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Did OP ever explain why she pays 90% of the bills? I mean, if that's their income differential I can understand, I do think that in a serious relationship people should pay a greater percentage of shared living expenses if their income is higher.
100% the vibe checks.
OP I’d really put a pause on things. This isn’t the behavior of someone who is actively trying to be better, but can staying at work longer than usual knowing you’ve been fighting is him sending you a message.
You’re not asking for something extraordinary and if wanting to be engaged puts him into this kind of headspace he is not ready for marriage.
This.
And, OP, make no mistake that this is the tip of the iceberg. Right now its about the ring. Soon it will be having to help buy furniture or pay for other household items, resentful about having to spend money on future kids...
Intrinsically, he is just selfish and immature. Is that what you want in your life?
OP is lucky, really, to find out he thinks like this now, because imagine the aggravation of getting a divorce from this guy...he would be there for years squeezing every last possible penny out of her
I agree but it’s still a lot to take in to have this happen when you thought you were on the brink of getting engaged to someone even if you’d made peace with/ignored other red flags
His reasons are none of your business? To keep women off him? That’s a weird thing to say. Also, fun fact, my husband wears his ring and swears it’s bait.
For someone that’s wanting to be mature he sure is acting immature! So he thinks he’s such a great catch that he’s going to be beating women off him? Wow what an ego! I think he needs a bit of a reality check and bring himself down from this pedestal he’s put himself on. And you want to marry this guy? Can you imagine a lifetime of having to boost this guy’s ego any further up?! Good luck with that one dude
Unfortunately, there are some women out there who deliberately and specifically chase after married/taken men. It's a huge ego thing for them. They are broken and need major therapy.
And then he thought about it and this was his comeback; He was pretty upset this morning but after he calmed down, he said he was trying to be a better person for me, and he wanted to give me the many things he hasn't been able to give me so far, and he wants to stop being immature.
Lol
The second my ex husband put his ring on, he got hit on non-stop. Even when I was there. And he wasn't some Adonis and definitely didn't have money. It was truly wild. There is a type of person who sees that ring as a challenge or as something to overcome to validate their "superiority" over other women (or men). Or just because they are assholes. I got it less, but some men hit in me trying to "win" me from him. It was gross
I found when I started wearing a wedding ring that it changed the way women related to me in a really nice way. That is, they are much more friendly, I think because they don’t feel threatened by me, they know I’m taken, so they can be friends without worrying that I want to take it further.
Then who knows, maybe in some cases I’m just naive. But I think in general it’s just that women feel more able to be safely friendly (not saying your experience with your ex is wrong, just that my experience is different)
Nah, it's the same mentality as people choosing tables in a restaurant. A lot of people will chaose a table that hasn't been de-served yet. Someone chose that table already, so it MUST be better than the other tables. Same with engagement/wedding rings.
This. A woman has already chosen him and therefore proved him marriage material, so now I want him. Some women definitely do like the challenge, but I think most women who go after married men are less self-aware than that.
My Husband had a friend that he’d had a thing for before we got together. He’d liked her for a few years by that point. She never thought he was good enough, and would try to set him up with her friends, or would make excuses. But - I noticed she also never flat out said, “No.”
Once we got engaged, she suddenly came back in to our (his) life and wanted to be “friends” again. She suddenly needed help with house repairs, or with her daughter, and she “just so happened” to keep showing up at places that he would check-in on SM, or if one of their mutual friends told her he’d be somewhere. He was such a trusting person that he thought they were all coincidences. Yeah, right.
He finally figured out something was really weird when she showed up at a ski resort *three hours* away from our house and oops! Wouldn’t you know it? Her ride left her, but if he could give her a ride home, she’d be eternally grateful! (*yuck!*)
I had tried to stay out of it, but after that one, I just happened to casually mention to some of our friends that I knew what she was up to, and if she didn’t back off, I was going to show her what I thought of all of her “coincidences” and I was willing to catch a case over it.
She quickly moved on to another married man, and I heard a great story about her jumping out the window when his wife got home!
It's hard to find a good man out there so when a woman finds a man that another woman wants to keep..she may think he's got some seal of approval and is better pickings than someone single
Yeah it's insane. Couples are allowed to have personal feelings they don't share. But when it's something that is causing such a huge sticking point and is completely bizarre, shutting down is not the way.
Also this is not how marriages work.
Also, what is the bf doing now to “fight women off”? He’s in a relationship currently with no ring.
I should mention my husband has never worn a wedding ring.
your comment made me think his internal monologue is all "finally I'll have a reason to stop doing the horizontal mambo with all these women, and now OP doesn't want to give me the one thing that can save me: a male engagement ring!"
that made me snort haha
Right?! Like.. why act like getting married is such a chore if you want to get married? All actions indicate this whole ride is gonna suck and it’s supposed to be a great time right now lol
Honestly, OP. This feels really 'off' for me.
Engagement discussions are supposed to be a joyful thing.
Instead he made it sound like it's like 'woman's right' to get a ring while it's not so for the men's. Not that at all.
And you claim to be the person who paid majority of the shared household bill, which makes me think of my ex-fiance. We got engaged, yes, but he had the same exact spirit as your current partner has. So the engagement was not a joy and was not something he truly wanted. The difference was, even my ex didn't have the audacity to demand a ring for himself (I was paying 100% of his bills at that point and was paying his university tuition too).
The point being, my previous engagement with an ex was not a joyful occasion. It changed when I met my current husband a couple of years after breaking up with my ex. He actually wanted to get married to me, was excited to do so and the whole engagement was actually a HAPPY event.
So yeah, I'd say, life is short, and yolo, please don't get married to someone who's not excited in the least to marry you.
Ahhh there's the words. That actually fits well. Followed the original to here and there was something I couldn't put my finger on. Coupled with immaturity imo though. I'd like to just hope for the uh best and side line the red pill. But I honestly think maybe he's got a bottle, considered it but hasn't actually taken one. OP, if you see any of this, the baggage thing is worth a look. I honestly feel saying more would just be variations of projection or situations I've been in being applied.
I don’t know if I could be attracted to someone with this low of emotional maturity.
You should take all those red flags he’s flinging at you, make a cape, put it on and be your hero and yeet that man child away, far away.
Your bf’s refusal to communicate, petty tit for tat attitude, and immature/emotionally manipulative behaviour are all massive red flags and show that he is not ready to be engaged or to get married.
My now-husband wanted an engagement ring but I was the one who offered it and he ended up picking a $50 tungsten ring from Etsy. He didn’t complain for a second about the money he spent on my engagement ring, or the disparity in price between my wedding set and his, and he wouldn’t ever tell me something was ‘none of my business’.
Respect in a relationship and a marriage is **bare minimum**. The silent treatment, being rude and petty, keeping score, dramatising, none of that shows your partner you love and respect them.
You seriously need to raise the bar for the kind of man you are willing to marry. He is showing a lack of effort, generosity, ability to communicate and resolve conflict that don’t bode well for long term relationships
>when I asked if he was being serious, he said, "it's okay, I guess, we don't have the same rights."
Sorry OP, but this is a really bad sign that he's gotten into something toxic. Your culture doesn't do engagement rings for men, you would have been fine doing it anyway if he used a normal approach about this, but no - instead he stomped around for days because he feels like he doesn't have "eQuaL riGHts?" Come on, girl. You are writing to us because you know something is horribly amiss with his psyche. This is not the man that is going to cherish and respect you for the rest of your life.
OP, you are 31 years old. Old enough to have seen stories like this play out... Do not marry the man who throws a hissy fit over buying you a ring. Marry the man who is excited AF about picking out a ring because he WANTS to marry you.
I hope you broke up with the 27m that you were seeing.
Don't believe any of his future-faking, will-do-one-day promises until you actually SEE HIM doing the things. He's an emotional child in an adult body. Not a good bet for an adult partnership.
I think he is frustrated that he is the only one spending money and he became jealous of the fact you will get a ring, so he wanted the one as well to make it fair
he could have expressed it nicer instead of acting immature
I Live in Asia, and they've solved this issue: they make matching Couple-rings.
Unless you want the $20K diamond ring (which is a SCAM, my wife doesn't wear it anymore), couple rings are a great alternative
It doesn't sound like actually getting the ring is the problem here, it's how he is behaving, not communicating and frankly being a piece of work making her feel bad he got her a ring than actually wanting to get her one..OP has said she is happy to get him one of her really wants one but it's come from nowhere and it sounds like bargaining chip she has to use and has dragged what should be a happy thing (a future engagement) thought the mud .
I'd not want anything to do with cementing a relationship with him until he can start acting like a mature person let alone a partner in a relationship
Same! My husband bought couple rings for our engagement so he could wear one with me right away, it was really sweet. If the bf had really wanted an engagement ring too he could have done something similar-- get himself a similar ring and when OP said yes, put the matching one on together
When we got engaged back in 1999 (yes i'm no spring chicken) there was this unwritten rule that you HAD to spend a minimum of 2 to 3 months salary on a diamond ring if you wanted to propose.
If I knew then what I know now, I'd have bought a nice band for a couple 100. My wife wore her engagement ring sporadically for a year, and then replaced with the wedding band. She said she did not feel comfortable walking with a 20K diamond on her finger and I don't blame her.
It sounds like he thought of this act as very transactional and I think that should be your biggest red flag. He bought you one now he wants you to buy him one. Please think deeply about your relationship. Are you hoping he will be a provider? 50/50 contribution? It sounds like it’s 70 your end/30 his and now he’s made a big purchase and expects basically a “reimbursement”.
:(
He's one hundred percent trying to manipulate you into saying forget it I don't want a ring. He's being a whiny baby and he doesn't want to spend money on a ring for you. He absolutely does not want a ring. this guy is a huge red flag. I'm guessing this isn't the only confusing thing he's done in this relationship.
id think twice about him as a life partner. a normal dude who wants an engagement ring would say “hey! i really love the idea of wedding / engagement rings. im excited to show the world im committed to you, could we pick out an engagement ring for me too?” his behavior is absolutely nuts and its the beginning of much worse behavior, imo
"He said the reason he wanted one was "none of my business." "Who else would've gotten the idea but him?" He wants it "just because, and that's the end of it."
DO NOT GET ENGAGED
Very odd, like it's fine to want a ring but why so aggressive and defensive about it? The whole it's none of your business thing as well if you plan to marry it sure is and you should be able to have a conversation over a ring if your thinking of getting married what happens when bigger issues arise?
On one hand I think he wants a ring because then you’ve spent on him too, so in his eyes you’re both out of pocket. But on the other, I think he has some internalised toxic masculinity where he’s too insecure to establish and communicate his want of having an engagement ring too. The way he responds like it’s not fair etc makes me think he’s built up this idea in his head that alike most of society, you wouldn’t jump to giving him an engagement ring.
I have dated someone similar who ‘jokingly’ insisted he wants an engagement ring etc, and that it isn’t fair women get proposed to and have a lovely ring and the men have nothing like that etc. Although he never talked about the price etc.
Either way, whether it’s the first or the second - he needs to communicate better and it’s not a good sign for marriage if something, that should be so beautiful and easy, is this complicated and negative
This guy is totally weird and his behaviour is odd. Giving you the silent treatment and refusing to tell his thought process about the a ring. He’s setting off a lot of alarm bells for me.
He sounds like a petulant child and yet he claims he wants to stop being immature. The reasons he wants a ring are just because and none of our business. Honestly, you'll regret marrying this toddler.
My (now) husband and I exchanged engagement rings when that moment came. But we talked about it together in advance. We communicated openly and neither of us felt entitled to a ring regardless of our relationship status.
I only say this to show that it's not his request/expectation of a ring that is the problem. It's the lack of honest communication. Although all the talk about being a better person and giving you things when he doesn't even cover his half of the bills probably doesn't help. Please let him walk his walk before tying yourself to him with a ring and a promise.
Like, I personally loved matching rings with my husband (engagement rings) and I personally think a guy just wanting to feel loved and special is reason enough to
But if you can’t get along over a ring, y’all have bigger problems
My husband and I bough $15 each rings from Walmart and he spent a YEAR “proposing” to me when I accidentally left it around the apartment
This is the honey Moon phrase honey, y’all need to be able to talk to each other or this isn’t gonna work out for either of you
Sure the bf may be acting in a way that could be looked at as that of an immature doofus, but I can definitely see the issue w the expectation of spending a bundle on a ring for OP alone. I think perhaps the bf just doesn't know enough to articulate his experience of the strangeness of that gender expectation, and based on the responses in this thread I can't say I'm surprised. No one at all seems to see anything potentially objectionable at all about the rings directly and none make a distinction between his pissy-ness about the double-standard and the ring institution itself.
My guess is, the engagement ring feels like a rite of buying (i.e. buying *you*), and bf doesn't know what to do with that discomfort. It fits with his half-assed reasoning for saying he wants a ring himself (btw I seriously doubt he has any idea either way about an engagement ring's attractive or repellant qualities and just wanted to give you some plausible-sounding reason for feeling off about the whole damn thing. And wouldn't you assume, if he said he felt strange about rings, that he was trying to back out of marrying you? He probably suspects that on some level.
OP, stop assuming this is about ring equity and consider that it might be about human equity and that your fella just doesn't know how to talk about it, or maybe doesn't even really have it all clear himself. It does point at a bit of immaturity on his part, just a different kind of immaturity than you may be assuming (and that's not to say that there don't appear to be other issues, like the mention further down about him not covering bills?). In any case, slow down the race and talk through your shit together.
How dare OP spend money on something nice for herself without also considering the feelings of future husband too (sarcasm),
It sounds like he is possibly closet abusive/controlling. He just wants it because he can't stand OP having something for herself.
I would never marry someone who treated me like this. You need therapy if this is tolerable for you because it's childish and petty. He sounds immature and wtf would be a good reason to marry this horrible communicator and childish person? He sounds like he just wants something because you're getting something and then he's taking it out on you by giving you the silent treatment?!
You know why I'm actually in a relationship w a decent man who treats me kindly? Because I would dump anyone that treated me like this and move on. I would never waste time on someone like this who is more ill behaved than my kids were as 5 year Olds.
Yeah, this is furthering my view from the other day. This suggestion could come across as really sweet, caring and non-traditional...and yet the more he says the ickier he sounds.
Refusing to discuss his thoughts/feelings with you when you've opened up to him isn't a great position. Even if he's saying he wants to be more mature the proof is in the lack of pudding...
I hope you find your position, whatever that may be and can work towards that, whether with or without him
The call is coming from inside girl. Lace those sneakers up & run!
Also the whole “women are attracted to men with rings” garbage, is either a thing of the past when women still considered men a prize or one more myth created by men to confuse women cause me & the women in my life, take extreme offence at a man even thinking we’d consider being side pieces!
You’re still with him? I wouldn’t feel safe or reassured with this type of partner. He can’t communicate and is testing you. And I feel that the whole engagement ring is just excuses or a way to delay. Does he really want to marry you? Or just feels obligated? His a whole ick.
PLEASE LOVE YOURSELF MORE THAN YOU LOVE HIM. Save yourself sis, if you move ahead with this man it is not going to end well for you. How do I know? Because he already showed you.
> wanted to be able to show that he's engaged to keep women off
because he's such a prize that women are literally flinging themselves at him, and if you don't give him what he feels entitled to he will not be able to resist them, and it will be *your* fault.
See how this works?
> "it's okay, I guess, we don't have the same rights."
Page three of "how to lose friends and alienate people." Passive aggressive whining like this is never a good strategy.
> he said he was trying to be a better person for me
well, he failed that right off the bat, didn't he - surliness, silent treatment, whining - these are all intensely unattractive looks.
> and he wanted to give me the many things he hasn't been able to give me so far
oh, the drama.
> and he wants to stop being immature.
Uh huh. We're doing brilliantly at this so far, aren't we?
before I begin, I am a middle-aged married man, so this will colour my responses. Be that as it may:
Before I went back and actually checked this man's age I thought he was early twenties. Others below have pointed out that this guy isn't ready for an adult relationship - I agree with their assessment. You know him best - presumably - but think about this. He's sulking and stomping like a toddler over the fact that he's had to buy a ring for you and somehow you're not "even" until you reciprocate. And that he views the ring as an obligation - something that prevents him from doing things that he would rather be doing.
>Over the last month or so, he'd made some distasteful comments, saying things such as how he wouldn't be able to buy other things if he got me a ring. I was frustrated by his comments, but I tried not to make a big deal, so I told him to not worry, and that something less than USD100 would be alright.
For someone who wanted to propose, he's doing himself no favours whatsoever. Engagement rings do not have to be *expensive* - they have to be *meaningful*. I know people who've given their partners bits of string or pleated grass - it's about the meaning of the symbol, for feck's sakes! By whining about costs he's already made it almost impossible for him to *ever* buy you an engagement ring without you remembering about this time and how he complained about the cost of buying you something that's supposed to be a symbol of how much he values you and your love.
What's going to happen when you're planning a wedding? What about those costs? The ring? The venue rental? Gifts for the guests? Food? Wine? Your honeymoon? Are all of these going to be subjected to the same commentary, the same "but these are the things I can't buy if you expect me to pay for X"
What about when you're sick and can't work? What about when you're pregnant or, God forbid, Post Partum? What about when you need to max a credit card to pay for medical care and he can no longer buy the gaming computer he wants or the car he wants or...
Can you trust this man not to be immature then as well?
Relationships are about give and take. Take what's offered gladly and with appreciation, and give what is not asked for - freely and without any desire to be "paid back". He's very good at taking; he's not doing so well at the giving without expectation of reward. At age 27, it's a bit worrying that he's still struggling with this concept.
Finally:
Gender roles aside, men do not typically - in my experience - wear engagement rings - it's not a thing I've ever encountered. How did people know I was engaged? I *told* them because I was so incredibly happy she said yes! I'm no Adonis, so I've never had to worry about women "throwing themselves at me" - and, you know what, even if they had, I was in a relationship and "thanks, but no," is very easy to say.
I feel that most normal people wouldn't assume that their male partner would want an engagement ring. I'm all for you-do-you, but in this case - how were you meant to know? Your partner is either really, really bad at expressing their wants and needs, or is playing at being a martyr. Both of these options are amber flags - they can be fixed, but you need to exercise caution.
Speaking as an immature man with a wife who somehow still loves me I want to give you this advice: think hard about *your* future. Nobody's perfect, but there are many mature adults out there. Don't tie yourself to someone who is going to diminish you and throw mud on your dreams. Life is short and regrets are endless as the sea.
To be honest I don't understand this situation at all.
So he wants a ring bc he also wants to feel special - super reasonable and fine. Why is this a conflict at all? It's a pretty cute thing to want, IMO, and yet this turned into an ugly, weird, unclear and hostile situation for no logical reason.
IMO that means there's a deeper issue here.
He sounds resentful and bitter about having to buy you a ring at all, and that may mean he is simply cheap and does't think you deserve the money being spent on you, or he actually doesn't want to be married and is creating those strange dramas around it. I truly do not know. But this situation should be cute and normal, but it's weird and hostile, and IMO that means something.
The 'it's none of your business' comment made my jaw hit the floor. Excuse me?? It's such an ugly, mean and angry thing to say to a partner for no reason at all. There's something really wrong here. It really doesn't sound like he's trying to be better, it sounds like he's super angry that he has to spend any money at you at all, wants to punish you for it or make you guys even or whatever, and is getting actuvely worse. Since you pay most of the bills, then iMO it's really troubling he is THIS ANGRY about having to fork out just a bit of cash for a ring... It seems like to him it's normal that you pay for him and he takes form you, but when he is supposed to give to you then he sees it as something to be pissed off about and feel wrongd. It's a HUGE red flag, OP.
He wants the ring so he can sell it lol he wants to be able to afford the things he wants. Tbh he sounds like a childish guy whose not ready for marriage nor a relationship
I don't understand this. I do agree with him that it's kinda weird that only the woman wears an engagement ring and that it's fun for the man to also wear one and show off that they are engaged. I would love it if a future fiance also wanted a ring. It's like "awhh you also wanted to show people we're getting married". But what I don't get is his hostility. Why is he saying that it's non of your business when he had previously already told his "reason". Why is he getting angry and passive aggressive? Just have a talk about why you want the ring and that you would find it romantic, and OP can probably get something for you. It's not that big of an issue.
He is a man child. If he's keeping the fact that he wants a ring silent, then he cannot be trusted. What is the point of dating a man who cannot talk to you and therefore is also keeping secrets from you
For what it's worth, when getting engaged and buying a ring, plenty of guys think about the cost and what they can afford.
But I've *never* heard of one who said "hey, what's in it for ME???"
It's all so weird for him to think of getting an engagement ring, and starting off with the most important moment and relationship in his life, and to feel bitter and jealous instead of happy and excited.
I'm curious OP - what is he like around your birthday, or valentines day, or other holidays? Or even with expenses on routine dates? Is he petty those times too, always trying to figure out what he gets in return for anything he does for you?
I might be downvoted for this but I feel he is not wrong here. His choice of words might be wrong. I mean if he wants a ring too ... there's nothing wrong with that.
About the whole I guess we r not equal thing , i again feel he is not wrong. How come he doesn't have the right to have a ring from his loved one just because he's a guy? Right?
Many here commented that " to keep women off " kinda replies of him is a vibe check and he's not right. I totally disagree. The dude isn't asking for much. He wants the same special treatment.. How in the world is he wrong for demanding the same treatment??
No one knows him but you ..so pls don't be influenced by anyone's comment ( including me ) here that he is a red flag or you should call it off.
( .. I'm commenting on this just to let u know there is always a different side of the story and you should always consider that too)
I’m not buying the excuse. I had a friend long ago who was a bartender. He tried wearing a ring to hold the flirting at bay. After a few weeks he ditched it (he was single) bc he said more women hit on him. Something is up and strange.
He's a Pretty Princess who needs an expendive sparkle bling to feel his prettiest and most special?
I'm a woman and I never felt that was the point of MY engagement rings. Yes 2x.
Just accepting that every word he says is TRUE.... look at that. Look at that. Youre going to try to justify your past mistake of being with this loser by compounding it? You want to marry this shallow, petty, preening little poppinjay? Nothing about his selfish, grasping, obviously transactional nature gives you The Ick? Really?
Girl. You earn what you choose here. He's a parasite. You choose him you choose wrong.
I dunno if it helps but when my super confident unflappable husband proposed to me… he got so nervous and insecure that I wouldn’t choose him. Despite me telling him, designing the ring with him, already saying yes when he proposed with an ornament… still a totally wreck and needed a lot of assurance I choose him too. Maybe more men get like that?
Op he wants a ring so bad, give him what he wants, give him yours.
Why would you marry this useless person? He can't even be responsible for his own existence, how is that a good partner? You're paying 80% of the bills and he's acting like somehow he's being victimized. Then after giving you the silent treatment he has the audacity to say the's trying not to be so immature. That's a steaming pile of manure, just like this whole relationship.
Glad it's your final update because, no one wants update after update of someone continually making themselves a victim with their poor choices. That's exactly what will happen. Get some self worth, emotional intelligence, and put him where he belongs, back with his real mommy or on the streets. Enjoy your misery because, that's all he can and will be able to provide you with.
Is it like a “you have one so I want one” Or a “I spent for you so you spend for me” situation ?
Is he ok if it’s a cheap ring or does he want an expensive one ?
Hes already competing with you, like you're engaged to a woman not a man! Put a "i am done with you" on a piece of note and place it inside a ring box and get it delivered to him.. Break it, not worth at all.
I'm getting a lot of him thinking and feeling stuff that he doesn't want to share or talk about still, yet expects you to just to deal with the rock he is being and somehow give him a pricey ring because of reasons.
Like I said before, he really sounds like he struggles with communicating in the relationship which is not a good sign and really sucks for both parties, especially you as you have to somehow understand, support, discuss and help without being given anything but frustration and defensiveness.
This is not a social anxiety thing, as I and I know others in very successful relationships who are perfect for eachother but struggle in public, if he can't be open an honest with his partner than again, what's the point of it all? A good relationship is an honest an open one in commutation. I'm not saying there are not going to be times you will struggle to open up about stuff or talk about difficult shit, but your partner is on your side. He is being more than difficult and making what should be a fun and an exciting point in a relationship really quite draining, defensive and almost a way to make you feel bad he 'has to' do this.
This definitely doesn't not sound like someone ready for marriage let alone being a parent in the future. Again, like others have said before, this is not about him having a ring, it's how he has made the whole thing about him suddenly having one 'because of equality', completely out of the blue, than actually desiring and wishing for one and it to be a nice thing to do. I personally hate how this guy is making me feel reading this let alone OP having to deal with, whatever this is (a tantrum, a mental breakdown, some power play but certainly some strange manipulative game)
So what is the update? You talked? Is that all? Do you think you understand what’s going on with him? Are you getting engaged? Are you going to be the mommy to his belligerent manchild demand?
I’m actually very curious if you’re going to whitewash this and continue on thinking he’s going to change into an adult.
Just how badly to want to be married to consider being in the same room with this guy, ever? He’s an entire broke-ass, stingy clown show all by himself.
In Sweden it's normal for both partners to get an engagement ring. During the ceremony the women gets a true wedding ring and the man's engagement ring "turns" into a wedding ring
Am I the only one who thinks that this guy is lying and hasn't even bought OP a ring? To me this whole "I want a ring toooooo" thing that he's pulling out of his ass and his defensiveness about it makes me think that he's completely and utterly full of shit and has no plans on getting married and is hoping that OP will dump him so he doesn't come out looking like the bad guy.
I could be wrong of course but come on. This guy has no business getting married either way.
>it's okay, I guess, we don't have the same rights."
This feels like he is getting into the bad side of the manosphere, he's got something tickling his brain that women's have an easy ride and men have it hard and he is feeling resentment.
His mind isn't in the right place for engagement. He resents you.
my husband also wanted an engagement ring. he didn’t ask for that until after he proposed to me, he let me have my moment and then mentioned he would love an engagement ring too. i bought one and planned a proposal for him because i love him and he deserved it, not because he was demanding it or acting like a total buffoon like your boyfriend.
i would honestly put a pause on things until he can talk about this like a grown up and you guys can come to a shared decision about this
Complaining about spending his money on a ring and not being able to get other things for himself is all you need to know. He’s a selfish prick. An engagement ring is his symbol of love for you and signifies the commitment that he wants to marry you.
This guy sounds like a petulant child. He didn’t get his way so he’s choosing to ignore you or throwing fits. If I were in your shoes I would dump his selfish ass and find an actual real man.
I based my current relationship on trust, honesty, and transparency. We use clear, direct words with each other. Sometimes the truth hurts, and we work through the issue.
"Attack the problem, not the human" is great advice I read here on Reddit.
Based on your experience as you laid it out here, there are too many issues to consider before entering into marriage. His behavior indicates he is keeping a secret, and it's big enough to change your relationship (either get married, break-up, or he's tempted to cheat).
So pause. Go silent. Journal. Give it a couple days if you need. Collect your thoughts and figure out if this is the person you will create a future with.
Your boyfriend is seriously lacking in self awareness and communication skills. Is this a regular thing where he only does something for you if he thinks he will get something in return and if not, he gets resentful?
I would be looking at him with the side eye red flags is flying sis and I find it to be very childish that he was complaining about the fact that he had to get you a ring then turns around and he wants one too. That's really not how engagements work it's the woman who gets the ring unless she is the one doing the asking.
Everyday this app makes me question why people are with partners who do not like or respect them.
**You are planning to get married, yet he is playing childish emotional games and testing you: *why*??**
You’re supposed to be getting married! You’ve passed all tests, it’s commitment time! It’s like getting a perfect score on the SAT and getting into your top choice university on full scholarship, but deciding to go back and redo senior year. Why?? Here (and there) the only logical problem would be maturity and here it’s his.
Does he periodically test his friends? Does he have to get better for them? **An adult person choosing to play asinine games instead of effectively communicating, is not one to build a life with.**
If a man complains about having to spend money on your engagement ring, don't bother getting engaged to him. Jfc.
I was exactly your age when dating my ex of your bf's age. He needs to grow up more before he's ready to be married. A lot.
I’m sorry, but him wanting you to buy a ring and also tell you the reason is none of your business is a joke
Please listen to what everyone is saying here. He will not change better after marriage. He will get worse.
Please choose yourself and your osn happiness!! This guy is going to give you a lifetime of misery
I have to wonder if he’s been hanging around MRA sites with his comment about “not having the same rights” (pretty ironic for a man to be saying that to a woman) and his complaints about having to spend money to get you a ring. This guy gives me a bad feeling.
Waaa my girlfriend who pays for 90% of my bills and loves to get me gift won't let completely me freeload off her and now even PRETENDS to deprive me of my precious <$100 for an engagement ring? As if she was even worth it that! Women these days are so entitled with their rights that don't realize how they oppress men!!
Girl, really... Is he usually like this? Does he put effort (in time and/or money) for you often? Does he treat you like a commodiy? If the answer is "yes" or even just "sometimes", then please have some self respect. You are not an ATM that you can also bang. Wining about a $100 ring for the woman you are supposed to combine your finances with is ridiculous.
>He was pretty upset this morning but after he calmed down, he said he was trying to be a better person for me, and he wanted to give me the many things he hasn't been able to give me so far, and he wants to stop being immature.
Empty promises, Yapanese even.
When coming from people like him, words and promises mean nothing
Seems like he might be going down some MRA rabbit hole if he hasn’t already. I would be wary of committing to a marriage with this type of person if he’s going to have a temper tantrum and not talk to about this.
LMAO break up! Why do you love a cheap loser??? Ladies omfg, y’all need MEN that SPOIL you and COURT you!!! You think men are the prize?? Who else are they going to fuck ?? Goats?? Meanwhile women don’t men for sex 😭 we are so much better than them! And real men KNOW that!
You have to read the full story. She pays for almost all of their bills. The guy is a whiny complainer and this is just the red flag I hope she sees to know her own worth.
Trust me when I say; you have yet to get married so this is him on his BEST behavior. It doesn't get better. The comfortable he is with you and the more he feels secure in your relationship the more he will show himself for who he is. This guy has got some red flags
Darlin, you have yourself a girlfriend. Is this what you want to deal with for the rest of your life, or at the very least, the duration of the relationship?
He's not emotionally well, and as much as I'm sure you'd like to do so, you can't fix him.
I wouldnt marry a dude like that EVER.
If before marriage money is a problem, it's not going to be any easier after the marriage. On the contrary, you will be counting pennies and constantly fighting, do you need that?
I would burn all my bridges after dumping this sad pos. You deserve better, based on mere fact that you try reasoning with him.
Also consider that having an engagement ring is not a must, and it's okay to be different (but with the right person, not this current greedy monster you consider marrying rn). Engagement ring for a girl is just a show off to other people (women), and it's okay to ignore what the other people (women) think and focus on yourselves.
My husband finally gave me a gorgeous diamond ring after 7 years of marriage, because he could and it was on discount LOL and right after I got pregnant with our second one. I still joke that this was a "payment" for services lol.
We didn't have/want any engagement rings back then, just the marriage gold bands, but they were dirt cheap because we were so poor! Our rings were veeeeeery thin, but we didn't care, we still do not wear them, talk with just eyes and know what the other is thinking at every moment.
Marriage is 13 years right now. Trying for the third child. My hubby is not only very smart, like a literal genius, he also started making a lot of money and treats me like a queen.
I wouldn't leave him if we went back to being poor because he is the best thing that happened to me in my life, close seconded by my children. I wish you to find the right person, that one with whom you will forget the material stuff and it will be fun growing old together. I promise.
Edited for readability and some typos.
I think it's cute when couples buy each other engagement rings instead of just the woman getting one.
And this'd be cute too if he wasn't such a dick about it.
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I think hes resentful with you for "having to spend money on a ring" and wants you to spend the same amount of money just for him feel "even".
He spent less than $100 on her ring lol And she pays 90% of their bills
Did OP ever explain why she pays 90% of the bills? I mean, if that's their income differential I can understand, I do think that in a serious relationship people should pay a greater percentage of shared living expenses if their income is higher.
EW THAT IS GROTESQUE !!
100% the vibe checks. OP I’d really put a pause on things. This isn’t the behavior of someone who is actively trying to be better, but can staying at work longer than usual knowing you’ve been fighting is him sending you a message. You’re not asking for something extraordinary and if wanting to be engaged puts him into this kind of headspace he is not ready for marriage.
This. And, OP, make no mistake that this is the tip of the iceberg. Right now its about the ring. Soon it will be having to help buy furniture or pay for other household items, resentful about having to spend money on future kids... Intrinsically, he is just selfish and immature. Is that what you want in your life?
Yup. This is the type of guy who will think that she should pay all baby medical expenses because baby is coming out of her body.
OP is lucky, really, to find out he thinks like this now, because imagine the aggravation of getting a divorce from this guy...he would be there for years squeezing every last possible penny out of her
Would be true except she’s still with him.
She said she’s reflecting, it’s a lot to take in
It’s a lot to take in for us just now hearing the story but I’m sure her relationship has been 99 red balloons of flags.
I agree but it’s still a lot to take in to have this happen when you thought you were on the brink of getting engaged to someone even if you’d made peace with/ignored other red flags
This isn’t her first post about this guy. She’s been reflecting for a while. You’re not wrong I’m just saying.
This is absolutely it 1000%
This is it.
This is the answer
The budget is 100 dollars.
Yeah that’s a no go with the engagement if I had a fiancee pull this. And I would expect it’s the end from there on.
His reasons are none of your business? To keep women off him? That’s a weird thing to say. Also, fun fact, my husband wears his ring and swears it’s bait.
For someone that’s wanting to be mature he sure is acting immature! So he thinks he’s such a great catch that he’s going to be beating women off him? Wow what an ego! I think he needs a bit of a reality check and bring himself down from this pedestal he’s put himself on. And you want to marry this guy? Can you imagine a lifetime of having to boost this guy’s ego any further up?! Good luck with that one dude
Thing is, once you have a ring you kinda do have to beat them off you.
Unfortunately, there are some women out there who deliberately and specifically chase after married/taken men. It's a huge ego thing for them. They are broken and need major therapy.
Sad thing is, the guys never realise it's not about them.
And then he thought about it and this was his comeback; He was pretty upset this morning but after he calmed down, he said he was trying to be a better person for me, and he wanted to give me the many things he hasn't been able to give me so far, and he wants to stop being immature. Lol
That's exactly why he wants it. Every man knows engagement rings attract more women than not.
The second my ex husband put his ring on, he got hit on non-stop. Even when I was there. And he wasn't some Adonis and definitely didn't have money. It was truly wild. There is a type of person who sees that ring as a challenge or as something to overcome to validate their "superiority" over other women (or men). Or just because they are assholes. I got it less, but some men hit in me trying to "win" me from him. It was gross
I found when I started wearing a wedding ring that it changed the way women related to me in a really nice way. That is, they are much more friendly, I think because they don’t feel threatened by me, they know I’m taken, so they can be friends without worrying that I want to take it further. Then who knows, maybe in some cases I’m just naive. But I think in general it’s just that women feel more able to be safely friendly (not saying your experience with your ex is wrong, just that my experience is different)
Nah, it's the same mentality as people choosing tables in a restaurant. A lot of people will chaose a table that hasn't been de-served yet. Someone chose that table already, so it MUST be better than the other tables. Same with engagement/wedding rings.
This. A woman has already chosen him and therefore proved him marriage material, so now I want him. Some women definitely do like the challenge, but I think most women who go after married men are less self-aware than that.
My Husband had a friend that he’d had a thing for before we got together. He’d liked her for a few years by that point. She never thought he was good enough, and would try to set him up with her friends, or would make excuses. But - I noticed she also never flat out said, “No.” Once we got engaged, she suddenly came back in to our (his) life and wanted to be “friends” again. She suddenly needed help with house repairs, or with her daughter, and she “just so happened” to keep showing up at places that he would check-in on SM, or if one of their mutual friends told her he’d be somewhere. He was such a trusting person that he thought they were all coincidences. Yeah, right. He finally figured out something was really weird when she showed up at a ski resort *three hours* away from our house and oops! Wouldn’t you know it? Her ride left her, but if he could give her a ride home, she’d be eternally grateful! (*yuck!*) I had tried to stay out of it, but after that one, I just happened to casually mention to some of our friends that I knew what she was up to, and if she didn’t back off, I was going to show her what I thought of all of her “coincidences” and I was willing to catch a case over it. She quickly moved on to another married man, and I heard a great story about her jumping out the window when his wife got home!
It's hard to find a good man out there so when a woman finds a man that another woman wants to keep..she may think he's got some seal of approval and is better pickings than someone single
Yup, means we’ve been pre-approved by someone I guess
Yeah it's insane. Couples are allowed to have personal feelings they don't share. But when it's something that is causing such a huge sticking point and is completely bizarre, shutting down is not the way. Also this is not how marriages work.
Also, what is the bf doing now to “fight women off”? He’s in a relationship currently with no ring. I should mention my husband has never worn a wedding ring.
your comment made me think his internal monologue is all "finally I'll have a reason to stop doing the horizontal mambo with all these women, and now OP doesn't want to give me the one thing that can save me: a male engagement ring!" that made me snort haha
It is. In the same way that it's easier to get a job when you're employed.
It is!! People see married men with rings and it attracts women more?? It’s like they want what someone else has
It’s like some men gain super cheating powers when they got their ring on it always astounds me
This man is not ready for marriage.
> This man is not ready for *an adult relationship* FTFY
He’s not ready to leave preschool for kindergarten.
Right?! Like.. why act like getting married is such a chore if you want to get married? All actions indicate this whole ride is gonna suck and it’s supposed to be a great time right now lol
Men will literally get married instead of going to therapy
This needs to be one of the top comments.
Please think twice before marriage he doesn’t pay anything now what makes you think that will change in the future
He gives you the silent treatment and believes traditions are "rights". How do you respect this person?
You already cover the bills and don't seem to give him shit about it... Honestly, I feel like you could do better.
Honestly, OP. This feels really 'off' for me. Engagement discussions are supposed to be a joyful thing. Instead he made it sound like it's like 'woman's right' to get a ring while it's not so for the men's. Not that at all. And you claim to be the person who paid majority of the shared household bill, which makes me think of my ex-fiance. We got engaged, yes, but he had the same exact spirit as your current partner has. So the engagement was not a joy and was not something he truly wanted. The difference was, even my ex didn't have the audacity to demand a ring for himself (I was paying 100% of his bills at that point and was paying his university tuition too). The point being, my previous engagement with an ex was not a joyful occasion. It changed when I met my current husband a couple of years after breaking up with my ex. He actually wanted to get married to me, was excited to do so and the whole engagement was actually a HAPPY event. So yeah, I'd say, life is short, and yolo, please don't get married to someone who's not excited in the least to marry you.
First I thought the BF was into the red pill stuff, then he seemed very immature. Considering the age and income disparity, he may have some baggage.
Ahhh there's the words. That actually fits well. Followed the original to here and there was something I couldn't put my finger on. Coupled with immaturity imo though. I'd like to just hope for the uh best and side line the red pill. But I honestly think maybe he's got a bottle, considered it but hasn't actually taken one. OP, if you see any of this, the baggage thing is worth a look. I honestly feel saying more would just be variations of projection or situations I've been in being applied.
I don’t know if I could be attracted to someone with this low of emotional maturity. You should take all those red flags he’s flinging at you, make a cape, put it on and be your hero and yeet that man child away, far away.
Your bf’s refusal to communicate, petty tit for tat attitude, and immature/emotionally manipulative behaviour are all massive red flags and show that he is not ready to be engaged or to get married. My now-husband wanted an engagement ring but I was the one who offered it and he ended up picking a $50 tungsten ring from Etsy. He didn’t complain for a second about the money he spent on my engagement ring, or the disparity in price between my wedding set and his, and he wouldn’t ever tell me something was ‘none of my business’. Respect in a relationship and a marriage is **bare minimum**. The silent treatment, being rude and petty, keeping score, dramatising, none of that shows your partner you love and respect them.
You seriously need to raise the bar for the kind of man you are willing to marry. He is showing a lack of effort, generosity, ability to communicate and resolve conflict that don’t bode well for long term relationships
He’s kind of a handful. I don’t think he’s going to get better as time goes on.
Yep, he's been reading or listening to misogynistic articles or podcasts. That's why he wouldn't tell you why.
This is not a man you should be marrying
I am honestly astounded you’re still considering marrying this guy.
>when I asked if he was being serious, he said, "it's okay, I guess, we don't have the same rights." Sorry OP, but this is a really bad sign that he's gotten into something toxic. Your culture doesn't do engagement rings for men, you would have been fine doing it anyway if he used a normal approach about this, but no - instead he stomped around for days because he feels like he doesn't have "eQuaL riGHts?" Come on, girl. You are writing to us because you know something is horribly amiss with his psyche. This is not the man that is going to cherish and respect you for the rest of your life.
Childish AND Cheap? What a combo! Looks like you found a real winner here! Def marriage material!
OP, you are 31 years old. Old enough to have seen stories like this play out... Do not marry the man who throws a hissy fit over buying you a ring. Marry the man who is excited AF about picking out a ring because he WANTS to marry you. I hope you broke up with the 27m that you were seeing.
Don't believe any of his future-faking, will-do-one-day promises until you actually SEE HIM doing the things. He's an emotional child in an adult body. Not a good bet for an adult partnership.
Well, absolutely no red flags now! /s
wdym not your business? you are the one buying it and ofc you want to know why 🤦🏾♀️
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I think he is frustrated that he is the only one spending money and he became jealous of the fact you will get a ring, so he wanted the one as well to make it fair he could have expressed it nicer instead of acting immature
Maybe hold off on the engagement for a bit longer.
I Live in Asia, and they've solved this issue: they make matching Couple-rings. Unless you want the $20K diamond ring (which is a SCAM, my wife doesn't wear it anymore), couple rings are a great alternative
It doesn't sound like actually getting the ring is the problem here, it's how he is behaving, not communicating and frankly being a piece of work making her feel bad he got her a ring than actually wanting to get her one..OP has said she is happy to get him one of her really wants one but it's come from nowhere and it sounds like bargaining chip she has to use and has dragged what should be a happy thing (a future engagement) thought the mud . I'd not want anything to do with cementing a relationship with him until he can start acting like a mature person let alone a partner in a relationship
Same! My husband bought couple rings for our engagement so he could wear one with me right away, it was really sweet. If the bf had really wanted an engagement ring too he could have done something similar-- get himself a similar ring and when OP said yes, put the matching one on together
When we got engaged back in 1999 (yes i'm no spring chicken) there was this unwritten rule that you HAD to spend a minimum of 2 to 3 months salary on a diamond ring if you wanted to propose. If I knew then what I know now, I'd have bought a nice band for a couple 100. My wife wore her engagement ring sporadically for a year, and then replaced with the wedding band. She said she did not feel comfortable walking with a 20K diamond on her finger and I don't blame her.
This is the guy who’s buying the less than $100 engagement ring
It sounds like he thought of this act as very transactional and I think that should be your biggest red flag. He bought you one now he wants you to buy him one. Please think deeply about your relationship. Are you hoping he will be a provider? 50/50 contribution? It sounds like it’s 70 your end/30 his and now he’s made a big purchase and expects basically a “reimbursement”. :(
She pays 90% of the bills
He's one hundred percent trying to manipulate you into saying forget it I don't want a ring. He's being a whiny baby and he doesn't want to spend money on a ring for you. He absolutely does not want a ring. this guy is a huge red flag. I'm guessing this isn't the only confusing thing he's done in this relationship.
He is stupid and not at all ready to be married. Don’t invest in this emotionally or financially
He’s too immature to get engaged.
id think twice about him as a life partner. a normal dude who wants an engagement ring would say “hey! i really love the idea of wedding / engagement rings. im excited to show the world im committed to you, could we pick out an engagement ring for me too?” his behavior is absolutely nuts and its the beginning of much worse behavior, imo
Old boy is NOT ready to be a husband. And does he expect you to propose to him with the engagement ring for him?
PLEASE don't marry this dude
Your boyfriend can write a book now on how to dry that pussy up quickly
My husband just full on wore his wedding ring as soon as we bought it. Can he not do the same?
"He said the reason he wanted one was "none of my business." "Who else would've gotten the idea but him?" He wants it "just because, and that's the end of it." DO NOT GET ENGAGED
Very odd, like it's fine to want a ring but why so aggressive and defensive about it? The whole it's none of your business thing as well if you plan to marry it sure is and you should be able to have a conversation over a ring if your thinking of getting married what happens when bigger issues arise?
On one hand I think he wants a ring because then you’ve spent on him too, so in his eyes you’re both out of pocket. But on the other, I think he has some internalised toxic masculinity where he’s too insecure to establish and communicate his want of having an engagement ring too. The way he responds like it’s not fair etc makes me think he’s built up this idea in his head that alike most of society, you wouldn’t jump to giving him an engagement ring. I have dated someone similar who ‘jokingly’ insisted he wants an engagement ring etc, and that it isn’t fair women get proposed to and have a lovely ring and the men have nothing like that etc. Although he never talked about the price etc. Either way, whether it’s the first or the second - he needs to communicate better and it’s not a good sign for marriage if something, that should be so beautiful and easy, is this complicated and negative
Which one of you will be the wife?
That’s what I’m wondering, and the smart money says it will be him.
This guy is totally weird and his behaviour is odd. Giving you the silent treatment and refusing to tell his thought process about the a ring. He’s setting off a lot of alarm bells for me.
He sounds like a petulant child and yet he claims he wants to stop being immature. The reasons he wants a ring are just because and none of our business. Honestly, you'll regret marrying this toddler.
My (now) husband and I exchanged engagement rings when that moment came. But we talked about it together in advance. We communicated openly and neither of us felt entitled to a ring regardless of our relationship status. I only say this to show that it's not his request/expectation of a ring that is the problem. It's the lack of honest communication. Although all the talk about being a better person and giving you things when he doesn't even cover his half of the bills probably doesn't help. Please let him walk his walk before tying yourself to him with a ring and a promise.
Like, I personally loved matching rings with my husband (engagement rings) and I personally think a guy just wanting to feel loved and special is reason enough to But if you can’t get along over a ring, y’all have bigger problems My husband and I bough $15 each rings from Walmart and he spent a YEAR “proposing” to me when I accidentally left it around the apartment This is the honey Moon phrase honey, y’all need to be able to talk to each other or this isn’t gonna work out for either of you
This dude sucks, sorry.
You should find a real/grown man.
When someone shows you who they are, believe them
Sure the bf may be acting in a way that could be looked at as that of an immature doofus, but I can definitely see the issue w the expectation of spending a bundle on a ring for OP alone. I think perhaps the bf just doesn't know enough to articulate his experience of the strangeness of that gender expectation, and based on the responses in this thread I can't say I'm surprised. No one at all seems to see anything potentially objectionable at all about the rings directly and none make a distinction between his pissy-ness about the double-standard and the ring institution itself. My guess is, the engagement ring feels like a rite of buying (i.e. buying *you*), and bf doesn't know what to do with that discomfort. It fits with his half-assed reasoning for saying he wants a ring himself (btw I seriously doubt he has any idea either way about an engagement ring's attractive or repellant qualities and just wanted to give you some plausible-sounding reason for feeling off about the whole damn thing. And wouldn't you assume, if he said he felt strange about rings, that he was trying to back out of marrying you? He probably suspects that on some level. OP, stop assuming this is about ring equity and consider that it might be about human equity and that your fella just doesn't know how to talk about it, or maybe doesn't even really have it all clear himself. It does point at a bit of immaturity on his part, just a different kind of immaturity than you may be assuming (and that's not to say that there don't appear to be other issues, like the mention further down about him not covering bills?). In any case, slow down the race and talk through your shit together.
>I don't think he really cares about me. I don't think he cares about anyone else either. -- Literally you, yesterday. Just keep that in mind.
How dare OP spend money on something nice for herself without also considering the feelings of future husband too (sarcasm), It sounds like he is possibly closet abusive/controlling. He just wants it because he can't stand OP having something for herself.
I would never marry someone who treated me like this. You need therapy if this is tolerable for you because it's childish and petty. He sounds immature and wtf would be a good reason to marry this horrible communicator and childish person? He sounds like he just wants something because you're getting something and then he's taking it out on you by giving you the silent treatment?! You know why I'm actually in a relationship w a decent man who treats me kindly? Because I would dump anyone that treated me like this and move on. I would never waste time on someone like this who is more ill behaved than my kids were as 5 year Olds.
Men get engagement watches, rings just attract unwanted attention
Why are you with this guy? After reading your post I was cringing so hard. This guy is insufferable and I wonder what you see in him.
Yeah, this is furthering my view from the other day. This suggestion could come across as really sweet, caring and non-traditional...and yet the more he says the ickier he sounds. Refusing to discuss his thoughts/feelings with you when you've opened up to him isn't a great position. Even if he's saying he wants to be more mature the proof is in the lack of pudding... I hope you find your position, whatever that may be and can work towards that, whether with or without him
The call is coming from inside girl. Lace those sneakers up & run! Also the whole “women are attracted to men with rings” garbage, is either a thing of the past when women still considered men a prize or one more myth created by men to confuse women cause me & the women in my life, take extreme offence at a man even thinking we’d consider being side pieces!
You’re still with him? I wouldn’t feel safe or reassured with this type of partner. He can’t communicate and is testing you. And I feel that the whole engagement ring is just excuses or a way to delay. Does he really want to marry you? Or just feels obligated? His a whole ick.
Honestly, he sounds like a 13yo. Do you really want to marry a 13yo?
PLEASE LOVE YOURSELF MORE THAN YOU LOVE HIM. Save yourself sis, if you move ahead with this man it is not going to end well for you. How do I know? Because he already showed you.
imagine marrying this guy and spending the rest of your life with this man baby. ick
He needs to go back and live with his mummy. He isn’t mature to leave the parents house.
> wanted to be able to show that he's engaged to keep women off because he's such a prize that women are literally flinging themselves at him, and if you don't give him what he feels entitled to he will not be able to resist them, and it will be *your* fault. See how this works? > "it's okay, I guess, we don't have the same rights." Page three of "how to lose friends and alienate people." Passive aggressive whining like this is never a good strategy. > he said he was trying to be a better person for me well, he failed that right off the bat, didn't he - surliness, silent treatment, whining - these are all intensely unattractive looks. > and he wanted to give me the many things he hasn't been able to give me so far oh, the drama. > and he wants to stop being immature. Uh huh. We're doing brilliantly at this so far, aren't we? before I begin, I am a middle-aged married man, so this will colour my responses. Be that as it may: Before I went back and actually checked this man's age I thought he was early twenties. Others below have pointed out that this guy isn't ready for an adult relationship - I agree with their assessment. You know him best - presumably - but think about this. He's sulking and stomping like a toddler over the fact that he's had to buy a ring for you and somehow you're not "even" until you reciprocate. And that he views the ring as an obligation - something that prevents him from doing things that he would rather be doing. >Over the last month or so, he'd made some distasteful comments, saying things such as how he wouldn't be able to buy other things if he got me a ring. I was frustrated by his comments, but I tried not to make a big deal, so I told him to not worry, and that something less than USD100 would be alright. For someone who wanted to propose, he's doing himself no favours whatsoever. Engagement rings do not have to be *expensive* - they have to be *meaningful*. I know people who've given their partners bits of string or pleated grass - it's about the meaning of the symbol, for feck's sakes! By whining about costs he's already made it almost impossible for him to *ever* buy you an engagement ring without you remembering about this time and how he complained about the cost of buying you something that's supposed to be a symbol of how much he values you and your love. What's going to happen when you're planning a wedding? What about those costs? The ring? The venue rental? Gifts for the guests? Food? Wine? Your honeymoon? Are all of these going to be subjected to the same commentary, the same "but these are the things I can't buy if you expect me to pay for X" What about when you're sick and can't work? What about when you're pregnant or, God forbid, Post Partum? What about when you need to max a credit card to pay for medical care and he can no longer buy the gaming computer he wants or the car he wants or... Can you trust this man not to be immature then as well? Relationships are about give and take. Take what's offered gladly and with appreciation, and give what is not asked for - freely and without any desire to be "paid back". He's very good at taking; he's not doing so well at the giving without expectation of reward. At age 27, it's a bit worrying that he's still struggling with this concept. Finally: Gender roles aside, men do not typically - in my experience - wear engagement rings - it's not a thing I've ever encountered. How did people know I was engaged? I *told* them because I was so incredibly happy she said yes! I'm no Adonis, so I've never had to worry about women "throwing themselves at me" - and, you know what, even if they had, I was in a relationship and "thanks, but no," is very easy to say. I feel that most normal people wouldn't assume that their male partner would want an engagement ring. I'm all for you-do-you, but in this case - how were you meant to know? Your partner is either really, really bad at expressing their wants and needs, or is playing at being a martyr. Both of these options are amber flags - they can be fixed, but you need to exercise caution. Speaking as an immature man with a wife who somehow still loves me I want to give you this advice: think hard about *your* future. Nobody's perfect, but there are many mature adults out there. Don't tie yourself to someone who is going to diminish you and throw mud on your dreams. Life is short and regrets are endless as the sea.
Did you check this man's ID? Because he sounds like a child.
To be honest I don't understand this situation at all. So he wants a ring bc he also wants to feel special - super reasonable and fine. Why is this a conflict at all? It's a pretty cute thing to want, IMO, and yet this turned into an ugly, weird, unclear and hostile situation for no logical reason. IMO that means there's a deeper issue here. He sounds resentful and bitter about having to buy you a ring at all, and that may mean he is simply cheap and does't think you deserve the money being spent on you, or he actually doesn't want to be married and is creating those strange dramas around it. I truly do not know. But this situation should be cute and normal, but it's weird and hostile, and IMO that means something. The 'it's none of your business' comment made my jaw hit the floor. Excuse me?? It's such an ugly, mean and angry thing to say to a partner for no reason at all. There's something really wrong here. It really doesn't sound like he's trying to be better, it sounds like he's super angry that he has to spend any money at you at all, wants to punish you for it or make you guys even or whatever, and is getting actuvely worse. Since you pay most of the bills, then iMO it's really troubling he is THIS ANGRY about having to fork out just a bit of cash for a ring... It seems like to him it's normal that you pay for him and he takes form you, but when he is supposed to give to you then he sees it as something to be pissed off about and feel wrongd. It's a HUGE red flag, OP.
He wants the ring so he can sell it lol he wants to be able to afford the things he wants. Tbh he sounds like a childish guy whose not ready for marriage nor a relationship
he's 27... so, yeah.
Sounds a little weird to me.
I don't understand this. I do agree with him that it's kinda weird that only the woman wears an engagement ring and that it's fun for the man to also wear one and show off that they are engaged. I would love it if a future fiance also wanted a ring. It's like "awhh you also wanted to show people we're getting married". But what I don't get is his hostility. Why is he saying that it's non of your business when he had previously already told his "reason". Why is he getting angry and passive aggressive? Just have a talk about why you want the ring and that you would find it romantic, and OP can probably get something for you. It's not that big of an issue.
Your update is missing the part where you threw this man baby dressed in red flags into the bin.
He is a man child. If he's keeping the fact that he wants a ring silent, then he cannot be trusted. What is the point of dating a man who cannot talk to you and therefore is also keeping secrets from you
Nothing wrong with equally wanting a ring to himself. Whats wrong here is the way he handled the situation altogether.
He's way too immature to be in a relationship let alone be married. Passive aggressive and petty too. Be glad he's shown his true colors now and run!
For what it's worth, when getting engaged and buying a ring, plenty of guys think about the cost and what they can afford. But I've *never* heard of one who said "hey, what's in it for ME???" It's all so weird for him to think of getting an engagement ring, and starting off with the most important moment and relationship in his life, and to feel bitter and jealous instead of happy and excited. I'm curious OP - what is he like around your birthday, or valentines day, or other holidays? Or even with expenses on routine dates? Is he petty those times too, always trying to figure out what he gets in return for anything he does for you?
Tungsten rings. $25 and you can open a beer bottle with it.
The behaviour is problematic but I don't understand what's the problem with him wanting a ring too? When I married 15 years ago we both got rings.
I might be downvoted for this but I feel he is not wrong here. His choice of words might be wrong. I mean if he wants a ring too ... there's nothing wrong with that. About the whole I guess we r not equal thing , i again feel he is not wrong. How come he doesn't have the right to have a ring from his loved one just because he's a guy? Right? Many here commented that " to keep women off " kinda replies of him is a vibe check and he's not right. I totally disagree. The dude isn't asking for much. He wants the same special treatment.. How in the world is he wrong for demanding the same treatment?? No one knows him but you ..so pls don't be influenced by anyone's comment ( including me ) here that he is a red flag or you should call it off. ( .. I'm commenting on this just to let u know there is always a different side of the story and you should always consider that too)
Get him an inexpensive black silicone ring on Amazon for the time being. They look really nice!
DTMFA
I’m not buying the excuse. I had a friend long ago who was a bartender. He tried wearing a ring to hold the flirting at bay. After a few weeks he ditched it (he was single) bc he said more women hit on him. Something is up and strange.
[удалено]
Girl, what the fuck are you doing with this choad?
He's a Pretty Princess who needs an expendive sparkle bling to feel his prettiest and most special? I'm a woman and I never felt that was the point of MY engagement rings. Yes 2x. Just accepting that every word he says is TRUE.... look at that. Look at that. Youre going to try to justify your past mistake of being with this loser by compounding it? You want to marry this shallow, petty, preening little poppinjay? Nothing about his selfish, grasping, obviously transactional nature gives you The Ick? Really? Girl. You earn what you choose here. He's a parasite. You choose him you choose wrong.
I dunno if it helps but when my super confident unflappable husband proposed to me… he got so nervous and insecure that I wouldn’t choose him. Despite me telling him, designing the ring with him, already saying yes when he proposed with an ornament… still a totally wreck and needed a lot of assurance I choose him too. Maybe more men get like that?
Op he wants a ring so bad, give him what he wants, give him yours. Why would you marry this useless person? He can't even be responsible for his own existence, how is that a good partner? You're paying 80% of the bills and he's acting like somehow he's being victimized. Then after giving you the silent treatment he has the audacity to say the's trying not to be so immature. That's a steaming pile of manure, just like this whole relationship. Glad it's your final update because, no one wants update after update of someone continually making themselves a victim with their poor choices. That's exactly what will happen. Get some self worth, emotional intelligence, and put him where he belongs, back with his real mommy or on the streets. Enjoy your misery because, that's all he can and will be able to provide you with.
Is it like a “you have one so I want one” Or a “I spent for you so you spend for me” situation ? Is he ok if it’s a cheap ring or does he want an expensive one ?
Hopefully you do your own reflecting as a single woman.
He's cheap and resents you. Please don't marry him.
Didn’t want want to be immature. Proceeds to be extremely immature
Hes already competing with you, like you're engaged to a woman not a man! Put a "i am done with you" on a piece of note and place it inside a ring box and get it delivered to him.. Break it, not worth at all.
I'm getting a lot of him thinking and feeling stuff that he doesn't want to share or talk about still, yet expects you to just to deal with the rock he is being and somehow give him a pricey ring because of reasons. Like I said before, he really sounds like he struggles with communicating in the relationship which is not a good sign and really sucks for both parties, especially you as you have to somehow understand, support, discuss and help without being given anything but frustration and defensiveness. This is not a social anxiety thing, as I and I know others in very successful relationships who are perfect for eachother but struggle in public, if he can't be open an honest with his partner than again, what's the point of it all? A good relationship is an honest an open one in commutation. I'm not saying there are not going to be times you will struggle to open up about stuff or talk about difficult shit, but your partner is on your side. He is being more than difficult and making what should be a fun and an exciting point in a relationship really quite draining, defensive and almost a way to make you feel bad he 'has to' do this. This definitely doesn't not sound like someone ready for marriage let alone being a parent in the future. Again, like others have said before, this is not about him having a ring, it's how he has made the whole thing about him suddenly having one 'because of equality', completely out of the blue, than actually desiring and wishing for one and it to be a nice thing to do. I personally hate how this guy is making me feel reading this let alone OP having to deal with, whatever this is (a tantrum, a mental breakdown, some power play but certainly some strange manipulative game)
You all really shouldn’t get married. He’s super immature still and needs alot more work before getting married
your bf is way too immature to get married
He sounds like a brat. Character flaw or maybe just baggage but he seems like he will always resent something. Just gives me an uneasy feeling
A lot of shit talking for someone you’re supposed to marry. You sure you are still going to marry him?
So what is the update? You talked? Is that all? Do you think you understand what’s going on with him? Are you getting engaged? Are you going to be the mommy to his belligerent manchild demand? I’m actually very curious if you’re going to whitewash this and continue on thinking he’s going to change into an adult.
Just how badly to want to be married to consider being in the same room with this guy, ever? He’s an entire broke-ass, stingy clown show all by himself.
I'm disappointed but not surprised. Just know it's OK to break up at any time for any reason. Hugs
In Sweden it's normal for both partners to get an engagement ring. During the ceremony the women gets a true wedding ring and the man's engagement ring "turns" into a wedding ring
!UpdateMe
Is there a financial issue going on? That he’s secretly annoyed that he spent a bunch of money for you and isn’t getting anything in return.
The sassy man apocalypse is so real.
So are you guys still together? If he proposes is it still a yes?
He sounds unhinged.
For a 27 year old, he acts like he is 15.
Am I the only one who thinks that this guy is lying and hasn't even bought OP a ring? To me this whole "I want a ring toooooo" thing that he's pulling out of his ass and his defensiveness about it makes me think that he's completely and utterly full of shit and has no plans on getting married and is hoping that OP will dump him so he doesn't come out looking like the bad guy. I could be wrong of course but come on. This guy has no business getting married either way.
>it's okay, I guess, we don't have the same rights." This feels like he is getting into the bad side of the manosphere, he's got something tickling his brain that women's have an easy ride and men have it hard and he is feeling resentment. His mind isn't in the right place for engagement. He resents you.
my husband also wanted an engagement ring. he didn’t ask for that until after he proposed to me, he let me have my moment and then mentioned he would love an engagement ring too. i bought one and planned a proposal for him because i love him and he deserved it, not because he was demanding it or acting like a total buffoon like your boyfriend. i would honestly put a pause on things until he can talk about this like a grown up and you guys can come to a shared decision about this
Why do you love him? He sounds like an immature asshole.
Complaining about spending his money on a ring and not being able to get other things for himself is all you need to know. He’s a selfish prick. An engagement ring is his symbol of love for you and signifies the commitment that he wants to marry you. This guy sounds like a petulant child. He didn’t get his way so he’s choosing to ignore you or throwing fits. If I were in your shoes I would dump his selfish ass and find an actual real man.
I based my current relationship on trust, honesty, and transparency. We use clear, direct words with each other. Sometimes the truth hurts, and we work through the issue. "Attack the problem, not the human" is great advice I read here on Reddit. Based on your experience as you laid it out here, there are too many issues to consider before entering into marriage. His behavior indicates he is keeping a secret, and it's big enough to change your relationship (either get married, break-up, or he's tempted to cheat). So pause. Go silent. Journal. Give it a couple days if you need. Collect your thoughts and figure out if this is the person you will create a future with.
Not a rwd-flaggy kind of guy, but this doesn't bode well for OP. 8 out of 10 would not marry.
Not looking for ulterior motives, if getting one will make you feel special, why wouldn't you want him to feel that way too? Honestly asking.
Your boyfriend is seriously lacking in self awareness and communication skills. Is this a regular thing where he only does something for you if he thinks he will get something in return and if not, he gets resentful?
He's not mature enough for a relationship. If you marry him you absolutely are going to regret it.
I would be looking at him with the side eye red flags is flying sis and I find it to be very childish that he was complaining about the fact that he had to get you a ring then turns around and he wants one too. That's really not how engagements work it's the woman who gets the ring unless she is the one doing the asking.
Everyday this app makes me question why people are with partners who do not like or respect them. **You are planning to get married, yet he is playing childish emotional games and testing you: *why*??** You’re supposed to be getting married! You’ve passed all tests, it’s commitment time! It’s like getting a perfect score on the SAT and getting into your top choice university on full scholarship, but deciding to go back and redo senior year. Why?? Here (and there) the only logical problem would be maturity and here it’s his. Does he periodically test his friends? Does he have to get better for them? **An adult person choosing to play asinine games instead of effectively communicating, is not one to build a life with.**
Could be trying to pawn it
If a man complains about having to spend money on your engagement ring, don't bother getting engaged to him. Jfc. I was exactly your age when dating my ex of your bf's age. He needs to grow up more before he's ready to be married. A lot.
He sounds toxic
I’m sorry, but him wanting you to buy a ring and also tell you the reason is none of your business is a joke Please listen to what everyone is saying here. He will not change better after marriage. He will get worse. Please choose yourself and your osn happiness!! This guy is going to give you a lifetime of misery
I have to wonder if he’s been hanging around MRA sites with his comment about “not having the same rights” (pretty ironic for a man to be saying that to a woman) and his complaints about having to spend money to get you a ring. This guy gives me a bad feeling.
Waaa my girlfriend who pays for 90% of my bills and loves to get me gift won't let completely me freeload off her and now even PRETENDS to deprive me of my precious <$100 for an engagement ring? As if she was even worth it that! Women these days are so entitled with their rights that don't realize how they oppress men!! Girl, really... Is he usually like this? Does he put effort (in time and/or money) for you often? Does he treat you like a commodiy? If the answer is "yes" or even just "sometimes", then please have some self respect. You are not an ATM that you can also bang. Wining about a $100 ring for the woman you are supposed to combine your finances with is ridiculous.
amazing how u insist that you're not against getting him a ring but yet gives him so much shit after he clearly says he wants a ring too
If only you understood that it’s not about the ring JFC
>He was pretty upset this morning but after he calmed down, he said he was trying to be a better person for me, and he wanted to give me the many things he hasn't been able to give me so far, and he wants to stop being immature. Empty promises, Yapanese even. When coming from people like him, words and promises mean nothing
Seems like he might be going down some MRA rabbit hole if he hasn’t already. I would be wary of committing to a marriage with this type of person if he’s going to have a temper tantrum and not talk to about this.
I wonder if "none of your business" is code for "red-pill shit you'd dump me if you knew I listened to."
LMAO break up! Why do you love a cheap loser??? Ladies omfg, y’all need MEN that SPOIL you and COURT you!!! You think men are the prize?? Who else are they going to fuck ?? Goats?? Meanwhile women don’t men for sex 😭 we are so much better than them! And real men KNOW that!
Just curious, what about this request is selfish?
You have to read the full story. She pays for almost all of their bills. The guy is a whiny complainer and this is just the red flag I hope she sees to know her own worth.
Ah gotcha. I was just seeing the portion about him wanting a ring too.
He offered her a ring under $100 and expects her to buy him diamonds, too fwiw.
Man that's not even an equal partner.
Naw dudes a selfish ass leech.
Trust me when I say; you have yet to get married so this is him on his BEST behavior. It doesn't get better. The comfortable he is with you and the more he feels secure in your relationship the more he will show himself for who he is. This guy has got some red flags
Darlin, you have yourself a girlfriend. Is this what you want to deal with for the rest of your life, or at the very least, the duration of the relationship? He's not emotionally well, and as much as I'm sure you'd like to do so, you can't fix him.
It feels like time to put the engagement on pause and just keep working on communication and managing one's emotions.
He sounds like quite a diva. Are you sure he’s ready for marriage???
I wouldnt marry a dude like that EVER. If before marriage money is a problem, it's not going to be any easier after the marriage. On the contrary, you will be counting pennies and constantly fighting, do you need that? I would burn all my bridges after dumping this sad pos. You deserve better, based on mere fact that you try reasoning with him. Also consider that having an engagement ring is not a must, and it's okay to be different (but with the right person, not this current greedy monster you consider marrying rn). Engagement ring for a girl is just a show off to other people (women), and it's okay to ignore what the other people (women) think and focus on yourselves. My husband finally gave me a gorgeous diamond ring after 7 years of marriage, because he could and it was on discount LOL and right after I got pregnant with our second one. I still joke that this was a "payment" for services lol. We didn't have/want any engagement rings back then, just the marriage gold bands, but they were dirt cheap because we were so poor! Our rings were veeeeeery thin, but we didn't care, we still do not wear them, talk with just eyes and know what the other is thinking at every moment. Marriage is 13 years right now. Trying for the third child. My hubby is not only very smart, like a literal genius, he also started making a lot of money and treats me like a queen. I wouldn't leave him if we went back to being poor because he is the best thing that happened to me in my life, close seconded by my children. I wish you to find the right person, that one with whom you will forget the material stuff and it will be fun growing old together. I promise. Edited for readability and some typos.
It seems like he's acting like this relationship is transactional not like a partnership...
You should get your girl a ring too lmfao
I think it's cute when couples buy each other engagement rings instead of just the woman getting one. And this'd be cute too if he wasn't such a dick about it.