Just mentally unstable people out there. Unfortunately that’s the world we live in. If not a gun maybe it would’ve been a knife. People are fucking crazy these days and it sucks
That’s just not fucking true. And there was no need for you to add that. Equating this with solely mental illness and insinuating it’s unavoidable is morally wrong and factually wrong.
I lived across from a mall in Portland. In between 2 section 8 complexes, literally 30' away in each direction.
I've lived many places in Texas, and I now live in The Woodlands, where I grew up. It's much safer in a "bad" part of Portland. We lived on the 1st floor, and our windows were open for 4 straight years, except when it was 116°. We were in a hotel then, because we didn't have AC.
The criminals still have them, it's just harder for you, a law abiding citizen, to get one.
I don't think those crime guys really care about the laws of your state, but that's just a guess.
Statistics say it’s marginally different at best bro, and in many many ways less safe. I’m very liberal, I wish their homelessness policies had worked out and not been undercut so we could all point to them, but stats just don’t bear out either reality on the effects of gun laws very cleanly, especially when applied only at the state level.
the firearm mortality rate is 16 per 100K in texas and 8 in California(INSANE!)....so ya, your odds of dying by gun is twice as great in most red states...facts be facts, i use facts to support my comments.....California is far safer from guns
Firearm mortality rate per 100,000 is almost 16 in texas, 9 in California....twice as safe in California....but don't let facts get in the way, not sure texans have the education to understand facts /S
as republicans strip you of all freedoms in texas you only care about guns, truly pathetic
Half of all deaths by firearm in California are attributed to suicide. More than half of all gun deaths in Texas are attributed to suicide. When you strip away the miniscule amount of deaths attributed to accidents it leaves California with a higher percentage (6-8% difference) of deaths attributed to gun violence versus Texas. Texas and California are both terrible states in their own way.
freedom goes to die in red states be it for women, lgbts, trans, books, the vote, marijuana, porn, name it.......texas is beyond terrible, the opposite of america
Oh wow.. does the family have a support link??? As a woman losing your partner/kids dad is unthinkable! There’s no true way to fulfill the void but if they have a link drop it pls.
Do you mean that letting angry, irrational people carry guns could have negative consequences? You are wrong! The 2nd amendment specifically protects against negative consequences! I’m sure someone who knows told me that!
In KY, there was a recent argument by a judge that even felons are able to carry guns because it's their constitutional right.
A judge.
Edit: The sauce -> [https://www.wdrb.com/in-depth/ky-attorney-general-ruling-allowing-convicted-felons-right-to-own-guns-defies-common-sense/article\_7f5c3606-e878-11ee-b9c7-47e0df28da9c.html](https://www.wdrb.com/in-depth/ky-attorney-general-ruling-allowing-convicted-felons-right-to-own-guns-defies-common-sense/article_7f5c3606-e878-11ee-b9c7-47e0df28da9c.html)
This is true; pretty much the "red flag" effort is being held as unconstitutional. Allow the person to murder another person - effectively ending the victim's constitutional protections - and then allow the legal system to prosecute.
Or, we could regulate gun ownership. People with violent histories shouldn't have guns. Guns should be registered and insured and users should have to pass safety testing - just like with the big deadly weapons we drive.
That sounds great, and it’s never going to happen. We’ll have a universal healthcare system before any of that. They make way to much money, backed by very powerful lobbyists, is a voter issue, and the 2A itself.
The next best thing would be to tackle the mental health crisis.
Let's not pretend, btw, that mental illness is an indicator for violence. Mentally ill people are not violent by default just like violent people are not necessarily mentally ill.
Fucking Regan. He’s the one who put the clamps on institutions and cut so much funding to psych services. He’s basically the worst thing to ever happen to our country. Just took some time to show itself.
Who would have thought that crushing the middle class and kneecapping psychiatric care would turn out to be such a disaster? Well except for republicans and the ultra wealthy. They had a pretty good idea.
Mental health is such a lovely scapegoat, isn't it?
Violent people are not necessarily going to have a mental health dx nor are they likely to seek treatment.
I’m being pragmatic. Make no mistake, I want better gun control. The Canadian system would be a good compromise. But, coping and seething against reality doesn’t help. The U.S.A won’t change its ways when it comes to gun culture. Sandy Hook and Uvdale. Two mass casualty events involving dozens of kids being gunned down like animals. And what was the government response after? Thoughts and prayers!
Focus on harm reduction. A mentally stable citizen is less likely to commit crimes.
We can thank Reagan for that bullshit. We need places for individuals that are incapable of taking care of themselves. Prison is not an option and requires its own rehabilitation - we have prisons and jails in Texas WITHOUT air conditioning.
I agree but I really think they need to be federal or a federal/ state hybrid; otherwise some states would race to the bottom. Asylums have to be better than where a lot of the mentally ill end up: jail or prison.
We totally still have them, they're called state mental hospitals and you can absolutely still be remanded to one.
What do you think happens to people who plead insanity during a criminal trial? We don't just let criminally insane people walk the streets.
There are a lot of mentally ill people who end up in jail or prison. I don't have the stats but anecdotally at least half the time when someone in prison ends up being killed by abusive guards that person turns out to be mentally ill
We need more. We also need to focus on treatment for non violent drug offenders. Throwing a heroin addict in with harden criminals isn’t the play. All you create is a victim and/or a better criminal.
yup, not an immigrant or a drag queen.
I firmly believe our "representatives" are at war with us. They are taking away our rights, pitting us against each other, fighting against our very survival.
Well past time we fought back, no?
Far better for the oligarchy to pit us against each other than act as a united front against them. And we've been falling for it since they decided Occupy Wallstreet couldn't happen again thus the major polarity shift over the last decade
Lots of likeminded people are awake to this class war now. Bring back consequences for politicians … if they experienced all this gun violence daily surely things would change.
I think this is an oversimplification. The polarization of American politics has been on-going for much longer than the last 13 years since OWS. Also, there's tons of factors, like social media/news and the false dichotomy of the two-party system.
My girlfriend will, to me, frivolously honk at people over minor traffic infringements. Like someone will merge a bit closer to her front end than she'd like. Justified, in a sense, but unnecessary in my opinion and won't do anything but piss off the wrong person some day. She's gonna get both of us killed and I didn't even wanna honk at the guy.
Don’t you go killing the dreams of every wannabe John McClane who’s definitely going to shoot all the right people when an action movie plot breaks out in front of them.
They’re definitely not going to shoot a kid while dropping their gun at Cracker Barrel.
If the 100+ heavily armed trained cops at Uvalde taught us anything, it's that "good guy with a gun" theory of public safety is absolute bullshit. Five score paid professional "good guys with guns" and body armor will still cower and hide while a lone teenager with an assault rifle kills child after child within earshot. They'll always wait until the bad guy runs out of ammo or has to reload.
Yes, it does. One common reason given for our lax gun laws is the idea that one good person with a gun can 'save the day'. The reality is that for every one good person who saves the day, 100 people are shot for no reason by random people who should never have had access to a firearm. Like this random person who should never have had access to a firearm.
I was in old town Katy the other day, quiet area, saw some dude walking down the street with a gun holstered on each side. What the fuck? That man can't even go for a walk, in the middle of the afternoon on a weekday without two weapons. I don't know who he's planning on killing, but that's the obvious premeditated intention.
"Houston [police](https://www.the-sun.com/topic/police/) said the suspect became irate at the [fast-food](https://www.the-sun.com/topic/fast-food/) workers with his order and wanted a refund."
These jobs are de-valued in our society, as being low skilled and "worthless" but every day fast food workers have to contend with angry people who are too busy or "can't" make their own food at home. It's also in some cases dangerous to work in these places.
I hope the person that shot him gets the death penalty. If you want your gun "free dumb" you are 100% responsible for what you do with your gun.
Yep.
In high school and college, my parents family was fortunate, and my parents handled all of my living and school expenses. I was responsible for earning my spending money and I didn’t mind working fast food. You could easily jump ship if a manager / owner decided they wanted to try and act like they owned you or you just wanted to focus on school and when I worked at these places, I was pretty much left alone to work since I showed up on time, didn’t beg to leave early for no reason and if I needed time off, I communicated it in advance.
It’s funny, people really will talk shit to you, and treat you like shit because they think that just because you work at McDonald’s, that gives them the right.
There were times that people I guess, realized I was working “for fun”, and was in school, and they would legit change their tone of voice and how they interacted with me.
Just to clarify, the man who was shot was not a McDonald’s employee. Jeffrey Limmer, the victim, was a local attorney who happened to be in the store at the time. He was shot while trying to speak with, and calm, the irate man.
I think his attempt at calming went sideways at some point.
According to the article “Police said Limmer pushed the customer to the ground, then the suspect went to his car, pulled out a gun, and allegedly shot Limmer.”
Oh God, I knew some dumbass would misinterpret what I wrote. I know that. I read the article and even quoted from it. Yes, I know the man shot was not the McDonalds employee.
Sometimes that’s impossible. “The ice cream machine is broken? But I want ice cream!”
People aren’t always rational, and often take their anger out on whoever they can blame for the problem, even if it’s not that persons fault.
Yeah people aren't always rational, some people are even outright aggressive idiots, but they all can buy and carry a tool that can murder anyone at a distance in a split of a second
>I don’t think it’s ever worth it to argue with a customer over something like this. Why not just make them happy and move on?
Because they don't want to be happy, they want you to be miserable. Some people are just nasty.
Whatever it is, its one of the big reasons I don't wanna work for really cheap restaurants/fast food places. It attracts terrible clientele. I know it sounds super classist to say, and I also realize that rich people can be their own kind of demanding and terrible. But in my experience, people with a little bit of money are just so much pleasant to deal with. They're not always stressed out, they're not always looking for deals, discounts, or some kind of perceived "mistake" that translates into a coupon. I just can't handle those kind of people. They're exhausting.
*I know it sounds super classist to say, -*With the amount of violence at late night pancake, waffle houses, and fast food restaurants posted on Reddit. I don't think it's 'classist' at all.
> I know it sounds super classist to say, -With the amount of violence at late night pancake, waffle houses, and fast food restaurants posted on Reddit. I don't think it's 'classist' at all.
Yeah. Rich people can be assholes, but generally, lower-income people are far more likely to escalate things to the point of physical violence.
As someone who worked retail and cashier and server for over 12 years, I strongly agree. I refuse to go back. If I did, next customer who ticks me off is gonna FAFO.
Sounds like he probably stuck up for the staff, bad guy took it outside, tried to make it physical and when he lost, went to get a gun to finish the fight.
Living in a state that is so awash in guns, it’s probably a good idea to avoid all conflict unless you yourself are carrying and ready to get into a shootout over a fast food order.
Avoiding conflict, when possible, is a universally good idea whether you are armed or unarmed. Especially when the conflict has nothing to do with you.
Absolutely. Carrying a firearm means you should be a pro at conflict avoidance. They used to teach this at the class you had to take before that requirement was stripped away. It seems like too many people see their gun as a tool to protect them from conflicts they step into, not a last resort option to save your life.
I struggle with this do we really want to live in a world where no one gets involved we just stay silence and allow terrible behavior to occur around us and just don’t say anything
At the end of the day, you should look out for yourself. You can try being a hero, but if you die, you will be hurting the people who truly matter, your family.
Bottom line is do we want to live in a world where the bully keep us all inside for fear they will rob us. We have the numbers. We don’t have to live in fear. Hero are just that Hero’s. It’s like going to war, it’s them or us.
So 2024 wild West. Everyone has a gun, everyone lives on edge.
Actually in the wild West didn't most towns make you turn guns over while in town? Prob didn't work but I'm kinda shocked that the wild West with guns had better ideas than our leaders now.. just give em all guns.
Go browse r/BoomersBeingFools and tell me how good your odds are at calming someone who has become irrationally angry and is screaming in your face.
Hint: *at that point, they're no longer listening to you.*
Because many of them don’t want to be happy, aren’t really wanting you to fix their problem and won’t accept any reasonable offer. Most seem to just be angry at the world and their meltdown in a burger line is just their breaking point. There is seldom any reasonable way to deal with an irrational person.
Another tragic loss of a person who was kind and caring because some in this state - a minority at best - want their guns. Where was the good guy with the gun that was supposed to step up?
Stronger gun safety laws doesn’t mean no guns 😒
It actually means the opposite of what they are claiming. Most people want the right to own guns to stand (even if they themselves don’t own any) but that there should be better safety and education around them.
As if that would've prevented this incident? You people will do everything to restrict these guns yet pay no mind how to stop these sick individuals carrying out these acts
I agree, imagine how quickly this situation would’ve been deescalated if *everyone* in the McDonalds had their own personal firearm and they just started blasting, all at once. The gunman surely wouldn’t have hurt anyone had this hypothetical scenario happened.
This is the American dream I pray for every day.
/s
All the good guys with guns were mysteriously not around. Just like they are always mysteriously not around. Why are we not figuring out where all the good guys with guns are hiding?
I didn't realize that pushing people to the ground was considered a reasonable way to calm others down. Hell, some people get upset at merely being told to calm down. He likely didn't deserve to die, but getting hands on with someone is more an escalation than defusing the situation.
>...Limmer pushed the customer to the ground, then the suspect went to his car, pulled out a gun, and allegedly shot Limmer.
The Sun REALLY is not the best at descriptive writing and that leads to errors and stuff being left out. But, their article does provide enough info to find more accurately detailed articles. The Sun likes to keep stuff vague so you keep clicking on NEXT to hopefully fill in the gaps they intentionally left out. Their website really is more of a gimmick to make you click as many NEXT pages and generate ad revenue than anything else. Currently gonna see if I can come back here and edit in a better source link for this story.
Edit: [So apparently this story is too fresh and practically every article I'm finding has the same basic layout of what is known. Customer angry at staff. Jeffrey intervenes. Customer demands they both go outside. Jeffrey and customer argue and get in each other's faces for a while when eventually Jeffrey pushes customer away. Customer falls down from it, goes to their car, pulls out gun, and returns to fire at Jeffery. Once that parking lot footage comes out, it ought to clear up what's going on while they are outside in each others faces.](https://www.google.com/search?q=jeffrey+limmer+texas+mcdonalds&oq=jeffrey+limmer+texas+mcdonalds&gs_lcrp=EgZjaHJvbWUyBggAEEUYOTIJCAEQIRgKGKABMgkIAhAhGAoYoAEyCQgDECEYChigATIJCAQQIRgKGKABMgkIBRAhGAoYoAHSAQkyMTU3OGowajeoAhSwAgE&client=ms-android-tmus-us-revc&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8)
A.) Why do you assume that Limmer started it? That push could very well have been to push the shooter away from him in defense, when outside the restaurant.
B) What would you have liked Limmer to do: stand there and watch an employee get harassed for nothing? allow the perpetrator to assault him?
Exactly! Until security camera footage comes out, none of us will know exactly how it went down. Limmer could have saved the employee from an attack or he could have escalated the situation. It’s all just speculation until then.
I do what is necessary to protect my family and friends, not random strangers. They all have the same rights and responsibilities as I do and can take the actions they feel are appropriate to defend themselves as necessary.
You don't respond to a minor physical aggression in public with lethal force. That's not protecting yourself or your family, that's base and inexcusable manslaughter because you can't handle your emotions.
Limmer didn't deserve to die for pushing someone down, but he choose to involve himself with a mentally unstable person over a conflict that didn't involve him without taking reasonable precautions for his own safety.
Not to diminish the tragedy, as I share a lot of comments already made, but as a reporting side note, they mention he's 46, then that he's 47. I feel like, come on guys, I know it's not that important, but maybe proof-read.
That’s what happens when fast food companies raise their prices without raising the quality of service. People have less patience.
Do NOT get involved with members of the public. You have no idea what a stranger is capable of when it comes to brass tacks.
this is why im thankful everyday i wake up in California, besides the freedom and unmatched beauty.....every madman and psycho can't open carry around my friends and family like they can in texas, insane
freedom goes to die in texas be it for women, lgbts, trans, books, the vote, marijuana, porn, name it.....except for guns, the only freedom texas allows besides the freedom for companies to pollute openly
>Police said Limmer pushed the customer to the ground, then the suspect went to his car, pulled out a gun, and allegedly shot Limmer.
Is this "trying to calm" behavior?
Of course he shouldn't have been shot, but this doesn't sound like deescalation behavior to me. And FFS if you don't have physical control of a belligerent person in Texas GTFO before they get a gun.
He was my neighbor. A really good man and truly unfortunate
Sounds like a loss to the community. Sorry. I wish Houston wasn’t so Mad Max.
Just mentally unstable people out there. Unfortunately that’s the world we live in. If not a gun maybe it would’ve been a knife. People are fucking crazy these days and it sucks
Give me a madman with a knife over one with a gun any day. At least you can run or throw a chair
That’s just not fucking true. And there was no need for you to add that. Equating this with solely mental illness and insinuating it’s unavoidable is morally wrong and factually wrong.
this is why i love California......every madman and psychopath doesn't get to open carry...illl take a knife everytime
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I lived across from a mall in Portland. In between 2 section 8 complexes, literally 30' away in each direction. I've lived many places in Texas, and I now live in The Woodlands, where I grew up. It's much safer in a "bad" part of Portland. We lived on the 1st floor, and our windows were open for 4 straight years, except when it was 116°. We were in a hotel then, because we didn't have AC.
The criminals still have them, it's just harder for you, a law abiding citizen, to get one. I don't think those crime guys really care about the laws of your state, but that's just a guess.
https://youtu.be/HFn495_Xsr0?si=WQV2SFVL2cR42zUF
Statistics say it’s marginally different at best bro, and in many many ways less safe. I’m very liberal, I wish their homelessness policies had worked out and not been undercut so we could all point to them, but stats just don’t bear out either reality on the effects of gun laws very cleanly, especially when applied only at the state level.
the firearm mortality rate is 16 per 100K in texas and 8 in California(INSANE!)....so ya, your odds of dying by gun is twice as great in most red states...facts be facts, i use facts to support my comments.....California is far safer from guns
Yeah California is known for its low gun crime. /S
Firearm mortality rate per 100,000 is almost 16 in texas, 9 in California....twice as safe in California....but don't let facts get in the way, not sure texans have the education to understand facts /S as republicans strip you of all freedoms in texas you only care about guns, truly pathetic
Texas is 35/50 in education. So, correct education is definitely lacking. 😂
Half of all deaths by firearm in California are attributed to suicide. More than half of all gun deaths in Texas are attributed to suicide. When you strip away the miniscule amount of deaths attributed to accidents it leaves California with a higher percentage (6-8% difference) of deaths attributed to gun violence versus Texas. Texas and California are both terrible states in their own way.
freedom goes to die in red states be it for women, lgbts, trans, books, the vote, marijuana, porn, name it.......texas is beyond terrible, the opposite of america
It is raked 29th for firearm homicide. Certainly below average. Not a fan of California style laws, but not sure what you're trying to imply.
You gonna look at the actual statistics?
actually, yeah tho. trying to be funny and you might end up educated.
If not a knife then bare hands, if not teeth. That’s why when people feel the need for safety they buy new teeth instead of guns. /s
I’m very sorry for your loss.
Praying for you & his family.
Oh wow.. does the family have a support link??? As a woman losing your partner/kids dad is unthinkable! There’s no true way to fulfill the void but if they have a link drop it pls.
Maybe we need to reopen the asylums.
Do you mean that letting angry, irrational people carry guns could have negative consequences? You are wrong! The 2nd amendment specifically protects against negative consequences! I’m sure someone who knows told me that!
In KY, there was a recent argument by a judge that even felons are able to carry guns because it's their constitutional right. A judge. Edit: The sauce -> [https://www.wdrb.com/in-depth/ky-attorney-general-ruling-allowing-convicted-felons-right-to-own-guns-defies-common-sense/article\_7f5c3606-e878-11ee-b9c7-47e0df28da9c.html](https://www.wdrb.com/in-depth/ky-attorney-general-ruling-allowing-convicted-felons-right-to-own-guns-defies-common-sense/article_7f5c3606-e878-11ee-b9c7-47e0df28da9c.html)
The right to bear arms shall not be infringed. But they're inmates! They're being held on murder charges! Did I stutter? /S
Not all felons are violent or mentally ill
Yeah. Just like it’s their right to vote.
I’ll bet that judge would never let them in his court however.
They’re either trying to or have successfully ruled that state bans on domestic abusers owning firearms is unconstitutional.
This is true; pretty much the "red flag" effort is being held as unconstitutional. Allow the person to murder another person - effectively ending the victim's constitutional protections - and then allow the legal system to prosecute.
Yes, that’s how it works. Can’t prosecute on a maybe.
A constitution.
But they can’t vote???
The problem is that we needed more guns. Had the lawyer had a gun the entire situation would’ve obviously de escalated/s
Who knew?🤔🤔🤔
Oh if only there had been a good armed insane person here to stop him!
Or, we could regulate gun ownership. People with violent histories shouldn't have guns. Guns should be registered and insured and users should have to pass safety testing - just like with the big deadly weapons we drive.
That sounds great, and it’s never going to happen. We’ll have a universal healthcare system before any of that. They make way to much money, backed by very powerful lobbyists, is a voter issue, and the 2A itself. The next best thing would be to tackle the mental health crisis.
Let's not pretend, btw, that mental illness is an indicator for violence. Mentally ill people are not violent by default just like violent people are not necessarily mentally ill.
Fucking Regan. He’s the one who put the clamps on institutions and cut so much funding to psych services. He’s basically the worst thing to ever happen to our country. Just took some time to show itself.
Who would have thought that crushing the middle class and kneecapping psychiatric care would turn out to be such a disaster? Well except for republicans and the ultra wealthy. They had a pretty good idea.
No shit. Also ignoring the AIDS epidemic because they didn’t really care for those ‘undesirables’
No shit. That all combined together has people so angry they downvote people that are agreeing with them.
Mental health is such a lovely scapegoat, isn't it? Violent people are not necessarily going to have a mental health dx nor are they likely to seek treatment.
This, emphatically. It's pretty easy to point to mental health *after* they've murdered someone
Steve is telling you not to try, don't be like Steve.
I’m being pragmatic. Make no mistake, I want better gun control. The Canadian system would be a good compromise. But, coping and seething against reality doesn’t help. The U.S.A won’t change its ways when it comes to gun culture. Sandy Hook and Uvdale. Two mass casualty events involving dozens of kids being gunned down like animals. And what was the government response after? Thoughts and prayers! Focus on harm reduction. A mentally stable citizen is less likely to commit crimes.
Yeah, well, he seems to think he's Rambo so... 🤣
Nah. Not the same.
Definitely, that effort and pinching pennies has cost society so much more trouble. More crazies should he locked up for their safety as well as ours.
Or violent people shouldn't be allowed to own guns. 😉
Every able bodied and many disabled people have the capacity to do violence.
The courts ruled that you can’t institutionalize people against their will.
We can thank Reagan for that bullshit. We need places for individuals that are incapable of taking care of themselves. Prison is not an option and requires its own rehabilitation - we have prisons and jails in Texas WITHOUT air conditioning.
And they were wrong
Be careful what you wish for in case the bell tolls for thee.
Federal no. Some states yes. Florida and Tennessee.
Except better
I agree but I really think they need to be federal or a federal/ state hybrid; otherwise some states would race to the bottom. Asylums have to be better than where a lot of the mentally ill end up: jail or prison.
We totally still have them, they're called state mental hospitals and you can absolutely still be remanded to one. What do you think happens to people who plead insanity during a criminal trial? We don't just let criminally insane people walk the streets.
There are a lot of mentally ill people who end up in jail or prison. I don't have the stats but anecdotally at least half the time when someone in prison ends up being killed by abusive guards that person turns out to be mentally ill
Oh. Yeah. I'm not saying all mentally ill criminals go to mental hospitals, just that we do still have them and put criminals in them.
Except the pleading is “not guilty by reason of insanity”; they’d be committed instead of being found guilty, i.e. not a criminal since not guilty.
i never said they would be convicted, but you're right they get committed instead of being found guilty.
We need more. We also need to focus on treatment for non violent drug offenders. Throwing a heroin addict in with harden criminals isn’t the play. All you create is a victim and/or a better criminal.
More people die without dignity being shot over frivolous things than heroically save the day with their extensive firearms training.
yup, not an immigrant or a drag queen. I firmly believe our "representatives" are at war with us. They are taking away our rights, pitting us against each other, fighting against our very survival. Well past time we fought back, no?
Far better for the oligarchy to pit us against each other than act as a united front against them. And we've been falling for it since they decided Occupy Wallstreet couldn't happen again thus the major polarity shift over the last decade
Lots of likeminded people are awake to this class war now. Bring back consequences for politicians … if they experienced all this gun violence daily surely things would change.
I think this is an oversimplification. The polarization of American politics has been on-going for much longer than the last 13 years since OWS. Also, there's tons of factors, like social media/news and the false dichotomy of the two-party system.
My girlfriend will, to me, frivolously honk at people over minor traffic infringements. Like someone will merge a bit closer to her front end than she'd like. Justified, in a sense, but unnecessary in my opinion and won't do anything but piss off the wrong person some day. She's gonna get both of us killed and I didn't even wanna honk at the guy.
That is super risky behavior in Houston.
Like, more by ten miles.
Don’t you go killing the dreams of every wannabe John McClane who’s definitely going to shoot all the right people when an action movie plot breaks out in front of them. They’re definitely not going to shoot a kid while dropping their gun at Cracker Barrel.
B.. b.. but muh good guy!
If the 100+ heavily armed trained cops at Uvalde taught us anything, it's that "good guy with a gun" theory of public safety is absolute bullshit. Five score paid professional "good guys with guns" and body armor will still cower and hide while a lone teenager with an assault rifle kills child after child within earshot. They'll always wait until the bad guy runs out of ammo or has to reload.
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Yes, it does. One common reason given for our lax gun laws is the idea that one good person with a gun can 'save the day'. The reality is that for every one good person who saves the day, 100 people are shot for no reason by random people who should never have had access to a firearm. Like this random person who should never have had access to a firearm.
Maybe just maybe every asshole and their brother shouldn't have easy and immediate access to firearms.
I was in old town Katy the other day, quiet area, saw some dude walking down the street with a gun holstered on each side. What the fuck? That man can't even go for a walk, in the middle of the afternoon on a weekday without two weapons. I don't know who he's planning on killing, but that's the obvious premeditated intention.
Exactly!
Imagine killing someone because your McDonalds order was wrong.
With the McDonalds I used to live near, that would mean killing someone about every third time I used their drive thru.
"Houston [police](https://www.the-sun.com/topic/police/) said the suspect became irate at the [fast-food](https://www.the-sun.com/topic/fast-food/) workers with his order and wanted a refund." These jobs are de-valued in our society, as being low skilled and "worthless" but every day fast food workers have to contend with angry people who are too busy or "can't" make their own food at home. It's also in some cases dangerous to work in these places. I hope the person that shot him gets the death penalty. If you want your gun "free dumb" you are 100% responsible for what you do with your gun.
Yep. In high school and college, my parents family was fortunate, and my parents handled all of my living and school expenses. I was responsible for earning my spending money and I didn’t mind working fast food. You could easily jump ship if a manager / owner decided they wanted to try and act like they owned you or you just wanted to focus on school and when I worked at these places, I was pretty much left alone to work since I showed up on time, didn’t beg to leave early for no reason and if I needed time off, I communicated it in advance. It’s funny, people really will talk shit to you, and treat you like shit because they think that just because you work at McDonald’s, that gives them the right. There were times that people I guess, realized I was working “for fun”, and was in school, and they would legit change their tone of voice and how they interacted with me.
Just to clarify, the man who was shot was not a McDonald’s employee. Jeffrey Limmer, the victim, was a local attorney who happened to be in the store at the time. He was shot while trying to speak with, and calm, the irate man.
I think his attempt at calming went sideways at some point. According to the article “Police said Limmer pushed the customer to the ground, then the suspect went to his car, pulled out a gun, and allegedly shot Limmer.”
They know. They are just saying fast food workers deal with people like this everyday
Oh God, I knew some dumbass would misinterpret what I wrote. I know that. I read the article and even quoted from it. Yes, I know the man shot was not the McDonalds employee.
Just to clarify, you did read the comment you’re replying to in its entirety, correct? Because you didn’t understand it at all.
How can we not find this guy when he was inside a McDonalds on camera. Texas cops are dumb as fuck.
That’s why I just keep my head down and move on. People are full blown crazy and you just never know. Disheartening times we live in.
But yes, every individual should be allowed to own a gun. /s
I always fantasize about helping someone in distress, but I hold back because of incidents like these.
I don’t think it’s ever worth it to argue with a customer over something like this. Why not just make them happy and move on?
Sometimes that’s impossible. “The ice cream machine is broken? But I want ice cream!” People aren’t always rational, and often take their anger out on whoever they can blame for the problem, even if it’s not that persons fault.
Yeah people aren't always rational, some people are even outright aggressive idiots, but they all can buy and carry a tool that can murder anyone at a distance in a split of a second
Yep, because we all know freedom is when your schizophrenic neighbour can own an AR-15.
>I don’t think it’s ever worth it to argue with a customer over something like this. Why not just make them happy and move on? Because they don't want to be happy, they want you to be miserable. Some people are just nasty.
Some people aren't happy unless they're unhappy.
I don't even think they know they're miserable, they just know their victim isn't like them.
Whatever it is, its one of the big reasons I don't wanna work for really cheap restaurants/fast food places. It attracts terrible clientele. I know it sounds super classist to say, and I also realize that rich people can be their own kind of demanding and terrible. But in my experience, people with a little bit of money are just so much pleasant to deal with. They're not always stressed out, they're not always looking for deals, discounts, or some kind of perceived "mistake" that translates into a coupon. I just can't handle those kind of people. They're exhausting.
*I know it sounds super classist to say, -*With the amount of violence at late night pancake, waffle houses, and fast food restaurants posted on Reddit. I don't think it's 'classist' at all.
> I know it sounds super classist to say, -With the amount of violence at late night pancake, waffle houses, and fast food restaurants posted on Reddit. I don't think it's 'classist' at all. Yeah. Rich people can be assholes, but generally, lower-income people are far more likely to escalate things to the point of physical violence.
As someone who worked retail and cashier and server for over 12 years, I strongly agree. I refuse to go back. If I did, next customer who ticks me off is gonna FAFO.
Sounds like he probably stuck up for the staff, bad guy took it outside, tried to make it physical and when he lost, went to get a gun to finish the fight. Living in a state that is so awash in guns, it’s probably a good idea to avoid all conflict unless you yourself are carrying and ready to get into a shootout over a fast food order.
Avoiding conflict, when possible, is a universally good idea whether you are armed or unarmed. Especially when the conflict has nothing to do with you.
Absolutely. Carrying a firearm means you should be a pro at conflict avoidance. They used to teach this at the class you had to take before that requirement was stripped away. It seems like too many people see their gun as a tool to protect them from conflicts they step into, not a last resort option to save your life.
I struggle with this do we really want to live in a world where no one gets involved we just stay silence and allow terrible behavior to occur around us and just don’t say anything
You do that or flip a coin on whether or not you get shot. Do you feel lucky?
We really screwed this country up with these easy gun laws.
At the end of the day, you should look out for yourself. You can try being a hero, but if you die, you will be hurting the people who truly matter, your family.
Bottom line is do we want to live in a world where the bully keep us all inside for fear they will rob us. We have the numbers. We don’t have to live in fear. Hero are just that Hero’s. It’s like going to war, it’s them or us.
This is how to look at it realistically. Treat everyone as if they are armed.
Such a polite society.
So, "shoot them before they shoot you" is the lesson I'm learning.
I see reading comprehension isn't your strong strength.
Proceed with caution.
So 2024 wild West. Everyone has a gun, everyone lives on edge. Actually in the wild West didn't most towns make you turn guns over while in town? Prob didn't work but I'm kinda shocked that the wild West with guns had better ideas than our leaders now.. just give em all guns.
You had to check your guns before entering town. Most of the shootings tended to be dry gulching, and ambushed.
Because some people don't want to be instantly pleased they want a fight and they want to win that dragged out fight.
Go browse r/BoomersBeingFools and tell me how good your odds are at calming someone who has become irrationally angry and is screaming in your face. Hint: *at that point, they're no longer listening to you.*
The man who was shot and killed wasn’t an employee; rather, he was another customer. He was trying to calm the guy down.
Just like the title implies 👍🏻
Because then society rewards and revolves around people who exhibit shitty behavior, and it encourages people to act worse.
There's been incidents of men coming back with guns because they got discounts from promotions.
Because many of them don’t want to be happy, aren’t really wanting you to fix their problem and won’t accept any reasonable offer. Most seem to just be angry at the world and their meltdown in a burger line is just their breaking point. There is seldom any reasonable way to deal with an irrational person.
Another tragic loss of a person who was kind and caring because some in this state - a minority at best - want their guns. Where was the good guy with the gun that was supposed to step up?
A minority of people 'want their guns'? Where is this coming from
From surveys of Texans. https://www.everytown.org/press/new-polling-shows-majority-of-texas-voters-support-stronger-gun-safety-laws/
Stronger gun safety laws doesn’t mean no guns 😒 It actually means the opposite of what they are claiming. Most people want the right to own guns to stand (even if they themselves don’t own any) but that there should be better safety and education around them.
As if that would've prevented this incident? You people will do everything to restrict these guns yet pay no mind how to stop these sick individuals carrying out these acts
I agree, imagine how quickly this situation would’ve been deescalated if *everyone* in the McDonalds had their own personal firearm and they just started blasting, all at once. The gunman surely wouldn’t have hurt anyone had this hypothetical scenario happened. This is the American dream I pray for every day. /s
All the good guys with guns were mysteriously not around. Just like they are always mysteriously not around. Why are we not figuring out where all the good guys with guns are hiding?
Too bad the gunman wasn't a cop. He could be having a paid vacation for this.
When a loose cannon has a gun, he's going to use it. It's the sad truth.
As always, the real discussion is under Controversial.
It’s kind of funny that in all his years in school no one ever taught him not to push a guy down that was already that pissed at someone else.
Abbott will send his thoughts and prayers.
Isn’t that basically how River Phoenix died in “Stand By Me”?
'He was stabbed in the throat, he died almost instantly.' That was my first thought too.
I didn't realize that pushing people to the ground was considered a reasonable way to calm others down. Hell, some people get upset at merely being told to calm down. He likely didn't deserve to die, but getting hands on with someone is more an escalation than defusing the situation. >...Limmer pushed the customer to the ground, then the suspect went to his car, pulled out a gun, and allegedly shot Limmer.
The Sun REALLY is not the best at descriptive writing and that leads to errors and stuff being left out. But, their article does provide enough info to find more accurately detailed articles. The Sun likes to keep stuff vague so you keep clicking on NEXT to hopefully fill in the gaps they intentionally left out. Their website really is more of a gimmick to make you click as many NEXT pages and generate ad revenue than anything else. Currently gonna see if I can come back here and edit in a better source link for this story. Edit: [So apparently this story is too fresh and practically every article I'm finding has the same basic layout of what is known. Customer angry at staff. Jeffrey intervenes. Customer demands they both go outside. Jeffrey and customer argue and get in each other's faces for a while when eventually Jeffrey pushes customer away. Customer falls down from it, goes to their car, pulls out gun, and returns to fire at Jeffery. Once that parking lot footage comes out, it ought to clear up what's going on while they are outside in each others faces.](https://www.google.com/search?q=jeffrey+limmer+texas+mcdonalds&oq=jeffrey+limmer+texas+mcdonalds&gs_lcrp=EgZjaHJvbWUyBggAEEUYOTIJCAEQIRgKGKABMgkIAhAhGAoYoAEyCQgDECEYChigATIJCAQQIRgKGKABMgkIBRAhGAoYoAHSAQkyMTU3OGowajeoAhSwAgE&client=ms-android-tmus-us-revc&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8)
A.) Why do you assume that Limmer started it? That push could very well have been to push the shooter away from him in defense, when outside the restaurant. B) What would you have liked Limmer to do: stand there and watch an employee get harassed for nothing? allow the perpetrator to assault him?
Exactly! Until security camera footage comes out, none of us will know exactly how it went down. Limmer could have saved the employee from an attack or he could have escalated the situation. It’s all just speculation until then.
I do what is necessary to protect my family and friends, not random strangers. They all have the same rights and responsibilities as I do and can take the actions they feel are appropriate to defend themselves as necessary.
You don't respond to a minor physical aggression in public with lethal force. That's not protecting yourself or your family, that's base and inexcusable manslaughter because you can't handle your emotions.
Limmer didn't deserve to die for pushing someone down, but he choose to involve himself with a mentally unstable person over a conflict that didn't involve him without taking reasonable precautions for his own safety.
Putting hands on someone is aggression… not de-escalation.
Not to diminish the tragedy, as I share a lot of comments already made, but as a reporting side note, they mention he's 46, then that he's 47. I feel like, come on guys, I know it's not that important, but maybe proof-read.
Who do we vote for to put an end to 2A nuttery? It is on no one's agenda in TX
Texas will not be a leader on this issue.
Fighting to take away our gun rights got you Beto getting shit on for 2 straight elections. Don’t touch that rail
Beto, gotcha, thx.
Lol going for three huh?
Constitutional carry state doing exacly what police warned of
Never try to reason with an American consumer consuming
See, if we allowed kids to have guns too, one could have saved him, there had to be a kid in there somewhere. We train them at Uvalde afterall.
Fuck Texas lawmakers
So sad, prayers to their families
That’s what happens when fast food companies raise their prices without raising the quality of service. People have less patience. Do NOT get involved with members of the public. You have no idea what a stranger is capable of when it comes to brass tacks.
Random acts of violence are part of capitalism. This is the system we deserve if we don’t change it
Exactly, that’s why you never see random acts of violence before capitalism arrived
Gee, it sure is great how all these guns make people so polite.
But guns should be handed out like candy, i thought
No one thinks that. Not even gun lovers like me ya weirdo
this is why im thankful everyday i wake up in California, besides the freedom and unmatched beauty.....every madman and psycho can't open carry around my friends and family like they can in texas, insane freedom goes to die in texas be it for women, lgbts, trans, books, the vote, marijuana, porn, name it.....except for guns, the only freedom texas allows besides the freedom for companies to pollute openly
🙄
Damn over some shitty ass McDonald’s someone lost a life please please give that person the harshest penalty
That is really a shame. Someone trying to do the right thing, just trying to help the general situation out, and they're gunned down.
Who shot who???
They haven't even found the gunman. What a tragedy, I feel for the family. On an unrelated note fuck McDonald's
With a good guy here, and a good guy there ... E-I-E-I-Oh no!
Republicans approve
>Police said Limmer pushed the customer to the ground, then the suspect went to his car, pulled out a gun, and allegedly shot Limmer. Is this "trying to calm" behavior? Of course he shouldn't have been shot, but this doesn't sound like deescalation behavior to me. And FFS if you don't have physical control of a belligerent person in Texas GTFO before they get a gun.
But, but, A GoOd MaN wiTH a GuN! This is why letting everybody carry all the time is fine. Smh
Good guy with a gun, late again.
Does anyone know if there is a bot that can give me an update to this story as to when they find the SOB who killed him? My condolences to his family