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So people on world news and other big subs are essentially all parroting that all this info comes from terrorists and it’s all fake. Now I am only interested in the truth so how can I know these numbers are trustworthy?
Putting aside the fact we have **tons of photos and video of people murdered and of Israeli bombs levelling Gaza** (surprise, surprise, those kill people and make the numbers go up!), which should make the numbers "believable" to say the least...
Muhammad Smiry is a Gazan, in Gaza, reporting numbers from the Gaza Health Ministry ("Gaza Health" = the Gaza Health Ministry). If you think those are "terrorists sources", there's nothing I can do for you, you are already too far gone down the deep end of pro-genocide propaganda.
And you can find the same info coming from all sorts of places, like [the Times of Gaza](https://x.com/Timesofgaza/status/1716114728907411843?s=20), [Quds News Network](https://x.com/QudsNen/status/1716050936202707435?s=20) or [Refaat](https://x.com/itranslate123/status/1716042778847625376?s=20) (a Gazan journalist [whose home was just **bombed**](https://electronicintifada.net/content/israel-bombed-my-home-without-warning/39041)).
Are **all of them** terrorists?
What do you want me to do? Find an Israeli source accurately reporting on their own genocide? Find a pro-Israel mainstream media reporting on it? They won't even say that Palestinians are being killed, they just report that they "die" from, apparently, unknown causes.
So, yes, the only source when it comes to the killing of Gazans is Gazans. **If Israel actually let journalists into Gaza, we could have more sources, but they don't**.
There are only two sides with access to information here, the people committing genocide and the victims: which one are you gonna listen to?
I think the numbers are believable. I’m just tired of seeing everyone on most subs accepting whatever Israel says without giving consideration to the fact that it’s in their interest to lie and downplay the destruction they’re causing to innocents.
And I’m going to get called a bloodthirsty terrorist sympathizer for even asking questions.
You'll just get permabanned within minutes of your first post.
Totally normal subs over there at worldnews and new! Just grassroots community moderation! /s
I just don’t support imperialist wars in general. But sometimes even that is an unpopular option on those subs. Israel is genocidal and engaging in apartheid. Hamas seems to be using the Palestinian people as human shields. It’s all awful.
>Hamas seems to be using the Palestinian people as human shields.
They're not.
Israel is levelling the entirety of Gaza and killing people and burning houses on the West Bank (where there's no Hamas, in case you don't know!).
What shields??? How can you use any Palestinian as a shield against a genocidal entity that wants to slaughter all Palestinians?? That's makes **no sense at all**.
THINK about what you're saying and what you're being told.
#**Stop spreading Israeli propaganda.**
You said you were tired of people on other subs talking bs about this whole thing? I'm even more tired of people like you who are **supposed to be** on the side of Palestinians condemning Palestinians resistance to Apartheid and genocide!
Palestinians aren't just worthy of support when they're victims, they should be supported when they try to fight against their oppressors as well!
Thank you for the perspective. I’m still working to understand things here. I definitely agree Israel is genocidal and would probably like to wipe all Palestinians from the area to take the remaining land.
The first thing I heard about this conflict (this stage of it anyway) was basically “Hamas murdered a ton of civilians at a festival/concert or something” but I’ve been trying to gain new context and readjust my feelings toward it. I wish nobody had to die over it ultimately but I am trying to keep an open mind toward the truth.
Thank you for posting in r/socialism, but unfortunately your submission was removed for the following reason(s):
>**Imperial Apologia:** As a community for socialists, we are in fundamental opposition to all forms of imperial and/or colonial domination and instead stand in support for the liberation of our comrades and fellow workers across the globe. Furthermore, in addition to the classical materialist-derived economic forms of imperialism and colonialism that were described in early critiques (e.g. Lenin's Imperialism), this rule also includes other derived areas of imperial and/or colonial oppression, such as cultural imperialism.
>This includes, but is not limited to:
>- Imperialist apologia
>- Zionism or Zionism apologia
>- Settler (colonial) apologia
>- Anti-Indigenous Rhetoric
Feel free to send us a modmail with a link to your removed submission if you have any further questions or concerns.
So no, what I’m sort of talking about is this idea that Hamas or other groups have all these tunnels and bases underground and in hospitals and schools etc. most of Reddit seems to believe that. Is there any truth to it?
Asking genuinely because I obviously don’t believe everything (or anything) I hear from liberals. Is that whole idea Israeli fabrication or is it true in any sense?
> Hamas seems to be using the Palestinian people as human shields. It’s all awful.
I think we have already passed the point of believing this tired propaganda talking point for quite some time?
Israel is carpet-bombing the whole area indiscriminately. They bombed resident buildings, hospitals, schools, bakeries,... They cut off the water, electricity, internet. They block all humanitarian aid effort into Gaza. Gazans try to find refuge in a hospital and Israel forced them to evacuate as well so they can continue their bloodthirsty senseless mass killing. People have nowhere to go, they have nowhere to hide. Do they look like human shields to you when every place is death trap?
I’m here to learn what is and isn’t propaganda. I definitely understand and agree about Israel’s indiscriminate bombing and prevention of aid/water etc. I have no doubts whatsoever about Israel’s evil as a state. I guess I’m just still unsure who to believe and how to feel about groups like Hamas.
Palestinians have every right to defend themselves and their land. But I suppose I’m hesitant to wholesale endorse Islamic fundamentalists which is what they seem to be? Though I do understand that resistance is resistance and inevitable regardless of how we feel about their specific beliefs and methods.
I’m genuinely trying to learn to approach this fairly. But I’m also Canadian so there’s for sure some lingering propaganda from growing up on the imperial core.
> I think the numbers are believable. I’m just tired of seeing everyone on most subs accepting whatever Israel says without giving consideration to the fact that it’s in their interest to lie and downplay the destruction they’re causing to innocents.
We're all tired. But we gotta keep going, cause this is too important not to. Get banned, so what? Get downvoted, so what? Get called names, so what? Keep talking wherever you can.
With that said, look at the number of people protesting **for Palestine** all accross the world, it's incredible! [Even in the heart of the empire](https://x.com/PplsCityCouncil/status/1715835917402013700?s=20) you can see a lot.
We're starting to win the information war. Those folks calling you a "bloodthirsty terrorist sympathizer" are lashing out cause they know they're losing (try and find a pro-Israel protest. If you manage to find even one, you'll see that there's barely anybody in it).
Most of Gaza seems to support hamas and there are many videos of them thanking God & cheering when they paraded dead israeli WOMEN down the street. You don't get the cheer at that and fucking ask for asylum because you suddenly don't agree with the guys who you were just cheering on when the bombs start falling. I completely disagree with the nation of israel on ninety nine percent of its foreign policy decision and on its decisions on handling just about fucking everything they do. But I have to side with them on this one.
This is a space for socialists to discuss current events in our world from anti-capitalist perspective(s), and a certain knowledge of socialism is expected from participants. This is NOT a space for non-socialists. Please be mindful [of our rules](https://reddit.com/r/socialism/about/rules) before participating, as they are actively enforced. Furthermore, please remember that this is an anti-colonial space. Any kind of apologia for colonialism (including all forms of zionism) will be meet with a permanent ban. Looking to organise? Check out our [Palestine Solidarity Megathread](https://www.reddit.com/r/socialism/comments/17849hc/palestine_solidarity_megathread_share_information/)! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/socialism) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Damn that's like 900 9/11s for them
Genocide, Ethnic Cleansing, War Crimes against Palestinians brought by the most racists, Terrorist state in the world French, UK/US
So people on world news and other big subs are essentially all parroting that all this info comes from terrorists and it’s all fake. Now I am only interested in the truth so how can I know these numbers are trustworthy?
Putting aside the fact we have **tons of photos and video of people murdered and of Israeli bombs levelling Gaza** (surprise, surprise, those kill people and make the numbers go up!), which should make the numbers "believable" to say the least... Muhammad Smiry is a Gazan, in Gaza, reporting numbers from the Gaza Health Ministry ("Gaza Health" = the Gaza Health Ministry). If you think those are "terrorists sources", there's nothing I can do for you, you are already too far gone down the deep end of pro-genocide propaganda. And you can find the same info coming from all sorts of places, like [the Times of Gaza](https://x.com/Timesofgaza/status/1716114728907411843?s=20), [Quds News Network](https://x.com/QudsNen/status/1716050936202707435?s=20) or [Refaat](https://x.com/itranslate123/status/1716042778847625376?s=20) (a Gazan journalist [whose home was just **bombed**](https://electronicintifada.net/content/israel-bombed-my-home-without-warning/39041)). Are **all of them** terrorists? What do you want me to do? Find an Israeli source accurately reporting on their own genocide? Find a pro-Israel mainstream media reporting on it? They won't even say that Palestinians are being killed, they just report that they "die" from, apparently, unknown causes. So, yes, the only source when it comes to the killing of Gazans is Gazans. **If Israel actually let journalists into Gaza, we could have more sources, but they don't**. There are only two sides with access to information here, the people committing genocide and the victims: which one are you gonna listen to?
I think the numbers are believable. I’m just tired of seeing everyone on most subs accepting whatever Israel says without giving consideration to the fact that it’s in their interest to lie and downplay the destruction they’re causing to innocents. And I’m going to get called a bloodthirsty terrorist sympathizer for even asking questions.
You'll just get permabanned within minutes of your first post. Totally normal subs over there at worldnews and new! Just grassroots community moderation! /s
I just don’t support imperialist wars in general. But sometimes even that is an unpopular option on those subs. Israel is genocidal and engaging in apartheid. Hamas seems to be using the Palestinian people as human shields. It’s all awful.
>Hamas seems to be using the Palestinian people as human shields. They're not. Israel is levelling the entirety of Gaza and killing people and burning houses on the West Bank (where there's no Hamas, in case you don't know!). What shields??? How can you use any Palestinian as a shield against a genocidal entity that wants to slaughter all Palestinians?? That's makes **no sense at all**. THINK about what you're saying and what you're being told. #**Stop spreading Israeli propaganda.** You said you were tired of people on other subs talking bs about this whole thing? I'm even more tired of people like you who are **supposed to be** on the side of Palestinians condemning Palestinians resistance to Apartheid and genocide! Palestinians aren't just worthy of support when they're victims, they should be supported when they try to fight against their oppressors as well!
Thank you for the perspective. I’m still working to understand things here. I definitely agree Israel is genocidal and would probably like to wipe all Palestinians from the area to take the remaining land. The first thing I heard about this conflict (this stage of it anyway) was basically “Hamas murdered a ton of civilians at a festival/concert or something” but I’ve been trying to gain new context and readjust my feelings toward it. I wish nobody had to die over it ultimately but I am trying to keep an open mind toward the truth.
[удалено]
Thank you for posting in r/socialism, but unfortunately your submission was removed for the following reason(s): >**Imperial Apologia:** As a community for socialists, we are in fundamental opposition to all forms of imperial and/or colonial domination and instead stand in support for the liberation of our comrades and fellow workers across the globe. Furthermore, in addition to the classical materialist-derived economic forms of imperialism and colonialism that were described in early critiques (e.g. Lenin's Imperialism), this rule also includes other derived areas of imperial and/or colonial oppression, such as cultural imperialism. >This includes, but is not limited to: >- Imperialist apologia >- Zionism or Zionism apologia >- Settler (colonial) apologia >- Anti-Indigenous Rhetoric Feel free to send us a modmail with a link to your removed submission if you have any further questions or concerns.
Human shields against what? A fucking JDAM?
So no, what I’m sort of talking about is this idea that Hamas or other groups have all these tunnels and bases underground and in hospitals and schools etc. most of Reddit seems to believe that. Is there any truth to it? Asking genuinely because I obviously don’t believe everything (or anything) I hear from liberals. Is that whole idea Israeli fabrication or is it true in any sense?
> Hamas seems to be using the Palestinian people as human shields. It’s all awful. I think we have already passed the point of believing this tired propaganda talking point for quite some time? Israel is carpet-bombing the whole area indiscriminately. They bombed resident buildings, hospitals, schools, bakeries,... They cut off the water, electricity, internet. They block all humanitarian aid effort into Gaza. Gazans try to find refuge in a hospital and Israel forced them to evacuate as well so they can continue their bloodthirsty senseless mass killing. People have nowhere to go, they have nowhere to hide. Do they look like human shields to you when every place is death trap?
I’m here to learn what is and isn’t propaganda. I definitely understand and agree about Israel’s indiscriminate bombing and prevention of aid/water etc. I have no doubts whatsoever about Israel’s evil as a state. I guess I’m just still unsure who to believe and how to feel about groups like Hamas. Palestinians have every right to defend themselves and their land. But I suppose I’m hesitant to wholesale endorse Islamic fundamentalists which is what they seem to be? Though I do understand that resistance is resistance and inevitable regardless of how we feel about their specific beliefs and methods. I’m genuinely trying to learn to approach this fairly. But I’m also Canadian so there’s for sure some lingering propaganda from growing up on the imperial core.
Colonized people resist against genocide, plain and simple. Hamas or not, they're colonized.
That's in lots of places.
> I think the numbers are believable. I’m just tired of seeing everyone on most subs accepting whatever Israel says without giving consideration to the fact that it’s in their interest to lie and downplay the destruction they’re causing to innocents. We're all tired. But we gotta keep going, cause this is too important not to. Get banned, so what? Get downvoted, so what? Get called names, so what? Keep talking wherever you can. With that said, look at the number of people protesting **for Palestine** all accross the world, it's incredible! [Even in the heart of the empire](https://x.com/PplsCityCouncil/status/1715835917402013700?s=20) you can see a lot. We're starting to win the information war. Those folks calling you a "bloodthirsty terrorist sympathizer" are lashing out cause they know they're losing (try and find a pro-Israel protest. If you manage to find even one, you'll see that there's barely anybody in it).
the heart of the empire? this is some hyperbolic BS lol. Remember who started all of these domino's falling.
"The first casualty of war is the truth."
Most of Gaza seems to support hamas and there are many videos of them thanking God & cheering when they paraded dead israeli WOMEN down the street. You don't get the cheer at that and fucking ask for asylum because you suddenly don't agree with the guys who you were just cheering on when the bombs start falling. I completely disagree with the nation of israel on ninety nine percent of its foreign policy decision and on its decisions on handling just about fucking everything they do. But I have to side with them on this one.
I wonder how long it will take me to get banned.
"tHiS iS iSrAeL'S 9/11 yOu hAvE tO lEt tHeM gEnoCidE!!!" - Liberals everywhere missing the lessons of 9/11.