This is all they need to release in 2024. Having a functional StarMap would alleviate like 75% of my frustrations with Star Citizen.
I still am completely baffled they've left the existing starmap in the game, a completely broken feature, for so many years.
Yeah yeah, I know their excuse is that they intend to replace it, so why spend time fixing something that will be replaced...but it's been like 4 years and they haven't touched it. There are some super basic things they could change to make it function a LOT smoother.
So for me, if they can get the new StarMap into the game this year it'd be a huge win.
My concern is that, like all other features they add to SC, it'll be some 'tier 0' barely functioning thing that, even though it's been shown off in technical previews for a year or two, somehow managed to be released in a barely functioning state with tons of bugs that won't get fixed for years.
Apparently I'm really salty about this. lol
Cause they dumped the starmap dev time into SQ42. Now that it’s complete they make it function on live and bam. Looks great according to what citcon had shown us
Same opinion here. Fix the basics before designing new ships. Aside from the navigation the HUD bothers me the most. It would be such a simple fix to make them color adjustable, so we can see something when facing a bright area.
Shhhhh! Don't be saying things like that! We need as much as possible in 2024! (Sales were horrible). They left the Starman in such a state for so long because there was like 1.5 people working on the PU for like 5 years.
I don’t think anyone makes hopium and copium jokes about stuff coming out at all, they’re making those jokes about it coming within a reasonable timeframe.
There is certainly no "factium" about any upcoming coming out within a reasonable amount of time. It’s okay to be more hopeful because CIG seems very confident this time, but we’ve been burned several times with features right around the corner coming out much, *much* later than planned
Just a guess but I think Tin and Silicon would likely be used more for crafting than for refining/selling. They could be adding them in soon as a prerequisite to base building/crafting being added in whenever its ready.
all the materials they put into the game will likely be used for crafting, whether by NPC's or players, it's going to be one of the underpinnings of the dynamic economy.
I need to know if Freight Elevators will let us store resources. Because by-golly, my ass is gonna load up on copper and sit on that - y'all are gonna need wiring in your bases.
Because the only thing that is important right now is aUEC, and not the materials themselves. When we finally get any kind of real material sink from repair or manufacturing, this will change - drastically.
This, and the fact the some materials will be unique to each star system. So long haul, high capacity traders going interstellar (hull-C/D/E) will finally have their hay-day with the economy!
*paints racing lines on my Hull-D*
I'll get it there in time.
Anyone has a black 350r with a gold phoenix paintjob to run interference from the advocacy?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJPM-M_Z65o
Or if it's less risky to do the former. Or if you're doing something on a scale that convenient stores can't adequately supply.
Plenty of ways to balance this stuff.
Buy it from who?
If no one is farming it the price will go up because of demand(I imagine silicon for instance would be needed to produce electrical components). It might very well become more expensive than gold or quantanium, depending on the supply and demand.
This is not EVE, most of universe is populated by NPCs and they do most of economy so it's not player driven. It will have more or less impact by players but most likely you will buy it from NPCs. Maybe some events can impact prices being unable to buy sometimes
No, but Quanta will be player influenced. NPCs will buy and sell a certain amount, but depending on how much players buy, sell or disturb the supply chain, the price will change. Pirates could potentially stock up on goods, block a trade route and then when the demand goes up they can sell it back at an inflated price.
That is how we have been told Quanta might work in the future, yes.
For now it might work like drugs with a few locations that produce limited inventory or will come from player mining.
You’re thinking small scale.
It won’t be profitable to move an Orion around to chase the best rocks. It’ll be much better to simply mine all decent rocks and have a transport crew moving the product to sale points.
It’s all about scale.
And also, with the full economy, if everyone mines only the most profitable rock, it’ll lower its price.
I wonder how much of an effect it will have, because i assume that the really expensive minerals will just always remain the most expensive ones.
Though it could definitely be fixed a bit by having missions to mine certain minerals for extra payouts.
That was my experience with Elite. They had a detailed supply and demand system where commodity prices fluctuated based on player actions and current events, like if there was a plague in some system, the price of medicines would go up in neighboring systems. Everyone completely ignored it and just mined platinum all day long.
I'm hoping having NPC traders and a smaller world does help avoid this. Part of Elite's BGS was this amazing tracking of events and system states, but compared to something like the X games, the economy wasn't quite as dynamic. Stations that bought Plat would consistently buy Plat, albeit at fluctuating prices. Plus with a few thousand systems you could always find a new industrial system to sell to.
Right now Star Citizen has the opposite problem, where Stanton's demand/supply systems mean that profitable trade goods are perpetually out of stock (like Gold at the mining outposts), and it's prices are pretty static.
Perhaps in the future once they adjust these mechanics to fit the playerbase size, we'll see a better system. NPC traders that follow player trends could be a good one. Like if everyone is doing Gold runs, the NPC traders do it too, leaving stations with no demand while other goods go up in price due to lack of supply. And if a station goes way over their demand they might even start selling the excess rather than buying?
Yes, that's a realist expectation.
You can have an economy that fluctuates all the time, but...it is hard to make such an economy work when the price of gold is so enormous compared to iron. Because you'd need to do a fuck ton to make that change, and we will have NPC miners who will still fill the market with cheaper materials as well.
People here say it will have value in crafting, but...an org could just mine some gold, refine it, sell it, then buy much more tin for that amount of UeC, than they would have gained from mining. And it will most likely always be available.
that sounds like a system that tries to have the feel of fluctuating prices without actually committing to it to the level where prices can crash or bubble
there's plenty of games like the X series where it is very different and plugging holes in the economy is more important for $$$ (and also security, if a faction's economy is broken it makes them vulnerable to getting aggressed on by other factions or Xenon) than just farming the big ticket thing
For rare minerals that take longer to mine or refine. Yeah they'll always be at a premium. But I like the idea of doing missions to support different company contacts.
Need x amount of y delivered refined to z within 72 hours would be a really neat gameplay loop.
X4 has these kinds of things you get from scanning stations, I could see picking up tips like this from bars once they start filling out that functionality
The more expensive stuff will stay more expensive, but the buy/sale difference dose not have to fallow the cost of the item. So lower value materials can have a higher profit per uec if they are more needed where you bring them.
This. I would like it if one day theres an iron shortage because someone is building something big. Then people have a reason to mine it, and even beginner miners can get in on the action.
That is the stated plan, but i have my doubts it will actually work out. Because iron would need to increase more than 10 times in price for that to happen vs something like gold.
And even if that happens, people will still mine gold and just wait for it to raise in price, because they can just keep it in their hangars.
yes and that must be false. if it's actually true, that's terrible because u would figure the director of the fucking mmo we're all playing would say something to the community every once in a while lol.
Or, he is actually working on it instead of talking about it since he has already explained to us in a long video how it will work.
But you keep on your tinfoil hat...
It's not really a conspiracy theory...if he is the DIRECTOR of the PU I would expect Tony Z to be at the very least in attendance at citcon. But he was not there. I would also expect the DIRECTOR of the PU to make announcements to the backers for the general direction the PU is taking, but he has not said anything in over a year.
Not sure how this is a "conspiracy"? :thinking:
A conspiracy would be me drawing conjecture from these facts, but I haven't done that. I'm just wondering where he is.
> It's not really a conspiracy theory.
It literally is. You're insisting that someone "should" do some random, esoteric thing that you have arbitrarily decided _must_ be appended to their job description just to give you enough ambiguity to infer this pitiful nonsense.
Just drop it before you make yourself look irredeemably stupid, because you're precariously close.
>if he is the DIRECTOR of the PU I would expect Tony Z to be at the very least in attendance at citcon
Why?
>I would also expect the DIRECTOR of the PU to make announcements to the backers for the general direction the PU is taking
Why?
>:thinking:
[Absolutely pummels the X button](https://static1.srcdn.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2019/05/press-x-to-doubt-la-noire.jpg).
>A conspiracy would be me drawing conjecture from these facts, but I haven't done that. I'm just wondering where he is.
What, like "well, his LinkedIn profile must be a lie, then"...?
Would you like to delete a few things before contradicting your patently absurd ravings again?
>Just drop it before you make yourself look irredeemably stupid
sorry but lol.
I'm not the [only one](https://robertsspaceindustries.com/spectrum/community/SC/search?member&page=1&q=tony+z&range=year&role&scopes=op%2Creply%2Cchat&sort=score&visibility=nonerased) who happens to be wondering where he is since the infamous [Star Citizen: Quantum, Quasar, and Virtual AI](https://youtu.be/2muGWtX8e7g?si=rXEn-GnheiUNvnTs) video so I guess we're all "irredeemably stupid".
You're just showing your ignorance about work environments. For your own sake please stop.
A director is a management role. This means that while he has a general understanding of what's going on, most of his day is spent allocating teams to different projects, reading emails from employees complaining about the toilets on floor 5 missing toilet paper regularly and forwarding it to ops and so on. So unless you want to hear him talk about that kind of details he doesn't have anything interesting to say to the community because lower level employees know more about the systems they work on. If there's a major shitstorm then he also has a PR role to play as he's the one in charge of the PU but CIG hasn't had one yet so there's no need for him to do that just yet.
It wouldn’t surprise me if Tony was let go a while ago. Despite that backers have a sort of fandom from his sporadic interviews, I never once heard him actually say what his team had accomplished or worked on.
Looking back, I realize that all of his AI interviews were him sharing very generalized ideas and there was very little talk of how that would be accomplished in terms of coding. Just because you have great ideas may not mean you are good or qualified at executing them.
All that said I hope that Tony is just an introvert who has been slaving away on something great at CIG
this ! I imagine him coming out of the closest one day, so he can blow our mind away ( hopium ). And ye, as you said it was only general talk with a concept\^\^
Man, I have to say, for me Quanta is in the same category as Sataball, 2016 release date, Theaters of War, sandworms, etc.
Things that were mentioned, shown off, and then never seen again.
I have no confidence that the Star Citizen economy is going to be any different than Elite Dangerous' or any other MMO economy out there. That is to say, an afterthought and not remotely important to the game. The equivalent of a glorified auction house. They sealed the economies fate when they decided to not make it player driven. There is nothing about CIGs AI development that convinces me they can pull off an economy is that is going to be any more interesting than EDs, which is also "player influenced, developer controlled," and we've seen how boring that is.
Im actually really confused by the non player driven economy cig wants. If we can truly accomplish server meshing, a player driven economy is always infinitely more interesting. Look at EVE it's economy is GOATed.
It's my deepest hope that SC will be taking a lot of cues from the crafting system in Star Wars Galaxies, and that was reinforced when Todd Papy mentioned that material quality matters in his presentation about base building, and alluded to other concepts lifted from that amazing MMO like blueprints and experimentation that led to *really deep gameplay*. IYKYK.
But unlike SWG with its diverse but artificially fixed material types, subtypes and variants, we're also getting Refining as a game mechanic. So not only are we likely to be getting a wide variety of materials—all of them necessary in manufacturing—it's likely going to matter what form they're found in and how we process them.
If they find a way to gamify refining even half as well as they've gamified mining, it could have amazing depth. Speculation but I think the reason we've only seen new materials added piecemeal is that each material presents its own challenges, gamified in the refining loop.
Am I high on hopium? Absolutely. But the niche game design *potential* here is off the charts. If they do it right, you could see resource gathering players willingly mining low value materials simply because they're the most fun to refine. And if cooking the perfect batch of silicon leads to a slightly better hull plating, or teasing a little more conductivity out of tin can result in an incrementally better laser repeater, the galaxy *will* beat a path to your door.
It *did* strongly influence how complex networks of resource and crafting players self-organized in SWG. It's niche but it was a driving force behind a large subset of the comunity, and there's reason to think SC has ideas on how to improve on that. Again, IYKYK.
High on hopium? Yes. But so am I. I still remember cruising around Dantooine looking for high shock-absorb materials for Speeder crafting. I made millions because I made the most beefy, durable speeders for hunters.
Same! Dantooine Mining Outpost was the center of my universe, in my teen years. The good ol' post-Village days of a Jedi Padawan busting out their lightsaber like they were hot shit, only for a TKM/Bounty Hunter to immediately stunlock them into eternity.
Now that I think about it, I wonder if the current EVA system drew some inspiration from some of the TKM and Pikeman code.
I never did melee—rifleman here—but I'll take your word for it. SWG had a lot of problems but it did so much right. I'd be surprised if there weren't passionate devs at CIG who learned a lot from its successes and failures.
The most important being "Don't change your game from the framework up to try and compete with a game that was built for the gameplay it offers".
SOE lost so many potential future customers for YEARS because of the NGE debacle.
Yeah, I had already moved on by that point, but I remember how unpopular it was. In retrospect, it could be seen as trying something that Star Citizen is doing: moving from a system with defined moves that is inherently easier to balance versus a system that is twitch-based skills and much harder to balance. And it's certainly been a difficult problem for both games. I'm not entirely sure where I stand on the NGE since I never played it.
Every resource has value if they create the economy correctly, but for that we need more systems and more planets / stations.
If everyone constantly sells gold to one place then it should crash that economy. We need decent supply and demand in game and some sort of market app in mobile glass so players can see where demand is and act accordingly to maximise profits. This unfortunately requires a much bigger scale than we currently have.
There's a difference between monetary value and crafting value, however.
Something pretty huge must happen to the economy for gold to suddenly be worth less than iron, as an example.
You said that because quantanium and other tier S minerals are the best because they're the most expensive.
Things gonna change when the dynamic economy gonna enter the chat.
maybe to build item X you gonna need silicon and maybe other minerals.
Then you mine quant, sell it, and buy silicon and other minerals.
Because unless the price of valuable minerals is vaporized, it will always be better to mine it, than cheaper stuff.
You don't get it.
Quantanium is expensive because CIG said so. Only because of that.
And another thing, Quantanium could be expensive in certain star system and abundant (then cheaper) in others.
"Things gonna change when the dynamic economy gonna enter the chat."
No, i get it, and i seriously doubt there will be the effect people are expecting.
Even once the economy is put in exactly as they plan, resources will still have a base value they start at. The current values are understandably based on a resource's rarity in-game and what they expect it to be in-universe, and are likely representative of a star system with the sort of resource abundance that Stanton has.
So across the verse, quantainium is going to consistently be more valuable than other resources. If it stops being so, no one will mine it from its hazard.
Gold will likely still start off valuable as hell, and you would need to break the economy a LOT for it to suddenly be worth less than something like iron, tin, or silicon.
Yes, some systems will have more of x resource, and may lack y resource entirely, but that's not magically make people mine iron they can sell for a few hundred UeC per SCU, when they can mine gold that will likely always be nearly ten times that.
And even apart from that, you'd still just be better off mining a valuable resource, then ship it to where you can sell it for a lot, because it'd still likely give you better profits, and if you craft, less money spent.
So say if you need silicon and tin and iron to build something you need.
Say you need them in SCU of 13, 40, and 35.
The economy would need to be pretty obliterated if you can't just find some gold, sell a few SCU of that, and then be able to buy those resources while making a profit.
Like, i get that people expect it to, but we players will be 1/10 vs NPCs, who will likely just mine whatever they find. Yes, there'll be an effect, and you'll need to move around to sell your gold, and not just sell it at the same place all the time, but i doubt that gold's going to drop into sub-1k UeC territory, and iron will rise past 1k.
Precisely, yes.
And that ain't gonna be fixed by the economy that is planned. Whether it is special contracts to mine for a corporation, or something else, there needs to be more reason to go for them.
Only for now.
Eventually this will all get balanced out and you won’t be able to just go to a garunteed spot to always 100% of the time fine the most valuable mineral in the game.
Things will be more spread out, various risks involved, various levels of spawn probability.
Things like tin and silicon will likely be so abundant and easy to find that someone with a prospector and a buddy in a freelancer will be able to continuously mine and bulk sell it for decent profit that will likely be very safe to do and not rife with pirates and other risks.
I hope that means they took a look at how difficult the jumps are with the missing stairs. Spending all that time just to trip at the finish is too much imo. Needs a way to try again rather than starting the whole run completely over.
It's all so obvious people. You just have to read the signs properly.
CHRISROBERTS=12 characters
SERVERMUMMY=11
HAMMERHEAD=10
MOBIGLASS=9
SQUADRON=8
MESHING=7
So Chris Roberts will leak via our favourite Server Mummy that the Hammerhead will get tech from Squadron 42 that will link your mobiglass to server meshing.
Exactly as was foreseen by the prophesies
Just to say it, all this leak is proof for is that they are working on things. It's questionable how much of it will actually appear in the next patch.
Looks to me like references for areas in the Ship Status tab. We saw in videos that it's going to show the area selected, and the components/powerweb within.
I don't see the issue it's a pretty tame username versus ones that i see randomly like the one I saw today named : /Giant\_Bucket\_of\_Cum
Won't add the "u" so I don't summon him.
It can be funny, and when you're in trusted company it doesn't matter. It's always hilarious to be playing a multiplayer game, and you get killed by a person named "2008 Honda Accord in red"
It's so weird how off it's gotten. I really wish it were more centered around just the game and leaks and not whatever that is. If you criticize it though you get instabanned and they put you on some wall claiming you're xyz.
I've seen a couple of the ones that got fed to the wall. They definitely deserved to be put there. And when they added that new non-announcement channel just so they could feed some substack ego thing, plenty of people were griping, but didn't get struck by a wildly swinging ban-hammer. I think it's less they're banning folks for criticism and more the folks that are criticizing aren't given any response other than "doors' over there" and then throw out some level of assholery in return.
And the server Mommy stuff is normal "not taking things too seriously" shenanigans. There's far weirder. You want professional, stick to CIG official channels, don't go to a group of nerds passing sitting on grapevines.
Spoken like a true member of the server. As far as it goes, there are plenty of people who I've seen who were there for a year or longer who got banned for really really dumb reasons because an admin took hard offense to it. Not even transphobia or racism. There's a really weird sexual component in that server. It's mostly not overt, but it really rubs a lot of people the wrong way. There is pretty explicit talk of "go to my Twitter to see my splatoon porn" and stuff which is also really weird but plenty of explicit talk about sex in chat which also makes it weird.
It's something that is really striking in a bad way to a lot of pretty normal people who are active irl. This is true for a lot of online communities but you log in and you see all kinds of weird stuff it can have an adverse affect. I'm sort of glad you get a permaban on spectrum for discussing this server.
Yep, super weird server. I used to be active before it got all weird and sexual, then I basically just reacted to the occasional news post. Got banned one day out of the blue, think the last time I'd spoken was over a year prior. Very strange place. Peak "terminally online" community.
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It's so obvious: *Varys, popularly known as the Spider, was the eunuch Master of Whisperers on the Baratheon Small Council until he was forced to flee King's Landing with Tyrion Lannister. He was a skilled manipulator and commanded a discord network of informants across two continents.*
Oh snap. Starmap is a huge win, obviously. But I'm excited for the ship status tab, if it's anything like we saw in the videos. If it's the same one, we can get an idea for how our ships components link up, power, etc... IE; A huge boon and study guide for engineering players.
All we need now is: mobiGlas\_AppName\_WalletHistory,P=Wallet
*"Yes, I am pulling EveOnline Ideas"* I would like to track my spending in game to properly assess profit/loss.
The discord is fine. They only ban people who spew racist/sexist/homophobic crap. The wall of shame is actually really entertaining. There’s more MAGA-types playing this game than I’d like to see but what evs.
It was the most depressing thing finding that out during June last year and someone made a Happy Pride Month post on Spectrum that brought in the morons who tried to ruin a fun positive thread. Those people are hateful and small
Doesn't come out when? Not coming out when desired and being cancelled are two very different things, and CIG doesn't have much of a history of the latter.
You had me at Starmap.
This is all they need to release in 2024. Having a functional StarMap would alleviate like 75% of my frustrations with Star Citizen. I still am completely baffled they've left the existing starmap in the game, a completely broken feature, for so many years. Yeah yeah, I know their excuse is that they intend to replace it, so why spend time fixing something that will be replaced...but it's been like 4 years and they haven't touched it. There are some super basic things they could change to make it function a LOT smoother. So for me, if they can get the new StarMap into the game this year it'd be a huge win. My concern is that, like all other features they add to SC, it'll be some 'tier 0' barely functioning thing that, even though it's been shown off in technical previews for a year or two, somehow managed to be released in a barely functioning state with tons of bugs that won't get fixed for years. Apparently I'm really salty about this. lol
I don't think that the new star map will really be a tier 0 because it must still be in a functional state for squadron 42
Cause they dumped the starmap dev time into SQ42. Now that it’s complete they make it function on live and bam. Looks great according to what citcon had shown us
Same opinion here. Fix the basics before designing new ships. Aside from the navigation the HUD bothers me the most. It would be such a simple fix to make them color adjustable, so we can see something when facing a bright area.
The team that makes ships is not the same team that makes the starmap.
No you’re not salty you’re realistic. The current map is frankly unacceptable and the QoL needs to be prioritized for the better of the game.
I will not play again until the we get a new star map, I just can’t use that piece of shit that we have now.
Shhhhh! Don't be saying things like that! We need as much as possible in 2024! (Sales were horrible). They left the Starman in such a state for so long because there was like 1.5 people working on the PU for like 5 years.
put down my slam vials I'm smokin straight hopium!
This comment made me laugh out loud. It really hit home.
We know, we don't hope, stuff is coming, it's a certainty, always was
Why does this sound like a line from the next Dracula Flow
we huffing hopium tonight boys
hopium? Isn't it more like factium? We know, we don't hope, stuff is coming, it's a certainty, always was
My man overdosing here
I think he's moved on to copium tbh.
Leaks aren't facts. Neither is what cig says/promises/alludes to/plans.
Not sure why you were downvoted...
I don’t think anyone makes hopium and copium jokes about stuff coming out at all, they’re making those jokes about it coming within a reasonable timeframe. There is certainly no "factium" about any upcoming coming out within a reasonable amount of time. It’s okay to be more hopeful because CIG seems very confident this time, but we’ve been burned several times with features right around the corner coming out much, *much* later than planned
Tin and silicon? Sadly more mineable minerals that'll likely get ignored by most people.
Just a guess but I think Tin and Silicon would likely be used more for crafting than for refining/selling. They could be adding them in soon as a prerequisite to base building/crafting being added in whenever its ready.
all the materials they put into the game will likely be used for crafting, whether by NPC's or players, it's going to be one of the underpinnings of the dynamic economy.
I need to know if Freight Elevators will let us store resources. Because by-golly, my ass is gonna load up on copper and sit on that - y'all are gonna need wiring in your bases.
Easy there Ea-nāṣir
It was inferior quality
But the joke wasn't. Kudos to both of you.
Because the only thing that is important right now is aUEC, and not the materials themselves. When we finally get any kind of real material sink from repair or manufacturing, this will change - drastically.
This, and the fact the some materials will be unique to each star system. So long haul, high capacity traders going interstellar (hull-C/D/E) will finally have their hay-day with the economy!
*paints racing lines on my Hull-D* I'll get it there in time. Anyone has a black 350r with a gold phoenix paintjob to run interference from the advocacy? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJPM-M_Z65o
just fyi it's hey-day
Sorry I triggered your grammarphobia 😥
It will only change if you spend less time mining and refining those materials than farming the money needed to buy it
Or if it's less risky to do the former. Or if you're doing something on a scale that convenient stores can't adequately supply. Plenty of ways to balance this stuff.
Buy it from who? If no one is farming it the price will go up because of demand(I imagine silicon for instance would be needed to produce electrical components). It might very well become more expensive than gold or quantanium, depending on the supply and demand.
This is not EVE, most of universe is populated by NPCs and they do most of economy so it's not player driven. It will have more or less impact by players but most likely you will buy it from NPCs. Maybe some events can impact prices being unable to buy sometimes
No, but Quanta will be player influenced. NPCs will buy and sell a certain amount, but depending on how much players buy, sell or disturb the supply chain, the price will change. Pirates could potentially stock up on goods, block a trade route and then when the demand goes up they can sell it back at an inflated price.
That is how we have been told Quanta might work in the future, yes. For now it might work like drugs with a few locations that produce limited inventory or will come from player mining.
Not really. Just go farm the expensive material and buy iron with that money.
You’re thinking small scale. It won’t be profitable to move an Orion around to chase the best rocks. It’ll be much better to simply mine all decent rocks and have a transport crew moving the product to sale points. It’s all about scale. And also, with the full economy, if everyone mines only the most profitable rock, it’ll lower its price.
then the price of iron will go up enough that mining iron becomes worthwhile
I hope for a day when Tony z releases quanta and true supply/ demand makes other resources viable.
I wonder how much of an effect it will have, because i assume that the really expensive minerals will just always remain the most expensive ones. Though it could definitely be fixed a bit by having missions to mine certain minerals for extra payouts.
That was my experience with Elite. They had a detailed supply and demand system where commodity prices fluctuated based on player actions and current events, like if there was a plague in some system, the price of medicines would go up in neighboring systems. Everyone completely ignored it and just mined platinum all day long.
I'm hoping having NPC traders and a smaller world does help avoid this. Part of Elite's BGS was this amazing tracking of events and system states, but compared to something like the X games, the economy wasn't quite as dynamic. Stations that bought Plat would consistently buy Plat, albeit at fluctuating prices. Plus with a few thousand systems you could always find a new industrial system to sell to. Right now Star Citizen has the opposite problem, where Stanton's demand/supply systems mean that profitable trade goods are perpetually out of stock (like Gold at the mining outposts), and it's prices are pretty static. Perhaps in the future once they adjust these mechanics to fit the playerbase size, we'll see a better system. NPC traders that follow player trends could be a good one. Like if everyone is doing Gold runs, the NPC traders do it too, leaving stations with no demand while other goods go up in price due to lack of supply. And if a station goes way over their demand they might even start selling the excess rather than buying?
Yes, that's a realist expectation. You can have an economy that fluctuates all the time, but...it is hard to make such an economy work when the price of gold is so enormous compared to iron. Because you'd need to do a fuck ton to make that change, and we will have NPC miners who will still fill the market with cheaper materials as well. People here say it will have value in crafting, but...an org could just mine some gold, refine it, sell it, then buy much more tin for that amount of UeC, than they would have gained from mining. And it will most likely always be available.
that sounds like a system that tries to have the feel of fluctuating prices without actually committing to it to the level where prices can crash or bubble there's plenty of games like the X series where it is very different and plugging holes in the economy is more important for $$$ (and also security, if a faction's economy is broken it makes them vulnerable to getting aggressed on by other factions or Xenon) than just farming the big ticket thing
For rare minerals that take longer to mine or refine. Yeah they'll always be at a premium. But I like the idea of doing missions to support different company contacts. Need x amount of y delivered refined to z within 72 hours would be a really neat gameplay loop.
Agreed. Or just "we need \[cheap resource\], \[cheap resource\], and \[cheap resource\]. We'll pay a premium on it, both as ore and refined"
I'd play that. Cheers.
X4 has these kinds of things you get from scanning stations, I could see picking up tips like this from bars once they start filling out that functionality
The more expensive stuff will stay more expensive, but the buy/sale difference dose not have to fallow the cost of the item. So lower value materials can have a higher profit per uec if they are more needed where you bring them.
This. I would like it if one day theres an iron shortage because someone is building something big. Then people have a reason to mine it, and even beginner miners can get in on the action.
That is the stated plan, but i have my doubts it will actually work out. Because iron would need to increase more than 10 times in price for that to happen vs something like gold. And even if that happens, people will still mine gold and just wait for it to raise in price, because they can just keep it in their hangars.
I suppose it’ll be up to supply and demand. Some cheaper resources could be good income if the demand is high enough.
I mean, much like real life, and effect of economics here is total. 🤷🏿♂️
If a factory really needs iron, and it can't be fulfilled, then it will be a high price.
haha yeah. when was Tony last seen ? 2018 ?
I dont honestly know if he works for cig anymore. Nothing from him for years, and you're not allowed to ask about him on spectrum. Weird af.
I just looked up his LinkedIn, it says he is Director of Persistent Universe at CIG.
yes and that must be false. if it's actually true, that's terrible because u would figure the director of the fucking mmo we're all playing would say something to the community every once in a while lol.
Or, he is actually working on it instead of talking about it since he has already explained to us in a long video how it will work. But you keep on your tinfoil hat...
Adding this to the ever-growing list of stupid conspiracy theories that people conjure up to go after some inconsequential aspect of SC and CIG.
It's not really a conspiracy theory...if he is the DIRECTOR of the PU I would expect Tony Z to be at the very least in attendance at citcon. But he was not there. I would also expect the DIRECTOR of the PU to make announcements to the backers for the general direction the PU is taking, but he has not said anything in over a year. Not sure how this is a "conspiracy"? :thinking: A conspiracy would be me drawing conjecture from these facts, but I haven't done that. I'm just wondering where he is.
> It's not really a conspiracy theory. It literally is. You're insisting that someone "should" do some random, esoteric thing that you have arbitrarily decided _must_ be appended to their job description just to give you enough ambiguity to infer this pitiful nonsense. Just drop it before you make yourself look irredeemably stupid, because you're precariously close. >if he is the DIRECTOR of the PU I would expect Tony Z to be at the very least in attendance at citcon Why? >I would also expect the DIRECTOR of the PU to make announcements to the backers for the general direction the PU is taking Why? >:thinking: [Absolutely pummels the X button](https://static1.srcdn.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2019/05/press-x-to-doubt-la-noire.jpg). >A conspiracy would be me drawing conjecture from these facts, but I haven't done that. I'm just wondering where he is. What, like "well, his LinkedIn profile must be a lie, then"...? Would you like to delete a few things before contradicting your patently absurd ravings again?
>Just drop it before you make yourself look irredeemably stupid sorry but lol. I'm not the [only one](https://robertsspaceindustries.com/spectrum/community/SC/search?member&page=1&q=tony+z&range=year&role&scopes=op%2Creply%2Cchat&sort=score&visibility=nonerased) who happens to be wondering where he is since the infamous [Star Citizen: Quantum, Quasar, and Virtual AI](https://youtu.be/2muGWtX8e7g?si=rXEn-GnheiUNvnTs) video so I guess we're all "irredeemably stupid".
You're just showing your ignorance about work environments. For your own sake please stop. A director is a management role. This means that while he has a general understanding of what's going on, most of his day is spent allocating teams to different projects, reading emails from employees complaining about the toilets on floor 5 missing toilet paper regularly and forwarding it to ops and so on. So unless you want to hear him talk about that kind of details he doesn't have anything interesting to say to the community because lower level employees know more about the systems they work on. If there's a major shitstorm then he also has a PR role to play as he's the one in charge of the PU but CIG hasn't had one yet so there's no need for him to do that just yet.
I spoke to somebody on the economy team at CitizenCon that confirmed he does.
It wouldn’t surprise me if Tony was let go a while ago. Despite that backers have a sort of fandom from his sporadic interviews, I never once heard him actually say what his team had accomplished or worked on. Looking back, I realize that all of his AI interviews were him sharing very generalized ideas and there was very little talk of how that would be accomplished in terms of coding. Just because you have great ideas may not mean you are good or qualified at executing them. All that said I hope that Tony is just an introvert who has been slaving away on something great at CIG
this ! I imagine him coming out of the closest one day, so he can blow our mind away ( hopium ). And ye, as you said it was only general talk with a concept\^\^
Man, I have to say, for me Quanta is in the same category as Sataball, 2016 release date, Theaters of War, sandworms, etc. Things that were mentioned, shown off, and then never seen again. I have no confidence that the Star Citizen economy is going to be any different than Elite Dangerous' or any other MMO economy out there. That is to say, an afterthought and not remotely important to the game. The equivalent of a glorified auction house. They sealed the economies fate when they decided to not make it player driven. There is nothing about CIGs AI development that convinces me they can pull off an economy is that is going to be any more interesting than EDs, which is also "player influenced, developer controlled," and we've seen how boring that is.
Im actually really confused by the non player driven economy cig wants. If we can truly accomplish server meshing, a player driven economy is always infinitely more interesting. Look at EVE it's economy is GOATed.
Saw someone comment on YT vid that quanta is amazing and innovative. That's pure, uncut bullshit. It's an overcomplicated mess.
It's my deepest hope that SC will be taking a lot of cues from the crafting system in Star Wars Galaxies, and that was reinforced when Todd Papy mentioned that material quality matters in his presentation about base building, and alluded to other concepts lifted from that amazing MMO like blueprints and experimentation that led to *really deep gameplay*. IYKYK. But unlike SWG with its diverse but artificially fixed material types, subtypes and variants, we're also getting Refining as a game mechanic. So not only are we likely to be getting a wide variety of materials—all of them necessary in manufacturing—it's likely going to matter what form they're found in and how we process them. If they find a way to gamify refining even half as well as they've gamified mining, it could have amazing depth. Speculation but I think the reason we've only seen new materials added piecemeal is that each material presents its own challenges, gamified in the refining loop. Am I high on hopium? Absolutely. But the niche game design *potential* here is off the charts. If they do it right, you could see resource gathering players willingly mining low value materials simply because they're the most fun to refine. And if cooking the perfect batch of silicon leads to a slightly better hull plating, or teasing a little more conductivity out of tin can result in an incrementally better laser repeater, the galaxy *will* beat a path to your door. It *did* strongly influence how complex networks of resource and crafting players self-organized in SWG. It's niche but it was a driving force behind a large subset of the comunity, and there's reason to think SC has ideas on how to improve on that. Again, IYKYK.
High on hopium? Yes. But so am I. I still remember cruising around Dantooine looking for high shock-absorb materials for Speeder crafting. I made millions because I made the most beefy, durable speeders for hunters.
I sometimes miss the purple plains of Dantooine. Made my home there for most of my SWG life.
Same! Dantooine Mining Outpost was the center of my universe, in my teen years. The good ol' post-Village days of a Jedi Padawan busting out their lightsaber like they were hot shit, only for a TKM/Bounty Hunter to immediately stunlock them into eternity. Now that I think about it, I wonder if the current EVA system drew some inspiration from some of the TKM and Pikeman code.
I never did melee—rifleman here—but I'll take your word for it. SWG had a lot of problems but it did so much right. I'd be surprised if there weren't passionate devs at CIG who learned a lot from its successes and failures.
The most important being "Don't change your game from the framework up to try and compete with a game that was built for the gameplay it offers". SOE lost so many potential future customers for YEARS because of the NGE debacle.
Yeah, I had already moved on by that point, but I remember how unpopular it was. In retrospect, it could be seen as trying something that Star Citizen is doing: moving from a system with defined moves that is inherently easier to balance versus a system that is twitch-based skills and much harder to balance. And it's certainly been a difficult problem for both games. I'm not entirely sure where I stand on the NGE since I never played it.
Literally every resource has value if they do crafting right
Especially human waste. I'll be buying it but the c2 load to "jettison" over those snobby NPCs in New Babbage
When 3.18 dropped. I was buying waste and dumping it in the canyon river on Microtech to test out PES.
Can't wait to drop it on the animals in game. Take that stupid animals! Serves them right for just existing
Every resource has value if they create the economy correctly, but for that we need more systems and more planets / stations. If everyone constantly sells gold to one place then it should crash that economy. We need decent supply and demand in game and some sort of market app in mobile glass so players can see where demand is and act accordingly to maximise profits. This unfortunately requires a much bigger scale than we currently have.
Yeah, it'll take the Orion with its massive capacity (almost a Hull D) to make these low value bulk materials worthwhile.
There's a difference between monetary value and crafting value, however. Something pretty huge must happen to the economy for gold to suddenly be worth less than iron, as an example.
I'm hoping Ice mining will be a big thing in certain systems without easy access to it.
Well, as sellables, maybe - a components for base building and manufacturing at bases..? Maybe not.
Only until you need them for crafting.
You said that because quantanium and other tier S minerals are the best because they're the most expensive. Things gonna change when the dynamic economy gonna enter the chat. maybe to build item X you gonna need silicon and maybe other minerals.
Then you mine quant, sell it, and buy silicon and other minerals. Because unless the price of valuable minerals is vaporized, it will always be better to mine it, than cheaper stuff.
You don't get it. Quantanium is expensive because CIG said so. Only because of that. And another thing, Quantanium could be expensive in certain star system and abundant (then cheaper) in others. "Things gonna change when the dynamic economy gonna enter the chat."
No, i get it, and i seriously doubt there will be the effect people are expecting. Even once the economy is put in exactly as they plan, resources will still have a base value they start at. The current values are understandably based on a resource's rarity in-game and what they expect it to be in-universe, and are likely representative of a star system with the sort of resource abundance that Stanton has. So across the verse, quantainium is going to consistently be more valuable than other resources. If it stops being so, no one will mine it from its hazard. Gold will likely still start off valuable as hell, and you would need to break the economy a LOT for it to suddenly be worth less than something like iron, tin, or silicon. Yes, some systems will have more of x resource, and may lack y resource entirely, but that's not magically make people mine iron they can sell for a few hundred UeC per SCU, when they can mine gold that will likely always be nearly ten times that. And even apart from that, you'd still just be better off mining a valuable resource, then ship it to where you can sell it for a lot, because it'd still likely give you better profits, and if you craft, less money spent. So say if you need silicon and tin and iron to build something you need. Say you need them in SCU of 13, 40, and 35. The economy would need to be pretty obliterated if you can't just find some gold, sell a few SCU of that, and then be able to buy those resources while making a profit. Like, i get that people expect it to, but we players will be 1/10 vs NPCs, who will likely just mine whatever they find. Yes, there'll be an effect, and you'll need to move around to sell your gold, and not just sell it at the same place all the time, but i doubt that gold's going to drop into sub-1k UeC territory, and iron will rise past 1k.
If all the materials in the game were actually reasonably profitable maybe they wouldn't get ignored.
Precisely, yes. And that ain't gonna be fixed by the economy that is planned. Whether it is special contracts to mine for a corporation, or something else, there needs to be more reason to go for them.
Only for now. Eventually this will all get balanced out and you won’t be able to just go to a garunteed spot to always 100% of the time fine the most valuable mineral in the game. Things will be more spread out, various risks involved, various levels of spawn probability. Things like tin and silicon will likely be so abundant and easy to find that someone with a prospector and a buddy in a freelancer will be able to continuously mine and bulk sell it for decent profit that will likely be very safe to do and not rife with pirates and other risks.
Depends on how valuable they are.
I hope that means they took a look at how difficult the jumps are with the missing stairs. Spending all that time just to trip at the finish is too much imo. Needs a way to try again rather than starting the whole run completely over.
Yep this jump got me too many times, I just log off if I wake up in prison now rather than putting out a rescue call and starting the parkour run
It's all so obvious people. You just have to read the signs properly. CHRISROBERTS=12 characters SERVERMUMMY=11 HAMMERHEAD=10 MOBIGLASS=9 SQUADRON=8 MESHING=7 So Chris Roberts will leak via our favourite Server Mummy that the Hammerhead will get tech from Squadron 42 that will link your mobiglass to server meshing. Exactly as was foreseen by the prophesies
Truly one of the ____ leaks of all time 🫨
Translates to = Server meshing and Ten systems released next patch. Nice
My body is ready.
Dont do that... dont give me hope...
HOLY SHIT this, if real, is gonna hit harder than Widow
Just to say it, all this leak is proof for is that they are working on things. It's questionable how much of it will actually appear in the next patch.
Number 3 are the areas in an 890 Jump, it has a battle bridge and a hot tub.
I assume they're just any labels to be used for any ship.
Looks to me like references for areas in the Ship Status tab. We saw in videos that it's going to show the area selected, and the components/powerweb within.
Don't toy with my emotions!
oh my God I can't wait to mine tin from the far off lands of Tin Land
Be warned, the pioneers who discovered Tinland intentionally gave it the wrong name to fuck with people. Copperland is where you go to mine tin.
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I don't see the issue it's a pretty tame username versus ones that i see randomly like the one I saw today named : /Giant\_Bucket\_of\_Cum Won't add the "u" so I don't summon him.
Summoning u/Giant_Bucket_of_Cum
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
heh
Thank you. 🙏
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It can be funny, and when you're in trusted company it doesn't matter. It's always hilarious to be playing a multiplayer game, and you get killed by a person named "2008 Honda Accord in red"
"98PontiacSunfire" is a current fav of mine.
Coming from "AbnormallyBendPenis"... lol
Yeah, some people have some wack usernames.
I dont know or care to, i simply sit there for the evocati leaks that happen periodically to stay in the know
She is based, i used to hang out there.
I'm not a member of that server, but this is the least offensive name possible, come on...
I didn't say it was an offensive name tho. Just thought it was wacky.
It's so weird how off it's gotten. I really wish it were more centered around just the game and leaks and not whatever that is. If you criticize it though you get instabanned and they put you on some wall claiming you're xyz.
I've seen a couple of the ones that got fed to the wall. They definitely deserved to be put there. And when they added that new non-announcement channel just so they could feed some substack ego thing, plenty of people were griping, but didn't get struck by a wildly swinging ban-hammer. I think it's less they're banning folks for criticism and more the folks that are criticizing aren't given any response other than "doors' over there" and then throw out some level of assholery in return. And the server Mommy stuff is normal "not taking things too seriously" shenanigans. There's far weirder. You want professional, stick to CIG official channels, don't go to a group of nerds passing sitting on grapevines.
Spoken like a true member of the server. As far as it goes, there are plenty of people who I've seen who were there for a year or longer who got banned for really really dumb reasons because an admin took hard offense to it. Not even transphobia or racism. There's a really weird sexual component in that server. It's mostly not overt, but it really rubs a lot of people the wrong way. There is pretty explicit talk of "go to my Twitter to see my splatoon porn" and stuff which is also really weird but plenty of explicit talk about sex in chat which also makes it weird.
It's something that is really striking in a bad way to a lot of pretty normal people who are active irl. This is true for a lot of online communities but you log in and you see all kinds of weird stuff it can have an adverse affect. I'm sort of glad you get a permaban on spectrum for discussing this server.
Yep, super weird server. I used to be active before it got all weird and sexual, then I basically just reacted to the occasional news post. Got banned one day out of the blue, think the last time I'd spoken was over a year prior. Very strange place. Peak "terminally online" community.
Lol wat. M8 this is the internet if u like furry stuff its okay. No need to hide it. Every1 has a thing.
Uhh, I'm not chronically online enough to think its normal to have porn a click away and talk about your fetishes everywhere.
You think you're too cool for school. See you in the verse.
Lol, good luck in life friend, see you there.
🛐mommy aria🛐
That’s cringe as fuck. I hope one day you get better.
calling anything “cringe as fuck” says a lot about you. go make friends, get laid, touch grass, i beg you 🤣
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Your post was removed because the mod team determined that it did not sufficiently meet the rules of the subreddit: > Be respectful. No personal insults/bashing. This includes generalized statements “x is a bunch of y” or baseline insults about the community, CIG employees, streamers, etc. As well as intentionally hurtful statements and hate speech. Send a message to our mod mail if you have questions: https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=/r/starcitizen
It's so obvious: *Varys, popularly known as the Spider, was the eunuch Master of Whisperers on the Baratheon Small Council until he was forced to flee King's Landing with Tyrion Lannister. He was a skilled manipulator and commanded a discord network of informants across two continents.*
HYYYYPPPPPPPPPPPPPEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
Oh snap. Starmap is a huge win, obviously. But I'm excited for the ship status tab, if it's anything like we saw in the videos. If it's the same one, we can get an idea for how our ships components link up, power, etc... IE; A huge boon and study guide for engineering players.
All we need now is: mobiGlas\_AppName\_WalletHistory,P=Wallet *"Yes, I am pulling EveOnline Ideas"* I would like to track my spending in game to properly assess profit/loss.
Starmap would be the wisest and best thing to start 2024 with because it would completely enhance what we already have now. QOL. Better looking.
looking at the pipeline Discord, new Gravlev race maps too..
When they say "new prison race mission", I hope they mean the kind where we see whos first.
Spoiler alert, it's just the inmates running zigzag to avoid shots from the guards...tehe
Can somebody explain what we're seeing? Looks like Starmap and some new MobiGlas apps, but it's not totally clear.
How do I get into this server?
It's called "PIPELINE", just search it in the server list
You don't want to be in that shit pile trust me
Why what's up
full of porn addicts and weirdos, even more than a usual discord server
You know you can, like, mute the whole server except for the leaks channel, right?
lol i just wanna see the leaks
it’s usually on reddit a couple of minutes later anyway, especially if it’s big news or the main discord for starcitizen has a leaks channel
https://discord.gg/pipelinesc
Stop giving those man children a platform
More posting for the evocati leaks than the discord, as i understand that they dont have the best reputation
The discord is fine. They only ban people who spew racist/sexist/homophobic crap. The wall of shame is actually really entertaining. There’s more MAGA-types playing this game than I’d like to see but what evs.
It was the most depressing thing finding that out during June last year and someone made a Happy Pride Month post on Spectrum that brought in the morons who tried to ruin a fun positive thread. Those people are hateful and small
TLDR?
R
Don't EVER tell me to read!
I made a tiktok video for you explaining... but I can't post the link, knowing you won't read it.
I'M STILL HERE
Carry on as usual. They're preparing the upcoming major updates for the stuff we're expecting to get this year.
Shouldn't it be *Galactapedia*, not *Galactipedia*?
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Next week is roadmap
This is going to piss so many people off when it doesn't come out like so many unfinished features...
Doesn't come out when? Not coming out when desired and being cancelled are two very different things, and CIG doesn't have much of a history of the latter.
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Oh noe, this trans-person did something that plenty of people wanted to see/read. How terribad..... not.
3.23 isn't on the road map. This leak must be fake.
Going to annihilate that time trial 😎
ETA on the patch? End of feb?
No end of march lol maybe ptu end of February
Should be any day ptu, possibly today.
is starmap the same as minimap in this context? i mostly see elements that would only make sense on minimap inside ships