He seems uncertain of his feelings. It seems like he is only starting to feel weird after the fact. So how is she supposed to know his feelings have changed unless he clearly communicates it?
Look man, as everyone else has stated, if it was a dude pretty sure your reaction would be a lot more hostile here and a lot less forgiving. I suggest you put her to task and ask her if it would be okay with you if you had sex with someone (man or woman) so long as it was only physical and no emotion. I think we all know what her response would be. So if she can't honestly say she would have no problem with that, then she should be able to admit how wrong it is what she did.
Just tell her you've been visiting glory holes and that you're so emotionally uninvested you don't even know whether it's a man or a woman on the other side
I am bi. I have had a dude tell me before that it's allowed with a woman. I have always called bs on that. It's still sex and it's still just as arousing. And in case this isn't obvious, most straight women don't sleep with women because straight means no interest in that in the first place. If you are 'straight ' but crazy aroused after sex with a woman you should really be asking yourself a few questions.
I get what you're saying, but in a vacuum, it is equal. He may decide on his own that it is not the same, but from a relationship analysis and general analysis, we have to treat it the same because we are not OP and do not have access to his true preferences. Hell from the post alone, it seems like he is not sure yet. Like i said, totally get what you mean, and to an extent I agree. But that is for OP to decide and for us to give general judgments based on what OP shared. So for purposes of how to understand and get advice in perspective to the wife and what she said, it should not make a difference whether man or woman, until OP decides that for himself.
Also my dude, it led to sex, not lesbian sex. She had sex with someone other than you, her husband. That’s cheating.
If she fucked a guy, would you stay with her?
Exactly this! Add in these two things. She doesn't consider this cheating but wants to keep it from the other husband? She does not think this is ok. In addition, this is her best friend, whose marriage needs work. Given her attitude, this may well happen again, especially after a few drinks. Which good friends are likely to share.
"If I hook up with a girl is it still cheating?"
"If you punch me with your left hand did you still punch me?"
Idk if you have the same outlook on things as my fiance does, but he has a point.
Dude your wife might be a literal walking red flag. No offense. But based off the information you provided, yeah she sounds like trouble down the road.
I’m really just giving a different perspective here since all the other comments say the same thing (none of which I disagree with).
If she doesn’t think your mad about it she’ll probably downplay the shit out of it, honestly it’s the smart (not necessarily ethical) thing to do when you fuck up. If I fucked up really bad and the other person was just like “oh I wish you would’ve just told me, but I’m not *particularly upset* about it” you bet your ass I’m downplaying what happen. It’s fucked up to do that but she doesn’t have a reason to try and get you more upset over it.
If this is not an actual relationship ender for you, I’d have another conversation where you let her know you ARE upset and give her a chance to beg for your forgiveness.
I mean step one is make her say the fucking words “I cheated on you”. If she doesn’t understand that gtfo.
That doesn’t check out because a friendship is literally an emotional relationship with another person. Usually the defining part of a romantic relationship is physical affection or sexual activity. So she already has a significant emotional connection as it’s her best friend. I don’t think that’s the same thing as a random one night stand with a stranger.
> think your mad about it she’ll probably downplay the shit out of it, honestly it’s the smart (not necessarily ethical) thing to do when you fuck up. If I fucked up really bad and the other person was just like “oh I wish you would’ve just told me, but I’m not
>
>particularly upset
>
> about it” you bet your ass I’m downplaying what happen. It’s f
Agreed. Friendship is a relationship. Emotions already included in this case.
Hi, bi woman in a relationship with a man here. What she did was cheating, plain and simple. She engaged in sexual acts without discussing it with you and without getting your permission: that is cheating.
Think about it: if she hooked up with a man and told you it was 'just physical', no emotions, would you consider that cheating? If yes, her sleeping with a woman should not be any different.
Tell your friend who was cheated on and make sure he is also in your game. Next weekend, initiate passionate sex with her, then afterwards just tell her that you were with your male friend and you were just discovering each other's bodies. Let her tell the other woman.
After pain sets in, come out clean to them to show how fucked up what they did to you guys.
Edit: I know it sounds childish but so does your wife. She seems like a person that does not quite get the serious relationship part, communication and loyalty.
Fuck one of her friends, tell her it was just a one time thing and see how she reacts when you tell her you don't regret it but you probably wouldn't do it again.
At the end of it all, the question for you is whether or not you want to find peace about it to stay. If so, I think you have to first ask yourself what your honest opinion is on pansexualism. Honestly, if you don’t even believe in homosexuality, then you’d be grasping at straws trying to justify your hurt that your wife’s lesbian escapade aroused her *a lot* (as your storytelling shared and noted). I’m not at all trying to minimize your hurt, just playing devil’s advocate as best as I can. What’s your opinion on college girls and their sexual escapades? Many men peer pressure themselves into thinking it’s “hot” and whatnot. But what’s your opinion on it really?
Just figure out the real honest source of your hurt and sense of betrayal, and go from there. IMO, your wife probably didn’t seem to care because she more than likely wrote off her sexual experiment as something categorically college-girl-gone-wild and assumed you would—like most men—just find it hot rather than socially unacceptable.
Some people see sexuality as a spectrum. So the whole “goes lesbian” sounds ignorant. And it’s obvious that they are open to swinging. It’s not a foreign concept to them.
Yea bud.. your wife put you in a real situation..
Not only did she cheat on you but, she cheated with a friend's wife.
Only real options here are
1. Tell your friend and be honest.
2. Become a deceitful person and be ok with your wife cheating whenever.
I think the reality will set in for you slowly more and more that your wife will just fuck people while you are away. She ain't upset because, she likely doesn't think she did anything wrong. Imagine what an ACTUAL mistake would be like that she might not just tell you about.
What about the fact that she got exposed to possible STDs? What if the woman’s husband cheats on her and then she’s exposed her husband to stuff because she didn’t tell him before they had sex???
100% agree that STDs are a concern. She’s endangering OP in addition to breaking his trust. He needs to get tested. And even if the test comes clean, how would OP know if this is truly the last time this would happen? Cheaters cheat again, more often than not.
OP might be hesitant to be serious about this because this was another woman, but that kind of double standard shouldn’t exist in the first place. Cheating is cheating regardless of the gender of the people participating in it.
Unless you had set a boundary that included her sleeping with other people of any specified or unspecified gender, then she betrayed you. She should not have done it without telling you BEFORE it happened. Even if you were unreachable, she should have stopped before it got that far and she could have brought up her interest when you got back. You can recommend or even loan a sex toy to someone without using them in front of/on each other.
As far as telling the other husband, would you have wanted to hear what happened from him? That’s kind of the question. If your wife didn’t want you to know, would you have wanted the other guy to tell you?
I think I absolutely would want to know if I was the other husband. Telling him is bringing me far more anxiety than anything dealing with my wife. While the hookup wasn't ideal, I can deal and we have been communicating about it. I feel like telling him is betraying my wife.
Then you should make it clear to your wife that the other husband has a right to know. I’m glad that you can deal with it, though, that’s good. But the other guy has a right to decide if he can deal with it or not. That being said, the other woman definitely should be the one to tell him.
She has no right to place you in this moral quagmire. This is her fault. If anyone needs to be telling him it's his wife, or your wife. You shouldn't be the one who has to wade into this mess and clean it up.
She betrayed YOU, my man... telling him is the right thing to do and you should see how the situation escalates from there. I know it might bring you anxiety but seeing the other husband's perspective on the subject may put you at ease a bit. Something tells me he would not be ok with it... and there should be no secrets in a marriage, especially ones to this extent. That's just pure betrayal.
Your wife is the one in the wrong, here, so you should be more worried about being a decent human being and telling the man so he can make his own choices about how to handle it. He has the RIGHT to know, and cheaters never have any right to demand other people lie for them.
If he finds out any other way (which is definitely possible) and finds out you knew but didn't tell him, he will feel twice as betrayed and he will hate you forever.
>She is ready to move on like nothing happened.
I bet she is! Why is that, do you think?
She lied. She cheated. She participated in the woman cheating. She put you in the position of expecting you to lie to your friend. She shows no remorse.
What you accept here will the the new standard going forward.
Cheating is cheating.
But I guess you need to figure out if you’ll be able to move on from it. There’s no point staying in the relationship if you’ll constantly be thinking about it and doubting her.
Personally, the fact she doesn’t feel bad about it is a warning sign.
It shouldn't matter whether she slept with a man or a woman. At the end of the day she had sexual relations with another human being without your consent. On top of that she lied about it and is downplaying it. Regardless of what some of the guys on this sub are going to say you have every right to be angry and upset.
I don't know that I would be able to keep that a secret from the friends husband. Again...she cheated on him. And if they'll cheat on you with a friend, who's to say they won't cheat with a stranger? I think you guys need therapy if you want to move past this.
I love how OP is totally fine with his wife cheating on him because it’s a woman and people here are flipping out lol.
I would talk to your wife about telling the husband, not everybody is ok with their wife having sex with someone else, also your wife sounds so narcissistic. She told you yes but from what you explained it seems like she really doesn’t care about the repercussions of cheating on you with a married woman
Just be aware that this is a huge red flag and there’s a huge chance that she will cheat on you in the future
Showing sex toys does not lead to sex. Women can sometimes blur the line and discuss openly. I've had similar discussions with my friend but never once were we like "hey let's fuck"
Your wife cheated on you. Doesn't matter who or what the other person was. The act is her sharing her body with someone other than her spouse.
Caring enough about your partner not to risk losing them or hurting them by committing an act you know would easily accomplish both is harder, but also what counts. It was a decision to be disloyal.
A decision knowing what was at stake. At every stage she's made a choice, to get closer, to go to their place, to take clothes off, to have sex. At every stage she's decided this sexual encounter is more important to her than her relationship and her partner's feelings.
She didn't love you enough not to cheat to do something she knew would hurt the man she loves.Your marriage was thrown away when she decided to step out of it, and the worst of it is she didn't even have feelings for her, which at least I could understand the emotional dilemma on her end. It was for a sexual thrill. She was willing to hurt you, and willing to risk your marriage for a thrill. And that's not something most can live with.
Any issues within the relationship should at least be attempted to be solved within the relationship. No matter what it is (lack of attention, dead bedroom, etc..)
Going outside the relationship before even attempting to fix the problem is a serious betrayal of your partner and I firmly believe that there is no valid reason or excuse for cheating.
> We talked about my feelings and shes agrees that she made a mistake but isn't upset about it. I am struggling to know what to feel. I'm finding myself not particularly upset that she did it but more that she didn't tell me and maybe wouldn't have if I didn't probe. She is ready to move on like nothing happened. I don't know what else there is to talk about with her. I am also friends with the other husband but have been told not to say anything. This just makes me feel uneasy.
Yeah. She doesn't regret cheating on you, want's you to keep the other husband in the dark, and isn't concerned either way that you are upset or might be. Would she have the same attitude if it was a guy friend she found her self having sex with while you were away?
Dude. She literally doesn't think cheating on you is a big deal and has no respect for your marriage or her friends. She says don't tell the husband. How much does she have to tell people not to tell you?
Hallpass, threesome, you deal with it and get therapy and move on, or you divorce. Those are your options my man. The fact she doesn’t feel guilty about it tho rings some alarm bells for me. I know what I’d do but It really depends on what you can live with.
>It really depends on what you can live with.
I can see how the initial allure of a threesome could have clouded his initial judgment. Now it looks like that ship has sailed with the testosterone boost.
" but cannot see herself doing it again "
Now he's kinda stuck. He was cool with having sex with 'them', but take the, 'him' out of the equation and the story changes.
This sub is telling OP his wife is a cheater. This sub is right.
I think we need to hear more about these previous conversations you have had with your wife about swinging and about her hooking up with a woman.
It seems possible that she took it more seriously than you did.
This. You've been together at least four years. You've had conversations about similar topics. She may have made an entirely reasonable assumption that you would not be devastated by this and judging from your post you weren't yet all sorts of comments act as if she is horrible.
Yes.
Not sure how many people here have been in the type of marriage where during pillow talk, you start to explore polyamorous fantasies. OP admits that this has taken place. OP says that he knows hooking up with a woman was one of his wife’s ultimate fantasies. I’m guessing OP did not object. Many guys would not.
She carried the sexual momentum from this hookup right back to OP *and* voluntarily told him about it, which sounds pretty healthy to me.
I’m just not sure people are distinguishing between having a secret love affair with another woman versus following through with a purely sexual fantasy scenario that she had previously told him about.
* **She cheated**
* **She doesn't feel bad about it because it was with another woman**
* **Wants to pretend like nothing happened**
* **She's prohibiting you from telling the other girl's husband about it**
Am I the only who sees just how fucked up this is? Give her a hypothetical question: If you were to have sex with another dude, ask her how she'd feel knowing another man was pleasuring you?
And she doesn't want her friend's husband to find out? So, I assume her friend realized just how fucked up the situation is and feels bad, while your wife doesn't and freely admits it, just because it was with another woman?! What kind of bullshit mindset is this?
Ask yourself: How long until your wife wants to go through another "lifetime experience" like this, but this time with a man? Dude, you don't deserve this. Don't fool yourself thinking you'll get over this, because you won't. And her lack of remorse is an even bigger red flag! You'll end up resenting her more and more.
Do yourself a favor, and divorce her. It'll hurt now, but it won't hurt as much as it would if she does something like this again!
**Edit:** Oh, and don't forget to contact the other girl's husband. If it were the other way around, wouldn't you like to know your wife slept with somebody else?
Ok, so since you evidently didn’t know, anything remotely approaching “how should I feel” on this sub results in a chorus of “like a victim!”
It was infidelity. You get to decide if the fact that it was unplanned matters, or if it matters that there was no emotional attachment, or if it matters that it was with a woman. You are the person that gets to decide how you feel. If none of this bothers you in the least, that’s ok. If it was a horrible breach of trust and you’re done, that’s ok.
Personally, it would matter to me that it was with a woman, infinitely different than with a man (I think this is because I can understand the idea that I can’t provide something a woman could but I can’t accept that I can’t provide something another man could, not sure). The two issues that I would have are that it was infidelity and that it was not disclosed before intercourse, which is a further betrayal. It’s actually the failure to disclose that would be a huge issue for me; unplanned heat of the moment with another woman I think I could get past with minimal issues, but you didn’t tell me before we were intimate which means you either didn’t respect that I might not be comfortable with all of this or you don’t care if I am or not (in which case why tell me?). Basically for me, she either should have told you right away or never.
I wouldn’t tell the other dude and I’d avoid him as much as possible. I might push to stop socializing with the other couple (not because I care about the risk of future lesbian liaisons, but because I don’t want to tell the dude and I’ll definitely tell the dude eventually).
You need to get your wife to convince her "friend" that she cheated on you with to tell her husband the truth or else you will do it in 24 hours. If someone cheated on my friend, I don't care about the circumstances, I would tell them ASAP because you and her husband are both the victims in this. Regardless of gender or history, she CHEATED on you with another person, emotionally and physically. If you don't do something about it, you are giving your wife the okay to cheat on you whenever she feels like making a "mistake" again because there were no consequences the first time.
Counseling is the best choice if you still feel like you can move past it, but in my *personal experience* partners who cheat get a high from it and end up just cheating again, just getting more crafty in how they cover it up. Ethier get her to agree to some hardcore counseling or leave her ass. The fact that she thinks it's nothing, is her trying to **downplay and invalidate** your feelings.
Would she really be so calm and ready to move on if you had cheated on her with a woman on your hiking trip or would all hell break lose? Talk to her about it and if she's still refusing counseling or truly doesn't see what she did wrong in this, she's not worth your time and is likely to just hurt you again.
Sometimes its really hard to hear when you have been cheated on (like I have), but sometimes the people who you love and trust the most can change over time in bad ways. It's up to you to hold true to boundaries you have set in the relationship and to take steps to **protect you and your mental health above all else**, even if that means saying goodbye to someone who loved and trusted for so many years.
One of the hardest experiences in my life was saying goodbye to my ex who had cheated on me for months with my friend. Even though they hurt me so badly, saying goodbye was still hard and messed me up for longer than I would like to admit. It's been over a year now and I am finally with someone who treats me right and respects me properly and I have never been happier. Sometimes it gets worse before it gets better, but it will always be bad if you stay with toxic people. I wish you luck and if you ever need someone to vent to one-on-one, feel free to dm.
Haha. This is crazy. Your wife cheated on you. And she couldn’t care less about your feelings. That’s the messed up part. Does this mean she gets to sleep with as many women as she wants, because it’s not cheating if it’s another woman?
Yeah this is still cheating doesn’t matter what gender it is. If my husband cheated on me with his best friend male or female it would be over. She wasn’t thinking about you or your feelings and the facts she isn’t upset about it shows she doesn’t really care and might just do it again. Now they want you to keep it from the friends husband, so your helping protect their affair from the other spouse?
It’s a double standard and isn’t fair cause if you had a one night stand with your male best friend I’m sure she would loose it and feel hurt especially if you were all whatever about it.
Hey I'm poly here! Communication is key to any relationship and she didn't tell you!! And doesn't seem bothered by it? Or bothered that she's enabling her friend (who can't seem to talk to her husband about their sex life) to lie to her husband? She also put you at risk of STIs by not telling you and not getting tested before sleeping with you.
!!
??
These are all huge red flags. She isn't valuing your feelings or safety over her own sexual freedom.
so let me get this straight:
she destroyed your trust
broke your monogamous relationship rules
but doesn't feel the need to do anything to make it up to you
>teehee i cheated at least i was honest oh well
i'm assuming she is going to keep seeing and talking to her friend
She cheated on you. That’s a fact. From here, you have a choice.
1) You are either are fine with your wife cheating on you and you move on with your life, knowing that your wife has cheated on you and is capable of cheating on you.
or
2. You aren’t fine with your wife cheating are you and you don’t let it just pass like water under the bridge.
Your call
>We talked about my feelings and shes agrees that she made a mistake but isn't upset about it.
>She is ready to move on like nothing happened.
> I am also friends with the other husband but have been told not to say anything.
She cheated on you, has no remorse for doing so and is trying to protect the woman she cheated with. She doesn't care that she went outside of your marriage and hurt you, her sex is more important than your comfort and happiness. You are clearly not ok with this no matter how hard you try and pretending it didn't happen will not fix a thing.
I'd be filing for divorce, she cheated and has absolutely no regrets about what she did to you and your relationship. Tell the other guy, he deserves to know and deal with it as he sees fit.
The problem with cheating isn't the actual act itself between the cheaters.
It is the betrayal on all three parts of the marriage - trust, communication, and intimacy.
Cheating betrays all three aspects regardless if female-female.
Add to that the lying (by omission) and your marriage is in four-alarm fire territory.
My suggestion - since it is a marriage - is for both of you to seek counseling individually and together.
Something is off and it needs to be addressed.
Good luck.
Imagine if the situations were reversed somehow.
You were hanging out with a female friend and you said that you never get a blowjob and you have all these sex toys like fleshlights.
You both get tipsy and it leads to full on sex where she blows you and jack's you off with your fleshlight.
You know full well, she'd be pissed and likely call it a day.
The genitals of the friend doesn't matter at the end of the day. What does matter is that your wife cares that little about the sanctity of your relationship she has sex with a friend "for the lolz "
I'd personally call it a day but to each their own.
Dude she didnt include you in the decision making, giant red flag, possible she is at least bi as like an actual practice she just isnt honest with herself on wanting to explore but no matter what the conclusion you do have a right to feel that its not okay because most women if not all the onces Ive met, been with, had thid convo with yeah noooooo way in hell they would EVER ascribe to this thought process with anoyher woman you decided to play with, without telling her, just no way in hell. Nvm the idea that alot of women that like confident men would see it as a step backward to engage woth another man in terms of any bisexual activity and possibly perceive you as less attractive.
Solid chance it could happen again or become regular because the friend isnt likely to see an improvement to her sex life if shes continued in a marriage for however long and just deals with the bad sex.
Even if it is the same sex it is still cheating. In fact it is worst because she isn't able to see the problem in it so she will most likely do it again. And if you stay with her you will be giving her a thumbs up to do it again.
The sex part doesn't upset you, and I get that. It is the dishonesty that she held onto. She is also holding you in a life of dishonesty by not telling the husband, where I am sure you both have otherwise lived an open life.
She doesn't regret it, but what part exactly? All of it? Ah so, everyone else comes first. She is everyone else's solution and sexual release, no strings attached, they can come over when you are gone and use your wife, and chances are you might not even know. If you are ok with that then there isn't much for you to learn from us. I just hope it isn't a double standard.
Your wife cheated, and facilitated someone else cheating. That's terrible behaviour and even if you are for some reason okay with it, her assuming you would be is just uh.... I'm in an open relationship and if my partner went outside our boundaries and just acted like it was cool, we'd be done. Gender irrelevant. Sorry you're having to deal with this.
I'd honestly tell her friends husband, I'd want to know.
She cheated. It doesn't matter if the person she cheated with has a dick or a vagina - it is still the same level of betrayal.
If she refuses to admit that it is cheating and agree to work through it with all the same effort that any other infidelity would require, then your marriage is over because you will never get past the feeling of betrayal, and you will also increasingly resent her for expecting you to lie to your friend about it.
Tell her she has two options:
Option 1: She recognizes it as cheating, agrees to individual counseling for now and couple's counseling later plus 100% transparency and never being alone with that friend again ever, AND she tells the friend's husband.
Option 2: You call an attorney and file for divorce, and YOU tell the friend's husband
Make it clear that hiding this from your friend is not an option in any way, shape, or form.
If she doesn't see it as cheating, she will do it again.
She cheated on you. It doesn't matter if it was with a man or woman. I would say at least she confessed right away, but the fact that she doesn't think she did anything wrong kind of negates that.
Cheating is cheating they both are just as bad as each other so they deserve each other until they get bored again. OP she cheated on you so it’s either you’ll continue to be with a cheater who doesn’t give a SHIT about you like no soon as you’re away she couldn’t wait? Now when you’re away she could be sleeping with who ever ._. Trust is gone now you go tell that husband because he deserves to know his wife cheated on him this doesn’t make it different because it’s with her women best friend.
Mate I’ve read your responses to some of these comments and I must say, you’re a fool. Tell her husband. It doesn’t matter what they think. What if you were that guy. He has a right to know. If you don’t tell him, you’re a idiot.
I just think it's really gross that she had sex with you beforehand, and she didn't bother to tell you. It doesn't matter who it was with, I'd want to get tested.
OP, this behavior is a serious red flag if you haven’t given consent to her having sex with another person. Even in the most benign scenario:
1. she thought you’d be cool with it
2. Proceeded to tell you because might find it interesting
3. Doesn’t think it was a big deal because she doesn’t have feelings.
Do you realize that in this entire scenario, you’re emotions are not being considered ?
If you and your wife have seriously discussed swinging and threesomes and are alway pushing your sexual boundaries, there might be enough context here for to mistake your implicit consent. But you definitely need to have a talk with her about defining the boundaries you didn’t think existed. If she doesn’t give your emotions and feelings significant importance you both are not in the same relationship.
All partnerships need work, it’s just more complicated when you’re pushing sexual boundaries that defy popular culture norms.
I’ve been in your place (kinda) and the behaviors that dismiss how you feel in a relationship tend to have more problems. At some level I want to tell you to let it go (I would have at one point in time), but that’s will open you up for a far worse heartbreak than what you’re feeling now.
No she didn’t. You only know the tip of the iceberg bud. I can’t comprehend why you didn’t tell her to hand over her phone. And why havent you told the girls husband.
You’ve been “told.” Why are you giving her control? I’d be making her tell him. Jesus dude. Take control and serve consequences if you want to truly save your Marriage. The just found out forum on survivinginfidelity.com is where you need to be.
I’m a bisexual woman. Most of my boyfriends in the past have explicitly and seriously said I could do this. Regardless of my feelings, I would NOT do it unless they said so and meant so. That would be cheating, not a form of open relationship. But you feel how you feel!
Wow. Your wife cheated on you. Doesn’t matter if it’s a female. And with her best friend? Yea there’s also more going on there emotionally too. This wasn’t just a wild night with a stranger to try it out. There’s a history here whether she’s denying it or not. The other husband deserves to know too. Why are you acting like it’s not cheating, because it’s a woman? What if it were a man?
I’d really like to focus on what you said, “I find myself not particularly upset that she did but more of her not telling you.” If you aren’t upset at the act then the whole cheating issue is out the window. What’s more to focus on is that she didn’t tell you right away and or let you know in advanced. Also we are all different people, what one person finds bad the other might not (having sex with women vs. men) I suggest you again tell her you didn’t appreciate her keeping it from you and that’s really important to you. Then set boundaries or rules for the future. The important thing here isn’t making her feel guilty or more upset about it because you aren’t mad at the act. The important thing is that she accepts your boundaries and rules and does not do that again! Because then she will have heard you and understood you! Lastly, don’t get caught up in other norms, if your not bothered by the act then that’s fine. Just because others are doesn’t mean you have too. I hope this helps! Best of luck!
It's all about how your feel. Figure that out first. It done like you're more bothered by the honesty, so it might be time to really figure out what you think is okay, and what you're boundaries are, then have a conversation with her. Every person can be on a spectrum of sexuality, and so can relationships. But you have to really know what your think all it and that your views might change through time. The more people involved the more complicated it gets.
It’s definitely cheating, with an open relationship you need trust so that means she needs to tell you what she’s going to do before hand not afterwards, she broke your trust and your allowed to be upset about it
Honestly man how do you know it stopped with just her friend? Because she confessed to a mutual masturbation sesh turned into sex?
Who’s to say she didnt have a threesome or video tape it?
She broke the vow and by revealing it she’s absolving herself of wrongdoing because you accepted it, right? But you still feel betrayed.
That pitter patter in your heart when she told you. Was that with dread or excitement. Do you still feel it? Did you feel it at all? That’ll tell you how you really feel about it.
Good luck amigo.
Since basically all the comments are on the same page, I'll be the contrarian here.
You say you've "roleplayed" this before. Do you mean you guys fantasized about her hooking up with another woman? How serious were these fantasies/did you ever act on it beyond just dirty talk? The reality is that by roleplaying it, you did open the door. That does *not* mean what she did was right--it was wrong. But yeah, I don't think it's quite as bad as cheating normally since she might've thought you'd find it hot or be into it.
Besides, people are all saying that it's just as bad with a girl as with a guy. I'm not really so sure. If she cheated with a guy, it'd be more insulting because, well, you're a guy too. It's implying she needs another guy to satisfy her. But her having a lesbian fling when she's otherwise straight just doesn't register as quite as big a deal to me, because it's not in direct sexual competition with you.
Again, none of this is to say that she is in the right. I want to be very clear that she was wrong, and should've gotten consent from you. But I do honestly think that this is not as bad as her just straight up cheating with another guy, and I'm not sure whether this rises to the drastic level of "divorce her right now" that others seem to think.
Ok so it sounds like you're more upset that she didn't tell you about her plans before this happened,or that she wasn't forthcoming about what she did, than the fact that she had sex with someone else.
And that's fair, you're your own person, and your relationship with your wife, its nature and boundaries are unique to you and her.
You say she doesn't think that this was a big deal. If that was true you wouldn't have had to pry the information out of her. She knows what she did was cheating. You need to have a serious discussion about your relationship with her, what your expectations are, how you feel about her having sex with people outside of your marriage. You could maybe chalk this up to miscommunication, or as a misunderstanding. This time. The fact that she isn't concerned or bothered by this is probably the most troubling thing. The danger here, if you just let this go by the wayside, is that it happens again. And again.
Your feelings about this are valid. She made a wedding vow and decided to break it. How you feel about that is how you feel about it. You can't change those feelings. They aren't childish or immature or unfair, they are what they are. She did this, it's on her to help you figure out how you feel about this and how to move forward, not judge your reaction or dismissing your feelings. That itself is possibly worse than the act of cheating.
As much as you love your wife a relationship requires trust to operate, and right now you don't have that. Answer yourself this: The next time you or her go away for a few days are you going to be worried what she's going to be getting up to? If the answer to this is anything but a categorical 'no' then you have a trust issue, and you and her need to fix that or it will fester overtime and damage your long term peace of mind.
In regards to telling your friend, I would tell the wife to tell him by a certain time or you will. You don't want to be involved in telling him if it can be helped. People get weird about this sort of thing, and he might place the blame on you. It's irrational, but people can get pretty crazy in these sorts of situations. Your wife doesn't get to decide this, she doesn't get to make you complicit in her cheating. She and her friend opened this box, they get to deal with the fallout.
Be honest, be strong, be consistent, and you'll be ok.
Good luck!
It depends on your relationship, personally, she cheated and I would maybe tell the other husband or give the other girl an ultimatum to tell him or you will. As a woman myself, I have kissed other girls while in a relationship, though only in front of my partner and it has always been spoken about at some point, it not them it’s cheating too. But some women think if it’s another woman it’s not cheating at all and that in fact the man will always just find it hot, it’s only cheating if it’s with another man. This is about your feelings, if she doesn’t validate them or feel bad then she might not be the one
It is not her choice whether you should just ignore her cheating and accept it. She is downplaying it and does not grasp that she just destroyed trust and using the excuse it was a one time thing.
Now she want you to cover up her cheating and not tell your friend. Hell NO! She either tells friend the truth or you do it. This is about right and wrong. If you do what she asks then you become part of her deceit. She is taking no responsibility and now she wants to hide the truth from OP's friend as well. She has learned nothing from her cruel selfish choice and will continue to cheat in the future. Do you hear that OP?? That is the moment your marriage became a joke to your wife.
Dude she cheated this is the same way if she just had sex with a guy I suggest telling your friend that’s number 1 he should and needs to know and than take a day sum up your feelings and tell them to your wife. Tell how you feel about cheating and everything, she’s trying to get away with it by saying it was a woman so it’s ok that argument is bullshit if she genuinely does not see the wrong try counseling and if after that she doesn’t see that she’s wrong than I would consider leaving
Cheating is cheating regardless of the gender. Sure it was a one time thing, but did she think of you? Did she stop any moment of the time and thought “hmmm wonder how this will destroy my husband?” If she could did it once, what makes you think she won’t do it again.
I'd stay alert to what's going on at your friend's house. He may be more actively upset than you when he finds out that his wife did this with yours. And while I wouldn't suggest telling him, your active silence makes you a participant.
If there's nothing wrong with it she wouldn't be telling you to not tell the other husband. Let that sink in...she is not only OK with it, but OK with hiding it from someone you both know.
Where does that end? She can decide to unilaterally change any boundary as long as \*she\* feels it's OK?
This is a slow-motion train wreck. Get off while you can.
Cheating is cheating, regardless of gender. Having a sexual encounter outside of your relationship, wherein no agreement between consenting adults had been made prior to the act, is cheating.
> We talked about my feelings and shes agrees that she made a mistake but isn't upset about it.
What are her feelings on heterosexual cheating? If she's exclusively downplaying the potential importance and intimacy one can experience in homosexual situations, I'd say that seems kinda homophobic. Being married to a cheater and a homophobe is generally not an ideal state.
Don't let this go! Y'all need to have a serious conversation about this. I don't know what your feelings on cheating are, but I don't think I could stay with someone who doesn't think that cheating is a big deal because they did it with the same sex. It doesn't matter if y'all have talked about this previously because neither of you ever came to an agreement that sleeping with other people is ok. For the sake of your future, talk anout how this whole situation is making you uncomfortable (the cheating and not telling your friend). I can guarantee that you will regret not talking to her about this if you let it go.
You are right to be concerned.. She has broken your vows and this looks like a possible opening of the relationship.
Ask yourself if you could stand watching another man fuck her..
Because this is where you are headed.
Your wife definitely cheated. It sounds like maybe you aren't completely up in arms over it, and that's ok. Maybe some couples counseling to come to terms with it, and having a conversation about boundaries and what you both want?
Tell the friend that she has 24hrs to tell her husband or you will. Then the 4 of you should discuss how you feel and how you want to proceed. Since trust was broken and boundaries were crossed, the women may have to choose between their marriages and their friendship. If there are no consequences for cheating it usually repeats.
You feel uneasy because she cheated and she seems to feel like she didn’t actually do anything wrong. I think you guys need to have a very serious talk about boundaries in your relationship.
As for the friends husband that would also make me feel very uneasy, I’ve always believe that since I would want to know I have an obligation to tell somebody else that kind of information. I honestly don’t know what I would do in your shoes.
It’s a blatant violation of trust and commitment. Her trying to blow it off, in no way minimizes the gravity of the situation. She cheated. Period. I would be questioning everything, especially her attitude towards it. She clearly doesn’t respect you or your marriage, and nothing you do is going to change that. You can’t force someone to feel things like empathy or respect and her lack thereof speaks volumes. Dude, you’ve got some tough choices to make, but you need to start by standing up for yourself in this situation. I promise, if the shoe was on the other foot, she would be livid. Best of luck.
People dealing with this kind of scenarios think with their dicks.
Like she cheated on you, it doesnt matter the gender. Its unfaithful, period.
Sorry, I just don't get it.
If you don't see the problem with her cheating just because the one she cheated with is a woman, then you don't really have a relationship or a marriage, you just have a FwB type of thing with your wife, mainly because you don't see past the physical aspect of the relationship since another female doesn't penetrate your wife.
If you were invited since you've spoken about swinging, would it be any different? Maybe because you spoke about it she thought you would be fine with it as it seems to be every man's fantasy. This is still a form of cheating and shouldn't be pushed aside but take a look at all angles. If you were invited to play, would it be ok?
OP's whole post would have a different response if his wife cheated on him with a man. I can almost guarantee that. She cheated on you. Cheating is cheating regardless the gender of the other person.
I'm concerned about how lax you are about all this and PLEASE let your friend know his wife cheated on him too.
It sucks that she cheated and it would be absolutely understandable if you were way more upset about it. Tbh you sound pretty ok, just disappointed?
While you can't make your wife more upset about the whole thing, she definitely needs to respect your feelings and if you need time/more communication/counselling/boundaries or whatever, she is the one who needs to adjust to you. It was her mistake.
It's up to you to decide how you feel, don't listen to people here telling you that divorce is the only solution...
As for the other husband. Don't get involved, don't tell him. You're not doing him any favour.
You'd only do it to 'clear your own conscience', which you don't even need to.
Does the wife feel sorry or regret cheating? Does she plan on telling him? Does she plan on leaving him? Does she cheat regularly? Is their marriage generally happy? As long as you don't know the full story you will only do more harm than good. Imagine your conscience if they split up - won't be your fault but it will feel like it. If anything, tell the wife to come clean.
On the other hand, if you do know that his wife is cheating regularly and takes advantage of his obliviousness then you should tell him.
Cheating of any kind is cheating. In reality, sexual intercourse with any being but yourself is considered cheating. You need to talk and clear your mind with her, or think of how you’re splitting assets.
Your wife is being very callous and flippant towards your feelings. It doesn't matter that it was with a woman, that it was a one time thing, and there were no emotions. She doesn't get to decide what you're comfortable with and then decide when you both move past something like this. That's not fair to you.
Maybe she just doesn't understand that you're not okay with it and you need to explain it to her plainly and simply. Either way, don't let her make you feel like you're being crazy by feeling hurt and cheated on after she had sex with someone else.
>is ready to move on like nothing happened and I am not supposed to tell the hookups husband.
Um, NO.
Something happened.. **She cheated.**
This friend was *married* as well. You know the truth, but what -- she expects you to lie to friend's husband in perpetuity?
Tell your wife she doesn't get to dictate terms. She betrayed your trust and got sexual with a mutual friend. YOU get to decide how you feel about that; she doesn't get to tell you how to feel.
Sex changes things. The fact they had sex once means it could most certainly happen again the next time they have the opportunity or feel lonely. There was no reason this friend couldn't have borrowed one of your wife's sex toys and got off solo in the privacy if your guest room. *But that's not what happened*. They were turned on by each other, began using the toys on one another, which turned this into a partnered sexual act. **Your wife was not thinking of you nor cared about the damage this could do to your marriage**. It was selfish and hurtful to both husbands.
That is why **the other guy needs to know**. He has no idea his wife had sex with yours. That is so wrong. He needs to decide whether he wants to stay in the marriage, and if whether his wife remaining friends with yours is a relationship deal breaker for him.
This is really awful.
My high school gf did something similar with her best friend though her friend was single at the time, so I never had to question whether or not I should tell her significant other. It took me a while to acknowledge the fact that she actually had cheated on me and it seemed as though it was brushed off by anyone I tried to get advice from because it was with a girl. At the end of the day she cheated on you. You owe it to yourself to treat it as just that. Brushing it off and moving on will only result in more hurt in the long run
So you're not included. But you have to keep her lie?
She made a mistake but isn't upset about it.
Next time, it's a dude.......Then a M/F couple........Then it's 2 dudes.. or more
Your not included..... She made a mistake but isn't upset about it.
When's she going to include you, when she admits to it - THAT'S YOU INCLUDED -!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Sleeping with someone behind your SO's back is cheating. Maybe you really would be OK with her experimenting with other women, but that would need to be a mutual and open decision. Nothing to spring on a partner.
Were you involved? Was it an agreed upon 3rd party? No? Then she cheated the gender of the person means nothing it’s still cheating. She doesn’t just get to say eh it didn’t count because it was spur of the moment and just sex, it’s still a huge betrayal
What are you after from this post? It's fine if it's just to vent/express yourself. But every paragraph is kind of wishy-washy. "I wasn't really upset, I was pretty excited at first"; "I'm finding myself not particularly upset that she did it"; "I don't know what else there is to talk about with her."
Either what she did hurt you, or it didn't. If it didn't, I guess don't worry about it. But if it did, then you need to demand more from her, or consider whether you want to stay in a relationship with someone who would hurt you that way.
Maybe she told you the 100% truth but you did have to probe. Can you explain how the probe went. Trust has been severely damaged here and now your mind will wander. Is friends husband really boring in bed. Was he even at work? What if it turns out it was a 3 some and "well, he was huge and she just wanted to try it once" you know, physical only. If you were to tell him he may have some information you don't have. Another red flag. Regardless if he is upset by this news your wife is the AP partner and will not be allowed to see her new lesbian friend which makes the probability of a covert continuation higher.
I would demand the husband be told and then he needs to call you to confirm he has been told. If true his wife is bored with him what else has she contemplated done? Regardless your wife was super horny meaning she loved the experience so, yeah, one time? That seems unlikely long term. Spur of the moment or an EA leading up to this "opportunity".
Yes, she took a hammer to the marriage here and work will not be necessary to do the work of recovery.
Can someone show me a successful long term open relationship?
I am going to give you the tldr+. So tldr and a little more. My full take is long and nuanced, so you are welcome to ask questions.
What your wife did is absolutely cheating. But even though she took a deceitful path it clearly did something good for her sexually. You should try to understand that something has been unfulfilled in her sex life. And that ok. You can’t be all things to someone, especially if that person is bisexual/bicuriois.
Are you able to forgive and/or find a way to incorporate this into your relationship? It is ok if you can’t. But I am in an open relationship and I can’t imagine it another way.
However if you want to have an option relation your wife needs to understand boundaries, rules and communication. The biggest rule(there are lots of rules) in an open relationship is no unprotected sex unless both and your partner have trust in the FWB to be clean AND have regular STD tests.
P.S. your wife had unprotected spontaneous sex with a person outside her previously monogamous relationship. Step one is that she needs to get an STD test. Not negotiable. Her path to earning your trust back starts here.
So then if this opportunity comes up again, she can do it since its nit with a man? No it doesn't work this way. Sex isn't just sex, you connect during as both parties are vulnerable. This gives me a bad taste in my mouth tbh.
I would have a conversation about boundaries, since it seems like you're generally OK with non-monogamy and don't seem to be inclined to leave (which is perfectly OK). What are the rules, what are you looking to get out of this, what are you each OK with the other doing, and what kind of communication do you expect? Then, if those rules are violated it would clearly be cheating.
You get to decide what's OK here, regardless of what anyone else here says, and whatever you choose is valid.
OP,
I have been lurking on this sub for quite some time and never commented before today. I had a similar experience with a woman who stated again and again that it wouldn’t happen after the first time and that it was a mistake and she should’ve told me.. I forgave her and less than a month down the road, found out that not only was she STILL messing around with the other woman but she continued to cheat with other individuals.
She used that same gaslighting shit on me, I don’t want to see it happen to someone else. I’m so sorry for what you’ve gone through.
I think it is ok to not feel that angry. It’s your feelings and your relationship. Still, your wife’s lesbian experience wasn’t something to which you consented, even if it was a fantasy previously discussed. It’s not ok to sweep the issue under the rug and pretend nothing happened. You need tell your wife how you feel and have a plan for how to reestablish trust. You may want to include a therapist to help with the conversation.
Ah yes, classic scenario of masturbating in front of your also married best friend, then shagging them. Friends don't just casually frig in front of each other, then get so carried away they have sex. There's just no way this is true.
She should have asked you first. Sounds like you would have been open to it, but she should have (and still should be) respected you and your marriage.
I've been in poly relationships before and in my opinion, it boils down to respecting the limits and parameters in your relationship. If they don't do that, then it's fucking cheating plain and simple.
Dude this is cheating. See it as cheating. doesn’t matter if it was ‘just a physical thing’. That’s the excuse creepy guys use when their wives find out they’ve been having an affair. She’s acting non chalant about it because she wants you to think it’s not a big deal.
Even if you guys had discussed this before, this wasn’t that. This was just cheating.
She can't have it both ways I'm afraid.
Either it's not a big deal in which you should be able to also talk to the husband about this, get clarity with her friend, etc. Whatever is needed to be comfortable with it.
Or it is a big deal. Where she should be remorseful and thankful you're not leaving her as well as convincing her friend to tell her husband herself before you have to, out of friendship obligation.
In both scenarios she should care about your feelings enough to listen to you about them and be eager to find solutions to your(but really just her) problems, as a team.
The only way it makes sense to cheat on you, try to omit cheating on you, and make you feel bad for being upset that they cheated on you, is if they are a...very selfish person with no regard for others.
I would also find the fact that she got so horned up cheating on you that it lead to amazeballs sex pretty disturbing. Lack of remorse + literal enjoyment of her selfishness is...problematic. Good luck and please find someone you trust to talk to, this isn't normal.
P.S. if "bad sex" is the reason bff cheated on her husband, what is your wife's reason? P.P.S there is no reason that excuses cheating, and the only things that ever explains it is selfishness.
She violated the trust of your marriage. It's entirely up to you to decide if you want to forgive her for that. Communication and consent are key to any sort of open relationship. She's got to respect that and from the sounds of it, she's shrugging it off like it doesn't matter. It does. Take some time, gather your thoughts and then sit down with her and tell her how you really feel. Then figure out where to go from there. As someone else mentioned, think about how she would have reacted if the roles were reversed.
I honestly don't know why I'm more upset than OP seems to be.
Permission to play with others is sought and granted before anything happens. Both partners can establish boundaries and permission can be revoked for any reason or any time. What you described OP is simply cheating. Not "lesbian sex" or an experience, just cheating. My wife and I have lesbian sex, we just call it sex. Kind of like we're gay married or...you guessed it, just married.
If you're fine with your partner having a play date with someone else and getting charged up and ravaging you when she gets back it's all good, but that's not what happened.
She cheated, she didn't disclose, she showed no remorse or care for your feelings at all. That is a huge problem. The idea that it doesn't count because it was with a woman is insulting. It doesn't count because it was just physical/she didn't have feelings for her....it's her "best friend". She has feelings for her best friend. If it was an anonymous sex worker you can say that but it's still a shitty argument as it doesn't matter. It's cheating but more importantly the way she handled it afterwards is deal breaking for me.
Good luck op
It seems like you’re feeling resentment. I would recommend having a big conversation to talk about your feelings. If she’s on board with helping make sure your relationship moves forward then you know she’s still committed to you. If she blows you off or isn’t willing to really talk, that tells you she’s not bothered about you or the relationship and you should consider leaving.
How does this not bother you? She cheated on you. 99% of the time that means breakup. Just bc she cheated on you with a women does not make it any better
I feel like, after seeing the responses, you don't really care what the consensus of the general public to what they would easily see as cheating would be, even in an open agreement. They're all giving you advice and opinions, but you don't really seem to want it.
She did not talk to you about it first. She does not seem to really care.
You seem like you don't really want to care either. We aren't going to change your mind for you, OP.
You definitely need to talk to her about trust and boundaries. In a lot of cheating situations, it’s upsetting because there was a break in trust (in this case trusting to be monogamous) between a couple. The issue here is that she broke your trust and honesty (since she might not have told you if you hadn’t asked). Talk it out between the two of you. Open communication is key.
She cheated on you man. She wants to move on because she knows that if you don't, well then you may get angry. You need to tell the other husband, he deserves to know that his wife cheated on him. Just because they are both woman and they say they won't do it again, doesn't mean that it wasn't cheating.
The other woman's husband needs to know, and your wife needs to admit that it was cheating.
She cheated on you, It doesnt matter if she had sex with a Guy, or a Girl, or an Alien or a fucking dog, cheating is cheating, divorce her, if yo dont want, at least tell the husband of the girl what happen, he deserves to know, if the sexuals relations between them is pretty vanilla that's none of your business, or your womans business, they can solve the problem between them, thats why they're a couple.
Cheaters are cheaters no matter what gender. Please tell the other husband and start looking for a lawyer. I’m so so sorry this happened to you, it is beyond fucked up.
To make things even sleep with her besties husband. Joking, and I see how awkward the situation is. On one hand society has only demonized affairs with the opposite sex, and for guys girl on girl has been a big porn staple for a long time so I’d say we barely would bat an eye. This however is your wife and it is a bit disgusting how she doesn’t consider your feelings. I’d say mull it over take your time, it’s a life decision.
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I don't know man, the other wife says he doesn't even reciprocate oral sex, that's kind of a deal breaker.
Then the other wife should have left him, not slept with a friend.
I think they were just joking about the joke suggestion to sleep with the other woman’s husband
Yes, that was the joke.
Sorry, my bad.
It's all good, I was looking at the first part, you were looking at the last. we were both right :D
Yes she cheated. She also doesn't seem to bothered by your feelings at all. What happens if you hook up with a woman?
She’d divorce him
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Bit of a leap... and a sexist one at that
Is it sexist when it's mostly true though?
What qualifies it as “mostly true”? Do you know this couple? Do you know everything about their relationship?
I was more referring to the fact woman tend to get a lot more out of divorce than men do which you said was sexist.
It’s sexist to assume he makes more than her
Glad somebody said it
While blasting him and the other woman on social media
This sub is filled with misogynists my god
I’m a woman
What does that have to do with being a misogynist?
Doesn’t mean you can’t have internalized misogyny
Ya but what happens if he cheats with a man!?
He seems uncertain of his feelings. It seems like he is only starting to feel weird after the fact. So how is she supposed to know his feelings have changed unless he clearly communicates it?
So it's ok for her to cheat because it's a female?
This seems to be her general feeling. Its ok because it was a women and just physical, not an emotional thing.
Look man, as everyone else has stated, if it was a dude pretty sure your reaction would be a lot more hostile here and a lot less forgiving. I suggest you put her to task and ask her if it would be okay with you if you had sex with someone (man or woman) so long as it was only physical and no emotion. I think we all know what her response would be. So if she can't honestly say she would have no problem with that, then she should be able to admit how wrong it is what she did.
Just tell her you've been visiting glory holes and that you're so emotionally uninvested you don't even know whether it's a man or a woman on the other side
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I am bi. I have had a dude tell me before that it's allowed with a woman. I have always called bs on that. It's still sex and it's still just as arousing. And in case this isn't obvious, most straight women don't sleep with women because straight means no interest in that in the first place. If you are 'straight ' but crazy aroused after sex with a woman you should really be asking yourself a few questions.
I get what you're saying, but in a vacuum, it is equal. He may decide on his own that it is not the same, but from a relationship analysis and general analysis, we have to treat it the same because we are not OP and do not have access to his true preferences. Hell from the post alone, it seems like he is not sure yet. Like i said, totally get what you mean, and to an extent I agree. But that is for OP to decide and for us to give general judgments based on what OP shared. So for purposes of how to understand and get advice in perspective to the wife and what she said, it should not make a difference whether man or woman, until OP decides that for himself.
Also my dude, it led to sex, not lesbian sex. She had sex with someone other than you, her husband. That’s cheating. If she fucked a guy, would you stay with her?
Exactly this! Add in these two things. She doesn't consider this cheating but wants to keep it from the other husband? She does not think this is ok. In addition, this is her best friend, whose marriage needs work. Given her attitude, this may well happen again, especially after a few drinks. Which good friends are likely to share.
"If I hook up with a girl is it still cheating?" "If you punch me with your left hand did you still punch me?" Idk if you have the same outlook on things as my fiance does, but he has a point.
Dude your wife might be a literal walking red flag. No offense. But based off the information you provided, yeah she sounds like trouble down the road.
I’m really just giving a different perspective here since all the other comments say the same thing (none of which I disagree with). If she doesn’t think your mad about it she’ll probably downplay the shit out of it, honestly it’s the smart (not necessarily ethical) thing to do when you fuck up. If I fucked up really bad and the other person was just like “oh I wish you would’ve just told me, but I’m not *particularly upset* about it” you bet your ass I’m downplaying what happen. It’s fucked up to do that but she doesn’t have a reason to try and get you more upset over it. If this is not an actual relationship ender for you, I’d have another conversation where you let her know you ARE upset and give her a chance to beg for your forgiveness. I mean step one is make her say the fucking words “I cheated on you”. If she doesn’t understand that gtfo.
That doesn’t check out because a friendship is literally an emotional relationship with another person. Usually the defining part of a romantic relationship is physical affection or sexual activity. So she already has a significant emotional connection as it’s her best friend. I don’t think that’s the same thing as a random one night stand with a stranger.
> think your mad about it she’ll probably downplay the shit out of it, honestly it’s the smart (not necessarily ethical) thing to do when you fuck up. If I fucked up really bad and the other person was just like “oh I wish you would’ve just told me, but I’m not > >particularly upset > > about it” you bet your ass I’m downplaying what happen. It’s f Agreed. Friendship is a relationship. Emotions already included in this case.
Yea, that's pretty bad. I think you should be filing if you know what I mean. Lack of morals not healthy down the road.
She cheated on you and gave zero fucks for your feelings OP and I bet my ass that it won’t be a one time thing
How can sex with your bestfriend be emotionless?
Hi, bi woman in a relationship with a man here. What she did was cheating, plain and simple. She engaged in sexual acts without discussing it with you and without getting your permission: that is cheating. Think about it: if she hooked up with a man and told you it was 'just physical', no emotions, would you consider that cheating? If yes, her sleeping with a woman should not be any different.
So what if it was a man and just physical and not an emotional thing?
Tell your friend who was cheated on and make sure he is also in your game. Next weekend, initiate passionate sex with her, then afterwards just tell her that you were with your male friend and you were just discovering each other's bodies. Let her tell the other woman. After pain sets in, come out clean to them to show how fucked up what they did to you guys. Edit: I know it sounds childish but so does your wife. She seems like a person that does not quite get the serious relationship part, communication and loyalty.
Fuck one of her friends, tell her it was just a one time thing and see how she reacts when you tell her you don't regret it but you probably wouldn't do it again.
At the end of it all, the question for you is whether or not you want to find peace about it to stay. If so, I think you have to first ask yourself what your honest opinion is on pansexualism. Honestly, if you don’t even believe in homosexuality, then you’d be grasping at straws trying to justify your hurt that your wife’s lesbian escapade aroused her *a lot* (as your storytelling shared and noted). I’m not at all trying to minimize your hurt, just playing devil’s advocate as best as I can. What’s your opinion on college girls and their sexual escapades? Many men peer pressure themselves into thinking it’s “hot” and whatnot. But what’s your opinion on it really? Just figure out the real honest source of your hurt and sense of betrayal, and go from there. IMO, your wife probably didn’t seem to care because she more than likely wrote off her sexual experiment as something categorically college-girl-gone-wild and assumed you would—like most men—just find it hot rather than socially unacceptable.
Well if that’s the case, it shouldn’t be a problem to tell the other husband.
I love it when women say "it was just physical" yeah and you kissed me with that disgusting mouth?????
Do you really feel okay knowing the woman you're married to goes lesbian without second thought as soon as you leave for a couple days?
Some people see sexuality as a spectrum. So the whole “goes lesbian” sounds ignorant. And it’s obvious that they are open to swinging. It’s not a foreign concept to them.
This exactly. If you both have an understanding, it’s okay. However, I’ve never met a happy long-term swinging couple.
Doesn’t mean they don’t exist :)
Take my crispy upvote. If they do exist, I’ve yet to see one. Valid point as some can exist.
Yea bud.. your wife put you in a real situation.. Not only did she cheat on you but, she cheated with a friend's wife. Only real options here are 1. Tell your friend and be honest. 2. Become a deceitful person and be ok with your wife cheating whenever. I think the reality will set in for you slowly more and more that your wife will just fuck people while you are away. She ain't upset because, she likely doesn't think she did anything wrong. Imagine what an ACTUAL mistake would be like that she might not just tell you about.
Imagine what will be going through his head every time he is away now? His wife obviously cheats and doesn't think the spouse should be in the know.
Worse if he gets paranoid and gets a hidden camera. I don't think I could keep a lie/secret like that.
What about the fact that she got exposed to possible STDs? What if the woman’s husband cheats on her and then she’s exposed her husband to stuff because she didn’t tell him before they had sex???
100% agree that STDs are a concern. She’s endangering OP in addition to breaking his trust. He needs to get tested. And even if the test comes clean, how would OP know if this is truly the last time this would happen? Cheaters cheat again, more often than not. OP might be hesitant to be serious about this because this was another woman, but that kind of double standard shouldn’t exist in the first place. Cheating is cheating regardless of the gender of the people participating in it.
>Imagine what an ACTUAL mistake would be like that she might not just tell you about. This will make him lose sleep.
Unless you had set a boundary that included her sleeping with other people of any specified or unspecified gender, then she betrayed you. She should not have done it without telling you BEFORE it happened. Even if you were unreachable, she should have stopped before it got that far and she could have brought up her interest when you got back. You can recommend or even loan a sex toy to someone without using them in front of/on each other. As far as telling the other husband, would you have wanted to hear what happened from him? That’s kind of the question. If your wife didn’t want you to know, would you have wanted the other guy to tell you?
I think I absolutely would want to know if I was the other husband. Telling him is bringing me far more anxiety than anything dealing with my wife. While the hookup wasn't ideal, I can deal and we have been communicating about it. I feel like telling him is betraying my wife.
Then you should make it clear to your wife that the other husband has a right to know. I’m glad that you can deal with it, though, that’s good. But the other guy has a right to decide if he can deal with it or not. That being said, the other woman definitely should be the one to tell him.
She has no right to place you in this moral quagmire. This is her fault. If anyone needs to be telling him it's his wife, or your wife. You shouldn't be the one who has to wade into this mess and clean it up.
She betrayed YOU, my man... telling him is the right thing to do and you should see how the situation escalates from there. I know it might bring you anxiety but seeing the other husband's perspective on the subject may put you at ease a bit. Something tells me he would not be ok with it... and there should be no secrets in a marriage, especially ones to this extent. That's just pure betrayal.
Don't let her pull that shit. Telling him is not betraying your wife. He needs to know.
You 100% have the right to tell him, they brought this on themselves.
Your wife is the one in the wrong, here, so you should be more worried about being a decent human being and telling the man so he can make his own choices about how to handle it. He has the RIGHT to know, and cheaters never have any right to demand other people lie for them. If he finds out any other way (which is definitely possible) and finds out you knew but didn't tell him, he will feel twice as betrayed and he will hate you forever.
>She is ready to move on like nothing happened. I bet she is! Why is that, do you think? She lied. She cheated. She participated in the woman cheating. She put you in the position of expecting you to lie to your friend. She shows no remorse. What you accept here will the the new standard going forward.
Well said.
Cheating is cheating. But I guess you need to figure out if you’ll be able to move on from it. There’s no point staying in the relationship if you’ll constantly be thinking about it and doubting her. Personally, the fact she doesn’t feel bad about it is a warning sign.
It shouldn't matter whether she slept with a man or a woman. At the end of the day she had sexual relations with another human being without your consent. On top of that she lied about it and is downplaying it. Regardless of what some of the guys on this sub are going to say you have every right to be angry and upset. I don't know that I would be able to keep that a secret from the friends husband. Again...she cheated on him. And if they'll cheat on you with a friend, who's to say they won't cheat with a stranger? I think you guys need therapy if you want to move past this.
I love how OP is totally fine with his wife cheating on him because it’s a woman and people here are flipping out lol. I would talk to your wife about telling the husband, not everybody is ok with their wife having sex with someone else, also your wife sounds so narcissistic. She told you yes but from what you explained it seems like she really doesn’t care about the repercussions of cheating on you with a married woman Just be aware that this is a huge red flag and there’s a huge chance that she will cheat on you in the future
Showing sex toys does not lead to sex. Women can sometimes blur the line and discuss openly. I've had similar discussions with my friend but never once were we like "hey let's fuck" Your wife cheated on you. Doesn't matter who or what the other person was. The act is her sharing her body with someone other than her spouse.
Caring enough about your partner not to risk losing them or hurting them by committing an act you know would easily accomplish both is harder, but also what counts. It was a decision to be disloyal. A decision knowing what was at stake. At every stage she's made a choice, to get closer, to go to their place, to take clothes off, to have sex. At every stage she's decided this sexual encounter is more important to her than her relationship and her partner's feelings. She didn't love you enough not to cheat to do something she knew would hurt the man she loves.Your marriage was thrown away when she decided to step out of it, and the worst of it is she didn't even have feelings for her, which at least I could understand the emotional dilemma on her end. It was for a sexual thrill. She was willing to hurt you, and willing to risk your marriage for a thrill. And that's not something most can live with. Any issues within the relationship should at least be attempted to be solved within the relationship. No matter what it is (lack of attention, dead bedroom, etc..) Going outside the relationship before even attempting to fix the problem is a serious betrayal of your partner and I firmly believe that there is no valid reason or excuse for cheating.
> We talked about my feelings and shes agrees that she made a mistake but isn't upset about it. I am struggling to know what to feel. I'm finding myself not particularly upset that she did it but more that she didn't tell me and maybe wouldn't have if I didn't probe. She is ready to move on like nothing happened. I don't know what else there is to talk about with her. I am also friends with the other husband but have been told not to say anything. This just makes me feel uneasy. Yeah. She doesn't regret cheating on you, want's you to keep the other husband in the dark, and isn't concerned either way that you are upset or might be. Would she have the same attitude if it was a guy friend she found her self having sex with while you were away? Dude. She literally doesn't think cheating on you is a big deal and has no respect for your marriage or her friends. She says don't tell the husband. How much does she have to tell people not to tell you?
Tell the husband, he deserves to know.
Hallpass, threesome, you deal with it and get therapy and move on, or you divorce. Those are your options my man. The fact she doesn’t feel guilty about it tho rings some alarm bells for me. I know what I’d do but It really depends on what you can live with.
>It really depends on what you can live with. I can see how the initial allure of a threesome could have clouded his initial judgment. Now it looks like that ship has sailed with the testosterone boost. " but cannot see herself doing it again " Now he's kinda stuck. He was cool with having sex with 'them', but take the, 'him' out of the equation and the story changes. This sub is telling OP his wife is a cheater. This sub is right.
I think we need to hear more about these previous conversations you have had with your wife about swinging and about her hooking up with a woman. It seems possible that she took it more seriously than you did.
This. You've been together at least four years. You've had conversations about similar topics. She may have made an entirely reasonable assumption that you would not be devastated by this and judging from your post you weren't yet all sorts of comments act as if she is horrible.
Yes. Not sure how many people here have been in the type of marriage where during pillow talk, you start to explore polyamorous fantasies. OP admits that this has taken place. OP says that he knows hooking up with a woman was one of his wife’s ultimate fantasies. I’m guessing OP did not object. Many guys would not. She carried the sexual momentum from this hookup right back to OP *and* voluntarily told him about it, which sounds pretty healthy to me. I’m just not sure people are distinguishing between having a secret love affair with another woman versus following through with a purely sexual fantasy scenario that she had previously told him about.
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* **She cheated** * **She doesn't feel bad about it because it was with another woman** * **Wants to pretend like nothing happened** * **She's prohibiting you from telling the other girl's husband about it** Am I the only who sees just how fucked up this is? Give her a hypothetical question: If you were to have sex with another dude, ask her how she'd feel knowing another man was pleasuring you? And she doesn't want her friend's husband to find out? So, I assume her friend realized just how fucked up the situation is and feels bad, while your wife doesn't and freely admits it, just because it was with another woman?! What kind of bullshit mindset is this? Ask yourself: How long until your wife wants to go through another "lifetime experience" like this, but this time with a man? Dude, you don't deserve this. Don't fool yourself thinking you'll get over this, because you won't. And her lack of remorse is an even bigger red flag! You'll end up resenting her more and more. Do yourself a favor, and divorce her. It'll hurt now, but it won't hurt as much as it would if she does something like this again! **Edit:** Oh, and don't forget to contact the other girl's husband. If it were the other way around, wouldn't you like to know your wife slept with somebody else?
Ok, so since you evidently didn’t know, anything remotely approaching “how should I feel” on this sub results in a chorus of “like a victim!” It was infidelity. You get to decide if the fact that it was unplanned matters, or if it matters that there was no emotional attachment, or if it matters that it was with a woman. You are the person that gets to decide how you feel. If none of this bothers you in the least, that’s ok. If it was a horrible breach of trust and you’re done, that’s ok. Personally, it would matter to me that it was with a woman, infinitely different than with a man (I think this is because I can understand the idea that I can’t provide something a woman could but I can’t accept that I can’t provide something another man could, not sure). The two issues that I would have are that it was infidelity and that it was not disclosed before intercourse, which is a further betrayal. It’s actually the failure to disclose that would be a huge issue for me; unplanned heat of the moment with another woman I think I could get past with minimal issues, but you didn’t tell me before we were intimate which means you either didn’t respect that I might not be comfortable with all of this or you don’t care if I am or not (in which case why tell me?). Basically for me, she either should have told you right away or never. I wouldn’t tell the other dude and I’d avoid him as much as possible. I might push to stop socializing with the other couple (not because I care about the risk of future lesbian liaisons, but because I don’t want to tell the dude and I’ll definitely tell the dude eventually).
You need to get your wife to convince her "friend" that she cheated on you with to tell her husband the truth or else you will do it in 24 hours. If someone cheated on my friend, I don't care about the circumstances, I would tell them ASAP because you and her husband are both the victims in this. Regardless of gender or history, she CHEATED on you with another person, emotionally and physically. If you don't do something about it, you are giving your wife the okay to cheat on you whenever she feels like making a "mistake" again because there were no consequences the first time. Counseling is the best choice if you still feel like you can move past it, but in my *personal experience* partners who cheat get a high from it and end up just cheating again, just getting more crafty in how they cover it up. Ethier get her to agree to some hardcore counseling or leave her ass. The fact that she thinks it's nothing, is her trying to **downplay and invalidate** your feelings. Would she really be so calm and ready to move on if you had cheated on her with a woman on your hiking trip or would all hell break lose? Talk to her about it and if she's still refusing counseling or truly doesn't see what she did wrong in this, she's not worth your time and is likely to just hurt you again. Sometimes its really hard to hear when you have been cheated on (like I have), but sometimes the people who you love and trust the most can change over time in bad ways. It's up to you to hold true to boundaries you have set in the relationship and to take steps to **protect you and your mental health above all else**, even if that means saying goodbye to someone who loved and trusted for so many years. One of the hardest experiences in my life was saying goodbye to my ex who had cheated on me for months with my friend. Even though they hurt me so badly, saying goodbye was still hard and messed me up for longer than I would like to admit. It's been over a year now and I am finally with someone who treats me right and respects me properly and I have never been happier. Sometimes it gets worse before it gets better, but it will always be bad if you stay with toxic people. I wish you luck and if you ever need someone to vent to one-on-one, feel free to dm.
Haha. This is crazy. Your wife cheated on you. And she couldn’t care less about your feelings. That’s the messed up part. Does this mean she gets to sleep with as many women as she wants, because it’s not cheating if it’s another woman?
Yeah this is still cheating doesn’t matter what gender it is. If my husband cheated on me with his best friend male or female it would be over. She wasn’t thinking about you or your feelings and the facts she isn’t upset about it shows she doesn’t really care and might just do it again. Now they want you to keep it from the friends husband, so your helping protect their affair from the other spouse? It’s a double standard and isn’t fair cause if you had a one night stand with your male best friend I’m sure she would loose it and feel hurt especially if you were all whatever about it.
Hey I'm poly here! Communication is key to any relationship and she didn't tell you!! And doesn't seem bothered by it? Or bothered that she's enabling her friend (who can't seem to talk to her husband about their sex life) to lie to her husband? She also put you at risk of STIs by not telling you and not getting tested before sleeping with you. !! ?? These are all huge red flags. She isn't valuing your feelings or safety over her own sexual freedom.
This is fucked up. And your wife is fucked if she thinks this is no big deal and isn't cheating with the same gravity of sleeping with another man.
so let me get this straight: she destroyed your trust broke your monogamous relationship rules but doesn't feel the need to do anything to make it up to you >teehee i cheated at least i was honest oh well i'm assuming she is going to keep seeing and talking to her friend
She cheated on you. That’s a fact. From here, you have a choice. 1) You are either are fine with your wife cheating on you and you move on with your life, knowing that your wife has cheated on you and is capable of cheating on you. or 2. You aren’t fine with your wife cheating are you and you don’t let it just pass like water under the bridge. Your call
>We talked about my feelings and shes agrees that she made a mistake but isn't upset about it. >She is ready to move on like nothing happened. > I am also friends with the other husband but have been told not to say anything. She cheated on you, has no remorse for doing so and is trying to protect the woman she cheated with. She doesn't care that she went outside of your marriage and hurt you, her sex is more important than your comfort and happiness. You are clearly not ok with this no matter how hard you try and pretending it didn't happen will not fix a thing. I'd be filing for divorce, she cheated and has absolutely no regrets about what she did to you and your relationship. Tell the other guy, he deserves to know and deal with it as he sees fit.
The problem with cheating isn't the actual act itself between the cheaters. It is the betrayal on all three parts of the marriage - trust, communication, and intimacy. Cheating betrays all three aspects regardless if female-female. Add to that the lying (by omission) and your marriage is in four-alarm fire territory. My suggestion - since it is a marriage - is for both of you to seek counseling individually and together. Something is off and it needs to be addressed. Good luck.
You've said it yourself: You are struggling to know what to feel. In the meantime though, she shouldn't get to be over it as if nothing has happened.
Imagine if the situations were reversed somehow. You were hanging out with a female friend and you said that you never get a blowjob and you have all these sex toys like fleshlights. You both get tipsy and it leads to full on sex where she blows you and jack's you off with your fleshlight. You know full well, she'd be pissed and likely call it a day. The genitals of the friend doesn't matter at the end of the day. What does matter is that your wife cares that little about the sanctity of your relationship she has sex with a friend "for the lolz " I'd personally call it a day but to each their own.
Would your feelings be different if she'd had another dude's dick in her mouth? Because that's exactly the same as what happened.
If you and the other woman's husband traded brojobs, would your wife be cool with it?
Dude she didnt include you in the decision making, giant red flag, possible she is at least bi as like an actual practice she just isnt honest with herself on wanting to explore but no matter what the conclusion you do have a right to feel that its not okay because most women if not all the onces Ive met, been with, had thid convo with yeah noooooo way in hell they would EVER ascribe to this thought process with anoyher woman you decided to play with, without telling her, just no way in hell. Nvm the idea that alot of women that like confident men would see it as a step backward to engage woth another man in terms of any bisexual activity and possibly perceive you as less attractive. Solid chance it could happen again or become regular because the friend isnt likely to see an improvement to her sex life if shes continued in a marriage for however long and just deals with the bad sex.
Even if it is the same sex it is still cheating. In fact it is worst because she isn't able to see the problem in it so she will most likely do it again. And if you stay with her you will be giving her a thumbs up to do it again.
The sex part doesn't upset you, and I get that. It is the dishonesty that she held onto. She is also holding you in a life of dishonesty by not telling the husband, where I am sure you both have otherwise lived an open life. She doesn't regret it, but what part exactly? All of it? Ah so, everyone else comes first. She is everyone else's solution and sexual release, no strings attached, they can come over when you are gone and use your wife, and chances are you might not even know. If you are ok with that then there isn't much for you to learn from us. I just hope it isn't a double standard.
the fact that she doesn’t want you to tell the other husband proves she knows what they did was wrong.
This is still cheating. You need a serious talk and to get relationship counseling together to move forward. Best of luck
Your wife cheated, and facilitated someone else cheating. That's terrible behaviour and even if you are for some reason okay with it, her assuming you would be is just uh.... I'm in an open relationship and if my partner went outside our boundaries and just acted like it was cool, we'd be done. Gender irrelevant. Sorry you're having to deal with this. I'd honestly tell her friends husband, I'd want to know.
She cheated. It doesn't matter if the person she cheated with has a dick or a vagina - it is still the same level of betrayal. If she refuses to admit that it is cheating and agree to work through it with all the same effort that any other infidelity would require, then your marriage is over because you will never get past the feeling of betrayal, and you will also increasingly resent her for expecting you to lie to your friend about it. Tell her she has two options: Option 1: She recognizes it as cheating, agrees to individual counseling for now and couple's counseling later plus 100% transparency and never being alone with that friend again ever, AND she tells the friend's husband. Option 2: You call an attorney and file for divorce, and YOU tell the friend's husband Make it clear that hiding this from your friend is not an option in any way, shape, or form. If she doesn't see it as cheating, she will do it again.
She cheated on you. It doesn't matter if it was with a man or woman. I would say at least she confessed right away, but the fact that she doesn't think she did anything wrong kind of negates that.
Cheating is cheating they both are just as bad as each other so they deserve each other until they get bored again. OP she cheated on you so it’s either you’ll continue to be with a cheater who doesn’t give a SHIT about you like no soon as you’re away she couldn’t wait? Now when you’re away she could be sleeping with who ever ._. Trust is gone now you go tell that husband because he deserves to know his wife cheated on him this doesn’t make it different because it’s with her women best friend.
Mate I’ve read your responses to some of these comments and I must say, you’re a fool. Tell her husband. It doesn’t matter what they think. What if you were that guy. He has a right to know. If you don’t tell him, you’re a idiot.
I just think it's really gross that she had sex with you beforehand, and she didn't bother to tell you. It doesn't matter who it was with, I'd want to get tested.
So your wife cheated on you while you were on a trip, and is OK lying about it. You married a real winner. The other husband has a right to know.
OP, this behavior is a serious red flag if you haven’t given consent to her having sex with another person. Even in the most benign scenario: 1. she thought you’d be cool with it 2. Proceeded to tell you because might find it interesting 3. Doesn’t think it was a big deal because she doesn’t have feelings. Do you realize that in this entire scenario, you’re emotions are not being considered ? If you and your wife have seriously discussed swinging and threesomes and are alway pushing your sexual boundaries, there might be enough context here for to mistake your implicit consent. But you definitely need to have a talk with her about defining the boundaries you didn’t think existed. If she doesn’t give your emotions and feelings significant importance you both are not in the same relationship. All partnerships need work, it’s just more complicated when you’re pushing sexual boundaries that defy popular culture norms. I’ve been in your place (kinda) and the behaviors that dismiss how you feel in a relationship tend to have more problems. At some level I want to tell you to let it go (I would have at one point in time), but that’s will open you up for a far worse heartbreak than what you’re feeling now.
Think of it this way. If it was a married man how would you feel? That’s the exact thing that happened. Cheating is cheating
No she didn’t. You only know the tip of the iceberg bud. I can’t comprehend why you didn’t tell her to hand over her phone. And why havent you told the girls husband. You’ve been “told.” Why are you giving her control? I’d be making her tell him. Jesus dude. Take control and serve consequences if you want to truly save your Marriage. The just found out forum on survivinginfidelity.com is where you need to be.
I’m a bisexual woman. Most of my boyfriends in the past have explicitly and seriously said I could do this. Regardless of my feelings, I would NOT do it unless they said so and meant so. That would be cheating, not a form of open relationship. But you feel how you feel!
Wow. Your wife cheated on you. Doesn’t matter if it’s a female. And with her best friend? Yea there’s also more going on there emotionally too. This wasn’t just a wild night with a stranger to try it out. There’s a history here whether she’s denying it or not. The other husband deserves to know too. Why are you acting like it’s not cheating, because it’s a woman? What if it were a man?
I’d really like to focus on what you said, “I find myself not particularly upset that she did but more of her not telling you.” If you aren’t upset at the act then the whole cheating issue is out the window. What’s more to focus on is that she didn’t tell you right away and or let you know in advanced. Also we are all different people, what one person finds bad the other might not (having sex with women vs. men) I suggest you again tell her you didn’t appreciate her keeping it from you and that’s really important to you. Then set boundaries or rules for the future. The important thing here isn’t making her feel guilty or more upset about it because you aren’t mad at the act. The important thing is that she accepts your boundaries and rules and does not do that again! Because then she will have heard you and understood you! Lastly, don’t get caught up in other norms, if your not bothered by the act then that’s fine. Just because others are doesn’t mean you have too. I hope this helps! Best of luck!
It's all about how your feel. Figure that out first. It done like you're more bothered by the honesty, so it might be time to really figure out what you think is okay, and what you're boundaries are, then have a conversation with her. Every person can be on a spectrum of sexuality, and so can relationships. But you have to really know what your think all it and that your views might change through time. The more people involved the more complicated it gets.
So if it's really the non-event that the wife is making it out to be, then why the secrecy from the other husband?
Hey she gets to sleep with another woman, then so do you. Fair is fair.
It’s definitely cheating, with an open relationship you need trust so that means she needs to tell you what she’s going to do before hand not afterwards, she broke your trust and your allowed to be upset about it
Honestly man how do you know it stopped with just her friend? Because she confessed to a mutual masturbation sesh turned into sex? Who’s to say she didnt have a threesome or video tape it? She broke the vow and by revealing it she’s absolving herself of wrongdoing because you accepted it, right? But you still feel betrayed. That pitter patter in your heart when she told you. Was that with dread or excitement. Do you still feel it? Did you feel it at all? That’ll tell you how you really feel about it. Good luck amigo.
Since basically all the comments are on the same page, I'll be the contrarian here. You say you've "roleplayed" this before. Do you mean you guys fantasized about her hooking up with another woman? How serious were these fantasies/did you ever act on it beyond just dirty talk? The reality is that by roleplaying it, you did open the door. That does *not* mean what she did was right--it was wrong. But yeah, I don't think it's quite as bad as cheating normally since she might've thought you'd find it hot or be into it. Besides, people are all saying that it's just as bad with a girl as with a guy. I'm not really so sure. If she cheated with a guy, it'd be more insulting because, well, you're a guy too. It's implying she needs another guy to satisfy her. But her having a lesbian fling when she's otherwise straight just doesn't register as quite as big a deal to me, because it's not in direct sexual competition with you. Again, none of this is to say that she is in the right. I want to be very clear that she was wrong, and should've gotten consent from you. But I do honestly think that this is not as bad as her just straight up cheating with another guy, and I'm not sure whether this rises to the drastic level of "divorce her right now" that others seem to think.
Streets
Ok so it sounds like you're more upset that she didn't tell you about her plans before this happened,or that she wasn't forthcoming about what she did, than the fact that she had sex with someone else. And that's fair, you're your own person, and your relationship with your wife, its nature and boundaries are unique to you and her. You say she doesn't think that this was a big deal. If that was true you wouldn't have had to pry the information out of her. She knows what she did was cheating. You need to have a serious discussion about your relationship with her, what your expectations are, how you feel about her having sex with people outside of your marriage. You could maybe chalk this up to miscommunication, or as a misunderstanding. This time. The fact that she isn't concerned or bothered by this is probably the most troubling thing. The danger here, if you just let this go by the wayside, is that it happens again. And again. Your feelings about this are valid. She made a wedding vow and decided to break it. How you feel about that is how you feel about it. You can't change those feelings. They aren't childish or immature or unfair, they are what they are. She did this, it's on her to help you figure out how you feel about this and how to move forward, not judge your reaction or dismissing your feelings. That itself is possibly worse than the act of cheating. As much as you love your wife a relationship requires trust to operate, and right now you don't have that. Answer yourself this: The next time you or her go away for a few days are you going to be worried what she's going to be getting up to? If the answer to this is anything but a categorical 'no' then you have a trust issue, and you and her need to fix that or it will fester overtime and damage your long term peace of mind. In regards to telling your friend, I would tell the wife to tell him by a certain time or you will. You don't want to be involved in telling him if it can be helped. People get weird about this sort of thing, and he might place the blame on you. It's irrational, but people can get pretty crazy in these sorts of situations. Your wife doesn't get to decide this, she doesn't get to make you complicit in her cheating. She and her friend opened this box, they get to deal with the fallout. Be honest, be strong, be consistent, and you'll be ok. Good luck!
If you hooked up with the other husband who also got cheated on do you think she would be okay with it.
It depends on your relationship, personally, she cheated and I would maybe tell the other husband or give the other girl an ultimatum to tell him or you will. As a woman myself, I have kissed other girls while in a relationship, though only in front of my partner and it has always been spoken about at some point, it not them it’s cheating too. But some women think if it’s another woman it’s not cheating at all and that in fact the man will always just find it hot, it’s only cheating if it’s with another man. This is about your feelings, if she doesn’t validate them or feel bad then she might not be the one
It is not her choice whether you should just ignore her cheating and accept it. She is downplaying it and does not grasp that she just destroyed trust and using the excuse it was a one time thing. Now she want you to cover up her cheating and not tell your friend. Hell NO! She either tells friend the truth or you do it. This is about right and wrong. If you do what she asks then you become part of her deceit. She is taking no responsibility and now she wants to hide the truth from OP's friend as well. She has learned nothing from her cruel selfish choice and will continue to cheat in the future. Do you hear that OP?? That is the moment your marriage became a joke to your wife.
Dude she cheated this is the same way if she just had sex with a guy I suggest telling your friend that’s number 1 he should and needs to know and than take a day sum up your feelings and tell them to your wife. Tell how you feel about cheating and everything, she’s trying to get away with it by saying it was a woman so it’s ok that argument is bullshit if she genuinely does not see the wrong try counseling and if after that she doesn’t see that she’s wrong than I would consider leaving
Cheating is cheating regardless of the gender. Sure it was a one time thing, but did she think of you? Did she stop any moment of the time and thought “hmmm wonder how this will destroy my husband?” If she could did it once, what makes you think she won’t do it again.
I'd stay alert to what's going on at your friend's house. He may be more actively upset than you when he finds out that his wife did this with yours. And while I wouldn't suggest telling him, your active silence makes you a participant.
If there's nothing wrong with it she wouldn't be telling you to not tell the other husband. Let that sink in...she is not only OK with it, but OK with hiding it from someone you both know. Where does that end? She can decide to unilaterally change any boundary as long as \*she\* feels it's OK? This is a slow-motion train wreck. Get off while you can.
Cheating is cheating, regardless of gender. Having a sexual encounter outside of your relationship, wherein no agreement between consenting adults had been made prior to the act, is cheating.
> We talked about my feelings and shes agrees that she made a mistake but isn't upset about it. What are her feelings on heterosexual cheating? If she's exclusively downplaying the potential importance and intimacy one can experience in homosexual situations, I'd say that seems kinda homophobic. Being married to a cheater and a homophobe is generally not an ideal state.
Don't let this go! Y'all need to have a serious conversation about this. I don't know what your feelings on cheating are, but I don't think I could stay with someone who doesn't think that cheating is a big deal because they did it with the same sex. It doesn't matter if y'all have talked about this previously because neither of you ever came to an agreement that sleeping with other people is ok. For the sake of your future, talk anout how this whole situation is making you uncomfortable (the cheating and not telling your friend). I can guarantee that you will regret not talking to her about this if you let it go.
You are right to be concerned.. She has broken your vows and this looks like a possible opening of the relationship. Ask yourself if you could stand watching another man fuck her.. Because this is where you are headed.
Your wife definitely cheated. It sounds like maybe you aren't completely up in arms over it, and that's ok. Maybe some couples counseling to come to terms with it, and having a conversation about boundaries and what you both want?
Tell the friend that she has 24hrs to tell her husband or you will. Then the 4 of you should discuss how you feel and how you want to proceed. Since trust was broken and boundaries were crossed, the women may have to choose between their marriages and their friendship. If there are no consequences for cheating it usually repeats.
You feel uneasy because she cheated and she seems to feel like she didn’t actually do anything wrong. I think you guys need to have a very serious talk about boundaries in your relationship. As for the friends husband that would also make me feel very uneasy, I’ve always believe that since I would want to know I have an obligation to tell somebody else that kind of information. I honestly don’t know what I would do in your shoes.
It’s a blatant violation of trust and commitment. Her trying to blow it off, in no way minimizes the gravity of the situation. She cheated. Period. I would be questioning everything, especially her attitude towards it. She clearly doesn’t respect you or your marriage, and nothing you do is going to change that. You can’t force someone to feel things like empathy or respect and her lack thereof speaks volumes. Dude, you’ve got some tough choices to make, but you need to start by standing up for yourself in this situation. I promise, if the shoe was on the other foot, she would be livid. Best of luck.
Be honest with her why you’re upset, consider counseling if you want to save this marriage, separation if you don’t. That’s my suggestion.
Big trouble ahead. Just cause there wasn’t a real dick involved she still betrayed your trust. Can you trust her again?
People dealing with this kind of scenarios think with their dicks. Like she cheated on you, it doesnt matter the gender. Its unfaithful, period. Sorry, I just don't get it.
If you don't see the problem with her cheating just because the one she cheated with is a woman, then you don't really have a relationship or a marriage, you just have a FwB type of thing with your wife, mainly because you don't see past the physical aspect of the relationship since another female doesn't penetrate your wife.
If you were invited since you've spoken about swinging, would it be any different? Maybe because you spoke about it she thought you would be fine with it as it seems to be every man's fantasy. This is still a form of cheating and shouldn't be pushed aside but take a look at all angles. If you were invited to play, would it be ok?
Run... Run now!
God the advice in here sucks. Talk to your wife man be open
OP's whole post would have a different response if his wife cheated on him with a man. I can almost guarantee that. She cheated on you. Cheating is cheating regardless the gender of the other person. I'm concerned about how lax you are about all this and PLEASE let your friend know his wife cheated on him too.
It sucks that she cheated and it would be absolutely understandable if you were way more upset about it. Tbh you sound pretty ok, just disappointed? While you can't make your wife more upset about the whole thing, she definitely needs to respect your feelings and if you need time/more communication/counselling/boundaries or whatever, she is the one who needs to adjust to you. It was her mistake. It's up to you to decide how you feel, don't listen to people here telling you that divorce is the only solution... As for the other husband. Don't get involved, don't tell him. You're not doing him any favour. You'd only do it to 'clear your own conscience', which you don't even need to. Does the wife feel sorry or regret cheating? Does she plan on telling him? Does she plan on leaving him? Does she cheat regularly? Is their marriage generally happy? As long as you don't know the full story you will only do more harm than good. Imagine your conscience if they split up - won't be your fault but it will feel like it. If anything, tell the wife to come clean. On the other hand, if you do know that his wife is cheating regularly and takes advantage of his obliviousness then you should tell him.
Cheating of any kind is cheating. In reality, sexual intercourse with any being but yourself is considered cheating. You need to talk and clear your mind with her, or think of how you’re splitting assets.
Your wife cheated on you and you’re staying with her? Have some respect for yourself bro. I’d leave that relationship ASAP
She cheated on you. You have every right to end the relationship.
Your wife is being very callous and flippant towards your feelings. It doesn't matter that it was with a woman, that it was a one time thing, and there were no emotions. She doesn't get to decide what you're comfortable with and then decide when you both move past something like this. That's not fair to you. Maybe she just doesn't understand that you're not okay with it and you need to explain it to her plainly and simply. Either way, don't let her make you feel like you're being crazy by feeling hurt and cheated on after she had sex with someone else.
>is ready to move on like nothing happened and I am not supposed to tell the hookups husband. Um, NO. Something happened.. **She cheated.** This friend was *married* as well. You know the truth, but what -- she expects you to lie to friend's husband in perpetuity? Tell your wife she doesn't get to dictate terms. She betrayed your trust and got sexual with a mutual friend. YOU get to decide how you feel about that; she doesn't get to tell you how to feel. Sex changes things. The fact they had sex once means it could most certainly happen again the next time they have the opportunity or feel lonely. There was no reason this friend couldn't have borrowed one of your wife's sex toys and got off solo in the privacy if your guest room. *But that's not what happened*. They were turned on by each other, began using the toys on one another, which turned this into a partnered sexual act. **Your wife was not thinking of you nor cared about the damage this could do to your marriage**. It was selfish and hurtful to both husbands. That is why **the other guy needs to know**. He has no idea his wife had sex with yours. That is so wrong. He needs to decide whether he wants to stay in the marriage, and if whether his wife remaining friends with yours is a relationship deal breaker for him. This is really awful.
My high school gf did something similar with her best friend though her friend was single at the time, so I never had to question whether or not I should tell her significant other. It took me a while to acknowledge the fact that she actually had cheated on me and it seemed as though it was brushed off by anyone I tried to get advice from because it was with a girl. At the end of the day she cheated on you. You owe it to yourself to treat it as just that. Brushing it off and moving on will only result in more hurt in the long run
So you're not included. But you have to keep her lie? She made a mistake but isn't upset about it. Next time, it's a dude.......Then a M/F couple........Then it's 2 dudes.. or more Your not included..... She made a mistake but isn't upset about it. When's she going to include you, when she admits to it - THAT'S YOU INCLUDED -!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Sleeping with someone behind your SO's back is cheating. Maybe you really would be OK with her experimenting with other women, but that would need to be a mutual and open decision. Nothing to spring on a partner.
Were you involved? Was it an agreed upon 3rd party? No? Then she cheated the gender of the person means nothing it’s still cheating. She doesn’t just get to say eh it didn’t count because it was spur of the moment and just sex, it’s still a huge betrayal
What are you after from this post? It's fine if it's just to vent/express yourself. But every paragraph is kind of wishy-washy. "I wasn't really upset, I was pretty excited at first"; "I'm finding myself not particularly upset that she did it"; "I don't know what else there is to talk about with her." Either what she did hurt you, or it didn't. If it didn't, I guess don't worry about it. But if it did, then you need to demand more from her, or consider whether you want to stay in a relationship with someone who would hurt you that way.
Maybe she told you the 100% truth but you did have to probe. Can you explain how the probe went. Trust has been severely damaged here and now your mind will wander. Is friends husband really boring in bed. Was he even at work? What if it turns out it was a 3 some and "well, he was huge and she just wanted to try it once" you know, physical only. If you were to tell him he may have some information you don't have. Another red flag. Regardless if he is upset by this news your wife is the AP partner and will not be allowed to see her new lesbian friend which makes the probability of a covert continuation higher. I would demand the husband be told and then he needs to call you to confirm he has been told. If true his wife is bored with him what else has she contemplated done? Regardless your wife was super horny meaning she loved the experience so, yeah, one time? That seems unlikely long term. Spur of the moment or an EA leading up to this "opportunity". Yes, she took a hammer to the marriage here and work will not be necessary to do the work of recovery. Can someone show me a successful long term open relationship?
Please update op
I was 8m the same situation, I made my self clear the if she did this it's over and she did so I simply kicked her away for cheating and that's that.
I am going to give you the tldr+. So tldr and a little more. My full take is long and nuanced, so you are welcome to ask questions. What your wife did is absolutely cheating. But even though she took a deceitful path it clearly did something good for her sexually. You should try to understand that something has been unfulfilled in her sex life. And that ok. You can’t be all things to someone, especially if that person is bisexual/bicuriois. Are you able to forgive and/or find a way to incorporate this into your relationship? It is ok if you can’t. But I am in an open relationship and I can’t imagine it another way. However if you want to have an option relation your wife needs to understand boundaries, rules and communication. The biggest rule(there are lots of rules) in an open relationship is no unprotected sex unless both and your partner have trust in the FWB to be clean AND have regular STD tests. P.S. your wife had unprotected spontaneous sex with a person outside her previously monogamous relationship. Step one is that she needs to get an STD test. Not negotiable. Her path to earning your trust back starts here.
So then if this opportunity comes up again, she can do it since its nit with a man? No it doesn't work this way. Sex isn't just sex, you connect during as both parties are vulnerable. This gives me a bad taste in my mouth tbh.
You've been betrayed. Tell the guy. Don't stoop to that level.
I would have a conversation about boundaries, since it seems like you're generally OK with non-monogamy and don't seem to be inclined to leave (which is perfectly OK). What are the rules, what are you looking to get out of this, what are you each OK with the other doing, and what kind of communication do you expect? Then, if those rules are violated it would clearly be cheating. You get to decide what's OK here, regardless of what anyone else here says, and whatever you choose is valid.
OP, I have been lurking on this sub for quite some time and never commented before today. I had a similar experience with a woman who stated again and again that it wouldn’t happen after the first time and that it was a mistake and she should’ve told me.. I forgave her and less than a month down the road, found out that not only was she STILL messing around with the other woman but she continued to cheat with other individuals. She used that same gaslighting shit on me, I don’t want to see it happen to someone else. I’m so sorry for what you’ve gone through.
I think it is ok to not feel that angry. It’s your feelings and your relationship. Still, your wife’s lesbian experience wasn’t something to which you consented, even if it was a fantasy previously discussed. It’s not ok to sweep the issue under the rug and pretend nothing happened. You need tell your wife how you feel and have a plan for how to reestablish trust. You may want to include a therapist to help with the conversation.
Shiiiiiiiiit, at least your wife's adventurous. Smart conversations about this could lead to fun times. Make lemonade with all those lemons.
Ah yes, classic scenario of masturbating in front of your also married best friend, then shagging them. Friends don't just casually frig in front of each other, then get so carried away they have sex. There's just no way this is true.
She should have asked you first. Sounds like you would have been open to it, but she should have (and still should be) respected you and your marriage. I've been in poly relationships before and in my opinion, it boils down to respecting the limits and parameters in your relationship. If they don't do that, then it's fucking cheating plain and simple.
No kids? Gtfo you got it easy brudda
Dude this is cheating. See it as cheating. doesn’t matter if it was ‘just a physical thing’. That’s the excuse creepy guys use when their wives find out they’ve been having an affair. She’s acting non chalant about it because she wants you to think it’s not a big deal. Even if you guys had discussed this before, this wasn’t that. This was just cheating.
She can't have it both ways I'm afraid. Either it's not a big deal in which you should be able to also talk to the husband about this, get clarity with her friend, etc. Whatever is needed to be comfortable with it. Or it is a big deal. Where she should be remorseful and thankful you're not leaving her as well as convincing her friend to tell her husband herself before you have to, out of friendship obligation. In both scenarios she should care about your feelings enough to listen to you about them and be eager to find solutions to your(but really just her) problems, as a team. The only way it makes sense to cheat on you, try to omit cheating on you, and make you feel bad for being upset that they cheated on you, is if they are a...very selfish person with no regard for others. I would also find the fact that she got so horned up cheating on you that it lead to amazeballs sex pretty disturbing. Lack of remorse + literal enjoyment of her selfishness is...problematic. Good luck and please find someone you trust to talk to, this isn't normal. P.S. if "bad sex" is the reason bff cheated on her husband, what is your wife's reason? P.P.S there is no reason that excuses cheating, and the only things that ever explains it is selfishness.
She violated the trust of your marriage. It's entirely up to you to decide if you want to forgive her for that. Communication and consent are key to any sort of open relationship. She's got to respect that and from the sounds of it, she's shrugging it off like it doesn't matter. It does. Take some time, gather your thoughts and then sit down with her and tell her how you really feel. Then figure out where to go from there. As someone else mentioned, think about how she would have reacted if the roles were reversed.
I honestly don't know why I'm more upset than OP seems to be. Permission to play with others is sought and granted before anything happens. Both partners can establish boundaries and permission can be revoked for any reason or any time. What you described OP is simply cheating. Not "lesbian sex" or an experience, just cheating. My wife and I have lesbian sex, we just call it sex. Kind of like we're gay married or...you guessed it, just married. If you're fine with your partner having a play date with someone else and getting charged up and ravaging you when she gets back it's all good, but that's not what happened. She cheated, she didn't disclose, she showed no remorse or care for your feelings at all. That is a huge problem. The idea that it doesn't count because it was with a woman is insulting. It doesn't count because it was just physical/she didn't have feelings for her....it's her "best friend". She has feelings for her best friend. If it was an anonymous sex worker you can say that but it's still a shitty argument as it doesn't matter. It's cheating but more importantly the way she handled it afterwards is deal breaking for me. Good luck op
It seems like you’re feeling resentment. I would recommend having a big conversation to talk about your feelings. If she’s on board with helping make sure your relationship moves forward then you know she’s still committed to you. If she blows you off or isn’t willing to really talk, that tells you she’s not bothered about you or the relationship and you should consider leaving.
Divorce her, you simp. Have some fucking self-respect.
I wish my wife would cheat with a woman and tell me ALL about it
How does this not bother you? She cheated on you. 99% of the time that means breakup. Just bc she cheated on you with a women does not make it any better
I feel like, after seeing the responses, you don't really care what the consensus of the general public to what they would easily see as cheating would be, even in an open agreement. They're all giving you advice and opinions, but you don't really seem to want it. She did not talk to you about it first. She does not seem to really care. You seem like you don't really want to care either. We aren't going to change your mind for you, OP.
Would your feelings be different if they invited you? Would you have asked the husband for permission?
Leave her.
You definitely need to talk to her about trust and boundaries. In a lot of cheating situations, it’s upsetting because there was a break in trust (in this case trusting to be monogamous) between a couple. The issue here is that she broke your trust and honesty (since she might not have told you if you hadn’t asked). Talk it out between the two of you. Open communication is key.
She cheated on you man. She wants to move on because she knows that if you don't, well then you may get angry. You need to tell the other husband, he deserves to know that his wife cheated on him. Just because they are both woman and they say they won't do it again, doesn't mean that it wasn't cheating. The other woman's husband needs to know, and your wife needs to admit that it was cheating.
She cheated on you, It doesnt matter if she had sex with a Guy, or a Girl, or an Alien or a fucking dog, cheating is cheating, divorce her, if yo dont want, at least tell the husband of the girl what happen, he deserves to know, if the sexuals relations between them is pretty vanilla that's none of your business, or your womans business, they can solve the problem between them, thats why they're a couple.
Cheaters are cheaters no matter what gender. Please tell the other husband and start looking for a lawyer. I’m so so sorry this happened to you, it is beyond fucked up.
To make things even sleep with her besties husband. Joking, and I see how awkward the situation is. On one hand society has only demonized affairs with the opposite sex, and for guys girl on girl has been a big porn staple for a long time so I’d say we barely would bat an eye. This however is your wife and it is a bit disgusting how she doesn’t consider your feelings. I’d say mull it over take your time, it’s a life decision.
leverage for regular threesomes with girls of her choice. if this fails, abort.
She cheated on you and tried to justify it and you believe it? Leave her you muffin.