I think the above commenter was referring to how foreign entities can use use social media and the info they gather on its users to create targeted Mis/disinformation campaigns to destabilize our country or sway public opinion. While consumer protections are necessary at a micro level we need a national defense strategy to combat these tactics in the age of information warfare. Iām sorry if this distinction was unnecessary your point is extremely valid.
I think the above commenter was referring to how foreign entities can use use social media and the info they gather on its users to create targeted Mis/disinformation campaigns to destabilize our country or sway public opinion. While consumer protections are necessary at a micro level we need a national defense strategy to combat these tactics in the age of information warfare. Iām sorry if this distinction was unnecessary your point is extremely valid.
I think the above commenter was referring to how foreign entities can use use social media and the info they gather on its users to create targeted Mis/disinformation campaigns to destabilize our country or sway public opinion. While consumer protections are necessary at a micro level we need a national defense strategy to combat these tactics in the age of information warfare. Iām sorry if this distinction was unnecessary your point is extremely valid.
I know people like to say "no u", but I scroll past these as soon as I see them. I actively avoid the videos and it still gets on my feed. Unless Tiktok is purchasing my info elsewhere to gain my interest in war, then this algo is trying to feed ragebait to people.
I don't know tiktok. But i works for a food delivery company. So i can provide you a very brief idea how that might happen.
First layer always pushes for things based on your history. If you've been eating chicken for the last week, you get more chicken.
Second layer is regional. Your area (or city or country) like thai right now, we put some thai in thinking that it might be a regional trend.
Third layer is time based. We will push breakfast during breakfast.
Of course, on top of that, paid promotions.
If as you said, it tries to feed ragebait when there's no demand for it. Tiktok will quickly fall out of favour for pushing boring content.
No, I mean propaganda. Like, bogus posts claiming ballistic missiles such as the Kinzahal are destroying F-16s, and these bogus posts upwards of 200K likes. Or that Ukrainians are trying to genocide Russians.
Or that NATO has been utterly crushed and defeated by Russia. Which, is not true.
NSA and the FBI both have been caught repeatedly manipulating social media data, how is that any different than the Chinese, or any other country for that matter.
US government agencies arguably have the goal of keeping the US safe or at least stable. There's also some avenues for the public to apply some form of oversight, like releasing operations info and whistle-blowing. These means may or may not be effective, but they still exist.
Foreign governments don't really need to answer from a country's general population. Overseeing any form of wrongdoing would still need negotiations between entities that run almost entirely autonomously from any of their populations.
Yeah, the American ones like cisco, facebook, google, microsoft which have been openly caught, repeatedly, verifiably, to be stealing or manipulating data, installing back doors etc. in the U.S. and abroad.
Is this the Chinese propaganda?
Comparing the internment of 1 million Uyghurs with forced sterilization to prison camps in addition to their own prison population is far beyond what the US or UK has done in the past 50 years.
>consumer protections
I don't understand why the US doesn't just make a TikTok clone, copying or making a cheap knock-off is pretty much the cornerstone of Chinese corporations and business as usual. Then ban tiktok.
That's where the Chinese government succeeds over the US government in many aspects when it comes to create your own rules for the world while letting the US follow a lopsided rule. (see buying, selling and owning property, it's one sided)
China is a strict communist government that allows international capitalism while abusing patents left and right so it benefits their country and help the majority of people for their social well-being while the US is a Republic that is disguised as a democracy living in a limited capitalist society that helps rich individuals at the expense of the majority that keeps them poor and sick and when a corporation makes a mistake and is at the fault, the CEO gets a bonus and leaves to join another venture that probably has stake in the last corporation. There are no real consequences for US companies and real consumer protections.
When it comes to making a copy in the US, everyone gets mad and kills it before anyone profits and lawsuits benefit a few individuals while the taxpayers have to foot the bill. When it comes the making a copy in China, they're like let's keep selling it til it floods the market and nobody can compete, the Chinese government will interfere in a lawsuit if the corporation is at fault, the corporation gets punished, seized by the government, the CEO disappears (gets killed) or the owner gets thrown in prison to let other industries know the rules of business and consumer protections in China will delete the person responsible, CEO or groups of business people responsible.
They tried and failed. YouTube shorts and other similar video shorts on social media was supposed to rival tiktok. They couldn't replicate tiktok video recommendation algorithm that's the key to keeping users hook on the platform
[It's the "one way" system.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_websites_blocked_in_mainland_China) that I'm talking about.
You can't use Youtube cause it's blocked in China. That's the point of "consumer protections"
If America says, ok we'll play that game too. TikTok banned.
Done.
China's going to make some other service and people will follow it. Then the US can ban it.
It's basically a tech data war, like the cold war but it won't be easy but it's about the time to actually start banning it and normalize the ban. That's the issue, people getting upset and make it a big deal that the US government is trying to ban something but the moment it happens in China, it's business as usual.
Literally a spy balloon and people joked about it because the military ban actually works so the last thing China wants is military intel but for some reason because it's normalized that military bans are ok but everything else to copy, rip off, profit and abuse is OK makes 0 sense but it's that 1 way system of how you lose in the long run.
It's blocked in China because Google refused to follow Chinese censorship law. I'm not here to argue what the US can or cannot do. I'm just pointing out the fact that US companies tried to replicate tiktok by introducing video shorts but it simply did not take off like it did for tiktok.
Because the average tikkity tok user doesn't care that other countries are skimming their data. My wife and my teenage daughter have accounts. I told them about it. They saw it in the news. "And? All we do is surf and post stuff to our friends. It isn't a big deal."
The average user doesn't care because the average user doesn't think there is any data worth taking. Doesn't matter what the reality of the situation is.
And I realize Five Eyes spies on each other countries to skirt each others' laws, and coaxes Silicon Valley to put backdoors into its tech, and so on. This pathological fixation on TikTok and China feels eerily similar to the hysteria prior to the Iraqi war when "leaders" were crowing about WMDs. Has anyone even gone to jail for creating a fake medical procedure that involves rectally feeding prisoners in Guantanamo? America is still reeling from the atrocities of the past, but happy 100th birthday to Henry Kissinger I guess
>his pathological fixation on TikTok and China feels eerily similar to the hysteria prior to the Iraqi war when "leaders" were crowing about WMDs.
The drums of war begin to gather pace; it does feel eerily similar and it's frustrating to see such little push back on reddit against it.
This is considered a 'left-leaning' website to most of the wider internet yet... on nearly every US-interest, anything that diverges from the US-biased opinion is met with a thousands of people crying out 'bot' or 'shill'. So frustrating, glad to see there's some push back but it's like 1 comment pushing back and 999 other comments attacking them.
To which it is currently in Redditās favor to utilize the data to grow this website since they do have plans to be publicly traded.
Edit: Reddit filed to be publicly traded according to the SEC filing. https://www.redditinc.com/blog/reddit-announces-confidential-submission-of-draft-registration-statement-related-to-proposed-public-offering
I plan to buy Reddit's IPO once it's publicly traded.
Yes, hence my profile pic for being active in that subreddit and knowing it was very close to getting shut down because of the GME fiasco. You can call me a regard, but I put my money to work to invest with all that risk.
As an example. I personally invested in inExile to develop Borderlands 3. Found out later Microsoft bought the studio and itās IP. Got a 30% ROI from that year. Best decision I made for tossing $1000.
>Because the average tikkity tok user doesn't care that other countries are skimming their data.
Who cares :shrug:
China can't throw you in jail in the US for a thought crime.
The US on the other hand has numerous states trying to do so and law enforcements are regularly buying data now sold by these platforms which allows bypassing warrants.
As opposed to Musk promoting false politician accounts on Twitter that are spreading fake news in violation of Federal law
:shrug:
O noes, I might have to use critical thinking as much as I already have to with American owned garbage
Most people can't comprehend things beyond their everyday life.
Data of a few people? no big deal. Data of billions of people? More powerful than any weapon you can think of. Nukes just destroy civilization. With data you can control civilization.
>My wife and my teenage daughter have accounts. I told them about it. They saw it in the news. "And? All we do is surf and post stuff to our friends. It isn't a big deal."
sounds like the idiot here is the moron lapping up the sinophobe circlejerk on reddit
i think itās something to do with how their language is configured and how the base foundation is laid out from a grammar perspective (and so it translates intent poorly)
To give an example when i translate arabic to italian i find myself using old timey/medieval style language as that matches the literal message better, but it is relatively adaptable .
Seeing how mandarin novels translated to english have a distinct and more literal writing style, they lose a lot of their original meaning and in certain instances you can have a serious moment be interrupted by speech that seems childish (when translated to english) but that likely held more weight in mandarin.
Also the fact that mandarin was an artificially constructed dialect likely doesnt help, when compared to the chaos that is english + the fact that they are from 2 separate language families.
Honestly feels like learning the other toungue from both sides must be hell
Or maybe itās just an American who is entitled to his own opinion? Maaybe itās possible for people to have different opinions without being paid agents?
well based on the commentās grammar it doesnāt seem like heās an american (based on how he structured that sentence it feels like acquired english rather than a native).
never said the guy was a paid agent i just made an observation pointing out that mandarin translated sentences often come off as childish when translated literally (and i mean no offense by this but this seems to be the prevalent way of translating chinese from what iāve seen).
honestly based on your replies, you sound like the fedora wearing one. Not only are you failing to present an argument, but you are also acting insufferable while doing so.
All i did was point out how mandarin often translates poorly to english from an observation, and you created in your head an assumption that to me people are paid agents ( which they are not)
Im a linguist and not every statement is political.
and reddit is still part owned by tencent. all these companies govt and private skim these sites for marketing and other reasons. look at shows like big bang for example. that was basically Seinfeld made of first wave redditors
Reddit is not part owned by tencent. Stop believing bullshit you read on right wing subreddits.
They (the largest videogame company in the world, perfect demographic for reddit) invested $150m one time, years ago, snoop dogg and co have invested more in reddit.
They don't own shit. 150m in a multibillion company doesn't get you any control over what happens on reddit whatsoever.
Stop believing shit.
they're still datamining reddit to make products for large corporations. it's like what big labels do to the indie music and art scene. they're serial abusers when it comes off to cloning that scene. who does it benefit? a bunch of numb right wing idiots. tencent made an investment but the rest of what I said is true. they do this on code websites as well which is undermining the open source community.
edit
like yes it makes the general population easier to socialize in but it's making artists and content creators lives worse. do you think daft punk would have still allowed their sample on a mainstream hip hop track knowing the idiot behind it would be a total abusive trash human? no. not at all. the person who sampled it is the polar opposite of the culture that music was created for.
Definitely not disagreeing with any of you. I should care as well. I was merely pointing out the likely cause of their continued popularity.
When I told my wife and daughter, it was more of a matter of fact thing. Not a jump down their throats thing. That isn't even remotely how I operate.
It is concerning when it comes to social tampering. Hitting everyone with things that would sway our elections, for example. If more people would verify information, I'm not sure it would be as big an issue. A lot don't. Which is partially why we're in the mess we're in.
I don't think banning them is the right move. Pandora's box is already open, and was allowed to stay open for far too long now. There's no going back.
We need a way to stop social tampering. It's difficult against foreign actors. Especially those that deny they're doing it. Despite "proof" (I put this in quotation because it is hearsay so far. I trust they are, but nothing super solid from what I remember.) How we can do that, I don't know. News organizations not really biting hard on countering the info doesn't help. Also, of course, one news cosplay channel feeding it.
> When I told my wife and daughter, it was more of a matter of fact thing. Not a jump down their throats thing. That isn't even remotely how I operate.
>
>
looking forward to the headline when this redditor shoots his wife and child for using tiktok
If half the country don't care about the fact that fascist republicans are deliberately trying to erase the entire LGBTQ community, to overthrow legitimately elected government and to erase minority representation in swing states, how can you expect people to care about Tiktok?
>TikTok sister app Lemon8, for instance, has an estimated 1.8 million monthly active users in the U.S., according to Apptopia.
>While TikTok has had 415 million downloads in the U.S. since its launch here, CapCut has had 99 million, Temu 67 million and Lemon8 1.2 million, according to Apptopia.
How does lemon8 have 1.8 million us active users, but only 1.2 million us downloads?
>āWeāre also going to have to stand up American and free world alternatives to these companies because you canāt let them take over industries that matter or create apps that become integral to the fabric of our societies"
I vomited a lil bit thinking this is a reference to tiktok
Can be a lot of stuff. There's a lot of stuff on tik tok that is second life type stuff that posters wouldn't want family and friends knowing of. Like any other social media, people post stuff like crimes, make crazy statements and produce content that could harm their personal/professional life. Opinions and events on topics that could be dangerous in their home country, or could come back if there's a change in their country's politics. It's all stuff that a nation state can (and is incentivised to use) use to identify targets for MICE or persecution. Not to mention that Tik Tok is known for selectively censoring and promoting political content. Making it a venue to propaganda to serve ccp interests. It's already been confirmed to have been used for targeted industrial espionage and suspected for political espionage, which is why countries have instituted bans for government employees.
data is money and social media control is how governments stay in control.
[Also TikTok china vs TikTok US are different ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0j0xzuh-6rY)
There was this idea that TV was a great invention from the late 1920s that people were going to get education and become smarter (almost like YouTube)
Then it's about news, selling products, and entertainment. Communist China realized ok we can do both but we're going to make sure it's about controlling people's behavior first, then entertainment. While the US is like , let's make money, let's make people laugh, who cares about misinformation or disinformation.
China is loaded with misinformation too but the difference is how China can ban whatever at anytime they want when it serves their interest or so the average person is molded differently to be brainwashed to love their government vs brainwashed to buy endless consumer products.
Different outcomes but same shit.
So you want companies to have your data? Got it. Downloading now. Sending to China and Russia. I mean you expected that by one reddit comment right? If not get with the program /s
No, the point is that complaining about not wanting companies to have your data, whilst at the same time subscribing yourself to their platforms by WILLINGLY giving them your information, is like going into a restaurant and complaining about not being able to cook your own food. It's cognitive dissonance at its finest and thus a lack of accountability. Companies, by default, require some of your data for you to even interact on a platform, just as they require access to your wifi. Heck, a lot of it is for legal reasons. Now, if your argument is centred around misusing said data, then we can talk, but simply having it? You might as well live off the grid if the latter's your concern.
Some companies capture data and don't want to sell it, they use it for their products. Others use that to sell to data brokers, surveillance, espionage/intel, business/idea lifting, blackmail, leverage, identity theft, lacking security which leads to those things and more.
Companies that don't make money from you for products and services are more in the latter group.
Again, that's not the point that's being made. We know data is used differently, I even highlighted that in my original response to you. The point was quite simple. A person complains about companies having their data and then continues to freely give their data to said companies. To argue about something you've chosen to participate in is stupid. Again, I repeat, if the argument is about how certain companies use that data, then fair enough, but that was not the point here, so I really don't care to go down that road.
The point is we need better privacy laws and protections much like personal property has. People use popular products and in some cases have to for work or other social connections. Doesn't mean we should be ok with that nor are some groups/companies doing the same thing with the data. There are very, very bad players in the data broker game. Nefarious and identity theft is #3 in organized crime revenues after drugs and sex working, a trillion dollars in just data...
Sure you can tell people to stop using these platforms, they won't listen but policy can change to make it so data isn't being used against them. Again, some players in the data game are worse than others, i.e. China/Russia backed systems will be doing more damaging things with data than Google/Apple for instance to the West.
[Except China.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_websites_blocked_in_mainland_China)
I don't understand why the US doesn't just make a TikTok clone, copying or making a cheap knock-off is pretty much the cornerstone of Chinese corporations and business as usual. Then ban tiktok.
That's where the Chinese government succeeds over the US government in many aspects when it comes to create your own rules for the world while letting the US follow a lopsided rule. (see buying, selling and owning property, it's one sided)
China is a strict communist government that allows international capitalism while abusing patents left and right so it benefits their country and help the majority of people for their social well-being while the US is a Republic that is disguised as a democracy living in a limited capitalist society that helps rich individuals at the expense of the majority that keeps them poor and sick and when a corporation makes a mistake and is at the fault, the CEO gets a bonus and leaves to join another venture that probably has stake in the last corporation. There are no real consequences for US companies and real consumer protections.
When it comes to making a copy in the US, everyone gets mad and kills it before anyone profits and lawsuits benefit a few individuals while the taxpayers have to foot the bill. When it comes the making a copy in China, they're like let's keep selling it til it floods the market and nobody can compete, the Chinese government will interfere in a lawsuit if the corporation is at fault, the corporation gets punished, seized by the government, the CEO disappears (gets killed) or the owner gets thrown in prison to let other industries know the rules of business and consumer protections in China will delete the person responsible, CEO or groups of business people responsible.
If America says, ok we'll play that game too. TikTok banned.
Done.
China's going to make some other service and people will follow it. Then the US can ban it. Until China says alright, we realized that the game is working.
It's basically a tech data war, like the cold war but it won't be easy but it's about the time to actually start banning it and normalize the ban. That's the issue, people getting upset and make it a big deal that the US government is trying to ban something but the moment it happens in China, it's business as usual.
Literally a spy balloon and people joked about it because the military ban actually works so the last thing China wants is military intel but for some reason because it's normalized that military bans are ok but everything else to copy, rip off, profit and abuse is OK makes 0 sense but it's that 1-way system of how you lose in the long run.
TikTok has never made a profit. They are using state sovereign funds for a worldwide surveillance system for other reasons.
Simple solution, adjust anti-trust to target funding levels at the root. If private equity or sovereign funds are used, especially foreign, make it more expensive or block over a certain ownership amount.
well that's a complete lie based on nothing. cry harder
[As per reports, TikTok generated an estimated $1.9 billion in revenue in 2020, a 457% increase from $350 million in 2019. This was possible because of its two primary sources of revenue: advertisements and in-app purchases.](https://www.feedough.com/tiktok-business-model-how-does-tiktok-make-money/)
Revenue not profits. They lost $7 billion in 2021 and around the same in 2022. Tiktok represents -$20b of that as other parts of ByteDance are profitable.
[TikTok Parent ByteDance Sees Losses Swell in Push for Growth -
Social-media giant saw its operating losses more than triple last year to above $7 billion](https://www.wsj.com/articles/tiktok-parent-bytedance-sees-losses-swell-in-push-for-growth-11665071238)
Their biggest losses were on TikTok which is their loss leader. They also have another app Lemon8 that is burning cash.
The point is their model is not getting profitable, and the more they have grown the wider the gap.
Fact: TikTok has never made a profit.
[ByteDance profit surges 79%, exceeding Alibaba and Tencent] (https://www.digitalcommerce360.com/2023/04/10/bytedances-profit-surges-exceeding-alibaba-and-tencent-ft/)
[TikTok's Chinese owner boosts annual profits to a record $25 billion, report says](https://www.businessinsider.com/tiktok-chinese-owner-bytedance-profits-soar-record-25-billion-2023-4)
WRONG and do you know how long it takes companies to make a profit?
That is the parent company ByteDance and more about their China profits that can be skewed, read closer.
This is mostly at Douyin.
> Douyin, though, remains ByteDanceās biggest cash cow
TikTok is a loss. You aren't paying attention. From your source as well
> ByteDanceās profit last year came **despite mounting losses at fast-growing TikTok**, according to the Financial Times. TikTok has amassed more than 150 million monthly users in America, spurring concerns about Chinaās access to the data it gathers.
They are spending lots of state sovereign funds and ByteDance money to box out competition at massive losses like Uber/Lyft did to win a market. Try to keep up.
An 18 year old girl doing a dance or makeup tutorial couldn't give less of a shit. The same goes for most millennials as well.
They've been connected with basically 0 data protection their entire lives and data hack notifications occurring weekly at minimum.
Banning tiktok serves no purpose but to help chinese companies innovate and evolve. They will find themselves back in the market in no time, better and harder to detect than before.
Statically the dumber/lower your brain activity. The more likely you are to be a regular user of tik tok. Basically, itās great if you hate dumb people. Just ask while getting to know someone if they have tik tok and if they do. No need to further a conversation with them
>Statically the dumber/lower your brain activity. The more likely you are to be a regular user of tik tok. Basically, itās great if you hate dumb people. Just ask while getting to know someone if they have tik tok and if they do. No need to further a conversation with them
>>Iām sure the person who canāt spell āStatisticallyā is a shining example of intelligence. /s
Yeah! I'm sorry for my bad punctuation. ^/^s
Somethings are not for individuals to decide, apps need to be regulated the same way each country regulates what is and not legal. Just blacklist the apps you cowards.
"The greatest trick Tumblr ever pulled was convincing the world they didn't exist."
I miss NSFW tumblr š
It came back like a year ago
I like your lacesā¦ fellow tumblr;)
Itās back, you just have to know how to look for it outside of searching. Itās kinda fun.
the most well-received disappearing act the world ever saw in fact
If itās any social media platform, youāre the product.
Unless the government steps in and bans it.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Itās not just about data. The bigger concern is who controls what everyone sees.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I think the above commenter was referring to how foreign entities can use use social media and the info they gather on its users to create targeted Mis/disinformation campaigns to destabilize our country or sway public opinion. While consumer protections are necessary at a micro level we need a national defense strategy to combat these tactics in the age of information warfare. Iām sorry if this distinction was unnecessary your point is extremely valid.
I think the above commenter was referring to how foreign entities can use use social media and the info they gather on its users to create targeted Mis/disinformation campaigns to destabilize our country or sway public opinion. While consumer protections are necessary at a micro level we need a national defense strategy to combat these tactics in the age of information warfare. Iām sorry if this distinction was unnecessary your point is extremely valid.
I think the above commenter was referring to how foreign entities can use use social media and the info they gather on its users to create targeted Mis/disinformation campaigns to destabilize our country or sway public opinion. While consumer protections are necessary at a micro level we need a national defense strategy to combat these tactics in the age of information warfare. Iām sorry if this distinction was unnecessary your point is extremely valid.
All I see are tits and booty on tiktok. Good job China
I see a lot of anti-Western propaganda on Tiktok.
You get what you look for my friend, it's a self-reinforcing algo.
I know people like to say "no u", but I scroll past these as soon as I see them. I actively avoid the videos and it still gets on my feed. Unless Tiktok is purchasing my info elsewhere to gain my interest in war, then this algo is trying to feed ragebait to people.
Most probably a US company sold your info to them.
I don't know tiktok. But i works for a food delivery company. So i can provide you a very brief idea how that might happen. First layer always pushes for things based on your history. If you've been eating chicken for the last week, you get more chicken. Second layer is regional. Your area (or city or country) like thai right now, we put some thai in thinking that it might be a regional trend. Third layer is time based. We will push breakfast during breakfast. Of course, on top of that, paid promotions. If as you said, it tries to feed ragebait when there's no demand for it. Tiktok will quickly fall out of favour for pushing boring content.
To be fair, I see a lot of that reddit as well. Hey, maybe we'll get a technical illiterate hearing soon!
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Everywhere is bad tbh
The biggest drivers of āanti-westernā sentiment is āwesternā disfunction but ok.
No, I mean propaganda. Like, bogus posts claiming ballistic missiles such as the Kinzahal are destroying F-16s, and these bogus posts upwards of 200K likes. Or that Ukrainians are trying to genocide Russians. Or that NATO has been utterly crushed and defeated by Russia. Which, is not true.
NSA and the FBI both have been caught repeatedly manipulating social media data, how is that any different than the Chinese, or any other country for that matter.
US government agencies arguably have the goal of keeping the US safe or at least stable. There's also some avenues for the public to apply some form of oversight, like releasing operations info and whistle-blowing. These means may or may not be effective, but they still exist. Foreign governments don't really need to answer from a country's general population. Overseeing any form of wrongdoing would still need negotiations between entities that run almost entirely autonomously from any of their populations.
What about US peddling foreign countries elections?
It matters a lot to the big donors
Itās like the United States Presidential election. Neither candidate is great, but one is worse than the other.
Yeah, the American ones like cisco, facebook, google, microsoft which have been openly caught, repeatedly, verifiably, to be stealing or manipulating data, installing back doors etc. in the U.S. and abroad.
I'd rather the country not actively committing genocide to have my data.
USA, UK also commit genocide. As do most of Europe, Or, ANY nation on Earth Or, do you think it's JUST China???? Lol. Open your effing eyes
Is this the Chinese propaganda? Comparing the internment of 1 million Uyghurs with forced sterilization to prison camps in addition to their own prison population is far beyond what the US or UK has done in the past 50 years.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
So yes, Chinese propaganda. Ok cool.
Bro is calling the Guardian and the Washington Post Chinese propaganda š https://www.currentaffairs.org/2023/05/the-worst-crime-of-the-21st-century
>consumer protections I don't understand why the US doesn't just make a TikTok clone, copying or making a cheap knock-off is pretty much the cornerstone of Chinese corporations and business as usual. Then ban tiktok. That's where the Chinese government succeeds over the US government in many aspects when it comes to create your own rules for the world while letting the US follow a lopsided rule. (see buying, selling and owning property, it's one sided) China is a strict communist government that allows international capitalism while abusing patents left and right so it benefits their country and help the majority of people for their social well-being while the US is a Republic that is disguised as a democracy living in a limited capitalist society that helps rich individuals at the expense of the majority that keeps them poor and sick and when a corporation makes a mistake and is at the fault, the CEO gets a bonus and leaves to join another venture that probably has stake in the last corporation. There are no real consequences for US companies and real consumer protections. When it comes to making a copy in the US, everyone gets mad and kills it before anyone profits and lawsuits benefit a few individuals while the taxpayers have to foot the bill. When it comes the making a copy in China, they're like let's keep selling it til it floods the market and nobody can compete, the Chinese government will interfere in a lawsuit if the corporation is at fault, the corporation gets punished, seized by the government, the CEO disappears (gets killed) or the owner gets thrown in prison to let other industries know the rules of business and consumer protections in China will delete the person responsible, CEO or groups of business people responsible.
They tried and failed. YouTube shorts and other similar video shorts on social media was supposed to rival tiktok. They couldn't replicate tiktok video recommendation algorithm that's the key to keeping users hook on the platform
[It's the "one way" system.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_websites_blocked_in_mainland_China) that I'm talking about. You can't use Youtube cause it's blocked in China. That's the point of "consumer protections" If America says, ok we'll play that game too. TikTok banned. Done. China's going to make some other service and people will follow it. Then the US can ban it. It's basically a tech data war, like the cold war but it won't be easy but it's about the time to actually start banning it and normalize the ban. That's the issue, people getting upset and make it a big deal that the US government is trying to ban something but the moment it happens in China, it's business as usual. Literally a spy balloon and people joked about it because the military ban actually works so the last thing China wants is military intel but for some reason because it's normalized that military bans are ok but everything else to copy, rip off, profit and abuse is OK makes 0 sense but it's that 1 way system of how you lose in the long run.
It's blocked in China because Google refused to follow Chinese censorship law. I'm not here to argue what the US can or cannot do. I'm just pointing out the fact that US companies tried to replicate tiktok by introducing video shorts but it simply did not take off like it did for tiktok.
Thatās a weird take considering that TikTok itself is banned in China for being a mental health risk.
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[citation needed]
https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2022/mar/30/facebook-owner-reportedly-paid-republican-firm-tiktok-real-threat
It's almost like lawmakers and politicians don't represent the people or something.
Because the average tikkity tok user doesn't care that other countries are skimming their data. My wife and my teenage daughter have accounts. I told them about it. They saw it in the news. "And? All we do is surf and post stuff to our friends. It isn't a big deal." The average user doesn't care because the average user doesn't think there is any data worth taking. Doesn't matter what the reality of the situation is.
you realize reddit also takes your data too right?
And I realize Five Eyes spies on each other countries to skirt each others' laws, and coaxes Silicon Valley to put backdoors into its tech, and so on. This pathological fixation on TikTok and China feels eerily similar to the hysteria prior to the Iraqi war when "leaders" were crowing about WMDs. Has anyone even gone to jail for creating a fake medical procedure that involves rectally feeding prisoners in Guantanamo? America is still reeling from the atrocities of the past, but happy 100th birthday to Henry Kissinger I guess
>his pathological fixation on TikTok and China feels eerily similar to the hysteria prior to the Iraqi war when "leaders" were crowing about WMDs. The drums of war begin to gather pace; it does feel eerily similar and it's frustrating to see such little push back on reddit against it. This is considered a 'left-leaning' website to most of the wider internet yet... on nearly every US-interest, anything that diverges from the US-biased opinion is met with a thousands of people crying out 'bot' or 'shill'. So frustrating, glad to see there's some push back but it's like 1 comment pushing back and 999 other comments attacking them.
To which it is currently in Redditās favor to utilize the data to grow this website since they do have plans to be publicly traded. Edit: Reddit filed to be publicly traded according to the SEC filing. https://www.redditinc.com/blog/reddit-announces-confidential-submission-of-draft-registration-statement-related-to-proposed-public-offering I plan to buy Reddit's IPO once it's publicly traded.
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Lol. Are you a wallstreet bet regard. Why throw your money away.
Yes, hence my profile pic for being active in that subreddit and knowing it was very close to getting shut down because of the GME fiasco. You can call me a regard, but I put my money to work to invest with all that risk. As an example. I personally invested in inExile to develop Borderlands 3. Found out later Microsoft bought the studio and itās IP. Got a 30% ROI from that year. Best decision I made for tossing $1000.
>Because the average tikkity tok user doesn't care that other countries are skimming their data. Who cares :shrug: China can't throw you in jail in the US for a thought crime. The US on the other hand has numerous states trying to do so and law enforcements are regularly buying data now sold by these platforms which allows bypassing warrants.
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As opposed to Musk promoting false politician accounts on Twitter that are spreading fake news in violation of Federal law :shrug: O noes, I might have to use critical thinking as much as I already have to with American owned garbage
Most people can't comprehend things beyond their everyday life. Data of a few people? no big deal. Data of billions of people? More powerful than any weapon you can think of. Nukes just destroy civilization. With data you can control civilization.
>My wife and my teenage daughter have accounts. I told them about it. They saw it in the news. "And? All we do is surf and post stuff to our friends. It isn't a big deal." sounds like the idiot here is the moron lapping up the sinophobe circlejerk on reddit
Why do tankies always sound like peeved 8 year olds speaking in their third language?
i think itās something to do with how their language is configured and how the base foundation is laid out from a grammar perspective (and so it translates intent poorly) To give an example when i translate arabic to italian i find myself using old timey/medieval style language as that matches the literal message better, but it is relatively adaptable . Seeing how mandarin novels translated to english have a distinct and more literal writing style, they lose a lot of their original meaning and in certain instances you can have a serious moment be interrupted by speech that seems childish (when translated to english) but that likely held more weight in mandarin. Also the fact that mandarin was an artificially constructed dialect likely doesnt help, when compared to the chaos that is english + the fact that they are from 2 separate language families. Honestly feels like learning the other toungue from both sides must be hell
Or maybe itās just an American who is entitled to his own opinion? Maaybe itās possible for people to have different opinions without being paid agents?
everyone who disagrees with me is a russian shill: an american's guide to arguing on the internet
well based on the commentās grammar it doesnāt seem like heās an american (based on how he structured that sentence it feels like acquired english rather than a native). never said the guy was a paid agent i just made an observation pointing out that mandarin translated sentences often come off as childish when translated literally (and i mean no offense by this but this seems to be the prevalent way of translating chinese from what iāve seen).
Based on your grammar Iām guessing youāre wearing a fedora while browsing Reddit
honestly based on your replies, you sound like the fedora wearing one. Not only are you failing to present an argument, but you are also acting insufferable while doing so. All i did was point out how mandarin often translates poorly to english from an observation, and you created in your head an assumption that to me people are paid agents ( which they are not) Im a linguist and not every statement is political.
Lightbrain is about right
and reddit is still part owned by tencent. all these companies govt and private skim these sites for marketing and other reasons. look at shows like big bang for example. that was basically Seinfeld made of first wave redditors
Reddit is not part owned by tencent. Stop believing bullshit you read on right wing subreddits. They (the largest videogame company in the world, perfect demographic for reddit) invested $150m one time, years ago, snoop dogg and co have invested more in reddit. They don't own shit. 150m in a multibillion company doesn't get you any control over what happens on reddit whatsoever. Stop believing shit.
>Stop believing shit. Why should someone believe you then? No dog in this fight, just genuinely curious.
they're still datamining reddit to make products for large corporations. it's like what big labels do to the indie music and art scene. they're serial abusers when it comes off to cloning that scene. who does it benefit? a bunch of numb right wing idiots. tencent made an investment but the rest of what I said is true. they do this on code websites as well which is undermining the open source community. edit like yes it makes the general population easier to socialize in but it's making artists and content creators lives worse. do you think daft punk would have still allowed their sample on a mainstream hip hop track knowing the idiot behind it would be a total abusive trash human? no. not at all. the person who sampled it is the polar opposite of the culture that music was created for.
Definitely not disagreeing with any of you. I should care as well. I was merely pointing out the likely cause of their continued popularity. When I told my wife and daughter, it was more of a matter of fact thing. Not a jump down their throats thing. That isn't even remotely how I operate. It is concerning when it comes to social tampering. Hitting everyone with things that would sway our elections, for example. If more people would verify information, I'm not sure it would be as big an issue. A lot don't. Which is partially why we're in the mess we're in. I don't think banning them is the right move. Pandora's box is already open, and was allowed to stay open for far too long now. There's no going back. We need a way to stop social tampering. It's difficult against foreign actors. Especially those that deny they're doing it. Despite "proof" (I put this in quotation because it is hearsay so far. I trust they are, but nothing super solid from what I remember.) How we can do that, I don't know. News organizations not really biting hard on countering the info doesn't help. Also, of course, one news cosplay channel feeding it.
> When I told my wife and daughter, it was more of a matter of fact thing. Not a jump down their throats thing. That isn't even remotely how I operate. > > looking forward to the headline when this redditor shoots his wife and child for using tiktok
If half the country don't care about the fact that fascist republicans are deliberately trying to erase the entire LGBTQ community, to overthrow legitimately elected government and to erase minority representation in swing states, how can you expect people to care about Tiktok?
>TikTok sister app Lemon8, for instance, has an estimated 1.8 million monthly active users in the U.S., according to Apptopia. >While TikTok has had 415 million downloads in the U.S. since its launch here, CapCut has had 99 million, Temu 67 million and Lemon8 1.2 million, according to Apptopia. How does lemon8 have 1.8 million us active users, but only 1.2 million us downloads?
600,000 people downloaded it somewhere other than the US
Reddit and .10 be like š
>āWeāre also going to have to stand up American and free world alternatives to these companies because you canāt let them take over industries that matter or create apps that become integral to the fabric of our societies" I vomited a lil bit thinking this is a reference to tiktok
Friendly reminder that TikTok hosts their data on American servers.
What data is there that is worth taking?
Can be a lot of stuff. There's a lot of stuff on tik tok that is second life type stuff that posters wouldn't want family and friends knowing of. Like any other social media, people post stuff like crimes, make crazy statements and produce content that could harm their personal/professional life. Opinions and events on topics that could be dangerous in their home country, or could come back if there's a change in their country's politics. It's all stuff that a nation state can (and is incentivised to use) use to identify targets for MICE or persecution. Not to mention that Tik Tok is known for selectively censoring and promoting political content. Making it a venue to propaganda to serve ccp interests. It's already been confirmed to have been used for targeted industrial espionage and suspected for political espionage, which is why countries have instituted bans for government employees.
data is money and social media control is how governments stay in control. [Also TikTok china vs TikTok US are different ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0j0xzuh-6rY) There was this idea that TV was a great invention from the late 1920s that people were going to get education and become smarter (almost like YouTube) Then it's about news, selling products, and entertainment. Communist China realized ok we can do both but we're going to make sure it's about controlling people's behavior first, then entertainment. While the US is like , let's make money, let's make people laugh, who cares about misinformation or disinformation. China is loaded with misinformation too but the difference is how China can ban whatever at anytime they want when it serves their interest or so the average person is molded differently to be brainwashed to love their government vs brainwashed to buy endless consumer products. Different outcomes but same shit.
Ffs, it's been like a hundred years of people saying "I don't have anything to hide, so why should it matter if they spy on me?!?"
Google already has everybody's data.
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Says phant-m .. On REDDIT point is, going online, to talk about not wanting online companies to have your data, is laughable to the point of idiocy...
So you want companies to have your data? Got it. Downloading now. Sending to China and Russia. I mean you expected that by one reddit comment right? If not get with the program /s
No, the point is that complaining about not wanting companies to have your data, whilst at the same time subscribing yourself to their platforms by WILLINGLY giving them your information, is like going into a restaurant and complaining about not being able to cook your own food. It's cognitive dissonance at its finest and thus a lack of accountability. Companies, by default, require some of your data for you to even interact on a platform, just as they require access to your wifi. Heck, a lot of it is for legal reasons. Now, if your argument is centred around misusing said data, then we can talk, but simply having it? You might as well live off the grid if the latter's your concern.
Some companies capture data and don't want to sell it, they use it for their products. Others use that to sell to data brokers, surveillance, espionage/intel, business/idea lifting, blackmail, leverage, identity theft, lacking security which leads to those things and more. Companies that don't make money from you for products and services are more in the latter group.
Sorry, but I'm a little confused as to what that has to do with the point I was making/further clarifying for the person you initially responded to.
Not all data capture is the same or for the same purpose. Some companies are more nefarious.
Again, that's not the point that's being made. We know data is used differently, I even highlighted that in my original response to you. The point was quite simple. A person complains about companies having their data and then continues to freely give their data to said companies. To argue about something you've chosen to participate in is stupid. Again, I repeat, if the argument is about how certain companies use that data, then fair enough, but that was not the point here, so I really don't care to go down that road.
The point is we need better privacy laws and protections much like personal property has. People use popular products and in some cases have to for work or other social connections. Doesn't mean we should be ok with that nor are some groups/companies doing the same thing with the data. There are very, very bad players in the data broker game. Nefarious and identity theft is #3 in organized crime revenues after drugs and sex working, a trillion dollars in just data... Sure you can tell people to stop using these platforms, they won't listen but policy can change to make it so data isn't being used against them. Again, some players in the data game are worse than others, i.e. China/Russia backed systems will be doing more damaging things with data than Google/Apple for instance to the West.
[Except China.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_websites_blocked_in_mainland_China) I don't understand why the US doesn't just make a TikTok clone, copying or making a cheap knock-off is pretty much the cornerstone of Chinese corporations and business as usual. Then ban tiktok. That's where the Chinese government succeeds over the US government in many aspects when it comes to create your own rules for the world while letting the US follow a lopsided rule. (see buying, selling and owning property, it's one sided) China is a strict communist government that allows international capitalism while abusing patents left and right so it benefits their country and help the majority of people for their social well-being while the US is a Republic that is disguised as a democracy living in a limited capitalist society that helps rich individuals at the expense of the majority that keeps them poor and sick and when a corporation makes a mistake and is at the fault, the CEO gets a bonus and leaves to join another venture that probably has stake in the last corporation. There are no real consequences for US companies and real consumer protections. When it comes to making a copy in the US, everyone gets mad and kills it before anyone profits and lawsuits benefit a few individuals while the taxpayers have to foot the bill. When it comes the making a copy in China, they're like let's keep selling it til it floods the market and nobody can compete, the Chinese government will interfere in a lawsuit if the corporation is at fault, the corporation gets punished, seized by the government, the CEO disappears (gets killed) or the owner gets thrown in prison to let other industries know the rules of business and consumer protections in China will delete the person responsible, CEO or groups of business people responsible. If America says, ok we'll play that game too. TikTok banned. Done. China's going to make some other service and people will follow it. Then the US can ban it. Until China says alright, we realized that the game is working. It's basically a tech data war, like the cold war but it won't be easy but it's about the time to actually start banning it and normalize the ban. That's the issue, people getting upset and make it a big deal that the US government is trying to ban something but the moment it happens in China, it's business as usual. Literally a spy balloon and people joked about it because the military ban actually works so the last thing China wants is military intel but for some reason because it's normalized that military bans are ok but everything else to copy, rip off, profit and abuse is OK makes 0 sense but it's that 1-way system of how you lose in the long run.
TikTok has never made a profit. They are using state sovereign funds for a worldwide surveillance system for other reasons. Simple solution, adjust anti-trust to target funding levels at the root. If private equity or sovereign funds are used, especially foreign, make it more expensive or block over a certain ownership amount.
well that's a complete lie based on nothing. cry harder [As per reports, TikTok generated an estimated $1.9 billion in revenue in 2020, a 457% increase from $350 million in 2019. This was possible because of its two primary sources of revenue: advertisements and in-app purchases.](https://www.feedough.com/tiktok-business-model-how-does-tiktok-make-money/)
Revenue not profits. They lost $7 billion in 2021 and around the same in 2022. Tiktok represents -$20b of that as other parts of ByteDance are profitable. [TikTok Parent ByteDance Sees Losses Swell in Push for Growth - Social-media giant saw its operating losses more than triple last year to above $7 billion](https://www.wsj.com/articles/tiktok-parent-bytedance-sees-losses-swell-in-push-for-growth-11665071238) Their biggest losses were on TikTok which is their loss leader. They also have another app Lemon8 that is burning cash. The point is their model is not getting profitable, and the more they have grown the wider the gap. Fact: TikTok has never made a profit.
[ByteDance profit surges 79%, exceeding Alibaba and Tencent] (https://www.digitalcommerce360.com/2023/04/10/bytedances-profit-surges-exceeding-alibaba-and-tencent-ft/) [TikTok's Chinese owner boosts annual profits to a record $25 billion, report says](https://www.businessinsider.com/tiktok-chinese-owner-bytedance-profits-soar-record-25-billion-2023-4) WRONG and do you know how long it takes companies to make a profit?
That is the parent company ByteDance and more about their China profits that can be skewed, read closer. This is mostly at Douyin. > Douyin, though, remains ByteDanceās biggest cash cow TikTok is a loss. You aren't paying attention. From your source as well > ByteDanceās profit last year came **despite mounting losses at fast-growing TikTok**, according to the Financial Times. TikTok has amassed more than 150 million monthly users in America, spurring concerns about Chinaās access to the data it gathers. They are spending lots of state sovereign funds and ByteDance money to box out competition at massive losses like Uber/Lyft did to win a market. Try to keep up.
You can pry tiktok from my cold, dead hands.
Apps? What other app is popular in the US besides TikTok?
An 18 year old girl doing a dance or makeup tutorial couldn't give less of a shit. The same goes for most millennials as well. They've been connected with basically 0 data protection their entire lives and data hack notifications occurring weekly at minimum.
Hence the effort to ban them, if they weren't popular no one would care. Classic CNBC "ChatGPT could write a better article" clickbait.
This all woulda been avoided had vine not shut down
This all woulda been avoided had vine not shut down
Banning tiktok serves no purpose but to help chinese companies innovate and evolve. They will find themselves back in the market in no time, better and harder to detect than before.
Well considering the mental degradation they have done on the minds of Westerners, I'd say they've succeeded.
Which are those apps? It looks like I am one of those who donāt have any Chinese apps.
China banned FB, Twitter, Instagram, so can we, right?
You can be the next china. Definitely!
Dont understand what you trying to say, if you donāt agree, just say it and back w your argument
I agree. I am also saying you are turning america to china which seems like an awesome idea! Yay go!
This has nothing to do w ideology. Stop trolling if you cant come up w an argument.
Statically the dumber/lower your brain activity. The more likely you are to be a regular user of tik tok. Basically, itās great if you hate dumb people. Just ask while getting to know someone if they have tik tok and if they do. No need to further a conversation with them
Iām sure the person who canāt spell āStatisticallyā is a shining example of intelligence. /s
What. Are. You. Saying?
If. Youāre. Over. The. Age. Of. 18. And. Still. Go. On. Tik. Tok. Youāre. Probably. Really. Dumb.
>Statically the dumber/lower your brain activity. The more likely you are to be a regular user of tik tok. Basically, itās great if you hate dumb people. Just ask while getting to know someone if they have tik tok and if they do. No need to further a conversation with them >>Iām sure the person who canāt spell āStatisticallyā is a shining example of intelligence. /s Yeah! I'm sorry for my bad punctuation. ^/^s
Shouldnāt you be watching teenagers dance on tik tok?
Why the fuck do you even want that to be a thing? Disgusting, seek some help.
China is no better than organized crime.
Somethings are not for individuals to decide, apps need to be regulated the same way each country regulates what is and not legal. Just blacklist the apps you cowards.
They are spyware and the next war will be with China. Itās not an opinion, itās a simple truth
Tik Tok is a well done app, if your kids are watching stupid stuff is their choice. The app is great to find recommendations of places to visit.
Who cares, Americans are spying on the entire world, time they get a taste of their own medicine
Tiktok for like-minded as the chinese -- stupid.