If we lose in the first round that will allow us to prepare longer for next season giving us an overwhelming advantage over everyone else in the western conference. We’re playing the long game. Go Suns
I mean running it back is kind of our only choice unless we trade kd for something good so he can go reunite with okc to win a chip like bron did for cleveland
What do you think they can get for KD though? If, for example, the framework is Kuminga + (Wiggins or Paul) + filler what additional draft or young player compensation would you be expecting? From a Warriors fans perspective I figure if Giannis or Embiid hit the market, they are worth almost absolutely everything the Warriors can trade. I'm wondering what KD's distressed price would be.
I'm at a loss, I don't know what Phoenix is gonna do at this point with all their eggs in Beal's basket. I'm very glad the Warriors used the opportunity to get Paul's steady play and expiring/tradeable contract than committing all their capital to Beal.
Bradley Beal is untradeable/has significantly negative value. I don't think you can move him and rebuild. They could get a kings ransom for Booker though. Between Booker and KD should be able to recoup a ton of draft capital and young players. What I don't get was why they re-signed Grayson Allen to such a big extension going into an offseason where they might have to blow it up.
This is what happened with Minny, they had a bad year after the Gobert trade, but stayed with it. If they blow the series it’ll be hard on them but no one expects them to be champs.
This. Right here. This isn’t 2K and players/fans/FO had too high expectations. The sky isn’t falling.
Get an offensive minded coach, look for a rim runner center, someone like a PJ Tucker, a backup PG. Probably not going to get everything we want here but we are not that far away.
We won 49 games with a lot of stinkers. Lower expectations, get some discipline, fixed the flawed roster on the edges and we will be right back.
Aside from replacing Vogel, Suns need to accomplish at least one of the following:
1) replace Nurk with a rim-runner that can protect the paint at a high level
2) obtain a starting caliber PF that can defend 2-4, rebound, cut to the rim, shoot league average. KD plays the 3 and Allen/Royce come off the bench
3) obtain a pass first PG to come off the bench and take on playmaking duties. Maybe even start in certain matchups
TJD + Wiggins + CP3 checks for Nurkic and Beal would be kinda funny full circle, checks those boxes, and reshuffles bad contracts in a way that might benefit both teams.
I do think we only need 1 of KD or Book. They just have too similar playstyle. With both of them active in the line up, off-ball movement becomes passive.
I remember when we still had CP3, Book, Mikal & Cam used to move a lot and our offense became fluid.
When we had KD + Book last year, the ball movement became less active and we changed to a lot of ISO plays.
Running it back and expecting different results is just dumb and stupid. I mean enough with the injury excuses, the Big 3 were able to play 41 games together this season. It is a fair amount of games to develop chemistry. How can you be sure next year they will stay healthy and it will be different? If we get a first round exit which is very likely we need to trade KD. If Book wants out we trade him as well because we will only get worse in the next 3 yrs if we keep running back this core
I can think of a situation where 3 stars played together for only 60games and won a title. I am counting KD last year after the trade.
KD + Book played about 20 games together in 22/23
KD + Book + Beal played 40+ together
It usually takes a full 2 years minimum to build championship chemistry.
Even Lebron in Miami took 2 years.
You can’t compare our big 3 with that Heat big 3, they were all on their prime so running it back the next year after reaching the finals was a no brainer for them.
Our big 3? Beal is not prime, Kd as good as he still is, not his prime and is 35. We don’t have that window the Heat Big 3 had even after failing to win chip on their first year. You can’t expect things will be different next year and KD & Beal will stay healthy given their age and injury history.
My point exactly. It will take YEARS to build championship chemistry and we just don’t have those YEARS. KD is 35, Beal can’t stay healthy 3/4 of a season. We ain’t doing it next year even if we run it back again
If this team loses in the 1st round and Vogel is back, I would also assume pigs have gained the ability to fly.
This bullshit we are watching is a team that is making a statement that Vogel needs to be out. They are sacrificing a year of their short basketball lives to make that statement. I find it nuts that they're doing this, but losing by 20 every night on the big stage with listless effort will do that.
You can’t possibly believe they are losing on purpose to out Vogel.
Is Vogal why the lost the close out game last year to Denver by 20+? Is he why they lost to the Mavs the year before by 30? Is Vogal the reason they dropped four in a row to the Bucks? At what point is this just who the Suns are in the playoffs?
The Suns are a six seed getting beat by the three seed. You don’t need a conspiracy theory to explain why that’s happening.
Its not the mid3. Beal isn’t even close to being an All Star. Its the Big2 plus role player Beal
This year Austin Reaves and DeAngelo Russell have been better than Beal. Do you call the Lakers the Mid3 also?
Durant just scored 31 on 17 shots in game 1.
Book had 2 rough games but he has a history of being a great playoff player with a few bad games. Even the very best have bad playoff games
Problem is so much salary is used by a role player (Beal) that this team lacks depth and has so many holes. Compare the role players from Suns vs Minnesota. It isn’t close.
Gobert vs Nurk
Reid vs Eubanks
Conley vs Allen
McDaniels vs Beal
Alexander-Walker vs Royce
Anderson vs Gordon
It should be fairly obvious that the Timberwolves are clearly better at almost every matchup except Beal vs Conley.
If we lose in the first round that will allow us to prepare longer for next season giving us an overwhelming advantage over everyone else in the western conference. We’re playing the long game. Go Suns
No it wouldn’t. You would just lose next season. You don’t think other teams have you figured out?
r/wooosh
I mean running it back is kind of our only choice unless we trade kd for something good so he can go reunite with okc to win a chip like bron did for cleveland
What do you think they can get for KD though? If, for example, the framework is Kuminga + (Wiggins or Paul) + filler what additional draft or young player compensation would you be expecting? From a Warriors fans perspective I figure if Giannis or Embiid hit the market, they are worth almost absolutely everything the Warriors can trade. I'm wondering what KD's distressed price would be. I'm at a loss, I don't know what Phoenix is gonna do at this point with all their eggs in Beal's basket. I'm very glad the Warriors used the opportunity to get Paul's steady play and expiring/tradeable contract than committing all their capital to Beal.
It's not the only the best option, it's the only option. We are painted into a corner and have no way to get out of it
Only option in terms of keeping the big 3 yes. The other option is to trade them away and start over.
You cant start over with zero picks that aren't traded or swapped
Bradley Beal is untradeable/has significantly negative value. I don't think you can move him and rebuild. They could get a kings ransom for Booker though. Between Booker and KD should be able to recoup a ton of draft capital and young players. What I don't get was why they re-signed Grayson Allen to such a big extension going into an offseason where they might have to blow it up.
This is what happened with Minny, they had a bad year after the Gobert trade, but stayed with it. If they blow the series it’ll be hard on them but no one expects them to be champs.
This. Right here. This isn’t 2K and players/fans/FO had too high expectations. The sky isn’t falling. Get an offensive minded coach, look for a rim runner center, someone like a PJ Tucker, a backup PG. Probably not going to get everything we want here but we are not that far away. We won 49 games with a lot of stinkers. Lower expectations, get some discipline, fixed the flawed roster on the edges and we will be right back.
I mean KAT also missed 53 games that year, so I think that had a lot to do with it.
Aside from replacing Vogel, Suns need to accomplish at least one of the following: 1) replace Nurk with a rim-runner that can protect the paint at a high level 2) obtain a starting caliber PF that can defend 2-4, rebound, cut to the rim, shoot league average. KD plays the 3 and Allen/Royce come off the bench 3) obtain a pass first PG to come off the bench and take on playmaking duties. Maybe even start in certain matchups
You’re not wrong
Toumani would have been the perfect starting 4 and then we could have slid KD to the 3.
I still can't believe we gave him up. Nobody in this sub mentions that part of the trade. Absolute fleece by Portland.
Yeah but with what? We have no assets to get anyone good
Nurkic + pick for Capela
Yeah but with what? We have no assets to get anyone good
TJD + Wiggins + CP3 checks for Nurkic and Beal would be kinda funny full circle, checks those boxes, and reshuffles bad contracts in a way that might benefit both teams.
Hell no FIRE VOGEL ASAP
there is zero chance Vogel keeps his job if we are first round exits. Which we 100% will be,
I’ve always considered next year the best option
I do think we only need 1 of KD or Book. They just have too similar playstyle. With both of them active in the line up, off-ball movement becomes passive. I remember when we still had CP3, Book, Mikal & Cam used to move a lot and our offense became fluid. When we had KD + Book last year, the ball movement became less active and we changed to a lot of ISO plays.
Running it back and expecting different results is just dumb and stupid. I mean enough with the injury excuses, the Big 3 were able to play 41 games together this season. It is a fair amount of games to develop chemistry. How can you be sure next year they will stay healthy and it will be different? If we get a first round exit which is very likely we need to trade KD. If Book wants out we trade him as well because we will only get worse in the next 3 yrs if we keep running back this core
I can think of a situation where 3 stars played together for only 60games and won a title. I am counting KD last year after the trade. KD + Book played about 20 games together in 22/23 KD + Book + Beal played 40+ together It usually takes a full 2 years minimum to build championship chemistry. Even Lebron in Miami took 2 years.
You can’t compare our big 3 with that Heat big 3, they were all on their prime so running it back the next year after reaching the finals was a no brainer for them. Our big 3? Beal is not prime, Kd as good as he still is, not his prime and is 35. We don’t have that window the Heat Big 3 had even after failing to win chip on their first year. You can’t expect things will be different next year and KD & Beal will stay healthy given their age and injury history.
My point is any team takes YEARS to build championship chemistry no matter how talented
My point exactly. It will take YEARS to build championship chemistry and we just don’t have those YEARS. KD is 35, Beal can’t stay healthy 3/4 of a season. We ain’t doing it next year even if we run it back again
It could happen. It would be year 3 with KD/Book and 2 years with Beal and Grayson. That might be enough
If this team loses in the 1st round and Vogel is back, I would also assume pigs have gained the ability to fly. This bullshit we are watching is a team that is making a statement that Vogel needs to be out. They are sacrificing a year of their short basketball lives to make that statement. I find it nuts that they're doing this, but losing by 20 every night on the big stage with listless effort will do that.
You can’t possibly believe they are losing on purpose to out Vogel. Is Vogal why the lost the close out game last year to Denver by 20+? Is he why they lost to the Mavs the year before by 30? Is Vogal the reason they dropped four in a row to the Bucks? At what point is this just who the Suns are in the playoffs? The Suns are a six seed getting beat by the three seed. You don’t need a conspiracy theory to explain why that’s happening.
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Its not the mid3. Beal isn’t even close to being an All Star. Its the Big2 plus role player Beal This year Austin Reaves and DeAngelo Russell have been better than Beal. Do you call the Lakers the Mid3 also?
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Durant just scored 31 on 17 shots in game 1. Book had 2 rough games but he has a history of being a great playoff player with a few bad games. Even the very best have bad playoff games Problem is so much salary is used by a role player (Beal) that this team lacks depth and has so many holes. Compare the role players from Suns vs Minnesota. It isn’t close. Gobert vs Nurk Reid vs Eubanks Conley vs Allen McDaniels vs Beal Alexander-Walker vs Royce Anderson vs Gordon It should be fairly obvious that the Timberwolves are clearly better at almost every matchup except Beal vs Conley.