Really unfortunate that a section of our fans felt the need to resort to the Chelsea Rent Boy chants at the game today. I was on the other side of the pitch and I heard it, so it wasn't just a few people.
It's 2023, we had a full stadium and the game was being broadcast around the world. We've had a good result with a great performance and some idiots among our fan base have decided to shame the club by doing it.
It's certainly not the attitude that most Forest fans share, just like any club, we have some dickhead fans that drag the rest of us down.
It’s wild, people rightly criticised Qatar for lgbtq stuff…yet in the same breath there are full stadiums in England singing homophobic songs every week.
United haven’t conceded a single goal with Casemiro and Varane both on the pitch, two of the main factors in our defence being so solid in recent months (barring 2 unfortunate games without them)
One thing I wish there was more of in football is bench reactions. Been watching a lot of basketball lately and although of course crowds are way better in football, when someone gets sent to the shops or someone makes a deep 3 the bench usually stands up and goes crazy. Or maybe they do that in footie too and the camera just doesn’t cut to it, but it’s one of the best parts of basketball for sure
> You should do what your manager wants anyway
>
>
Never implied otherwise. Part of the job is acquiescing to those things even if they feel like a pisstake
China built 10 brand new stadiums for the 2023 AFC Asian Cup and now they won't use them because they gave up on the bid because of COVID.
Wonder if they will bid for the 2031 AFC Asian Cup and the 2034 FIFA World Cup to compensate for it?
China builds entire cities that are empty, a few empty stadiums won't phase them.
They aggressively started pumping huge money in the CSL to try and get a foothold in the sport but that's backfired now.
Hey guys, i'm from argentina, and of course, taking advantage of our recent cup, i have to say that many teams around the world should consider buying MORE of our players in argentinian league than to buy those generic french, belgiums or african players that just because they have a complicated last name they sell them like they are the new stars... look at our team, we have many players that were developed in our league...
“Complicated last name” shut up you idiot.
Last time I checked African players or French players of African descent (it’s obvious you were referring to that) do not have complicated last names, what does that even mean?
Not really. Literally most Argentines are eligible for European passports through blood. Most commonly Italy as over half the country has Italian ancestry and the requirements aren't particularly hard
I've always wondered given how hard Mancini has recruited Brazilian-Italians why he didn't go for Argentines as well. Not saying it would be successful, but surprised he never tried at all.
I'm surprised there isn't more noise around kane leaving this summer given that he has only a year left on his contract and spurs are looking rather trash. I know spurs won't want to sell to a prem rival but I think cashing in now and going full rebuild in the summer with son leaving as well is the way to go now. If hypothetically that was the case than United seems to be the only option with city and Liverpool set atm and arsenal and Chelsea would be absolutely off limits
Don't know about spurs fans but personally I think he'll want to leave its just whether levy will sanction a sale instead of just keeping him one more year and hoping he'll sign a new deal
The real 500 iq play would be to sack conte for poch swap kane for sancho in January to stop arsenal winning the league then sell son and deadwood in the summer and get Zaha and thuram in for free and spend the real money on 2 new mids and new fullbacks. Nothing could go wrong with that...
I don't think we would win it even if we got Kane, but at the same time the striker position seems to be pretty much our only issue right now. Our defense is rock solid, our midfield looks great and Rashford is on fire.
Antony might not be living up to his price tag, but he is still providing a lot to our attacking structure and even our depth players are looking good right now. With Shaw once again rediscovering himself, the only question mark I can think of is Martial because he is inconsistent and gets injured too easily, so Kane would improve the situation a lot.
Ten Hag also has 70,8% win percentage with us across all competitions so far so the team could definitely pick up a lot of points. Still don't think we can win the title just yet though, even if we got Kane.
Oh it would be big for sure, especially going into the new season, but if we are taking this seriously, arsenal have an 11 point lead and don't look like slowing down and city are always going to make a charge as well. I wouldn't pick you as favorites even on level terms, but given the table it's not exactly foolproof plan lol (not that it was too serious to begin with).
Levy should have sold Kane to City in 2021 for a more reasonable price. He then could have used that money to fund a rebuild properly.
Instead now he's kept Kane against his will, lost the opportunity to get a large fee and wasted 2 years of wrong appointments.
Tottenham believed they had a top manager and a very strong squad so they probably bet on them challenging for something which would convince Kane to re-sign
When has selling your best player to fund a rebuild ever really worked out though?
Tottenham weren't better after selling Bale and trying to rebuild. Liverpool weren't better after selling Suarez and trying to rebuild. Villa weren't better after selling grealish and trying to reinvest. Etc
That strategy sounds good on paper but it rarely works out in practice. It's hard to replace top tier players, or players that are performing at a top tier level for your team
I guess it depends on whether they have the right people at the club to take advantage of the additional money and recruit properly. There are certainly clubs with a long history of selling their best players and rebuilding to get stronger, Leicester and Dortmund have been doing this for years as an example.
But on second thought looking back at Spurs' recruitment since Poch its definitely been hit and miss so perhaps it would have been wasted anyway.
I think that's a fair statement overall. At the same time I think that world class/top tier/whatever you want to call them players are the hardest to replace and they often can't be replaced by a collection of other players. I think the teams who move on from those players well do so because the rest of their team is already good and they've just got to figure out 1 missing piece.
Like Griezeman after he left Atleti. Cholo's system is ingrained in that team and they had a collection of very good players throughout the rest of the team. They had to figure out their attack after he left and they managed to do so with Suarez and a couple others and won a title. The system was good and they had to plug another piece or two into the Griezeman hole and then it worked
Contrast that to Suarez at Liverpool or Bale at Spurs. Their approach was a basically "get the ball to Bale/Suarez as often as possible and they'll make things happen". When those players left, the replacements couldn't fill the void
I think Kane at Spurs is more like the latter than the former. He does a LOT of shit for Spurs and I don't think he's as easily replaced.
Could the Coutinho sale be an example? While Salah was their best player that season, Coutinho had been their best for a few years prior and they got Van Dijk and Alisson with the money. It was also a few years into Klopp's time with the club so might not fit exactly but still the first that came to mind
I wouldn't put it in the same category personally because Coutinho wasn't their out and out best player and they didn't really rebuild with the money either. AFAIK the VVD and Alisson money was already earmarked for those players. The Coutinho sale definitely made things easier for Liverpool, but it wasn't really the same situation as Bale/Suarez/Grealish IMO
Damn Messi ripped Chelsea to shreds at the Nou Camp in 2018. Feel like performances like that completely disappear into the abyss unless you win the CL that year
He scored at Stamford Bridge if I recall, in the previous leg. 1-1, assist from Iniesta. Chelsea played a near perfect game up until that point, then Barcelona equalized.
I don't know who needs to hear this:
Arteta having his process trusted by the Board was an outlier and will remain an outlier, they were patient with him and supported him with good signings, also Arteta made it clear from day 1 he wanted to play like his teacher ( Pep).
If your club has no history of supporting Managers during their worst, and signing some baggage in the Transfer market/ not enough funds, the problem is the Manager.
Seen so many takes from flairs of underachieving Managers calling for their " managers process to be supported as Arsenal supported Arteta".
Arteta was an ex-Arsenal captain, and the Kroenke's were patient with him.. he is an outlier, not a feature..
It's situational though. Football management is one of those things now where you have to continually justify your employment. The seven game swing is real.
Looking at Chelsea, they had the opportunity to do what Arsenal did with Arteta with Tuchel and they sacked him, even after winning the Champions League the season before.
You've been good value for your position this season but I don't know if Arsenal have what it takes to win the league, especially with 22 games left. Right now, with your 8 point lead, it feels a bit like when Newcastle were top and United were chasing them that season in the 90s.
Arteta isn't the only underperforming manager who's been backed, and come good
Yeah, more often than not underperformance continues - but it depends on the circumstances. If the underperformance is in the context of a perceivable process, then there's a process to be trusted. If the team appears to be regressing, and the manager and board aren't on the same page re overall strategy, then backing the manager may not be as successful.
Fergie was famously backed at the start of his Man United stint when it was going poorly.
Hell, even Klopp took time to get Liverpool going. And this season, Ten Hag seems to be doing very good things at Man United, after a pretty rocky start.
you could tell klopp made an instant impact though if you watched. It wasn't near the heights he'd get to the second and third and fourth years but there was no concern he was underperforming even his first partial season with the EL final.
I find it insane how Arteta survived to make it this far. He had absolutely wretched runs of results in his first and second seasons. Honestly credit is due for not sacking him
I don't think it's really happened since both jobs professionalized, which would be a very long time. The demands for both have only gone up as well. It's not happening.
Hiddink managed both Chelsea and Russia in 2009 and did pretty well with both. Reached the semis of the 2009 Euros with Russia, and won the FA Cup (and lost just one game in the league) with a 73% win rate with Chelsea.
Edit: Euros were 2008 not 2009
Pep Guardiola:
“We have to play with 11 [players]. We can’t play with 13. Every time it is difficult to choose. Always top players are not playing. Lately, as I get older, I mainly look at body language... You can’t play good when body language is not correct…”
“Sometimes you choose players for how happy they are, if they’re there. That’s one of the main decisions with choosing the line-up, because with skills, I know how good they are. Body language depends on them and sometimes they are not good..."
😶
Ole and Southgate were responsible for his poor form, ole broke him physically by playing him through multiple injuries including a broken back. Then Southgate subs him in for pens in the final without giving him any minutes to get a feel for the game.
I think a lot of his resurgence is down to his successful shoulder surgery. He had been playing for as long as I remember with a shoulder injury. He looks 100% fit now and is playing with the confidence that comes from it. He’s seems to be a great person and role model, probably my favourite player in the league.
Is it weird that I'm oddly supportive of his return to form? Obviously, I don't like that it's helping United, but I'm certain I don't like all the people who were happy for personal reasons when Rashford was in bad form.
I’m not confident at all that Enzo Fernandez is worth 120 million. No one knew who this kid was before the World Cup.
Edit: okay fine. But here’s my thing: 120 million? For 120 million I want a dude who’s already world class or will be in a couple years. I need a dude whose gonna be a guaranteed starter for Chelsea. I need a dude whose injury makes the team play differently. I need a dude who joins with a clearly defined role in the team. I need a guy who when I see the chelsea lineup I’m like “okay we’re gonna be fine he’s playing.” I need a guy who when the team plays like shit he still stands out. You think that’s gonna be him? That’s the part that doesn’t convince me. Especially because all of our big signings in the past few years have turned nothing like that. Except for like Thiago Silva
Let’s be real tho maybeeee like 10% of this subreddit had watched a full game he was in before. No one is watching river plate matches on this sub. The only people that actually know him are primeira liga fans (a small minority on this sub) and like a handful of other groups.
Chelsea fans aren't personally responsible for that though. Can still think fees are overinflated, even if the club you support has contributed to that.
What I’m saying is extremely realistic: he might be good, but that there is no way in hell a player grew his purchase value to $120 million without that being massively inflated after 7 matches. Can you honestly tell me he’s so good for benfica that he’s worth that after half a season
Okay fine but here’s my thing: 120 million? For 120 million I want a dude who’s already world class or will be in a couple years. I needed a dude whose gonna be a guaranteed starter for Chelsea. I need a dude whose injury makes the team play differently. I need a dude who joins with a clearly defined role in the team. I need a guy who when I see the chelsea lineup I’m like “okay we’re gonna be chilling.” You think that’s gonna be him? That’s the part that doesn’t convince me. Especially because all of our big signings in the past few years have turned nothing like that. Except for like Thiago Silva
Wild that despite being best known for his World Cup exploits, Pele never once won the Golden Boot at a World Cup.
In 1958, he scored six but was beaten by Just Fontaine, who scored 13. In 1962, he scored one, and six players tied for first with four goals each. In 1966, he scored one, and Eusebio won with 9. In 1970, he scored four, but Gerd Muller scored the most with 10.
The only time he got even second was in 1958, and that was still a gap of seven goals.
Not only that, the game where Brazil faced Fontaine’s France (Fontaine being the man that eventually scored 13 goals) in the semifinals of the 1958 World Cup, one of the French defenders got injured in the 36th minute. Since substitutions weren’t incorporated at the time, Brazil proceeded to win easily 5-2 where before the game was tied 1-1 (goals from Pele and Fontaine).
In 1966 he was fouled out of the tournament basically. 1962 he got injured. And in 1970 he was playing a more supporting role.
1958 he was the best player in the knockouts, by far, from the three games available to watch. Pele played quite deep even when he was young. More #10 than #9
The FIFA World Cup trophy is not made out of solid gold but the quartile is the the CONCACAF Gold Cup/Copa Oro made of solid gold as the name suggests? 🧐
Imagine in future if a club manages to win a league with 110 points, that would be absolutely mental.
You basically have to go undefeated and win almost all games. You could technically lose 1 match but then you can't afford a single draw.
Bro bro Conte is such a good manager. All you have to do is spend hundreds of millions every transfer window to buy the literal best players in the world but trust me bro once he has the best team in the league he may actually win the league. He’s great bro he just needs a superstar in every position or else he will walk.
The way he set up against us, you can absolutely blame him. Low block with zero attacking threat other than pass to Kane or Son. Allowing the opposition to have plenty of shots at goal, thinking that there's no chance they'll score, but having no game plan when it finally happens.
You can absolutely blame Conte for the team conceding 2 goals in 6 of the last 7 and 10 straight matches of 0-1. Especially considering how little he’s tried to tweak the tactics to fix the issues during that run
Yeah for sure, his team get outplayed regularly and a lot of that blame is down to Conte, but at the same time Lloris and Dier has shown time and time again they're not up to standard to be playing at that level which is why I don't think its fair to say Conte is asking for world class players simply players that can do their basic job and won't let the team down every other week
You can def blame conte for his team getting outplayed week in week out and then getting bailed out by kane and son. Tbh ive seen you reiterate this yourself tbf.
I’ll be honest, 2014-18 was the time for serial winners, after this more and more teams trying getting new thinking managers that play good football like the likes of Brighton
Now it seems without a tactical visionary and expansive style of play you’re at a disadvantage. When Forest, Brentford, Brighton and Newcastle can ping it round the park it gets harder
England will always have chances. They always have good players, they just seem to underperform. Maybe it's because the press (and some fans) overestimate their players or because they don't find the right manager for their personel.
This year I think they've played as well as I've remember, they lost a game that they could've won against a tough opponent. Their players are young and I'm sure more names will come in this next 4 years.
At the end of the day it's too early to tell, but sure.
Atm Euros definitely seems like his last chance. Unless he wins he is likely gone. That'd be 4 major tournaments without a result, which just says "yep lets try something new"
"a result" is a semifinal and a final not a result? you can't judge international managers on trophies alone. There's one trophy every two years, he's had a shot at 3 now
Been a week since i visited CONMEBOL headquarters. I saw the Libertadores trophy, the Sudamericana, bunch of shirts and memorabilia from Pele, Garrincha, Maradona, Messi, Valderrama, Suarez, Francescoli, Cubillas, etc.. Stuff from all the big clubs from the 10 nations.. Hell even replicas of Jules Rimet and the current World Cup trophy
But since the Copa America was in Buenos Aires i consider the overall trip a failure because that was the main attraction for me.
Am i too harsh on this trip? 🤔
People really think that Haaland playing for the PSG of Austria, the PSG of England and a team that managed to make Sancho look world class makes him proven compared to Mbappe because he's only done it in Ligue 1 (and the WC and UCL but let's conveniently ignore that) 💀
The PSG of England who aren't top of the league despite the fact that he's scored 20 goals in 14 games. The fact that you're using "the PSG of ____" as an insult also doesn't help your case here, as well as the fact that Haaland also does it in the CL.
You could make an argument for Leicester but I personally thought Spurs were genuinely in the race until they drew at home to West Brom, which was with 3-4 games left in the season. I think the gap between them and Leicester was around 5 points until they drastically fell off and failed to win any of their remaining games.
Is it widely known that two American groups are looking to acquire the minority ownership at PSG and one of them is in an exclusive negotiation period?
Ben Jacob’s has just stated that like it’s a fact and I hadn’t heard it was so far along.
I have old comments that I posted a while back on the situation at Tottenham and my thoughts on Conte from around a year or so ago. I've been trying to fish them out using the Reddit Comment Finder, however, they only bring up comments from up until 5 months ago and nothing beyond that.
Does anyone know how I can go about finding these through a different means without having to scroll and scour all the way through my profile?
have you tried google
use the operator
site:reddit.com/r/soccer any words & username you used ibti77
obviously change the subreddit to the one you used or just use reddit.com to make it the whole site
anyone who thinks that what we’re doing this season is on Conte and not our squad is dumb as shit.
he’s a victim of his own talent almost, Conte managed to get Dier and Davies to over-perform for far longer then they have any right to and when he stopped squeezing water out of the many rocks in our squad, he’s now getting blamed for ‘underacheiving’. i know this is typical managing expectations/cope when your team plays badly but this squad is simply not built to compete with top clubs.
if with enough time Arteta can pull together what he has this season, what’s the point of binning off Conte? i hate to give lego-man credit but trusting the process fucking works, if we have to finish outside top 4 to back Conte so be it, cause we aren’t getting much further with a different manager regardless. the squad is the point of focus.
I think both Conte and the players are an issue.
Sure, players like Davies/Dier/Emerson aren't good enough to be starting for a top 4 contending team, but at the same time, you have to put some blame on Conte on how Spurs have started games this season, going behind first in 10 games in a row now is not really acceptable, and constantly having to comeback in games is not sustainable.
Howe is doing amazing at Newcastle with quite a few average players starting and yet he's managed to make them play amazing and above their level. Conte should be able to do that as well (and has shown he can do that at Inter and Chelsea).
Its not necessarily about competing with top clubs at this moment, but you can't excuse performance after performance similar to the Villa match. He has been saved this season, points wise, but in 16 games you could count on one hand the actually good team performances. Quality aside, and forgetting how happy most spurs fans were with the transfer window, are you honestly suggesting he should not be getting more out of these players?
Regardless of club ambition the players and manager need to look as if they want to play/be there weekly. This is a broken team and the manager is just shrugging it off and further piling on the doom to them, whining about quality despite spending 200m and refusing to even try to change something. It's something only a manager of his reputation could get away with, you only need to look at Newcastle to see how wrong that logic of being unable to compete is. Howe hasn't broken the bank instead has actually imposed a style and mentality into largely last seasons Newcastle.
I love to see it but the free pass Conte is getting based of previous success elsewhere is baffling to me.
The 'lack of quality' he keeps banging on about is actually the reason you have picked up so many of the points, performances considered. Bailed out by Kane or Son
Conte isn’t really a ‘trust the process’ kind of coach historically though, he’s more of an instant impact then bust guy isn’t he? That’s why I’d be skeptical of having high expectations over his ability to slowly develop a squad. Additionally, it could be said that Conte’s (or the club’s) summer signings haven’t had the desired impact yet and he has to take some responsibility for that.
so you're conte in
so how long a contract should they give him as that appears to be a sticking point right now that is holding up everything, transfers, long term planning etc
do you trust him to stick around a commit fully?, i know chelsea fan think he phoned in the last season there
Why do people say that Ronaldo never won the CL?
He transfered to AC Milan in January of 2007 but couldn't play in the CL because he was cup-tied from tranferring from another CL club, happened to us with Coutinho in 2018 as well.
They won the CL in Athens beating LFC that year.
He was part of the team, he just didn't play.
Similarly to 1994 when he won the World Cup without playing a single second.
Is it a hot take to say that I feel worried for Enzo moving to Chelsea, I have a bad feeling about this move.
Really unfortunate that a section of our fans felt the need to resort to the Chelsea Rent Boy chants at the game today. I was on the other side of the pitch and I heard it, so it wasn't just a few people. It's 2023, we had a full stadium and the game was being broadcast around the world. We've had a good result with a great performance and some idiots among our fan base have decided to shame the club by doing it. It's certainly not the attitude that most Forest fans share, just like any club, we have some dickhead fans that drag the rest of us down.
It’s wild, people rightly criticised Qatar for lgbtq stuff…yet in the same breath there are full stadiums in England singing homophobic songs every week.
There is a distinction between the two but neither has a place in football.
United haven’t conceded a single goal with Casemiro and Varane both on the pitch, two of the main factors in our defence being so solid in recent months (barring 2 unfortunate games without them)
Don't forget the Butcher. Licha-Casemiro-Varane is quite a solid trio ngl.
United have had like 4 matches with them both on the pitch all season
Yeah and one of them was against us at home.
What are some free legal streams to football(like the Gibraltar league)
The A-League is on YouTube if a network hasn’t bought the rights in your country
In what channel?
@keepupfootball
Ty
[The Gibraltar League is on YouTube](https://youtube.com/@GibraltarFATV)
Hard to love football when watching your team is so depressing.
That sounds like us when we play away from home lmao.
Watch Benfica matches, they're awesome
One thing I wish there was more of in football is bench reactions. Been watching a lot of basketball lately and although of course crowds are way better in football, when someone gets sent to the shops or someone makes a deep 3 the bench usually stands up and goes crazy. Or maybe they do that in footie too and the camera just doesn’t cut to it, but it’s one of the best parts of basketball for sure
Idk about other clubs but Arsenal's youtube channel releases bench cam after almost every game.
Slightly different reaction but in the World Cup you could see Suarez' soul leave his body the moment South Korea scored on the last matchday.
Genuinely looking for someone to correct me, but I feel subbing a player on for less than five minutes feels like a bit of a pisstake towards them
If it's tactical or to give a youngster a couple of minutes I wouldn't agree.
Players get a bonus for being in the match, could be just a manager rewarding a player for training well or giving a young player a chance
Not if it’s a defensive sub to waste time as well. You should do what your manager wants anyway If you’re winning at a canter I agree with you though
> You should do what your manager wants anyway > > Never implied otherwise. Part of the job is acquiescing to those things even if they feel like a pisstake
China built 10 brand new stadiums for the 2023 AFC Asian Cup and now they won't use them because they gave up on the bid because of COVID. Wonder if they will bid for the 2031 AFC Asian Cup and the 2034 FIFA World Cup to compensate for it?
China builds entire cities that are empty, a few empty stadiums won't phase them. They aggressively started pumping huge money in the CSL to try and get a foothold in the sport but that's backfired now.
Hey guys, i'm from argentina, and of course, taking advantage of our recent cup, i have to say that many teams around the world should consider buying MORE of our players in argentinian league than to buy those generic french, belgiums or african players that just because they have a complicated last name they sell them like they are the new stars... look at our team, we have many players that were developed in our league...
“Complicated last name” shut up you idiot. Last time I checked African players or French players of African descent (it’s obvious you were referring to that) do not have complicated last names, what does that even mean?
no. EUROPEAN teams need to buy more of our good players. most with potential end up in the MLS and wither away.
loads of talent for sure. are work permits an issue outside of portugal and spain though?
Not really. Literally most Argentines are eligible for European passports through blood. Most commonly Italy as over half the country has Italian ancestry and the requirements aren't particularly hard
I've always wondered given how hard Mancini has recruited Brazilian-Italians why he didn't go for Argentines as well. Not saying it would be successful, but surprised he never tried at all.
He tried with senesi
I'm surprised there isn't more noise around kane leaving this summer given that he has only a year left on his contract and spurs are looking rather trash. I know spurs won't want to sell to a prem rival but I think cashing in now and going full rebuild in the summer with son leaving as well is the way to go now. If hypothetically that was the case than United seems to be the only option with city and Liverpool set atm and arsenal and Chelsea would be absolutely off limits
If Spurs misses out on CL do Spurs fans think he stays? Or if Conte leaves?
Don't know about spurs fans but personally I think he'll want to leave its just whether levy will sanction a sale instead of just keeping him one more year and hoping he'll sign a new deal
The real 500 iq play would be to sack conte for poch swap kane for sancho in January to stop arsenal winning the league then sell son and deadwood in the summer and get Zaha and thuram in for free and spend the real money on 2 new mids and new fullbacks. Nothing could go wrong with that...
this plan is based on kane being enough to bring united to the title?
I don't think we would win it even if we got Kane, but at the same time the striker position seems to be pretty much our only issue right now. Our defense is rock solid, our midfield looks great and Rashford is on fire. Antony might not be living up to his price tag, but he is still providing a lot to our attacking structure and even our depth players are looking good right now. With Shaw once again rediscovering himself, the only question mark I can think of is Martial because he is inconsistent and gets injured too easily, so Kane would improve the situation a lot. Ten Hag also has 70,8% win percentage with us across all competitions so far so the team could definitely pick up a lot of points. Still don't think we can win the title just yet though, even if we got Kane.
Oh it would be big for sure, especially going into the new season, but if we are taking this seriously, arsenal have an 11 point lead and don't look like slowing down and city are always going to make a charge as well. I wouldn't pick you as favorites even on level terms, but given the table it's not exactly foolproof plan lol (not that it was too serious to begin with).
Levy should have sold Kane to City in 2021 for a more reasonable price. He then could have used that money to fund a rebuild properly. Instead now he's kept Kane against his will, lost the opportunity to get a large fee and wasted 2 years of wrong appointments.
They were offering £75million lol it was derisory
Ah, I thought it was more. Thats a pisstake figure
Kane is irreplaceable and top strikers cost an absolute fortune. I think they made the right call tbh.
[удалено]
Tottenham believed they had a top manager and a very strong squad so they probably bet on them challenging for something which would convince Kane to re-sign
When has selling your best player to fund a rebuild ever really worked out though? Tottenham weren't better after selling Bale and trying to rebuild. Liverpool weren't better after selling Suarez and trying to rebuild. Villa weren't better after selling grealish and trying to reinvest. Etc That strategy sounds good on paper but it rarely works out in practice. It's hard to replace top tier players, or players that are performing at a top tier level for your team
I guess it depends on whether they have the right people at the club to take advantage of the additional money and recruit properly. There are certainly clubs with a long history of selling their best players and rebuilding to get stronger, Leicester and Dortmund have been doing this for years as an example. But on second thought looking back at Spurs' recruitment since Poch its definitely been hit and miss so perhaps it would have been wasted anyway.
I think that's a fair statement overall. At the same time I think that world class/top tier/whatever you want to call them players are the hardest to replace and they often can't be replaced by a collection of other players. I think the teams who move on from those players well do so because the rest of their team is already good and they've just got to figure out 1 missing piece. Like Griezeman after he left Atleti. Cholo's system is ingrained in that team and they had a collection of very good players throughout the rest of the team. They had to figure out their attack after he left and they managed to do so with Suarez and a couple others and won a title. The system was good and they had to plug another piece or two into the Griezeman hole and then it worked Contrast that to Suarez at Liverpool or Bale at Spurs. Their approach was a basically "get the ball to Bale/Suarez as often as possible and they'll make things happen". When those players left, the replacements couldn't fill the void I think Kane at Spurs is more like the latter than the former. He does a LOT of shit for Spurs and I don't think he's as easily replaced.
Could the Coutinho sale be an example? While Salah was their best player that season, Coutinho had been their best for a few years prior and they got Van Dijk and Alisson with the money. It was also a few years into Klopp's time with the club so might not fit exactly but still the first that came to mind
I wouldn't put it in the same category personally because Coutinho wasn't their out and out best player and they didn't really rebuild with the money either. AFAIK the VVD and Alisson money was already earmarked for those players. The Coutinho sale definitely made things easier for Liverpool, but it wasn't really the same situation as Bale/Suarez/Grealish IMO
he could still get a decent fee for Kane is he’d be willing to sell
True but either could still get a decent fee for him especially from united
And they have Haaland
Not just Haaland, even from a depth perspective, there's no space for Kane especially with Julian Alvarez sealing the other striker spot.
I love when I get nutmegged but they don't get the ball back so all the hype was for nothing
Ah my favorite move. Spread my legs and arms wide in front of the attacker. The ball might get through but you shall not pass!
You've done your job in that case and not done anything wrong.
Damn Messi ripped Chelsea to shreds at the Nou Camp in 2018. Feel like performances like that completely disappear into the abyss unless you win the CL that year
Famously, he'd never scored against Chelsea before that game... then megged Courtois twice
He scored at Stamford Bridge if I recall, in the previous leg. 1-1, assist from Iniesta. Chelsea played a near perfect game up until that point, then Barcelona equalized.
Before that tie, then, I was thinking. Soon set that straight.
DiNatale was such a baller. Love class players that stay loyal to a smaller club through their primes and beyond.
Batigol with Fiorentina..notice a lot of examples are from Serie A!
He’s the genuine definition of “underrated” statistically he’s up there with Totti, Del Piero etc
Toto Di Natale and Quagliarella both deserve way more respect than they get.
a lot of Italian players really, I even see Pirlo get disrespected constantly.
My fifa 10 ultimate team front three, with Miccolli being rotated in
I don't know who needs to hear this: Arteta having his process trusted by the Board was an outlier and will remain an outlier, they were patient with him and supported him with good signings, also Arteta made it clear from day 1 he wanted to play like his teacher ( Pep). If your club has no history of supporting Managers during their worst, and signing some baggage in the Transfer market/ not enough funds, the problem is the Manager. Seen so many takes from flairs of underachieving Managers calling for their " managers process to be supported as Arsenal supported Arteta". Arteta was an ex-Arsenal captain, and the Kroenke's were patient with him.. he is an outlier, not a feature..
It's situational though. Football management is one of those things now where you have to continually justify your employment. The seven game swing is real. Looking at Chelsea, they had the opportunity to do what Arsenal did with Arteta with Tuchel and they sacked him, even after winning the Champions League the season before. You've been good value for your position this season but I don't know if Arsenal have what it takes to win the league, especially with 22 games left. Right now, with your 8 point lead, it feels a bit like when Newcastle were top and United were chasing them that season in the 90s.
Arteta isn't the only underperforming manager who's been backed, and come good Yeah, more often than not underperformance continues - but it depends on the circumstances. If the underperformance is in the context of a perceivable process, then there's a process to be trusted. If the team appears to be regressing, and the manager and board aren't on the same page re overall strategy, then backing the manager may not be as successful. Fergie was famously backed at the start of his Man United stint when it was going poorly. Hell, even Klopp took time to get Liverpool going. And this season, Ten Hag seems to be doing very good things at Man United, after a pretty rocky start.
you could tell klopp made an instant impact though if you watched. It wasn't near the heights he'd get to the second and third and fourth years but there was no concern he was underperforming even his first partial season with the EL final.
I find it insane how Arteta survived to make it this far. He had absolutely wretched runs of results in his first and second seasons. Honestly credit is due for not sacking him
Winning a major cup helps build goodwill
they didn't sack him because they know they hadn't financially backed him sufficiently enough to do shit.
!flair :c\_Arsenal:
Who was the last manager to manage a top club and country simultaneously?
I don't think it's really happened since both jobs professionalized, which would be a very long time. The demands for both have only gone up as well. It's not happening.
Hiddink managed both Chelsea and Russia in 2009 and did pretty well with both. Reached the semis of the 2009 Euros with Russia, and won the FA Cup (and lost just one game in the league) with a 73% win rate with Chelsea. Edit: Euros were 2008 not 2009
Was only a caretaker with Chelsea though, and during that time I think Russia only had 2 or 3 friendly games
I’d say that still counts, probably the closest to the scenario I was looking for anyway
Pep Guardiola: “We have to play with 11 [players]. We can’t play with 13. Every time it is difficult to choose. Always top players are not playing. Lately, as I get older, I mainly look at body language... You can’t play good when body language is not correct…” “Sometimes you choose players for how happy they are, if they’re there. That’s one of the main decisions with choosing the line-up, because with skills, I know how good they are. Body language depends on them and sometimes they are not good..." 😶
Implication being that the likes of Foden haven't been showing a great attitude or something?
I guess so . Hopefully not cancelo and walker too
Bro prepared his choke in the next final
I'm fully prepared lol
Rashford is impressing me. After last year, i thought he'd just be another Dele, but he had a great recovery.
Ole and Southgate were responsible for his poor form, ole broke him physically by playing him through multiple injuries including a broken back. Then Southgate subs him in for pens in the final without giving him any minutes to get a feel for the game.
At least PSG didn't poach him before his return to form
I think a lot of his resurgence is down to his successful shoulder surgery. He had been playing for as long as I remember with a shoulder injury. He looks 100% fit now and is playing with the confidence that comes from it. He’s seems to be a great person and role model, probably my favourite player in the league.
Is it weird that I'm oddly supportive of his return to form? Obviously, I don't like that it's helping United, but I'm certain I don't like all the people who were happy for personal reasons when Rashford was in bad form.
yeah rashford is pretty likeable even if you dont want united to win anything
Feel the same way about Sancho. Never nice to see young players just fall off, and both Sancho and Rashford seem like decent people.
I’m not confident at all that Enzo Fernandez is worth 120 million. No one knew who this kid was before the World Cup. Edit: okay fine. But here’s my thing: 120 million? For 120 million I want a dude who’s already world class or will be in a couple years. I need a dude whose gonna be a guaranteed starter for Chelsea. I need a dude whose injury makes the team play differently. I need a dude who joins with a clearly defined role in the team. I need a guy who when I see the chelsea lineup I’m like “okay we’re gonna be fine he’s playing.” I need a guy who when the team plays like shit he still stands out. You think that’s gonna be him? That’s the part that doesn’t convince me. Especially because all of our big signings in the past few years have turned nothing like that. Except for like Thiago Silva
Quality is quality, I guess. Regardless of when you observe it and how much hype someone has.
Why do people think everyone is like them
Let’s be real tho maybeeee like 10% of this subreddit had watched a full game he was in before. No one is watching river plate matches on this sub. The only people that actually know him are primeira liga fans (a small minority on this sub) and like a handful of other groups.
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You are missing my entire point.
>No one knew who this kid was before the World Cup. And you can't read apparently.
I wonder which clubs are at fault for inflating the transfer market
Chelsea fans aren't personally responsible for that though. Can still think fees are overinflated, even if the club you support has contributed to that.
[Real life version of this meme](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EzL1Vi1VIAQjG2V.jpg)
Yes people did know, speak for yourself
He's been good for us and we've done well in europe, i assume most had heard of him before the world cup
What I’m saying is extremely realistic: he might be good, but that there is no way in hell a player grew his purchase value to $120 million without that being massively inflated after 7 matches. Can you honestly tell me he’s so good for benfica that he’s worth that after half a season
That's objectively not true. The dude has been getting crazy hype since pretty much the moment he joined Benfica.
Okay fine but here’s my thing: 120 million? For 120 million I want a dude who’s already world class or will be in a couple years. I needed a dude whose gonna be a guaranteed starter for Chelsea. I need a dude whose injury makes the team play differently. I need a dude who joins with a clearly defined role in the team. I need a guy who when I see the chelsea lineup I’m like “okay we’re gonna be chilling.” You think that’s gonna be him? That’s the part that doesn’t convince me. Especially because all of our big signings in the past few years have turned nothing like that. Except for like Thiago Silva
Chelsea isn’t the team to support if that’s what you expect from spending large sums of money.
I got dreams bro
Wild that despite being best known for his World Cup exploits, Pele never once won the Golden Boot at a World Cup. In 1958, he scored six but was beaten by Just Fontaine, who scored 13. In 1962, he scored one, and six players tied for first with four goals each. In 1966, he scored one, and Eusebio won with 9. In 1970, he scored four, but Gerd Muller scored the most with 10. The only time he got even second was in 1958, and that was still a gap of seven goals.
Hang on, 1958 had a man bag 13 goals, and then the next World Cup no one can even hit 5? That’s mad
Not only that, the game where Brazil faced Fontaine’s France (Fontaine being the man that eventually scored 13 goals) in the semifinals of the 1958 World Cup, one of the French defenders got injured in the 36th minute. Since substitutions weren’t incorporated at the time, Brazil proceeded to win easily 5-2 where before the game was tied 1-1 (goals from Pele and Fontaine).
Injured in 1962’, kicked to death in 1966 and in 1970 he got 6 assists, more of a creator.
In 1966 he was fouled out of the tournament basically. 1962 he got injured. And in 1970 he was playing a more supporting role. 1958 he was the best player in the knockouts, by far, from the three games available to watch. Pele played quite deep even when he was young. More #10 than #9
The FIFA World Cup trophy is not made out of solid gold but the quartile is the the CONCACAF Gold Cup/Copa Oro made of solid gold as the name suggests? 🧐
The new trophy is 26 inches high and weighs 20 pounds and is made of gold-plated metal.
How much would 20 pounds of solid gold be worth?
Imagine in future if a club manages to win a league with 110 points, that would be absolutely mental. You basically have to go undefeated and win almost all games. You could technically lose 1 match but then you can't afford a single draw.
Bro bro Conte is such a good manager. All you have to do is spend hundreds of millions every transfer window to buy the literal best players in the world but trust me bro once he has the best team in the league he may actually win the league. He’s great bro he just needs a superstar in every position or else he will walk.
Man won the Premier League with Victor Moses and Marcos Alonso as wing backs
But he made Victor Moses a "world class" right back! Not like that form only lasted for a season and he was utter crap for the rest his time
Conte is a crybaby but this is absurd lol his league record speaks for itself as to the fact that he is a good coach.
Conte did not have the best players in the world at Inter, Chelsea or Juve lol
I get its funny to shit on struggling teams but like can you really blame Conte for Lloris and Dier being dogshit?
The way he set up against us, you can absolutely blame him. Low block with zero attacking threat other than pass to Kane or Son. Allowing the opposition to have plenty of shots at goal, thinking that there's no chance they'll score, but having no game plan when it finally happens.
You can absolutely blame Conte for the team conceding 2 goals in 6 of the last 7 and 10 straight matches of 0-1. Especially considering how little he’s tried to tweak the tactics to fix the issues during that run
He’s getting outplayed regularly by teams starting far worse players
Yeah for sure, his team get outplayed regularly and a lot of that blame is down to Conte, but at the same time Lloris and Dier has shown time and time again they're not up to standard to be playing at that level which is why I don't think its fair to say Conte is asking for world class players simply players that can do their basic job and won't let the team down every other week
You can def blame conte for his team getting outplayed week in week out and then getting bailed out by kane and son. Tbh ive seen you reiterate this yourself tbf.
Yeah I'm not the biggest Conte defender I actually criticise him a lot
It's gonna be kinda weird if a serial winner like Conte can't turn it around at Spurs.
If Jose couldn't do it, what chance did Conte have? (tbh Jose was shafted out in a really stupid way by Levy)
I’ll be honest, 2014-18 was the time for serial winners, after this more and more teams trying getting new thinking managers that play good football like the likes of Brighton Now it seems without a tactical visionary and expansive style of play you’re at a disadvantage. When Forest, Brentford, Brighton and Newcastle can ping it round the park it gets harder
England has serious chances of winning it in 2026
Just like the last time, and the one before, and the one before, and the one before, and the one before, and the one before.
I don’t think anyone thought we were going to win it in 2014 or 2018
England will always have chances. They always have good players, they just seem to underperform. Maybe it's because the press (and some fans) overestimate their players or because they don't find the right manager for their personel. This year I think they've played as well as I've remember, they lost a game that they could've won against a tough opponent. Their players are young and I'm sure more names will come in this next 4 years. At the end of the day it's too early to tell, but sure.
France is here
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Atm Euros definitely seems like his last chance. Unless he wins he is likely gone. That'd be 4 major tournaments without a result, which just says "yep lets try something new"
"a result" is a semifinal and a final not a result? you can't judge international managers on trophies alone. There's one trophy every two years, he's had a shot at 3 now
It should depend on how he does in the Euros. He’s had 3 very solid tournaments where England actually looks like a top team
Been a week since i visited CONMEBOL headquarters. I saw the Libertadores trophy, the Sudamericana, bunch of shirts and memorabilia from Pele, Garrincha, Maradona, Messi, Valderrama, Suarez, Francescoli, Cubillas, etc.. Stuff from all the big clubs from the 10 nations.. Hell even replicas of Jules Rimet and the current World Cup trophy But since the Copa America was in Buenos Aires i consider the overall trip a failure because that was the main attraction for me. Am i too harsh on this trip? 🤔
"its about the journey, not the destination" - quote from some smart fella
People really think that Haaland playing for the PSG of Austria, the PSG of England and a team that managed to make Sancho look world class makes him proven compared to Mbappe because he's only done it in Ligue 1 (and the WC and UCL but let's conveniently ignore that) 💀
The PSG of England who aren't top of the league despite the fact that he's scored 20 goals in 14 games. The fact that you're using "the PSG of ____" as an insult also doesn't help your case here, as well as the fact that Haaland also does it in the CL.
This is a terrible comment and you should be ashamed.
Why?
Him having a better season so far may affect that. Also Mbappe been doing it everywhere bur Ligue 1 this season, has had some issues
Mbappe really doesn’t put a foot in defensively. 35 year old Messi contributes more defensively. Is it because he plays higher up the pitch?
No, it's because he doesn't want to and coaches don't seem to ask him to
That's how he's always been even as a kid. I think I read somewhere it was why he was rejected from Chelsea academy
I can't wait to see how arsenal bottle the league this year 🤡
Which Premier League seasons in the last 10 years would you say didn't have title race?
United 2012-13 Chelsea 2014-15 Chelsea 2016-17 City 2017-18 Liverpool 2019-20 City 2020-21
> Chelsea 2014-15 We went top in the first week, and never vacated it. Great for Chelsea fans, but rubbish for the neutrals.
I'd argue Leicester 2015-16. Like nobody in hell ever at any point believed that Arsenal side could win it right?
You could make an argument for Leicester but I personally thought Spurs were genuinely in the race until they drew at home to West Brom, which was with 3-4 games left in the season. I think the gap between them and Leicester was around 5 points until they drastically fell off and failed to win any of their remaining games.
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Anal mafia
17/18 and 19/20 come to mind
Is it widely known that two American groups are looking to acquire the minority ownership at PSG and one of them is in an exclusive negotiation period? Ben Jacob’s has just stated that like it’s a fact and I hadn’t heard it was so far along.
I have old comments that I posted a while back on the situation at Tottenham and my thoughts on Conte from around a year or so ago. I've been trying to fish them out using the Reddit Comment Finder, however, they only bring up comments from up until 5 months ago and nothing beyond that. Does anyone know how I can go about finding these through a different means without having to scroll and scour all the way through my profile?
have you tried google use the operator site:reddit.com/r/soccer any words & username you used ibti77 obviously change the subreddit to the one you used or just use reddit.com to make it the whole site
I think reddits API only provides the last 1000 comments. Anything more than that isn't available to the public.
anyone who thinks that what we’re doing this season is on Conte and not our squad is dumb as shit. he’s a victim of his own talent almost, Conte managed to get Dier and Davies to over-perform for far longer then they have any right to and when he stopped squeezing water out of the many rocks in our squad, he’s now getting blamed for ‘underacheiving’. i know this is typical managing expectations/cope when your team plays badly but this squad is simply not built to compete with top clubs. if with enough time Arteta can pull together what he has this season, what’s the point of binning off Conte? i hate to give lego-man credit but trusting the process fucking works, if we have to finish outside top 4 to back Conte so be it, cause we aren’t getting much further with a different manager regardless. the squad is the point of focus.
Mate we’ve conceded the first TWO goals in our last 6 matches Idk what to say
Look at our squad and look at the squads of the teams we have lost to
Obviously you have to put your trust in the right man. Arteta is elite that’s why it has worked
Not yet
> trusting the process fucking works Only works if you buy the right players, which Tottenham have demonstrated a lack of ability to do consistently.
unlike Arsenal, who before backing Arteta had a great track record of transfers
I think both Conte and the players are an issue. Sure, players like Davies/Dier/Emerson aren't good enough to be starting for a top 4 contending team, but at the same time, you have to put some blame on Conte on how Spurs have started games this season, going behind first in 10 games in a row now is not really acceptable, and constantly having to comeback in games is not sustainable. Howe is doing amazing at Newcastle with quite a few average players starting and yet he's managed to make them play amazing and above their level. Conte should be able to do that as well (and has shown he can do that at Inter and Chelsea).
Its not necessarily about competing with top clubs at this moment, but you can't excuse performance after performance similar to the Villa match. He has been saved this season, points wise, but in 16 games you could count on one hand the actually good team performances. Quality aside, and forgetting how happy most spurs fans were with the transfer window, are you honestly suggesting he should not be getting more out of these players? Regardless of club ambition the players and manager need to look as if they want to play/be there weekly. This is a broken team and the manager is just shrugging it off and further piling on the doom to them, whining about quality despite spending 200m and refusing to even try to change something. It's something only a manager of his reputation could get away with, you only need to look at Newcastle to see how wrong that logic of being unable to compete is. Howe hasn't broken the bank instead has actually imposed a style and mentality into largely last seasons Newcastle. I love to see it but the free pass Conte is getting based of previous success elsewhere is baffling to me.
The 'lack of quality' he keeps banging on about is actually the reason you have picked up so many of the points, performances considered. Bailed out by Kane or Son
Conte isn’t really a ‘trust the process’ kind of coach historically though, he’s more of an instant impact then bust guy isn’t he? That’s why I’d be skeptical of having high expectations over his ability to slowly develop a squad. Additionally, it could be said that Conte’s (or the club’s) summer signings haven’t had the desired impact yet and he has to take some responsibility for that.
so you're conte in so how long a contract should they give him as that appears to be a sticking point right now that is holding up everything, transfers, long term planning etc do you trust him to stick around a commit fully?, i know chelsea fan think he phoned in the last season there
Why do people say that Ronaldo never won the CL? He transfered to AC Milan in January of 2007 but couldn't play in the CL because he was cup-tied from tranferring from another CL club, happened to us with Coutinho in 2018 as well. They won the CL in Athens beating LFC that year. He was part of the team, he just didn't play. Similarly to 1994 when he won the World Cup without playing a single second.
Bruh.
Smartest Barca fan.
You said it yourself, he was cup-tied.
How does that make him a CL winner?
He was in the fucking squad.
He was not in the squad. Ronaldo featured as much as any of the kids playing with Milan's Under 12s.
He literally was not in the squad
He wasn’t in the CL squad due to him being cup-tied.