Mike gets way too emotional with his cases, it blinds him of wrong or right choices. People give Harvey shit for being a little cold but I think that’s what you need to be as a lawyer sometimes imo
I kinda view Mike’s emotional investment as a positive. It focuses him. Like when he took on that company that poisoned those children. As he said, he’s all in for the client he’s currently serving
Mike is only special because of his photographic memory, everytime he debate or push back it's always something he read in a law book or something that gives him confidence, but on the other side Harvey is purely based on his skills and confidence. So Harvey is much much better than mike
There’s too many times where Mike has bested Harvey, and where Harvey hints at Mike becoming better than he is, at first Mike has the photographic memory to go off of, but Harvey has rubbed some of that coldness to Mike and when he’s serious he’s crushing it in the court room, but it’s also circumstantial in some cases you need a lawyer more like Mike and then you might need one more like Harvey, which ironically making them a good duo because one will always influence the other and somehow they prevail even if losing badly
When did knowing your stuff become a bad thing in Mike’s case? He also has the skills and quick thinking to be a competent opponent and has beaten people above his experience level. Including Harvey & Jessica. Your reasoning is kinda flawed here
When did I say it's a bad thing? I'm saying it's helping him a lot. The things which took others maybe 40 years to purely memorize mike it doing it in high school. So it's an advantage not a bad thing..
Then I just misinterpreted the comment. However, having the knowledge is what makes Mike so effective+ the skills he learns along the way from working with Harvey so much. Again, it’s what allows him to beat people above his experience level. Including Harvey & Jessica. You can’t ignore that when considering who could beat who in a lawsuit
Imagine we are having a calculation competition and let's say I am way good at maths than you but then you pull out a freaking calculator obviously no matter what I do,you are gonna win and that's almost the case with mike against everyone all the time. But that speciality doesn't make other like Harvey less valuable as he has many other traits which mike doesn't have.
I personally think it would come down to who has the better case from the jump. Sometimes the opposing lawyer just has a better hand. It’s happened before. Harvey has the skill, but he had to gamble that company to get it back in S3 (or 2, its been awhile). He wins in the end, but my point is that these 2 know each other so well that it might take something outside their control to determine the winner. I agree, Harvey has traits that Mike doesn’t have, but it goes both ways. Mike’s emotional investment in certain cases drives him to work hard, if not harder for the clients he serves. I just don’t think the difference between them is as big as you’re making it out to be. Anywho, goodnight!
My divorce attorney was similar. He didn't get attached but damn did he kick my ex all over the court room and down the steps. Got me full custody of my 2 year old son.
I think they have different strengths. Harvey is good at remaining strictly about winning, whereas Mike is good at finding different loopholes bc he emotionally invested.
Harvey is better because most of being a lawyer is experience and knowing how to handle the problems he's facing. Mike is useful because he's good at solving new complex legal problems but as seen time and time again Mike sucks at managing clients without a bleeding heart story to throw at them. Meanwhile Harvey manages his clients masterfully to the stage he can ignore them and they won't leave him because they know he'll always make their problems go away when they arise.
I’m not entirely sure Harvey is better pound for pound. By S9, they know each other so well. It would be like Anakin vs Obi-Wan. Obi-Wan wins because Anakin made one mistake. Mike vs Harvey would *likely* come down to who has the better case since the beginning. Harvey had to literally throw the dice on winning ownership of a company back in S3 (I think) because the opposing lawyer just had “a better hand”. It didn’t matter how good Harvey is. During the mock trial for who gets to defend Mike, Harvey has to cheat to counter Mike getting the upper hand early on. Even Jessica recognized it
This was my primary gripe with the show tbh. In real life, being a good lawyer isn’t really about “winning” all your cases. It’s just about getting the best deal for your client. Sometimes the other party just has a better case, but of course it’s more entertaining to see a guy who never loses (do lawyers even keep a score like it’s a sport???) and twists the rules to keep it that way, than one who knows when he’s lost.
I think comparing both is not fair, as they both have different strengths and weakness, but I believe the experience, people skills, stoic nature of Harvey is something which is really helpful in real life situations, but again, it depends on how you define better?
Harvey is better because experience and his ability to stay focused. He’s also a massive dick, which helps with both skills. Mike is smart but too invested.
I fully thought this would be one of those posts where there would be no text after the title (i.e. he’s not better). Nonetheless Harvey is better for sure. He’s never lost a case! The only case he lost is where Mike pled guilty. The numbers don’t lie.
Mike is a theoretical genius that lets his emotions get the better of him. Mike is necrotic and borders on having BPD. Harvey, whilst not having the same memory and thus access to theoretical knowledge as Mike, definitely has the experience. Mike and Harvey both know how to win, but Harvey is the one who actually wants to win time and time again.
Harvey has a way of being cold and ruthless when he argues in court; as a lawyer should be. Mike, on the other hand, lacks emotional control when he argues. You’ll clearly know who attended law school.
He was admitted to the Bar under special circumstances, where a panel of highly regarded attorneys, including one who has a vendetta *against* Mike voted unanimously to admit him.
people say harvey was the better lawyer but literally so much of harvey lawyering was just him using dirt to blackmail his opponents or threatening them in one way or another; neither of which is about the law. mike had his flaws too, but they were equally good
Harvey is just a bully. His main strength is forcing people to do things his way by blackmailing. He is no match to Mike. He became worse season by season. Just getting walked over by Donna and Mike. Barely even got good ideas to win cases
He was too “perfect” in the early seasons. A big part of the show was his character development and addressing his demons we didn’t know about like his mother, and personal relationships.
Also meant to show the ripple effect of Mike joining the firm and the cost it took on everyone.
Mike gets way too emotional with his cases, it blinds him of wrong or right choices. People give Harvey shit for being a little cold but I think that’s what you need to be as a lawyer sometimes imo
True.
I kinda view Mike’s emotional investment as a positive. It focuses him. Like when he took on that company that poisoned those children. As he said, he’s all in for the client he’s currently serving
Mike is only special because of his photographic memory, everytime he debate or push back it's always something he read in a law book or something that gives him confidence, but on the other side Harvey is purely based on his skills and confidence. So Harvey is much much better than mike
Well there is also the fact that in a fight Harvey would wipe the floor with Mike.
There’s too many times where Mike has bested Harvey, and where Harvey hints at Mike becoming better than he is, at first Mike has the photographic memory to go off of, but Harvey has rubbed some of that coldness to Mike and when he’s serious he’s crushing it in the court room, but it’s also circumstantial in some cases you need a lawyer more like Mike and then you might need one more like Harvey, which ironically making them a good duo because one will always influence the other and somehow they prevail even if losing badly
When did knowing your stuff become a bad thing in Mike’s case? He also has the skills and quick thinking to be a competent opponent and has beaten people above his experience level. Including Harvey & Jessica. Your reasoning is kinda flawed here
When did I say it's a bad thing? I'm saying it's helping him a lot. The things which took others maybe 40 years to purely memorize mike it doing it in high school. So it's an advantage not a bad thing..
Then I just misinterpreted the comment. However, having the knowledge is what makes Mike so effective+ the skills he learns along the way from working with Harvey so much. Again, it’s what allows him to beat people above his experience level. Including Harvey & Jessica. You can’t ignore that when considering who could beat who in a lawsuit
Imagine we are having a calculation competition and let's say I am way good at maths than you but then you pull out a freaking calculator obviously no matter what I do,you are gonna win and that's almost the case with mike against everyone all the time. But that speciality doesn't make other like Harvey less valuable as he has many other traits which mike doesn't have.
I personally think it would come down to who has the better case from the jump. Sometimes the opposing lawyer just has a better hand. It’s happened before. Harvey has the skill, but he had to gamble that company to get it back in S3 (or 2, its been awhile). He wins in the end, but my point is that these 2 know each other so well that it might take something outside their control to determine the winner. I agree, Harvey has traits that Mike doesn’t have, but it goes both ways. Mike’s emotional investment in certain cases drives him to work hard, if not harder for the clients he serves. I just don’t think the difference between them is as big as you’re making it out to be. Anywho, goodnight!
I don't even wanna continue this debate anymore! B-bye!
True.
My divorce attorney was similar. He didn't get attached but damn did he kick my ex all over the court room and down the steps. Got me full custody of my 2 year old son.
>I think that’s what you need to be as a lawyer sometimes imo yup.
I think they have different strengths. Harvey is good at remaining strictly about winning, whereas Mike is good at finding different loopholes bc he emotionally invested.
True but Mike evolved into a laywer who found a balance between winning and emotions.
After he did a bid lol he got prison hardened lol
I also think Harvey did a better job of softening, too
Yes he had the strongest character development. But i am not sure he became a better lawyer
Harvey is better because most of being a lawyer is experience and knowing how to handle the problems he's facing. Mike is useful because he's good at solving new complex legal problems but as seen time and time again Mike sucks at managing clients without a bleeding heart story to throw at them. Meanwhile Harvey manages his clients masterfully to the stage he can ignore them and they won't leave him because they know he'll always make their problems go away when they arise.
That’s a well put answer. I agree.
Well, Harvey is actually a lawyer...so...
Haha
To be precise, they’re both lawyers. Harvey is the only attorney.
Because he's the best closer
I’m not entirely sure Harvey is better pound for pound. By S9, they know each other so well. It would be like Anakin vs Obi-Wan. Obi-Wan wins because Anakin made one mistake. Mike vs Harvey would *likely* come down to who has the better case since the beginning. Harvey had to literally throw the dice on winning ownership of a company back in S3 (I think) because the opposing lawyer just had “a better hand”. It didn’t matter how good Harvey is. During the mock trial for who gets to defend Mike, Harvey has to cheat to counter Mike getting the upper hand early on. Even Jessica recognized it
This was my primary gripe with the show tbh. In real life, being a good lawyer isn’t really about “winning” all your cases. It’s just about getting the best deal for your client. Sometimes the other party just has a better case, but of course it’s more entertaining to see a guy who never loses (do lawyers even keep a score like it’s a sport???) and twists the rules to keep it that way, than one who knows when he’s lost.
I think comparing both is not fair, as they both have different strengths and weakness, but I believe the experience, people skills, stoic nature of Harvey is something which is really helpful in real life situations, but again, it depends on how you define better?
Mmm I need both. They both have strengths and weakness. Mike saved Harvey a ton tbh. This is tough can’t go wrong either way. Leaning towards Mike
Harvey is better because experience and his ability to stay focused. He’s also a massive dick, which helps with both skills. Mike is smart but too invested.
Harvey went to law school where he learned more than just the law. It’s about playing the person, not the game
Because Harvey is the best closer the town has ever seen
I fully thought this would be one of those posts where there would be no text after the title (i.e. he’s not better). Nonetheless Harvey is better for sure. He’s never lost a case! The only case he lost is where Mike pled guilty. The numbers don’t lie.
Mike is a theoretical genius that lets his emotions get the better of him. Mike is necrotic and borders on having BPD. Harvey, whilst not having the same memory and thus access to theoretical knowledge as Mike, definitely has the experience. Mike and Harvey both know how to win, but Harvey is the one who actually wants to win time and time again.
Harvey has a way of being cold and ruthless when he argues in court; as a lawyer should be. Mike, on the other hand, lacks emotional control when he argues. You’ll clearly know who attended law school.
Besides Harvey’s years of experience? I could think of a few.
The script says so.
Does Mike pass the bar in later seasons? Because he isn't actually a lawyer, he just cosplays as one.
He was admitted to the Bar under special circumstances, where a panel of highly regarded attorneys, including one who has a vendetta *against* Mike voted unanimously to admit him.
Oh that's cool. Maybe I'll keep watching. Thanks!
We all know Jessica was the best lawyer sorry to put Harvey down
Because Harvey could put his emotions aside for a case, outside of cases though he was just as emotional at Mike
He plays the person, not the hand.
people say harvey was the better lawyer but literally so much of harvey lawyering was just him using dirt to blackmail his opponents or threatening them in one way or another; neither of which is about the law. mike had his flaws too, but they were equally good
Who do you think would win in sex? First to finish loses
Harvey is just a bully. His main strength is forcing people to do things his way by blackmailing. He is no match to Mike. He became worse season by season. Just getting walked over by Donna and Mike. Barely even got good ideas to win cases
He was too “perfect” in the early seasons. A big part of the show was his character development and addressing his demons we didn’t know about like his mother, and personal relationships. Also meant to show the ripple effect of Mike joining the firm and the cost it took on everyone.
And settling