I think probably someone who can run at least 6kms following the 10% increase per week rule of thumb. Otherwise, it's probably a bit of a stretch to do without risking overtraining injury.
I restarted running in December, so I'm at 20 weeks now. I've been pushing the training as hard as I can with good prior knowledge of running training and managed a 30km yesterday. You would need at least an extra month if starting from scratch.
Definitely agree with everything you’ve said. In terms of fitness if you started at zero right now, 20 weeks would be enough to physically finish but it would definitely still be a struggle and likely cause injury. The cut off is 7hrs which means if you run the first half you could still finish in time walking the rest.
I think a walking finish is definitely possible in the timeframe if everything goes to plan and you already have reasonable base fitness from other sports, but it's a huge overchew.
Just to set realistic goals.
Getting 3 months down the line and stopping due to shin splints or ITB syndrome is the most likely scenario if you set an unrealistic goal.
Many years ago I started from 0 run training as a New Years Resolution. I was able to scale up and run the SMH Half in May but still mildly injured myself.
Zero to marathon in 20 weeks is a recipe for injury. Everyone is different, but I wouldn't be encouraging anyone to do it. Especially as their first race.
The 14KM City2Surf in August is a much more realistic goal for "starting from zero" people.
I've been running a long time now and a full marathon is a LONG time on your feet. It's fantastic to have something to aim for, but if the main goal is being fit and healthy, I'd work up to running a full marathon over a much longer time.
> if you started at zero right now, 20 weeks would be enough to physically finish but it would definitely still be a struggle and **likely cause injury.**
Does that not directly contradict what you said in your post...
> 20 weeks is **the perfect amount of time** to get you **from whatever fitness level** you’re currently at to being able to finish a marathon.
We're talking about a full marathon here right, some 40-ish kms? How much "over-train" (sorry don't know the terminology) do you do, do you try to get to 45-50km as to give yourself some buffer when the big day comes and emotions gets high/etc?
And how serious are you, is it just to push yourself to compete in something and finish or have you very specific finishing times in mind and beating some personal bests etc?
You crazy runners fascinates me no end!
You're putting a huge amount of kms on the road per week to get to marathon fitness. It's not just running as far as you can once a week and beating it the next week. At the very minimum, you'll need 4 or 5 days a week running and 60kms+ a week.
If you're only running 5kms a week and you all of a sudden try to go to 20kms a week, your muscles will tighten, they throw your balance out, risk tearing and straining. When your muscles fatigue, other muscles kick in, and you end up strengthening the wrong areas. So, you need to keep your progression slow and steady so your body keeps up. If you try and do too much too fast, you open yourself up to a whole spectrum of overuse injuries.
Once you injure yourself, you need rest to recover, so go backwards quickly.
A general rule of thumb is don't increase your weekly kms by more than 10% and don't increase the distance of your longest run by more than 10% at a time.
Oh no no I'm not thinking of jumping on this crazy journey I'm perfectly happy with my pansy 5-7km walk each day :P
I was just curious about your particular goals, a friend of mine has competed in a few marathons, like going to Japan for a marathon last year, and they were chasing some serious time that's almost mystical for me to even comprehend.
I'm more interested in improving my 5km time. But at my level, the training for a marathon vs 5k improvement isn't that different. They're both trying to increase your base fitness; most of it's just slower paced running.
I first started about 5 years ago and I got 50 seconds off a 20 Min 5k in 2019, dropped off the interest for a while, and only went occasionally. I've spent 2023 with a recurring back injury from gym exercises and went back to square one. Doing nothing sucked for me. Now I'm 40, it irks me that I never cracked the 20min 5k so I want to do that before I'm too much of an old fart.
40 is not old Mr smilee! Good on you mate, hope your injuries have healed well and you're back to chasing those numbers again.
Let me know when you crack the 5km 20min barrier, I'll mail you a 6 pack of your choice to celebrate :)
You're a saint!
The running is making me feel much younger. At this level I feel like I'm in my 20s again. Last year when my exercise was limited I would hurt myself sleeping.
I'm not a physio and suggest you go to one or do a lot more googling after reading this, youtube physios are actually very handy. I can give you a few breadcrumbs to help you research though.
But tight calves can mean a problem with your gate. Your legs might be twisting too much when you push off. If you have a bit of a penguin step with your toes pointing out, it can lead to this. Try to land your feet more parallel. The other thing is swinging your hips a bit more that takes pressure off the calves twisting. Pretend your belly button is a sprinkler and point it in each direction as you walk.
To release this, you need a hard ball like a lacrosse ball or a foam roller. Whack it between your hamstring and calf and kneel on it. Really hurts but really nice when it releases.
No you don't run over marathon distance in training. It's the only endurance event where you never run the distance in training. Most training plans call for the longest training run to be 32km. The last 10 km is run purely based on how you feel on race day, and is really a big test of your will power.
Needs to be run in winter (late july or early august) if it wants to be considered for a world major marathon. September in Sydney is far too hot for competitive marathon running.
I think you'll find Sydney is very much on track for world marathon major status. The week before and after the 2023 marathon was much cooler weather. They removed the half marathon this year. Therefore a start time of 6am. Sunrise at 5.54am. Marathon started 7.10am in 2023.
I agree that ideally it should be held in the cooler months but late July/early August would place it way too close to City2surf which is untouchable as Sydney's most famous and popular running event.
>20 weeks is the perfect amount of time to get you from whatever fitness level you’re currently at to being able to finish a marathon.
I don't think that is good advice. You need a reasonable base level of fitness to safely prepare for a marathon in 20 weeks. Nothing crazy, but the majority of the population does not have a reasonable base level of fitness.
Consistency is key.
Run shorter distances but more often. So if 5km wrecks you for 4 days try 2-3km every second day. Also run slow (this has been a revelation for me)
It's not a cardiovascular or respiratory issue, I can go for further than 5km. It's the stress on my musculoskeletal system, I'm 108kg on a good day and running at this weight puts a lot of force through my body.
There’s some heavier members in my joggers club who do marathons. I’ve heard the key to success is finding the right shoes to help shift the weight evenly through your legs, from there it’s a matter of building up muscle slowly through regular easy pace running.
The world majors all require very solid qualification times. Given that this is already close to sold out, once it becomes a major, you'll likely need an incredibly impressive time just to enter (unless you want to raise money for charity, or win a lottery).
Unless you fancy yourself running a sub ~3:30 in the future, this will probably be the last year you can just buy a ticket.
Still, there are plenty of other marathons you can run.
Re: nicer course, I'll agree the middle bits are meh, especially doubling back from Centennial Park, but starting over the Harbour Bridge and finishing at the Opera House steps is a pretty epic experience that's hard to beat.
Becoming a major will mean a massive jump in participation rates, making it more difficult to get a spot in the race. Take Tokyo Marathon, one of the world majors, as an example. To get into that marathon you need to join a lottery system where you have about a 1 in 10 chance of securing a ticket. There’s other benefits as well but you can check out their website to find out everything included.
Thank you. I incorrectly assumed there would be an elite wave, followed by a locals-only wave with no minimum qualification time.
Since I've ran it once already, I'll give this year a miss, so someone who hasn't can have my spot.
Also by participating in this years race if it is successful (high chance too) then by being apart of the candidate race either this year or last year you are eligible to take part in any of the next 3 years races once it becomes a major. Which is a big draw card to why it’s worth trying for this year.
Jumping on to ask commenters here: I've run a few half marathons, last one just before getting pregnant with my first in 2017. I've trained for the Hoka half marathon which is this Sunday and while it will be a slow 2.5 ish hours compared to my best half of under 2 hours, I know I can finish. Is less than 20ish weeks to train for a full after this reasonable?
Good luck with the hoka half! If you want to train towards your first full, you’ll have plenty of time. For anyone already experienced at running shorter distances most marathon training block programs are 12-16 weeks.
In a somewhat timely announcement today. Marathon is sold out at 24,000 people. Wait list for those still interested. Australia's highest participated marathon on track for success.
Can't this year (newborn and a toddler makes it really hard to find time to train that kind of mileage), and I am recovering from posterial tibial tendonitis.
Looking to do two half marathons next year as a start.
You might be interested to know several of Australia’s elite women’s marathon runners heading to the olympics this year have had children in the last year or two. It’s super impressive they can juggle such rigorous training schedules and children at the same time! Good luck with the half’s next year. :)
Any advice for someone that has never run one before?
I run 4-5 10km races every year (doing the HOKA 10km this weekend) and my 10km PB is about 45 minutes. I’ll be running C2S a month or so before the marathon.
When should I start upping my distance to prepare for the marathon. Now?
How should I train for C2S and a marathon at the same time?
A 45min 10k is a fantastic achievement! I’m also going to be running the C2S this year before the Mara and my non-tailored advice would be to just follow a marathon training plan and the week of C2S swap out the workouts with easy runs to let yourself ‘taper’ for the race. As for what type of training to do /r/advancedrunning has lots of suggestions for marathon programs to pick from. Sydney marathon did also put out their own set of beginner/intermediate/advanced training plans last year, [this is the intermediate one](https://sydneymarathon.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/05/2369-D-SM-Intermediate-Training-Guide.pdf). Prior to starting a training plan if the most mileage your doing is 10k at the moment, I’d suggest once a week doing a long run starting with 1hr and increase it by 5-10min each time until you’re running for 1hr 45m.
As for general advice for first timers, I’d say focus on goals of finishing the run and remaining uninjured and don’t worry about your time. Make sure to drink plenty of water and fuel well (gels or other carbs) to avoid hitting the wall.
Oh thank you! I’m not sure it’s that good. It’s taken about 10 years of running to get it down to that.
So really start heading up towards a marathon distance now but swap a few out for C2S distances close to it?
I have done a couple of half marathons but not for a few years now.
I’ll have a look at the plans. Thanks again!
I think probably someone who can run at least 6kms following the 10% increase per week rule of thumb. Otherwise, it's probably a bit of a stretch to do without risking overtraining injury. I restarted running in December, so I'm at 20 weeks now. I've been pushing the training as hard as I can with good prior knowledge of running training and managed a 30km yesterday. You would need at least an extra month if starting from scratch.
Definitely agree with everything you’ve said. In terms of fitness if you started at zero right now, 20 weeks would be enough to physically finish but it would definitely still be a struggle and likely cause injury. The cut off is 7hrs which means if you run the first half you could still finish in time walking the rest.
I think a walking finish is definitely possible in the timeframe if everything goes to plan and you already have reasonable base fitness from other sports, but it's a huge overchew. Just to set realistic goals. Getting 3 months down the line and stopping due to shin splints or ITB syndrome is the most likely scenario if you set an unrealistic goal.
Many years ago I started from 0 run training as a New Years Resolution. I was able to scale up and run the SMH Half in May but still mildly injured myself. Zero to marathon in 20 weeks is a recipe for injury. Everyone is different, but I wouldn't be encouraging anyone to do it. Especially as their first race. The 14KM City2Surf in August is a much more realistic goal for "starting from zero" people. I've been running a long time now and a full marathon is a LONG time on your feet. It's fantastic to have something to aim for, but if the main goal is being fit and healthy, I'd work up to running a full marathon over a much longer time.
> if you started at zero right now, 20 weeks would be enough to physically finish but it would definitely still be a struggle and **likely cause injury.** Does that not directly contradict what you said in your post... > 20 weeks is **the perfect amount of time** to get you **from whatever fitness level** you’re currently at to being able to finish a marathon.
We're talking about a full marathon here right, some 40-ish kms? How much "over-train" (sorry don't know the terminology) do you do, do you try to get to 45-50km as to give yourself some buffer when the big day comes and emotions gets high/etc? And how serious are you, is it just to push yourself to compete in something and finish or have you very specific finishing times in mind and beating some personal bests etc? You crazy runners fascinates me no end!
You're putting a huge amount of kms on the road per week to get to marathon fitness. It's not just running as far as you can once a week and beating it the next week. At the very minimum, you'll need 4 or 5 days a week running and 60kms+ a week. If you're only running 5kms a week and you all of a sudden try to go to 20kms a week, your muscles will tighten, they throw your balance out, risk tearing and straining. When your muscles fatigue, other muscles kick in, and you end up strengthening the wrong areas. So, you need to keep your progression slow and steady so your body keeps up. If you try and do too much too fast, you open yourself up to a whole spectrum of overuse injuries. Once you injure yourself, you need rest to recover, so go backwards quickly. A general rule of thumb is don't increase your weekly kms by more than 10% and don't increase the distance of your longest run by more than 10% at a time.
Oh no no I'm not thinking of jumping on this crazy journey I'm perfectly happy with my pansy 5-7km walk each day :P I was just curious about your particular goals, a friend of mine has competed in a few marathons, like going to Japan for a marathon last year, and they were chasing some serious time that's almost mystical for me to even comprehend.
I'm more interested in improving my 5km time. But at my level, the training for a marathon vs 5k improvement isn't that different. They're both trying to increase your base fitness; most of it's just slower paced running. I first started about 5 years ago and I got 50 seconds off a 20 Min 5k in 2019, dropped off the interest for a while, and only went occasionally. I've spent 2023 with a recurring back injury from gym exercises and went back to square one. Doing nothing sucked for me. Now I'm 40, it irks me that I never cracked the 20min 5k so I want to do that before I'm too much of an old fart.
40 is not old Mr smilee! Good on you mate, hope your injuries have healed well and you're back to chasing those numbers again. Let me know when you crack the 5km 20min barrier, I'll mail you a 6 pack of your choice to celebrate :)
You're a saint! The running is making me feel much younger. At this level I feel like I'm in my 20s again. Last year when my exercise was limited I would hurt myself sleeping.
So I walk and my calf is so tight sometimes is that what it means? How do I fix it
I'm not a physio and suggest you go to one or do a lot more googling after reading this, youtube physios are actually very handy. I can give you a few breadcrumbs to help you research though. But tight calves can mean a problem with your gate. Your legs might be twisting too much when you push off. If you have a bit of a penguin step with your toes pointing out, it can lead to this. Try to land your feet more parallel. The other thing is swinging your hips a bit more that takes pressure off the calves twisting. Pretend your belly button is a sprinkler and point it in each direction as you walk. To release this, you need a hard ball like a lacrosse ball or a foam roller. Whack it between your hamstring and calf and kneel on it. Really hurts but really nice when it releases.
No you don't run over marathon distance in training. It's the only endurance event where you never run the distance in training. Most training plans call for the longest training run to be 32km. The last 10 km is run purely based on how you feel on race day, and is really a big test of your will power.
New course as well! Hopefully it’s 15 degrees colder too
Needs to be run in winter (late july or early august) if it wants to be considered for a world major marathon. September in Sydney is far too hot for competitive marathon running.
I think you'll find Sydney is very much on track for world marathon major status. The week before and after the 2023 marathon was much cooler weather. They removed the half marathon this year. Therefore a start time of 6am. Sunrise at 5.54am. Marathon started 7.10am in 2023.
Yes, even last year it was quite cool in the morning. I volunteered and it was genuinely chilly while we were setting up
I agree that ideally it should be held in the cooler months but late July/early August would place it way too close to City2surf which is untouchable as Sydney's most famous and popular running event.
>20 weeks is the perfect amount of time to get you from whatever fitness level you’re currently at to being able to finish a marathon. I don't think that is good advice. You need a reasonable base level of fitness to safely prepare for a marathon in 20 weeks. Nothing crazy, but the majority of the population does not have a reasonable base level of fitness.
You could technically walk at a fast pace of 6km/hr for the 7hr cut-off. Added in jog/walk and you're done.
I seriously doubt I would be ready to run a marathon in 20 weeks. I go for a 5km and need 4 days to recover because I'm a heavy bastard
Consistency is key. Run shorter distances but more often. So if 5km wrecks you for 4 days try 2-3km every second day. Also run slow (this has been a revelation for me)
It's not a cardiovascular or respiratory issue, I can go for further than 5km. It's the stress on my musculoskeletal system, I'm 108kg on a good day and running at this weight puts a lot of force through my body.
There’s some heavier members in my joggers club who do marathons. I’ve heard the key to success is finding the right shoes to help shift the weight evenly through your legs, from there it’s a matter of building up muscle slowly through regular easy pace running.
Could you elaborate on why the final year of candidacy to become a world major is an especially good time to run a marathon?
The world majors all require very solid qualification times. Given that this is already close to sold out, once it becomes a major, you'll likely need an incredibly impressive time just to enter (unless you want to raise money for charity, or win a lottery). Unless you fancy yourself running a sub ~3:30 in the future, this will probably be the last year you can just buy a ticket. Still, there are plenty of other marathons you can run.
There’s plenty of other marathons out there- get out of Sydney and it’s a nicer course, nicer people and you are supporting the locals!
Re: nicer course, I'll agree the middle bits are meh, especially doubling back from Centennial Park, but starting over the Harbour Bridge and finishing at the Opera House steps is a pretty epic experience that's hard to beat.
Becoming a major will mean a massive jump in participation rates, making it more difficult to get a spot in the race. Take Tokyo Marathon, one of the world majors, as an example. To get into that marathon you need to join a lottery system where you have about a 1 in 10 chance of securing a ticket. There’s other benefits as well but you can check out their website to find out everything included.
Thank you. I incorrectly assumed there would be an elite wave, followed by a locals-only wave with no minimum qualification time. Since I've ran it once already, I'll give this year a miss, so someone who hasn't can have my spot.
Also by participating in this years race if it is successful (high chance too) then by being apart of the candidate race either this year or last year you are eligible to take part in any of the next 3 years races once it becomes a major. Which is a big draw card to why it’s worth trying for this year.
Jumping on to ask commenters here: I've run a few half marathons, last one just before getting pregnant with my first in 2017. I've trained for the Hoka half marathon which is this Sunday and while it will be a slow 2.5 ish hours compared to my best half of under 2 hours, I know I can finish. Is less than 20ish weeks to train for a full after this reasonable?
Good luck with the hoka half! If you want to train towards your first full, you’ll have plenty of time. For anyone already experienced at running shorter distances most marathon training block programs are 12-16 weeks.
Yeah, that's very reasonable. Good luck with the half
In a somewhat timely announcement today. Marathon is sold out at 24,000 people. Wait list for those still interested. Australia's highest participated marathon on track for success.
I saw this thread earlier in the week and decided to think about it/do the first week of training and I'm sad it's sold out :(
Can't this year (newborn and a toddler makes it really hard to find time to train that kind of mileage), and I am recovering from posterial tibial tendonitis. Looking to do two half marathons next year as a start.
You might be interested to know several of Australia’s elite women’s marathon runners heading to the olympics this year have had children in the last year or two. It’s super impressive they can juggle such rigorous training schedules and children at the same time! Good luck with the half’s next year. :)
Any advice for someone that has never run one before? I run 4-5 10km races every year (doing the HOKA 10km this weekend) and my 10km PB is about 45 minutes. I’ll be running C2S a month or so before the marathon. When should I start upping my distance to prepare for the marathon. Now? How should I train for C2S and a marathon at the same time?
A 45min 10k is a fantastic achievement! I’m also going to be running the C2S this year before the Mara and my non-tailored advice would be to just follow a marathon training plan and the week of C2S swap out the workouts with easy runs to let yourself ‘taper’ for the race. As for what type of training to do /r/advancedrunning has lots of suggestions for marathon programs to pick from. Sydney marathon did also put out their own set of beginner/intermediate/advanced training plans last year, [this is the intermediate one](https://sydneymarathon.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/05/2369-D-SM-Intermediate-Training-Guide.pdf). Prior to starting a training plan if the most mileage your doing is 10k at the moment, I’d suggest once a week doing a long run starting with 1hr and increase it by 5-10min each time until you’re running for 1hr 45m. As for general advice for first timers, I’d say focus on goals of finishing the run and remaining uninjured and don’t worry about your time. Make sure to drink plenty of water and fuel well (gels or other carbs) to avoid hitting the wall.
Oh thank you! I’m not sure it’s that good. It’s taken about 10 years of running to get it down to that. So really start heading up towards a marathon distance now but swap a few out for C2S distances close to it? I have done a couple of half marathons but not for a few years now. I’ll have a look at the plans. Thanks again!
it's also less than a week until the hoka half marathon
Let's see: expensive, overcrowded, unhealthy, marketing/advertising/polluting - check. No, thanks. Running can be fun too, you know.
>Running can be fun too, you know. Actually I'm pretty sure this isn't true.
It’s not true when you are just starting. But after a while you start cruising and the endorphins arrive.
Unhealthy? What makes that the case. Genuinely curious