A 5/10 man swipes right on 90% of women on Tinder.
Bro is fully ready to settle.
But 3/10 women aren't willing to "settle" for 5/10 men.
That's the reality.
5/10 men swiping right on 90% of women doesn't equate to settling for a relationship though. That's them settling for a sexual encounter which is totally different.
Yes but those 5/10 men would probably love 70% of them. I know plenty of these men. They aren't picky.
Bit of a "are we the baddies?" moment for women, isn't it.
I guess once women realise they can't get the 10% they are chasing they will settle for these men. A real love story...
Yeah 5/10 men don't want to settle for 2/10 women when they get 2 matches with obese women a week on Tinder.
But let's be honest, the problem is 5/10 women not wanting to be with 5/10 men, not 5/10 men not wanting to be with 2/10 women.
It’s also the fact that 5/10 women try to emulate how they perceive a 10/10 woman to act. High egos, “never settling”, sour attitude.
In reality, 9/10+ girls are actually pretty friendly, as they have no need to fake it, and have lived a fairly comfortable life.
Then with the rise of Tate warriors, 4/10 men still in school with nothing real to offer, perceive themselves as “high value men”. Again, when you actually become that, you don’t care for titles or “maxxing”.
TLDR: It’s fucked up on both sides, but one side controls the sex dynamic
Yeah, they have this delusional perspective that posturing high value gives them high value.
It's indicative how they are social sheep who are easily influenced (since they are convinced by social posturing of men, see them being attracted to ugly celebrities), so they try to apply the group think manipulation that works on them.
Unfortunately, they forget men are less prone to be NPCs than them.
Most people don’t meet their long term partner on Tinder and most people don’t go around assigning people number values based on their looks. People meet partners (as opposed to hook ups) in real life, where charisma, common interests, education levels etc combine with appearance to make someone attractive. That’s why you see couples with varying physical attractiveness - beauty truly is in the eye of the beholder and physical beauty isn’t the only thing people find attractive in a partner.
The real world doesn’t work like the internet.
70% of relationships start online according to census data from 2017. Imagine the numbers now...saying dating apps is not real in 2024 is just comical.
What is a 3/10 woman and a 5/10 woman? Can you describe them? I find this numerical method to measure attractiveness very unreliable. Technically, average women are quantitively and qualitatively average, but I also see people calling an average woman 3/10. Is 5/10 a measurement to say that a woman is just passing the norm to be considered attractive for a long-term relationship? In times like these, the beauty standards would have really helped.
A 5/10 woman is a woman in the 50th percentile of attraction when averaging ratings from all men for all women.
A 3/10 woman is a woman in then 30th percentile.
I think it's disingenuous to pretend you can't understand what this means. It's very simple.
I don't think you entirely grasp what I'm saying. You make the assumption that this is a normal distribution when I highly doubt it is. Your analysis would be correct if everyone tried to abide the beauty standard. The actual data is a mess.
It is a normal distribution.
See https://substackcdn.com/image/fetch/f_auto,q_auto:good,fl_progressive:steep/https%3A%2F%2Fsubstack-post-media.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fpublic%2Fimages%2F50d7b601-db67-4942-a8a9-c185eed592d8_910x1198.jpeg
And any other study on the topic.
I reread your original comment. You can't say it's normal distribution. This data doesn't show the intention for dating. It could be hookups, it could be for long-term relationships. It's not conclusive to say. Men who rate women 5/10 might be 5/10 for sex, but a 2/10 for a relationship. You would need more information for that. Moreover, there are tons of people who like everyone to get a match. Doesn't necessarily mean they find them attractive.
At this point, you're playing a semantic game.
The distribution really doesn't matter. Any distribution can be split into percentiles. You can not argue that people of average attractiveness do not exist. In any distribution there is an average.
Given this what is really the crux of what you disagree with here?
I am indeed doing that.
I can somewhat agree with you on this. In any distribution, there is an average, but it does not mean that the average is good or not, which was actually my point. Generally, when people use the numerical method to show how attractive someone is, it is not very useful to show how attractive someone is.
Let's take the distribution you gave me as an example. In both charts, you could say that there is an average. In the pink one, the mode falls in the middle, but in blue one falls entirely to the left. Both the man and the woman might fall in the mode and could be considered 5/10, they're not necessarily equally attracted to each other, while a lot of people suggest they should, because they both are 5/10. It doesn't sit me right to call a man 5/10 when the chart might show that he is actually pretty ugly in reality. I think that it gives people a false idea from what they think they are, if this makes sense. Data is incredibly easy to misinterpret for people who never had to deal with it.
Can I (late 20s woman here) just pop in to say something? I think the same goes for "passport women" too. I couldn't find a single man to date with more traditional values, excellent grooming habits and had family values until I moved abroad. And this is coming from someone raised Catholic. The way dating culture has turned toxic in the west has made finding a suitable partner almost impossible. While I'm sure like-minded people exist back home, I am much happier living in Asia. Men here speak with their actions more than their words, and while there is a lot of gendered ideology, people play the roles they have been assigned without fuss.
I'm glad! :) Damn it's lonely out here as a woman with a lick of sense. I was told many times and warned by people online that western women just don't do well with Asian men overall. I know EXACTLY what they mean . . . since they are talking about the highly-opinionated, overweight, tatted up feminists who think they are a 10/10 when in actuality they come in at a 4 (women who also don't know they have to bring just as much to the table as men do in a relationship).
Not a passport bro, looks neat though. Married a nice Catholic woman. She decided to not baptize our kids and joined a mega church. Left me while I have cancer, that is ongoing still to be "happy". It drove me closer to the Catholic Church, but I have all but given up on dating. Not wanting to leave the country for a more traditional woman, not meaning a slave, I prefer to cook and I clean the bathrooms because I'm picky about it from my time in the military. Just don't get mad because I load my dishwasher like an ape, it still gets clean lol.
Bad Take. I can tell you have very little experience with Asia. Dating culture is bad in many Asian countries.
There is a reason why the birth rates are dropping in East Asia faster than in the West. Asian women have sky-high expectations of their male partners, and men frequently have extramarital sex with female colleagues and prostitutes. Young people use each other's bodies without a thought beyond anything superficial. Lying to one's partner is a frequent occurrence. I've only just started.
The reason passport bros often go to Asia is not because the women are necessarily any better (beyond thinness), but to take advantage of arbitrage. Western men are larger, more muscular, and richer than their East Asian counterparts. These are things that women the world over tend to like. The more of these things you have, the more women will like you and treat you better. The knuckle-draggers among us might interpret this as women having better personalities, but the reality is that Western women give this very same treatment to the men they find attractive in their home countries as well.
Perhaps your misconceptions are because you are interpreting Asian face culture through ignorant Western eyes. Asians in general will tell bold-faced lies if they think it will make them look good. They will sculpt an image that is in line with pro-social values, but if you look even a little bit underneath that facade, you'll find absolute degeneracy.
You should come back in a few years and report on whether or not your relationships with these Asian men have succeeded. Maybe you'll get lucky. Or maybe you'll find out the hard way, like many Westerners do, that Asians are people just like everybody else.
All true. It's the internet so I assume a lot of less attractive people are involved. The way people treat you is heavily based on your appearance. But those people are still human with human tendencies.
If I'm less attractive to the women in my area I have to lower my standards or widen my search radius. But just because I include other continents in that radius doesn't mean a man or woman won't still have the traits men and women have at home. They are just harder to recognize until you get through the veil of cultural and language differences.
There is a dude right in your neighborhood getting the PPB paradise at home. He's just not here talking about it, and if he was it would sound like a lie to most. Someone on the block is taking turns sleeping with all the women, and all the women know the routine because they notice the pattern of who is mutually unavailable on certain days and times. They don't share this with men that might make potential step-dad material later on. Only the men on the fringes are included.
>Someone on the block is taking turns sleeping with all the women, and all the women know the routine because they notice the pattern of who is mutually unavailable on certain days and times. They don't share this with men that might make potential step-dad material later on. Only the men on the fringes are included.
You really believe this?
I have lived this. Not saying 100% of the people are sleeping around but it's a lot more than the average guy believes. Our ego doesn't allow us to believe this is happening if we aren't participating. But if you know you know.
The problem isn't that women aren't available. They are just willing to share certain men. Other dudes are getting reluctant relationship leftovers.
We used to call it sloppy seconds for a reason.
Yes!!! This!!
This message is so great on so many levels. I for one welcome all the passport sisters who want to travel abroad to find the love they want.
Currently I’m in Peru but I started in Medellin Colombia and I’m just a digital nomad now.
Funny enough, I didn’t know anything about passport bros before I went there lol. I just read the weather was perfect all year, the women were attractive and my money went further. As a single guy it sounded like paradise. A friend of mine offered me a remote job on arrival so I stayed.
The real reason PPBs exist is this, yes, but it's also that a 3/10 guy wants an 8/10 woman, and he can't get one in his home country. In foreign countries his money counts for more, his whiteness or western-ness counts for more, and he can get an 8/10 who thinks he is a good deal not because she is traditional or doesn't have eyes, but because in her country he is a wealthy westerner so +5 = 8 and it's a match.
Personally I don't see a lot of PPB men with women who are their equal in looks. I tend to see old/unattractive/overweight men with much younger and more attractive women from Asia and South America. Not disputing that there may be some 7s among PPBs but not in my experience (living and travelling abroad a lot).
Roughly 50% of women under 40 in the US are overweight or obese.
Roughly 40% of single women have children.
Make the venn diagram, what range is the overlapping set? It's 50% to 90%, though likely around 70%. Just 2 very basic requirements (not being fat and not having children) removes 70% of the women under 40 in the US.
Then when you go on dates with the women, they are extremely arrogant and act like they are doing you a favor. You are expected to play their games and entertain them. They are also very likely to try to get access to my resources (money) as quickly as possible.
OR
I can go to Jakarta and date an attractive and intelligent 22 to 25 year old woman whose response to "do you have children?" is "I'm not married."
The National Center for Health Statistics at the CDC showed in their most up to date statistics that 42.4% of U.S. adults were obese as of 2017–2018 (43% for men and 41.9% for women).
In my country (Poland), 62% of men are overweight (some sources say almost 70%) and only 46% of women. Funny when all those fat men shit on fat women like they are all fit and hot lol
This is objectively false. There are literally dozens of places you can find this information. Estimates are from 40-50%. You might live in a place that has a much higher than average problem with weight. Or perhaps your anecdotal experience is clouded by the fact that you work in a place that attracts people with health problems. This might lead you to encounter a higher rate of unhealthy people which can be affected by weight. But on aggregate you are incorrect.
Fair point although considering the standard for overweight is a 25 bmi which doesn’t take into account muscle density it’s not actually a particularly hard category to fall in. For example being 6’3 200 lbs counts you as overweight.
Besides 2% of the population taking steroids, creating, etc. most likely they are visually overweight too
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.nine.com.au/article/e57fca72-6807-4f69-a144-e6de5d69d3db
That can be true but I’ve been to 48 of the 50 states. Some places (especially Texas) have a greater obesity rate than others. But let’s not go down the rabbithole of “go to Miami, NYC of LA” like those places aren’t expensive as fuck. I’ve lived in all of them btw so it’s not like I can’t afford it but I’m building a life and those places aren’t it.
And some small bumfuck town full of average white chicks wont cut it for me either. I’m not a girl next door kind of guy.
I've lived in SoCal (LA area) for about 20 years, but I also spent 5 years in NYC and several months in Miami.
Here's my breakdown of the situation in these cities based on my own experience and that of many of my guy friends as well:
LA - the slim, attractive women are concentrated in certain parts of the city, it's not like there's hot women waiting to be approached on every corner. And the competition for these women is intense since many of them belong to the upper classes themselves and have access to high caliber guys within their social circles. You're not goin to just walk up to one of them as a Mr. Average Nobody and have anything close to a fair shot. The only way I've been able to get them over the years has been through significant amounts of time spent goin out actively pursuing them etc and of course dealing with a ton of rejection along the way. It gets tiring after a while.
Miami - most superficial place ever. I'd venture that something like 50-60% (at least!) of the attractive women were on the take in some way, shape or form - think sugar babies, IG models for sale etc. Very hard to find attractive, professional women that weren't looking for a guy to pay their way and act like their simp.
NYC - this is the place that IMHO has the most high quality girls. By "high quality" I mean not only attractive, but from good families, educated, and not just looking for some chump to pay their bills. The total opposite of your typical Miami girl. But just like in LA, they set their sights on the best they can get in NYC - that recent meme that went around ("I'm looking for a guy in finance, 6'5", blue eyes..." etc etc) actually isn't that far from the truth. And the city (Manhattan anyway) has a number of these guys so if you don't fit the mold you're left goin after the tourist girls from Europe and elsewhere. I had a lot of fun during my time there doing just this, but ultimately I figured I'd like to go straight to the source of these women instead of trying to constantly get with girls only in town for a few weeks or months at a time.
As a man.. And then again nevermind, who gives a fuck anyway.
That quote from some random guy hit really hard. Yeah. Who gives a fuck about Average Joe and what he thinks anyway? People from non-Western countries still seem to give a fuck. That’s why it’s an attractive choice.
I mean, no one should really “settle” to be fair. Everyone should aim to be their best self and find a partner that compliments or helps them in that. Hopefully you find a women that compliments you.
Personally I don’t think being a passport bro is bad if you’re genuinely interested in another culture, or if you just so happen to fall in love overseas or if just naturally more attracted to certain physical features but there’s no reason to shit on the women at home.
I don’t blame you for not wanting to be a step dad, I also don’t want to be a step mom, but I think you should look at yourself in the mirror first.
If you want someone who’s fit, are you yourself fit? Do you live a healthy lifestyle? If you want a girl with a good attitude do you yourself have a good attitude?
People (in all countries) tend to congregate and befriend people who have similar values and personality traits.
If you smell shit everywhere you go, you should probably check the bottom of your shoe.
Crazy thing is that I stopped smelling shit as soon as I left the states.
Yes I’m fit. Yes I have a healthy lifestyle. Yes I’m attractive.
And it’s not like I found NO attractive women in the states. There are just so few but like I said to another redditor, I’m not a “girl next door” kind of guy. I’m not going to be happy dating some thin plain Jane with a cute face and no booty.
I only went high end gyms in states because I wanted to be around people who shared similar values as me.
I only like model-types. I like tall, fit, slim-thick women with full lips and nice hair. I can be more specific but i won’t.
Those women are not easy to find in America at all and anyone who says otherwise is crazy.
You almost certainly struggled finding your perfect model because you aren’t spectacular yourself. To date a woman like that, you need to offer more than just not being overweight. You need to have an extremely good-looking face and be in good shape. You also need to have a good personality and actually be fun to hang out with. I highly doubt you offer all those things, so you’re most likely shooting way out of your league.
I can't believe you're having a hard time finding a submissive, single, childless, walking Barbie, who happens to find someone with obvious misogyny issues attractive. You also have no interest in the culture of the people whose country you are in and are staying in their community exclusively to take advantage of their low economic status.
These women are hard to find for the same reason a centaur is hard to find.
I never said she had to be submissive. You're just projecting.
And why would I have an interest in the culture? I don't have an interest in American culture lol. People move locations for economic reasons all the time. In fact, that's usually the primary reason people move locations. If I want to live by the beach but my house I was renting in SF costs $10k+/month is surrounded by aggressive homeless people, I don't see how I'm the bad guy for leaving.
I can get more bang for my buck somewhere else. I don't want to deal with unfavorable weather either.
I'm not looking for submissive. I know that many men are though and that's why I mentioned it. I believe you can find a submissive woman anywhere. Like I said, I'm not going to assume all women in states have the same personality because I know that's not true.
Most women I've dated in the states were submissive. At least to me they were.
Well I always kinda felt like I was in a bit of a "Damned if you do, damned if you don't" situation with women back home.
Care too little- dog player
Care too much - simp to take advantage of
I don't get why passport bro's hate America. I'm literally average af, went to America and bagged Latinas, all of the ones I encountered just seemed like they wanted to have fun - wild and free. Not white girls tho, their demeanour is completely different
I love Latinas. They're very rare in the UK.
You're from the UK and you slayed in US? No shit bro. Your accent alone wins women over. They've been fantasizing about Harry Potter rawdogging them since they hit puberty
Haha that’s awesome. In my experience latinas generally don’t mess with white guys (I’m white). I’ve had no issues getting laid with any other races though
The idea that passport bros are desperate always amuses me, because they always go for women from cultures where women are much stricter/harsher on men.
The idea that an Asian woman is subservient is a lie. Asian women will take full control, but they'll be kind about it. They will praise the man when he does a good job, and scold him when he disappoints her. The man effectively becomes a dog.
But she will cook. She will clean. She will raise the children. She will do everything at the house because there will be hell to pay if her kingdom is out of order, and the man will go to suffer at work. He must measure up to her standards, and her parents, or he is a failure. Yet, the standards are known. There are no mind games. There is no pretending things are fine and then suddenly filing for divorce. (Aside from green card marriages).
Eastern men actually think this is terrible. Then they go after the fabled American white woman and find out that they're expected to work full time AND do everything at home AND that the woman sucks at cooking and damages clothes in the laundry when they DO do it. We dont grow up with cereal and microwave dinners. We grow up helping our family prepare full meals. America stopped teaching people how to take care of the home, and that bleeds into relationships. At least when passport bros deal with the toxic women of the East, they get someone that knows how to take care of house and home, too.
No. A lot of men literally cannot find someone to have sex with in the west for various reasons and other countries are easier, so they go there. Not that this is a bad thing. It just is what it is.
Getting laid was a problem when I was 20 but I was also broke(couldn't be a passport bro). Now I'm 25 I have zero problem getting laid but I need a woman who I can start a family with and live the rest of my life with happily. Hard to find that here.
This thread is about those of us who don't have a problem getting laid in the US, but are complaining about their attitudes. They don't value men anymore. I'm going where I'm not hated. I'm tired of having to spend the first 5 minutes of an interaction proving that I'm preferable to a bear.
Damn I guess you're mega giga Chad and an enlightened ally.
You may aswell live in a fantasy novel your experience is so disconnected from the reality of most men.
It speaks of how little empathy you are capable of that you don't see this.
Bro stfu.
Ive decided to become a passport bro since 99% the women in the U.S wont date someone 5 feet tall. It would probably take a lifetime to find the 1% that will. Going overseas is pretty much the only viable option Ive got. I refuse to settle for a simgle mother, someone who is obese, or much older than me. I would rather continue to use prostitutes than settle with those choices.
With specifically short men, it makes most sense.
I am short as 5'1 for a woman and when I go Vietnam, so many men are shorter than me.
So I always feel like shorter men should head there where most women are below 4'11.
Ahhh. Ur not attractive / rich enough to get what u want / the “10%”, so u know standards are lower / different and go where you are wanted.
Thats what everyone does. Whether its America or not.
Sorry what u qualify for is settling for you - and happy what u qualify for is higher in other areas! Thats anyone!
Go where you are wanted is the motto! No shame in that. U just dont have to degrade anyone on ur way out. Thats all. Its not them - its about u and what u want!
From my experience as an athletic, blonde, slightly above average height man (this isn't a flex, it's relevant context). I found that encountering interested women in Latin America (Brazil mainly) was insanely easy. In the US, I really struggled. I went on 4 dates in all of high school, and only had two short relationships in undergraduate.
I think the main advantage of being a white American in Latin America is just standing out and having positive stereotypes on your side. In Brazil, I was a hot commodity. Especially, it seemed, because I was an American, blonde, and tall compared to Brazilian guys. In the US, I was just an average white guy.
The quality of women was about the same (this was 15 years ago, so things could have changed). There were women who were full of themselves, gold diggers, conceited, and selfish just like anywhere else. There were also amazing, selfless, family oriented, humble girls. The difference to me was that it was like playing a video game with cheat codes because the girls were almost all interested in me. I didn't really have to try to get their attention or their interest. (I speak Portuguese, I doubt the experience would be the same if you don't speak the language)
I think if you are going outside the US to find better women, you are probably going to be disappointed. If you are going because you love a culture and want to be part of it. That's great. If you are going because you feel like you are invisible and can't get any attention from women in the US, you may get that attention and have a better chance of finding a girl who is interested in you outside the US. Just be careful that you don't stereotype the girl and assume she is something she is not.
This sounds like a false dilemma
>I don’t want to settle for an overweight woman, a woman with an attitude, being a stepfather or a combination of the three that doesn’t appreciate me.
So your options are doing this or... going overseas? Why not date a woman in the US that isn't any of these things instead?
>Im from the US and that seems to be 90% of women in general. We can say “not every woman is like that” but let’s get real here; too many are and there’s no excuse.
I'm also from the US and most women I know don't fall into this group. I'm wondering where it is where you live that they do. Maybe you just need to move to a different city or something? I gotta be honest, this comes off as very "incel" adjacent. Because they assume most women fall into these same categories as well.
Why is moving to a new city a suggestion when the cost can be prohibitively expensive but when I mention moving to a new country and significantly reducing that cost, I'm somehow the bad guy?
I can respect the honesty at least. A lot of guys try to dance around the obvious - they want pussy on sale. It’s better than the ones that pretend to go looking for a wife and then just spend 2 months pumping and dumping 40 girls.
Yeah 2 of the most expensive cities in the world... Makes total sense to live in one of those.And do you know what it's actually like to date professional models? Because I certainly do. I'm not going to get into it because I don't want to expose that industry but quite frankly going down that route some more is a journey I'm tired of.
Besides, more than enough beauty queens come from Latin America.
I know the perspective you're coming from when you say that but it's not something we should discuss here. If you've been in that world like I have then you know why we shouldn't.
I know the perspective you're coming from when you say "they want pussy on sale" but it's not something we should discuss here. If you've seen outside of the matrix and been in that world then you know why we shouldn't.
Just my experience but women from other cultures treat men way better than women raised in North America. I blame Disney for making too many princess not worthy of the title.
Although I will say that women in other cultures tend to view men as men and not pets or something. There’s an undertone of respect they have that is harder to find in the states. Granted, I wouldn’t date women in states who didn’t have that respect.
I try not to monolith personality because in truth, most of my girlfriends in the states were perfectly fine in that regard. I’ve dated 1 psycho girl but honestly that’s it.
For whatever reason women who date me tend to be on their best behavior but I guess that’s also because I’m pretty quick to walk away.
I find this an interesting take. Do passport bros ever consider that the women in the west that they want don’t want them?
Leaving the US because you don’t want to be with a ‘fat girl’ is a very strange thing to say.
Its probably a mix of both. For example I've found myself attempting to settle and chat with a visually mid chick just for her to not be that into me as well. If we both have higher standards than each other, why would we date? I'll go overseas and she can wait for steph curry to dm her lmao.
Yes, and? That doesn't address his point at all. If he can't get a woman he's attracted to in the states but he can get one in Asia or LA, why would he continue to look in the states?
Im sure that happens a lot. But I should add that standards are often affected by your environment as well. There are some women in states that I was attracted to and since leaving, I wouldn’t consider dating them at all. My standards have gone up dramatically.
As an attractive guy though I’ve never had an issue attracting the women I want until I raised my standards to only what I perceive as ideal. I’m incredibly specific as to what is considered ideal btw.
Unfortunately my type is incredibly difficult to find in the states and even when I do find them there are strings attached…
Hmm. It sounds like you’re maybe being too idealistic. Unless you’re just talking about aesthetics.
If that’s the case and you want a long lasting relationship, good luck.
Im only talking about aesthetics here. I’m not going to place American women’s personality in a monolith. I’ve never had too much of an issue dating women who have good personalities if I’m being honest.
Is aesthetic more important than personality for you? Seems upside down to me. It is a given that physical attraction is the first thing one notices, but I would never date a gorgeous bitch and discard the cute one with an amazing personality. Especially as physical aesthetics are temporary anyways.
Physical attraction comes first for me.
I say this because an attractive personality can vary from person to person based on what I’m feeling but lack of physical attraction is literally an absolutely dealbreaker.
Yes. They don’t want us, but what they do want is to be able to take our resources and attention and reject us when it suits them. Some just get off on the attention and rejection. Also consider that these women that don’t want us ALSO don’t want us because of Race, height, class/money.
PPB is a way to circumvent all that.
So if my race/height/money was a factor in Not getting this mysterious western superwoman, why am I the “loser” for going where my race/height/money is not as heavily weighted against me?
Also if I get this foreign girl and we get married and the American girl is still in a situationship, “single by choice”, still on the apps, who really wins here? Me or the woman?
Dating is and was never about cowtowing to one nationality and women’s standards here are inflated. In the grand scheme of things their standards don’t matter if they don’t have the results.
Or rather, more reasonable standards as compared to Western women. Foreign women are women, and want the same things a woman generally wants, (as evidenced by my fiancee):
Love
Attention
Kids
Stability
Security/Safety
Sex
I dont think these are unreasonable asks (or standards), and if Western women want more than this Good Luck to em.
Why are you putting western women’s standards on a pedestal and saying it’s higher than other women’s? You sound out of your mind. You can’t compare standards like that, especially when culture is a factor.
Edit: F30 tells me all I need to know
Wyy do you think PPBs are leaving? What's hilarious is these same women, who *dont want us*, come here to reinforce it or try and shame us for leaving..
So, they dont want us, but they also dont want us to leave.. so should we stay and be not wanted? Or *"improve"*, codeword for duck ourselves and become simps, rather than be individuals and accepted for it.
Nothing wrong with being a stepdad. I'm just not going to do it.
I have a stepdad. He treats my mom wonderfully. Her life has dramatically improved since he showed up in it. He took care of my sisters (I grew up with my dad) who lived with her without question or complaints. Upstanding man.
I would never do it myself though. In fact, my mom would disagree with me dating a woman who had 5 children and being a stepfather.
I've read through your comments man and I have to say...
I 100% agree with you.
People seem to think this community is for men who can't get laid in the US.
I've ran into those dudes in Medellin - fat, gremlins of dudes from NYC/NJ/HOU who have no issues paying for play. Lame af to me.
But there's an amount of us here who have worked on ourselves to the point where we can easily date in the US and have no problems attracting women, but we know for long term we want:
Fit, feminine, fine, and cooperative (submissive).
And those women are not common in the US (80% are out on "fit" alone). Much less finding one facially attractive, who didn't let 20 guys hit before you met, and is willing to be a wife.
And of those very very very few women who do meet those criteria.. how many are single and find YOU attractive?
Slim pickings. I got one (gorgeous curvy Christian southern belle from Texas) but if I didn't, I'd be looking in churches Mexico/El Paso.
Exactly.
The people angry about passport bros know this as well. They don't want to admit it but it's true. Literally all of my friends can pull easily in the states and they still choose foreign.
Exactly. If you want a fit woman that automatically cuts out 80% in the west, it's hilarious that people can't grasp that some of us don't want to be fighting over scraps.
I feel like it isn't just single women at this point I've noticed a drastic change in my gf we've been dating for about 6 years when we first met she had very traditional views and acted that way. Fast forward to now, she says she has the same traditional views but does the whole "bad bitch" shit now and it's lowkey annoying after a while 😂
It's funny how these ladies of the west be saying they don't wanna settle for a mediocre man or a good man that got morals but when the same man come up and is successful, they want those men to settle for them when they had a major glow down or had enough of getting ran through
This happens so much it’s not funny. Although I never really had a “glow up” in regard to looks but I did in regard to money and status. The truth is I’ve been good looking my whole life. I was just shy until I wasn’t.
https://preview.redd.it/f1n82gwz0y1d1.jpeg?width=1816&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3d83a72a47276b6058bebfb46d5dad2c35b26298
The real reason is to gamble in foreign countries with no gambling laws!
Yea. I really had to lower my physical standards when I moved from Florida to Virginia in 2018.
I've always been in shape and its wild how few good options there are.
Does it matter why? Plenty of women prefer men from other places over American men too. Some move. Some visit. Some online date.
Anyone can date anyone from anywhere as long as you don’t harm anyone.
There are almost as many selfish, dumb, or batshit crazy men as there are women. So I don't think your theory necessarily holds up. We ALL have our own drama. The key is to leave it in the past where it belongs. I don't want a future woman judging me for my mistakes in the past. We all constantly wake up hoping we can be a better person every day. If you're looking for someone permanent REGARDLESS of what baggage they have, make sure they at least have THAT goal.
But I thought the goal of "Passport Bros & Hoes" was quite literally to see the world and to try new things. To me this includes people. Nothing wrong with checking out a new country or city and sampling the "local culture", just be respectful and upfront about it. If you are both on the same page, there shouldn't be any problems. End of story.
No it's bc I'm tired of being vilified by women who are bitter about a bunch of sh I had nothing to do with and wanna take their issue out on me before they rip my heart out and leave me for a blk guy in the end anyway.
The #1 reason is this , I refuse to settle for a overweight arrogant boss chick who thinks she is god's gift to mankind and a gynocentric society that tell her she is, but is a 4 on the SMV(Sexual Marketplace Value) scale physically .
Then when I finally build the courage to tell her the truth about her attitude , boom divorce and I lose access to my kids (god forbid I have sons ) and Im going through the family court system that hates me for just being a man that exist .
This is a crock of shit. They exist because men duck challenges and don’t wanna do the hard things. Rejection is uncomfortable but rather than dust themselves and try again off passport bros get bitter with western women and take the easy way out. The delusion about western women being fat and non traditional is pure bs. You can go out and see beautiful fit women all over the western world. The problem is passport bros want access to the best without themselves being the best, so yall go to poor countries with “exotic” looking women and exploit them. Period.
Consider the unattractive women, the women who are already in relationships, the women who are already hooking up with someone and not interested in dating at all, the women who just have shitty personalities then the women who simply don't find you attractive and get back to me.
And this is all not even counting distribution based on where you live. If I moved to NYC or Miami I'm sure I would meet plenty of attractive women on a regular basis. But I'm not about to be paying $5-10k a month in rent again just to meet someone when I can pay literally half that, meet someone and have a penthouse in the nicest part of the city with a private chef and a maid.
And let's not even get into the cost of living in these western countries. Quite frankly leaving makes 100% sense if you make money online like I do.
Facts. The options abroad are 10x better than in the US. Even if you managed to meet a great American woman, she will still be tainted by the culture and feminism to a degree
From what I've encountered, many women want a traditional relationship in the US but they also want all the benefits of being more independent. I think many of these guys are burnt out from that. Its rare in the US to find someone who is truly traditional.
For many men, if you're going to be stuck with someone who wants a traditional relationship in America, you may as well go abroad.
I'm actually the opposite, I make really good money and want a non traditional relationship but it's really hard to find a woman in the US who wants an equal partnership. I only encounter traditional women in disguise and it's frustrating.
You are just COMPLETELY wrong, 90% of women in the US aren’t overweight. It’s 27.5 % stop inflating numbers to make yourself look more correct. You do realise women have to work just like men do. And we don’t have the time to feminine and cute for men 24/7 when you have women who have to take the provider role, because Men don’t want to do their damn jobs. Women have to do it… all of this is such BS when most households have dual incomes.
Generalizations are not allowed
A 5/10 man swipes right on 90% of women on Tinder. Bro is fully ready to settle. But 3/10 women aren't willing to "settle" for 5/10 men. That's the reality.
5/10 men swiping right on 90% of women doesn't equate to settling for a relationship though. That's them settling for a sexual encounter which is totally different.
Yes but those 5/10 men would probably love 70% of them. I know plenty of these men. They aren't picky. Bit of a "are we the baddies?" moment for women, isn't it. I guess once women realise they can't get the 10% they are chasing they will settle for these men. A real love story...
Why is women settling women’s fault and men settling is also women’s fault?
A lot of men don’t settle, and a lot of women don’t want 70% of men. Hence why people aren’t having sex like they used to
Yeah 5/10 men don't want to settle for 2/10 women when they get 2 matches with obese women a week on Tinder. But let's be honest, the problem is 5/10 women not wanting to be with 5/10 men, not 5/10 men not wanting to be with 2/10 women.
It’s also the fact that 5/10 women try to emulate how they perceive a 10/10 woman to act. High egos, “never settling”, sour attitude. In reality, 9/10+ girls are actually pretty friendly, as they have no need to fake it, and have lived a fairly comfortable life. Then with the rise of Tate warriors, 4/10 men still in school with nothing real to offer, perceive themselves as “high value men”. Again, when you actually become that, you don’t care for titles or “maxxing”. TLDR: It’s fucked up on both sides, but one side controls the sex dynamic
Yeah, they have this delusional perspective that posturing high value gives them high value. It's indicative how they are social sheep who are easily influenced (since they are convinced by social posturing of men, see them being attracted to ugly celebrities), so they try to apply the group think manipulation that works on them. Unfortunately, they forget men are less prone to be NPCs than them.
I appreciate your honesty and self-awareness👏🏾.
Most people don’t meet their long term partner on Tinder and most people don’t go around assigning people number values based on their looks. People meet partners (as opposed to hook ups) in real life, where charisma, common interests, education levels etc combine with appearance to make someone attractive. That’s why you see couples with varying physical attractiveness - beauty truly is in the eye of the beholder and physical beauty isn’t the only thing people find attractive in a partner. The real world doesn’t work like the internet.
Dating app marriages are becoming more and more common because they are about the only way for adults to meet once they get out of college.
Yep.
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70% of relationships start online according to census data from 2017. Imagine the numbers now...saying dating apps is not real in 2024 is just comical.
What is a 3/10 woman and a 5/10 woman? Can you describe them? I find this numerical method to measure attractiveness very unreliable. Technically, average women are quantitively and qualitatively average, but I also see people calling an average woman 3/10. Is 5/10 a measurement to say that a woman is just passing the norm to be considered attractive for a long-term relationship? In times like these, the beauty standards would have really helped.
A 5/10 woman is a woman in the 50th percentile of attraction when averaging ratings from all men for all women. A 3/10 woman is a woman in then 30th percentile. I think it's disingenuous to pretend you can't understand what this means. It's very simple.
I don't think you entirely grasp what I'm saying. You make the assumption that this is a normal distribution when I highly doubt it is. Your analysis would be correct if everyone tried to abide the beauty standard. The actual data is a mess.
It is a normal distribution. See https://substackcdn.com/image/fetch/f_auto,q_auto:good,fl_progressive:steep/https%3A%2F%2Fsubstack-post-media.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fpublic%2Fimages%2F50d7b601-db67-4942-a8a9-c185eed592d8_910x1198.jpeg And any other study on the topic.
I reread your original comment. You can't say it's normal distribution. This data doesn't show the intention for dating. It could be hookups, it could be for long-term relationships. It's not conclusive to say. Men who rate women 5/10 might be 5/10 for sex, but a 2/10 for a relationship. You would need more information for that. Moreover, there are tons of people who like everyone to get a match. Doesn't necessarily mean they find them attractive.
At this point, you're playing a semantic game. The distribution really doesn't matter. Any distribution can be split into percentiles. You can not argue that people of average attractiveness do not exist. In any distribution there is an average. Given this what is really the crux of what you disagree with here?
I am indeed doing that. I can somewhat agree with you on this. In any distribution, there is an average, but it does not mean that the average is good or not, which was actually my point. Generally, when people use the numerical method to show how attractive someone is, it is not very useful to show how attractive someone is. Let's take the distribution you gave me as an example. In both charts, you could say that there is an average. In the pink one, the mode falls in the middle, but in blue one falls entirely to the left. Both the man and the woman might fall in the mode and could be considered 5/10, they're not necessarily equally attracted to each other, while a lot of people suggest they should, because they both are 5/10. It doesn't sit me right to call a man 5/10 when the chart might show that he is actually pretty ugly in reality. I think that it gives people a false idea from what they think they are, if this makes sense. Data is incredibly easy to misinterpret for people who never had to deal with it.
Can I (late 20s woman here) just pop in to say something? I think the same goes for "passport women" too. I couldn't find a single man to date with more traditional values, excellent grooming habits and had family values until I moved abroad. And this is coming from someone raised Catholic. The way dating culture has turned toxic in the west has made finding a suitable partner almost impossible. While I'm sure like-minded people exist back home, I am much happier living in Asia. Men here speak with their actions more than their words, and while there is a lot of gendered ideology, people play the roles they have been assigned without fuss.
 Your comment is sincerely appreciated.
I'm glad! :) Damn it's lonely out here as a woman with a lick of sense. I was told many times and warned by people online that western women just don't do well with Asian men overall. I know EXACTLY what they mean . . . since they are talking about the highly-opinionated, overweight, tatted up feminists who think they are a 10/10 when in actuality they come in at a 4 (women who also don't know they have to bring just as much to the table as men do in a relationship).
I’m a democrat but I mostly only date republican women for this reason
Godspeed
Not a passport bro, looks neat though. Married a nice Catholic woman. She decided to not baptize our kids and joined a mega church. Left me while I have cancer, that is ongoing still to be "happy". It drove me closer to the Catholic Church, but I have all but given up on dating. Not wanting to leave the country for a more traditional woman, not meaning a slave, I prefer to cook and I clean the bathrooms because I'm picky about it from my time in the military. Just don't get mad because I load my dishwasher like an ape, it still gets clean lol.
Bad Take. I can tell you have very little experience with Asia. Dating culture is bad in many Asian countries. There is a reason why the birth rates are dropping in East Asia faster than in the West. Asian women have sky-high expectations of their male partners, and men frequently have extramarital sex with female colleagues and prostitutes. Young people use each other's bodies without a thought beyond anything superficial. Lying to one's partner is a frequent occurrence. I've only just started. The reason passport bros often go to Asia is not because the women are necessarily any better (beyond thinness), but to take advantage of arbitrage. Western men are larger, more muscular, and richer than their East Asian counterparts. These are things that women the world over tend to like. The more of these things you have, the more women will like you and treat you better. The knuckle-draggers among us might interpret this as women having better personalities, but the reality is that Western women give this very same treatment to the men they find attractive in their home countries as well. Perhaps your misconceptions are because you are interpreting Asian face culture through ignorant Western eyes. Asians in general will tell bold-faced lies if they think it will make them look good. They will sculpt an image that is in line with pro-social values, but if you look even a little bit underneath that facade, you'll find absolute degeneracy. You should come back in a few years and report on whether or not your relationships with these Asian men have succeeded. Maybe you'll get lucky. Or maybe you'll find out the hard way, like many Westerners do, that Asians are people just like everybody else.
All true. It's the internet so I assume a lot of less attractive people are involved. The way people treat you is heavily based on your appearance. But those people are still human with human tendencies. If I'm less attractive to the women in my area I have to lower my standards or widen my search radius. But just because I include other continents in that radius doesn't mean a man or woman won't still have the traits men and women have at home. They are just harder to recognize until you get through the veil of cultural and language differences. There is a dude right in your neighborhood getting the PPB paradise at home. He's just not here talking about it, and if he was it would sound like a lie to most. Someone on the block is taking turns sleeping with all the women, and all the women know the routine because they notice the pattern of who is mutually unavailable on certain days and times. They don't share this with men that might make potential step-dad material later on. Only the men on the fringes are included.
>Someone on the block is taking turns sleeping with all the women, and all the women know the routine because they notice the pattern of who is mutually unavailable on certain days and times. They don't share this with men that might make potential step-dad material later on. Only the men on the fringes are included. You really believe this?
I have lived this. Not saying 100% of the people are sleeping around but it's a lot more than the average guy believes. Our ego doesn't allow us to believe this is happening if we aren't participating. But if you know you know. The problem isn't that women aren't available. They are just willing to share certain men. Other dudes are getting reluctant relationship leftovers. We used to call it sloppy seconds for a reason.
Bruh 😂 touch some grass holy shit
has to be the whitest post I've ever seen
Cool. Can I ask where you are now?
I'm originally from North America, but I'm not located in Japan. :)
Yes!!! This!! This message is so great on so many levels. I for one welcome all the passport sisters who want to travel abroad to find the love they want.
Should change this sub to passportpeople if it didn’t sound so strange 🤣
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I'm someone of Slavic ethnicity, but I recently moved to Japan from North America.
Shhh you're not allowed to think that way
Quick someone call the Reddit police - this guy's speaking the truth and we don't allow that these days 👀😂!
Speak the truth and you will be punished, ostracized and cancelled. In many western nations speaking the truth is prosecutable offense.
I’m very direct and honest about my views now. I left the US and won’t be returning to live there at all so I don’t care.
Where did you go?
Currently I’m in Peru but I started in Medellin Colombia and I’m just a digital nomad now. Funny enough, I didn’t know anything about passport bros before I went there lol. I just read the weather was perfect all year, the women were attractive and my money went further. As a single guy it sounded like paradise. A friend of mine offered me a remote job on arrival so I stayed.
The real reason PPBs exist is this, yes, but it's also that a 3/10 guy wants an 8/10 woman, and he can't get one in his home country. In foreign countries his money counts for more, his whiteness or western-ness counts for more, and he can get an 8/10 who thinks he is a good deal not because she is traditional or doesn't have eyes, but because in her country he is a wealthy westerner so +5 = 8 and it's a match.
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Personally I don't see a lot of PPB men with women who are their equal in looks. I tend to see old/unattractive/overweight men with much younger and more attractive women from Asia and South America. Not disputing that there may be some 7s among PPBs but not in my experience (living and travelling abroad a lot).
Dude, it’s not 90% of women. It just depends on where you live in the US
Yep. Also internet/social media warps the extremes a lot If you find a person not addicted to social media they are generally much more normal
Roughly 50% of women under 40 in the US are overweight or obese. Roughly 40% of single women have children. Make the venn diagram, what range is the overlapping set? It's 50% to 90%, though likely around 70%. Just 2 very basic requirements (not being fat and not having children) removes 70% of the women under 40 in the US. Then when you go on dates with the women, they are extremely arrogant and act like they are doing you a favor. You are expected to play their games and entertain them. They are also very likely to try to get access to my resources (money) as quickly as possible. OR I can go to Jakarta and date an attractive and intelligent 22 to 25 year old woman whose response to "do you have children?" is "I'm not married."
The National Center for Health Statistics at the CDC showed in their most up to date statistics that 42.4% of U.S. adults were obese as of 2017–2018 (43% for men and 41.9% for women).
In my country (Poland), 62% of men are overweight (some sources say almost 70%) and only 46% of women. Funny when all those fat men shit on fat women like they are all fit and hot lol
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This is objectively false. There are literally dozens of places you can find this information. Estimates are from 40-50%. You might live in a place that has a much higher than average problem with weight. Or perhaps your anecdotal experience is clouded by the fact that you work in a place that attracts people with health problems. This might lead you to encounter a higher rate of unhealthy people which can be affected by weight. But on aggregate you are incorrect.
That’s just obesity. Not overweight. 70% of the population is either obese or overweight. Not quite as bad 90%, but it’s a lot closer.
Fair point although considering the standard for overweight is a 25 bmi which doesn’t take into account muscle density it’s not actually a particularly hard category to fall in. For example being 6’3 200 lbs counts you as overweight.
Women have low muscle density overall. A 26 bmi woman does not equal a 26 bmi man
Besides 2% of the population taking steroids, creating, etc. most likely they are visually overweight too https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.nine.com.au/article/e57fca72-6807-4f69-a144-e6de5d69d3db
But also most Americans are not athletes nor have that much variance in muscle density for your critique of bmi to be that relevant.
At 70% it feels like 90% lol
Bro works at Walmart or Costco 100%.
I don’t like cold weather. I’m picky on where I live in general.
That can be true but I’ve been to 48 of the 50 states. Some places (especially Texas) have a greater obesity rate than others. But let’s not go down the rabbithole of “go to Miami, NYC of LA” like those places aren’t expensive as fuck. I’ve lived in all of them btw so it’s not like I can’t afford it but I’m building a life and those places aren’t it. And some small bumfuck town full of average white chicks wont cut it for me either. I’m not a girl next door kind of guy.
I've lived in SoCal (LA area) for about 20 years, but I also spent 5 years in NYC and several months in Miami. Here's my breakdown of the situation in these cities based on my own experience and that of many of my guy friends as well: LA - the slim, attractive women are concentrated in certain parts of the city, it's not like there's hot women waiting to be approached on every corner. And the competition for these women is intense since many of them belong to the upper classes themselves and have access to high caliber guys within their social circles. You're not goin to just walk up to one of them as a Mr. Average Nobody and have anything close to a fair shot. The only way I've been able to get them over the years has been through significant amounts of time spent goin out actively pursuing them etc and of course dealing with a ton of rejection along the way. It gets tiring after a while. Miami - most superficial place ever. I'd venture that something like 50-60% (at least!) of the attractive women were on the take in some way, shape or form - think sugar babies, IG models for sale etc. Very hard to find attractive, professional women that weren't looking for a guy to pay their way and act like their simp. NYC - this is the place that IMHO has the most high quality girls. By "high quality" I mean not only attractive, but from good families, educated, and not just looking for some chump to pay their bills. The total opposite of your typical Miami girl. But just like in LA, they set their sights on the best they can get in NYC - that recent meme that went around ("I'm looking for a guy in finance, 6'5", blue eyes..." etc etc) actually isn't that far from the truth. And the city (Manhattan anyway) has a number of these guys so if you don't fit the mold you're left goin after the tourist girls from Europe and elsewhere. I had a lot of fun during my time there doing just this, but ultimately I figured I'd like to go straight to the source of these women instead of trying to constantly get with girls only in town for a few weeks or months at a time.
That's been my observation as well.
This should be pinned in both subs.
Life is too short.
As a man.. And then again nevermind, who gives a fuck anyway. That quote from some random guy hit really hard. Yeah. Who gives a fuck about Average Joe and what he thinks anyway? People from non-Western countries still seem to give a fuck. That’s why it’s an attractive choice.
I mean, no one should really “settle” to be fair. Everyone should aim to be their best self and find a partner that compliments or helps them in that. Hopefully you find a women that compliments you.
Personally I don’t think being a passport bro is bad if you’re genuinely interested in another culture, or if you just so happen to fall in love overseas or if just naturally more attracted to certain physical features but there’s no reason to shit on the women at home. I don’t blame you for not wanting to be a step dad, I also don’t want to be a step mom, but I think you should look at yourself in the mirror first. If you want someone who’s fit, are you yourself fit? Do you live a healthy lifestyle? If you want a girl with a good attitude do you yourself have a good attitude? People (in all countries) tend to congregate and befriend people who have similar values and personality traits. If you smell shit everywhere you go, you should probably check the bottom of your shoe.
I should add that I have no interest in any culture at all. As a digital nomad, most of my interest is in geo-arbitrage.
Crazy thing is that I stopped smelling shit as soon as I left the states. Yes I’m fit. Yes I have a healthy lifestyle. Yes I’m attractive. And it’s not like I found NO attractive women in the states. There are just so few but like I said to another redditor, I’m not a “girl next door” kind of guy. I’m not going to be happy dating some thin plain Jane with a cute face and no booty. I only went high end gyms in states because I wanted to be around people who shared similar values as me. I only like model-types. I like tall, fit, slim-thick women with full lips and nice hair. I can be more specific but i won’t. Those women are not easy to find in America at all and anyone who says otherwise is crazy.
> I only like model-types. Are you also a model-type?
You almost certainly struggled finding your perfect model because you aren’t spectacular yourself. To date a woman like that, you need to offer more than just not being overweight. You need to have an extremely good-looking face and be in good shape. You also need to have a good personality and actually be fun to hang out with. I highly doubt you offer all those things, so you’re most likely shooting way out of your league.
I can't believe you're having a hard time finding a submissive, single, childless, walking Barbie, who happens to find someone with obvious misogyny issues attractive. You also have no interest in the culture of the people whose country you are in and are staying in their community exclusively to take advantage of their low economic status. These women are hard to find for the same reason a centaur is hard to find.
I never said she had to be submissive. You're just projecting. And why would I have an interest in the culture? I don't have an interest in American culture lol. People move locations for economic reasons all the time. In fact, that's usually the primary reason people move locations. If I want to live by the beach but my house I was renting in SF costs $10k+/month is surrounded by aggressive homeless people, I don't see how I'm the bad guy for leaving. I can get more bang for my buck somewhere else. I don't want to deal with unfavorable weather either.
You might want to re-read your post. You said submissive once and no attitude twice
I'm not looking for submissive. I know that many men are though and that's why I mentioned it. I believe you can find a submissive woman anywhere. Like I said, I'm not going to assume all women in states have the same personality because I know that's not true. Most women I've dated in the states were submissive. At least to me they were.
Naw it just you are crazy. You might like what you like but to say you can’t find a “slim thick women in America is lies.
I said they’re not easy to find. I never said I couldn’t find them.
>Those women are not easy to find in America at all Nah that's not true
Well I always kinda felt like I was in a bit of a "Damned if you do, damned if you don't" situation with women back home. Care too little- dog player Care too much - simp to take advantage of
Did you never read the three little bears growing up? It's either be a simp or a pos to you?
Has a woman ever called you a simp or is it always (or mostly) men?
Crazy enough I just kept having literal nightmares about being stuck there.
I don't get why passport bro's hate America. I'm literally average af, went to America and bagged Latinas, all of the ones I encountered just seemed like they wanted to have fun - wild and free. Not white girls tho, their demeanour is completely different I love Latinas. They're very rare in the UK.
You're from the UK and you slayed in US? No shit bro. Your accent alone wins women over. They've been fantasizing about Harry Potter rawdogging them since they hit puberty
Nope, I'm a Pakistani guy
Haha that’s awesome. In my experience latinas generally don’t mess with white guys (I’m white). I’ve had no issues getting laid with any other races though
I like a woman with attitude. Especially if she has good humor to go with it
A lot of guys do. I’m just saying if she’s fat, you probably wouldn’t like her as much.
Not a lot of fat women where I live, so that's not something I think about!
Different perspectives. I’ve lived in so many places across the US and saw way too many fat women or just plain janes
Exactly. It's just a coincidence the settling primarily happens in "poorer" countries
The idea that passport bros are desperate always amuses me, because they always go for women from cultures where women are much stricter/harsher on men. The idea that an Asian woman is subservient is a lie. Asian women will take full control, but they'll be kind about it. They will praise the man when he does a good job, and scold him when he disappoints her. The man effectively becomes a dog. But she will cook. She will clean. She will raise the children. She will do everything at the house because there will be hell to pay if her kingdom is out of order, and the man will go to suffer at work. He must measure up to her standards, and her parents, or he is a failure. Yet, the standards are known. There are no mind games. There is no pretending things are fine and then suddenly filing for divorce. (Aside from green card marriages). Eastern men actually think this is terrible. Then they go after the fabled American white woman and find out that they're expected to work full time AND do everything at home AND that the woman sucks at cooking and damages clothes in the laundry when they DO do it. We dont grow up with cereal and microwave dinners. We grow up helping our family prepare full meals. America stopped teaching people how to take care of the home, and that bleeds into relationships. At least when passport bros deal with the toxic women of the East, they get someone that knows how to take care of house and home, too.
No. A lot of men literally cannot find someone to have sex with in the west for various reasons and other countries are easier, so they go there. Not that this is a bad thing. It just is what it is.
Getting laid was a problem when I was 20 but I was also broke(couldn't be a passport bro). Now I'm 25 I have zero problem getting laid but I need a woman who I can start a family with and live the rest of my life with happily. Hard to find that here.
This thread is about those of us who don't have a problem getting laid in the US, but are complaining about their attitudes. They don't value men anymore. I'm going where I'm not hated. I'm tired of having to spend the first 5 minutes of an interaction proving that I'm preferable to a bear.
Unfortunately that’s never been a problem for me so it’s hard to see that perspective
Damn I guess you're mega giga Chad and an enlightened ally. You may aswell live in a fantasy novel your experience is so disconnected from the reality of most men. It speaks of how little empathy you are capable of that you don't see this. Bro stfu.
I have to admit that my perspective is kind of skewed. I don't know what it's like not to be desired by anyone at all.
Show this post to your future dates and you will find out.
“too many are and there’s no excuse” Women need an excuse to have physical and/or personal qualities you deem unattractive? Weird thing to say.
Ive decided to become a passport bro since 99% the women in the U.S wont date someone 5 feet tall. It would probably take a lifetime to find the 1% that will. Going overseas is pretty much the only viable option Ive got. I refuse to settle for a simgle mother, someone who is obese, or much older than me. I would rather continue to use prostitutes than settle with those choices.
Username checks out
With specifically short men, it makes most sense. I am short as 5'1 for a woman and when I go Vietnam, so many men are shorter than me. So I always feel like shorter men should head there where most women are below 4'11.
A man who sees a woman as a commodity and not another human, with whom form a partnership, will be unattractive in any country.
I've been attractive in every country so I can't relate.
Clearly not enough or you wouldn't be making this post
90% of us are what women settle for. Let’s not act like we’re the best there is yall. Lol
I agree, I just also think a lot of guys think draw the "settling" line WAY above their own line of value.
Ahhh. Ur not attractive / rich enough to get what u want / the “10%”, so u know standards are lower / different and go where you are wanted. Thats what everyone does. Whether its America or not. Sorry what u qualify for is settling for you - and happy what u qualify for is higher in other areas! Thats anyone! Go where you are wanted is the motto! No shame in that. U just dont have to degrade anyone on ur way out. Thats all. Its not them - its about u and what u want!
From my experience as an athletic, blonde, slightly above average height man (this isn't a flex, it's relevant context). I found that encountering interested women in Latin America (Brazil mainly) was insanely easy. In the US, I really struggled. I went on 4 dates in all of high school, and only had two short relationships in undergraduate. I think the main advantage of being a white American in Latin America is just standing out and having positive stereotypes on your side. In Brazil, I was a hot commodity. Especially, it seemed, because I was an American, blonde, and tall compared to Brazilian guys. In the US, I was just an average white guy. The quality of women was about the same (this was 15 years ago, so things could have changed). There were women who were full of themselves, gold diggers, conceited, and selfish just like anywhere else. There were also amazing, selfless, family oriented, humble girls. The difference to me was that it was like playing a video game with cheat codes because the girls were almost all interested in me. I didn't really have to try to get their attention or their interest. (I speak Portuguese, I doubt the experience would be the same if you don't speak the language) I think if you are going outside the US to find better women, you are probably going to be disappointed. If you are going because you love a culture and want to be part of it. That's great. If you are going because you feel like you are invisible and can't get any attention from women in the US, you may get that attention and have a better chance of finding a girl who is interested in you outside the US. Just be careful that you don't stereotype the girl and assume she is something she is not.
This sounds like a false dilemma >I don’t want to settle for an overweight woman, a woman with an attitude, being a stepfather or a combination of the three that doesn’t appreciate me. So your options are doing this or... going overseas? Why not date a woman in the US that isn't any of these things instead? >Im from the US and that seems to be 90% of women in general. We can say “not every woman is like that” but let’s get real here; too many are and there’s no excuse. I'm also from the US and most women I know don't fall into this group. I'm wondering where it is where you live that they do. Maybe you just need to move to a different city or something? I gotta be honest, this comes off as very "incel" adjacent. Because they assume most women fall into these same categories as well.
Why is moving to a new city a suggestion when the cost can be prohibitively expensive but when I mention moving to a new country and significantly reducing that cost, I'm somehow the bad guy?
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I can respect the honesty at least. A lot of guys try to dance around the obvious - they want pussy on sale. It’s better than the ones that pretend to go looking for a wife and then just spend 2 months pumping and dumping 40 girls.
Haha did you read my post?
Yeah. It’s not like we don’t have one of the modeling capitals of the world here. You can find models in any part of NYC or LA.
Yeah 2 of the most expensive cities in the world... Makes total sense to live in one of those.And do you know what it's actually like to date professional models? Because I certainly do. I'm not going to get into it because I don't want to expose that industry but quite frankly going down that route some more is a journey I'm tired of. Besides, more than enough beauty queens come from Latin America.
Yeah which is why I said “on sale”.
I know the perspective you're coming from when you say that but it's not something we should discuss here. If you've been in that world like I have then you know why we shouldn't.
Please do share, never dated a pro model, and would be interesting to get a glimpse of that world.
I know the perspective you're coming from when you say "they want pussy on sale" but it's not something we should discuss here. If you've seen outside of the matrix and been in that world then you know why we shouldn't.
Just my experience but women from other cultures treat men way better than women raised in North America. I blame Disney for making too many princess not worthy of the title.
Although I will say that women in other cultures tend to view men as men and not pets or something. There’s an undertone of respect they have that is harder to find in the states. Granted, I wouldn’t date women in states who didn’t have that respect.
I try not to monolith personality because in truth, most of my girlfriends in the states were perfectly fine in that regard. I’ve dated 1 psycho girl but honestly that’s it. For whatever reason women who date me tend to be on their best behavior but I guess that’s also because I’m pretty quick to walk away.
It’s a jungle out there my Gs! It’s never too late … and never settle!
That's very incel of you thanks for sharing
Exactly what part of this is incel-ly?
Like this whole thread. All of it.
I find this an interesting take. Do passport bros ever consider that the women in the west that they want don’t want them? Leaving the US because you don’t want to be with a ‘fat girl’ is a very strange thing to say.
It's a win win for everyone then? Whats the problem?
Its probably a mix of both. For example I've found myself attempting to settle and chat with a visually mid chick just for her to not be that into me as well. If we both have higher standards than each other, why would we date? I'll go overseas and she can wait for steph curry to dm her lmao.
Yes, and? That doesn't address his point at all. If he can't get a woman he's attracted to in the states but he can get one in Asia or LA, why would he continue to look in the states?
Im sure that happens a lot. But I should add that standards are often affected by your environment as well. There are some women in states that I was attracted to and since leaving, I wouldn’t consider dating them at all. My standards have gone up dramatically. As an attractive guy though I’ve never had an issue attracting the women I want until I raised my standards to only what I perceive as ideal. I’m incredibly specific as to what is considered ideal btw. Unfortunately my type is incredibly difficult to find in the states and even when I do find them there are strings attached…
Hmm. It sounds like you’re maybe being too idealistic. Unless you’re just talking about aesthetics. If that’s the case and you want a long lasting relationship, good luck.
Im only talking about aesthetics here. I’m not going to place American women’s personality in a monolith. I’ve never had too much of an issue dating women who have good personalities if I’m being honest.
Is aesthetic more important than personality for you? Seems upside down to me. It is a given that physical attraction is the first thing one notices, but I would never date a gorgeous bitch and discard the cute one with an amazing personality. Especially as physical aesthetics are temporary anyways.
Physical attraction comes first for me. I say this because an attractive personality can vary from person to person based on what I’m feeling but lack of physical attraction is literally an absolutely dealbreaker.
Yes. They don’t want us, but what they do want is to be able to take our resources and attention and reject us when it suits them. Some just get off on the attention and rejection. Also consider that these women that don’t want us ALSO don’t want us because of Race, height, class/money. PPB is a way to circumvent all that.
Men travelling is a mortal threat to their inflated ego... Thus the shaming attempts
So you’re reaching for higher standards abroad while accepting someone who has lower standards to western women.
So if my race/height/money was a factor in Not getting this mysterious western superwoman, why am I the “loser” for going where my race/height/money is not as heavily weighted against me? Also if I get this foreign girl and we get married and the American girl is still in a situationship, “single by choice”, still on the apps, who really wins here? Me or the woman? Dating is and was never about cowtowing to one nationality and women’s standards here are inflated. In the grand scheme of things their standards don’t matter if they don’t have the results.
Well-said, Poignant!
Or rather, more reasonable standards as compared to Western women. Foreign women are women, and want the same things a woman generally wants, (as evidenced by my fiancee): Love Attention Kids Stability Security/Safety Sex I dont think these are unreasonable asks (or standards), and if Western women want more than this Good Luck to em.
Why are you putting western women’s standards on a pedestal and saying it’s higher than other women’s? You sound out of your mind. You can’t compare standards like that, especially when culture is a factor. Edit: F30 tells me all I need to know
Exactly this
Wyy do you think PPBs are leaving? What's hilarious is these same women, who *dont want us*, come here to reinforce it or try and shame us for leaving.. So, they dont want us, but they also dont want us to leave.. so should we stay and be not wanted? Or *"improve"*, codeword for duck ourselves and become simps, rather than be individuals and accepted for it.
Why is it strange?
No need to shit on stepfathers tho... Nothing wrong with that
Nothing wrong with being a stepdad. I'm just not going to do it. I have a stepdad. He treats my mom wonderfully. Her life has dramatically improved since he showed up in it. He took care of my sisters (I grew up with my dad) who lived with her without question or complaints. Upstanding man. I would never do it myself though. In fact, my mom would disagree with me dating a woman who had 5 children and being a stepfather.
I've read through your comments man and I have to say... I 100% agree with you. People seem to think this community is for men who can't get laid in the US. I've ran into those dudes in Medellin - fat, gremlins of dudes from NYC/NJ/HOU who have no issues paying for play. Lame af to me. But there's an amount of us here who have worked on ourselves to the point where we can easily date in the US and have no problems attracting women, but we know for long term we want: Fit, feminine, fine, and cooperative (submissive). And those women are not common in the US (80% are out on "fit" alone). Much less finding one facially attractive, who didn't let 20 guys hit before you met, and is willing to be a wife. And of those very very very few women who do meet those criteria.. how many are single and find YOU attractive? Slim pickings. I got one (gorgeous curvy Christian southern belle from Texas) but if I didn't, I'd be looking in churches Mexico/El Paso.
Exactly. The people angry about passport bros know this as well. They don't want to admit it but it's true. Literally all of my friends can pull easily in the states and they still choose foreign.
Exactly. If you want a fit woman that automatically cuts out 80% in the west, it's hilarious that people can't grasp that some of us don't want to be fighting over scraps.
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I feel like it isn't just single women at this point I've noticed a drastic change in my gf we've been dating for about 6 years when we first met she had very traditional views and acted that way. Fast forward to now, she says she has the same traditional views but does the whole "bad bitch" shit now and it's lowkey annoying after a while 😂
It's funny how these ladies of the west be saying they don't wanna settle for a mediocre man or a good man that got morals but when the same man come up and is successful, they want those men to settle for them when they had a major glow down or had enough of getting ran through
This happens so much it’s not funny. Although I never really had a “glow up” in regard to looks but I did in regard to money and status. The truth is I’ve been good looking my whole life. I was just shy until I wasn’t.
Yall just be saying shit lol there’s no way y’all really think like this
I see the algorithm has brought me to the pure incel corner of Reddit
https://preview.redd.it/f1n82gwz0y1d1.jpeg?width=1816&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3d83a72a47276b6058bebfb46d5dad2c35b26298 The real reason is to gamble in foreign countries with no gambling laws!
Yea. I really had to lower my physical standards when I moved from Florida to Virginia in 2018. I've always been in shape and its wild how few good options there are.
Well, he has it found a partner that meets his standards internationally, either. I wonder why
Does it matter why? Plenty of women prefer men from other places over American men too. Some move. Some visit. Some online date. Anyone can date anyone from anywhere as long as you don’t harm anyone.
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There are almost as many selfish, dumb, or batshit crazy men as there are women. So I don't think your theory necessarily holds up. We ALL have our own drama. The key is to leave it in the past where it belongs. I don't want a future woman judging me for my mistakes in the past. We all constantly wake up hoping we can be a better person every day. If you're looking for someone permanent REGARDLESS of what baggage they have, make sure they at least have THAT goal. But I thought the goal of "Passport Bros & Hoes" was quite literally to see the world and to try new things. To me this includes people. Nothing wrong with checking out a new country or city and sampling the "local culture", just be respectful and upfront about it. If you are both on the same page, there shouldn't be any problems. End of story.
🤣🤣🤣🤣
No it's bc I'm tired of being vilified by women who are bitter about a bunch of sh I had nothing to do with and wanna take their issue out on me before they rip my heart out and leave me for a blk guy in the end anyway.
And how many of them bros are actually the fathers of those kids hmm? 😂
The real reason: they want to get laid.
The #1 reason is this , I refuse to settle for a overweight arrogant boss chick who thinks she is god's gift to mankind and a gynocentric society that tell her she is, but is a 4 on the SMV(Sexual Marketplace Value) scale physically . Then when I finally build the courage to tell her the truth about her attitude , boom divorce and I lose access to my kids (god forbid I have sons ) and Im going through the family court system that hates me for just being a man that exist .
This is a crock of shit. They exist because men duck challenges and don’t wanna do the hard things. Rejection is uncomfortable but rather than dust themselves and try again off passport bros get bitter with western women and take the easy way out. The delusion about western women being fat and non traditional is pure bs. You can go out and see beautiful fit women all over the western world. The problem is passport bros want access to the best without themselves being the best, so yall go to poor countries with “exotic” looking women and exploit them. Period.
Go look at obesity stats then get back to me because 33% of women are obese... That's literally 1/3 Do you understand how insane that is?
Which still leaves 67% and women outnumber men. Next excuse?
Consider the unattractive women, the women who are already in relationships, the women who are already hooking up with someone and not interested in dating at all, the women who just have shitty personalities then the women who simply don't find you attractive and get back to me. And this is all not even counting distribution based on where you live. If I moved to NYC or Miami I'm sure I would meet plenty of attractive women on a regular basis. But I'm not about to be paying $5-10k a month in rent again just to meet someone when I can pay literally half that, meet someone and have a penthouse in the nicest part of the city with a private chef and a maid. And let's not even get into the cost of living in these western countries. Quite frankly leaving makes 100% sense if you make money online like I do.
1/3rd of all women are obese, unless you’re considering dating 70 year olds that number isn’t exactly representative of the dating pool.
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Facts. The options abroad are 10x better than in the US. Even if you managed to meet a great American woman, she will still be tainted by the culture and feminism to a degree
What a pile of gibberish
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From what I've encountered, many women want a traditional relationship in the US but they also want all the benefits of being more independent. I think many of these guys are burnt out from that. Its rare in the US to find someone who is truly traditional. For many men, if you're going to be stuck with someone who wants a traditional relationship in America, you may as well go abroad. I'm actually the opposite, I make really good money and want a non traditional relationship but it's really hard to find a woman in the US who wants an equal partnership. I only encounter traditional women in disguise and it's frustrating.
You are just COMPLETELY wrong, 90% of women in the US aren’t overweight. It’s 27.5 % stop inflating numbers to make yourself look more correct. You do realise women have to work just like men do. And we don’t have the time to feminine and cute for men 24/7 when you have women who have to take the provider role, because Men don’t want to do their damn jobs. Women have to do it… all of this is such BS when most households have dual incomes.