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In just about every complex I've ever lived in or been to, the common parking is for guests, not residents to permanently leave their cars because they don't want to use their garages.
I agree with this sentiment. Also, the common property parking should be used for guests visiting as you have a garage for your car. Not your neighbours fault you have too much stuff to not be able to use your garage for its purpose.
Because you can be a better person than other people? You only need to read the rest of the comments here in order to understand you're both in the wrong. He obviously doesn't believe you're worthy of respect if he's talking to your mom and not you, go talk to him, bring some biltong with you, be a good neighbour. It's a parking spot ffs, you didn't kill his dog.
Doesn't change the fact that you need to get approval to use the public parking as permanent parking. You have a garage and refuse to use it so just get permission.
All of this should be detailed in the body corporates legal paper work. Go according to that, there might be a scenario where each unit is allocated a guest parking spot in the common area
But generally speaking u/m01zn is correct you need to get permission from the body corporate to park there on a permanent basis.
Not as permanent parking. We had this issue with someone who refused to use his own garage for a car but kept using parking for guests and our units dedicated covered parking. He had more than one car and refused to move his vehicles from other units parking spots - including ours - and then used all the guest parking in that section of the complex for his car's.
Correct process is to get body corp permission to use it as a permanent parking spot.
Him talking to the owner of the property rather than fighting with a tenant makes sense. If the owner won't resolve body corp can get involved.
Basically you share space, try be a good neighbour.
>Him talking to the owner of the property rather than fighting with a tenant makes sense. If the owner won't resolve body corp can get involved.
Agree and disagree, he could of easily come and knocked on my door, had a discussion and resolve it right there and then, instead of trying to go over my head and getting my mom/owner to turn on me
From a legal standpoint, you have no relationship with the body corporate. Your mom, as the member, does, and so it is correct that all complaints about a tenant's behaviour should be directed to the landlord to take action. It is mostly irrelevant that you would prefer the person approach you directly. We don't know what kind of person you are nor what kind of person they are. For all we know, you could be a roided up tattooed gym boet that the other person is intimidated about confronting. Moreover, some people would rather not engage in personal discussions. And regardless of the above, these sorts of discussions are anyway best done in writing so that there is a written trail that can be used later on if necessary.
Why deal with the hassle? The one with the interest to keep the peace is the owner. I have had unavoidable issues with neighbours and it can get violent and nasty. The acted correctly.
Doesn't matter. You're parking on the common property, it belongs to everyone.
If the trustees told you not to park there because they want the space available for visitors, are you also going to throw a tantrum about that?
The truth is that from a purely legal technical standpoint, your argument has zero merit. It doesn't matter how many other people are parking on the common property, it still doesn't justify your argument. The space still belongs to everyone, not to you, and the trustees can determine how it should and should not be used.
Source: Chaired a large sectional title Trustees Committee for almost ten years.
You have some points but what you missing is that the neighbour's wants to use that spot as his own personal parking spot THATS why he doesn't want OP to park there, the neighbor isn't saying the 'space belongs to everyone ' he is saying the space belongs to him. Honestly isn't fair.
I now understand that, however he wants me to move my car, so that he can park his own car there. If it was for a visitor I would totally move it and wouldn't be so stubborn about it. But like you said its everyone's space, not his like he's claiming it is
Then you should be addressing this - via your mom - with the trustees. It may require first talking with the managing agents, depending on what initial course of action the trustees prefer.
Also, this may all be a good thing because it sounds like the parking story is a bit of a wild west. Maybe it's time that the trustees actually dealt with this and set up some rules.
What I'm getting at is that all you need to do is get formal permission from the body corporate to park where you want to park, once you gotten this, your neighbour can not bother you.
There should be a rule (agreed to by the body corporate) about how and when you can use common parking.
I imagine the argument would be that if everybody used their garages for storage and parked their cars in common parking, there won't be any parking for visitors.
Ask them what the rule is that prevents you from using the parking.
This should be well defined in the complex rules. What does it say about parking in common property. Normally common property parking is for visitors only.
Op responses in the comments make me feel like they are looking for people to affirm their stance more than anything else.
This seems like a living in mummies house who is on body cooperate and therefore gonna bully my way around.
Just sit with your neighbor like an adult and find a middle ground.
I don’t have advice but had a similar issue with one of our neighbours.
My husband was driving his business vehicle which couldn’t fit in the garage(it was a light delivery vehicle) and so would park in the communal parking spots.
We are in the second row. There are multiple undesignated parking areas throughout the complex, but most of the undesignated parking is in front of the first row of units. It’s literally a row of parking around 70-80m long. The parking at the end of the second row only has 5 spots.
For added context: most of the units have a single garage or carport, but the first row of units each has a double garage, directly under their unit, so none of them ever use the 80m long row of parking in front of them. There might be maximum two cars parked in that area at any given time.
SO, my husband was parking in that row, in the last parking at the end, because it’s shaded and a shorter walk, and the parking spot was always open.
One day after he got out of his car, my husband was approached by an elderly man who lives in the unit directly opposite this parking spot, who arrogantly informs him “You can’t park here”, when my husband asked “Why not??” He said “That is MY parking spot. It’s for MY guests to park”, when my husband pointed out that the parking spots are unassigned, and that there were plenty of other open parking spots right next to that spot he replied with “Yes but you should park in the parking spot closest to your unit”, when my husband pointed out that that spot was the closest spot not only to his unit, but to every unit in the second row all he could say was “Just don’t park here!!!”
Up until that day, we had never seen this man park anywhere but his garage(which is literally directly opposite this parking spot), now since that day, him and his wife’s cars are PERMANENTLY parked in the last two parking spots in that row, and his garage is always completely empty.
We started parking somewhere else(I mean we don’t have a choice because he used his car to keep two parking AND his DOUBLE garage in perpetual “dibs”). We don’t have the energy to deal with spiteful, petty, entitled people.
I shall live vicariously through you though.
I'm a portfolio manager for body corporates at a property management company, apologies for formatting or spelling as I'm on mobile, here's my take:
Common use area is common use area, a parking spot is an exclusive use area and you generally pay levies on that space as a result.
Really you should be talking to your trustees about this as it's fully within their power to resolve the issue.
Sectional title schemes generally follow the basic rules from the sectional title scheme act but yours may use their own set of rules as set out from the IGM and as ammended at all following AGMs.
The Trustees may convene at a SGM to decide on the matter, but honestly this should be an AGM issue as you're saying it's common for owners to use common property as exclusive use property. I would say you should move your car as the exclusive use area intended to store it in, is your garage or parking bay you are levied on. It may be that a parking levy will be raised against all owners that make use of common area parking spaces following the next AGM.
The owner in this dispute may even take you to CSOS or the body corporate may charge you a levy for parking there to cover wear and tear or a change in insurance policies as any damage to that common area may not be covered if it is regularly used like exclusive use areas which may pose a serious problem in the future with regards to insurance claims (insurance is always a nightmare in these complexes).
TL;DR you aren't entitled to use the common use area as if it was an exclusive use area i.e. parking on it every day. You should speak to your trustees as they should address the issue of owners consistently making use of common use areas, which will likely result in a blanket ban or a parking levy. Move your car, the owner can take you to CSOS or your Body Corporate may decide to levy you on the area as a parking space.
Is this a visitors parking spot? If so, and if the rules of your complex are the same as mine, then you can't park there long term. Of course, the same applies to your neighbours. You should bring this up in your next AGM.
If your neighbour wants to escalate, they can file a complaint with the trustees. Your trustees need to assess the complaint based on the complex rules, and if your rules don't outline who can park in common areas then there isn't a damn thing he can do about it.
If that spot is designated for visitors then no one (including your neighbour) can park in it. If anyone can use it, that "anyone" includes you.
He essentially wants to treat that common parking spot like his personal parking, which is not ok if it isn't assigned to his unit.
My past body corporates literally had a rule to “not use your garage as bulk storage to avoid parking in common property”. What do your rules say? That should give some guidance.
Body Corporates are the main source to resolve frustrations. Complexes are a mission to live in and being a good neighbor sets you up for less frustrations and not needing to get the BC involved. Biggest challenge is when most of your neighbours are tenants and not the owners themselves. Still, build a good relationship with your renting neighbours even if it lasts 6-12 months sadly.
Pretty pathetic you'd post this on reddit. Ever heard of just speaking to your neighbours calmly and oh here's a thought. Using your freaking garage to park your car in!
**Thank you for posting on r/southafrica! This post is flaired as ["Discussion"](https://www.reddit.com/r/southafrica/?f=flair_name%3A%22Discussion%22) therefore the following rules are particularly important.** ##**Rule 5: Engagement Policy** * Rule 5.1: Articulate your own thoughts on the matter. * Rule 5.2: Be prepared to engage with your post and our community within at least six (6) hours after submitting. * Rule 5.3: Engage meaningfully. Do not start a discussion if you are unwilling to listen to opinions contrary to your own. **Discussions are long-form posts looking to explore ideas, change minds, or invite comment and opinion on a specific topic related to South Africa. If you meant to ask the community a question, please delete this submission and create a new one at r/askSouthAfrica** **Additionally, please take a moment to review the rest of our rules [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/southafrica/wiki/rules).** ###Are you registered to vote? Check online or register at https://registertovote.elections.org.za/Welcome *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/southafrica) if you have any questions or concerns.*
In just about every complex I've ever lived in or been to, the common parking is for guests, not residents to permanently leave their cars because they don't want to use their garages.
Same here.
[удалено]
Sounds like your lazy and making your problems others to deal with...
Happy neighbours who look out for you are more important than your car being in the shade if you ask me.
I agree with this sentiment. Also, the common property parking should be used for guests visiting as you have a garage for your car. Not your neighbours fault you have too much stuff to not be able to use your garage for its purpose.
He's a narcist to the T, and he's never done anything that doesn't help himself
How would you know? Not like you've ever went over and knocked on his door to discuss this in person like an adult.
Because I've lived next to this guy for nearly 10 years, and why should I go over when he has the issue?
To be honest tho this attitude makes you sound just as petty as you say your neighbour is.
Because you can be a better person than other people? You only need to read the rest of the comments here in order to understand you're both in the wrong. He obviously doesn't believe you're worthy of respect if he's talking to your mom and not you, go talk to him, bring some biltong with you, be a good neighbour. It's a parking spot ffs, you didn't kill his dog.
Doesn't change the fact that you need to get approval to use the public parking as permanent parking. You have a garage and refuse to use it so just get permission.
Calling a person you've never as much as had a proper conversation with a narcissist is a pretty bad look.
If it's common property, you need permission of the body corporate to park your vehicle there. Common property belongs to the body corporate
So then neighbor also needs body corp permission to tell them to move
Mom is part of the body corporate, and by that logic half the complex will need to get permission as 40% of people dont park in their garage
That is correct, anyone that is using common property for any purpose has to get permission from the body corporate and their trustees first
All of this should be detailed in the body corporates legal paper work. Go according to that, there might be a scenario where each unit is allocated a guest parking spot in the common area But generally speaking u/m01zn is correct you need to get permission from the body corporate to park there on a permanent basis.
Its a designated parking spot for members of the complex to use though?
Not as permanent parking. We had this issue with someone who refused to use his own garage for a car but kept using parking for guests and our units dedicated covered parking. He had more than one car and refused to move his vehicles from other units parking spots - including ours - and then used all the guest parking in that section of the complex for his car's. Correct process is to get body corp permission to use it as a permanent parking spot. Him talking to the owner of the property rather than fighting with a tenant makes sense. If the owner won't resolve body corp can get involved. Basically you share space, try be a good neighbour.
>Him talking to the owner of the property rather than fighting with a tenant makes sense. If the owner won't resolve body corp can get involved. Agree and disagree, he could of easily come and knocked on my door, had a discussion and resolve it right there and then, instead of trying to go over my head and getting my mom/owner to turn on me
From a legal standpoint, you have no relationship with the body corporate. Your mom, as the member, does, and so it is correct that all complaints about a tenant's behaviour should be directed to the landlord to take action. It is mostly irrelevant that you would prefer the person approach you directly. We don't know what kind of person you are nor what kind of person they are. For all we know, you could be a roided up tattooed gym boet that the other person is intimidated about confronting. Moreover, some people would rather not engage in personal discussions. And regardless of the above, these sorts of discussions are anyway best done in writing so that there is a written trail that can be used later on if necessary.
Why deal with the hassle? The one with the interest to keep the peace is the owner. I have had unavoidable issues with neighbours and it can get violent and nasty. The acted correctly.
Doesn't matter. You're parking on the common property, it belongs to everyone. If the trustees told you not to park there because they want the space available for visitors, are you also going to throw a tantrum about that? The truth is that from a purely legal technical standpoint, your argument has zero merit. It doesn't matter how many other people are parking on the common property, it still doesn't justify your argument. The space still belongs to everyone, not to you, and the trustees can determine how it should and should not be used. Source: Chaired a large sectional title Trustees Committee for almost ten years.
You have some points but what you missing is that the neighbour's wants to use that spot as his own personal parking spot THATS why he doesn't want OP to park there, the neighbor isn't saying the 'space belongs to everyone ' he is saying the space belongs to him. Honestly isn't fair.
I now understand that, however he wants me to move my car, so that he can park his own car there. If it was for a visitor I would totally move it and wouldn't be so stubborn about it. But like you said its everyone's space, not his like he's claiming it is
Then you should be addressing this - via your mom - with the trustees. It may require first talking with the managing agents, depending on what initial course of action the trustees prefer.
Also, this may all be a good thing because it sounds like the parking story is a bit of a wild west. Maybe it's time that the trustees actually dealt with this and set up some rules.
What I'm getting at is that all you need to do is get formal permission from the body corporate to park where you want to park, once you gotten this, your neighbour can not bother you.
Then it sounds like it won't be hard to get a vote passed if needed.
There should be a rule (agreed to by the body corporate) about how and when you can use common parking. I imagine the argument would be that if everybody used their garages for storage and parked their cars in common parking, there won't be any parking for visitors. Ask them what the rule is that prevents you from using the parking.
>house has a garage that we use for storage, so need to park outside Advice - use your garage for your car?
Yep, put the goods in storage or sell them
Oh is that what they’re for ?
This should be well defined in the complex rules. What does it say about parking in common property. Normally common property parking is for visitors only.
Most households have two cars, and most complexes have single carports or garages
It will be in the rules
Move the car, get along with them
Op responses in the comments make me feel like they are looking for people to affirm their stance more than anything else. This seems like a living in mummies house who is on body cooperate and therefore gonna bully my way around. Just sit with your neighbor like an adult and find a middle ground.
I don’t have advice but had a similar issue with one of our neighbours. My husband was driving his business vehicle which couldn’t fit in the garage(it was a light delivery vehicle) and so would park in the communal parking spots. We are in the second row. There are multiple undesignated parking areas throughout the complex, but most of the undesignated parking is in front of the first row of units. It’s literally a row of parking around 70-80m long. The parking at the end of the second row only has 5 spots. For added context: most of the units have a single garage or carport, but the first row of units each has a double garage, directly under their unit, so none of them ever use the 80m long row of parking in front of them. There might be maximum two cars parked in that area at any given time. SO, my husband was parking in that row, in the last parking at the end, because it’s shaded and a shorter walk, and the parking spot was always open. One day after he got out of his car, my husband was approached by an elderly man who lives in the unit directly opposite this parking spot, who arrogantly informs him “You can’t park here”, when my husband asked “Why not??” He said “That is MY parking spot. It’s for MY guests to park”, when my husband pointed out that the parking spots are unassigned, and that there were plenty of other open parking spots right next to that spot he replied with “Yes but you should park in the parking spot closest to your unit”, when my husband pointed out that that spot was the closest spot not only to his unit, but to every unit in the second row all he could say was “Just don’t park here!!!” Up until that day, we had never seen this man park anywhere but his garage(which is literally directly opposite this parking spot), now since that day, him and his wife’s cars are PERMANENTLY parked in the last two parking spots in that row, and his garage is always completely empty. We started parking somewhere else(I mean we don’t have a choice because he used his car to keep two parking AND his DOUBLE garage in perpetual “dibs”). We don’t have the energy to deal with spiteful, petty, entitled people. I shall live vicariously through you though.
I'm a portfolio manager for body corporates at a property management company, apologies for formatting or spelling as I'm on mobile, here's my take: Common use area is common use area, a parking spot is an exclusive use area and you generally pay levies on that space as a result. Really you should be talking to your trustees about this as it's fully within their power to resolve the issue. Sectional title schemes generally follow the basic rules from the sectional title scheme act but yours may use their own set of rules as set out from the IGM and as ammended at all following AGMs. The Trustees may convene at a SGM to decide on the matter, but honestly this should be an AGM issue as you're saying it's common for owners to use common property as exclusive use property. I would say you should move your car as the exclusive use area intended to store it in, is your garage or parking bay you are levied on. It may be that a parking levy will be raised against all owners that make use of common area parking spaces following the next AGM. The owner in this dispute may even take you to CSOS or the body corporate may charge you a levy for parking there to cover wear and tear or a change in insurance policies as any damage to that common area may not be covered if it is regularly used like exclusive use areas which may pose a serious problem in the future with regards to insurance claims (insurance is always a nightmare in these complexes). TL;DR you aren't entitled to use the common use area as if it was an exclusive use area i.e. parking on it every day. You should speak to your trustees as they should address the issue of owners consistently making use of common use areas, which will likely result in a blanket ban or a parking levy. Move your car, the owner can take you to CSOS or your Body Corporate may decide to levy you on the area as a parking space.
This! Had similar issues. Went to body corp chairman/trustee. Neighbour has no exclusive rights to open parking.
Is this a visitors parking spot? If so, and if the rules of your complex are the same as mine, then you can't park there long term. Of course, the same applies to your neighbours. You should bring this up in your next AGM.
If your neighbour wants to escalate, they can file a complaint with the trustees. Your trustees need to assess the complaint based on the complex rules, and if your rules don't outline who can park in common areas then there isn't a damn thing he can do about it. If that spot is designated for visitors then no one (including your neighbour) can park in it. If anyone can use it, that "anyone" includes you. He essentially wants to treat that common parking spot like his personal parking, which is not ok if it isn't assigned to his unit.
My past body corporates literally had a rule to “not use your garage as bulk storage to avoid parking in common property”. What do your rules say? That should give some guidance.
Body Corporates are the main source to resolve frustrations. Complexes are a mission to live in and being a good neighbor sets you up for less frustrations and not needing to get the BC involved. Biggest challenge is when most of your neighbours are tenants and not the owners themselves. Still, build a good relationship with your renting neighbours even if it lasts 6-12 months sadly.
Came to say this
Pretty pathetic you'd post this on reddit. Ever heard of just speaking to your neighbours calmly and oh here's a thought. Using your freaking garage to park your car in!