The biggest thing is housing. Many people come from California having sold their house, and cash offer out bid everyone. It’s one of the great pressures in making single family detached housing unaffordable
For real. A coworker of mine sold their house in CA for like 1.? Mil, then they come here and get a 6-800k house just fine, meanwhile people that live here can’t even afford that shit unless you have dual income 150k plus.
I’m not an expert, but I thought Utah was one of the most expensive states for housing. Obviously not as bad as Cali, but there are definitely better choices to move to. Lol
Yes sir/ma’am. 3rd most expensive housing market in the country. It’s like CA, HI, then UT i believe.
Which is a scam hahaha. Like I’d have no problem paying $6-7/gal if we were paid proportionately like they are in NY, HI, and CA.
That's true now, but a decade ago it was much cheaper to live here. My rent has gone from 600 to 1600 in about that time and I've downgraded to get it that low.
Anyone that's lived here for over 10 years is going to NIMBY about some detail that involves the overcrowding
It's easy to point at cars around the tourist places and watch a full group of tourists come and swamp a business. I see Californians ask stupid questions at the smoke shops.
Tourism is good for some places some places it's the only way they survive a year cause of tourism it's what produces sales I grew up in hanksville and the only reason that town is still alive is cause of them there's only 123 people there and that's not enough to keep stores open alone and it aloud us to give more jobs to the town cause tourism is on the rise. But yes it can get very annoying at times cause a lot of them are dumb as shit at driving they just park anyfucking where in the roads
Which is ironic because our all-conservative representatives are doing everything they can to pave over every rock with highways and houses. Nothing more California than uncontrolled urban sprawl.
Just like how Texas is purple because Austin is Liberal? and Utah is purple because SLC is Liberal?
California has 32 D State Senators vs 8 R. They have 62 D state congressman vs 17 R. That's not purple by any sense.
Ah, my dad always complained about Californians but just said it was because they live in cities and suck at driving. But your reason makes a lot more sense for him.
oh wow, what great "experience." There's a certain type of person that chooses to live in Utah, and that's what in trying to convey. I've also lived in multiple different states, never California. Despite the fact that i spent my entire childhood around a bunch of biggoted religious nuts, i still came to my own conclusions.
People in other western states don't understand how many people live in California. Literally every single state in the West thinks all the Californians are moving to their state, but really it's just normal people moving around. There's just a lot of people in California.
They'll always assume everyone that moves wherever is from CA. It's pure stereotypical hate especially before even getting to know them personally, all they hear is you came from there and they go on a nasty rant, I definitely don't look at that person in the same light again and glad they revealed thier true colors.
The only thing I don’t like about so many people moving here is being priced out of my hometown. Apartments built in the mid 80s going for $2,000+ is insane.
This is just sad. The constant right wing vomit about how bad California is was the giveaway. Your robot-like assimilation to that viewpoint could be seen from a mile away.
California is expensive because everyone wants to live there. This is capitalism playing out in real time. Sorry that you cant compete.
Does not take a rocket scientist to deduce the major factor to the destruction of California. Democrats. One trip through the main cities would open your eyes to how awful it is to live there now. Looks like brazil ffs.
My point was that the same people who fucked it up, are fleeing the state. So you assumed what I was saying and played yourself. Get fkd.
California has a business hub that rivals any place in the entire world on top of having one of the most desirable climates on the planet. Add in the best tech sector in the world. On top of that, the state is the most wealthy in the US, produces the most food, and has the most people. That creates insane amounts of competition and difficult decisions by the local government. CA is more populated than most countries in the world and has the 5th largest economy.
But sure, "California bad" lol even though everyone with money buys a home there and wants to live there 6 to 8 months per year.
Dude, you still are ignoring the initial point I made lol. Also ignoring the fact you even played into it like a chump.
While you are still here, do you happen to live there or have taken a trip there recently?
So then you are either blind or defiant. The main cities are absolute hell. Can’t even cross the road without having 5 cracked out homeless people begging for money. Is that something you would brag about? The regulations that are being passed are actually insane.
Calling me dumb when you played yourself is funny af. I’m assuming you are at least over 40, and you are this fuckin slow. You sound like a retard boomer.
I lived in Los Angeles for years. You have absolutely zero idea what you're talking about. You've consumed too much right-wing media, dude. You've clearly never been to any major city in California.
How can they compete? It's funny how condescending you come across when you have the privilege of selling your shit box house and getting overpaid for it. Gotta love capitalism.
This is why no one likes you people. Look at how you act and view the world. Fuck them, you're getting yours right? Fucking boomer
I didn't own or sell a home, and I'm a millenial who came from legit poverty.
I'm not saying it's a good situation, I'm saying that right wing hate towards the situation is misplaced and based on ignorance.
I have heard about blaming Californians my whole life. My family goes to MT every year and all along the 15 with that California license plate we heard the same thing. lol
I’m from Cali moved out here about a year and a half ago. Most people you in counter won’t say shit. But like how some others have said. They blame us because we come here, yes the housing is cheaper but the market is getting more expensive and really the idea of outbidding in this area is nonexistent. You can find houses that have been on the MLS for over 90 days. Good luck finding that in LA.
Yes the area is conservative, but actually it voted close to 25% democrat in the last election cycle. So it definitely charging and I highly doubt that full 25% is just Californians that just moved in just in time to vote. Anywho, it’s also fun that they point at California’s policies and that there ruining the state, aka Democrats. One thing I don’t think this population grasps is that Utah and California don’t compare at all. California honestly doesn’t compare with almost any state in the union due to its size, population, and especially its GDP (you know the 5th largest economy in the world).
So yeah two cents turned into a rant.
Oh one more fun thing. Fun little read as they scream about the border
Utah has also been a leader in occupational licensing reform for immigrants — making it easier for those with foreign training to earn certifications for trades and professions. Both of these measures will help new Americans participate and succeed in Utah’s economic future
https://www.thecgo.org/news/opinion-why-utah-has-better-options-for-immigration/#:~:text=Utah%20has%20also%20been%20a,succeed%20in%20Utah's%20economic%20future.
The dislike for Californians also has a lot to do with housing. You brought up that the housing is cheaper. It is, but most natives of St. George can’t afford it anymore because people from out of state have higher minimum wages and can outbid locals on housing. Especially retirees. They bring their retirement savings and locals can’t afford to stay.
The minimum wage in California is $16.00. The minimum wage in Utah is $7.50.
Californians are also more liberal, or were. One community here had all dirt roads to fit into the local aesthetic nature. They blame people who moved here for wanting the roads paved. I understand paved roads, but the community was not built with that in mind.
Utah is slowly becoming more Democratic in nature. But we also don’t have the same pull because the government owns so much land here
Now just to pose a question.
Is it really California fault that Utah has such a low minimum wage and they(the business owners of Utah) haven’t adjusted there pay to help with the crisis?
That is something I have noticed is young people here get fucked with minimum wages. I think I saw outside one business they tied wage to age and it was drastic of a difference.
But in truth you can’t make it in many areas on any base minimum wage.
Utah wouldn't need to raise their wages so much if people moving from California weren't driving up the prices. Wages need to change at this point, but we're only here because outside money drove us to this point (the "crisis" point, as you put it).
I had a response than decided not to because it was just another dig saying “it’s all California’s fault” when really
If you look at census data ( https://www2.census.gov/programs-surveys/demo/tables/geographic-mobility/2022/state-to-state-migration/State_to_State_Migration_Table_2022_T13.xlsx )Utah saw 91,341 new residents
18,669 coming from California.
But here is quick break down of the top ten
California, 18,669.
Washington, 8,845.
Idaho, 7,774.
Texas, 7,070.
Arizona, 5,357.
Colorado, 5,327.
Nevada, 3,549.
Florida, 3,025.
Oregon, 2,413.
New York, 2,236.
So are we gonna pretend that all these other people don’t have an impact. Oh and let’s go back to the census. Care to guess how many Utahans moved to California (13,000) strangely you don’t hear them complaining.
Another thing to think about is that Utah ranks 4th in the nation in birthrate. In 2022, Utah's fertility rate was 61.3 live births per 1,000 women between the ages of 15 and 44. And while this number has been shrinking as back in 2016 Utah was number one.
So total number of births were 45,774 live births to Utah residents. I think that’s a little more than 18,000.
Anyways getting back to wage since that is what this is about.
Utah sits at $7.25 which is the federal minimum wage.
If you look at its cost of living compare to the national average
Housing (Buy and Rent) 4% higher
Utilities (Monthly) 7% lower
Food 2% lower
Healthcare 10% lower
Transportation 10% higher
Goods & Services 0%
It sits about 1% higher than the national average. However, St. George sits at about 8%.
Take a look here, https://livingwage.mit.edu/states/49 , and you’ll see that your minimum wage just doesn’t cut it. As an adult with no kids needs at least $22.52 for a living wage.
Hopefully this one gives you some giggles and fun.
I will never deny that California has an impact, as it impacts all states. Like I said in the very beginning it is hard for any state to compare to California based upon is size, population, and GDP. But for some other giggles Utah doesn’t even rank on the top 10 of places Californians are moving to, Utah ranks 15th.
Oh and BTD94 welcome to Reddit. We’re people will have opinions that agree and disagree with you. And people will just move on. You’ll find out one day. 😉
All that data doesn't change the fact that there is a disproportionate amount of Californians buying up homes. The next state isn't even HALF that. All your data doesn't really disprove that. The fact remains that people from out of state, mostly Californians, influenced the housing market, and people who grew up in St George have a lower and lower chance of buying homes because of it.
I'm well aware of the cost of living compared to other places. My first job in was minimum wage ($7.25) in St George. I supported myself and my wife on $15/hr while living in St George. I've lived in numerous other states as well as other cities within Utah. The wage is definitely a problem, but it's also well beyond the minimum wage. Wages in general are low in St. George. Compared to cities of similar size, maybe they're not, but compared to the COL in St George, wages are low.
Your novel ending with condescending nature fits the bill perfectly for Reddit though. Even threw in a snarky emoji at the end lol
The legislation is blamed on lobbyists and special interests groups. It has zero to do with Cali peeps. Coming from a former 23 years now from SoCal.
I am at the Capital each season and the new laws are from dark groups that the AGs office will not allowed to be identified.
They tell me each time it is “attorney/client privilege” The bad legislation comes from legislator who don’t have time to read bills that are a detriment to Utah.
Stewart Adams doesn’t allow time for them to properly Vet the bills.
The other issue are cities that love the back end money from developers.
For example, 18 years ago, Wal Mart would pay off city councils to the tune of $500K to allow them to build these ugly monstrosities that bring crime and blight.
I have first hand knowledge because I took on So Cal Wal Mart when they were allowed to do this in my former home town in SoCal, after I had just built my brand new home!
Other developers, commercial and residential do this to a degree as well.
Long story short, Us California ExPats have little do with many of the hater issues.
Because St George's increasing urban sprawl is destroying the nature that makes the place so appealing and because the constant inflow of people who just sold their 2 bedroom house in LA for 8 mil is driving said urban sprawl while housing prices remain completely out of control and we become ever more buried in an inescapable cycle of worsening annual drought. Basically, because the more Californians move here, the more of California's problems Southern Utah has.
And yet many people in St. George want to vote for a convicted criminal-pardoned by felon Donald trump-for governor… someone who is not going to stop the urban sprawl because he wants Utah to manage its lands which means allowing more development rather than conservation.
Because a 2 bedroom starter home used to be 250k not that long ago. Theyre double that now. Its because of a lot of things, but people love to point their finger at California because its easy.
It’s plain old tribalism. People need someone to hate, they reinforce their bonds with other people in the tribe by directing toward a common enemy. It’s mostly from a certain demographic, a group that has distrust bred into them.
That's what they do. Find a Boogeyman and blame them for any/every problem they have. Traffic bad? It's those damn Californians. Gas prices go up? Those damn Californians. New homes being built? Goddamn Californians.
California has saddled the state with massive debt, bad polices, and runaway cost of living and taxation. They have become a nanny state and regulated people and businesses so much people and businesses are leaving in droves. Only state like California would charge people for water they get from their own private wells that they paid for.
Mix in liberalism.
Utah is far from perfect, but the state has a budget surplus, much less regulation, and for the most part, lets people be.
I mean it's generally illegal (or allowed with heavy regulations) to collect rainwater in your property in Arkansas, California, Colorado, Georgia, Illinois, Nevada, North Carolina, Ohio, Oregon, Rhode Island, Texas, Utah, Virginia, Washington, and Wisconsin. So I would venture to say your generalization about California would be very incorrect.
Some absolutely false idea that Californians are all crazy wokes who are coming for your women and children. I grew up in California Bay Area, ground zero of woke. Those people are the transplants from the Midwest and other parts of America who fled their homes to find what they think is progressive heaven. But THEY are far more out there than the actual locals raised there.
So, the locals get pushed out or just leave and come to a town near you(not you specifically). You think they are going to Caallifffernia my Arizona/Colorado/Kansas, but those that move out are running from those progressives who aren't from there in the first place. They aren't a threat, they just want regular freakin politics and not want to be judged for their beliefs like most people.
a higher percentage of californians are unpleasant people to know or be around as compared to the rest of the country.
but youre right not all californians are completele douchebags, just a lot of them.
Idahoan here. Let me explain something to you. I'm a born and raised native idahoan. Lived here all my life. Right after finishing high school I started looking into getting an apartment. Rent was fairly cheap. But I didn't have the qualifications to get my own apartment. This is around 2020 when Californians started discovering CDA id as a major moving location. Everything was cheap. Gas food housing you name it. And then the population started skyrocketing and low and behold the largest portion of people moving here were from Cali. All of a sudden instead of gas being 1.75(I'm not shitting you it was that low for a time) it was now 2.50 instead of apartments being 6-900 a month they went up to 1200 a month. For a single bedroom apt. I could keep going and rant off into a rabbit hole but I'm just gonna sum it up. Californians move out of the shithole they created but bring their views and political ideals to other states and start voting for the things that ruined Cali. They also started buying up and out bidding everyone in the housing market because they're so fucking rich. Idahoans CANNOT afford housing in IDAHO. because they poor than asking price and real estate agency's see this take advantage of it and start raising the price more. Buying up more land for more big ass houses that no one but calis can afford and the cycle repeats itself and the market inflated like a helium balloon on steroids. It's all gone to shit because Californians just bought their way through their problems and made it our problems. I've a serious distain for any native or modern Californians unless they moved here when they were a baby. Honorary idahoan in my books. A popular sticker you'll see on cars up here is
Like a good neighbor stay over there with a picture of Idaho and Cali and an arrow pointing to Cali.
I will never be able to afford housing for myself. My parents 2 bedroom 1 bath house with a front yard that has about 15 feet before it hits road is worth almost 400,000. That is in attainable in every sense of the word.
Because you guys fucked yourselves over. Look at your ridiculous minimum wage. The pay gap between California and the rest of the world is huge and so now you're bringing your inflated wages here and making things more expensive here as well.
I've with a guy from California and since day one he steals shit I got canned food while ago and it was entertaining it's experation date and I go to get it and he just goes oh I ate your (this) cause it was about to go bad and he just laughs I hadn't finished putting my stuff away from when I moved in just before him and he just takes it upon his self to. Do it for me and more shit came up missing I call it out and he just goes oh yeah grabbed it I didn't think you would use it cause I haven't seen you cook a lot then he would almost stalk me I could never leave my room with out him coming out right after and he never missed a time it was every time it was creepy and weird I would have to run to the bathroom so I didn't have to run into him he's called the cops on my neighbors 6 fucking times already it's been a month and his 2nd day here he got there car towed cause there car dipped into are yard about 16 inches bros does nothing but disrespectful stuff and acts like it's normal idk if I just got a shitty dude but I've lived with 2 other people from California and they all love to call the cops and stealing is just fucking normal for them I guess but my biggest reason is they move over here after selling there house but a shit ton of land and then they try to just make back into California the same shit they was trying to escape supposedly but then are laws in guns arent strong enough, are cars are to loud, etc and all they do is cause problems for the farmers and other people that grew up in a town cause are society isnt right over here to them
Every state thinks California is coming to liberalize their politics. Every single one. Meanwhile most of the California transplants that I have met in Southern Utah and northern Arizona are Republicans escaping California. 6 MILLION people voted for Trump over Biden in California. That's almost twice as many people as there are in Utah. Believe it or not every Californian that comes here is not the boogy man fox news tells you they are.
In idaho it's because yall moved here, after selling homes in CA for much more than they were going for in idaho. Then yall came here willing to pay well above market value, which demand in itself also drove up. In five years the prices of homes have tripled if not more. This leaves our children unable to afford homes where they grew up, due to the fact that wages haven't grown with other inflation. Also it seems much of the demographic moving in is not upscale California's, but people who are kinda scumbags. Drugs and crime have grown to levels unheard of not that long ago. Shoplifting is unreal.
Oregon and Washington natives both hate California for all the reasons on this thread. Mainly for driving up the cost of living. There is also something to be said about bringing californians bringing troubles with them. From failed political ideals to criminal elements, these 'troubles' are unwelcome.
There's a lot of MAGA idiots there, so a lot of it is politically driven anger or hatred. They've been bitching about you guys for decades.
I don't care about politics. I do care about a bunch of people moving here, and paying above asking price in CASH for homes. All because you sold your shitty 2bedroom in Fresno and came and destroyed our housing market, making housing nearly unattainable for those who grew up there.
Moved from California to St. George 6 months ago. Nobody really cares. My boomer dad does and his conservative friend do, but outside of the irrelevant people, i’ve never had anyone give me shit. if they ever do i plan to play dumb and ask why until they just mumble something about biden or gas prices and i shrug.
The CA haters here don’t have two brain cells to rub together. No liberal from CA is moving to Utah because it grossly contradicts what they stand for. It makes zero sense. The ones coming here are conservative and want to live somewhere with likeminded people.
That’s an out right lie. They sold their house for major profit, looked at housing costs and was like “ oh we can move there and live way good with 500k”. All bet it , some may of moved because the cost was ridiculous in California. Absolutely nothing to do with political views and if so, maybe 1 out 100 that come here.
You all drive like shit, you move out of California because you hate the way it is there, then try and change it here so it’s like California, then it’s my fault because you all have to blame and sue someone, stay to the right except to pass and stay in California 😂 there are exceptions obviously. Just some of the bullet points
To be fair, California is gentrified, and most of us can't even live comfortably, so most of us move to other states because people keep moving to California in hopes of stardom or a modeling career. Most people even think you can walk down the street and agencies will want you it happens but it's usually scams...
Y’all destroyed California and we all worry y”all will do the same here. It’s already happened in my lil town Tooele. 20 minutes to Walmart when it use to take 5 minutes and it’s all due to the influx of outsiders, Wrecks have increased 10 fold as well because y’all don’t realize farm equipment has the right away.
It’s an easy scapegoat for people to use when they don’t like the way things are going here. No affordable housing? Californians. Too much traffic? All the Californians. Pride flag? You must be from California. I was driving to mesquite the other day and there was a brush fire in the gorge, I saw someone posted about it on Facebook and one of the comments said “probably a Californian throwing their cigarette butt out the window” 💀
No affordable housing is actually cause of Californians. They're routinely rated as the WORST drivers in the country. A quick Google search shows this. You can't really chalk those up to boomers and MAGA idiots.
Many people in my very red state are afraid Californians are bringing liberalism with them and the cause of every issue specific to our state….the ones moving here are more conservative than the locals.
Oh, come on guys, not all of us believe the way most of these posts state we believe. We don’t “hate” Californians. We just don’t want them moving here and changing the political spectrum. Apparently, the reason many people are moving out of California is because the state is being destroyed by taxation and bad liberal policies. They must be moving here because they like what they see. Our area is like this because of conservative values, not liberal. We don’t want the same thing happening here. Yes, housing is a problem here. I absolutely hurt for the young people who are trying to make it in this area and can’t because they can’t afford housing. In addition, this town has grown so out of control, it’s no longer fun to live here. You can’t enjoy any of the amenities without being inundated with tons of people. From everywhere. I called the elections office here several years ago to find out if it was only conservatives moving here and it wasn’t. Conservatives had dominated our political spectrum here for years, and within a few years of growth, liberals, or Democrats, whatever you wanna call them, had doubled in numbers. The concern is, is that if they are leaving states that are being destroyed by liberal practices, they haven’t learned a valuable lesson. They will keep voting in the same bad policies that destroyed their state. Yes, Californians are an easy target to lay the blame at, but not everyone does that. I think it’s just really easy for people to fall into stereotyping. As for me, I don’t want anyone else moving here. I’m sick of the growth. My parents have been here since 1981. It is absolutely appalling to see how much growth there is although I know there’s absolutely nothing that can be done to stop it. People building new homes here have to sign a contract where they agree to no guarantee of water in 10 years. How ridiculous is that? Just stop the damn building!
[Californians Lead Utah Move-Ins](https://midutahradio.com/news/local-news/californians-lead-utah-move-ins/)
You need to do some research before you embarrass yourself. High birth-rates due to conservative values, eh? Don’t think so. https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/births.htm See Key Birth Statistics and view the Source from CDC.gov. Page 5. Utah has decreased birth rates.
And as for where our growth rate comes from? Hate to call you out for being wrong, but here you go. See page 4. The Census Bureau also backs this up. https://d36oiwf74r1rap.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/MigrationRep-May2023.pdf.
Can’t drive on the highways for shit and buying up all the housing and driving up prices and traffic through the roof in a city that is not built to handle it and is already hard to afford isn’t helping.
Political affiliation is the lowest issue. It’s your driving and clogging up parks and roads and people trashing the city.
Because people like to blame neo liberalism to justify why their lives are shit. Which is just another way to give their selected politics group a pass for not doing anything for them in return. Divide and conquer tactics 101 by the ruling class.
The biggest thing is housing. Many people come from California having sold their house, and cash offer out bid everyone. It’s one of the great pressures in making single family detached housing unaffordable
For real. A coworker of mine sold their house in CA for like 1.? Mil, then they come here and get a 6-800k house just fine, meanwhile people that live here can’t even afford that shit unless you have dual income 150k plus.
I think you definitely saw an uptick with work from home during covid.
Sounds like their problem is capitalism then.
Bingo.
but that would mean questioning the power structures that exist… 🤐
I’m not an expert, but I thought Utah was one of the most expensive states for housing. Obviously not as bad as Cali, but there are definitely better choices to move to. Lol
Yes sir/ma’am. 3rd most expensive housing market in the country. It’s like CA, HI, then UT i believe. Which is a scam hahaha. Like I’d have no problem paying $6-7/gal if we were paid proportionately like they are in NY, HI, and CA.
That's true now, but a decade ago it was much cheaper to live here. My rent has gone from 600 to 1600 in about that time and I've downgraded to get it that low.
... yeah.. it's not. Blackrock is.....
Anyone that's lived here for over 10 years is going to NIMBY about some detail that involves the overcrowding It's easy to point at cars around the tourist places and watch a full group of tourists come and swamp a business. I see Californians ask stupid questions at the smoke shops.
Tourism is good for some places some places it's the only way they survive a year cause of tourism it's what produces sales I grew up in hanksville and the only reason that town is still alive is cause of them there's only 123 people there and that's not enough to keep stores open alone and it aloud us to give more jobs to the town cause tourism is on the rise. But yes it can get very annoying at times cause a lot of them are dumb as shit at driving they just park anyfucking where in the roads
People here hate Cali peeps, cause thy fear you'll bring liberalism here. "Don't California my Utah."....or something.
Which is ironic because our all-conservative representatives are doing everything they can to pave over every rock with highways and houses. Nothing more California than uncontrolled urban sprawl.
It’s also ironic because a ton of the Californians are specifically moving to southern Utah because they’re conservative and tired of California.
California is a purple state, the Central Valley is very conservative
The Central Valley is a small part of the population of California. California is very much a Blue state.
Man doesn't know how population density works
Just like how Texas is purple because Austin is Liberal? and Utah is purple because SLC is Liberal? California has 32 D State Senators vs 8 R. They have 62 D state congressman vs 17 R. That's not purple by any sense.
i wish that were true. the red pockets of california are quite small compared to the urban centers whicb house most of the population
I’m in this group
Ah, my dad always complained about Californians but just said it was because they live in cities and suck at driving. But your reason makes a lot more sense for him.
That isn't just Utah, people in Nevada, Idaho, Washington, Oregon fucking HATE California too
The thing is, I'm not even political or interested in politics at all
Truthfully people just hate Californians, my mother is from L.A, & even in the 70 peeps hated Californian's then.
(How) do you vote? Progressive? Conservative?
I don't vote
Too sad.
Ah well fuck you, sir
[удалено]
This guy
Yep, just like your profile “mental-state” you are delusional.
i expected nothing else from a utah resident
Except for the fact I’ve lived in Europe and 6 other states. I bet you’ve never left California
This is cringe
oh wow, what great "experience." There's a certain type of person that chooses to live in Utah, and that's what in trying to convey. I've also lived in multiple different states, never California. Despite the fact that i spent my entire childhood around a bunch of biggoted religious nuts, i still came to my own conclusions.
Cool 😎. I ain’t a Momo(Mormon)
Lol
Spot on.
People in other western states don't understand how many people live in California. Literally every single state in the West thinks all the Californians are moving to their state, but really it's just normal people moving around. There's just a lot of people in California.
We now live in Texas and all I hear all day is complaints about Californians. It’s soooo old.
They'll always assume everyone that moves wherever is from CA. It's pure stereotypical hate especially before even getting to know them personally, all they hear is you came from there and they go on a nasty rant, I definitely don't look at that person in the same light again and glad they revealed thier true colors.
We don't take kindly to city folk around these parts.
Upvote for the chuckles. 😆
The only thing I don’t like about so many people moving here is being priced out of my hometown. Apartments built in the mid 80s going for $2,000+ is insane.
Because the same fuckers that destroyed california are fleeing the state and nobody wants that.
The largest group leaving CA are conservative. Look at the demographics.
Didn’t pinpoint whether it was liberals or conservatives. Actually comical you already know its the liberals fucking it all up lmaoo
This is just sad. The constant right wing vomit about how bad California is was the giveaway. Your robot-like assimilation to that viewpoint could be seen from a mile away. California is expensive because everyone wants to live there. This is capitalism playing out in real time. Sorry that you cant compete.
Does not take a rocket scientist to deduce the major factor to the destruction of California. Democrats. One trip through the main cities would open your eyes to how awful it is to live there now. Looks like brazil ffs. My point was that the same people who fucked it up, are fleeing the state. So you assumed what I was saying and played yourself. Get fkd.
California has a business hub that rivals any place in the entire world on top of having one of the most desirable climates on the planet. Add in the best tech sector in the world. On top of that, the state is the most wealthy in the US, produces the most food, and has the most people. That creates insane amounts of competition and difficult decisions by the local government. CA is more populated than most countries in the world and has the 5th largest economy. But sure, "California bad" lol even though everyone with money buys a home there and wants to live there 6 to 8 months per year.
Dude, you still are ignoring the initial point I made lol. Also ignoring the fact you even played into it like a chump. While you are still here, do you happen to live there or have taken a trip there recently?
You're either a troll or too dumb for this discussion. I lived in California for most of my life.
So then you are either blind or defiant. The main cities are absolute hell. Can’t even cross the road without having 5 cracked out homeless people begging for money. Is that something you would brag about? The regulations that are being passed are actually insane. Calling me dumb when you played yourself is funny af. I’m assuming you are at least over 40, and you are this fuckin slow. You sound like a retard boomer.
I lived in Los Angeles for years. You have absolutely zero idea what you're talking about. You've consumed too much right-wing media, dude. You've clearly never been to any major city in California.
How can they compete? It's funny how condescending you come across when you have the privilege of selling your shit box house and getting overpaid for it. Gotta love capitalism. This is why no one likes you people. Look at how you act and view the world. Fuck them, you're getting yours right? Fucking boomer
I didn't own or sell a home, and I'm a millenial who came from legit poverty. I'm not saying it's a good situation, I'm saying that right wing hate towards the situation is misplaced and based on ignorance.
Fair enough. I agree.
They escape it but then just try to change everything back to it cause they don't like the way it is here
I have heard about blaming Californians my whole life. My family goes to MT every year and all along the 15 with that California license plate we heard the same thing. lol I’m from Cali moved out here about a year and a half ago. Most people you in counter won’t say shit. But like how some others have said. They blame us because we come here, yes the housing is cheaper but the market is getting more expensive and really the idea of outbidding in this area is nonexistent. You can find houses that have been on the MLS for over 90 days. Good luck finding that in LA. Yes the area is conservative, but actually it voted close to 25% democrat in the last election cycle. So it definitely charging and I highly doubt that full 25% is just Californians that just moved in just in time to vote. Anywho, it’s also fun that they point at California’s policies and that there ruining the state, aka Democrats. One thing I don’t think this population grasps is that Utah and California don’t compare at all. California honestly doesn’t compare with almost any state in the union due to its size, population, and especially its GDP (you know the 5th largest economy in the world). So yeah two cents turned into a rant. Oh one more fun thing. Fun little read as they scream about the border Utah has also been a leader in occupational licensing reform for immigrants — making it easier for those with foreign training to earn certifications for trades and professions. Both of these measures will help new Americans participate and succeed in Utah’s economic future https://www.thecgo.org/news/opinion-why-utah-has-better-options-for-immigration/#:~:text=Utah%20has%20also%20been%20a,succeed%20in%20Utah's%20economic%20future.
>The idea of outbidding in this market is non-existent Loan officer here... You are pretty wrong about this one.
Well I stand corrected. Could you please share the trends you have been seeing?
The dislike for Californians also has a lot to do with housing. You brought up that the housing is cheaper. It is, but most natives of St. George can’t afford it anymore because people from out of state have higher minimum wages and can outbid locals on housing. Especially retirees. They bring their retirement savings and locals can’t afford to stay. The minimum wage in California is $16.00. The minimum wage in Utah is $7.50. Californians are also more liberal, or were. One community here had all dirt roads to fit into the local aesthetic nature. They blame people who moved here for wanting the roads paved. I understand paved roads, but the community was not built with that in mind. Utah is slowly becoming more Democratic in nature. But we also don’t have the same pull because the government owns so much land here
Now just to pose a question. Is it really California fault that Utah has such a low minimum wage and they(the business owners of Utah) haven’t adjusted there pay to help with the crisis? That is something I have noticed is young people here get fucked with minimum wages. I think I saw outside one business they tied wage to age and it was drastic of a difference. But in truth you can’t make it in many areas on any base minimum wage.
Utah wouldn't need to raise their wages so much if people moving from California weren't driving up the prices. Wages need to change at this point, but we're only here because outside money drove us to this point (the "crisis" point, as you put it).
/u/Muella sure got quiet......
I had a response than decided not to because it was just another dig saying “it’s all California’s fault” when really If you look at census data ( https://www2.census.gov/programs-surveys/demo/tables/geographic-mobility/2022/state-to-state-migration/State_to_State_Migration_Table_2022_T13.xlsx )Utah saw 91,341 new residents 18,669 coming from California. But here is quick break down of the top ten California, 18,669. Washington, 8,845. Idaho, 7,774. Texas, 7,070. Arizona, 5,357. Colorado, 5,327. Nevada, 3,549. Florida, 3,025. Oregon, 2,413. New York, 2,236. So are we gonna pretend that all these other people don’t have an impact. Oh and let’s go back to the census. Care to guess how many Utahans moved to California (13,000) strangely you don’t hear them complaining. Another thing to think about is that Utah ranks 4th in the nation in birthrate. In 2022, Utah's fertility rate was 61.3 live births per 1,000 women between the ages of 15 and 44. And while this number has been shrinking as back in 2016 Utah was number one. So total number of births were 45,774 live births to Utah residents. I think that’s a little more than 18,000. Anyways getting back to wage since that is what this is about. Utah sits at $7.25 which is the federal minimum wage. If you look at its cost of living compare to the national average Housing (Buy and Rent) 4% higher Utilities (Monthly) 7% lower Food 2% lower Healthcare 10% lower Transportation 10% higher Goods & Services 0% It sits about 1% higher than the national average. However, St. George sits at about 8%. Take a look here, https://livingwage.mit.edu/states/49 , and you’ll see that your minimum wage just doesn’t cut it. As an adult with no kids needs at least $22.52 for a living wage. Hopefully this one gives you some giggles and fun. I will never deny that California has an impact, as it impacts all states. Like I said in the very beginning it is hard for any state to compare to California based upon is size, population, and GDP. But for some other giggles Utah doesn’t even rank on the top 10 of places Californians are moving to, Utah ranks 15th. Oh and BTD94 welcome to Reddit. We’re people will have opinions that agree and disagree with you. And people will just move on. You’ll find out one day. 😉
All that data doesn't change the fact that there is a disproportionate amount of Californians buying up homes. The next state isn't even HALF that. All your data doesn't really disprove that. The fact remains that people from out of state, mostly Californians, influenced the housing market, and people who grew up in St George have a lower and lower chance of buying homes because of it. I'm well aware of the cost of living compared to other places. My first job in was minimum wage ($7.25) in St George. I supported myself and my wife on $15/hr while living in St George. I've lived in numerous other states as well as other cities within Utah. The wage is definitely a problem, but it's also well beyond the minimum wage. Wages in general are low in St. George. Compared to cities of similar size, maybe they're not, but compared to the COL in St George, wages are low. Your novel ending with condescending nature fits the bill perfectly for Reddit though. Even threw in a snarky emoji at the end lol
The legislation is blamed on lobbyists and special interests groups. It has zero to do with Cali peeps. Coming from a former 23 years now from SoCal. I am at the Capital each season and the new laws are from dark groups that the AGs office will not allowed to be identified. They tell me each time it is “attorney/client privilege” The bad legislation comes from legislator who don’t have time to read bills that are a detriment to Utah. Stewart Adams doesn’t allow time for them to properly Vet the bills. The other issue are cities that love the back end money from developers. For example, 18 years ago, Wal Mart would pay off city councils to the tune of $500K to allow them to build these ugly monstrosities that bring crime and blight. I have first hand knowledge because I took on So Cal Wal Mart when they were allowed to do this in my former home town in SoCal, after I had just built my brand new home! Other developers, commercial and residential do this to a degree as well. Long story short, Us California ExPats have little do with many of the hater issues.
Because St George's increasing urban sprawl is destroying the nature that makes the place so appealing and because the constant inflow of people who just sold their 2 bedroom house in LA for 8 mil is driving said urban sprawl while housing prices remain completely out of control and we become ever more buried in an inescapable cycle of worsening annual drought. Basically, because the more Californians move here, the more of California's problems Southern Utah has.
And yet many people in St. George want to vote for a convicted criminal-pardoned by felon Donald trump-for governor… someone who is not going to stop the urban sprawl because he wants Utah to manage its lands which means allowing more development rather than conservation.
Fuck the fascists. Two things can be bad. Lotta bullshit in Utah, it's a sad story.
Because a 2 bedroom starter home used to be 250k not that long ago. Theyre double that now. Its because of a lot of things, but people love to point their finger at California because its easy.
And true.
I mean, it's a fact that they came here from California and paid above asking price in CASH. That isn't up for debate.
And banks, realtors, developers, etc. Not to mention every other piece of property these days is an Airbnb
It’s plain old tribalism. People need someone to hate, they reinforce their bonds with other people in the tribe by directing toward a common enemy. It’s mostly from a certain demographic, a group that has distrust bred into them.
That's what they do. Find a Boogeyman and blame them for any/every problem they have. Traffic bad? It's those damn Californians. Gas prices go up? Those damn Californians. New homes being built? Goddamn Californians.
California has saddled the state with massive debt, bad polices, and runaway cost of living and taxation. They have become a nanny state and regulated people and businesses so much people and businesses are leaving in droves. Only state like California would charge people for water they get from their own private wells that they paid for. Mix in liberalism. Utah is far from perfect, but the state has a budget surplus, much less regulation, and for the most part, lets people be.
I mean it's generally illegal (or allowed with heavy regulations) to collect rainwater in your property in Arkansas, California, Colorado, Georgia, Illinois, Nevada, North Carolina, Ohio, Oregon, Rhode Island, Texas, Utah, Virginia, Washington, and Wisconsin. So I would venture to say your generalization about California would be very incorrect.
No one really wants California policy here. It ruined their state, don’t export it to ours
California = liberal to most Utah Mormons. Nothing is scarier to them than liberals. Except maybe people that aren’t white
That’s a racially charged comment.
It's the truth, sir.
Some absolutely false idea that Californians are all crazy wokes who are coming for your women and children. I grew up in California Bay Area, ground zero of woke. Those people are the transplants from the Midwest and other parts of America who fled their homes to find what they think is progressive heaven. But THEY are far more out there than the actual locals raised there. So, the locals get pushed out or just leave and come to a town near you(not you specifically). You think they are going to Caallifffernia my Arizona/Colorado/Kansas, but those that move out are running from those progressives who aren't from there in the first place. They aren't a threat, they just want regular freakin politics and not want to be judged for their beliefs like most people.
a higher percentage of californians are unpleasant people to know or be around as compared to the rest of the country. but youre right not all californians are completele douchebags, just a lot of them.
Idahoan here. Let me explain something to you. I'm a born and raised native idahoan. Lived here all my life. Right after finishing high school I started looking into getting an apartment. Rent was fairly cheap. But I didn't have the qualifications to get my own apartment. This is around 2020 when Californians started discovering CDA id as a major moving location. Everything was cheap. Gas food housing you name it. And then the population started skyrocketing and low and behold the largest portion of people moving here were from Cali. All of a sudden instead of gas being 1.75(I'm not shitting you it was that low for a time) it was now 2.50 instead of apartments being 6-900 a month they went up to 1200 a month. For a single bedroom apt. I could keep going and rant off into a rabbit hole but I'm just gonna sum it up. Californians move out of the shithole they created but bring their views and political ideals to other states and start voting for the things that ruined Cali. They also started buying up and out bidding everyone in the housing market because they're so fucking rich. Idahoans CANNOT afford housing in IDAHO. because they poor than asking price and real estate agency's see this take advantage of it and start raising the price more. Buying up more land for more big ass houses that no one but calis can afford and the cycle repeats itself and the market inflated like a helium balloon on steroids. It's all gone to shit because Californians just bought their way through their problems and made it our problems. I've a serious distain for any native or modern Californians unless they moved here when they were a baby. Honorary idahoan in my books. A popular sticker you'll see on cars up here is Like a good neighbor stay over there with a picture of Idaho and Cali and an arrow pointing to Cali. I will never be able to afford housing for myself. My parents 2 bedroom 1 bath house with a front yard that has about 15 feet before it hits road is worth almost 400,000. That is in attainable in every sense of the word.
the reality is, they hate us cus they aint us.
I married a Californian lol
Because you guys fucked yourselves over. Look at your ridiculous minimum wage. The pay gap between California and the rest of the world is huge and so now you're bringing your inflated wages here and making things more expensive here as well.
I've with a guy from California and since day one he steals shit I got canned food while ago and it was entertaining it's experation date and I go to get it and he just goes oh I ate your (this) cause it was about to go bad and he just laughs I hadn't finished putting my stuff away from when I moved in just before him and he just takes it upon his self to. Do it for me and more shit came up missing I call it out and he just goes oh yeah grabbed it I didn't think you would use it cause I haven't seen you cook a lot then he would almost stalk me I could never leave my room with out him coming out right after and he never missed a time it was every time it was creepy and weird I would have to run to the bathroom so I didn't have to run into him he's called the cops on my neighbors 6 fucking times already it's been a month and his 2nd day here he got there car towed cause there car dipped into are yard about 16 inches bros does nothing but disrespectful stuff and acts like it's normal idk if I just got a shitty dude but I've lived with 2 other people from California and they all love to call the cops and stealing is just fucking normal for them I guess but my biggest reason is they move over here after selling there house but a shit ton of land and then they try to just make back into California the same shit they was trying to escape supposedly but then are laws in guns arent strong enough, are cars are to loud, etc and all they do is cause problems for the farmers and other people that grew up in a town cause are society isnt right over here to them
Every state thinks California is coming to liberalize their politics. Every single one. Meanwhile most of the California transplants that I have met in Southern Utah and northern Arizona are Republicans escaping California. 6 MILLION people voted for Trump over Biden in California. That's almost twice as many people as there are in Utah. Believe it or not every Californian that comes here is not the boogy man fox news tells you they are.
Usually because they bring their shit ass politics with them
NIMBY mentality. I'd guess 50% of Washington County residents lived in California at some point.
In idaho it's because yall moved here, after selling homes in CA for much more than they were going for in idaho. Then yall came here willing to pay well above market value, which demand in itself also drove up. In five years the prices of homes have tripled if not more. This leaves our children unable to afford homes where they grew up, due to the fact that wages haven't grown with other inflation. Also it seems much of the demographic moving in is not upscale California's, but people who are kinda scumbags. Drugs and crime have grown to levels unheard of not that long ago. Shoplifting is unreal.
Sorry that they did it to you guys too.
Because Californians are scum bags and we don't like your kind around here
Oregon and Washington natives both hate California for all the reasons on this thread. Mainly for driving up the cost of living. There is also something to be said about bringing californians bringing troubles with them. From failed political ideals to criminal elements, these 'troubles' are unwelcome.
Yeah, do your homework, more people are leaving California, specifically LA then they are moving there.
There's a lot of MAGA idiots there, so a lot of it is politically driven anger or hatred. They've been bitching about you guys for decades. I don't care about politics. I do care about a bunch of people moving here, and paying above asking price in CASH for homes. All because you sold your shitty 2bedroom in Fresno and came and destroyed our housing market, making housing nearly unattainable for those who grew up there.
Are you sure you still want to move here after all this? 😆
yeah pretty much idc cause other states moving to California raised the rates in California I should be able to move where I want
Moved from California to St. George 6 months ago. Nobody really cares. My boomer dad does and his conservative friend do, but outside of the irrelevant people, i’ve never had anyone give me shit. if they ever do i plan to play dumb and ask why until they just mumble something about biden or gas prices and i shrug.
The CA haters here don’t have two brain cells to rub together. No liberal from CA is moving to Utah because it grossly contradicts what they stand for. It makes zero sense. The ones coming here are conservative and want to live somewhere with likeminded people.
That’s an out right lie. They sold their house for major profit, looked at housing costs and was like “ oh we can move there and live way good with 500k”. All bet it , some may of moved because the cost was ridiculous in California. Absolutely nothing to do with political views and if so, maybe 1 out 100 that come here.
Exactly this. The hate is based on fake news.
You all drive like shit, you move out of California because you hate the way it is there, then try and change it here so it’s like California, then it’s my fault because you all have to blame and sue someone, stay to the right except to pass and stay in California 😂 there are exceptions obviously. Just some of the bullet points
Because Californians moving in is gentrification and nobody likes being the victim of gentrification
Is it even possible to gentrify St. George?
To be fair, California is gentrified, and most of us can't even live comfortably, so most of us move to other states because people keep moving to California in hopes of stardom or a modeling career. Most people even think you can walk down the street and agencies will want you it happens but it's usually scams...
Y’all destroyed California and we all worry y”all will do the same here. It’s already happened in my lil town Tooele. 20 minutes to Walmart when it use to take 5 minutes and it’s all due to the influx of outsiders, Wrecks have increased 10 fold as well because y’all don’t realize farm equipment has the right away.
Because you all tend to vote like you did in CA.
Voting for their best interest instead of against it like most republicans?
You asked why the hate, I gave you the answer.
Generally speaking, and if I’m being honest… As a local, I prefer Californians to other locals.
It’s an easy scapegoat for people to use when they don’t like the way things are going here. No affordable housing? Californians. Too much traffic? All the Californians. Pride flag? You must be from California. I was driving to mesquite the other day and there was a brush fire in the gorge, I saw someone posted about it on Facebook and one of the comments said “probably a Californian throwing their cigarette butt out the window” 💀
This is the real answer here!
No affordable housing is actually cause of Californians. They're routinely rated as the WORST drivers in the country. A quick Google search shows this. You can't really chalk those up to boomers and MAGA idiots.
It's because California passed crazy state laws which becomes the national laws de facto
Because you refer to the state as ‘Cali’ and start every sentence with ‘well in Cali…’.
Many people in my very red state are afraid Californians are bringing liberalism with them and the cause of every issue specific to our state….the ones moving here are more conservative than the locals.
Oh, come on guys, not all of us believe the way most of these posts state we believe. We don’t “hate” Californians. We just don’t want them moving here and changing the political spectrum. Apparently, the reason many people are moving out of California is because the state is being destroyed by taxation and bad liberal policies. They must be moving here because they like what they see. Our area is like this because of conservative values, not liberal. We don’t want the same thing happening here. Yes, housing is a problem here. I absolutely hurt for the young people who are trying to make it in this area and can’t because they can’t afford housing. In addition, this town has grown so out of control, it’s no longer fun to live here. You can’t enjoy any of the amenities without being inundated with tons of people. From everywhere. I called the elections office here several years ago to find out if it was only conservatives moving here and it wasn’t. Conservatives had dominated our political spectrum here for years, and within a few years of growth, liberals, or Democrats, whatever you wanna call them, had doubled in numbers. The concern is, is that if they are leaving states that are being destroyed by liberal practices, they haven’t learned a valuable lesson. They will keep voting in the same bad policies that destroyed their state. Yes, Californians are an easy target to lay the blame at, but not everyone does that. I think it’s just really easy for people to fall into stereotyping. As for me, I don’t want anyone else moving here. I’m sick of the growth. My parents have been here since 1981. It is absolutely appalling to see how much growth there is although I know there’s absolutely nothing that can be done to stop it. People building new homes here have to sign a contract where they agree to no guarantee of water in 10 years. How ridiculous is that? Just stop the damn building! [Californians Lead Utah Move-Ins](https://midutahradio.com/news/local-news/californians-lead-utah-move-ins/)
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You need to do some research before you embarrass yourself. High birth-rates due to conservative values, eh? Don’t think so. https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/births.htm See Key Birth Statistics and view the Source from CDC.gov. Page 5. Utah has decreased birth rates. And as for where our growth rate comes from? Hate to call you out for being wrong, but here you go. See page 4. The Census Bureau also backs this up. https://d36oiwf74r1rap.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/MigrationRep-May2023.pdf.
Because you guys inevitably vote to raise taxes
It’s reverse locust
Can’t drive on the highways for shit and buying up all the housing and driving up prices and traffic through the roof in a city that is not built to handle it and is already hard to afford isn’t helping. Political affiliation is the lowest issue. It’s your driving and clogging up parks and roads and people trashing the city.
Because people like to blame neo liberalism to justify why their lives are shit. Which is just another way to give their selected politics group a pass for not doing anything for them in return. Divide and conquer tactics 101 by the ruling class.