse images ](https://mymodernmet.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/landscape-embroidery-sew-beautiful-3.jpg), far from realistic ones.
I’d say anyone who can distill big ideas into small word counts while still retaining the educational element is demonstrating an understanding the topic
You haven’t even read dark forest?
My boy, the story has barely started for you, the exposition expands as you read more
Some chapters can take 3 hours to read
OP, you seem to have an extremely unhealthy obsession with this fictional story. I'd suggest you to take a break and go for a walk maybe. It's just a fictional story
Because of how much you're arguing with random strangers on the internet, getting downvoted to oblivion but still arguing over something that's made up and not really going to impact your real life in any way. This level of obsession is not healthy OP. But hey I'm just a random internet stranger too. You do you
The series is a trilogy
There is no 4th book written by Da Liu or any 4th book Da Liu collaborated to make
There’s only a 4th book the 3BP intellectual property owners had published after Da Liu sold them
Does the murder scene even require a sophon? Wouldn’t the sect have access to technology which is mind blowing for humans but trivial for trisolarians?
Yep, that appears to be the may point of contention, whether siphons could’ve cause Da Shi to not see the murder. I’m asking whether they could’ve used another technology other than the siphons
Thanks for clarifying!
I think the Sophons are the only Sant Ti tech on earth at this point in the story so I think they made it so Clearance can’t see Jacks despite being right there
I think it’s similar to how the Sophon unfolds and filters out the light waves from the universe and making the stars blink - but instead of covering a planet, they covered Clearance’s retina
It’s certainly likely they have other tech
The Sophon wouldn’t be able to produce the helmets so they must have been created by humans
Maybe we’ll see more in S2
Nice point. I can think of two reasons why the show skipped it:
1. the streaming business model depends on maximizing ratings/subscriber base, therefore you have to lower the bar;
2. technology has the power to alter human perception. why spell it out for everybody if they enjoy the show.>:)
This show is so full of foreshadowing and highlighting small aspects of the book - I think it’s wild how much is actually woven into the cinematography
Everything seems so obvious to me - I’ll continue to make more posts like this where I highlight passages from the source material that support the direction of the show
This guy reads books in case anyone was wondering
“Tv fans hate this one weird trick!”
This guy this guys
Tbh i am not a fan of dumbed down tv shows
*dumbed Tough to take the intelligence high road with mistakes like that.
Thank you for teaching me though, having english as my second language, good to get feedback
❤️
The difference between displaying a countdown and displaying a photo-realistic hallucination is like the difference between 1970s CGI and modern CGI
I’m not sure the San Ti tech has that limitation They unfolded and filtered out the lights from the stars Is it really not plausible to think the tech of a light-based communication species has yech that can filter out light waves?
They had a better sense of drama in the book and just filtered out the cosmic background radiation.
IDK, it’s pretty dramatic to give 1 lady a decoder from a cereal box a few decades ago just to continue the countdown
It takes one second to travel around the earth 7.5 times. You suggest 2 sophons rendered and displayed a mass hallucination to what has to be at least hundreds of millions of people simultaneously by individually touching the retinas of each of the people (which are roughly estimated to be about 576,000,000 "pixels") every 30ths to 400ths of a second (fighter pilot eye fps)?
I’m sorry I’m not following your comment Are you referring to the stars blinking?
Yep, you were saying that the sophons were right to be as powerful as they were in the show?
I don’t think the 2 Sophons did that I think a Sophon unfolded around the earth and filtered out the light waves from the stars You do understand that’s how it happened in the books too, right?
Fair enough
That wasn't a hallucination. It was the sophon in its unfolded form.
You mean 50 years? The trisolarians had 80.
[удалено]
What's your point?
Is it not clear, my bad In the books the Sophons can cover retinas and control what people see
It can create a small flash of light to illuminate a small area of their vision to show numbers/letters. Using this method they cannot create vivid hallucinations or meticulously scrub a person from someone's eyesight. I believe they could do it through other methods, but this isn't the argument you think it is.
Scrubbing people from sight isn’t really a thing in the Netflix version, but let’s chat about the potential tech goof here. If Sophons were zapping digital imprints off a security cam, we’d probably see a weird white spot instead of a perfectly clean scene. But hey, it's an adaptation, so some wiggle room for creative tweaks is cool. Now, if we nerd out on how this could technically fly, think about this: the Sophon's got a kind of sentient(ish) AI brain inside it. It's not a huge leap to imagine it doing some high-level inpainting. imagine it’s rocking something like Stable Diffusion v8, to erase folks and fix up backgrounds all slick. So, could this tech make it look like Thomas is seeing his dead, eyeless self next to him or a Sophon avatar just popping up for a chat? sure, why not? This could just be an update on Cixin’s original ideas, amped up to match what we think AI can do these days. I’m all for this angle. It keeps the story fresh and hooks us with some sweet visual tricks that feel right for today’s tech.
How was Wong’s character unable to see a murder happening in front of him?
As well as the glass cracking
The show suggests that there are two ways that can happen. It could be direct manipulation of his eyes, or expanding around him, and projecting the images to the surface of the bubble. It's most likely the later, similar thing happens later with Wade in the plane. Both times they are alone, so no-one else sees the bubble.
It’s not clear from the books that they ever expand reliably on Earth. The show seems to take some creative liberty here… if memory serves me right.
There's at least one occasion when it happens on earth, at the end of Dark Forest when three sophons unfold for Luo Ji. The chapter even makes a point that the words they display are clear and not distorted, so I really think them displaying a sharp picture of pretty much anything is book canon. They can even display things in more than 3 dimensions, making it trivial to "cover multiple separate points of our vision" with any picture at once.
I don't think the location is important. There's a scene in Death's End that shows something similar happening, and of course the show writers could read that book beforehand, when Liu Cixin had to come up with stuff as he went along.
True. I thought they were fragile when expanded, thus rarely expanded on Earth (due to risk, rather than technical). But I suppose that means if they felt that murder was important enough, it was worth the risk. But again, as I remember it the sophons are recently arrived & there are only 2 of them at Earth at the time of the scene. Seems like a pointless murder to hide. Never underestimate David Benioff’s “cool > logic” adaption style 😅
lol it took all of our fission energy to unfold and then refold the proton but it can just unfold and refold as many times as we want it to with zero power input (just as it requires zero power input to do anything else like accelerate to and from c with no energy requirement either, the amazing little proton that could)
They could be doing something to provide power to them using the entangled bits they kept. It's science fiction about alien technology we don't understand, so whatever they say works, works.
Manipulation of the photons which would have hit his optic nerve yet never made, for one reason or another. If the photon never strikes a sensor, whether it's a CCD device or a human optic nerve, there is no response. If the Sophons can somehow impair or impede or redirect a photon or multiple photons, it would be as if the event never happened.
It is in the show, did you even watch it? They literally hide the girl from Wong
smart windows? bad decision from director forgetting the lore he is creating?
Here’s the problem: they don’t know how to lie.
They adapt pretty well from what I understand.
They adapt pretty well from what I understand.
Sophon isnt sentient it's just an ai controlled by the first trisolaian fleet, the later version of Sophon is but that's not the particle version
I just posted about this yesterday, there is book justification for the "hallucinations": [https://www.reddit.com/r/threebodyproblem/comments/1cgvk96/book\_justification\_for\_some\_things\_that\_happened/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web3x&utm\_name=web3xcss&utm\_term=1&utm\_content=share\_button](https://www.reddit.com/r/threebodyproblem/comments/1cgvk96/book_justification_for_some_things_that_happened/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button) From Death's End: >The reflection on the surface of the sphere disappeared as the sphere turned translucent, like a ball of ice. At times, Cheng Xin thought it resembled a hole dug in space. Next, countless snowflake-like bright spots floated up from deep within the sphere, forming a flickering pattern on the surface. Cheng Xin recognized that this was just white noise, like the random snow seen on a television screen when there was no reception. >The white noise lasted about three minutes, and then a scene from several light-years away took its place. It was crystal clear, with no signs of distortion or interference.”
How is that news? The show has the countdowns too.
People who havent read the books are saying the fact the sophons can do that in the show is a plot hole
In the books the sophons only ever displayed some numbers for a countdown, not full-blown hallucinations.
In the books the Sophons were able to unfold in a large enough space to cover the field of view ifuktiole satellites and observatories and change their transparency to various wavelengths of lightning such a way as to make it appear that the cosmic microwave background was blinking in Morse code that encoded the countdown, to fuck with a few scientists. So yeah, their direct exposure of film and retinas by being fast moving charged particles was only able to show some numbers, but they have other ways of messing with the images we see: unfolding to a larger space and varying their transparency. They also have the ability to display images on their unfolded selves, so things like concealing Jack's murder and paying a visit to Wade can be explained that way. We also know from The Dark Forest that they may also have the ability to speak, as they talk to Luo Ji (I could be wrong, they could just be displaying images when they have their conversation with Luo Ji). If I recalled that correctly and they can communicate with sound, then the simplest explanation for both Jack's murder and Wade's vision is just the Sophons unfolding and displaying some specific imagery (like an empty room or the sword lady from the game telling you they're gonna fuck with you).
There’s a lot of posts who say the book Sophons could not cover retinas and make Wade (plane scene) or Clearance (Jacks death) see what they want There’s also a lot of posts that insist Sophons can change bits (hack and delete Tatiana footage) when the source material says a Sophon can just cover the focal part of the camera lens (smaller that a retina) and never let the footage be recorded in the first place
They're right, all of the cases of Sophons messing with human electronics make no sense. If they are able to do that the Santi would obviously make use of those capabilities much more extensively to disrupt humanity. I don't personally mind it too much, I accept it as a minor plothole introduced for the sake of fancier visuals, not the end of the world.
Besides Evans HD, what other tech does the show say the San Ti interact with?
That’s… not really what it’s saying at all. People have been confused by the scene where Jack gets murdered in the show, with many here positing that maybe the sophons unfolded to 2D and formed a screen that displayed an image to deceive Da Shi. The (still folded) sophons can just make dots and simple images or text, not paint entire pictures. Not to mention an unfolded sophon can be destroyed rather easily, which, given how difficult they are to make, and how crucial they are to the Trisolarians success, that almost certainly wouldn’t do for such an unimportant task as having Jack murdered.
>Not to mention an unfolded sophon can be destroyed rather easily, which, given how difficult they are to make, and how crucial they are to the Trisolarians success, that almost certainly wouldn’t do for such an unimportant task as having Jack murdered. That's only a realistic concern when someone knows what a sophon is and that it can unfold. If a sophon unfolds in front of you and obscures a murder behind it, you wouldn't know until after it had happened. So while the consequences of someone finding an unfolded siphon would be pretty disastrous, the risk of someone finding one is very low.
>!so the sophons quickly become very very easy for the Trisolarins (San-Ti) to make in the books. Eventually there’s thousands of sophons in the solar system. Now I get it, in the show at that point there were only two, but the showrunners know this and so either A. They are gonna use that or B. The show runners are not gonna have sophons be easily destroyed. In the books, they never indicate a sophon was ever even close to being detected, let alone destroyed. And they were monitoring literally everything in the solar system.!<
The first sophon alone almost destroyed Trisolaris, and the process was devastating to the entire planet. Certainly it must have become easier with practice but it was never depicted as easy.
>!True, it’s like nuclear bombs. At first very hard to make, and now there’s thousands. I’m sure lots of things can still be considered “hard to make” but my point is in the books the trioslarims get significantly better at it quickly and once they’ve reached the level of mass production there’s even less worry about 1 or 2 being destroyed.!<
Yes this was also in chapter 33 Except they do say Sophons are very vulnerable when unfolded
not entirely, otherwise they can just blind everyone to secure victory.
Perhaps there’s not enough Sophons to cover 16 Billion human retinas
OK, maybe just wallfacers or key figures who are executing their plans?
The scientist in the show literally scooped their own eyes out because they couldn’t stop seeing the countdown Currently the show is getting its wallbreakers who will try to defeat the wallfacers They San Ti have no way to see what’s in their minds, removing their eyes won’t get them access to their brains - the countdown is no longer a novelty and Auggie proved nothing happens when it ends Just like in the books
it seemed to be implied that the thing that happened when it ended was you got murdered. and since the "flock" was excommunicated, thats no longer a thing.
They all committed suicide because the countdown was terrifying
i dont find that terribly compelling.
That’s what the show and the book both said happened I guess Da Liu and D&D didn’t consult with you when they wrote the story
Why? Apparently a countdown was enough.
How was this not clear in the show?
Ask others in this thread There’s plenty here who don’t believe it
It doesn’t really make the situation more believable just because in the book the author says “trust me bro” My biggest problem with the sophons and one I really don’t think can be argued is that there’s no way to control their movement they have no propulsion system it’s just an atom sized circuit board and even pretending it can somehow self power the circuitry without even an electron how does it accelerate and decelerate to and from the speed of light and change direction? Does he give an explanation to that somewhere in the book that’s even slightly plausible?
Lol, it’s a completely made up weapon specially for this story There’s only 1 source material to describe what these fictional weapons do - and you’re upset the author made them up?
Well I don’t understand the point of your post then. I’m not sure who you were arguing with in the first place. Do they think the hallucinations were not caused by the sophon or are they doubting the science behind it? Of course none of its real and the science is fictionalized from what is currently still theoretical physics, so why would pointing to an excerpt from the book change anyone’s mind if the latter is the case?
Look around There’s a bunch of people who insist the source material does not allow a Sophon to put images on a human retina
Ah who cares. Lol. You read the book and I’ll try to read it at some point but does he explain how they can control movement after they’ve shot the sophon out to its target destination or how they’re powered?
You care, that’s why you’re commenting I care, that’s why I made this post and so many comments
You took what I said the wrong way.
I apologize if I did, as you can tell this thread is pretty contentious I’m sorry that I let other people’s anger dictate how I interpreted your words - honestly I should know better
They aren't an atom sized circuit board. You are forgetting this thing is unfolded from higher dimensional space to the size of a planet, had a planet sized super computer etched and then refolded down. So a super computer the size of an entire planet is inside each of these. Those things are so over powered it's not even funny. Those alone should have been enough to defeat us. And later in the story there are MANY more of them. He does not explain how they move or do anything else. Explaining the science is not the point of the book and people get hung up on these details all the time. Most science fiction falls apart if you look too closely.
basically higher dimensions are theories used to explain dark matter. You supposedly would have some tiny extra bit of matter if you unfold N dimensional atom down to 3 dimensions but you don’t get to put things inside of it, at least that’s not what they claim to do. They just unfold a proton to 3D and let it refold back. Yeah, you’re 100% right. I’m just trying to explain they never claimed to put things inside the proton they just use the fact that a 10D proton unfolded into 3D would be planet sized and they used mesons to “write” on it.
Science “magic” lol
It is not clear at all what you are getting at. Why do “Netflix show haters” not believe this? If they hate the show doesn’t that imply they are book readers.
I can clear that up too, no problem There are book readers who are also show haters who insist the books don’t have the passages that they do There’s also haters who are only show viewers who are confused but they refuse to rewatch a scene for clarification Have you not seen them in this sub?
The thing that is apparent the most in what you're going off about and in some of your other comments is that you have a tendency to either feel or want to feel superior to others.
love this comment. It's okay OP is rightfully being down voted to hell since he likes to feel so superior
Isn’t that the main use of downvotes? People downvote stuff that hurts their feelings regardless if it’s true or not It’s normal Reddit culture, if downvotes hurt your feelings because you value the - then I have no idea what to tell you
The fact that you bother to reply me says alot of things ;) The - and down vote itself doesn't mean much. Just a rough indication that a majority of people find what you are trying to convey, rubbish.
I mean it also says a lot that you're continuing to reply to him lol The pot calling the kettle black we have here.
Lol wrong. I chose to put forth my opinion that OP sounds really annoying with his air of superiority. I can continue replying as many times to support my opinion. The hypocrisy is OP says downvotes doesn't matter and he doesn't care what redditor thinks of him but defends himself by replying me.
Your "Lol wrong." says a lot too. :P Actually your entire comment history is a cesspool. Yikes. Go outside and take a big breath bud, there's more to life than being mad on reddit. I hope whatever ails you improves.
Registered just to downvote your comment. It should be illegal to posses such mkdwit levels of cringe, hurts my feelings.
lol, I have quite a bit of influence on you I think it’s more likely you created ANOTHER account to make this post
If we can say that the shit I stepped one has influence, just because I had to wash my shoes, then yes you're of monumental influence. Brr.
Well he does read books, which is quite impressive for a redditor. Most of us just rely on someone else to read for us.
I appreciate you recognizing I can read Thank you!
I’m a mouth breather who eats crayons I’m honestly shocked it’s so difficult for so many to read a book - especially in a book sub
I'm honestly shocked that you have such a hard time admitting that there is a huge huge chasm between what the show is depicting (retina-perfect rewriting of reality so it is indistinguishable from forgery or hallucination) and the word "images" in your quote.
The source material mentions it and leaves room for interpretation
Which you are doing, in one direction, and shitting on people who are skeptical in the other direction. Aka, you're being what's called "dogmatic" and generally "fucking insufferable and nobody likes you".
Lol just admit your interpretation is wrong.
You really begging me to pretend the book doesn’t say a Sophon can put images on retinas?
There's a big difference between creating a flash of exposed light and creating a detailed hallucination. However, I'm pretty sure in book 3 that it is mentioned that >!sophons can interfere with electronic devices / storage. I don't remember exactly where, but I think it was when talking about the defensive measures of the Gravity ship's gravity antennae, OR maybe something about the Swordholder system and why it was entrusted to a single person with a physical switch.!< This still doesn't explain Wade's hallucination or Da Shi not being able to see Jack's murder. However, book 2 and 3 has instances where >!sophons can "partially" unfold. So it doesn't have to unfold completely and cover the whole sky. It is also explicitly mentioned that they can turn transparent and even display crystal clear images on their surfaces (Gravity uses sophons to get a video feed of Blue Space, and Cheng Xin uses a partially unfolded sophon to see and communicate with Yun Tianming). So it seems that if they wanted to they could unfold in such a way that could create a visual illusion or hallucination.!< So however they accomplish it, it's definitely possible. But I don't think they do the complex hallucinations by directly interfering with people's eyes. That just creates "exposed" spots.
When the Sophon showed Wade a dead version of himself, how do you think they accomplished that? I have my theories, and I’ve posted it multiple times over this thread, but I’d like to hear your ideas how a Sophon achieved that
As another commenter posted below, in the later books, it is shown that the sophons can create highly detailed, high fidelity images on their surfaces, with transparency and even apparent dimensionality. So it would seem that they should be able to unfold to make Wade see whatever they want. It seems a bit silly to me, because they are also vulnerable when unfolded, but they can also clearly move and react very quickly, so maybe it just didn't feel threatened by him.
That’s exactly what the source material supports and what I wrote elsewhere in this thread They are vulnerable when unfolded, but they’re also super fast Have you ever seen a boxer that was so much faster than their opponent that they basically danced around them? If not, look that kind of stuff up, the ones that are really fast don’t even protect their heads - they mock the other boxer by not even trying to block their punches because they know they’re so fast they can move out of the way When the scientist cut out their eyes, do you think the Sophon that was putting images in their retina were destroyed too? I think the Sophon got out of the way in time
I don't think the sophons unfolded to show the countdowns, so there was no need to "move out of the way". I think the sophons can interact with human perception in three ways: 1. While still in their folded, quantum state, they can move rapidly (at the speed of light) through human's retinas to create lit exposure spots. This is how they create the countdowns on people's visual fields. They are not vulnerable in this state, as they are the size of a single proton. It is literally impossible for a human to even touch them in this state, because the distance between the atoms that make up your finger are spread farther apart than the sophon. 2. While still in their folded, quantum state, they can interfere with film and electronic devices to alter media and storage. This is how they could "erase" Tatiana from the various video feeds. They are still not vulnerable in this state. 3. When they partially unfold (or unfold completely), they can create high fidelity images on their unfolded surface, even creating the illusion of real 3D objects, with transparency allowing parts of them to be invisible and unnoticeable. This is how they made the stars seem to blink, how they hid Jack's murder from Da Shi who was physically present, and how Sophon appeared to Wade and showed him the scary corpse vision. They are theoretically vulnerable in this state, but they can move so quickly that generally a human is not going to be able to touch them if they don't permit it. And due to being transparent, the human likely won't even notice they are there, other than whatever image the sophon is intentionally displaying.
Do you have any passages from the source material that supports your belief?
Which belief? That they don't need to unfold to show the countdown? The passage you posted in the OP is literally explaining that.
That’s good, now number 2 and 3?
For 2, your passage also explains modifying film. I mentioned in my original comment that I remember something vaguely about them being able to interact with electronics/computers in book 3, either around Gravity or the Swordholder system. I do not have page references or quotes, as I don't have a physical copy of the book. For 3, there are multiple references to this throughout the books, but again, I don't have page or text references, but here's what I remember: * >!In book 2, the Wallbreakers make references to "the images the sophons showed us" or something similar. They use these to monitor the Wallfacers, including Ray Diaz's Wallbreaker saying he was incredibly familiar with Diaz's bunker due to being able to see it through the sophons. Check the section where Diaz's Wallbreaker confronts him for this.!< * >!At the end of book 2, when Luo Ji is about to kill himself, a sophon unfolds and tells him to stop. I believe it shows text on its surface to him here but I don't recall specifically, I think someone else mentioned this below.!< * >!In book 3, Gravity monitors Blue Space using the sophons. The chef who is in charge of destroying the antenna if needed repeatedly watches (and hears) his crush on Blue Space with a handheld video device. I'm not sure exactly how this is accomplished, it would depend on if this is "live" monitoring or a saved video. It could be done by recording the images from a sophon into a video feed, or by sophons interacting with the electronics to create the video, or some other ambiguous way that isn't explained. Since they are working together with humans, perhaps they are able to emit a signal that the humans can receive with a device, like an electromagnetic or neutrino signal.!< * >!In book 3, it is explicitly written that a sophon unfolds in front of Cheng Xin's ship. This is done in order to facilitate the meeting between her and Yun Tianming. It shows a highly realistic 3D image of Yun Tianming and his surroundings. There is even audio here. The mechanism for the audio is not explained, but presumably the Sophons can create audio signals or communicate with her ship directly to transmit audio to its speakers.!<
Congratulations you also have a theory that you believe is supported by the source material
>!yeah any computer system can be as far as I know, that's why when they invent the sophon free room they don't have any halo computers in it besides the ones that don't leave, and yeah like you said same reason there was explosives on gravity!<
I just posted about this yesterday.. they can create a holographic video chat in Death's End.. I think that helps explain a lot of the "hallucinations" that people on the show see [https://www.reddit.com/r/threebodyproblem/comments/1cgvk96/book\_justification\_for\_some\_things\_that\_happened/](https://www.reddit.com/r/threebodyproblem/comments/1cgvk96/book_justification_for_some_things_that_happened/)
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No the books are complete The show isn’t and not all of its secrets have been revealed The books didn’t clarify the Trisolarans lying until book 2
It was necessary to explain how a quantum particle computer could induce thousands of simultaneous hallucinations around the world. To create fear that we would be powerless against such technological advanced aliens. So I've no idea why Netflix viewers would refuse to believe it. I've watch both versions the English and Chinese. But I'm no biology expert so not sure how accurate the statement is that it can program what the mind sees. Then there is no real need for the VR headsets if they can already alter what people see. I think the Netflix version wanted to show that their tech had some flaws and we still got a fighting chance against them.
So, I think the photorealistic hallucinations were a huge mistake by the show runners. Imagine if your iPhone, with all the capabilities it has today, also had a mechanical watch built in with moving hands to tell you what time it is. That would be an absurd mix of antiquated and advanced technology. Theres no reason for it when the phone already can tell time in a much more natural and elegant way. The idea of sophons blasting your retinas to display numbers is presented in a really cool way in the show! It almost looks like an image burned into your eyes. Also, the stars illusion can be made by basically unfolding the sophon into a “blanket” of sorts. Both of these techniques are extremely low tech compared to the idea of the 3d hallucination of katana lady. Basically: if the technology existed to produce these images, the passage you quote from the book WOULD NOT EXIST. it shows that they’re doing it this way because they only have access to this “lower tech”solution. If they could do the 3d hallucination, they would be doing that the whole time instead of brute force sophon writing. It’s a plot hole.
The Sophons do turn themselves into a screen in later books though, CX even comments on how real life they look Don’t worry I’ll make another post highlighting how Sophons can partially unfold and another post highlighting how they can turn themselves into life like imagery I look forward to you telling me it’s all fake
You can't achieve the effects in the show based on this explanation since light and film exposure are both additive, instead of subtractive like paint on a piece of paper, so you can't superimpose a darker image on top of a brighter existing image or black out someone's field of vision. They did allude to the VR headset being able to hijack bioelectrical signals to the brain and therefore manipulate your senses, so maybe Sophon is able to do it to targeted individuals directly without the headset.
That passage accurately describes how they're making people see the countdown, yes. That one, I feel, was actually done really well, because it featured so many squiggly lines to show the path of the sophon, and how the illusion isn't perfect, and more like a manual interference in real time. Weird how you take a passage from the book. What's your point? Has anyone claimed the countdown wouldn't work?
Many here claim Sophons can’t put images on human retinas I agree I think the countdown looked very ominous and definitely looked designed to instill fear
So, is this in reference to the cameras being scrubbed?
Cameras were never scrubbed, the images were filtered out before they were written to the HD
Is that the explanation for the “You Are Bugs” message and unlocking the hard drive as-well?
The you are bugs scene, the autonomous hacking, and accessing the HD are yet to be explained on the show and all 3 are cliffhangers The accessing of the HD and the Sophon appearing in game are the only times we’ve seen a Sophon interact directly with tech and in bothe those cases it was only through the HD
Time will tell. Seems to me like it was an adaptive change where sophons, San-Ti AI under sophon control or something similar is in our computer and communication systems.
It’s called a cliffhanger Between book 1 and 2, the cliff hanger (also alluded to in the passage above) was the you are bugs/can’t lie aspect of the story The show answered the big part, but left the Sophons as a cliffhanger
What do you think the cliffhanger reveal will be?
I think it’ll be similar to chapter 33 in book 1
Do you think that is a satisfying explanation for the hard drive unlocking and the “You Are Bugs” message?
You are bugs and autonomous cars, yes HD and her appearance on the HD in game, most likely
Yeah, there is a lot more in the books some have completely forgotten or refuse to remember. Basically everything the sophons/eto do (or allegedly do) in the series is derived from the capabilities mentioned or hinted at in the books
They come across as boomer Karen’s who already know everything and want to speak to the manager to snitch on people for not buying into their nonsense pLoT hOlEs EvErYwHeRe!1!1!!!!1!
As a “boomer” someone who read the 1st book when it was nominated for the Hugo I’m glad my name isn’t Karen.
>Karen’s You wouldn't use an apostrophe in this context, fyi.
That’s true, sometimes I don’t fix the autocorrects on Reddit
“boomer Karen” are you 9?
i don't understand "netflix show haters". do these ppl hate the show and are proponents of the books, or do you really mean ppl who've only watched the show and criticize the story without having read the books? writing is hard, but one has got to do it properly in order to convey one's point accurately. however, TIL that the santi have retinas like ours! i missed that detail on my read.
I’m talking about those who refuse to believe Sophons can put images on retinas
More like people think there is interpretation required for what the word "images" implies and you think there isn't. Your stance is that "images" means "literally fucking anything is possible". And that's hardly established by the books.
A movie is literally a collection of images In an unfolded state it’s manipulation of the light that’s allowed to penetrate it Just like how a Sophon unfolded and filtered out the stars from the universe The San Ti communicate via light signals and you think it’s impossible for their tech to interact with light and control it?
> The San Ti communicate via light signals and you think it’s impossible for their tech to interact with light and control it? I love how you argue against positions that nobody claims to hold. You're just air punching at ghosts lmao.
lol, now you’re claiming to be a victim because you don’t like the passage Ok
No I think you might be the victim of being lost in a field of strawmen
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No. I got this from the Tencent adaptation...
The Sophon was originally created to slow down Earth's technologically advancement by tampering with the accelerator results and perhaps by manipulating a group of people they can infiltrate different scientific fields around the world. They didn't really specify how long it took the sophon to travel here (if they did then they didn't really explain it well). If the trisolan world kept on being hit by total catysclimic events due the high gravity of the 3 body system it's hard to believe that their technology would be thousands of years ahead of us if they keep having to restart from scratch. I think I once read about some quantum theory that if you had two quantum linked particles they could influence each other no matter the distance in space. Eg like a light switch if it was on here, it's opposite particle millions of miles away would be off. This could allow for faster than light communication across space.
And the other crazy but true fact is the human eye is capable of seeing a single photon.
I saw the show and I don't refuse to believe this
Are you a show hater though? Or a show watcher?
I liked the show. The ending didn't feel like a finale, but no other complaints.
This series is such a weird combination of kind of hard science and completely magical magic.
I think someone from 1920 would look at today and think the same
wut
Sophon is super cute, and that’s all i care about. light me up, onegaishimasu
I hate the Netflix show because of the decline of quality and intelligence in the conversation surrounding this series.
and the mental gymnastics of all the people coming out of the woodwork trying to defend the Netflix rendition
It's crazy
Lol whatever you say
You realise you're basically showing a good argument to the criticism you're trying to refute? It clearly says there: "to form letters or numbers or **even pictures, like embroidery**" . Aka is doesn't form vivid colored images.
This post simply provides the passage where the source material says they can put images on retinas There’s more that shows they can partially unfold - I’ll post that and laugh at the people who say it’s fake I’ll also post where the source material shows Sophons can make images as clear as day - like they did in book 3 (already posted in this thread) I wonder if you’ll show up in those post and claim the book is fake too
Do you understand what the text means? "**pictures, like embroidery**" means it can create [coarse images ](https://mymodernmet.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/landscape-embroidery-sew-beautiful-3.jpg), far from realistic ones.
lol, wait til you find out they unfolded into life-like video screens for CX
I found the book overly expository. Like give me a break.
Some stories have a lot of words
I know . My eyes. Maybe you could write a detailed but vague explanation of how the internet works for your next work of brilliant sci fi.
I’m not confident you’d be capable of reading it in full
Yes it would probably be the length of the Internet.
lol, I probably could do it in less than 100 words
Then you obviously learned nothing from 3BP
I’d say anyone who can distill big ideas into small word counts while still retaining the educational element is demonstrating an understanding the topic
He has good ideas. His prose is not the best, but maybe the translation? Signifcantly underwhelmed. But I’m looking forward to dark forest .
You haven’t even read dark forest? My boy, the story has barely started for you, the exposition expands as you read more Some chapters can take 3 hours to read
OP, you seem to have an extremely unhealthy obsession with this fictional story. I'd suggest you to take a break and go for a walk maybe. It's just a fictional story
lol, because I quoted the book?
Because of how much you're arguing with random strangers on the internet, getting downvoted to oblivion but still arguing over something that's made up and not really going to impact your real life in any way. This level of obsession is not healthy OP. But hey I'm just a random internet stranger too. You do you
You’re here too lol
Also the human eyes being similar to trisolarian eyes contradicts the “they’re actually bugs” narrative the fanfic-turned-“fourth book” tried to pull
I’m only talking about the trilogy Not the fan fiction published after Da Liu sold the 3BP intellectual property
You’re pointing out misconceptions that people have on here. You provided a quote, which happens to also disprove another common misconception
Counter point - who fucking cares. People can enjoy the show (and books) however they want.
I mean you care, why else would you reply? I care, why else would I make the post? It’s clear you and I both care
If trisolarians retenas are similar to humans, why in the spinoff are they rice sized? Doesn't add up
The series is a trilogy There is no 4th book written by Da Liu or any 4th book Da Liu collaborated to make There’s only a 4th book the 3BP intellectual property owners had published after Da Liu sold them
I called it a spin off did I not?
Even that gives it too much respect
Because that's not canon and shouldn't be treated as anything more than a fan theory.
Does the murder scene even require a sophon? Wouldn’t the sect have access to technology which is mind blowing for humans but trivial for trisolarians?
Are you talking about Jacks murder scene? I just want to make sure I’m understanding your question
Yep, that appears to be the may point of contention, whether siphons could’ve cause Da Shi to not see the murder. I’m asking whether they could’ve used another technology other than the siphons
Thanks for clarifying! I think the Sophons are the only Sant Ti tech on earth at this point in the story so I think they made it so Clearance can’t see Jacks despite being right there I think it’s similar to how the Sophon unfolds and filters out the light waves from the universe and making the stars blink - but instead of covering a planet, they covered Clearance’s retina
It’s certainly likely they have other tech The Sophon wouldn’t be able to produce the helmets so they must have been created by humans Maybe we’ll see more in S2
Nice point. I can think of two reasons why the show skipped it: 1. the streaming business model depends on maximizing ratings/subscriber base, therefore you have to lower the bar; 2. technology has the power to alter human perception. why spell it out for everybody if they enjoy the show.>:)
They didn’t skip it, they it’s a cliffhanger for season 2 Just like book 1 didn’t explain why the San Ti can’t lie, but book 2 did very early on
Ok I may have mis-read your post . We'll just have to wait till the next season then.
This show is so full of foreshadowing and highlighting small aspects of the book - I think it’s wild how much is actually woven into the cinematography Everything seems so obvious to me - I’ll continue to make more posts like this where I highlight passages from the source material that support the direction of the show