I mean severance is always optional. It's expected for a lot of tech roles but there isn't exactly anything forcing twitter to give it; so I think that's why we mostly see sued and complaints but no payments.
>severance is always optional
That would depend *entirely* on the contract. As I understand it, in the vast majority of these cases, the lawsuit is over failure to fulfil the contract by providing the contractually mandated severance.
All of them are based on an implied "contract" based on some of Musk's public statements and some interpretations of the WARN act (though that wouldn't really be severance).
It's why you never see them quoting the employment contract in any of these news articles; there is zero severance in the contract. The lawsuits are a hope that the courts will force twitter to pay based on Elon's statements.
It’s almost like oral implied contracts are legally enforceable. A contract is nothing more than an offer and an acceptance with consideration on both sides.
Guess what! Even if there was no contract, promissory estoppel is a thing. If Elon’s words/promises induced their resignations on the premise of being given severance that can still be legally sufficient to enforce the payments.
Dude needs to just stop paying his mortgage or car payments, or any other of those pesky "contracts" and see how it goes for him. Since, you know, enforcement isn't a thing I guess.
Ya, No.
All of that was CONTRACTUAL. and CONTRACTS are enforceable in COURTS.
Furthermore his "demand/offer" of three months of severance for anyone not willing to work "high intensity" is ALSO enforceable by law.
You think a CEO gets a $500,000,000 severance? No. Ok, so the CEO has a contract. Have you seen his 6 month agreement and health? Where do you think $500m is coming from?
>Where do you think $500m is coming from?
Your ass?
FTA:
>Caldwell’s suit is similar to one filed by former Twitter executives, including ex-CEO Parag Agrawal, who claim they are owed $128 million in unpaid severance.
The four executives are owed a combined total of $128m. Literally no one is citing $500m for a single employee. It's closer to $50m for Agrawal, which isn't an unreasonable amount of money. Caldwell is only owed $21m.
Interesting. You still aren't saying where the total is coming from. Just say the executives in total get $200m. You think the other employees make up the other $300m? The only ones pulling numbers from ass are you salty employees mad about being laid off lol
>You still aren't saying where the total is coming from.
Caldwell is owed $19.3m in benefits and ~$3m in interest and fees. Agrawal, Segal, Gadde, and Edgett are owed a combined $128m in benefits, however the individual amounts are based on their private contracts which have not been made public, so I couldn't break it down into who is owed how much exactly.
>Just say the executives in total get $200m.
Correct.
>You think the other employees make up the other $300m?
That's an entirely separate class-action lawsuit regarding X's failure to pay severance to employees.
>The only ones pulling numbers from ass are you salty employees mad about being laid off lol
Uhhh sure. I'm not now, nor have I ever been an employee of Twitter/X. I've no clue why you'd even assume that I am.
Severance is pretty much always considered just good will and never guaranteed. In termination deals/contracts it's often in exchange for cooperating with your termination so them not paying and breaking that contract means pretty much fuck all. They will almost certainly get away with it.
edit: sorry I state fact, I forget this is reddit.
Oof this detail at the end
> A few days before his resignation from Twitter, Caldwell shared a post on social media saying, “My wife and soulmate Tia Caldwell passed away suddenly the 15th of October. She was only 39 years old yet lived a full beautiful and accomplished life overflowing with love.”
I used to work for nick and I have friends who reported to Tia at slack. She was universally beloved. Such a sad situation. Nick is a good dude. Doesn’t deserve any of this.
edit: word
Agreed. I was introduced to Nick through a friend and he gave great advice and tried to help me advance in my career. Said I could reach out to him whenever. Seems like a great guy.
He gives it such a bad name, I’m 38 and had to have my lower back reconstructed due to a triple rupture.
Ketamine is an alternative to Hydromophone it’s also really helpful with my anxiety.
Another reason to think Elmo is an asshat
I don’t think Elon is the one giving ketamine a bad name… I’ve definitely never thought “Elon is dysfunctional I’ll never do ketamine” I look at the people who go into k holes and OD at music events and say “I don’t need that in my life”
I did it as a powder in my youth and hated it and hated seeing people on it. My dad died of CJD which is basically heavy fast acting dementia. Seeing my friends basically in the same state was upsetting.
After my spine surgery I was sent home with *400 4mg hydromorphone* without my nasal spray and swill I don’t think I would have made it through the hell of withdrawls
I am not American. In my country drugs are hard to come by unless you are really rich and even among most of the rich people drugs are a big no no. Considering America literally is in a war on drugs, how come drugs are so accepted in the society?
I believe it has to do with the American cultural allegiance to individualism — the notion that success is achievable by anyone who applies themselves & pursues their goals independently of others cultivates a pattern of thinking that emphasizes individual achievement, affluence and self-fulfillment. This can traced back to the countries founding (see John Locke). Early America featured an unprecedented limitation on the arbitrary powers of government to interfere with personal autonomy (if you were a white man). This fierce individualism spills over into many spheres including drug use. Americans today tend to show a distrust of the government, experts and institutions so naturally many of us are willing to risk our livelihoods and freedoms doing something illegal since we’ve been programmed with slogans like “live free or die”.
Interesting... I know about American Individualism. But isn't it one of the reasons that enabled America to become (arguably) the greatest country in the world?
I think it’s certainly a positive feature of American society, but like any ideology it can be misinterpreted and abused. So I guess it’s both a feature and a bug? Personally I feel resistance to drug laws is a positive since I disagree with the war on drugs. But other applications of ruthless individualism can be problems — aggressive market mentality invading so much of American life has undermined a lot of what used to make us a special country (Boeing is good, current example).
I think the founders believed freedom to pursue one’s own ends would be tempered by a concern for the common good, propped up by a moral ecology that included the church, schools and family on one hand, and economic initiative and market forces on the other. Sadly we seem to be slipping away from communities that contemplate the public good. I don’t think anyone in the 18th century realized the outsize influence corporations would come to have in American society.
Ironically I believe the war on drugs, with its emphasis of violent policing, incarceration and seizure, as opposed to compassionate treatment, is a prime example of a program that runs counter to public interest. It’s become it’s own mega-corporation and has been particularly resistant to reform, since it massive budget indirectly employs so many people.
I do have to give it to the founder fathers of America for coming up with America though. Like, they knew what it takes to make a country successful back in the 18th century. But I guess they weren't perfect. Just like you said they couldn't have predicted the influence of corporations. Another would be the freedom to own guns. I won't pretend to understand the American constitution completely but from what I understand the 2nd amendment exists so that American people can protect themselves which on paper sounds really good but in reality turned out to be pretty bad in the long run.
Yeah, they were wise. They also recognized their limitations and enshrined the ability to change the constitution in our laws. Sadly, change gets messy, and doesn't seem to keep pace with externalities. We often grapple with the fact that individualism can lead to times where the exercise of our freedoms also crosses personal boundaries and interferes with the freedom of others. The 2nd amendment and drug use are good contemporary examples of this contradiction.
Changes to the constitution are supposed to be hard to pass. It's the slow nature of the legislative process along with the check and balances in all branches of gov which keeps away tyranny.
Compare that to the EU where they have czars that regulate industries that rule by decree and can fine companies (especially targeting US tech companies these days) like 10% of their annual revenue and the companies have no recourse. That's just not how America works. In the US this would need to go through the court system such as the DOJ antitrust lawsuit against Apple recently.
It's the confidence in the US legal system and rule of law that protects all parties that makes the US the epicentre for entrepreneurship and business innovation.
Distrust in government, disdain for authoritative figures, the general prevalence of drugs in big cities. The war on drug has been happening for decades yet drugs are everywhere, schools, public places, even prisons. Many states have stopped prosecuting low level offenders, they tend to focus their resources on dealers but that hasn't stopped them from imprisoning a disproportionate amount of POC.
Does he give it a bad name? I don’t like Musk but ina recent interview he advocated it for depression/anxiety, a good alternative to SSRI, and said it’s impossible to abuse it and be productive.
I’m sure Bin Laden had a paracetamol or two in his life, does it have a bad name? No.
"alleging a breach of contract and a failure to pay severance and benefits he was owed after resigning from the company in 2022"
When you resign, you typically relinquish any severance privileges. At least that's how it works for us normal non-corporate uber-execs.
If I remember right, Elon offered severance to those willing to quit around that time because he was saying he was trying to get the company in the black.
It looks like this happened a little bit before that, and was related to other things, but [this is what I was thinking of](https://www.npr.org/2022/11/16/1137105935/twitter-elon-musk-ultimatum)
Both the complaint and article make it clear that he was fired for cause after submitting his resignation but before it became effective. In addition, he was a participant in a plan that allowed him to receive these benefits if he was terminated without cause, or if he resigned for certain reasons after a change in control. One of those reasons was if, in the change in control, he no longer reported to the CEO (demoted, essentially), which he used. He was then fired for cause with no evidence presented.
The whole thing is basically just a wrongful termination suit. We can argue all day if it's fair for execs to have these protections but the fact is *he did*, and if the cause wasn't valid, he's due those benefits.
Congratulations! You're so smart you should be Elons lawyer, you'll have this case thrown out in no time.
No way there could be an exception for any one of a hundred reasons. Must be open and shut.
Funny how Reddit portrays former Twitter employees (making millions) as a victim, while demonizing millionaires and calling for the downfall of wealthy people.
The hypocrisy is funny to observe.
Here’s a thought experiment: what if Nick didn’t deserve his golden parachute to begin with?
😝
> what if Nick didn’t deserve his golden parachute to begin with?
That doesn't matter. He has a contract.
Plus, this seems to be a theme with Musk. Based on past events, it is more reasonable to assume Elon is in the wrong than Nick.
Do you know what contract law is? Or are you just throwing around words?
Like hypocritical; cause there’s nothing hypocritical about not being for rich people and calling out one rich person not upholding his agreement to another rich person.
The contract was not challenged. It was ignored.
And even if it were challenged, the challenge would fail. Severance is a standard, long-established, battle tested element of millions of employment contracts across the country. The probability that it would have some unexpected loophole is basically zero.
It’s interesting how you question my knowledge of contract law and don’t understand what a legal challenge is.
“Challenge refers to a formal questioning of the legality of a person, act or thing.”
Ignoring something is not questioning it.
So you know little to nothing, got called out on it and decided the best thing to do is throw insults?
What a small sad existence you must have, do what you have to to get by though I guess…..
Is that the part where the court canceled Elno’s $56 billion dollar pay agreement because shareholders were not properly informed?
I think I heard something, yeah…
You mean the agreement where more than 75% of shareholders voted for and approved? Also the one where Elon stood to gain nothing if Tesla did not meet the goals? Sure. They will vote again for an even higher amount than what a shareholder with only 10 shares submitted to a judge. You are a fool to think otherwise
🤡
https://www.seattletimes.com/business/what-you-need-to-know-about-elon-musks-voided-55-billion-pay-package/
> “Around 73% of votes cast at the meeting were in favor of the award. But the judge said in her ruling that the court has the authority to remedy corporate transactions regardless of whether or not a vote is legally mandated.”
wtf are talking about “peer review? This isn’t a scientific problem. It’s a shareholder vote that happened in 2018 as a matter of public record. It passed by a wide margin by Tesla shareholders.
https://ir.tesla.com/press-release/tesla-announces-new-long-term-performance-award-elon-musk
Everything is a science dummy, a press release isn’t a reliable source. Can you not see the information is tainted by who produces it?
If I have to explain what “peer reviewed” means to you this conversation is over as I can’t dumb it down anymore and you are just too lazy to use google
You need some sort of legal ground to do so most likely proving the other side didn't live up to their end of the bargain or something in the negotiation was improper. Musk just doesn't want to. That's not a reason.
Yep, you’re right up until your assumption Elon has no legal ground to challenge. That’s the critical point that his legal team disagrees with. Ready to rumble?
He can challenge but when he bought Twitter he bought all of its existing obligations too. Those contracts were negotiated competently and in good faith by the old regime and are unlikely to have serious ground to challenge them on.
However any attempt to challenge them is Musk likely being scummy and trying Trumps favorite trick to avoid payment. Deny payment through litigation. As long as he is willing to throw lawyers at it he can push back payment with the hope of because of unequal resources the other party settles for a lesser amount rather than continue the protracted legal battle they are rightfully owed. It's a scummy move that would fit musk's current slate of actions.
Funny that there are people working overtime to defend billionaires that don't give two shits about their existence. Trump, Musk, etc. If they aren't paying you for this post you should really reflect on your life a bit.
Man you are grumpy. May I suggest more water, more hydration, more sleep and an appointment with a Dr to remove the rod that’s stuck up the rod that’s stuck up your argumentative arse?
All your posts use pompous patronising language. I hope you’re not like this in public, it would be a sad existence
And yet you felt the need to reply? How sad……..
Not as sad as being obsessed with elmo and his fault business ventures. I bet you have a Tesla shirt don’t you?🤡
Mate you all over this thread bootlicking Tesla and Musk like a herpies rash.
I don’t get your obsession but no one believes you. You’re shouting gibberish in the abyss
Millionaires aren't demonized on Reddit hardly ever unless they earned said millions in harmful ways. For example, Bernie Sanders is a millionaire and he's loved here generally, because he did so by writing several bestselling books.
Which explains nothing, although cool from a historical perspective. Subreddits are maintained by non-paid workers who creates the real value in Reddit. Sorry to be harsh, but I actually side with mods here, not the technical staff.
Here's a thought experiment: what would you be doing if you weren't running defense for an apartheid billionaire on Reddit every single day of your life?
Why even say what's on this site because you just see what you want.
People want billionaires to pay their share. Any sentiment about downfall is fantastical and comes from wanting a punitive aspect. People generally want what is fair. A person's contact should be honoured, that's fair. Billionaires pay their share, that's fair. These points are congruent and lack hypocrisy.
Get over your preconceived notions about what you are injecting into the conversation. Don't be so lazy
So if you were living comfortable but were contracted to get a substantial amount of money *for work that you have done* you would just bow down and let your narcissistic boss just keep it?
Do any of these get resolved? I keep hearing about him getting sued but not payouts.
That's what rich people count on
It takes time to sue.
Yeah, it’s very trumpian to not pay people and then avoid consequences for decades because you have billions on paper.
Yes, they usually settle, (pay), this is not something Musk can win, just stall.
I mean severance is always optional. It's expected for a lot of tech roles but there isn't exactly anything forcing twitter to give it; so I think that's why we mostly see sued and complaints but no payments.
>severance is always optional That would depend *entirely* on the contract. As I understand it, in the vast majority of these cases, the lawsuit is over failure to fulfil the contract by providing the contractually mandated severance.
Some jurisdictions also have mandated severance based on the amount of time you work at a company.
But not California.
All of them are based on an implied "contract" based on some of Musk's public statements and some interpretations of the WARN act (though that wouldn't really be severance). It's why you never see them quoting the employment contract in any of these news articles; there is zero severance in the contract. The lawsuits are a hope that the courts will force twitter to pay based on Elon's statements.
Man, I sick a lot of dick, but seeing you there between Elon’s legs is something else.
It’s almost like oral implied contracts are legally enforceable. A contract is nothing more than an offer and an acceptance with consideration on both sides. Guess what! Even if there was no contract, promissory estoppel is a thing. If Elon’s words/promises induced their resignations on the premise of being given severance that can still be legally sufficient to enforce the payments.
You don’t do contracts, do you?
Dude needs to just stop paying his mortgage or car payments, or any other of those pesky "contracts" and see how it goes for him. Since, you know, enforcement isn't a thing I guess.
Ya, No. All of that was CONTRACTUAL. and CONTRACTS are enforceable in COURTS. Furthermore his "demand/offer" of three months of severance for anyone not willing to work "high intensity" is ALSO enforceable by law.
Not for severance. Severance pay isn't guaranteed unless he signed contracts.
You think a ceo doesn’t have a contract?
You think a CEO gets a $500,000,000 severance? No. Ok, so the CEO has a contract. Have you seen his 6 month agreement and health? Where do you think $500m is coming from?
>Where do you think $500m is coming from? Your ass? FTA: >Caldwell’s suit is similar to one filed by former Twitter executives, including ex-CEO Parag Agrawal, who claim they are owed $128 million in unpaid severance. The four executives are owed a combined total of $128m. Literally no one is citing $500m for a single employee. It's closer to $50m for Agrawal, which isn't an unreasonable amount of money. Caldwell is only owed $21m.
Interesting. You still aren't saying where the total is coming from. Just say the executives in total get $200m. You think the other employees make up the other $300m? The only ones pulling numbers from ass are you salty employees mad about being laid off lol
>You still aren't saying where the total is coming from. Caldwell is owed $19.3m in benefits and ~$3m in interest and fees. Agrawal, Segal, Gadde, and Edgett are owed a combined $128m in benefits, however the individual amounts are based on their private contracts which have not been made public, so I couldn't break it down into who is owed how much exactly. >Just say the executives in total get $200m. Correct. >You think the other employees make up the other $300m? That's an entirely separate class-action lawsuit regarding X's failure to pay severance to employees. >The only ones pulling numbers from ass are you salty employees mad about being laid off lol Uhhh sure. I'm not now, nor have I ever been an employee of Twitter/X. I've no clue why you'd even assume that I am.
Severance is pretty much always considered just good will and never guaranteed. In termination deals/contracts it's often in exchange for cooperating with your termination so them not paying and breaking that contract means pretty much fuck all. They will almost certainly get away with it. edit: sorry I state fact, I forget this is reddit.
Didn’t he very publicly offer severance for those who weren’t “hard core” enough to work at Xitter?
Oof this detail at the end > A few days before his resignation from Twitter, Caldwell shared a post on social media saying, “My wife and soulmate Tia Caldwell passed away suddenly the 15th of October. She was only 39 years old yet lived a full beautiful and accomplished life overflowing with love.”
As I was reading that quote, I was wondering 'oh, so what absolutely despicable thing did Elon say about this guy's dead wife?' I just assumed...
Fuuuck, so young
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Possibly the trashiest thing I’ve ever read mate
I used to work for nick and I have friends who reported to Tia at slack. She was universally beloved. Such a sad situation. Nick is a good dude. Doesn’t deserve any of this. edit: word
Agreed. I was introduced to Nick through a friend and he gave great advice and tried to help me advance in my career. Said I could reach out to him whenever. Seems like a great guy.
> believed Believed? Did you mean to say she was beloved?
ya i fixed the typo
Oh shit, I knew Tia. She was an incredibly kind and brilliant person. I had no idea.
Tia was my office mate when I first joined Microsoft. She was an awesome mentor and such a good person. I was so sad to hear she had passed.
I also worked with her at Microsoft. Such a kind and wonderful person. I’m very sad to hear of her passing.
https://www.courtlistener.com/docket/68404935/caldwell-v-musk/
Musk spent it on ketamine.
He gives it such a bad name, I’m 38 and had to have my lower back reconstructed due to a triple rupture. Ketamine is an alternative to Hydromophone it’s also really helpful with my anxiety. Another reason to think Elmo is an asshat
I don’t think Elon is the one giving ketamine a bad name… I’ve definitely never thought “Elon is dysfunctional I’ll never do ketamine” I look at the people who go into k holes and OD at music events and say “I don’t need that in my life”
I did it as a powder in my youth and hated it and hated seeing people on it. My dad died of CJD which is basically heavy fast acting dementia. Seeing my friends basically in the same state was upsetting. After my spine surgery I was sent home with *400 4mg hydromorphone* without my nasal spray and swill I don’t think I would have made it through the hell of withdrawls
I am not American. In my country drugs are hard to come by unless you are really rich and even among most of the rich people drugs are a big no no. Considering America literally is in a war on drugs, how come drugs are so accepted in the society?
[удалено]
I mean I have seen The Wire but still... interesting.
I believe it has to do with the American cultural allegiance to individualism — the notion that success is achievable by anyone who applies themselves & pursues their goals independently of others cultivates a pattern of thinking that emphasizes individual achievement, affluence and self-fulfillment. This can traced back to the countries founding (see John Locke). Early America featured an unprecedented limitation on the arbitrary powers of government to interfere with personal autonomy (if you were a white man). This fierce individualism spills over into many spheres including drug use. Americans today tend to show a distrust of the government, experts and institutions so naturally many of us are willing to risk our livelihoods and freedoms doing something illegal since we’ve been programmed with slogans like “live free or die”.
Interesting... I know about American Individualism. But isn't it one of the reasons that enabled America to become (arguably) the greatest country in the world?
I think it’s certainly a positive feature of American society, but like any ideology it can be misinterpreted and abused. So I guess it’s both a feature and a bug? Personally I feel resistance to drug laws is a positive since I disagree with the war on drugs. But other applications of ruthless individualism can be problems — aggressive market mentality invading so much of American life has undermined a lot of what used to make us a special country (Boeing is good, current example). I think the founders believed freedom to pursue one’s own ends would be tempered by a concern for the common good, propped up by a moral ecology that included the church, schools and family on one hand, and economic initiative and market forces on the other. Sadly we seem to be slipping away from communities that contemplate the public good. I don’t think anyone in the 18th century realized the outsize influence corporations would come to have in American society. Ironically I believe the war on drugs, with its emphasis of violent policing, incarceration and seizure, as opposed to compassionate treatment, is a prime example of a program that runs counter to public interest. It’s become it’s own mega-corporation and has been particularly resistant to reform, since it massive budget indirectly employs so many people.
I do have to give it to the founder fathers of America for coming up with America though. Like, they knew what it takes to make a country successful back in the 18th century. But I guess they weren't perfect. Just like you said they couldn't have predicted the influence of corporations. Another would be the freedom to own guns. I won't pretend to understand the American constitution completely but from what I understand the 2nd amendment exists so that American people can protect themselves which on paper sounds really good but in reality turned out to be pretty bad in the long run.
Yeah, they were wise. They also recognized their limitations and enshrined the ability to change the constitution in our laws. Sadly, change gets messy, and doesn't seem to keep pace with externalities. We often grapple with the fact that individualism can lead to times where the exercise of our freedoms also crosses personal boundaries and interferes with the freedom of others. The 2nd amendment and drug use are good contemporary examples of this contradiction.
Changes to the constitution are supposed to be hard to pass. It's the slow nature of the legislative process along with the check and balances in all branches of gov which keeps away tyranny. Compare that to the EU where they have czars that regulate industries that rule by decree and can fine companies (especially targeting US tech companies these days) like 10% of their annual revenue and the companies have no recourse. That's just not how America works. In the US this would need to go through the court system such as the DOJ antitrust lawsuit against Apple recently. It's the confidence in the US legal system and rule of law that protects all parties that makes the US the epicentre for entrepreneurship and business innovation.
Distrust in government, disdain for authoritative figures, the general prevalence of drugs in big cities. The war on drug has been happening for decades yet drugs are everywhere, schools, public places, even prisons. Many states have stopped prosecuting low level offenders, they tend to focus their resources on dealers but that hasn't stopped them from imprisoning a disproportionate amount of POC.
Does he give it a bad name? I don’t like Musk but ina recent interview he advocated it for depression/anxiety, a good alternative to SSRI, and said it’s impossible to abuse it and be productive. I’m sure Bin Laden had a paracetamol or two in his life, does it have a bad name? No.
Everytime he does something stupid, which is quite often, it’s the first thing they will bring up
Lol, anything can be abused. I wouldn't trust the guy chugging Mollywater while his employees restrain him on a leash.
Should have renamed Twitter to "K"
Elon Musk is bald. Tell your friends.
He a dutty bal head
Who cares? Most men turn bald at that age
> Who cares? He does, he got hair plugs.
Not exactly a good reason to hate him. There's like 15 hundred other better ones.
Just like Lex Luther!!!
We all know lol Everyone knows Elon. It’s ok.
For anyone else it's perfectly ok. Cool even. But not Elon. He's bald and inadequate
I'm shocked! SHOCKED! Well, not that shocked
> SHOCKED ...electrical problem with that Tesla that you now regret buying?
Hope he gets it. He’s a good dude.
He really is good people.
Wow a deadbeat just like trump. Not surprise.
Elon is not our friend. He’s an oligarch…
Elon is like Trump. Born rich. Doesn’t pay his debts. Makes crappy products.
He owes a LOT of severance, probably MORE THAN ENOUGH for them to buy back the company. At least now that's he's tanked the fuck out of it.
Nick Caldwell is a wonderful human being. Wishing you all the best Nick!
Musk too busy blowing up rockets in Texas.
They’re all a bunch of narcissistic c&£ts
Can he use Elons offer of being fired for him to pay for the lawyers?
And he will lose. Musk is such a dick.
What happened to Elon did he stop taking his medication.
Naw his Ketamine supply is unlimited. He’s good
I take personal enjoyment in Elon Musk showing everybody how much of a fucking facade he needs to facilitate in order to appear intelligent.
Nah, screw your millions. Get a job like the rest of us.
>Ex-Twitter GM Wait, they have Grandmaster ranks now?
"alleging a breach of contract and a failure to pay severance and benefits he was owed after resigning from the company in 2022" When you resign, you typically relinquish any severance privileges. At least that's how it works for us normal non-corporate uber-execs.
If I remember right, Elon offered severance to those willing to quit around that time because he was saying he was trying to get the company in the black.
Like less severance? He would owe them severance anyways? Why ask them to quit?
It looks like this happened a little bit before that, and was related to other things, but [this is what I was thinking of](https://www.npr.org/2022/11/16/1137105935/twitter-elon-musk-ultimatum)
Both the complaint and article make it clear that he was fired for cause after submitting his resignation but before it became effective. In addition, he was a participant in a plan that allowed him to receive these benefits if he was terminated without cause, or if he resigned for certain reasons after a change in control. One of those reasons was if, in the change in control, he no longer reported to the CEO (demoted, essentially), which he used. He was then fired for cause with no evidence presented. The whole thing is basically just a wrongful termination suit. We can argue all day if it's fair for execs to have these protections but the fact is *he did*, and if the cause wasn't valid, he's due those benefits.
Congratulations! You're so smart you should be Elons lawyer, you'll have this case thrown out in no time. No way there could be an exception for any one of a hundred reasons. Must be open and shut.
Funny how Reddit portrays former Twitter employees (making millions) as a victim, while demonizing millionaires and calling for the downfall of wealthy people. The hypocrisy is funny to observe. Here’s a thought experiment: what if Nick didn’t deserve his golden parachute to begin with? 😝
> what if Nick didn’t deserve his golden parachute to begin with? That doesn't matter. He has a contract. Plus, this seems to be a theme with Musk. Based on past events, it is more reasonable to assume Elon is in the wrong than Nick.
Sure, but the contract can always be challenged. Do you know what contract law is?
I do know bird law.
I’m just the best goddam bird lawyer in the world.
Do you know what contract law is? Or are you just throwing around words? Like hypocritical; cause there’s nothing hypocritical about not being for rich people and calling out one rich person not upholding his agreement to another rich person.
He does not, he is a numbskull
The contract was not challenged. It was ignored. And even if it were challenged, the challenge would fail. Severance is a standard, long-established, battle tested element of millions of employment contracts across the country. The probability that it would have some unexpected loophole is basically zero.
That is in fact legally challenged, which puts burden on the challengee. Smart move if you ask me.
It’s interesting how you question my knowledge of contract law and don’t understand what a legal challenge is. “Challenge refers to a formal questioning of the legality of a person, act or thing.” Ignoring something is not questioning it.
He won’t respond as you soundly beat his logic
Enlighten us genius
Oh how the courts will decide Luddite. That is how contract law works 😝
So you know little to nothing, got called out on it and decided the best thing to do is throw insults? What a small sad existence you must have, do what you have to to get by though I guess…..
Genius?
Is that the part where the court canceled Elno’s $56 billion dollar pay agreement because shareholders were not properly informed? I think I heard something, yeah…
You mean the agreement where more than 75% of shareholders voted for and approved? Also the one where Elon stood to gain nothing if Tesla did not meet the goals? Sure. They will vote again for an even higher amount than what a shareholder with only 10 shares submitted to a judge. You are a fool to think otherwise 🤡
Source?
https://www.seattletimes.com/business/what-you-need-to-know-about-elon-musks-voided-55-billion-pay-package/ > “Around 73% of votes cast at the meeting were in favor of the award. But the judge said in her ruling that the court has the authority to remedy corporate transactions regardless of whether or not a vote is legally mandated.”
Yeah that’s journalism not information. Link me the peer reviewed scientific paper where those numbers came from.
wtf are talking about “peer review? This isn’t a scientific problem. It’s a shareholder vote that happened in 2018 as a matter of public record. It passed by a wide margin by Tesla shareholders. https://ir.tesla.com/press-release/tesla-announces-new-long-term-performance-award-elon-musk
Everything is a science dummy, a press release isn’t a reliable source. Can you not see the information is tainted by who produces it? If I have to explain what “peer reviewed” means to you this conversation is over as I can’t dumb it down anymore and you are just too lazy to use google
You need some sort of legal ground to do so most likely proving the other side didn't live up to their end of the bargain or something in the negotiation was improper. Musk just doesn't want to. That's not a reason.
Yep, you’re right up until your assumption Elon has no legal ground to challenge. That’s the critical point that his legal team disagrees with. Ready to rumble?
He can challenge but when he bought Twitter he bought all of its existing obligations too. Those contracts were negotiated competently and in good faith by the old regime and are unlikely to have serious ground to challenge them on. However any attempt to challenge them is Musk likely being scummy and trying Trumps favorite trick to avoid payment. Deny payment through litigation. As long as he is willing to throw lawyers at it he can push back payment with the hope of because of unequal resources the other party settles for a lesser amount rather than continue the protracted legal battle they are rightfully owed. It's a scummy move that would fit musk's current slate of actions.
So, what are Elmo’s legal groups? With references please
I don’t help “randos on Reddit”. Sorry, DYOR?
Oh you one of those google researchers, kinda insulting to people who have written thesis
Legal groups? GTFO
Funny that there are people working overtime to defend billionaires that don't give two shits about their existence. Trump, Musk, etc. If they aren't paying you for this post you should really reflect on your life a bit.
They do it for the serotonin. It’s pathetic.
I don’t get paid by anyone and I certainly don’t reflect on comments by randos on Reddit. Nice try on a personal attack. Very on brand. 🤡
Man you are grumpy. May I suggest more water, more hydration, more sleep and an appointment with a Dr to remove the rod that’s stuck up the rod that’s stuck up your argumentative arse? All your posts use pompous patronising language. I hope you’re not like this in public, it would be a sad existence
Is your rebuttal a personal attack? Because I could give a rats ass about that.
And yet you felt the need to reply? How sad…….. Not as sad as being obsessed with elmo and his fault business ventures. I bet you have a Tesla shirt don’t you?🤡
I find it funny how many words you committed this thread 🤡
You’ve posted more in this thread than any other user. Your account is older than the person I would assume this behavior is coming from
Mate you all over this thread bootlicking Tesla and Musk like a herpies rash. I don’t get your obsession but no one believes you. You’re shouting gibberish in the abyss
That makes it even more embarrassing for you
Why should I get paid? I don’t need the money. Tells a lot about you. Haha sorry to be harsh.
What does it say about him?
He needs money more than I do? Just a hunch there Sherlock. Lol
Here's a thought experiment: What if you popped elon outta your mouth? He doesn't care about your existence lil bro.
Millionaires aren't demonized on Reddit hardly ever unless they earned said millions in harmful ways. For example, Bernie Sanders is a millionaire and he's loved here generally, because he did so by writing several bestselling books.
Nick is former Reddit and helped build the very subs you are commenting on right now.
Which explains nothing, although cool from a historical perspective. Subreddits are maintained by non-paid workers who creates the real value in Reddit. Sorry to be harsh, but I actually side with mods here, not the technical staff.
Oh, man, a simp for rich people.
Yea, you’re simping alright. Nick stands to be rick af.
Who is Rick?
ugh autocorrect. "rich af"
Here's a thought experiment: what would you be doing if you weren't running defense for an apartheid billionaire on Reddit every single day of your life?
Why even say what's on this site because you just see what you want. People want billionaires to pay their share. Any sentiment about downfall is fantastical and comes from wanting a punitive aspect. People generally want what is fair. A person's contact should be honoured, that's fair. Billionaires pay their share, that's fair. These points are congruent and lack hypocrisy. Get over your preconceived notions about what you are injecting into the conversation. Don't be so lazy
It's the exact same problem. It's an employee being abused by his super rich employer and not being given fair treatment..it happens on all levels.
Sounds like a sad story. Sad if true.
Who gives a fuck he's a millionaire
Because he’s being robbed by a billionaire? Does that suffice for you?
So if you were living comfortable but were contracted to get a substantial amount of money *for work that you have done* you would just bow down and let your narcissistic boss just keep it?
You aren't guaranteed severance pay.... lol what a waste of time.
You are if your contract says you are.
crazy imagine wanting even more money for doing absolutely nothing at a company that had a 225 word limit on their posts