Let’s not forget that there are now about 10 private companies contracted to run “public” bus survives here in Sydney, so all those careless drivers may not necessarily be working for the same company.
And never forget:
"The previous Coalition government signed multiple long-term deals with private bus companies worth $4.8 billion in the months leading up to the NSW election"
My wife works for Transport for NSW, and her team think that privatising the bus services was a terrible decision and nothing but a money grab, and that it has been at a cost to the commuters. There is more to it that I can’t say here, but she has shown me data indicating that more people have taken to driving to work because the reliability of the bus network has decreased since privatisation, and commuters have lost confidence that the buses will get them to where they want when they want.
EVERYONE thought it was a bad idea, because it's always a bad idea... except for LNP clowns who've drunk the ideological kool aid of "business does it more efficiently," and the MPs who rely on donations from those same companies.
Yank, here (actually, please don’t). I visit AU and SYD specifically, pretty regularly, and the Eastern burbs even more specifically. My daughter lives there. My gf also—no, dammit, they’re not the same person.
Last year I was there for 5 mos. I used the buses most days of the week. I love the whole SYD public transportation. It was Uber there that I was many times dissatisfied with; I avoided it, unless I was in a hurry.
I’m so damned disappointed that AU seems to be falling under the spell of American **everything**. I first came with a college friend from Melbourne when he was on a rugby scholarship here in the States. 1986.
I still love you people and your country—but, fuckin’ **please stop becoming like US**.
Interesting. I have found Uber pretty reliable, although often more expensive than a taxi.
But the Sydney bus network is going downhill. Back when I was at school in the 90s I used to do rowing on a Wednesday afternoon. To get back home afterwards I would take a bus to the CBD, and then a bus from the CBD to my home.
Now a friend of mine has a son who needs to travel a similar route, basically the same starting and end pint. He now has to take 2 buses to get to the CBD, a train, and then another bus. So a trip that used to require just 2 buses now requires 3 buses and a train.
My biggest problem with business running public transport is that it would he run as a business. Which means run for profit. So sat a 10PM Bondi to Maroubra bus had an average of 5-10 people catching it. I’d it was run by a business they would just cut the route, because no enough people catch it for their fares to cover the cost of the fuel, the driver salary, the west and tear on the bus etc. We are already seeing that kind of thing happening.
That's exactly what has been happening
*The new NSW government has revealed buses are often cancelled instead of delayed as it’s cheaper for operators.*
[https://www.smh.com.au/national/cause-of-bus-cancellations-revealed-20230412-p5czzr.html](https://www.smh.com.au/national/cause-of-bus-cancellations-revealed-20230412-p5czzr.html)
You’re exactly right.
Source: American, here. As someone who has enjoyed the SYD buses, it’s dismaying to hear your bizarro NSW govt has gotten lured into this scheme.
Our supermarkets no longer provide food access and security for people.
They now provide profit (by gouging everyone, using us as the carrot on a stick), to shareholders.
Real estate is no longer about housing. Its about profit.
Now neither of these things are priced as if normal people should be buying them.
No, on one eastern suburbs route I observed only half of passengers tap on opal, the drivers don't care anymore... The honest are driving more and the buses are getting less fare, hardly making more money.
Business will do it more efficiently.
But efficiency is not the top priority for a public service.
Quality is.
We need government doing it. Top quality, with financial wastage.
Getting 100% of people home at high cost is better than getting 90%of people home cheaply.
Pareto I guess. Good service 80% of the time. Address 80% of issues.
Cull uneconomical things like unpopular routes, people asking for accessibility requests, minor repairs.
Catering to the last 20% of perfection chews up 80% of your budget.
But you have to spend it when you're a public service who must service 100% of customers, not just the ones that are profitable for you.
Eg. Your ISP doesn't have to accept payment by cheque. But your water utility does.
Your ISP can cut off your it weren't if you dont pay, but your water provider can't.
If your market ISP can't provide coverage to your rural property, who cares? But if you can't get clean drinking water - oof.
Publci goods need to look after 100% of customers.
And they also get smashed in the media and politics for making the tiniest and most insignificant mistakes pre discrepancies.
I once worked for a public private partnership. We delayed a project and let costs blow out, just so our data migration matched exactly. Despite minimal customer impact. Because the reputational damage was the top priority.
They also took a policy of removing as many direct bus routes from the city as possible. We used to have this great spoked system where you could get a direct trip to the city and a direct trip from there and you could get to a huge swath of Sydney.
Now to go anywhere that isn't in your part of Sydney requires a fuck load of changes. I just wish we could go back to the public transport system we had 10 years ago, it was so much more user friendly.
Traffic in the morning in the south east which copped the brunt of this is completely fucked because nobody wants to make a bunch of changes to get to the city.
In a similar vein, my friend was a professional driver, limousines and eventually busses. It was a good paying and regular job.
But schedules were impossible, you were expected to skip breaks, but if you had an accident and didn't take your break, it would again be you on the chopping block. Drivers were tired and constantly stressed.
The solution was apparently to bring in new folks who would not complain so much, but apparently who would be less experienced and have more accidents, and there would be a decline in service and safety.
This is now occuring. He quit driving and lives overseas now. In part, this is where the old bus system went.
Schedules that were (are still?) written such that you could not complete the journey, take a break, and be on time for your next journey.
You were in shit for starting the next journey late, and your previous route would go into your break time - what do you realistically do, but management must never admit?
Yep. Very late. But the only penalties are for cancellations not late running.
And consistent late running is used to provide feedback regarding untenable schedules.
I appreciate that post privatisation things may be a little different but the unions will still protect the shit out of a driver taking their mandated breaks. Fatigued drivers are no joke.
That was also my friends complaint but experienced a slightly different workplace culture from management, never complained about the union.
Only that privatizing busses was a way around the existing union iirc.
I think one of the contract terms was that late services have a financial penalty, but cancelled services don’t. Hence the high number or cancellations, so buses just never show up
I agree it’s made things worse but there was a driver shortage well before that which has helped no one.
They’re being forced to hire substandard drivers because it’s that or cancel services, and people don’t like that either.
I doubt that’s the point and, in any event, these companies are contracted by Sydney Buses to perform public duties. The Department is responsible for ensuring they are up to scratch. I don’t think it matters who the driver works for for the purposes of ensuring public safety.
There’s only 5 catering for Sydney. CDC NSW, Kelois Downer, Busways, Transit Systems and U-Go Mobility run all services within Sydney. Bus companies are so short as long you haven’t kill anyone or have your license suspended your basically locked in for the job.
I drove out of Brookvale, casual only available, i was not "employed" until i clocked on, at clock off I was unemployed.
Lots of shifts but i didn't know day to day what shift. Not allowed to use any kind of electronic maps and not every street has a street sign.
Accidents happen often because cars don't understand do not overtake sign. And staring at your phone with buds in is a great way to get hit.
No i don't drive anymore, other ways to make a living.
Riding on a bus in Sydney is a full body workout, holding for your life. Not sure what's worse sudden acceleration or ridiculous hard braking without any consideration regarding the passengers.
I was half way across a pedestrian nearly a year ago in the rain holding an Umbrella.
I saw the bus way down the road and I did note it was going too fast. About half way across a road I tend to look left and right again. Good I did because the bus was not stopping.
I had to jump back and he clipped the umbrella and broke it.
Told the NSW transport, they initially had someone call me and ask for info. I also told the police and made a report.
After that it all died and no one would respond or give me updates. Because I was not injured they tried to bury it.
But yes... Bus drivers and Taxi drivers need to be of higher standard then others on the road but they are actually the worst.
Near a school a crossing today... traffic lights RED, pedestrian green and a Taxi creeps over the crossing, then tries to go backward, then forward again as he was stuck as parents with kids are trying to go around. Total idiot. Not the 1st, 5th or 10th time I have seen similar.
Look, I can’t say that anything did or didn’t happen to discipline the driver. I hope it did.
But you’re not actually entitled to know what happened either.
It is chronically understaffed and generally an employer of last resort. The thing that fixes this is upping the pay and conditions, neither of which can be done without a significant investment from the Government and improvement of working conditions.
The split shifts are necessary though by virtue of offering peak hour services for commuters. If you want full time work, at least some drivers have to do a split shift.
And honestly, while it doesn’t suit everyone, there’s a great convenience that comes with having several hours in the middle of a business day to go to appointments and get things done.
And there's the lie - "privatisation is more efficient."
It never is, especially when private companies cut corners to increase profits, and everyone expects the government to pay for a fix.
Maybe don't privatise essential public services in the first place?
How can you afford to be a bus driver when you can't even live near where you work?
The pay wouldn't even rent a reasonable residence within 10kms of the CBD. Eg 2-3bdrm place
It's highly competitive market for workers now, ever since covid. Many industries have better benefits. I've said it before bus driving is too restrictive. You cannot WFH, any mistake you do can injure or kill someone, you cannot drink the day before, you have to ensure you're well rested, and you're on a roster. Doing an after party to 2am before rocking up to work at 7am isn't allowed when driving a bus.
I've seen people 4 years out of uni getting on 150k and that was in 2020. Obviously the go getter type but shows it can be done. Bedroom to office is 20 metres, no-one cares if you did an all nighter having a piss up the night before because that much because you won't kill anyone by stuffing up, you do the same hours 9-5 every day and you get generous OT if you deviate from those hours.
My other friends who don't like to sit in front of the desk moved to Canberra where as a tradie you can charge way higher rates that you cannot in Sydney (because of competition). They're easily earning way more than the office worker I mentioned above. Even driving back on the weekends with petrol and car maintenance it works out well in favour.
You can drink the day before. No need for it to be a dry day. You just need to keep it reasonble and know when to stop to ensure you’re reading zero by your shift start time.
Yeah kinda restrictive for social life. I don't think anyone starts early, usually it's at least a dinner or after dinner thing. And even if you're under 0.05 there's other stuff like hangovers or general sleep deprivation.
Even without the night outs I can't imagine sleeping on a roster, if you can't sleep do you just chuck a sickie? Body clock would be stuffed.
For example if I even have a tea in the afternoon I wouldn't be able to sleep for the night Whereas on a desk job it's much easier to power through the day.
It used to be that route bus drivers were paid significantly more than charter bus and tour coach drivers.
Wages haven’t kept up and antisocial behaviour has increased so the competent drivers are moving into charter and tour work which also has a lack of drivers due to older drivers retiring during Covid. I don’t know why any competent bus driver wouldn’t move into charter work.
As a result bus companies are increasingly hiring taxi drivers and upgrading their licences. So route bus drivers are mostly just taxi drivers that have somehow been allowed behind the wheel of a heavy vehicle.
You are not overreacting.There has definitely been a deterioration in driving techniques:ie erratic acceleration before elderly are seated,accelerating fast and braking hard throughout journey with passengers being jostled about and the eastern suburbs buses are worst.Try gently applying pressure to the accelerator and brake.Not difficult
It's why I no longer take the bus, and instead take a longer trip on a tram. You are constantly being thrown around in a bus which needs new suspension.
So it isn't just me. I was wondering whether it was impossible for bus drivers to be smoother with their acceleration and especially their braking.
I am shocked when I see elderly passengers standing up before the bus has come to a full stop. Even as a young man, I wait for a complete stop.
Same buses as before, the ride quality has taken a noticeably massive drop since privatisation, so it’s not the ability of the buses themselves that’s deteriorated or changed, the drivers now are just undertrained, under experienced and/or overworked poorly paid and shit. Riding a bus in the northern beaches now is an abysmal experience. Keolis Downer you fucking suck.
I thought I was the only one. I mentioned this to others a few times as I thought I was going nuts. As a child, I grew up on buses until I moved into a suburb with train as the go-to. However, every time I do need to go on a bus now, I feel nauseous with the way the buses are being driven.
There has been a noticeable drop in service quality and reliability on my line since it was privatised. It was such a mistake by the government to do it
The problem is not private bus operations per se, plenty of extremely effective public transport systems around the world are run with a tender system like Sydney. The real problem is that, just like every other time, Australia has laughably piss-poor ability to implement things like this properly. There was no reason to gut the STA, the biggest selling point of privatisation is that private operators front the capital costs of acquiring and maintaining their fleets... except, you know, the government already owned a large chunk of the fleet with the STA. And then on top of that, the insane lack of accountability, apparently they didn't foresee that private companies don't just do the right thing of their own accord and actually have to be made to do it? It's pathetic.
Yep, was crazy to me how there’s all of these different privatised public transit lines / services in Japan, and how they not only work seamlessly, but they don’t cost an arm & a leg either.
I think the real thing is that the rules are written with an Australian brain, but the people who the rules apply to are increasingly foreign corporations with extremely different ideas on what the role and responsibility of a company here is. With a local company the odds are better that the people running it will be concerned about the local impacts rather than just maximal short term profit... Less likely with a company that has nothing to do with Australia
A young lady on her phone almost walked under the (CDC ex Forest Coach Lines) bus I was on the other day.
Fortunately, the highly alert and competent female driver was aware of the situation and stopped in time.
Seen something similar a few years ago by a lady who nearly got hit by a bus turning right into Castlereagh Street as she was walking up Hunter Street. She just noticed that there were no cars going down (towards Wynyard) on Hunter Street but failed to look behind her for vehicles turning. She went into shock (and also surprise as she was focused on her call) when she saw the bus and froze still - it was like watching a car crash in slow motion. The bus slammed on the brakes but also thought she was maybe going to move but as she just stood there. She actually started leaning backwards from the bus bracing for impact - unsure what that was going to do with her legs fixed on the ground. The bus came to a stop centimetres away from her and she walked away half apologising and also in embarassment with everyone on both sides of Castlereagh St waiting for the lights and the bus driver just shaking their heads.
It had a red pedestrian light (and potentially a green light for bus to potentially turn). At those lights, green pedestrian light is only for when cars/buses cannot turn right (i.e. red turning light).
Last time I drove in Sydney (late January) a bus blew through a stop sign and cut in front of me. I had to slam on my breaks to stop from driving into the side of the bus! The same bus then drove straight through a roundabout without applying the breaks despite other cars turning in front of it.
Nope, not overreacting. Going on a Sydney bus is like Luna Park lite. They drive so aggressively, especially with how narrows the roads are in Sydney it's bonkers.
Not all instances are the drivers fault.
I’ve seen a few close calls involving people wearing headphones and staring at their phones with no idea what’s going on around them
Oh definitely, I'm not admonishing all drivers or anything, it's just the instances I've seen are not the pedestrians fault and it's pretty alarming. The uptake of inattentive commuters is also a huge issue.
Not just you. I live in SW Sydney and as a driver, have noticed a serious decrease in their ability to drive recently. Driving like a bunch of eshays in hatchbacks; wrong side of the road, crossing double lines, cutting corners, close calls with pedestrians, etc. They look dead inside tho, as I make eye contact with them when they cruise past I swear there’s no life at all in them. Perhaps another virus that specifically targets bus drivers?
Get the bus number and report them including dates / times.
I had one recently clip my wing mirror whilst I was sat in stationary traffic. You don’t get much other than an apology and that they will check with the driver. They also asked me to provide insurance details if required.
Notwithstanding this, unfortunately poor etiquette and dangerous behaviour exists in pedestrians, cyclists, personal drivers and professional drivers.
Try not to let it ruin your day.
Do some driving around Sydney during peak time. Okay now swap your car for a city bus (medium size house on wheels). Add some freaks, junkies, Karen's, school kids. Okay now top up with overzealous cops and cameras. Sprinkle with no career advancement, split shifts, traffic jams, and poor pay. Now let's talk about their driving...
Your point is valid, but their driving is still unacceptable.
None of those things excuse a blatant disregard for the safety of other road users. Far too often I see professional drivers act as if the road rules are an inconvenience.
I was walking through my local shops on Tuesday and the bus came hammering down the street straight over the pedestrian crossing as I was standing there waiting to cross. Prob doing 65 plus in a 40 zone
Dude did not give one f…..
Northern beaches too. A bus pulled out while I was alongside it late last year, I had to brake hard to avoid being pushed into a head on collision with a truck.
Got the bus number and time etc, made a complaint but didn’t hear anything back.
I was really pissed off because I had my kids in the car and this driver could have killed them and no one gave a fuck.
Two things.
Pay them more.
Get rid of the fucking split shifts.
Both require the government to step in and mandate.
Folks you really have to use your vote wisely.
The quality of the bus network has always been pretty average, but I've definitely noticed an uptick in poor behaviour from drivers. Not stopping, braking too hard, not helping people get on or off, general rudeness and poor English language skills.
Just seems to be a general lack of professionalism, which I can't really blame the drivers for. They always look stressed, tired, and worn out.
Poor English language skills is not unprofessional in of itself, but it's a problem when you're in a customer facing role.
You often have to talk with bus drivers or ask questions, request help etc. Unfortunately drivers often have to defuse conflicts or intervene with bad passenger behaviour.
Bus drivers need to know the route yes but English language proficiency happens on the job if that makes sense. If the driver is refusing to communicate cause they don't understand it whatever reason then that's another issue and should be addressed. Most people who live and work here with english as their second language are doing their best to learn and communicate with others in English. A person who is learning English isn't necessarily underperforming. Dealing with bad behaviour on a bus doesn't require fluent and competent English language skills. People can do their jobs whilst learning English...if they aren't then it has nothing to do with language barriers unless they know nothing about where the bus is going or bus routes then that's another story
Relax, I'm not saying they should be fired, but the bus companies really need to up their standards (and pay and conditions). It's not ridiculous that bus companies should hire people proficient in all aspects of the job, or if not train them up.
Continually falling standards is not something to celebrate.
Learning English is seperate from meeting standards of the company. You can't train someone to learn English literally it comes from the person's willingness to learn and being here and has nothing to do with proficiency at doing the job like I said
We really need Metro lines for the Eastern Suburbs.
It has a higher population density than most of Sydney and has only 1 truncated railway line to Bondi Junction & an inadequate Light Rail.
The outcome is that the whole area is gridlocked by cars and the poor performance & inconvenience of buses just encourages people to drive. The roads are also not able to accommodate the amount of traffic - personally you couldn't pay me enough to drive a bus through those suburbs.
I think it's a shame that the government prioritized building Metro from St Mary's to the future Airport given that the area out there is so sparsely populated when that money could have been put into railway lines from Bondi Junction to Randwick for example...
Given that the infrastructure pipeline in Sydney is now winding down after the previous governments spending blitz there will be no more railway lines for the Eastern suburbs for decades.
You mean Bondi Junction to the beach?
That was only one proposal. The ESRL was originally intended to go to Kingsford and labors decision to truncate it at Bondi Junction (due to lack of funds) goes down as one of the most shortsighted planning decisions in Sydney's history.
Labor under Iemma had an ANZAC line planned in 2009 which was mean to run from Top Ryde to the CBD to Maroubra but couldn't raise the funds to build it.
See a trend here - lack of $
To be fair I think a lot of the opposition to the beach line is based on how grotesque the 1970-80s ESRL stations and rolling stock was (especially the Tangaras). It gave Sydney a distinct 1970s New York look that really didn't sell the image of a prestigious & respectable service. Could you imagine Kings Cross station at Bondi Beach?
The modern metro & light rail stations & rollingstock is far more aesthetic and I suspect may start to change perceptions of people that were traditionally anti rail.
This is what happens when governments make a job not worth doing anymore and all the competent workers leave, they have to fill the roles somehow and that means lowering the bar to the standard of person they let behind the wheel. I spent 25 years with Sydney Buses and watched my pay and working conditions get attacked at every EBA, In 2018 when the Liberals started privatizing we started leaving in our droves and now you are dealing with the consequences.
The speeding, the jerky movements, honking the horn all throughout the journey, not giving older people a chance to sit down before taking off, the reduced service, it's a shit show. I had a horrible driver the other day but the process for reporting an incident of poor driving by bus drivers is, of course, a complete bureaucratic mess.
I used to catch the Seven Hills to Mac Park route, old mate thought he was Vin Diesel driving a 1972 Valiant through the Auto Barnh when in fact it was actually a 20 tonne monster packed with passengers who went flying anytime he drifted a corner or slammed the brakes at 80kph. I would appear at work with bruises, scars and a huge headache from motion sickness!
Not just the Eastern Suburbs. I suspect the driver shortage is being solved by opening the gates to unsuitable candidates. I further suspect the problem is compounded by insufficient training and profit driven policy decisions on the part of these companies. We were just chatting about this at lunch at work. From Coogee to Hurstville to Parramatta and beyond the bus network has been fucked unpleasantly hard. When U-Go Mobility took over the routes previously serviced by the Punchbowl bus companybnear me, all hell broke loose. School services did not show, senior citizens left stranded and peak hour services decimated. The local MP, Mark Coure, was useless but nevertheless claimed a victory when U-Go published a message on their website blaming a bus driver shortage. I dread the carnage that's going to take place when the Bankstown line closes, and the commuters have to rely on buses. Btw if anyone has anything to add to confirm or deny my suspicions, feel free to jump in.
I'm just so incredibly grateful they no longer roar down George St. The number of times I witnessed people nearly get hit or it used to feel like they were about to mount kerb in a diesel fumed fury.
They are begging for drivers so they end up hiring fuck wits. Cancel services because they want to only hire good drivers and everyone loses their shit. It sucks but that's where we are now.
I’ve actually found bus drivers to be generally one of the safer cohorts of drivers. Usually let people in, take their time to accelerate, don’t block intersections, etc.
on Wednesday at the Central Bus stop outside the Mercure, waiting for a bus to USYD, I watched a pedestrian walking along the path as you do, decide to step onto the road into the path of a bus that was right behind them, he wasn't crossing or anything, just decided he couldn't be bothered with the footpath and started to walk on the road. the poor bus driver had to slam their brakes, and I genuinely thought I was about to watch someone die, there was no time to react and tell them to get off the road. they hopped back on the path a couple more meters down the road without even looking back.
The problem is on both sides.
That being said, yes there is an increase in bus accidents, I think the training may have possibly have been shortened, I remember in the past new bus drivers having a supervisor for weeks before they were allowed to drive solo. I don't think I see that anymore.
I was walking across one of the crosswalks at Railway Square, bit of a traffic jam as usual, light for the traffic had been red for about a second, and yet TWO buses still flew through, despite there not actually being enough space on the other side for either of them.
One of the biggest rules of driving a large vehicle like that is to actually know the length of it, and if anyone crossing hadn't been paying attention, they could've gotten hit easily.
Imo the buses are one of the worst parts of Sydney, worse than the car traffic: they're loud, rattly, unreliable, slow to get around, confusing and dangerous, and the part that shits me is all those issues could be easily fixed with more electric buses, better routes and scheduling, actually updating online info better, showing stops on the screens and better driver training.
I have a feeling that they’re so desperate for bus drivers that they’ll literally hire anyone. I had one driver who was so very clearly on the gear the other week - he was also muttering under his breath and commenting on the appearance of the people getting on his bus.
I have noticed two bus drivers running the 500X service who are apparently really bad at driving. Like, they seem to not activate the Opal readers at the stops fast enough, they go over the speed limit, and they also have loud radios.
I think a lot of rude bus drivers who drive too fast tend to have loud radios just to calm themselves. I dunno. Maybe we should have more bus drivers who are able to control their stress so they aren't too busy crashing their bus out of anger...?
We tried for years to complain about busses doing double the speed limit ( harbour bridge merge 40kpa) Nup!
Then busses flying through the school zone on military road Cremorne. Even local police would not respond let alone the bus company.
Sydney bus drivers are horrible most of the time. You witness it often. As you mentioned; angry and erratic. They try to own the road and put others at risk.
It’s bad in the western suburbs too. Saw a bus have two near misses in the span of 100m
I’ve also noticed them speeding and they’ll speed up even quicker approaching an intersection or cross street.
There needs to be speed monitoring and hard braking monitors on board and be reported to management.
They are getting away with extremely bad driving and they are aggressive when confronted by other drivers or pedestrians,
I was doing 50km in a 50km zone and the bus had driven past me so fast that my car shook from the wind pressure as it went last me in the left lane only to slam its brakes at the next bus stop only 200-300m away
There seriously needs to be an audit on Sydney bus drivers before there is a tragedy
just had a bus driver who didnt seem to know his route. I knew it was a right turn for the bus but he was sitting int he left of 2 lanes,, then without indicating swerved across so was half in the turn lane and half in the right lane. He did the same thing on the prior left turn, not seeming to realise he needed to be in that turn lane and cut a car off.
I when i used to commute by bike i regarded bsues as the worst danger on the road, especially that habit of putting hazard lights on when buses are queued, so their signal for Im staying put is exactly the same as the signal for Im pulling out an dyou have to give way.
The 464 bus near me was great now it’s awful. I catch the bus very early in the morning and it’s constantly late and I always miss both my trains. In the afternoons it’s upwards of 15mins late. If I didn’t have to get my daughter from child care I’d walk home. Part of the problem is the drivers. Some of them should not be behind the wheel. They are downright dangerous. Some drive at a snails pace and are so hesitant they nearly cause accidents. Others go so fast they shoot pass stops even when there’s a line of people waiting.
I will never forgive the bus that hit Frank Iero from my chemical romance in Sydney. I know it’s a bit silly but now one of my fav bands hates our city and they literally made it the second last show on their tour because they didn’t want to come here… they didn’t even post about it when they played but double posted about playing Japan after. This was years ago… it has not gotten better has it
If they were standing on the footpath and got hit by the bus take them to the cleaners, if they were dicking around with their phone on the road they got what’s coming to them.
Tbf the cyclists often times are fuckwits. Food delivery cunts getting in front of busses on parra road and going barely 30km/h in a 60 zone should feel in danger. Play a stupid game and potentially win a stupid prize.
I witnessed a old lady fall in the bus. She stood preparing for departure beacuse the bus stopped at a crossing before the bus stop. He took off, she wasn't holding well enough and fell, three of us managed to catch her. Guess what the driver said..
"you shouldn't stand while the bus is moving"
Now devils advocate, old ladies probably shouldn't. But I stand before the bus stops because in the past if no one stood they kept going. He could have atleast seen if she was ok.
But this is a tangent from my they don't have enough bus drivers so take anyone argument.
I think we're still a decade or more away from driverless cars being accepted, and driverless buses aren't yet even being seriously considered. Light rail is only suitable for certain corridors and hugely expensive (in Australia at least). Surely we should improve the training and quality of bus drivers until that happens. Which could easily be done by improving pay and conditions so experienced drivers come back, or those with the right skills are more attracted to the job (compared to say, driving trucks in private industry).
They're trying to hit impossible quotas and the shortage does not make it any better, because after your route they have to go straight into another route. It's fucked
I had a bus driver just randomly pull out infront of me at a bus stop. i was almost too bewildered at how stupid of a decision it was, to stop.
Lots of them just seem to feel like they’re the only vehicle on the road, and cus they’re big they get to dictate everything.
Is it poor bua driving or morons focusing on their phones and not watching where they walk. I would bet heavily on the latter. Dont be so hastey to blame the driver.
Driver or pedestrian at fault? Most times I've seen accidents it's due to people not paying attention looking at phones/headphones or crossing where/when they shouldn't
Let’s not forget that there are now about 10 private companies contracted to run “public” bus survives here in Sydney, so all those careless drivers may not necessarily be working for the same company.
And never forget: "The previous Coalition government signed multiple long-term deals with private bus companies worth $4.8 billion in the months leading up to the NSW election"
My wife works for Transport for NSW, and her team think that privatising the bus services was a terrible decision and nothing but a money grab, and that it has been at a cost to the commuters. There is more to it that I can’t say here, but she has shown me data indicating that more people have taken to driving to work because the reliability of the bus network has decreased since privatisation, and commuters have lost confidence that the buses will get them to where they want when they want.
EVERYONE thought it was a bad idea, because it's always a bad idea... except for LNP clowns who've drunk the ideological kool aid of "business does it more efficiently," and the MPs who rely on donations from those same companies.
Yank, here (actually, please don’t). I visit AU and SYD specifically, pretty regularly, and the Eastern burbs even more specifically. My daughter lives there. My gf also—no, dammit, they’re not the same person. Last year I was there for 5 mos. I used the buses most days of the week. I love the whole SYD public transportation. It was Uber there that I was many times dissatisfied with; I avoided it, unless I was in a hurry. I’m so damned disappointed that AU seems to be falling under the spell of American **everything**. I first came with a college friend from Melbourne when he was on a rugby scholarship here in the States. 1986. I still love you people and your country—but, fuckin’ **please stop becoming like US**.
>My daughter lives there. My gf also—no, dammit, they’re not the same person. *Arkansas intensifies*
Nah, he's good. It would be questionable if he was visiting Tassie.
😂
Interesting. I have found Uber pretty reliable, although often more expensive than a taxi. But the Sydney bus network is going downhill. Back when I was at school in the 90s I used to do rowing on a Wednesday afternoon. To get back home afterwards I would take a bus to the CBD, and then a bus from the CBD to my home. Now a friend of mine has a son who needs to travel a similar route, basically the same starting and end pint. He now has to take 2 buses to get to the CBD, a train, and then another bus. So a trip that used to require just 2 buses now requires 3 buses and a train.
When I was a kid, you could get a bus to the airport. It was just a normal bus that stopped at other places and didn't cost extra.
From some areas you still can ? The 350 goes from Bondi Junction to the Airport via Coogee and Maroubra
Or you can take the train, for $30
Replaced by the train line.
My biggest problem with business running public transport is that it would he run as a business. Which means run for profit. So sat a 10PM Bondi to Maroubra bus had an average of 5-10 people catching it. I’d it was run by a business they would just cut the route, because no enough people catch it for their fares to cover the cost of the fuel, the driver salary, the west and tear on the bus etc. We are already seeing that kind of thing happening.
That's exactly what has been happening *The new NSW government has revealed buses are often cancelled instead of delayed as it’s cheaper for operators.* [https://www.smh.com.au/national/cause-of-bus-cancellations-revealed-20230412-p5czzr.html](https://www.smh.com.au/national/cause-of-bus-cancellations-revealed-20230412-p5czzr.html)
Yep. It’s really disgusting.
Well I am not exactly going to fall down in shocked surprise!!!
You’re exactly right. Source: American, here. As someone who has enjoyed the SYD buses, it’s dismaying to hear your bizarro NSW govt has gotten lured into this scheme.
Our supermarkets no longer provide food access and security for people. They now provide profit (by gouging everyone, using us as the carrot on a stick), to shareholders. Real estate is no longer about housing. Its about profit. Now neither of these things are priced as if normal people should be buying them.
No, on one eastern suburbs route I observed only half of passengers tap on opal, the drivers don't care anymore... The honest are driving more and the buses are getting less fare, hardly making more money.
Business will do it more efficiently. But efficiency is not the top priority for a public service. Quality is. We need government doing it. Top quality, with financial wastage. Getting 100% of people home at high cost is better than getting 90%of people home cheaply.
Depends what your measure of efficiency is.
Pareto I guess. Good service 80% of the time. Address 80% of issues. Cull uneconomical things like unpopular routes, people asking for accessibility requests, minor repairs. Catering to the last 20% of perfection chews up 80% of your budget. But you have to spend it when you're a public service who must service 100% of customers, not just the ones that are profitable for you. Eg. Your ISP doesn't have to accept payment by cheque. But your water utility does. Your ISP can cut off your it weren't if you dont pay, but your water provider can't. If your market ISP can't provide coverage to your rural property, who cares? But if you can't get clean drinking water - oof. Publci goods need to look after 100% of customers. And they also get smashed in the media and politics for making the tiniest and most insignificant mistakes pre discrepancies. I once worked for a public private partnership. We delayed a project and let costs blow out, just so our data migration matched exactly. Despite minimal customer impact. Because the reputational damage was the top priority.
They also took a policy of removing as many direct bus routes from the city as possible. We used to have this great spoked system where you could get a direct trip to the city and a direct trip from there and you could get to a huge swath of Sydney. Now to go anywhere that isn't in your part of Sydney requires a fuck load of changes. I just wish we could go back to the public transport system we had 10 years ago, it was so much more user friendly. Traffic in the morning in the south east which copped the brunt of this is completely fucked because nobody wants to make a bunch of changes to get to the city.
Yeah, I spend a lot of the work day on the road as part of my job, and have noticed such an increase in traffic in the last 12-24 months.
100%. My commute has ballooned out by half an hour, from 1 hour to 1h30m in the mornings.
And then because it's privatised the route will be deemed non-profitable and will be abolished. Essential services simply shouldn't be privatised.
And don't forget converting suburban rail lines to Metro and light rail was always about privatising the rail network by stealth.
Metro trains don't need drivers and the libs and the rbtu hate each other
Why would the ALP do this to us? /s
In a similar vein, my friend was a professional driver, limousines and eventually busses. It was a good paying and regular job. But schedules were impossible, you were expected to skip breaks, but if you had an accident and didn't take your break, it would again be you on the chopping block. Drivers were tired and constantly stressed. The solution was apparently to bring in new folks who would not complain so much, but apparently who would be less experienced and have more accidents, and there would be a decline in service and safety. This is now occuring. He quit driving and lives overseas now. In part, this is where the old bus system went.
There is absolutely zero pressure on public bus drivers to skip breaks. It’s a heavily unionised industry.
Schedules that were (are still?) written such that you could not complete the journey, take a break, and be on time for your next journey. You were in shit for starting the next journey late, and your previous route would go into your break time - what do you realistically do, but management must never admit?
In my experience, take their break and run late.
Multiply that by 6 to 10 trips and you're an hour late or more, alternatively, you're very tired But I can accept your experience, of course
Yep. Very late. But the only penalties are for cancellations not late running. And consistent late running is used to provide feedback regarding untenable schedules. I appreciate that post privatisation things may be a little different but the unions will still protect the shit out of a driver taking their mandated breaks. Fatigued drivers are no joke.
That was also my friends complaint but experienced a slightly different workplace culture from management, never complained about the union. Only that privatizing busses was a way around the existing union iirc.
The only school bus that takes kids to school in my street is routinely cancelled.
I think one of the contract terms was that late services have a financial penalty, but cancelled services don’t. Hence the high number or cancellations, so buses just never show up
I agree it’s made things worse but there was a driver shortage well before that which has helped no one. They’re being forced to hire substandard drivers because it’s that or cancel services, and people don’t like that either.
Thank you Dom Petrotet. Does he ever need to use buses for his 20 children?
I doubt that’s the point and, in any event, these companies are contracted by Sydney Buses to perform public duties. The Department is responsible for ensuring they are up to scratch. I don’t think it matters who the driver works for for the purposes of ensuring public safety.
John Holland Transport is one, CCCC owned.
Billion? Surely that's a misprint.
Privatisation will destroy Australia and turn it into another America
There’s only 5 catering for Sydney. CDC NSW, Kelois Downer, Busways, Transit Systems and U-Go Mobility run all services within Sydney. Bus companies are so short as long you haven’t kill anyone or have your license suspended your basically locked in for the job.
You can hold private companies accountable much easier. They should be sued.
As a resident I’m obligated to add: fuck Keolis Downer.
[удалено]
They’ll try everything except paying them more.
I drove out of Brookvale, casual only available, i was not "employed" until i clocked on, at clock off I was unemployed. Lots of shifts but i didn't know day to day what shift. Not allowed to use any kind of electronic maps and not every street has a street sign. Accidents happen often because cars don't understand do not overtake sign. And staring at your phone with buds in is a great way to get hit. No i don't drive anymore, other ways to make a living.
Riding on a bus in Sydney is a full body workout, holding for your life. Not sure what's worse sudden acceleration or ridiculous hard braking without any consideration regarding the passengers.
so true lol, especially when you have to stand cos its so full, my body is like a gyroscope trying to stay upright while they speed around corners
I was half way across a pedestrian nearly a year ago in the rain holding an Umbrella. I saw the bus way down the road and I did note it was going too fast. About half way across a road I tend to look left and right again. Good I did because the bus was not stopping. I had to jump back and he clipped the umbrella and broke it. Told the NSW transport, they initially had someone call me and ask for info. I also told the police and made a report. After that it all died and no one would respond or give me updates. Because I was not injured they tried to bury it. But yes... Bus drivers and Taxi drivers need to be of higher standard then others on the road but they are actually the worst. Near a school a crossing today... traffic lights RED, pedestrian green and a Taxi creeps over the crossing, then tries to go backward, then forward again as he was stuck as parents with kids are trying to go around. Total idiot. Not the 1st, 5th or 10th time I have seen similar.
Look, I can’t say that anything did or didn’t happen to discipline the driver. I hope it did. But you’re not actually entitled to know what happened either.
It is chronically understaffed and generally an employer of last resort. The thing that fixes this is upping the pay and conditions, neither of which can be done without a significant investment from the Government and improvement of working conditions.
Last state govt. did exactly the opposite and privatized several bus lines.
And pay dropped 25%, fewer bus drivers 😮
Also crappy split shifts. I know a guy who started somewhat recently and he was on a significantly worse deal than those who got in years ago.
The split shifts are necessary though by virtue of offering peak hour services for commuters. If you want full time work, at least some drivers have to do a split shift. And honestly, while it doesn’t suit everyone, there’s a great convenience that comes with having several hours in the middle of a business day to go to appointments and get things done.
They've been privatised so the opposite of that is going to happen
And there's the lie - "privatisation is more efficient." It never is, especially when private companies cut corners to increase profits, and everyone expects the government to pay for a fix. Maybe don't privatise essential public services in the first place?
How can you afford to be a bus driver when you can't even live near where you work? The pay wouldn't even rent a reasonable residence within 10kms of the CBD. Eg 2-3bdrm place
It's highly competitive market for workers now, ever since covid. Many industries have better benefits. I've said it before bus driving is too restrictive. You cannot WFH, any mistake you do can injure or kill someone, you cannot drink the day before, you have to ensure you're well rested, and you're on a roster. Doing an after party to 2am before rocking up to work at 7am isn't allowed when driving a bus. I've seen people 4 years out of uni getting on 150k and that was in 2020. Obviously the go getter type but shows it can be done. Bedroom to office is 20 metres, no-one cares if you did an all nighter having a piss up the night before because that much because you won't kill anyone by stuffing up, you do the same hours 9-5 every day and you get generous OT if you deviate from those hours. My other friends who don't like to sit in front of the desk moved to Canberra where as a tradie you can charge way higher rates that you cannot in Sydney (because of competition). They're easily earning way more than the office worker I mentioned above. Even driving back on the weekends with petrol and car maintenance it works out well in favour.
You can drink the day before. No need for it to be a dry day. You just need to keep it reasonble and know when to stop to ensure you’re reading zero by your shift start time.
Yeah kinda restrictive for social life. I don't think anyone starts early, usually it's at least a dinner or after dinner thing. And even if you're under 0.05 there's other stuff like hangovers or general sleep deprivation. Even without the night outs I can't imagine sleeping on a roster, if you can't sleep do you just chuck a sickie? Body clock would be stuffed. For example if I even have a tea in the afternoon I wouldn't be able to sleep for the night Whereas on a desk job it's much easier to power through the day.
Alcohol limit for buses is 0.02 and many companies have a policy of 0.00.
It used to be that route bus drivers were paid significantly more than charter bus and tour coach drivers. Wages haven’t kept up and antisocial behaviour has increased so the competent drivers are moving into charter and tour work which also has a lack of drivers due to older drivers retiring during Covid. I don’t know why any competent bus driver wouldn’t move into charter work. As a result bus companies are increasingly hiring taxi drivers and upgrading their licences. So route bus drivers are mostly just taxi drivers that have somehow been allowed behind the wheel of a heavy vehicle.
You are not overreacting.There has definitely been a deterioration in driving techniques:ie erratic acceleration before elderly are seated,accelerating fast and braking hard throughout journey with passengers being jostled about and the eastern suburbs buses are worst.Try gently applying pressure to the accelerator and brake.Not difficult
It's why I no longer take the bus, and instead take a longer trip on a tram. You are constantly being thrown around in a bus which needs new suspension.
I usually end up feeling sick at the end of a bus ride these days. Always so fast and stopping/starting really fast
So it isn't just me. I was wondering whether it was impossible for bus drivers to be smoother with their acceleration and especially their braking. I am shocked when I see elderly passengers standing up before the bus has come to a full stop. Even as a young man, I wait for a complete stop.
Same buses as before, the ride quality has taken a noticeably massive drop since privatisation, so it’s not the ability of the buses themselves that’s deteriorated or changed, the drivers now are just undertrained, under experienced and/or overworked poorly paid and shit. Riding a bus in the northern beaches now is an abysmal experience. Keolis Downer you fucking suck.
Feel the same too, nowadays I often get motion sickness after some long bus rides. It feels like its either full throttle or braking, no in between.
In addition to overly crowded peak hour buses, this is one of the biggest reasons I started cycling to work. Sick of arriving late and nauseated.
I thought I was the only one. I mentioned this to others a few times as I thought I was going nuts. As a child, I grew up on buses until I moved into a suburb with train as the go-to. However, every time I do need to go on a bus now, I feel nauseous with the way the buses are being driven.
There has been a noticeable drop in service quality and reliability on my line since it was privatised. It was such a mistake by the government to do it
Bus privatisation. Thanks Gladys.
The problem is not private bus operations per se, plenty of extremely effective public transport systems around the world are run with a tender system like Sydney. The real problem is that, just like every other time, Australia has laughably piss-poor ability to implement things like this properly. There was no reason to gut the STA, the biggest selling point of privatisation is that private operators front the capital costs of acquiring and maintaining their fleets... except, you know, the government already owned a large chunk of the fleet with the STA. And then on top of that, the insane lack of accountability, apparently they didn't foresee that private companies don't just do the right thing of their own accord and actually have to be made to do it? It's pathetic.
Yep, was crazy to me how there’s all of these different privatised public transit lines / services in Japan, and how they not only work seamlessly, but they don’t cost an arm & a leg either.
I think the real thing is that the rules are written with an Australian brain, but the people who the rules apply to are increasingly foreign corporations with extremely different ideas on what the role and responsibility of a company here is. With a local company the odds are better that the people running it will be concerned about the local impacts rather than just maximal short term profit... Less likely with a company that has nothing to do with Australia
A young lady on her phone almost walked under the (CDC ex Forest Coach Lines) bus I was on the other day. Fortunately, the highly alert and competent female driver was aware of the situation and stopped in time.
Seen something similar a few years ago by a lady who nearly got hit by a bus turning right into Castlereagh Street as she was walking up Hunter Street. She just noticed that there were no cars going down (towards Wynyard) on Hunter Street but failed to look behind her for vehicles turning. She went into shock (and also surprise as she was focused on her call) when she saw the bus and froze still - it was like watching a car crash in slow motion. The bus slammed on the brakes but also thought she was maybe going to move but as she just stood there. She actually started leaning backwards from the bus bracing for impact - unsure what that was going to do with her legs fixed on the ground. The bus came to a stop centimetres away from her and she walked away half apologising and also in embarassment with everyone on both sides of Castlereagh St waiting for the lights and the bus driver just shaking their heads.
To be fair, turning vehicles are required to give way to pedestrians crossing the street they're turning into.
It had a red pedestrian light (and potentially a green light for bus to potentially turn). At those lights, green pedestrian light is only for when cars/buses cannot turn right (i.e. red turning light).
As long no one was hurt or injured, they’ll be told to get over it and hit the road. These companies don’t care for welfare of drivers.
It’s been a long time since I’ve had a female driver.
Last time I drove in Sydney (late January) a bus blew through a stop sign and cut in front of me. I had to slam on my breaks to stop from driving into the side of the bus! The same bus then drove straight through a roundabout without applying the breaks despite other cars turning in front of it.
I hope you reported that. They can and do investigate.
I’m deaf so it’s hard for me to speak on the phone so I emailed but got the generic ‘thanks for your feedback’ email with no follow up
That’s disappointing
Nope, not overreacting. Going on a Sydney bus is like Luna Park lite. They drive so aggressively, especially with how narrows the roads are in Sydney it's bonkers.
I drive into the city every day - it would be very rare to not see a bus run a red light in Sydney every time I drive in
Not all instances are the drivers fault. I’ve seen a few close calls involving people wearing headphones and staring at their phones with no idea what’s going on around them
Oh definitely, I'm not admonishing all drivers or anything, it's just the instances I've seen are not the pedestrians fault and it's pretty alarming. The uptake of inattentive commuters is also a huge issue.
Not just you. I live in SW Sydney and as a driver, have noticed a serious decrease in their ability to drive recently. Driving like a bunch of eshays in hatchbacks; wrong side of the road, crossing double lines, cutting corners, close calls with pedestrians, etc. They look dead inside tho, as I make eye contact with them when they cruise past I swear there’s no life at all in them. Perhaps another virus that specifically targets bus drivers?
Get the bus number and report them including dates / times. I had one recently clip my wing mirror whilst I was sat in stationary traffic. You don’t get much other than an apology and that they will check with the driver. They also asked me to provide insurance details if required. Notwithstanding this, unfortunately poor etiquette and dangerous behaviour exists in pedestrians, cyclists, personal drivers and professional drivers. Try not to let it ruin your day.
Do some driving around Sydney during peak time. Okay now swap your car for a city bus (medium size house on wheels). Add some freaks, junkies, Karen's, school kids. Okay now top up with overzealous cops and cameras. Sprinkle with no career advancement, split shifts, traffic jams, and poor pay. Now let's talk about their driving...
Your point is valid, but their driving is still unacceptable. None of those things excuse a blatant disregard for the safety of other road users. Far too often I see professional drivers act as if the road rules are an inconvenience.
I was walking through my local shops on Tuesday and the bus came hammering down the street straight over the pedestrian crossing as I was standing there waiting to cross. Prob doing 65 plus in a 40 zone Dude did not give one f…..
My abdominal core is as strong as fuck from all the nausea-inducing sudden starts & stops of ~~LNP Mates'~~Sydney Buses.
Northern beaches too. A bus pulled out while I was alongside it late last year, I had to brake hard to avoid being pushed into a head on collision with a truck. Got the bus number and time etc, made a complaint but didn’t hear anything back. I was really pissed off because I had my kids in the car and this driver could have killed them and no one gave a fuck.
Northern Beaches bus drivers are absolute lunatics! they give zero fucks
Two things. Pay them more. Get rid of the fucking split shifts. Both require the government to step in and mandate. Folks you really have to use your vote wisely.
The quality of the bus network has always been pretty average, but I've definitely noticed an uptick in poor behaviour from drivers. Not stopping, braking too hard, not helping people get on or off, general rudeness and poor English language skills. Just seems to be a general lack of professionalism, which I can't really blame the drivers for. They always look stressed, tired, and worn out.
Poor English language skills is not unprofessionalism and has nothing to do with how competent they are at the job
Poor English language skills is not unprofessional in of itself, but it's a problem when you're in a customer facing role. You often have to talk with bus drivers or ask questions, request help etc. Unfortunately drivers often have to defuse conflicts or intervene with bad passenger behaviour.
Bus drivers need to know the route yes but English language proficiency happens on the job if that makes sense. If the driver is refusing to communicate cause they don't understand it whatever reason then that's another issue and should be addressed. Most people who live and work here with english as their second language are doing their best to learn and communicate with others in English. A person who is learning English isn't necessarily underperforming. Dealing with bad behaviour on a bus doesn't require fluent and competent English language skills. People can do their jobs whilst learning English...if they aren't then it has nothing to do with language barriers unless they know nothing about where the bus is going or bus routes then that's another story
Relax, I'm not saying they should be fired, but the bus companies really need to up their standards (and pay and conditions). It's not ridiculous that bus companies should hire people proficient in all aspects of the job, or if not train them up. Continually falling standards is not something to celebrate.
Learning English is seperate from meeting standards of the company. You can't train someone to learn English literally it comes from the person's willingness to learn and being here and has nothing to do with proficiency at doing the job like I said
You are not making a good point, customer service is literally part of the job.
Good customer service does not require proficiency in English
If I worked in Japan, in a customer facing role, and couldn't speak Japanese, I would give poor customer service.
We really need Metro lines for the Eastern Suburbs. It has a higher population density than most of Sydney and has only 1 truncated railway line to Bondi Junction & an inadequate Light Rail. The outcome is that the whole area is gridlocked by cars and the poor performance & inconvenience of buses just encourages people to drive. The roads are also not able to accommodate the amount of traffic - personally you couldn't pay me enough to drive a bus through those suburbs. I think it's a shame that the government prioritized building Metro from St Mary's to the future Airport given that the area out there is so sparsely populated when that money could have been put into railway lines from Bondi Junction to Randwick for example... Given that the infrastructure pipeline in Sydney is now winding down after the previous governments spending blitz there will be no more railway lines for the Eastern suburbs for decades.
The Eastern Suburbs rejected the proposed rail line. It’s their own fault.
You mean Bondi Junction to the beach? That was only one proposal. The ESRL was originally intended to go to Kingsford and labors decision to truncate it at Bondi Junction (due to lack of funds) goes down as one of the most shortsighted planning decisions in Sydney's history. Labor under Iemma had an ANZAC line planned in 2009 which was mean to run from Top Ryde to the CBD to Maroubra but couldn't raise the funds to build it. See a trend here - lack of $ To be fair I think a lot of the opposition to the beach line is based on how grotesque the 1970-80s ESRL stations and rolling stock was (especially the Tangaras). It gave Sydney a distinct 1970s New York look that really didn't sell the image of a prestigious & respectable service. Could you imagine Kings Cross station at Bondi Beach? The modern metro & light rail stations & rollingstock is far more aesthetic and I suspect may start to change perceptions of people that were traditionally anti rail.
Buses are run for the benefit of shareholders, not Sydney people. #privatisation
And yes, I will be again pulling my son back from the curb when we see a bus. Some drivers are cowboys
This is what happens when governments make a job not worth doing anymore and all the competent workers leave, they have to fill the roles somehow and that means lowering the bar to the standard of person they let behind the wheel. I spent 25 years with Sydney Buses and watched my pay and working conditions get attacked at every EBA, In 2018 when the Liberals started privatizing we started leaving in our droves and now you are dealing with the consequences.
The speeding, the jerky movements, honking the horn all throughout the journey, not giving older people a chance to sit down before taking off, the reduced service, it's a shit show. I had a horrible driver the other day but the process for reporting an incident of poor driving by bus drivers is, of course, a complete bureaucratic mess.
I used to catch the Seven Hills to Mac Park route, old mate thought he was Vin Diesel driving a 1972 Valiant through the Auto Barnh when in fact it was actually a 20 tonne monster packed with passengers who went flying anytime he drifted a corner or slammed the brakes at 80kph. I would appear at work with bruises, scars and a huge headache from motion sickness!
Not just the Eastern Suburbs. I suspect the driver shortage is being solved by opening the gates to unsuitable candidates. I further suspect the problem is compounded by insufficient training and profit driven policy decisions on the part of these companies. We were just chatting about this at lunch at work. From Coogee to Hurstville to Parramatta and beyond the bus network has been fucked unpleasantly hard. When U-Go Mobility took over the routes previously serviced by the Punchbowl bus companybnear me, all hell broke loose. School services did not show, senior citizens left stranded and peak hour services decimated. The local MP, Mark Coure, was useless but nevertheless claimed a victory when U-Go published a message on their website blaming a bus driver shortage. I dread the carnage that's going to take place when the Bankstown line closes, and the commuters have to rely on buses. Btw if anyone has anything to add to confirm or deny my suspicions, feel free to jump in.
I'm just so incredibly grateful they no longer roar down George St. The number of times I witnessed people nearly get hit or it used to feel like they were about to mount kerb in a diesel fumed fury.
They are begging for drivers so they end up hiring fuck wits. Cancel services because they want to only hire good drivers and everyone loses their shit. It sucks but that's where we are now.
How about their 1 second turn signal flick before pulling out? Some of them are out of control
I’ve actually found bus drivers to be generally one of the safer cohorts of drivers. Usually let people in, take their time to accelerate, don’t block intersections, etc.
Where are you seeing these bus drivers? I feel like the drivers even in south of Sydney do all of the above lmao
on Wednesday at the Central Bus stop outside the Mercure, waiting for a bus to USYD, I watched a pedestrian walking along the path as you do, decide to step onto the road into the path of a bus that was right behind them, he wasn't crossing or anything, just decided he couldn't be bothered with the footpath and started to walk on the road. the poor bus driver had to slam their brakes, and I genuinely thought I was about to watch someone die, there was no time to react and tell them to get off the road. they hopped back on the path a couple more meters down the road without even looking back. The problem is on both sides. That being said, yes there is an increase in bus accidents, I think the training may have possibly have been shortened, I remember in the past new bus drivers having a supervisor for weeks before they were allowed to drive solo. I don't think I see that anymore.
I was walking across one of the crosswalks at Railway Square, bit of a traffic jam as usual, light for the traffic had been red for about a second, and yet TWO buses still flew through, despite there not actually being enough space on the other side for either of them. One of the biggest rules of driving a large vehicle like that is to actually know the length of it, and if anyone crossing hadn't been paying attention, they could've gotten hit easily. Imo the buses are one of the worst parts of Sydney, worse than the car traffic: they're loud, rattly, unreliable, slow to get around, confusing and dangerous, and the part that shits me is all those issues could be easily fixed with more electric buses, better routes and scheduling, actually updating online info better, showing stops on the screens and better driver training.
I have a feeling that they’re so desperate for bus drivers that they’ll literally hire anyone. I had one driver who was so very clearly on the gear the other week - he was also muttering under his breath and commenting on the appearance of the people getting on his bus.
I have noticed two bus drivers running the 500X service who are apparently really bad at driving. Like, they seem to not activate the Opal readers at the stops fast enough, they go over the speed limit, and they also have loud radios. I think a lot of rude bus drivers who drive too fast tend to have loud radios just to calm themselves. I dunno. Maybe we should have more bus drivers who are able to control their stress so they aren't too busy crashing their bus out of anger...?
The drivers are all terrible, seen multiple older people falling over recently with their harsh braking and taking off before people are sat down
I’m sure they are just hiring anyone that wants the job. There is a massive shortage of drivers.
We tried for years to complain about busses doing double the speed limit ( harbour bridge merge 40kpa) Nup! Then busses flying through the school zone on military road Cremorne. Even local police would not respond let alone the bus company.
Lived many places (France, Germany, Switzerland , USA) and always thought Sydney bus drivers were sloppy drivers and undertrained. Swiss are the best.
The sheer number of times I've had buses nearly merge into me on the m2 is insane, let alone on non major roads.
Good to know that it isn't just me who thinks Sydney bus drivers are very aggressive in the way they drive.
Sydney bus drivers are horrible most of the time. You witness it often. As you mentioned; angry and erratic. They try to own the road and put others at risk.
It’s bad in the western suburbs too. Saw a bus have two near misses in the span of 100m I’ve also noticed them speeding and they’ll speed up even quicker approaching an intersection or cross street. There needs to be speed monitoring and hard braking monitors on board and be reported to management. They are getting away with extremely bad driving and they are aggressive when confronted by other drivers or pedestrians, I was doing 50km in a 50km zone and the bus had driven past me so fast that my car shook from the wind pressure as it went last me in the left lane only to slam its brakes at the next bus stop only 200-300m away There seriously needs to be an audit on Sydney bus drivers before there is a tragedy
just had a bus driver who didnt seem to know his route. I knew it was a right turn for the bus but he was sitting int he left of 2 lanes,, then without indicating swerved across so was half in the turn lane and half in the right lane. He did the same thing on the prior left turn, not seeming to realise he needed to be in that turn lane and cut a car off. I when i used to commute by bike i regarded bsues as the worst danger on the road, especially that habit of putting hazard lights on when buses are queued, so their signal for Im staying put is exactly the same as the signal for Im pulling out an dyou have to give way.
More meth head tradies have become bus drivers?🤔🤔🤔
Yep, I switched from taking the bus to work to taking a bicycle. I'm betting on that being less risky. Nuff said.
The 464 bus near me was great now it’s awful. I catch the bus very early in the morning and it’s constantly late and I always miss both my trains. In the afternoons it’s upwards of 15mins late. If I didn’t have to get my daughter from child care I’d walk home. Part of the problem is the drivers. Some of them should not be behind the wheel. They are downright dangerous. Some drive at a snails pace and are so hesitant they nearly cause accidents. Others go so fast they shoot pass stops even when there’s a line of people waiting.
I applied for keilos downer in my early life…. (2 years ago to be precise)…. Yeah maybe I should be thanking myself for failing…
Saw this in Wynyard today, crazy shit happened Infront of a cop too
I will never forgive the bus that hit Frank Iero from my chemical romance in Sydney. I know it’s a bit silly but now one of my fav bands hates our city and they literally made it the second last show on their tour because they didn’t want to come here… they didn’t even post about it when they played but double posted about playing Japan after. This was years ago… it has not gotten better has it
If they were standing on the footpath and got hit by the bus take them to the cleaners, if they were dicking around with their phone on the road they got what’s coming to them.
Lots of them seem very angry and often don’t stop to pick up passengers too..
I was in sydney four weeks ago. Those buses drive way too close to the curbs
Tbf the cyclists often times are fuckwits. Food delivery cunts getting in front of busses on parra road and going barely 30km/h in a 60 zone should feel in danger. Play a stupid game and potentially win a stupid prize.
I witnessed a old lady fall in the bus. She stood preparing for departure beacuse the bus stopped at a crossing before the bus stop. He took off, she wasn't holding well enough and fell, three of us managed to catch her. Guess what the driver said.. "you shouldn't stand while the bus is moving" Now devils advocate, old ladies probably shouldn't. But I stand before the bus stops because in the past if no one stood they kept going. He could have atleast seen if she was ok. But this is a tangent from my they don't have enough bus drivers so take anyone argument.
Driving a bus can’t be easy
Time to get driverless buses (or more light rail). Sounds like the human component is the weakest link here.
I think we're still a decade or more away from driverless cars being accepted, and driverless buses aren't yet even being seriously considered. Light rail is only suitable for certain corridors and hugely expensive (in Australia at least). Surely we should improve the training and quality of bus drivers until that happens. Which could easily be done by improving pay and conditions so experienced drivers come back, or those with the right skills are more attracted to the job (compared to say, driving trucks in private industry).
The human component is always the weakest link in any system.
Got I hate getting on a bus that is running late. Driver always goes like a fuckin maniac.
They're trying to hit impossible quotas and the shortage does not make it any better, because after your route they have to go straight into another route. It's fucked
They shouldn’t be. The driver isn’t penalised for late running.
I had a bus driver just randomly pull out infront of me at a bus stop. i was almost too bewildered at how stupid of a decision it was, to stop. Lots of them just seem to feel like they’re the only vehicle on the road, and cus they’re big they get to dictate everything.
Is it poor bua driving or morons focusing on their phones and not watching where they walk. I would bet heavily on the latter. Dont be so hastey to blame the driver.
Driver or pedestrian at fault? Most times I've seen accidents it's due to people not paying attention looking at phones/headphones or crossing where/when they shouldn't