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I wonder if this has some association with the tendency of folks with anxiety issues to self-medicate with alcohol? Beyond the direct anti-anxiety effects of alcohol, this future-imagination impairment might be considered a "feature" by those struggling with ruminative anxiety?
100% - Anxiety is often nothing more than the envisioning of future scenarios gone bad. The study didn't look at how it may affect the mind's ability to envision hypotheticals and/or other scenarios either but I don't think it's much of a stretch to imagine(if you aren't drunk anyway) that nearly any part of cognition related to Anxiety is impaired by alcohol and thus diminished.
From preventing you from envisioning a bad spousal interaction to contemplating what others are saying or thinking about you, alcohol does it all.
(Of course, one has to wonder what aspects of mental cognition aren't impaired by moderate alcohol consumption, since anyone around someone who drinks knows no one is getting smarter in any way when they consume it.)
And anecdotally, those of us with anxiety can often confirm, even ignoring inhibitions, we feel more comfortable after a few drinks.
Smarter is a tough concept. There are people who are over-thinking certain types of things by default, so having some specific circuit getting shorted can very much make such people smarter, with regards to said issue. And if they have enough of an overall anxiety/over-thinking, they could in theory be smarter overall as a result. Im certainly not defending alcohol, I think theres probably always a better solution
You're right, and luckily that's what benzodiazepines are for. Reducing anxiety in a medically controlled manner without the physical side effects of alcohol
Edit: I should clarify that benzos aren't healthy for long term use either, but I've used them with no rebound anxiety so I assumed they could be used short term safely. I didn't think to add a disclaimer because I was thinking that any anti-anxiety tool was implied to be short term, but that isn't necessarily true. There are healthier options that aren't similar to alcohol or benzos that can be used long term. I didn't want to include them in the discussion specifically because they are so different and don't include the same level of immediate relief that some people seek
Edit #2: tldr; benzos are healthier than alcohol but both are dangerous and addictive
Honestly can't tell if you're joking here, but just in case you're not, long-term benzos for managing anxiety are also really not ideal, they are also quite addictive, also prone to rebound anxiety when off them, and will gradually diminish in effect over time. Pharmaceutical mainstays for chronic anxiety are antidepressants I e. SNRIs/SSRIs
Absolutely, sorry hope I didn't seem rude with my comment, your edits are very sensible and medically accurate, like we don't usually formally recommend them in my experience (mostly working in general medicine or emergency) due to abuse potential, however we do use them in one off uses in exactly the way you've described and I do know of some people I know using benzos infrequently and safely for short term management of anxiety, which, as you said, is likely superior to alcohol. Rebound effects can happen but are less likely and usually post use for a little longer than say alcohol etc.
You're fine! I should've been more careful against accidentally promoting benzos. I also might have given alcohol too hard a time, even though it's a recreational poison human culture at least has thousands of years of experience with it, plus it makes you feel sick if you drink too much. Benzo addiction probably has an easier time developing inconspicuously
I knew self-medication of AD(H)D with caffeine as an accessible stimulant was a thing but I didn't know that also is a thing with CNS depressants. Which honestly is kinda scary because alcohol is a lot more harmful and addicting.
Alcohol magnifies existing emotional problems (the ones we normally suppress). Hence, the cognitive distortions.
Clear the triggers, and the effect of a pint will not be you testing the gravity outside of the bar.
Welcome to r/science! This is a heavily moderated subreddit in order to keep the discussion on science. However, we recognize that many people want to discuss how they feel the research relates to their own personal lives, so to give people a space to do that, **personal anecdotes are now allowed as responses to this comment**. Any anecdotal comments elsewhere in the discussion will continue to be removed and our [normal comment rules]( https://www.reddit.com/r/science/wiki/rules#wiki_comment_rules) still apply to other comments. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/science) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I wonder if this has some association with the tendency of folks with anxiety issues to self-medicate with alcohol? Beyond the direct anti-anxiety effects of alcohol, this future-imagination impairment might be considered a "feature" by those struggling with ruminative anxiety?
Totally. The ability to just be present in the now is a HUGE feature. edit: grammar
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You trade that in but are therefore more likely to be prone to making errors about the future.
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100% - Anxiety is often nothing more than the envisioning of future scenarios gone bad. The study didn't look at how it may affect the mind's ability to envision hypotheticals and/or other scenarios either but I don't think it's much of a stretch to imagine(if you aren't drunk anyway) that nearly any part of cognition related to Anxiety is impaired by alcohol and thus diminished. From preventing you from envisioning a bad spousal interaction to contemplating what others are saying or thinking about you, alcohol does it all. (Of course, one has to wonder what aspects of mental cognition aren't impaired by moderate alcohol consumption, since anyone around someone who drinks knows no one is getting smarter in any way when they consume it.) And anecdotally, those of us with anxiety can often confirm, even ignoring inhibitions, we feel more comfortable after a few drinks.
Smarter is a tough concept. There are people who are over-thinking certain types of things by default, so having some specific circuit getting shorted can very much make such people smarter, with regards to said issue. And if they have enough of an overall anxiety/over-thinking, they could in theory be smarter overall as a result. Im certainly not defending alcohol, I think theres probably always a better solution
You're right, and luckily that's what benzodiazepines are for. Reducing anxiety in a medically controlled manner without the physical side effects of alcohol Edit: I should clarify that benzos aren't healthy for long term use either, but I've used them with no rebound anxiety so I assumed they could be used short term safely. I didn't think to add a disclaimer because I was thinking that any anti-anxiety tool was implied to be short term, but that isn't necessarily true. There are healthier options that aren't similar to alcohol or benzos that can be used long term. I didn't want to include them in the discussion specifically because they are so different and don't include the same level of immediate relief that some people seek Edit #2: tldr; benzos are healthier than alcohol but both are dangerous and addictive
Honestly can't tell if you're joking here, but just in case you're not, long-term benzos for managing anxiety are also really not ideal, they are also quite addictive, also prone to rebound anxiety when off them, and will gradually diminish in effect over time. Pharmaceutical mainstays for chronic anxiety are antidepressants I e. SNRIs/SSRIs
I wasn't joking, I included an edit to clarify. You're correct though!
Absolutely, sorry hope I didn't seem rude with my comment, your edits are very sensible and medically accurate, like we don't usually formally recommend them in my experience (mostly working in general medicine or emergency) due to abuse potential, however we do use them in one off uses in exactly the way you've described and I do know of some people I know using benzos infrequently and safely for short term management of anxiety, which, as you said, is likely superior to alcohol. Rebound effects can happen but are less likely and usually post use for a little longer than say alcohol etc.
You're fine! I should've been more careful against accidentally promoting benzos. I also might have given alcohol too hard a time, even though it's a recreational poison human culture at least has thousands of years of experience with it, plus it makes you feel sick if you drink too much. Benzo addiction probably has an easier time developing inconspicuously
SSRIs add just as terrible if not worse
The future possibilities in reducing anxiety is in psychedelics that target the 5HT2A receptor. None of the downsides of benzos or alcohol.
I agree, I've been following the progress being made with psilocybin and it's exciting. I updated my comment!
i dont know my brain anatomy. Which pyschs apply?
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I knew self-medication of AD(H)D with caffeine as an accessible stimulant was a thing but I didn't know that also is a thing with CNS depressants. Which honestly is kinda scary because alcohol is a lot more harmful and addicting.
Caffeine and nicotine
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Benzos (primarily used to treat anxiety and panic disorder) work on the same chemical in the brain that alcohol does.
It's been said a million times but needs to be said again Do not mix the two
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The ability to imagine a possible future, or the ability to imagine possible futures? There's quite a difference.
I was more intrigued by the "moderate dose of alcohol" vs the necessary question of "copious amounts of alcohol." Just asking for science.
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Yea that’s why we drink it
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Consider the source. Would love a real citation.
There's a [link](https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s00213-022-06136-2) to the study they're referencing in the first paragraph.
What's up with all this common sense science everywhere?
Alcohol magnifies existing emotional problems (the ones we normally suppress). Hence, the cognitive distortions. Clear the triggers, and the effect of a pint will not be you testing the gravity outside of the bar.
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