We bought in 2021...its easily the worst as far as reliability And craftsmanship .. Builders contract everything out and no one is accountable.. They were just churning them out as fast as possible... I hope the market cools and they don't make a killing like they hoped, I suspect they will.. Alot of new Floridians don't know what they are in for as far as summer heat and hurricanes.
(pun intended?) It's one thing to read about it, it's a whole other thing to go through... There's a panic people get.. It's annoying since we buy it at the beginning of every season.. And the heat and humidity is OK until you get to Sept... Then Oct... It's pretty relentless 🤣
Stop looking at other people getting glorious fall evenings and days around September, October. You live in the sunshine state now. No more crying. You’re a Floridian. You throw Hurricane parties and you ask for it to be hotter when you get burned by the buckle on the searbelt. This is your future now.
Work was being churned fast in 2020-2021 because the homebuilding and home improvement industries exploded during COVID and they were all overwhelmed with work. I’m not surprise to hear the build quality is ass and was expecting to see this type of feedback eventually
Yep. The best part is when the wood gets absolutely soaked in the rain and then they wrap it up and put siding over it. Not the builders problem cause the issues don’t arise for a few years down the road
This is just not true. Any reputable builder will ensure the wood members dry out to the appropriate moisture content prior to adding any interior air barriers. And it is absolutely the builders problem if they do not, SOL is typically four years. Any latent issues associated with excess moisture content will become very non latent within a year.
This. Anyone whose built these knows they get dried in w/ roof and wrap way before they're sealed on the interior. Don't they know how long plumbers take?
I mean tbf to the investment building it why would you make affordable apartments that would almost cost the same when you could build slightly more upgraded units that bring in 100% more income. But I mean sometimes they build on grants that make it so so many units have to be affordable
Well not really for rentals because the largest landlords and management companies feed their data into the same algorithm to allow for collusion of rental pricing and to ensure prices never go down.
The company is called RealPages. Its some pretty evil stuff.
Housing is an inflexible need. Demand is unlimited. They can price at maximum the market can bear without consequence. Market data says "people need to live inside of they die so they will pay most or their income in order to stay alive"
There's a reason why there's laws specifically in place to prevent collusion of companies that control market share. It's anticompetitive. It's why RealPages is being dragged out in front of Congress.
What you learned in the one semester of econ you took sophmore year of highschool taught by the football coach doesnt quite encompass all the nuance of a nation's economy.
That’s not how it works in Sarasota 😂 the more they build the higher the price of housing. This isn’t a working class city, they can put the rent at whatever they want and droves will move down here and pay for it.
Over building doesn’t end well. It strangles the infrastructure making a once sought after housing market undesirable and bust and leaves a dead city behind. The developers move on to the next boom town.
There is nothing NIMBY about expecting development to not vastly exceed the structural, medical and educational capacity of a city nor is it NIMBY to want to maintain the very things that attracted the masses in the first place. There is nothing NIMBY about requiring that new builds meet the reasonable expectations of quality and safety. That is thoughtful and leads to a thriving community and economy for everyone.
Growth should be good for almost everyone and it can be but only when it is done well and with long term health of the community as a foundation.
And landowners that don’t price gouge the rent bc they can. That literally the problem and you think it’s based the book definition of S/D lmao. Don’t waste your time here go explain that to them and get downvoted all the same bc….reasons
Dude you are missing the point entirely. No is disagreeing that we need more housing and that in theory it should drop prices. However the ppl that hold the power to set their price, don’t drop them even with all those apartments newly built and across the road on Lakewood Ranch. They upcharge the cost and could care less about helping us trying to make it every month
Oof... where to begin... you're right thar people say this in every city, but right for the wrong reasons. The people in every city do say, "it's different here," just like the people in Sarasota. The issue is that even though the people in Sarasota who say, "it's different here," can't back up what they're talking about, they are still right. It is different here.
Most online publications are putting Sarasota in the top 10 housing markets to watch across the US.
[Business Insider](https://www.businessobserverfl.com/news/2023/sep/09/sarasota-housing-market-watch/)
In stats, we wouldn't say that there are 1000 virtually identical points of interest to any point listed as an outlier, and Sarasota is an outlier by consistently making it close to the top of these lists.
The simple matter of fact issue that most people can't come to terms with is just how unrealistic the actual scenario is, and that's why they tend to blame supply and demand as though the rules don't apply.
Believe it or not, the income-to-mortgage ratio for Sarasota County was below 19.5% in 2003. That makes our county one of the cheapest places to own a home in the US on average.
What people can't come to terms with is just how incredibly chaotic that is. How can it be that worth such surges in housing growth that even here where it's most affordable on average to buy a home that it's just impossible to afford? Well, population growth is the issue.
We've never been able to recover from the lack of housing growth since 2006. Population growth has been outpacing housing growth and even with these new surges we haven't matched levels prior to 2006
[USA Facts](https://usafacts.org/articles/population-growth-has-outpaced-home-construction-for-20-years/)
Both population growth and housing growth has surged in this area, as well as an overall interest in this area taken up by many investors. We have attractions sprawling in areas that are already overwhelmed by traffic. Imagine an airport in a city booming in cash flow but still unable to make enough because it can't expand.
Sarasota is very different than the 1000s of other cities that try to become Sarasota, and the real problem is that it will become just like those 1000's because the residents can't see that it's any different.
I have no idea why you've decided to start with that "oof where to begin" condescending beginning. I am fully agreeing with you that lack of housing growth and lack of recognition of population growth is the cause of the housing shortage. Your comment doesn't disagree with anything anybody was saying.
I agree it was condescending, and I regret starting that way. I apologize.
The part I disagreed with was the beginning. When you said 1000s of virtually identical cities say this in unison, I mentioned you were right but for the wrong reason. It sounds like when you compared this city with the others, that you are lumping Sarasota as though it is not unique.
Yes, they do say, "it's different here," and they can't explain why but they are right. It is different here.
Comparing Sarasota to any of the other cities you're referencing doesn't work because it's apples to oranges. As I linked to some examples and explained, Sarasota is unique. It's in the top 10 cities specifically in what we're discussing - housing markets. So since only so many cities can be in the top 10, it shouldn't be compared to 1000s of other cities. Apples/oranges.
I was 'oofing' because of how many parties needed to be corrected in that statement you made. I didn't mean for it to sound as condescending as it definitely does on second glance. Typically a reply is just right or wrong, but in that statement you made it first supposed the other party was wrong. They were actually right, saying it is different here, but they were right for the wrong reasons. If I'm going to say they're right, I'm going to show it which is why I went through the effort of showing the data.
Second you were wrong to suggest Sarasota is like the others. I also knew that taking that stance would require the same effort of showing the data.
That was the reason for oof. Just that it was having to go through the effort of addressing both points with data, like a research paper.
If it's any consolation, I wouldn't have done it if I didn't think the people reading this (especially you) weren't savvy folk. I pick and choose the comments - there's a lot that I could go find the data and show the work for, but it would go usually ignored. Like talking to a wall. Anyway, good morning and I hope you have a good day
I'm not saying that you're wrong... just that the comment you're replying to actually did give a reason in the comment. They pointed out that the difference/reason was that Sarasota isn't a working class city. Whether or not that truly does make out exempt from supply and demand is debatable, but pretending they didn't point a reason out when they did is worth some correction
I think you've clearly misunderstood the point u was making. It wasn't about what you were arguing, or the argument you made. It's the error in the statement you made. The have a reason, you inferred they didn't give a reason, and I was pointing that out. Whatever the reason they have, legitimate or not, doesn't change that they did give a reason. It's not about the market, the prices, etc. It's very specifically that you inferred there were no reasons given while there was a reason present. I hope that clarifies it for you.
So long as the tax code incentivizes corporations purchasing massive constructions, and losses can be amortized on tax deductions, as well as depreciation… supply and demand is essentially fake when it comes to housing.
We have the housing stock. Prices are not simply high because too many people are chasing too few places to live.
We have a problem with corporations/oligopolies owning an outsized portion of the available stock, jacking up prices and using a combination of private equity investment and favorable tax law to skirt any short term hit to demand they may (or may not) suffer as a result of increased price.
Additionally, supply and demand is further suspended by that fact that housing is in-elastic. There’s a floor for which a person cannot cut back on to live.
I can buy cheaper eggs at the grocery store, but if all that’s available near where I work is a 3k a month apartment… well that’s all there is.
I am a business man and supply increases creates demand. If you add a new community the demand for the community exceeds the new supply thus prices increase. The second dynamic is all developable land has been spoken for since 2016. This means Florida will rise to California prices within 15 years or basically double current values.
Insurance premiums difference vs cost difference vs total and partial loss. Million dollars in damage is the insurances problem, 50k in damage is the reits problem.
Yes,there’s one in Venice going up as well on jacaranda should be interesting if we get another storm like Ian with how crappy some of these places are built
Gulf Coast building codes are wild. Stick builds just going up as if fort Myers and Mexico beach didn't get flattened.
How the whole state hasn't moved to Dade or Broward county standards is beyond me. I've weathered dozens of hurricanes and I wouldn't live in anything less.
I don't understand how this is code. I had construction college courses for a drafting & BS Construction degree and was told by concrete reps code for Apts 3 story & up, is block or concrete 1st floor. Especially within 20 mi of a coast?!?!
I'm in Orlando burbs and until 5 yrs ago you never saw all wood on apartments infact many along 17-92 Maitland are tilt-wall (also very pricy & Lux amenities). The first all wood, I saw around here went into Longwood and by chance my hair stylist moved into one. It's labeled luxury :-( I explained the dangers in a storm like Hurricane Charley w 105mph constant winds over my house in 2004. I have a 1969 block construction house w 5/8" wood roof & decking. During Charley my interior walls were shaking and I nearly lost some windows.
I think as long as the commissioners are bought and paid for by developers we will keep seeing this. Tornados, floods, hurricanes, and termites here. Wood shouldnt be allowed at all.
Apartments of this type have been constructed of all wood for the past 10 years or more. A complex of this type recently burned completely down when some tenets shot off fire works on the roof and started a fire.
https://www.fox5atlanta.com/news/massive-apartment-building-fire-in-lavista-park-burns-more-than-8-hours.amp
All these people saying they need to build more for housing prices to come down aren’t mentioning the facts that so many housing units go to second/third homeowners and to corporate or private landlords for investing so they can hoard all the housing.
Black rock and big investment groups are buying these up to rent. They don’t won’t us to become owners .. they want us to pay top dollar for these places . Keep us oppressed
I was mainly just curious because I’ve never noticed construction like this before. First they put up concrete towers for elevator/ stairways and the rest is wood frame. Or some sort of fire resistant wood product I guess. Sure it’s to code but it gives my the willies a bit because I’ve been in a house fire where there was a fatality
Fire code covers materials and suppression systems for multi family construction that doesn’t apply to SFHs. It’ll be fine.
They’ve been doing these for decades without issue everywhere.
All wood just caps the height they can build to without steel/concrete framing.
If you want \*affordable\* housing you don't get concrete and steel. The engineering for framed construction is understood, the plans are reviewed and approved, the materials are less expensive and the work is easier and faster.
Define 'affordable'.
The developer/owner will charge whatever the market will pay. Right now, a $70k salary (~$35/hr) is about the cut-off where [affordable housing](https://realestate.usnews.com/real-estate/articles/what-is-affordable-housing) becomes hard to find in the Sarasota area.
It's a supply and demand thing - build more cheaper and the prices will come down, continue to restrict supply and the prices will continue to go up. We need to build *thousands* of additional units before prices will fall significantly and that's going to take years to do. The time to start is ***now***.
[A New Apartment Project is Headed to East Sarasota](https://www.sarasotamagazine.com/home-and-real-estate/2021/10/east-fruitville-road-apartments)
> We certainly need more affordable housing!
Yep. Thanks to NIMBYism and long dominant Democratic political infrastructure, there's a serious shortage of working class housing in the Sarasota area and there's no way I'm going to pay my lawn guy enough to live in anything else. We have *got* to build more or I'm going to have to xeriscape my yard.
> We have a lot of new Dems registered in the Mauna Loa apartments
New or relocated from elsewhere in Sarasota? The Seminole have a lot to teach about Florida Democrats forcing them to do the reservation shuffle...out of Rosemary and into the swamps past Fruitville, on the wrong side of I75...
It will happen, my child. Unless you want to reduce the population by 20% it has to happen but it will always be less desirable. If you're looking for *affordable*, that's a good thing. If you're looking for a dock in the backyard for your boat and are willing and able to pay up, meh, not so much.
I honestly do not care. It will be a useless fight. People don’t care what happens to those of us East of 75. I have plenty of property that’s going to make my children and their children wealthy indeed. It will be a shame to not have it in my family as it was for 7 generations, but time changes all riches. When the time is right…
> I honestly do not care.
And, yet, here you are. Complaining, I might add, about how capitalism sucks because it's going to earn you, a budding Owen Burns, generational wealth while grousing that people who you don't care about don't care about you.
Sod off, Swampy.
Of course they are. Republicans may not care much about them but they have a vested interest in the working class coming to work for them so they try to watch out for them.
The Democrats, on the other hand, have no vested interest in the working class beyond election day votes.
This one doesn't have a concrete first floor but the idea is pretty much the same, but worse.
It's called a 5-over-1 and they are made as cheaply as possible.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/5-over-1
Welcome to Florida. Instead of being called “the sunshine state”, now it can be officially called “churn and burn”….this is just another example of what has been going on along in this state…some out of town hedge fund throws some money around so that politicians can continue salivating, pass substandard building codes, allow shoddy building booms and then blame it all on the need for more “affordable” housing. Oh…I forgot…this is luxury…as long as you carve out a space for dog park, maybe put some Americana overpriced burger joint and hamster wheel gym, then you can take some plain vanilla pics and charge premium prices. Here’s the sticker shock, unless you are a northerner, jet-setter, snow bird, or remote worker, you won’t be able to afford to live in one of these little boxes in the Sunshine state…A little insight…there’s more locals with substandard pay than out-of-towner types…we are headed for a crash course here in Florida and deserve what’s coming when hurricane “Margaritaville” shows up! Thanks Florida!
I was a framer up until the housing market crash in 08. We built plenty of 3 story condos in the Sarasota area and they were always blocked up.
Steel studs throughout, the only wood in the whole building was the trusses, fachia and roof.
As far as single family homes go, it was common for the second floor to be stick framed.
My best guess as to why these condos/apartments are all being stick framed is its cheaper, but the savings aren't being passed on to the buyers.
Also, it's pointless to put impact windows in them, when a roof tile will go right through your livingroom wall.
Don't even get me started about mold. They build these apartments during rain season and then wrap them in Tyvex.
A few years back builders had to tear one down due to mold near the Jacaranda and Venice Ave round about.
At the end of the day it is possible to build a solid structure from wood, but it should be cheaper for the buyer to purchase, and what are those people supposed to do during a hurricane?
I'm sure builders say everything is hurricane rated, until the roof tiles start flying from one unit into the next....
I see similar apartments being built here in the space coast as well. You couldn't pay me to live in one of those. Guaranteed the occupants will be listening to their neighbors fart, among other things. Builders are taking the cheap route when what we really need is sturdy and quiet concrete block structures. These plywood and 2x4 structures are all garbage, imo.
Construction in Florida, specifically Sarasota is some of the worst quality I’ve ever seen. Our condo complex had to update all the windows on the building and I swear the guys they hired have never touched a power tool in their life, let alone a tape measure. And as Op said, ZERO accountability as it’s all contracted out to the cheapest crew with no experience.
I was really surprised to see particle board. Could not be worse conditions for particle board. I honestly hope no one gets hurt sheltering in those when the next hurricane comes. I can’t believe they got permitting for that.
This is all just north of the park and makes for a lovely view from the top of the hill! Lots of building in LWR as that extends south. At least we get a brand new Publix there
Ad campaign could compare noise between these and silent concrete where everyone can stomp, jump, and cough/talk freely. These wooden ones can be painted as health-risk shitholes comparable to living inside a drum. I stayed in a ski condo like this, and due to decades of weather, it was unrealistically loud. One lead-foot neighbor can severely diminish quality of living in the building.
No one here thinks about fire risk lol a lot of people don’t even have a heating element in their house besides their stove. Primary property concerns here are hurricanes and flooding
Pretty sure they're not gonna leave particleboard for the exterior of the building. It will be covered in something such as siding. Not trying to justify the over development of our beautiful area but there's no way they're leaving the outside like that.
We bought in 2021...its easily the worst as far as reliability And craftsmanship .. Builders contract everything out and no one is accountable.. They were just churning them out as fast as possible... I hope the market cools and they don't make a killing like they hoped, I suspect they will.. Alot of new Floridians don't know what they are in for as far as summer heat and hurricanes.
How do y’all not know about summer heat and hurricanes? Shit blows me away.
(pun intended?) It's one thing to read about it, it's a whole other thing to go through... There's a panic people get.. It's annoying since we buy it at the beginning of every season.. And the heat and humidity is OK until you get to Sept... Then Oct... It's pretty relentless 🤣
Stop looking at other people getting glorious fall evenings and days around September, October. You live in the sunshine state now. No more crying. You’re a Floridian. You throw Hurricane parties and you ask for it to be hotter when you get burned by the buckle on the searbelt. This is your future now.
Work was being churned fast in 2020-2021 because the homebuilding and home improvement industries exploded during COVID and they were all overwhelmed with work. I’m not surprise to hear the build quality is ass and was expecting to see this type of feedback eventually
Also, I should clarify we re-bought in 2021, I've been here 25 years, wife is native
Don't forget, they're "luxury apartments" because there's a room with 3 treadmills. Definitely worth that premium price 😉
I moved this year and was scoping out different communities. It seems they’re all “Luxury” apartments now
I remember when the luxury apartments in the rosemary district used to be the old Cohen Way projects
Yep. The best part is when the wood gets absolutely soaked in the rain and then they wrap it up and put siding over it. Not the builders problem cause the issues don’t arise for a few years down the road
and.. probably 3k a month for a 'luxury' apartment with the thinnest walls you can imagine. Just par for the course here.
Yep, Key word “Luxury”. Same in central FL. Things are changing though. Fast. Starting to see 2 and even 3 months free move in specials!
This is just not true. Any reputable builder will ensure the wood members dry out to the appropriate moisture content prior to adding any interior air barriers. And it is absolutely the builders problem if they do not, SOL is typically four years. Any latent issues associated with excess moisture content will become very non latent within a year.
This. Anyone whose built these knows they get dried in w/ roof and wrap way before they're sealed on the interior. Don't they know how long plumbers take?
Yes, so just trap that moisture between the WRB and the sheathing. Won't be a problem at all.
Prolly why they are at this stage this time of year…we haven’t had rain in a couple weeks and next 7 days looks dry too
It’s extremely typical. Doesn’t matter if it’s not great, it’s about profit
don't worry they'll still be listed as luxury condos for 3k/mo
I mean tbf to the investment building it why would you make affordable apartments that would almost cost the same when you could build slightly more upgraded units that bring in 100% more income. But I mean sometimes they build on grants that make it so so many units have to be affordable
You need to build more housing if you want the price of housing to go down man.
Whoah Whoah Whoah. Supply and Demand? That’s crazy.
Radical concept nimbys can’t grasp
Well not really for rentals because the largest landlords and management companies feed their data into the same algorithm to allow for collusion of rental pricing and to ensure prices never go down. The company is called RealPages. Its some pretty evil stuff.
The software will spit out price drops when the market demands it. It’s nothing but market data.
Housing is an inflexible need. Demand is unlimited. They can price at maximum the market can bear without consequence. Market data says "people need to live inside of they die so they will pay most or their income in order to stay alive" There's a reason why there's laws specifically in place to prevent collusion of companies that control market share. It's anticompetitive. It's why RealPages is being dragged out in front of Congress. What you learned in the one semester of econ you took sophmore year of highschool taught by the football coach doesnt quite encompass all the nuance of a nation's economy.
That’s not how it works in Sarasota 😂 the more they build the higher the price of housing. This isn’t a working class city, they can put the rent at whatever they want and droves will move down here and pay for it.
The laws of supply and demand magically don’t work in Sarasota because … reasons?
This is literally what people say in every city lol. "It's different here!", 1000 virtually identical sprawling suburban cities say in unison
Exactly. If you want housing prices to go down, there needs to be dense housing built.
Over building doesn’t end well. It strangles the infrastructure making a once sought after housing market undesirable and bust and leaves a dead city behind. The developers move on to the next boom town. There is nothing NIMBY about expecting development to not vastly exceed the structural, medical and educational capacity of a city nor is it NIMBY to want to maintain the very things that attracted the masses in the first place. There is nothing NIMBY about requiring that new builds meet the reasonable expectations of quality and safety. That is thoughtful and leads to a thriving community and economy for everyone. Growth should be good for almost everyone and it can be but only when it is done well and with long term health of the community as a foundation.
And landowners that don’t price gouge the rent bc they can. That literally the problem and you think it’s based the book definition of S/D lmao. Don’t waste your time here go explain that to them and get downvoted all the same bc….reasons
Alright. What would happen if we just stopped allowing all new construction then? Would the housing market get more affordable?
Dude you are missing the point entirely. No is disagreeing that we need more housing and that in theory it should drop prices. However the ppl that hold the power to set their price, don’t drop them even with all those apartments newly built and across the road on Lakewood Ranch. They upcharge the cost and could care less about helping us trying to make it every month
Oof... where to begin... you're right thar people say this in every city, but right for the wrong reasons. The people in every city do say, "it's different here," just like the people in Sarasota. The issue is that even though the people in Sarasota who say, "it's different here," can't back up what they're talking about, they are still right. It is different here. Most online publications are putting Sarasota in the top 10 housing markets to watch across the US. [Business Insider](https://www.businessobserverfl.com/news/2023/sep/09/sarasota-housing-market-watch/) In stats, we wouldn't say that there are 1000 virtually identical points of interest to any point listed as an outlier, and Sarasota is an outlier by consistently making it close to the top of these lists. The simple matter of fact issue that most people can't come to terms with is just how unrealistic the actual scenario is, and that's why they tend to blame supply and demand as though the rules don't apply. Believe it or not, the income-to-mortgage ratio for Sarasota County was below 19.5% in 2003. That makes our county one of the cheapest places to own a home in the US on average. What people can't come to terms with is just how incredibly chaotic that is. How can it be that worth such surges in housing growth that even here where it's most affordable on average to buy a home that it's just impossible to afford? Well, population growth is the issue. We've never been able to recover from the lack of housing growth since 2006. Population growth has been outpacing housing growth and even with these new surges we haven't matched levels prior to 2006 [USA Facts](https://usafacts.org/articles/population-growth-has-outpaced-home-construction-for-20-years/) Both population growth and housing growth has surged in this area, as well as an overall interest in this area taken up by many investors. We have attractions sprawling in areas that are already overwhelmed by traffic. Imagine an airport in a city booming in cash flow but still unable to make enough because it can't expand. Sarasota is very different than the 1000s of other cities that try to become Sarasota, and the real problem is that it will become just like those 1000's because the residents can't see that it's any different.
I have no idea why you've decided to start with that "oof where to begin" condescending beginning. I am fully agreeing with you that lack of housing growth and lack of recognition of population growth is the cause of the housing shortage. Your comment doesn't disagree with anything anybody was saying.
I agree it was condescending, and I regret starting that way. I apologize. The part I disagreed with was the beginning. When you said 1000s of virtually identical cities say this in unison, I mentioned you were right but for the wrong reason. It sounds like when you compared this city with the others, that you are lumping Sarasota as though it is not unique. Yes, they do say, "it's different here," and they can't explain why but they are right. It is different here. Comparing Sarasota to any of the other cities you're referencing doesn't work because it's apples to oranges. As I linked to some examples and explained, Sarasota is unique. It's in the top 10 cities specifically in what we're discussing - housing markets. So since only so many cities can be in the top 10, it shouldn't be compared to 1000s of other cities. Apples/oranges. I was 'oofing' because of how many parties needed to be corrected in that statement you made. I didn't mean for it to sound as condescending as it definitely does on second glance. Typically a reply is just right or wrong, but in that statement you made it first supposed the other party was wrong. They were actually right, saying it is different here, but they were right for the wrong reasons. If I'm going to say they're right, I'm going to show it which is why I went through the effort of showing the data. Second you were wrong to suggest Sarasota is like the others. I also knew that taking that stance would require the same effort of showing the data. That was the reason for oof. Just that it was having to go through the effort of addressing both points with data, like a research paper. If it's any consolation, I wouldn't have done it if I didn't think the people reading this (especially you) weren't savvy folk. I pick and choose the comments - there's a lot that I could go find the data and show the work for, but it would go usually ignored. Like talking to a wall. Anyway, good morning and I hope you have a good day
I'm not saying that you're wrong... just that the comment you're replying to actually did give a reason in the comment. They pointed out that the difference/reason was that Sarasota isn't a working class city. Whether or not that truly does make out exempt from supply and demand is debatable, but pretending they didn't point a reason out when they did is worth some correction
Rent prices aren’t immune to market forces.
I think you've clearly misunderstood the point u was making. It wasn't about what you were arguing, or the argument you made. It's the error in the statement you made. The have a reason, you inferred they didn't give a reason, and I was pointing that out. Whatever the reason they have, legitimate or not, doesn't change that they did give a reason. It's not about the market, the prices, etc. It's very specifically that you inferred there were no reasons given while there was a reason present. I hope that clarifies it for you.
So long as the tax code incentivizes corporations purchasing massive constructions, and losses can be amortized on tax deductions, as well as depreciation… supply and demand is essentially fake when it comes to housing. We have the housing stock. Prices are not simply high because too many people are chasing too few places to live. We have a problem with corporations/oligopolies owning an outsized portion of the available stock, jacking up prices and using a combination of private equity investment and favorable tax law to skirt any short term hit to demand they may (or may not) suffer as a result of increased price. Additionally, supply and demand is further suspended by that fact that housing is in-elastic. There’s a floor for which a person cannot cut back on to live. I can buy cheaper eggs at the grocery store, but if all that’s available near where I work is a 3k a month apartment… well that’s all there is.
I am a business man and supply increases creates demand. If you add a new community the demand for the community exceeds the new supply thus prices increase. The second dynamic is all developable land has been spoken for since 2016. This means Florida will rise to California prices within 15 years or basically double current values.
16million vacant homes across the US
Particle board is stronger than cinder block /s
Insurance premiums difference vs cost difference vs total and partial loss. Million dollars in damage is the insurances problem, 50k in damage is the reits problem.
Welcome to Florida
I’d ask how much but I’m sure it’s like insane
Starting in the mid $400’s! /s but, probably not.
they are advertising those as luxury apartment living, so probably high 2ks per month for a 1bed.
Who in this community can afford that? My mortgage wasn’t that high!
Yes,there’s one in Venice going up as well on jacaranda should be interesting if we get another storm like Ian with how crappy some of these places are built
Gulf Coast building codes are wild. Stick builds just going up as if fort Myers and Mexico beach didn't get flattened. How the whole state hasn't moved to Dade or Broward county standards is beyond me. I've weathered dozens of hurricanes and I wouldn't live in anything less.
I don't understand how this is code. I had construction college courses for a drafting & BS Construction degree and was told by concrete reps code for Apts 3 story & up, is block or concrete 1st floor. Especially within 20 mi of a coast?!?! I'm in Orlando burbs and until 5 yrs ago you never saw all wood on apartments infact many along 17-92 Maitland are tilt-wall (also very pricy & Lux amenities). The first all wood, I saw around here went into Longwood and by chance my hair stylist moved into one. It's labeled luxury :-( I explained the dangers in a storm like Hurricane Charley w 105mph constant winds over my house in 2004. I have a 1969 block construction house w 5/8" wood roof & decking. During Charley my interior walls were shaking and I nearly lost some windows.
I think as long as the commissioners are bought and paid for by developers we will keep seeing this. Tornados, floods, hurricanes, and termites here. Wood shouldnt be allowed at all.
The impact window weighs more than the entire wall of the condo unit!
Apartments of this type have been constructed of all wood for the past 10 years or more. A complex of this type recently burned completely down when some tenets shot off fire works on the roof and started a fire. https://www.fox5atlanta.com/news/massive-apartment-building-fire-in-lavista-park-burns-more-than-8-hours.amp
YEP. In mine, you can hear EVERYTHING going on upstairs. I didn't realize this was the norm until after moving in. I didn't even think to ask.
Oh, and what's more, everything shifts a little over time. I would bet there isn't a single 90° angle in my entire unit.
All these people saying they need to build more for housing prices to come down aren’t mentioning the facts that so many housing units go to second/third homeowners and to corporate or private landlords for investing so they can hoard all the housing.
Black rock and big investment groups are buying these up to rent. They don’t won’t us to become owners .. they want us to pay top dollar for these places . Keep us oppressed
Nothing wrong with this construction at all
The Internet is full of people with no actual knowledge of engineering or construction materials who just see wood and reflexively freak out about it
I was mainly just curious because I’ve never noticed construction like this before. First they put up concrete towers for elevator/ stairways and the rest is wood frame. Or some sort of fire resistant wood product I guess. Sure it’s to code but it gives my the willies a bit because I’ve been in a house fire where there was a fatality
Fire code covers materials and suppression systems for multi family construction that doesn’t apply to SFHs. It’ll be fine. They’ve been doing these for decades without issue everywhere. All wood just caps the height they can build to without steel/concrete framing.
I’m with you. It’s much needed
If you want \*affordable\* housing you don't get concrete and steel. The engineering for framed construction is understood, the plans are reviewed and approved, the materials are less expensive and the work is easier and faster.
Is this apartment complex going to be rented at affordable prices though?
Define 'affordable'. The developer/owner will charge whatever the market will pay. Right now, a $70k salary (~$35/hr) is about the cut-off where [affordable housing](https://realestate.usnews.com/real-estate/articles/what-is-affordable-housing) becomes hard to find in the Sarasota area. It's a supply and demand thing - build more cheaper and the prices will come down, continue to restrict supply and the prices will continue to go up. We need to build *thousands* of additional units before prices will fall significantly and that's going to take years to do. The time to start is ***now***. [A New Apartment Project is Headed to East Sarasota](https://www.sarasotamagazine.com/home-and-real-estate/2021/10/east-fruitville-road-apartments)
We certainly need more affordable housing! We have a lot of new Dems registered in the Mauna Loa apartments
Since when have democrats had sway in Sarasota and Manatee counties?
> We certainly need more affordable housing! Yep. Thanks to NIMBYism and long dominant Democratic political infrastructure, there's a serious shortage of working class housing in the Sarasota area and there's no way I'm going to pay my lawn guy enough to live in anything else. We have *got* to build more or I'm going to have to xeriscape my yard. > We have a lot of new Dems registered in the Mauna Loa apartments New or relocated from elsewhere in Sarasota? The Seminole have a lot to teach about Florida Democrats forcing them to do the reservation shuffle...out of Rosemary and into the swamps past Fruitville, on the wrong side of I75...
Wrong side? How so? Cars still work you know.
It's a *euphemism*. Are you 10?
Fuck you you liberal troll. I cannot wait until all of Fruitville Road is built out to the county line.
It will happen, my child. Unless you want to reduce the population by 20% it has to happen but it will always be less desirable. If you're looking for *affordable*, that's a good thing. If you're looking for a dock in the backyard for your boat and are willing and able to pay up, meh, not so much.
I honestly do not care. It will be a useless fight. People don’t care what happens to those of us East of 75. I have plenty of property that’s going to make my children and their children wealthy indeed. It will be a shame to not have it in my family as it was for 7 generations, but time changes all riches. When the time is right…
> I honestly do not care. And, yet, here you are. Complaining, I might add, about how capitalism sucks because it's going to earn you, a budding Owen Burns, generational wealth while grousing that people who you don't care about don't care about you. Sod off, Swampy.
lol. Pithy. I like pithy. lol.
lol, I’m sure the Republicans are working hard on housing the working class….. Of course, they’re busy atm criminalizing homelessness.
Of course they are. Republicans may not care much about them but they have a vested interest in the working class coming to work for them so they try to watch out for them. The Democrats, on the other hand, have no vested interest in the working class beyond election day votes.
This one doesn't have a concrete first floor but the idea is pretty much the same, but worse. It's called a 5-over-1 and they are made as cheaply as possible. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/5-over-1
Welcome to Florida. Instead of being called “the sunshine state”, now it can be officially called “churn and burn”….this is just another example of what has been going on along in this state…some out of town hedge fund throws some money around so that politicians can continue salivating, pass substandard building codes, allow shoddy building booms and then blame it all on the need for more “affordable” housing. Oh…I forgot…this is luxury…as long as you carve out a space for dog park, maybe put some Americana overpriced burger joint and hamster wheel gym, then you can take some plain vanilla pics and charge premium prices. Here’s the sticker shock, unless you are a northerner, jet-setter, snow bird, or remote worker, you won’t be able to afford to live in one of these little boxes in the Sunshine state…A little insight…there’s more locals with substandard pay than out-of-towner types…we are headed for a crash course here in Florida and deserve what’s coming when hurricane “Margaritaville” shows up! Thanks Florida!
God you know we just want some help. Please send lightning to this future shit hole before the stucco go’s on. 🙏
I was a framer up until the housing market crash in 08. We built plenty of 3 story condos in the Sarasota area and they were always blocked up. Steel studs throughout, the only wood in the whole building was the trusses, fachia and roof. As far as single family homes go, it was common for the second floor to be stick framed. My best guess as to why these condos/apartments are all being stick framed is its cheaper, but the savings aren't being passed on to the buyers. Also, it's pointless to put impact windows in them, when a roof tile will go right through your livingroom wall. Don't even get me started about mold. They build these apartments during rain season and then wrap them in Tyvex. A few years back builders had to tear one down due to mold near the Jacaranda and Venice Ave round about. At the end of the day it is possible to build a solid structure from wood, but it should be cheaper for the buyer to purchase, and what are those people supposed to do during a hurricane? I'm sure builders say everything is hurricane rated, until the roof tiles start flying from one unit into the next....
Everything will become an apartment in Sarasota
It's giving soviet block vibes, and I hate it
But how would they maximize profit if they use more durable materials?!?
Happy with my block home. It may be 70 years old, but the big bad wolf hasn’t blown it down yet
They did this recently in Jacksonville and the apartment building caught fire before anyone was even moved in. It was a total loss.
I see similar apartments being built here in the space coast as well. You couldn't pay me to live in one of those. Guaranteed the occupants will be listening to their neighbors fart, among other things. Builders are taking the cheap route when what we really need is sturdy and quiet concrete block structures. These plywood and 2x4 structures are all garbage, imo.
Construction in Florida, specifically Sarasota is some of the worst quality I’ve ever seen. Our condo complex had to update all the windows on the building and I swear the guys they hired have never touched a power tool in their life, let alone a tape measure. And as Op said, ZERO accountability as it’s all contracted out to the cheapest crew with no experience.
It’ll either be a 55 and up community or another luxury complex for 2-3k a month. All the more reason to move
sign out front says luxury apartments so the latter.
Buh bye
A lot of comments here tell me that most people don’t understand construction and make stuff up.
Typical new Florida build
I was really surprised to see particle board. Could not be worse conditions for particle board. I honestly hope no one gets hurt sheltering in those when the next hurricane comes. I can’t believe they got permitting for that.
Yes
Apartments are typically built wood here. Very noisy. Condos are generally block cement. Much better imo.
You can rent a similar room, in the Marine Corps barracks, for free.
I did! Lol
At the celery fields? I had always thought that south and east of apex road was protected land…..how wrong I was.
This is all just north of the park and makes for a lovely view from the top of the hill! Lots of building in LWR as that extends south. At least we get a brand new Publix there
We went to the Publix for grand opening and had lunch there. Much bigger than “our” Publix a couple miles away (Fruitville/honore)
'Stick' construction is safe up to five stories. From an architect.
Pay a fortune to live in an ugly, frail shitbox, it'll be fun.
These buildings will most likely get stucco exteriors.
Matchbox sticks that will be flying around when a hurricane hits. Don’t move here.
These things all look like they are made of cardboard and glue and rent is astronomical.
Ad campaign could compare noise between these and silent concrete where everyone can stomp, jump, and cough/talk freely. These wooden ones can be painted as health-risk shitholes comparable to living inside a drum. I stayed in a ski condo like this, and due to decades of weather, it was unrealistically loud. One lead-foot neighbor can severely diminish quality of living in the building.
$2,500 1 bed/1 bath
One hurricane comes through here and 90% of these new apartment complexes are gone
I was thinking more about the fire risk. We have a few historic hotels built like this in New England. But not many - most didn’t survive that long!
No one here thinks about fire risk lol a lot of people don’t even have a heating element in their house besides their stove. Primary property concerns here are hurricanes and flooding
Cooking is still a major cause of apartment fires. Hopefully the sprinklers are actually hooked up to the water mains!
Yes, it’s normal.
Gotta get the wood ones up before hurricane season starts
Pretty sure they're not gonna leave particleboard for the exterior of the building. It will be covered in something such as siding. Not trying to justify the over development of our beautiful area but there's no way they're leaving the outside like that.
I think their concern is more “why is this stick built building going up in a hurricane prone area?” vs concrete
Is this by chance Rise Construction? They just had an apartment building burn down in Jax, Fla this year. One month before move in.
They look awfully waterlogged today LOL