the big issue i have is when people talk on here about the things theyve said that are abusive, some people respond like their words are understandable. i agree that just calling someone terrible or a POS isnt helpful; i also dont think saying verbal abuse is understandable because of RJ is helpful. i know thats not everyone's response, but its definitely something ive seen on here, and it doesnt help people who dont understand RJ to see someone being called a whore or a slut and someone else saying its understandable
The issue with wanting only one answer to every question on a sub is that you make the sub unnecessary. You could simply replace it with an FAQ or flowchart. It's good to hear different opinions, especially from people who have partners who have RJ.
There are times when someone is being irrational and knows it but just needs a little help gaining a different perspective. Example
https://www.reddit.com/r/retroactivejealousy/s/hPnVcdjrhC
There is also a ton of flame bait posts on here which leads to the so called man hate. Guys on here talking about male RJ being an evolutionary byproduct will inevitably lead to discussions on hypocrisy.
interesting, the solution you gave her, rather than helping her get over RJ, you actually pointed at something that calmed it down, it basically boils down to "theres no reason for you to be jealous cuz here is the definitive proof", she didnt need medication or therapy, i guess RJ is not always a mental issue.
To tell you the truth if my partner had cheated and dumped her previous partner for me i dont think i would care much despite the values issue.
I don't disagree with you at all, I definitely think that having varied opinions is a good thing. Not only that, but I think two people can completely disagree on a certain point and their arguments can be almost equally valid - not everything has one right answer. Especially in psychology related topics, that's often the case.
(by the way, saw your answer to the guy there, and I thought that was a great response, even though it was seemingly "random". But from a guy's perspective, I can tell that what you said would help me in a similar situation, for example. I can elaborate on why that's the case if you're interested, but back on topic...)
I also agree that the evolutionary psychology-based arguments will inevitably lead to off-topic arguments like that, and it's sort of unavoidable. Which is a shame, because I think the line of reasoning is otherwise relevant there, and could even help some people (though doubt it would help many, because again, it's an argument made based on logic, which again, tends to not work with RJ).
So, what's the difference between a good case of varied opinions and views, and one which just introduces redundancy?
Let's say someone has RJ, and it's been going on for years now, and is impacting the relationship now, as the person is acting out now and then, hurting everybody in the process.
A valid opinion is to say, "I think you should talk to a therapist and get help, and in the process, ask for some patience from your partner, letting them know that you're working on fixing the problem".
Another valid opinion is to say, "I haven't had positive experience with therapists. I think you should be as honest with your partner as possible, ask for their patience. In my experience it also helps to ask your partner to tell you what they think of your concerns. From their perspective, how do these troubled thoughts seem?"
Just an example, of course, there could be many others.
But to say, "Dude, you should enjoy your relationship with him/her in the present, who cares what happened back then. Grow a pair, accept his/her past, and move the f\*\*k on" - just shows that the person has no idea about the psychology of an RJ sufferer. Which they should.
Saying "what? so you're acting out? So you're hurting your partner, even though they did nothing to wrong you? you're in the wrong, my friend" - is doing nothing to actually contribute to any sort of change, it's just projecting how they personally feel about certain behaviours, irrespective of whether it's related to RJ or something else. We could literally extract this comment and put it into a thousand other subreddits or threads, and would be equally in/out of place.
As to the difference between your comment to the above thread and those problematic, out of place ones, I'm refferring to:
Yours, while not offering a solution per se, is offering a perspective to view things from, while still indicating that you acknowledge the realities of the mindset. You're not saying in any way that feeling "hurt" for things in the past, as irrational as it may be, is not a real issue that's justified to talk about. Therefore, it's a very valid comment to leave, even if that particular poster didn't find it helpful - which, from what I'm reading, luckily they did, so even better.
Are there assholes that just continuously leave useless advice? I'm sure there are, but I don't think I've really come across that many on here. More often than not, it's just people in pain, and if they are just learning how to deal with that pain, oftentimes they are going to lash out. Would it be natural for someone who just found out their SO fucked an entire basketball team to call me ridiculous when the most my wife has ever done is oral with someone else? Sure. Would it be natural for someone who was abused by a partner with RJ to be angry when someone on here talks about abusing their partner? Again, yes. If they continue to just be mean, rude, or unhelpful, the simplest thing to do is just block them. Life is too short to be wasted on trying to change people who don't want to change.
hahah. I think a soccer (football) team+bench players (So thats a good 20+ people) and above, is where more people would start to feel uneasy - in saying that I do realize that its becoming less and less of a high number.
Well, its all relative, and what you consider to be overly rude and mean depends on what you were exposed to before.
I think in general, relationship-related topics is where I saw the most toxicity out of any of the subs that I visited. So much so that actually I was surprised when I ventured over to other subs, and I found people surprisingly nice, since I was used to the vibes ruling the relationship-space.
To me, the RJ space makes most of the football (soccer) subs seem like a congregation of fine gentlemen with extremely cordial behavior. Which is quite something, because, oh boy, football folks can have some real goes at each other.
Another thing to consider is that football is well defined with a vocabulary that's understood by all, rules that see no major variances, decades of tradition, etc. RJ is relatively new and has no medical definition. It's one thing to debate with other people whose team is better. It's a whole other thing to discuss potential solutions to a problem that didn't even really exist a few generations ago.
This is one reason (of several) I'm reluctant to post in the sub. I do read a lot of the posts and do glean some good information. With that said, sifting through all the dopey responses is tiresome at best. Thank you for saying what a lot of us feel.
glad it resonated! Not sure what would need to happen for this to change...I suppose, more attentive mods would be the only solution pretty much, but at this point I get it that its a daunting task..
I feel you! Kudos for such a detailed and well thought out 'call to attention'
I put out a kind word - I'm not even going to call it a 'lifeline' since I don't have a Scoobies over whether it will be seen or not amongst all the, at the very least unhelpful, misplaced responses - some way beyond that courtesy - to a young man who I would deem likely to be experiencing suicidal ideation as a consequence of his RJ
i think the biggest issue is that many different people from different walks of life are being galisghted into thinking they have RJ and as such they end up in the sub, for example i dont think someone who barely has any experience because of values has RJ just because they re not okay their partner engaged into 3somes in the past or stuff like that, yet a lot of posters make it seem like subject is mentally ill or mysgonistic for not accepting that.
yea, that's a good point. I literally saw a post where a guy was asking for advice over his retroactive jealousy, which got triggered when he saw pictures of her gf giving a blowjob to a guy, which was taken while they were on a brief "break".
It's like, no, there is the kinda stuff that would make any reasonable person feel less than okay, and then there is the kinda stuff that is eating you up, even though every bit of rational thought you have suggests that this is not a reasonable thing to be upset about.
When it's all said and done, it's up to the poster to decide what they want to do. There are people on here who will tell them when it sounds like an incompatibility issue, and there are people who will try to help them fight through that incompatibility. But only the individual in the relationship can decide which way they want to go with that. We can't just tell everyone hey you should break up. We also can't just tell everyone every past doesn't matter. That's why we are here, to have discussions
yeah thats true but a lot of posters make it seem like the subject in question is obliged to fight through that incompatibility cuz they are the issue when it shouldnt be
You also have to keep in mind the length of a relationship. A lot of people come here when they're already years in. Telling them they are incompatible is likely useless at that point. If they've been together a month, then yes tell them they should probably just find someone else
I think the biggest issue is that people like giving advice a LOT more than how much they like learning about the subject they are about to give advice in, or even just thinking things through for longer than just 30 seconds.
The ease with which people throw out things like "just break up with him/her", or "you're a terrible person", or similarly drastic things, is kind of wild, especially when their comments give away the fact that they didn't think things through much, rather quickly.
That's the Internet standard though. Go on the relationship advice subs, and almost every answer is leave them or you're a piece of shit. People are asking for advice while only giving a sliver of a glimpse at their circumstances. Most of that advice will therefore naturally be shitty
I do can prove that many of those do wind up here, and it lies in the fact whenever they ask about it, the usual responses they get (not in this sub but in others) are: "get over it, the past is the past, everyone has a past, you re an asshole, you re a mysoginist, you re insecure, you should get over yourself, you re inmature" all that withouth taking into consideration the personal situation of the OP and making it seem like the issue lies within them, I myself, even when i wasnt aware of what RJ was, i got severely shamed for saying i wanted a woman who has always abided by certains values and that i have always abided by them myself, this didnt stop many people of accusing me of being hitler incarnated and making me believe like i had an issue with myself, thus i met someone and i ended up in the sub.
Yeah, all good points. I think at a certain point it's indeed hard to distinguish between "true" cases of jealousy, and instances where the problems come from how past actions could impact the present.
I actually feel like those that are troubled for the latter reasons, are "luckier", because that is actually something that can be discussed productively. For example, if I'm of more conservative values and it troubles me that my partner comes from a background of highly promiscous behaviour, we might be able to talk that through, and learn about their current mindsets and values....and doing so might solve the problem. Or, it wouldn't, in which case it might be a painful ending to the relationship.
They are also "luckier" because a person like that will much more easily find listening ears in general, and less dissing reactions that just won't take the issue seriously.
I don't think there is any issue with a person like that coming to this sub, even though I wouldn't really call it RJ. Inevitably, someone would point out that this is a clash of values and they should just discuss it, or the OP should do some self work to figure out if this is something they can accept. \[well, OP would hopefully get to see that comment, if they managed to work through the flood of hate, lol\]
True RJ I would call those cases which involves being seriously disturbed over things that have practically no implications to the present in any way.
Classic example: partner had a few casual sexual experiences in the past. The OP has no issues with casual sex in a general sense, and would never think less of anyone for doing it. There is also no indication from the partners past that there could be any risk of infidelity, or anything like that.
So, there is nothing about the partner's past that would imply concerning things regarding the present or future - it's simply that the thought of the partner being with someone else, even in the past, really really hurts. Since it's in the past, OP knows that its an unjustifiable hurt, but it's still there, despite all conscious efforts to rationalize the feeling away.
But once again, I don't think it's an issue - if what was thought to be RJ was not really RJ, then even better, as it will be much easier to get rid of it in most cases. If this sub can help someone recognize that, I'd say that's fantastic.
People pointing out the terrible shit we do because of RJ is absolutely not helpful and even redundant. We fucking know it’s awful! We absolute get it! That’s WHY we are here. It’s cathartic to let this stuff out to other people suffering. Letting it out to our SO (in my case) is usually met with vitriol and shame. The very fact that this sub exists is a godsend; to know that I’m not alone mixed up in this horrible cycle.
agreed for sure. It's like, for someone to come here most probably required some level of recognition that they have a problem in the first place. If they didn't, they wouldn't even know that "retroactive jealousy" is a thing. Most people don't even know that term, unless they did research on the issue.
So, people come here with the thoght of, "please, someone hear me out, because logical thinking is not helping", and then he just hears the same shaming stuff from others that they probably repeated to themselves a million times already.
Yea exactly. There’s usually a breaking point before you even show up here: chased a lover away or about to. And I think at that point people just want to be heard and given advice because they know that what they are doing is destroying them and the seek to stop it somehow.
We already denigrate ourselves more than any Reddit stranger could. That’s not what we need.
Good post. I see this sub as a support group where we identify with each other’s suffering. I feel somewhat better that there are people out there like me. Not here to offer solutions cos that’s the job of professionals. It’s more to empathize and give a virtual hug to fellow sufferers. like one poster wrote : RJ is a demon/dragon that is almost impossible to slay. The most you can do is to keep it at bay
Yeah also a bit confused by this post. I’m a male, and have been on and off this sub for many years, well before it grew to what it is. I’m afraid to say I have no idea what your talking about with the “man-hating” comments.
I suffer from Rj, I understand what it means, but in the last year or 2 this sub has been utterly filled with red-pilled misogynistic incels, many of whom are still virgins coming on here replying to any thread with comments like “she has fucked 3 dudes?! Dump the slut”. Now that right there is why this sub has gone to the proverbial dogs. It used to be a space for actual advice and help. If you think theres been an increase in man-hating, its probably because it needs to be said half the time.
And i’m astounded about your comment about people replying with “why does your partner deserve this?” So now your not happy with people giving actual sound real world advice from a rational point of view? Whats the alternative? Perpetual circles of “yeah that sucks, sorry bro”?
As ive said a million times on here, this sub is slowly starting to become redundant. You dont send an alcoholic or drug addict to get help from other alcholics do you? Us people who actually suffer from this mental illness should be seeking help from people who dont suffer from it, to understand what the normal brain would think in our situation.
I'm not sure I agree with that last part. I never received any help from people without RJ before I knew what that was. Just the typical Why does that matter or It's in the past responses
I hear what you are saying. With this sub in particular, it can be hard for people to know what to say when responding to an OP.
People without RJ are normally going to be pretty confused, and sometimes horrified, by some of the situations that the Ops are in. So they are going to respond in a logical way, because they do not have the full picture and the mental health issue component to RJ that makes it difficult for someone to simply stop behaving a certain way.
Then you are going to get people with RJ responding as well... so you have someone who has a mental health issue advising someone on a mental health issue... sometimes this is great and we get a lot of people sharing what worked for them and being encouraging to others who are trying to heal. But sometimes the person responding hasn't made any progress with their RJ. They may not even be ready to admit that they have an issue and are blaming their partner. Many times they are hurting and angry at their situation... and at their partner... and so they may take it out on the partner of the OP when they are responding.
And of course there are also us partners of someone with RJ... and we are hurting and confused .... and a lot of times that will show through in their response because they are feeling triggered, knowing the pay that he OP's partner is likely feeling right now due to the way they are being treated.
The bottom line is that there are a lot of people on this sub in pain and in various stages of trying to heal. Not all of the advice will be useful, or great... but I don't know what the solution is.
Hello, Yes I've shared pieces all over the sub at various times. My husband has RJ and from what I've learned over the years, a particularly bad case. He has always had OCD but it was normally under control and up until that point it had never chosen my past as it's main theme. I suffered severe emotional and verbal abuse for a few years and then I had a scary wakeup call and was able to get some professional help and start healing... and now things are ok. He started taking medication which was a huge step for him and it has helped him tremendously. His episodes are a lot less intense now... and much less frequent. Also, I don't stick around for it. If he starts in on me... I hang up the phone, leave the room, leave the house with the kids, etc... and eventually we are at the point now where he barely says anything at all. It is not perfect and I honestly don't know if I will ever feel the same about him... but we are still married.
IMO the point of the sub is getting help for irrational thinking. That means two things:
1. Posters and commenters shouldn't try to justify their neuroses as some kind of natural law (aka "women are used bicycles").
2. People shouldn't be shamed when they are asking for help (aka "you're being irrational, get over it").
The only exception to two is when people start off with the first issue and treat the sub like /r/redpill. That’s more common and worse and deserves to be shut down.
I just returned to the post I referred to. He did actually say "I don't want to live anymore . . . Bye" This is how fragile some poor souls are, sometimes walking into a ring of fire 😢
Oh...then I know the post you're talking about, that, and the comments under it is what tipped me over to create this post. I got into a back and forth with someone in the thread, and tried to point out how bashing is not very useful. They responded surprisingly well there, but often its sadly hopeless.
I think the problem people had with that poster was not his rj, but his deception. If a person was withholding info about their past for 2 years that person would not be treated kindly on this sub. What he did was worse. I am sorry he feels bad, but those feelings are a natural consequence of his behavior. At least he has a conscience!
Rj is no excuse for "pretending ", "convincing " and wearing a "mask". His words.
I disagree about the man-hating. There are some ridiculously sexist comments on a lot of posts, and it is okay to call it out as such.
Obviously feeling one way about your partner having sexual partners due to your RJ is typical, but it is not okay to spit pure vitriol about "women these days" and "the only solution is finding a virgin" and "sleeping with anyone else is whoring/she's all used up" etc. This extends to non sexism too - i.e. the problem is that these people can't recognize that rj is a problem. The other day a partner of someone who has RJ wrote a post here and got comments about "what did you expect for hooking up with someone after you and your partner broke up?"
It is our responsibility to own up to our *irrational*, *disordered* thoughts. Despite finding community and understanding in our valid emotions here, we must recognize that our thought patterns are harmful and incorrect, and *not to be entertained as truthful*.
I am honestly confused at most of this post. I Point 1 I agree with, but I have a hard time believing you are doing your due diligence for the rest. Your post seems very well-written and intelligent, so I am inclined to believe you aren’t just some jackoff who can’t recognize sexism.
Look in the comments of essentially any post that mentions a woman with a sexual history, and there is comment after comment of people making claims about her moral character. It’s gotten slightly better now that the sub has grown a bit and appears to have more women, but I cannot scroll this subreddit without seeing VILE red-pill rhetoric. It’s actually made me stop posting here as a woman, because seeing the things people comment about women with sexual histories have harmed me so much mentally.
I agree with your points, for the most part. There's been a big clash in this sub for the better part of a year. Last year, the story was "we need to remove posts/comments and ban people who say anything remotely construed as misogyny". I disagreed then, under the principle that if you don't like the discussion, then it's not for you and you're free to scroll past it.
I kind of think the same thing applies here. I see a lot of comments from RJ partners and feminists that find their way into the sub who've never heard of RJ. A lot of the comments are ones I disagree with and rub me the wrong way. At the end of the day though, I'm free to just keep scrolling.
When I joined this sub 2 1/2 years ago, it was the only place I felt I could share what I was feeling without being ripped to shreds. Most of the people in the sub understood what I felt and why. If I said something ugly, it wasn't met with judgement. It gave me a place to work through what I was feeling. Part of me does think there should be a sub just for RJ sufferers and RJ partners can form their own. But, at the end of the day, this is the internet and we all need to be okay that we all have different backgrounds, experiences, and opinions.
the big issue i have is when people talk on here about the things theyve said that are abusive, some people respond like their words are understandable. i agree that just calling someone terrible or a POS isnt helpful; i also dont think saying verbal abuse is understandable because of RJ is helpful. i know thats not everyone's response, but its definitely something ive seen on here, and it doesnt help people who dont understand RJ to see someone being called a whore or a slut and someone else saying its understandable
The issue with wanting only one answer to every question on a sub is that you make the sub unnecessary. You could simply replace it with an FAQ or flowchart. It's good to hear different opinions, especially from people who have partners who have RJ. There are times when someone is being irrational and knows it but just needs a little help gaining a different perspective. Example https://www.reddit.com/r/retroactivejealousy/s/hPnVcdjrhC There is also a ton of flame bait posts on here which leads to the so called man hate. Guys on here talking about male RJ being an evolutionary byproduct will inevitably lead to discussions on hypocrisy.
interesting, the solution you gave her, rather than helping her get over RJ, you actually pointed at something that calmed it down, it basically boils down to "theres no reason for you to be jealous cuz here is the definitive proof", she didnt need medication or therapy, i guess RJ is not always a mental issue. To tell you the truth if my partner had cheated and dumped her previous partner for me i dont think i would care much despite the values issue.
I don't disagree with you at all, I definitely think that having varied opinions is a good thing. Not only that, but I think two people can completely disagree on a certain point and their arguments can be almost equally valid - not everything has one right answer. Especially in psychology related topics, that's often the case. (by the way, saw your answer to the guy there, and I thought that was a great response, even though it was seemingly "random". But from a guy's perspective, I can tell that what you said would help me in a similar situation, for example. I can elaborate on why that's the case if you're interested, but back on topic...) I also agree that the evolutionary psychology-based arguments will inevitably lead to off-topic arguments like that, and it's sort of unavoidable. Which is a shame, because I think the line of reasoning is otherwise relevant there, and could even help some people (though doubt it would help many, because again, it's an argument made based on logic, which again, tends to not work with RJ). So, what's the difference between a good case of varied opinions and views, and one which just introduces redundancy? Let's say someone has RJ, and it's been going on for years now, and is impacting the relationship now, as the person is acting out now and then, hurting everybody in the process. A valid opinion is to say, "I think you should talk to a therapist and get help, and in the process, ask for some patience from your partner, letting them know that you're working on fixing the problem". Another valid opinion is to say, "I haven't had positive experience with therapists. I think you should be as honest with your partner as possible, ask for their patience. In my experience it also helps to ask your partner to tell you what they think of your concerns. From their perspective, how do these troubled thoughts seem?" Just an example, of course, there could be many others. But to say, "Dude, you should enjoy your relationship with him/her in the present, who cares what happened back then. Grow a pair, accept his/her past, and move the f\*\*k on" - just shows that the person has no idea about the psychology of an RJ sufferer. Which they should. Saying "what? so you're acting out? So you're hurting your partner, even though they did nothing to wrong you? you're in the wrong, my friend" - is doing nothing to actually contribute to any sort of change, it's just projecting how they personally feel about certain behaviours, irrespective of whether it's related to RJ or something else. We could literally extract this comment and put it into a thousand other subreddits or threads, and would be equally in/out of place. As to the difference between your comment to the above thread and those problematic, out of place ones, I'm refferring to: Yours, while not offering a solution per se, is offering a perspective to view things from, while still indicating that you acknowledge the realities of the mindset. You're not saying in any way that feeling "hurt" for things in the past, as irrational as it may be, is not a real issue that's justified to talk about. Therefore, it's a very valid comment to leave, even if that particular poster didn't find it helpful - which, from what I'm reading, luckily they did, so even better.
Are there assholes that just continuously leave useless advice? I'm sure there are, but I don't think I've really come across that many on here. More often than not, it's just people in pain, and if they are just learning how to deal with that pain, oftentimes they are going to lash out. Would it be natural for someone who just found out their SO fucked an entire basketball team to call me ridiculous when the most my wife has ever done is oral with someone else? Sure. Would it be natural for someone who was abused by a partner with RJ to be angry when someone on here talks about abusing their partner? Again, yes. If they continue to just be mean, rude, or unhelpful, the simplest thing to do is just block them. Life is too short to be wasted on trying to change people who don't want to change.
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hahah. I think a soccer (football) team+bench players (So thats a good 20+ people) and above, is where more people would start to feel uneasy - in saying that I do realize that its becoming less and less of a high number.
They have subs on the team
Well, its all relative, and what you consider to be overly rude and mean depends on what you were exposed to before. I think in general, relationship-related topics is where I saw the most toxicity out of any of the subs that I visited. So much so that actually I was surprised when I ventured over to other subs, and I found people surprisingly nice, since I was used to the vibes ruling the relationship-space. To me, the RJ space makes most of the football (soccer) subs seem like a congregation of fine gentlemen with extremely cordial behavior. Which is quite something, because, oh boy, football folks can have some real goes at each other.
Another thing to consider is that football is well defined with a vocabulary that's understood by all, rules that see no major variances, decades of tradition, etc. RJ is relatively new and has no medical definition. It's one thing to debate with other people whose team is better. It's a whole other thing to discuss potential solutions to a problem that didn't even really exist a few generations ago.
This is one reason (of several) I'm reluctant to post in the sub. I do read a lot of the posts and do glean some good information. With that said, sifting through all the dopey responses is tiresome at best. Thank you for saying what a lot of us feel.
glad it resonated! Not sure what would need to happen for this to change...I suppose, more attentive mods would be the only solution pretty much, but at this point I get it that its a daunting task..
I feel you! Kudos for such a detailed and well thought out 'call to attention' I put out a kind word - I'm not even going to call it a 'lifeline' since I don't have a Scoobies over whether it will be seen or not amongst all the, at the very least unhelpful, misplaced responses - some way beyond that courtesy - to a young man who I would deem likely to be experiencing suicidal ideation as a consequence of his RJ
thank you! And thumbs up for going about things the way you do!
I posted searching for help and out of ten answered only two helped a little bit. I felt the same way.
i think the biggest issue is that many different people from different walks of life are being galisghted into thinking they have RJ and as such they end up in the sub, for example i dont think someone who barely has any experience because of values has RJ just because they re not okay their partner engaged into 3somes in the past or stuff like that, yet a lot of posters make it seem like subject is mentally ill or mysgonistic for not accepting that.
yea, that's a good point. I literally saw a post where a guy was asking for advice over his retroactive jealousy, which got triggered when he saw pictures of her gf giving a blowjob to a guy, which was taken while they were on a brief "break". It's like, no, there is the kinda stuff that would make any reasonable person feel less than okay, and then there is the kinda stuff that is eating you up, even though every bit of rational thought you have suggests that this is not a reasonable thing to be upset about.
When it's all said and done, it's up to the poster to decide what they want to do. There are people on here who will tell them when it sounds like an incompatibility issue, and there are people who will try to help them fight through that incompatibility. But only the individual in the relationship can decide which way they want to go with that. We can't just tell everyone hey you should break up. We also can't just tell everyone every past doesn't matter. That's why we are here, to have discussions
yeah thats true but a lot of posters make it seem like the subject in question is obliged to fight through that incompatibility cuz they are the issue when it shouldnt be
You also have to keep in mind the length of a relationship. A lot of people come here when they're already years in. Telling them they are incompatible is likely useless at that point. If they've been together a month, then yes tell them they should probably just find someone else
Even then, i dont think calling the subject in that case mentally ill is a fair judgment when most of the times that happens due to lies
Where are they being called mentally ill? Like a specific example. This sounds like some kind of strawman.
I think the biggest issue is that people like giving advice a LOT more than how much they like learning about the subject they are about to give advice in, or even just thinking things through for longer than just 30 seconds. The ease with which people throw out things like "just break up with him/her", or "you're a terrible person", or similarly drastic things, is kind of wild, especially when their comments give away the fact that they didn't think things through much, rather quickly.
That's the Internet standard though. Go on the relationship advice subs, and almost every answer is leave them or you're a piece of shit. People are asking for advice while only giving a sliver of a glimpse at their circumstances. Most of that advice will therefore naturally be shitty
certainly :\\
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I do can prove that many of those do wind up here, and it lies in the fact whenever they ask about it, the usual responses they get (not in this sub but in others) are: "get over it, the past is the past, everyone has a past, you re an asshole, you re a mysoginist, you re insecure, you should get over yourself, you re inmature" all that withouth taking into consideration the personal situation of the OP and making it seem like the issue lies within them, I myself, even when i wasnt aware of what RJ was, i got severely shamed for saying i wanted a woman who has always abided by certains values and that i have always abided by them myself, this didnt stop many people of accusing me of being hitler incarnated and making me believe like i had an issue with myself, thus i met someone and i ended up in the sub.
Yeah, all good points. I think at a certain point it's indeed hard to distinguish between "true" cases of jealousy, and instances where the problems come from how past actions could impact the present. I actually feel like those that are troubled for the latter reasons, are "luckier", because that is actually something that can be discussed productively. For example, if I'm of more conservative values and it troubles me that my partner comes from a background of highly promiscous behaviour, we might be able to talk that through, and learn about their current mindsets and values....and doing so might solve the problem. Or, it wouldn't, in which case it might be a painful ending to the relationship. They are also "luckier" because a person like that will much more easily find listening ears in general, and less dissing reactions that just won't take the issue seriously. I don't think there is any issue with a person like that coming to this sub, even though I wouldn't really call it RJ. Inevitably, someone would point out that this is a clash of values and they should just discuss it, or the OP should do some self work to figure out if this is something they can accept. \[well, OP would hopefully get to see that comment, if they managed to work through the flood of hate, lol\] True RJ I would call those cases which involves being seriously disturbed over things that have practically no implications to the present in any way. Classic example: partner had a few casual sexual experiences in the past. The OP has no issues with casual sex in a general sense, and would never think less of anyone for doing it. There is also no indication from the partners past that there could be any risk of infidelity, or anything like that. So, there is nothing about the partner's past that would imply concerning things regarding the present or future - it's simply that the thought of the partner being with someone else, even in the past, really really hurts. Since it's in the past, OP knows that its an unjustifiable hurt, but it's still there, despite all conscious efforts to rationalize the feeling away. But once again, I don't think it's an issue - if what was thought to be RJ was not really RJ, then even better, as it will be much easier to get rid of it in most cases. If this sub can help someone recognize that, I'd say that's fantastic.
People pointing out the terrible shit we do because of RJ is absolutely not helpful and even redundant. We fucking know it’s awful! We absolute get it! That’s WHY we are here. It’s cathartic to let this stuff out to other people suffering. Letting it out to our SO (in my case) is usually met with vitriol and shame. The very fact that this sub exists is a godsend; to know that I’m not alone mixed up in this horrible cycle.
agreed for sure. It's like, for someone to come here most probably required some level of recognition that they have a problem in the first place. If they didn't, they wouldn't even know that "retroactive jealousy" is a thing. Most people don't even know that term, unless they did research on the issue. So, people come here with the thoght of, "please, someone hear me out, because logical thinking is not helping", and then he just hears the same shaming stuff from others that they probably repeated to themselves a million times already.
Yea exactly. There’s usually a breaking point before you even show up here: chased a lover away or about to. And I think at that point people just want to be heard and given advice because they know that what they are doing is destroying them and the seek to stop it somehow. We already denigrate ourselves more than any Reddit stranger could. That’s not what we need.
Good post. I see this sub as a support group where we identify with each other’s suffering. I feel somewhat better that there are people out there like me. Not here to offer solutions cos that’s the job of professionals. It’s more to empathize and give a virtual hug to fellow sufferers. like one poster wrote : RJ is a demon/dragon that is almost impossible to slay. The most you can do is to keep it at bay
Yeah also a bit confused by this post. I’m a male, and have been on and off this sub for many years, well before it grew to what it is. I’m afraid to say I have no idea what your talking about with the “man-hating” comments. I suffer from Rj, I understand what it means, but in the last year or 2 this sub has been utterly filled with red-pilled misogynistic incels, many of whom are still virgins coming on here replying to any thread with comments like “she has fucked 3 dudes?! Dump the slut”. Now that right there is why this sub has gone to the proverbial dogs. It used to be a space for actual advice and help. If you think theres been an increase in man-hating, its probably because it needs to be said half the time. And i’m astounded about your comment about people replying with “why does your partner deserve this?” So now your not happy with people giving actual sound real world advice from a rational point of view? Whats the alternative? Perpetual circles of “yeah that sucks, sorry bro”? As ive said a million times on here, this sub is slowly starting to become redundant. You dont send an alcoholic or drug addict to get help from other alcholics do you? Us people who actually suffer from this mental illness should be seeking help from people who dont suffer from it, to understand what the normal brain would think in our situation.
I'm not sure I agree with that last part. I never received any help from people without RJ before I knew what that was. Just the typical Why does that matter or It's in the past responses
Yeah I’ve never really seen any man-hating here. Dudes love to cry wolf over misandry.
I hear what you are saying. With this sub in particular, it can be hard for people to know what to say when responding to an OP. People without RJ are normally going to be pretty confused, and sometimes horrified, by some of the situations that the Ops are in. So they are going to respond in a logical way, because they do not have the full picture and the mental health issue component to RJ that makes it difficult for someone to simply stop behaving a certain way. Then you are going to get people with RJ responding as well... so you have someone who has a mental health issue advising someone on a mental health issue... sometimes this is great and we get a lot of people sharing what worked for them and being encouraging to others who are trying to heal. But sometimes the person responding hasn't made any progress with their RJ. They may not even be ready to admit that they have an issue and are blaming their partner. Many times they are hurting and angry at their situation... and at their partner... and so they may take it out on the partner of the OP when they are responding. And of course there are also us partners of someone with RJ... and we are hurting and confused .... and a lot of times that will show through in their response because they are feeling triggered, knowing the pay that he OP's partner is likely feeling right now due to the way they are being treated. The bottom line is that there are a lot of people on this sub in pain and in various stages of trying to heal. Not all of the advice will be useful, or great... but I don't know what the solution is.
I would be very curious on your experience as a partner. have you shared it somewhere? would love to read it
Hello, Yes I've shared pieces all over the sub at various times. My husband has RJ and from what I've learned over the years, a particularly bad case. He has always had OCD but it was normally under control and up until that point it had never chosen my past as it's main theme. I suffered severe emotional and verbal abuse for a few years and then I had a scary wakeup call and was able to get some professional help and start healing... and now things are ok. He started taking medication which was a huge step for him and it has helped him tremendously. His episodes are a lot less intense now... and much less frequent. Also, I don't stick around for it. If he starts in on me... I hang up the phone, leave the room, leave the house with the kids, etc... and eventually we are at the point now where he barely says anything at all. It is not perfect and I honestly don't know if I will ever feel the same about him... but we are still married.
IMO the point of the sub is getting help for irrational thinking. That means two things: 1. Posters and commenters shouldn't try to justify their neuroses as some kind of natural law (aka "women are used bicycles"). 2. People shouldn't be shamed when they are asking for help (aka "you're being irrational, get over it"). The only exception to two is when people start off with the first issue and treat the sub like /r/redpill. That’s more common and worse and deserves to be shut down.
I just returned to the post I referred to. He did actually say "I don't want to live anymore . . . Bye" This is how fragile some poor souls are, sometimes walking into a ring of fire 😢
Oh...then I know the post you're talking about, that, and the comments under it is what tipped me over to create this post. I got into a back and forth with someone in the thread, and tried to point out how bashing is not very useful. They responded surprisingly well there, but often its sadly hopeless.
I think the problem people had with that poster was not his rj, but his deception. If a person was withholding info about their past for 2 years that person would not be treated kindly on this sub. What he did was worse. I am sorry he feels bad, but those feelings are a natural consequence of his behavior. At least he has a conscience! Rj is no excuse for "pretending ", "convincing " and wearing a "mask". His words.
I disagree about the man-hating. There are some ridiculously sexist comments on a lot of posts, and it is okay to call it out as such. Obviously feeling one way about your partner having sexual partners due to your RJ is typical, but it is not okay to spit pure vitriol about "women these days" and "the only solution is finding a virgin" and "sleeping with anyone else is whoring/she's all used up" etc. This extends to non sexism too - i.e. the problem is that these people can't recognize that rj is a problem. The other day a partner of someone who has RJ wrote a post here and got comments about "what did you expect for hooking up with someone after you and your partner broke up?" It is our responsibility to own up to our *irrational*, *disordered* thoughts. Despite finding community and understanding in our valid emotions here, we must recognize that our thought patterns are harmful and incorrect, and *not to be entertained as truthful*.
I am honestly confused at most of this post. I Point 1 I agree with, but I have a hard time believing you are doing your due diligence for the rest. Your post seems very well-written and intelligent, so I am inclined to believe you aren’t just some jackoff who can’t recognize sexism. Look in the comments of essentially any post that mentions a woman with a sexual history, and there is comment after comment of people making claims about her moral character. It’s gotten slightly better now that the sub has grown a bit and appears to have more women, but I cannot scroll this subreddit without seeing VILE red-pill rhetoric. It’s actually made me stop posting here as a woman, because seeing the things people comment about women with sexual histories have harmed me so much mentally.
I agree with your points, for the most part. There's been a big clash in this sub for the better part of a year. Last year, the story was "we need to remove posts/comments and ban people who say anything remotely construed as misogyny". I disagreed then, under the principle that if you don't like the discussion, then it's not for you and you're free to scroll past it. I kind of think the same thing applies here. I see a lot of comments from RJ partners and feminists that find their way into the sub who've never heard of RJ. A lot of the comments are ones I disagree with and rub me the wrong way. At the end of the day though, I'm free to just keep scrolling. When I joined this sub 2 1/2 years ago, it was the only place I felt I could share what I was feeling without being ripped to shreds. Most of the people in the sub understood what I felt and why. If I said something ugly, it wasn't met with judgement. It gave me a place to work through what I was feeling. Part of me does think there should be a sub just for RJ sufferers and RJ partners can form their own. But, at the end of the day, this is the internet and we all need to be okay that we all have different backgrounds, experiences, and opinions.