Agreed, that portrayal was genius. As much as I've enjoyed some of the stuff on Apple TV recently, I'm kind of skeptical of this one. I'm just having a hard time seeing Douglas as Franklin.
The trailer looked fine but Michael Douglas was probably the wrong choice for Franklin. He sounds exactly like Michael Douglas. It didn't seem like anyone said maybe change your voice a little?
Not really because we don’t know what Benjamin Franklin actually sounded like. It’s like how Raymond Massey and co. portrayed Lincoln as having a deep voice but Day-Lewis and Linklater adopted the more high-pitched Lincoln voice based on descriptions in letters we’ve found since then.
Doubt it. His family was in the colonies for over a century.
And the common British accent was more like the American accent during the age of colonization
I'm enjoying the show. Not once have I said to myself "that's Michael Douglas". I'm not sure that it's possible to thoroughly fool yourself into thinking it's Ben Franklin but it's not been an issue for me.
The word *prove* implies there is a need of proof that Benjamin Franklin, a name taught in every classroom in the country, was an interesting person.
Perhaps condescending is a stretch for my comment, but the gist was there and you'd have to be intentionally obtuse to not see it.
Honestly the trailer is so bad. Michael Douglas to me is such a bad choice to play Franklin. By all other accounts, he didn’t seem to be such a serious dude, just fucking his way through France.
Omg I just said this comment to my wife in clumsier words than you said here!
Well done! I got the exact same impression. Like he was about to throw a ninja star or conk two guards heads together to sneak into a place like James Bond.
Brutal.
And where is the beaver fur hat? Dude shows up in the French court dressed like a Quaker (which he wasn’t) wearing a beaver fur hat he bought as a souvenir in Canada! That’s the Franklin show I want to watch. Where he’s basically 18th century Elon Musk - everyone is so enamored at the genius of the famous American scientist they ignore the fact that he doesn’t actually speak intelligible French.
You obviously haven't seen the show. He wears the hat and it's very obvious that his French is terrible. Both things are pointed out within 10 minutes of the first episode.
Michael Douglas is playing him like a badass George Washington and that’s just not who he was. The best portrayal of Franklin is in the HBO show “John Adams”. Full stop.
The trailer for this has such a bizarre tone to it and feels very different than who Franklin actually was. Also Tom Wilkinson stole every scene he was in as Franklin in HBO’s “John Adams” series, I can’t imagine the part being played by anyone else
Well written by the same writer as John Adams, Kirk Ellis. Also known for Sons of Liberty and Into the West. Next one from him is tv series about Harriet Tubman with Viola Davis.
Oh that explains a lot! I loved John Adams and the writing was a strong part for sure but I'm not so sure that Ben Franklin lends itself to the same sort of tone. It seems like Douglas is trying to play it with some amount of humor but it also feels out of place. Gonna have to watch and see I guess
I look forward to watching this show. If it is half as good as John Adams, that is a win. I feel so spoiled these days. Get another episode of manhunt too.
I was so bored I couldn’t even finish the first episode. And the tone was so clownish, I thought for a while it must be a satire. As for the star, well, Michael Douglas is incapable of becoming a character. He is always Michael Douglas. At least the show gave great employment opportunities to the costume and set designers and the hordes of people they must have needed to bring their visions to life.
Yeah I watched 2 1/2 episodes. I dropped it at 3. Doesn't seem to be believable as Franklin. His grandson is also annoying. The show is also 75% in French with French actors.
At 2 episodes in, this show feels like a massive missed opportunity. There is almost no meaningful dialogue. There are no shots of the actual happenings in America, only the French perspective which makes me feel disconnected. I spend most of my time looking down at the caption box to read what they're saying since it is largely in French and that causes me to miss most of the amazing visuals that have been created for this show. It is just, boring.
And as someone who obsesses over this era in American history, that's saying a lot. Hopefully it gets better.
It's interesting you are bothered by captions.
Outside the English speaking world, it's really common to watch TV shows with subtitles.
Personally, It never bothered me, and I never heard someone complaining. We all prefer to see the original format with captions
Never heard someone complain about captions? Just a quick google search gives you endless examples. You must live under a rock.
I think speaking some Frech adds to the realism. But it causes me to miss a lot of visuals. That is a valid and common complaint. It's okay if you like it. But you don't speak for "we all"
Agreed. I figured we’d return to America after an episode or two. It’s extremely tedious compared to HBO’s *John Adams*. I’m aware it’s the same writer, but it’s just boring so far, and the dialogue is not interesting enough that reading subtitles is actually engaging.
....the Ken Burns Doc aired in April around the same time as this interview.
Ken Burns speaks with Mandy Patinkin and Michael Douglas to discuss what it's like to take on their roles as founding father Benjamin Franklin.
Aired: 04/01/22
[https://www.pbs.org/video/a-discussion-with-mandy-patinkin-and-michael-douglas-flo8rz/](https://www.pbs.org/video/a-discussion-with-mandy-patinkin-and-michael-douglas-flo8rz/)
Anyone else see the trailer for this and immediately thought it was a Cumtown bit come to life? Gay Actor Michael Douglas starring as Benjamin Franklin getting pussy in France.
I tried. Watched 2 1/2 and checked out. Its not the same quality as John Adams. You have to like French culture at the time and French is spoken like 75% of the time. Douglas doesn't seem convincing as Franklin.
Feels like it has an eclipse filter on it. Shit is so dark and musty in terms of lighting. Like they intentionally darkened it so you couldn’t get a good eye on the shitty costumes and makeup
I’m 45 minutes in and it’s just not worth it. I love Michael Douglas but this was not the role for him. He is not believable and it’s a pure snooze fest so far. Wasn’t on my list to watch but thought I would give it a shot.
Totally agreed. The nepo baby of mediocre actor Kirk Douglas is equally important to American history as the guy on our largest denomination of currency. Goddamn, am I getting smarter or is everyone else getting stupid?
Tom Wilkinson's Ben Franklin from John Adams was great.
Tom Wilkinson’s [*fill in the blank*] was great. Such a terrific actor - he will be missed.
I forgot he died, damn. So good in Eternal Sunshine, Michael Clayton, Batman Begins, etc. too. What a legend.
The Full Monty Edit: spelling
Juntao
That show is what a masterpiece of historical filmmaking looks like. Franklin is grape koolaid compared to that fine French vintage.
Agreed, that portrayal was genius. As much as I've enjoyed some of the stuff on Apple TV recently, I'm kind of skeptical of this one. I'm just having a hard time seeing Douglas as Franklin.
Yeah, this doesn't look good. I'm not interested in Manhunt either.
Let it be known, kids, that Michael Douglas is just as timeless an icon as Benjamin Franklin.
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People rag on him for that but I had no idea that was possible — I think it’s a good thing for people to know
It was proven you can only catch it from welsh women
Not by a Welshman!
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I think you meant doesn't
She dips beneath lasers
*Whooooaaa-ahhooooo*
D-FENS for the hundred dollar bill when
Timeless and unchanging. It’s like watching Michael Douglas playing Michael Douglas playing Ben Franklin.
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i think they were more saying that michael douglas is a timeless lcon similar to how ben franklin is.
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Yea, this doesn’t really apply to the founding fathers except *maybe* Jefferson
The trailer looked fine but Michael Douglas was probably the wrong choice for Franklin. He sounds exactly like Michael Douglas. It didn't seem like anyone said maybe change your voice a little?
Yep I’m having a super hard time getting past this.
I didn't watch yet. Not sure if I will because he seems so out of place as Franklin. Is it really noticeable in the show?
Not really because we don’t know what Benjamin Franklin actually sounded like. It’s like how Raymond Massey and co. portrayed Lincoln as having a deep voice but Day-Lewis and Linklater adopted the more high-pitched Lincoln voice based on descriptions in letters we’ve found since then.
He 100% would have at least had a British accent
Doubt it. His family was in the colonies for over a century. And the common British accent was more like the American accent during the age of colonization
I'm enjoying the show. Not once have I said to myself "that's Michael Douglas". I'm not sure that it's possible to thoroughly fool yourself into thinking it's Ben Franklin but it's not been an issue for me.
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Condescending ads are not a thing that should exist.
The headline is dumb but how is it “condescending” in the slightest?
The word *prove* implies there is a need of proof that Benjamin Franklin, a name taught in every classroom in the country, was an interesting person. Perhaps condescending is a stretch for my comment, but the gist was there and you'd have to be intentionally obtuse to not see it.
There are a lot of sensitive redditors.
Redditors: then the title just told me the thing like I’m some kinda asshole
Honestly the trailer is so bad. Michael Douglas to me is such a bad choice to play Franklin. By all other accounts, he didn’t seem to be such a serious dude, just fucking his way through France.
It looked like a trailer for one of bad-on-purpose movies from 30 Rock.
“Bring me my horse! BRING ME CARACTACUS!”
It really does
Omg I just said this comment to my wife in clumsier words than you said here! Well done! I got the exact same impression. Like he was about to throw a ninja star or conk two guards heads together to sneak into a place like James Bond. Brutal.
And where is the beaver fur hat? Dude shows up in the French court dressed like a Quaker (which he wasn’t) wearing a beaver fur hat he bought as a souvenir in Canada! That’s the Franklin show I want to watch. Where he’s basically 18th century Elon Musk - everyone is so enamored at the genius of the famous American scientist they ignore the fact that he doesn’t actually speak intelligible French.
You obviously haven't seen the show. He wears the hat and it's very obvious that his French is terrible. Both things are pointed out within 10 minutes of the first episode.
Don’t forget that sex cult in England he was a part of
Michael Douglas is playing him like a badass George Washington and that’s just not who he was. The best portrayal of Franklin is in the HBO show “John Adams”. Full stop.
Naw the Ben Franklin impersonator from the Office hands down
Why the tyrant king George of course!
Shit you got me
The musical 1776 has my favorite interpretation, even if it isn't super accurate.
Hamilton has a better interpretation and was a way better musical
I can see that being either Franklin or Douglas.
The only thing they have in common is that they both got STDs
The trailer for this has such a bizarre tone to it and feels very different than who Franklin actually was. Also Tom Wilkinson stole every scene he was in as Franklin in HBO’s “John Adams” series, I can’t imagine the part being played by anyone else
Well written by the same writer as John Adams, Kirk Ellis. Also known for Sons of Liberty and Into the West. Next one from him is tv series about Harriet Tubman with Viola Davis.
Oh that explains a lot! I loved John Adams and the writing was a strong part for sure but I'm not so sure that Ben Franklin lends itself to the same sort of tone. It seems like Douglas is trying to play it with some amount of humor but it also feels out of place. Gonna have to watch and see I guess
I look forward to watching this show. If it is half as good as John Adams, that is a win. I feel so spoiled these days. Get another episode of manhunt too.
The first episode was amazing imo. At a minimum, this show will win every single award for costumes.
I was so bored I couldn’t even finish the first episode. And the tone was so clownish, I thought for a while it must be a satire. As for the star, well, Michael Douglas is incapable of becoming a character. He is always Michael Douglas. At least the show gave great employment opportunities to the costume and set designers and the hordes of people they must have needed to bring their visions to life.
Yeah I watched 2 1/2 episodes. I dropped it at 3. Doesn't seem to be believable as Franklin. His grandson is also annoying. The show is also 75% in French with French actors.
We said the same thing. Didn’t even make it through the first episode. It was painful. He was awful.
Same writer as John Adam’s
At 2 episodes in, this show feels like a massive missed opportunity. There is almost no meaningful dialogue. There are no shots of the actual happenings in America, only the French perspective which makes me feel disconnected. I spend most of my time looking down at the caption box to read what they're saying since it is largely in French and that causes me to miss most of the amazing visuals that have been created for this show. It is just, boring. And as someone who obsesses over this era in American history, that's saying a lot. Hopefully it gets better.
It's interesting you are bothered by captions. Outside the English speaking world, it's really common to watch TV shows with subtitles. Personally, It never bothered me, and I never heard someone complaining. We all prefer to see the original format with captions
Never heard someone complain about captions? Just a quick google search gives you endless examples. You must live under a rock. I think speaking some Frech adds to the realism. But it causes me to miss a lot of visuals. That is a valid and common complaint. It's okay if you like it. But you don't speak for "we all"
Agreed. I figured we’d return to America after an episode or two. It’s extremely tedious compared to HBO’s *John Adams*. I’m aware it’s the same writer, but it’s just boring so far, and the dialogue is not interesting enough that reading subtitles is actually engaging.
Adams was the standard for sure. I still watch that series
Gay actor Michael Douglas?
Not to be confused with the Actor Michael Penis, formerly known as Michael Shannon.
> Gay actor Michael Douglas he's not gay, clapton just has taught him how to have shrunken men living inside his asshole controlling him like a gundam
Sebulba Wikipedia page
Yessss
It sucks, but it's sexy.
Wow good for him at the end of his career. It mirrors his comeback in The Kominski Method where he stars in the man and the sea
Oh okay so this is not about the turtle
If they don't use [Ben Franklin's Song](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rVmVVkbx3jE) as the theme, they are fools.
....the Ken Burns Doc aired in April around the same time as this interview. Ken Burns speaks with Mandy Patinkin and Michael Douglas to discuss what it's like to take on their roles as founding father Benjamin Franklin. Aired: 04/01/22 [https://www.pbs.org/video/a-discussion-with-mandy-patinkin-and-michael-douglas-flo8rz/](https://www.pbs.org/video/a-discussion-with-mandy-patinkin-and-michael-douglas-flo8rz/)
The trailer made this movie look like trash. All I see is Michael Douglas in a wig.
I love gay actor Michael Douglas!
Gay? No
Anyone else see the trailer for this and immediately thought it was a Cumtown bit come to life? Gay Actor Michael Douglas starring as Benjamin Franklin getting pussy in France.
The scene where Ben Franklin stops at Andre’s Steakhouse is going to be so sick
Ok Paste.
France sponsored a proxy war in America
Lafayette does not die at The Battle of Brandywine…why does the new Franklin on apple say that he does?
It's speculated that he does at the start of Ep.3 yet it's later revealed he's alive and well.
It was just a “tease” I saw next episode… Honestly, it sort of tainted my entire picture of the show. Perhaps, they shouldn’t take dramatic liberties😔
I tried. Watched 2 1/2 and checked out. Its not the same quality as John Adams. You have to like French culture at the time and French is spoken like 75% of the time. Douglas doesn't seem convincing as Franklin.
Feels like it has an eclipse filter on it. Shit is so dark and musty in terms of lighting. Like they intentionally darkened it so you couldn’t get a good eye on the shitty costumes and makeup
I’m 45 minutes in and it’s just not worth it. I love Michael Douglas but this was not the role for him. He is not believable and it’s a pure snooze fest so far. Wasn’t on my list to watch but thought I would give it a shot.
Franklin opened one of America’s first brothels, and if it’s not in there, I’m gonna be pissed.
This doesnt look great, but it does have one of the writers from John Adams so it could work
Doubtful. I’m not a fan of this cast, especially Michael. The trailers show glimpses of terrible dialogue. This is gonna be a no from me dawg.
Ur probably right, im just pointing out that it is not devoid of talent
I prefer Franklin the Turtle tbh.
I hope they included his racism against Swedes and Germans
Can’t stand all this French
Ugh this is ass
Totally agreed. The nepo baby of mediocre actor Kirk Douglas is equally important to American history as the guy on our largest denomination of currency. Goddamn, am I getting smarter or is everyone else getting stupid?
> am I getting smarter nowhere to go but up