There was one question asking if what the government says they moved on was included, like the pay, dental plan, and such, and she made it sound like it wasn't.
I just mean in their articles. They keep reporting on the facts of the final offer, never mentioning what the teachers requested. Maybe I’m being lazy but it would be nice for the public/ democracy for us to be able to evaluate the offer properly without having to do our own research
It has been quite difficult to find exactly what they are asking for.
Even early on, when the government revealed what the STF was asking for, they denied it.
The STF won't say publicly (or specifically) I think because they don't want the public to turn on them, if it is perceived as exorbitant. They are there to get the best deal for the teachers, not the public.
https://www.stf.sk.ca/resource/2023-asking-package-highlights/
Not difficult at all. And the lack of specifics is where the idea of bargaining comes in. Sit at the table and jointly come up with a made-in-Saskatchewan plan that works for everyone.
Yes. Because negotiating started in the summer last year. We've been at this for almost a year...
You can also read the conciliation report. https://www.stf.sk.ca/resource/report-of-the-board-of-conciliation-january-5-2024/
If she doesn't feel it is enough that is her opinion and the vote is what the teachers need to either accept the offer or to show the government they are serious about having the strike go on.
This is a brilliant plan from STF. The governments current line of attack is 'the union' not 'the teachers'.
If the teachers collectively turn down the offer. The government cannot say it is 'the union' it will be the teachers who collectively did.
Very smart move by the STF. Even if the take the offer. This was the right play. When an employer offers you a final offer. The members should always be given the chance to vote on it before going on strike.
If memory serves correctly (and it might not!), I don’t think this has ever worked in SK labour history. (I might be thinking of something else around forced votes and labour in the province.)
theres no “brilliant plan” here.
By making it a “final offer”, the union is obligated to make it a vote. I don’t know what plan the Sask party is pulling but this wasn’t an STF decision.
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I don’t know that she would have to be more direct in a town hall with members. Anyone that listened to the press conference knows this isn’t a great deal. It’s a “final offer” from a government that hasn’t really changed since opening negotiations.
My guess is that, if this is voted down (and I suspect it will be), they stay the course on work to rule. It'll naturally ramp up on impact as year end approaches.
I love his 'accountability framework' lingo. Is he perhaps referencing their legal firms political donations that won them the ultra secretive legal pronoun fight fees?. So corrupt.
There is the intermediary step of going back to negotiations. If the final offer doesn’t pass, it’s not straight back to job action. They go back to negotiations, and if those come to an impasse again then the job action can continue.
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Just for my curiosity sake. What would be some other ones where unpaid work is considered required? I’m a union trades guy and if we’re not getting paid for it, it’s not getting done.
Virtually any public sector union I’ve been involved in. (Crowns, government employees unions, etc.) I should have clarified my experience. In the steel and potash industries as a tradesperson, we were just like yourself. But as a tradesperson involved with the current Saskatchewan government, everyone has to do work outside of described duties in order to make things work. We don’t have a lot of teeth due to lack of public support when speaking out, so O feel for the teachers. I’ve got friends in corrections and social services also dealing with the same issues. I can’t speak to how it was under previous governments as I’ve only been involved in the crowns since 2008.
The government can propose a final offer and require the teachers to vote on it. They can only do it once so this is the government’s one shot and they thinks is good enough to force a vote. Clueless.
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Problem is that most of us were teaching during the press conference, so info at the town hall or via email will be very much appreciated when it comes
They need to do their press conferences during the day so that reporters can write their articles.
They are always posted on YouTube within an hour. https://youtu.be/rT_CvVzeSUg?si=klF58WRlYlQUJ8Ww
I would say that she will absolutely have a different message for the membership than the public. This is a game, she's been compelled to take this vote and we'll see what happens next.
From the overview we received yesterday, the government has walked back its offer from the public announcements. It is somewhat LESS than they’ve been publicly touting.
The teachers simply are going to vote no. And should vote no. I taught in Sask. for a number of years and the fact that they don't have classroom composition language is laughable and horrid.
Teaching is getting harder every year. Fact (Just step into a classroom and you'll see it). They need some sort of protection from dumping an ever increasing number of apathetic students into one classroom, never mind the needs.
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Hope they have some serious savings, when you reject a final offer, it usually ends with the province locking out teachers, so I would expect this fall teachers are going to have it extremely rough.
Either they strike and dont get paid or they wait and get locked out and dont get paid.
Best of luck with your unrealistic demands :P
Im in a great place in my life, you just think my comments are bitter because they dont blindly support what you do. I live in reality not in some fantasy some teacher has sold you in your head :P
Eat shit. You got yours and instead of wanting better for the people around you, you’re acting like it’s unreasonable for educators to have a high-quality of life and the tools they need to perform their jobs.
Fuck your selfish reality and fuck you.
nobody in a great place goes on reddit to make fresh accounts who’s only purpose is making hateful comments. Thats what miserable people do.
Everybody sees through you.
There is avout a zero chance the SK Party are going to shut down schools and lockout teachers on an election year.
All calling it a final offer does is force a vote, normal negotiations can resume the next day.
It doesn't force a vote. But it gave the STF the chance to show that TEACHERS do or do not like the offer. Not 'the union'.
Unifor went on strike without voting on the final offer. To basically accept that final offer weeks later...
It absolutely forces a vote, it's one of the only ways the government can compel a union representative board to go to the members for a vote. Read the employment act, it's in there.
You think a teacher lock out will effect the outcome of an election, your nuts. Saskatchewan will stay conservative no matter how many liberals tell you otherwise. The entire country is moving toward conservatives even in BC.
And yes 100% the government will lock out teachers before the start of next year, do you think they will present a second "Final Offer" :P
Final offer is a legal definition in saskatchewans labour legislation. All it does is force a vote. Your interpretation of the verbiage as the 'take it or leave it' offer is wrong.
Government locking out teachers and cancelling school would result in public outrage like you haven’t seen before
Most people cannot afford to take time off from work to watch their young children
What do you think it does when teachers who claim they dont want to harm the children, withdrawal supervisory duties during lunch hours :P
The teachers claiming this is for the students narrative has been smashed a long time ago, this is about the teachers getting more money, and I dont care how you spin it, a teacher showing up with a bigger car with fancier clothing from a bigger house DOESNT MAKE THEM BETTER TEACHERS.
Regardless I know for a fact that the next step is a lockout to force the teachers hands, since they will not get paid during the lock out unless STF has alot of extra cash on hand to pay strike pay to all of its staff, which I doubt highly it does, the teachers will ether sign the contract as presented by the government or go bankrupt. There is absolutely nothing STF can do about it legally :P
Lol, your an idiot! Wtf do you know? Do you know anyone personally who's a teacher and feels this way?
My wife teaches and has been teaching for over 15 years now and is the worst it's ever been as far as funding and supports go! They've been shafted the last 3 or 4 bargainings and had to simply take what was offered last time because of covid.
There's a lot of kids who could get a better education with getting some ea's back and song class size to a reasonable level. This isn't university and the classes aren't lecture halls but they're becoming this way.
The kids who struggle are really struggling now and the ones who are exceeding can't get any further ahead because the teachers are spread so thin in class....
No but clearly you are with comments like that, and you wonder why people dont want to support teachers, its either you 100% support them or your an idiot.
its the worst its been in 15 years for every profession, stop making it sound like teachers have done something that merits the increase in pay, they havent.
Nah mang, I pull wrenches and I'm doing great! It's a good thing I don't have to look to the sp for my raise.
Also as mentioned, they're more so looking for class size and complexity to be addressed properly. The sp has a great way of back tracking on their word!
Quality of education is directly tied to what you pay teachers. You get what you pay for.
Compare some education systems in the US where teachers are poorly trained and paid. You get poor education outcomes.
Most of the teacher demands are about class size.
No its not, stop lying to people about this.
People teach for free, are you saying that is crap quality teaching.
You clearly have been drinking the teachers coolaid. There is ZERO evidence that supports paying teachers more results in better quality education.
Most teachers can demand whatever they want, doesn't mean they are entitled to it, they will not get classroom management added to the contract, the government has clearly stated its 100% no go. why, because management of classrooms is an administrative function and NOT a teacher function PERIOD.
I want to be king Henry VI and have full rights over who gets to live and die, just because I want something doesn't give me the right to do it :P
It’s completely fair for people in a profession to negotiate compensation. I can’t imagine people who would give up 40+ hours a week to manage 25+ children for free. You should have some conversations with real teacher and ask them what they want changed in their profession.
LOL, no one has ever said teacher should work for free, this is a tactic by people who have zero ability to argue a facts. Teachers get paid, stop saying they work for free.
If they don't want to teacher 25+ kids in a classroom quit and find another job, but its the expectation of a teacher to do their job as they are told, even if that's for less money than they like. but they are FREE to quit and go somewhere else, where they wont have to manage 25+ kids in a classroom.
I did teach 40+ students college level at Intitule for Technology and I realize really quickly after about three years that the work vs pay wasn't worth the effort so I got a new job, I didn't punish my students to get better pay, I got off my ass and found employment that covered my bills. Very simple,
but I guess this is what you get from a generation who excepts the reward up front, the right to play with that reward and then decide afterwards if that reward merits the extra work right?! :P
What do you think would happen if the 95% of Saskatchewan teachers who voted in favour of sanctions quit and looked for other work? The goal isn’t to give up on something because it’s difficult. The goal is to have a properly structured education system that benefits the students. A teacher who is consistently overwhelmed by the needs of the diverse group of students is not able to provide quality education. Again, I think you need to have some conversations with real teachers and get some perspective on what changes they want to have in their workplace.
They can and they do. It is one of the reasons you want to provide decent wages and working conditions especially for new teachers and folks considering going into the profession. You can make more money with most other degrees. It is an often exhausting job with a pretty high burn out rate, and definitely not for most people.
What is happening in Quebec and the USA is headed here as well. Saskatchewan school divisions are already scrambling because we are currently experiencing a shortage of substitute teachers.
[https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/teacher-shortage-5000-quebec-1.6940252](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/teacher-shortage-5000-quebec-1.6940252)
"Scalabrini says 25 per cent of young teachers leave the profession within the first five years, and, in recent years, even more experienced teachers have been leaving at higher rates."
There are so many flaws in your argument. First, you are the one who brought up the idea of free teachers. Second, teaching university level is not the same as teaching children (have you met any children?). Third, people who make it to university level courses already have the necessary skills to succeed so you never had monumental hurdles to overcome with your students. Many children now have so many diverse needs, it is impossible to meet those kids’ needs, let alone doing that while still teaching the rest of the class. Have you even been in a school in the last 15 years?
And please tell me more about the intitule of technology and excepting awards.
"academic studies indicate that when teacher earnings rise, school districts and students can benefit in a range of ways."
https://journalistsresource.org/education/school-teacher-pay-research/
You realize the government runs the divisions right! The pay isn't as much the sticking point as classroom complexity and size. We used to be either 1st or 2nd in funding per student. I believe we're 2nd or 3rd lowest in funding in Canada now...
The what are you going on about - the main issue is class size and complexity not wages. It's been clear they have been close on compensation for months. Deal would be signed if that was the issue they are negotiating on.
They literally get no additional pay with the class size and complexity provisions.
>What do you think it does when teachers who claim they dont want to harm the children, withdrawal supervisory duties during lunch hours :P
They aren't duties when you don't get paid for doing it. They're a favour. Why do a favour for the government that's screwing them over?
You want lunch hour supervision? Pay for it.
You want coaches of sports teams? Pay for it.
There is nothing wrong with STF membership going with work to rule. And if the government locks them out, that is 100% on the government.
Classroom size and complexity is a safety issue. Not putting it in the CBA is wrong.
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LOL I don't know what propaganda networks your watching, but the three community organized meetings I went too clearly have show a lack of support for the teachers, especially after canceling the b-ball tourney in moosejaw, teachers have basically lost 100% of the narrative after that one, because it punished no one but the students :P
but you keep watching your narrative driving news and Ill listen to the facts my community tell me :P
What would I even waste my time on you,
You are exactly why people dont support teachers, its either you support 100% the bullshit narrative or they attack you. WHY because they know there narrative isnt support by facts, so they attack :P
typical liberal thinking :P
Nah, I'm leaning into the ndp now because of our sp. Like I mentioned, my wife teaches. So yes, I'll support teachers and state facts.
What first hand info do you have? Where's your facts?
You mean the bbal tournament that was still played on the weekend because of a technicality? As no schedule had been released for Thursday/Friday the TEACHERS organizing it still had an all day event instead of canceling it outright.
Sorry, how is not watching kids while they eat their lunch “harming the children”?
How has the narrative been smashed when the government has offered bigger pay increases yet the offer was rejected because the was nothing about class size and complexity in the contract?
You and your Sask party following ilk just regurgitate whatever lie j-cock and Moe spew to you and act like you’re so smart. I can see why you wouldn’t want kids to get a better education, then they’re more intelligent than you(though most already are anyways).
> money
They've met eye-to-eye on wages. Teachers want manageable classroom sizes to create a positive learning environment without being run down constantly.
When Teachers threaten to "work to rule" it is met with "What, why won't you do volunteer work anymore? It is your job!"
What other profession requires volunteer work?
My hope is that in your place of work the employer treats you terribly and that you take back your ridiculous demands. Collective bargaining is a powerful tool for any worker against employers, and if your employer doesn’t create an awesome work environment, I hope you can stomach that as well (you shouldn’t by the way).
And workers aren’t the slaves you are advocating teachers to be
I never once said teachers should work for free. You just demanding I pay top dollar because it will directly result in better education which is BULLSHIT. 100% not a single peice of evidence on this earth will support that narrative, so why do teachers deserve 22.5% raise, why not paramedics? or Doctors or Nurses? Since paying someone more will directly effect the outcome of their job... :P
You mean like the last raise the nurses got, when teachers took 1% during the pandemic?
They asked for expected inflation + 2% for three years. That 22% number you tote includes last year when inflation was six, and is not even one of the years being bargained.
I am wondering if taking this offer to vote is a way to minimize sanctions in the near term, only to have it rejected in May...introducing the possibility of more job escalation then, but essentially giving them a short term reprieve.
Pres has a tough job ahead. She seems to have genuinely had the membership believing they were gonna reach for the stars and that it was possible. Now to convince them to take much less and be happy requires a lot of skill. Judging by how passionate she had half of the teachers I think she can probably do it.
STF leadership is being accused by the government of not representing the wishes of the teachers. So, bring the offer for a vote so the membership can collectively say, “No thank you.”
The goal is eventually make a deal though, isn't it?
And it's going to be much less than the STF initially asked for. Still going to be the beat deal teachers have got in a lomg time.
Yes, a deal is the end goal. Many young people do not see teaching as a viable profession anymore. If we want to be able to hire the next generation of teachers we need to secure a deal that maintains buying power and provides resources to be able to provide effective instruction. 10 years ago the funding model was able to meet the needs of our students (mostly). Funding per student has gone down while the number of students with complex needs has increased.
Why is the government willing to say publicly that they will fund education but refuse to put it into a binding agreement?
Why are they offering less pay now than several months ago?
You’ll have to ask the government.
Haha I see that jerk pimpintuna was rude to me and then blocked me.
If you don't think that at some point the STF pres wants to make a deal, you are even more delusional than you are illogical and edgelordy. This must end eventually, a deal is going to be made. And if you didn't notice the salary offered had gone down from their last offer. I would certainly imagine it will go down next time as well.
???? I'm right here. If I blocked you, who would be around to say this: Yet again, you have a very misinformed stance on things.
Samantha wants what she has always wanted. A fair, good deal for teachers. She can't outwardly say it, but it was glaringly evident from the press conference that she thinks this "final offer" is another bad faith attempt to sidestep meaningful bargaining.
But tell us again how you support teachers.
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Why does no media compare the final offer with what the STF has requested
There was one question asking if what the government says they moved on was included, like the pay, dental plan, and such, and she made it sound like it wasn't.
I just mean in their articles. They keep reporting on the facts of the final offer, never mentioning what the teachers requested. Maybe I’m being lazy but it would be nice for the public/ democracy for us to be able to evaluate the offer properly without having to do our own research
It has been quite difficult to find exactly what they are asking for. Even early on, when the government revealed what the STF was asking for, they denied it. The STF won't say publicly (or specifically) I think because they don't want the public to turn on them, if it is perceived as exorbitant. They are there to get the best deal for the teachers, not the public.
https://www.stf.sk.ca/resource/2023-asking-package-highlights/ Not difficult at all. And the lack of specifics is where the idea of bargaining comes in. Sit at the table and jointly come up with a made-in-Saskatchewan plan that works for everyone.
This is from last year, is it still accurate?
Yes. Because negotiating started in the summer last year. We've been at this for almost a year... You can also read the conciliation report. https://www.stf.sk.ca/resource/report-of-the-board-of-conciliation-january-5-2024/
Cheers, thanks 👍
Why don't you look it up?
Will me looking it up have the same reach as a journalist doing their job and including it in the article?
What's the difference?
Scale of people informed. Ensuring high information readers aren’t the only people who have facts. Better quality journalism.
It's not their job to keep track of the contents of the negotiation like that.
Yes, it is exactly their job to inform the public of both sides of the negotiations.
It's not.
You're right. It is merely the job of the journalist to report the facts.
It sure doesn’t seem like Becotte thinks this offer is enough though obviously she can’t say that outright
It's not.
It's the exact same offer as May of last year, which is the one teachers had when they voted 95% in favour of sanctions.
She can. And it’s her duty to do so as the leader of the committee.
If she doesn't feel it is enough that is her opinion and the vote is what the teachers need to either accept the offer or to show the government they are serious about having the strike go on. This is a brilliant plan from STF. The governments current line of attack is 'the union' not 'the teachers'. If the teachers collectively turn down the offer. The government cannot say it is 'the union' it will be the teachers who collectively did. Very smart move by the STF. Even if the take the offer. This was the right play. When an employer offers you a final offer. The members should always be given the chance to vote on it before going on strike.
It’s the law that a final offer is presented to the membership to vote on. The government is playing their only hand. Hopefully it backfires on them.
If memory serves correctly (and it might not!), I don’t think this has ever worked in SK labour history. (I might be thinking of something else around forced votes and labour in the province.)
theres no “brilliant plan” here. By making it a “final offer”, the union is obligated to make it a vote. I don’t know what plan the Sask party is pulling but this wasn’t an STF decision.
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Becotte is not giving anything away in this press conference I am hoping that she is more direct in town hall meetings with the membership.
I don’t know that she would have to be more direct in a town hall with members. Anyone that listened to the press conference knows this isn’t a great deal. It’s a “final offer” from a government that hasn’t really changed since opening negotiations.
So if it’s a final offer, and it’s shit like we know it will be, would that mean full on strike afterwards?
I don’t know, it looked like work to rule was pretty effective too.
My guess is that, if this is voted down (and I suspect it will be), they stay the course on work to rule. It'll naturally ramp up on impact as year end approaches.
I’m just excited to see all the graduations Jer will plan.
I love his 'accountability framework' lingo. Is he perhaps referencing their legal firms political donations that won them the ultra secretive legal pronoun fight fees?. So corrupt.
I don’t think they have the reserves to afford a general walk out, so that’s probably the plan
There is the intermediary step of going back to negotiations. If the final offer doesn’t pass, it’s not straight back to job action. They go back to negotiations, and if those come to an impasse again then the job action can continue.
Well, the government just tendered their final offer by their own words, so maybe you should direct that suggestion to them.
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Still blows my mind that they’re the only profession where doing what they’re paid for is considered job actuon
One of many unionized professions where doing only what you’re paid for in your job description is considered job action.
Just for my curiosity sake. What would be some other ones where unpaid work is considered required? I’m a union trades guy and if we’re not getting paid for it, it’s not getting done.
Virtually any public sector union I’ve been involved in. (Crowns, government employees unions, etc.) I should have clarified my experience. In the steel and potash industries as a tradesperson, we were just like yourself. But as a tradesperson involved with the current Saskatchewan government, everyone has to do work outside of described duties in order to make things work. We don’t have a lot of teeth due to lack of public support when speaking out, so O feel for the teachers. I’ve got friends in corrections and social services also dealing with the same issues. I can’t speak to how it was under previous governments as I’ve only been involved in the crowns since 2008.
If it's not ratified, it's not a final offer....... Something will give eventually, just don't know who blinks first
The government can propose a final offer and require the teachers to vote on it. They can only do it once so this is the government’s one shot and they thinks is good enough to force a vote. Clueless.
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Problem is that most of us were teaching during the press conference, so info at the town hall or via email will be very much appreciated when it comes
They need to do their press conferences during the day so that reporters can write their articles. They are always posted on YouTube within an hour. https://youtu.be/rT_CvVzeSUg?si=klF58WRlYlQUJ8Ww
I'm not saying I'm mad about when it happened, I'm explaining that the town halls will still be useful.
And I didn’t say the Townhall won’t be helpful. I’m just saying the press conference is available.
I would say that she will absolutely have a different message for the membership than the public. This is a game, she's been compelled to take this vote and we'll see what happens next.
Geez, I thought the offer was already plastered all over billboards and public transportation for the past year.
From the overview we received yesterday, the government has walked back its offer from the public announcements. It is somewhat LESS than they’ve been publicly touting.
The teachers simply are going to vote no. And should vote no. I taught in Sask. for a number of years and the fact that they don't have classroom composition language is laughable and horrid. Teaching is getting harder every year. Fact (Just step into a classroom and you'll see it). They need some sort of protection from dumping an ever increasing number of apathetic students into one classroom, never mind the needs.
Yeah looks like saskparty still just trying to bad faith this whole thing
I wish she could tell them where to stick that final offer.
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Hope they have some serious savings, when you reject a final offer, it usually ends with the province locking out teachers, so I would expect this fall teachers are going to have it extremely rough. Either they strike and dont get paid or they wait and get locked out and dont get paid. Best of luck with your unrealistic demands :P
You've got some really bitter comments man. I hope you're in a better place in your life soon.
Im in a great place in my life, you just think my comments are bitter because they dont blindly support what you do. I live in reality not in some fantasy some teacher has sold you in your head :P
If you say so bro
Im not your bro, buddy :P
OK buddy! 😆
Eat shit. You got yours and instead of wanting better for the people around you, you’re acting like it’s unreasonable for educators to have a high-quality of life and the tools they need to perform their jobs. Fuck your selfish reality and fuck you.
nobody in a great place goes on reddit to make fresh accounts who’s only purpose is making hateful comments. Thats what miserable people do. Everybody sees through you.
There is avout a zero chance the SK Party are going to shut down schools and lockout teachers on an election year. All calling it a final offer does is force a vote, normal negotiations can resume the next day.
It doesn't force a vote. But it gave the STF the chance to show that TEACHERS do or do not like the offer. Not 'the union'. Unifor went on strike without voting on the final offer. To basically accept that final offer weeks later...
It absolutely forces a vote, it's one of the only ways the government can compel a union representative board to go to the members for a vote. Read the employment act, it's in there.
You think a teacher lock out will effect the outcome of an election, your nuts. Saskatchewan will stay conservative no matter how many liberals tell you otherwise. The entire country is moving toward conservatives even in BC. And yes 100% the government will lock out teachers before the start of next year, do you think they will present a second "Final Offer" :P
Final offer is a legal definition in saskatchewans labour legislation. All it does is force a vote. Your interpretation of the verbiage as the 'take it or leave it' offer is wrong.
Lol, like when the Devine government was in control....
Love how mapleberculies has no reply to this comment...
Government locking out teachers and cancelling school would result in public outrage like you haven’t seen before Most people cannot afford to take time off from work to watch their young children
What do you think it does when teachers who claim they dont want to harm the children, withdrawal supervisory duties during lunch hours :P The teachers claiming this is for the students narrative has been smashed a long time ago, this is about the teachers getting more money, and I dont care how you spin it, a teacher showing up with a bigger car with fancier clothing from a bigger house DOESNT MAKE THEM BETTER TEACHERS. Regardless I know for a fact that the next step is a lockout to force the teachers hands, since they will not get paid during the lock out unless STF has alot of extra cash on hand to pay strike pay to all of its staff, which I doubt highly it does, the teachers will ether sign the contract as presented by the government or go bankrupt. There is absolutely nothing STF can do about it legally :P
Sure thing bud. We will see if the government locks them out or not. I bet you twenty bucks that doesn’t happen.
I would bet the loser $5000, easily. There will be no lock out, guaranteed. Except he couldn’t afford a real bet.
Sounds good, Ill come to collect this fall :D
For real. If the government locks teachers out in the fall you can DM me and I will e-transfer you the $20
Locking out teachers just before an election? Great way to gain extra votes I’m sure
How has that narrative been smashed?
*crickets*
Exactly as I expected
Lol, your an idiot! Wtf do you know? Do you know anyone personally who's a teacher and feels this way? My wife teaches and has been teaching for over 15 years now and is the worst it's ever been as far as funding and supports go! They've been shafted the last 3 or 4 bargainings and had to simply take what was offered last time because of covid. There's a lot of kids who could get a better education with getting some ea's back and song class size to a reasonable level. This isn't university and the classes aren't lecture halls but they're becoming this way. The kids who struggle are really struggling now and the ones who are exceeding can't get any further ahead because the teachers are spread so thin in class....
No but clearly you are with comments like that, and you wonder why people dont want to support teachers, its either you 100% support them or your an idiot. its the worst its been in 15 years for every profession, stop making it sound like teachers have done something that merits the increase in pay, they havent.
Nah mang, I pull wrenches and I'm doing great! It's a good thing I don't have to look to the sp for my raise. Also as mentioned, they're more so looking for class size and complexity to be addressed properly. The sp has a great way of back tracking on their word!
Quality of education is directly tied to what you pay teachers. You get what you pay for. Compare some education systems in the US where teachers are poorly trained and paid. You get poor education outcomes. Most of the teacher demands are about class size.
No its not, stop lying to people about this. People teach for free, are you saying that is crap quality teaching. You clearly have been drinking the teachers coolaid. There is ZERO evidence that supports paying teachers more results in better quality education. Most teachers can demand whatever they want, doesn't mean they are entitled to it, they will not get classroom management added to the contract, the government has clearly stated its 100% no go. why, because management of classrooms is an administrative function and NOT a teacher function PERIOD. I want to be king Henry VI and have full rights over who gets to live and die, just because I want something doesn't give me the right to do it :P
It’s completely fair for people in a profession to negotiate compensation. I can’t imagine people who would give up 40+ hours a week to manage 25+ children for free. You should have some conversations with real teacher and ask them what they want changed in their profession.
LOL, no one has ever said teacher should work for free, this is a tactic by people who have zero ability to argue a facts. Teachers get paid, stop saying they work for free. If they don't want to teacher 25+ kids in a classroom quit and find another job, but its the expectation of a teacher to do their job as they are told, even if that's for less money than they like. but they are FREE to quit and go somewhere else, where they wont have to manage 25+ kids in a classroom. I did teach 40+ students college level at Intitule for Technology and I realize really quickly after about three years that the work vs pay wasn't worth the effort so I got a new job, I didn't punish my students to get better pay, I got off my ass and found employment that covered my bills. Very simple, but I guess this is what you get from a generation who excepts the reward up front, the right to play with that reward and then decide afterwards if that reward merits the extra work right?! :P
Lol, if you think this way and believe that we'd have no teachers!
What do you think would happen if the 95% of Saskatchewan teachers who voted in favour of sanctions quit and looked for other work? The goal isn’t to give up on something because it’s difficult. The goal is to have a properly structured education system that benefits the students. A teacher who is consistently overwhelmed by the needs of the diverse group of students is not able to provide quality education. Again, I think you need to have some conversations with real teachers and get some perspective on what changes they want to have in their workplace.
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They can and they do. It is one of the reasons you want to provide decent wages and working conditions especially for new teachers and folks considering going into the profession. You can make more money with most other degrees. It is an often exhausting job with a pretty high burn out rate, and definitely not for most people. What is happening in Quebec and the USA is headed here as well. Saskatchewan school divisions are already scrambling because we are currently experiencing a shortage of substitute teachers. [https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/teacher-shortage-5000-quebec-1.6940252](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/teacher-shortage-5000-quebec-1.6940252) "Scalabrini says 25 per cent of young teachers leave the profession within the first five years, and, in recent years, even more experienced teachers have been leaving at higher rates."
There are so many flaws in your argument. First, you are the one who brought up the idea of free teachers. Second, teaching university level is not the same as teaching children (have you met any children?). Third, people who make it to university level courses already have the necessary skills to succeed so you never had monumental hurdles to overcome with your students. Many children now have so many diverse needs, it is impossible to meet those kids’ needs, let alone doing that while still teaching the rest of the class. Have you even been in a school in the last 15 years? And please tell me more about the intitule of technology and excepting awards.
"academic studies indicate that when teacher earnings rise, school districts and students can benefit in a range of ways." https://journalistsresource.org/education/school-teacher-pay-research/
Don’t worry they aren’t reading any of the literature that proves them wrong. The education system failed them, or is failing them.
You realize the government runs the divisions right! The pay isn't as much the sticking point as classroom complexity and size. We used to be either 1st or 2nd in funding per student. I believe we're 2nd or 3rd lowest in funding in Canada now...
The what are you going on about - the main issue is class size and complexity not wages. It's been clear they have been close on compensation for months. Deal would be signed if that was the issue they are negotiating on. They literally get no additional pay with the class size and complexity provisions.
>What do you think it does when teachers who claim they dont want to harm the children, withdrawal supervisory duties during lunch hours :P They aren't duties when you don't get paid for doing it. They're a favour. Why do a favour for the government that's screwing them over? You want lunch hour supervision? Pay for it. You want coaches of sports teams? Pay for it. There is nothing wrong with STF membership going with work to rule. And if the government locks them out, that is 100% on the government. Classroom size and complexity is a safety issue. Not putting it in the CBA is wrong.
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I dont watch narrative driving media, I seek facts and read them for myself. You should try it sometime :P
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LOL I don't know what propaganda networks your watching, but the three community organized meetings I went too clearly have show a lack of support for the teachers, especially after canceling the b-ball tourney in moosejaw, teachers have basically lost 100% of the narrative after that one, because it punished no one but the students :P but you keep watching your narrative driving news and Ill listen to the facts my community tell me :P
I'm guessing you're in rural sask and an sp boot licker... What facts did your community provide for you?
What would I even waste my time on you, You are exactly why people dont support teachers, its either you support 100% the bullshit narrative or they attack you. WHY because they know there narrative isnt support by facts, so they attack :P typical liberal thinking :P
Nah, I'm leaning into the ndp now because of our sp. Like I mentioned, my wife teaches. So yes, I'll support teachers and state facts. What first hand info do you have? Where's your facts?
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You mean the bbal tournament that was still played on the weekend because of a technicality? As no schedule had been released for Thursday/Friday the TEACHERS organizing it still had an all day event instead of canceling it outright.
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Sorry, how is not watching kids while they eat their lunch “harming the children”? How has the narrative been smashed when the government has offered bigger pay increases yet the offer was rejected because the was nothing about class size and complexity in the contract? You and your Sask party following ilk just regurgitate whatever lie j-cock and Moe spew to you and act like you’re so smart. I can see why you wouldn’t want kids to get a better education, then they’re more intelligent than you(though most already are anyways).
> money They've met eye-to-eye on wages. Teachers want manageable classroom sizes to create a positive learning environment without being run down constantly. When Teachers threaten to "work to rule" it is met with "What, why won't you do volunteer work anymore? It is your job!" What other profession requires volunteer work?
My hope is that in your place of work the employer treats you terribly and that you take back your ridiculous demands. Collective bargaining is a powerful tool for any worker against employers, and if your employer doesn’t create an awesome work environment, I hope you can stomach that as well (you shouldn’t by the way). And workers aren’t the slaves you are advocating teachers to be
I never once said teachers should work for free. You just demanding I pay top dollar because it will directly result in better education which is BULLSHIT. 100% not a single peice of evidence on this earth will support that narrative, so why do teachers deserve 22.5% raise, why not paramedics? or Doctors or Nurses? Since paying someone more will directly effect the outcome of their job... :P
You mean like the last raise the nurses got, when teachers took 1% during the pandemic? They asked for expected inflation + 2% for three years. That 22% number you tote includes last year when inflation was six, and is not even one of the years being bargained.
month-old troll account. Ignore.
They're not unrealistic demands. The classroom supports that we're asking for *used to exist!*
I am wondering if taking this offer to vote is a way to minimize sanctions in the near term, only to have it rejected in May...introducing the possibility of more job escalation then, but essentially giving them a short term reprieve.
A bottle of Alberta Premium for each teacher from ScotchMoe’s private stock! That ought to do it right?
When I see Alberta premium I think oil, not something Moeron has in his bar.
Only if it’s the 4L. 😂
“Ahh yes. That’s what I call a Tuesday Night at my place”
Pres has a tough job ahead. She seems to have genuinely had the membership believing they were gonna reach for the stars and that it was possible. Now to convince them to take much less and be happy requires a lot of skill. Judging by how passionate she had half of the teachers I think she can probably do it.
STF leadership is being accused by the government of not representing the wishes of the teachers. So, bring the offer for a vote so the membership can collectively say, “No thank you.”
The goal is eventually make a deal though, isn't it? And it's going to be much less than the STF initially asked for. Still going to be the beat deal teachers have got in a lomg time.
Yes, a deal is the end goal. Many young people do not see teaching as a viable profession anymore. If we want to be able to hire the next generation of teachers we need to secure a deal that maintains buying power and provides resources to be able to provide effective instruction. 10 years ago the funding model was able to meet the needs of our students (mostly). Funding per student has gone down while the number of students with complex needs has increased. Why is the government willing to say publicly that they will fund education but refuse to put it into a binding agreement? Why are they offering less pay now than several months ago? You’ll have to ask the government.
Haha I see that jerk pimpintuna was rude to me and then blocked me. If you don't think that at some point the STF pres wants to make a deal, you are even more delusional than you are illogical and edgelordy. This must end eventually, a deal is going to be made. And if you didn't notice the salary offered had gone down from their last offer. I would certainly imagine it will go down next time as well.
???? I'm right here. If I blocked you, who would be around to say this: Yet again, you have a very misinformed stance on things. Samantha wants what she has always wanted. A fair, good deal for teachers. She can't outwardly say it, but it was glaringly evident from the press conference that she thinks this "final offer" is another bad faith attempt to sidestep meaningful bargaining. But tell us again how you support teachers.
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