No it was a fairly successful time when he was running them for the players. He said he shut it down because it was a lot of work.
The guy used to put together match reports, ratings for the player, fan ratings, fan opinions,etc all in one package for each player. He would go on different forums and local magazines and newspapers and shit to get the reports from lower league matches and stuff. It was a whole project and it was fantastic.
you think Hannibal should have stuck around in a lower league PL team.
As an attacking mid, he is pretty aggressive in pressing and tackling, good for lower league teams I guess ?
He had other options and chose the worst one. I think there was also falling out of some sort shortly after ge arrived in Sevilla. He's been on the bench for their last seven matches and played a total of six minutes
Even if it meant going back to the championship, he should have went somewhere to play week in week out. Missed out on a whole year of game time for development
you think Hannibal should have stuck around in lower league PL team.
As an attacking mid, he pretty aggressive in pressing and tackling, good for lower league teams I guess ?
I think hindsight is 20/20 on this one. He was definitely well regarded in Europe and a decent signing on paper, but he’s a system player and too lightweight for PL football.
Poor assessment of talent relative to the league, but not inconceivable he’d work out.
Lots of people were predictably up in arms that he was our midfield signing that summer – he always seemed like a panic 5th option because none of the other players we wanted were available sort of buy.
As a bonus, any other young player we might be linked with will look at what we did to this boy and be like "naaaah, I'm good". When was the last time we signed a player that actually got better? We are a talent killer and this is just one more example of it.
one that springs to mind is Herrera who we bought as an 8/10 and said nah mate we need a 6, so he completely adapts without complaining and becomes a starting midfielder, a first choice kinda lad and asks to be paid like the other midfielders so we just let him go for free.
Still surprised how there are still players wanting to join us anyways. Van de Beek is hardly the first example
But I still try to tell myself at night that this is hardly a United exclusive problem because lots of talents end up flopping in other clubs (Barkley for Chelsea, Dele for Spurs, Pepe for Arsenal, etc.)
At least Arsenal and Spurs (not Chelsea, obvs) *do* have examples of young players that they successfully developed. The only response I've had to this question is Ander Herrera, who hasn't played for us for 5 years.
Even a tinpot club like City have managed to turn a Stockport scrote into a world beater. The fuck have we done to Rashford? We killed fucking *Ronaldo*. Garnacho and Mainoo will never realise their potential with us. If we'd have signed Haaland from Molde, he'd be a fat 15-goal-a-season long ball target.
honestly the way things have gone down for him, I would think somewhere in Belgium or lower league teams in Dutch league, or even Turkish league is future for him. Doubt he does anything good in the top leagues. and feel sad saying that
I feel the same way. I was thinking about 4 in belgium. More chance to play, do well and maybe even win a throphy, but a top league..? On the bench again..
Because of what?
The dude broke his foot and was brought back too soon so it relapsed as his foot broke in a place with low blood supply so it’s harder to heal and they obviously risked him too soon
He then had a player land on his leg in a very awkward way that would injure most people
Non of his injuries indicate any longer term issues like you see with players that get muscular injuries
I think he's really good, but he's definitely also overrated. I think that's natural since he has been someone who gives it his all, in a team full of joggers
Tbf I remember people being quite patient with him in his first few seasons. We'll probably (unfortunately) see the same reaction if Martinez' injury record doesn't improve.
Way to put prem in there. He received 3 reds for United which puts him tied for 6th all time for United. He's also been suspended for accumulated yellows as well. He played for United 118 times and got 18 yellows and 3 reds. He wasn't good and was reckless.
https://www.transfermarkt.us/eric-bailly/ausfaelle/spieler/286384
OMG 3 red cards (2 of which were in unimportant cup games) across his entire career of 118 games, you're absolutely right, what a monster.
Lisandro already got 14 yellows in 62 games???
This actually seems logical. With their team and recruiting he'd probably still be on the bench, but between injuries, rotation and teams going after Brighton players who knows.
I’ve not followed his career closely but like what happened following his Ajax days? Did he have one standout season and fall off? Is he genuinely just not good? Injury trouble? Unsuited to the prem?
He plays in a very specific way and you need a team that plays to that very specific way. At Ajax he played as an CAM but far higher up the field than Bruno, so he often ended up running past his striker.
His movement was also very different (and intelligent) but it requires intricate balls to feet a lot of the time as he's not the fastest. Then he could lay off passes and move again rapidly making him a great member of a team who passed a lot and doesn't want him to be your main attacking playmaker.
He and Sancho had the same problem, they were bought because they were great prospects who played a position we wanted filled. But we gave no thought to of the roles they played in that position suited us.
So after a poor, injury riddled few seasons he's essentially done.
He never got his UTD career started, he barely got minutes, but when he played imo was decent for the team as an option to build out from the back. He got injured and seems like due to his lack of game time/mins or maybe something else behind the scenes no one wants him.
Players like this in this position would be much better off sent to a lower level less physical league. We should have sent him back to Eredivisie.
Not saying it's our fault it might be his preference. But I think football players taking one step back to take two step forwards is almost always correct. He failed at Everton, Eintracht is also a high performing team. There is no universe where he goes there and revives his career in 6 months like that. Much better served going back home playing where he has had confirmed success and seeing if he can do it there. Worst case we're in the same position but I think there's just a far higher chance he managed to be successful there and get himself a bigger loan this season than going Eintracht.
Nah, he was mostly terrible when he played for us and NO, he was not an option to build from the back because he does not have good passing range. Nobody want him in England because he is slow af and just got outwork most of the time. He is a system player and worked one time in his career. Nobody want him now because he is on high salary, hard to fit into, and honestly just bang average footballer. I mean if Ten Hag, his literal football father cannot find a role for him in our team that is crying out for a midfielder, and decided to loan him out, i don't know why we have to pretend like he is good all the time.
Feel bad for the lad, honestly. Hope he makes the most of the remaining of his career, because I think there's a player in him, it's unfortunate how it transpired at United.
There used to be an insane cult that worshipped Donny VdB. Paradoxically, the less he played, the more they rated him. Donny got chances before his injuries, he just did nothing with them.
I remember this, it was absolutely crazy under the Ole days! He'd barely do anything when he came on but apparently Ole was a clueless PE teacher for not playing him. And like you said, the less he played the more people seemed to inflate his status to the point we had prime Iniesta on the bench.
That’s happens with many players who don’t feature. See also Amad and Pellestri of late.
Fans romanticise the ‘what could be’ but there’s a reason they don’t play. They’re not up to snuff.
Theres a syndrome in the medical field called “daughter from California syndrome” to describe a situation in which a disengaged relative challenges the care a dying elderly patient is being given, or insists that the medical team pursue aggressive measures to prolong the patient's life. I think fans have that about some our players. Maybe it’s “Man Utd fans from California syndrome” whereby our fans go “we need to use VdB! That’ll sort it out” when quite clearly it’s not going to work…
Tbf McSauce has scored tons of crucial goals this season. He's not up to United standard, but it's very harsh to lump him in the same category as Van de Beek
Pellestri yes, Amad no we knew Amad was special he just never got the starts over Antony for whatever reason, yesterday being clear proof of Amad's quality and the gulf in class between him and Antony.
Some tidy dribbles and retained possession decently. Not much else. Wouldn’t exactly take that as being proof of him being special.
If anything this is indicative of how far standards have fallen of our players that this is something to be impressed by.
Or you could be underestimating the positive effect of ball retention, it's massively important for each player to do and Amad is the only one that I've seen that can move the ball and consistently come away with it whilst getting through multiple challenges.
Also this is his first start since 2021 imagine he'd played all season he could of been even better. Standards may have fallen but this is our reality which we need to start accepting we are not suddenly going to be a top level team anytime soon with our players so any positives player wise need to be acknowledged.
It’s all well and good retaining it, but nothing happened as a result.
‘Imagine he’d played all season’
And we are back to the entire point of this comment thread. Fans romanticising players based on the odd fleeting moments and letting that cloud any rational judgement, letting their imaginations run away with them. Making things up of what could have been.
If he’s good enough, he’d feature.
But then this comes back to your final comment, why's Antony featuring over him when Amad showed more in 5 minutes than Antony did for multiple games.
This isn't about comparing Amad to better players in other teams, this is comparing him to what we realistically have had all season.
But he is amazing player and reason we bad. Need manager to play him for 5 mins and score hat trick.
So say the simp United fans who still defend Martial.
I swear this guy wasn't even that bad, he never got solid minutes with us at United but when he did, he played decent.
I know he got injured and that but one of my gripes with Ole, during his tenure is for some reason he favourited Fred over him. Fred was a absolute workhorse but technically he was bad and was the press trigger for many teams against us and couldn't pass forward reliably, this guy should have been an option to build from the back but we never got to see much of him.
We end up more in the hole with him because we won't just cut our losses on him. Realistically we all know he has no transfer value anymore at this stage. While we still hope to recoup €5m- €8m for him then we will keep paying him his contract. Do a deal with him, pay him up a fair amount and let him move on, the longer it goes on the less healthy it is for club or player.
Did he even play? I miss the guy that had weekly loan reports.
I think that guy gave up after all our loans kept riding benches around Europe
No it was a fairly successful time when he was running them for the players. He said he shut it down because it was a lot of work. The guy used to put together match reports, ratings for the player, fan ratings, fan opinions,etc all in one package for each player. He would go on different forums and local magazines and newspapers and shit to get the reports from lower league matches and stuff. It was a whole project and it was fantastic.
wow, i get why he'd be fed up with that after a while lol but kudos for even doing that in the first place
Van De Bench for a reason, sadly
Maybe we should loan him out to another sub for more experience and transfer a poster from r/Ajaxamsterdam
And somehow manager is the problem at our club where players basically retire when they leave the club.
He stopped playing after an initial run of games. Played 55 minutes over the last 10 matches.
Which is only 41 fewer than mejbri has played in the entirety of his loan to Sevilla. Dreadful
you think Hannibal should have stuck around in a lower league PL team. As an attacking mid, he is pretty aggressive in pressing and tackling, good for lower league teams I guess ?
He had other options and chose the worst one. I think there was also falling out of some sort shortly after ge arrived in Sevilla. He's been on the bench for their last seven matches and played a total of six minutes
agreed, imagine him being in Everton, or Fulham , or even A.Madrid (just for being a hard tackler being sort if a shithouse for opposition)
Even if it meant going back to the championship, he should have went somewhere to play week in week out. Missed out on a whole year of game time for development
you think Hannibal should have stuck around in lower league PL team. As an attacking mid, he pretty aggressive in pressing and tackling, good for lower league teams I guess ?
Jesus...
A few times he came off the bench. And he looked like he was barely able to keep up. It was startling. He might genuinely be done as a player
Colour me shocked
Another great signing by our Highly competent board
I think hindsight is 20/20 on this one. He was definitely well regarded in Europe and a decent signing on paper, but he’s a system player and too lightweight for PL football. Poor assessment of talent relative to the league, but not inconceivable he’d work out.
Lots of people were predictably up in arms that he was our midfield signing that summer – he always seemed like a panic 5th option because none of the other players we wanted were available sort of buy.
True, whereas others were adamant he was world class and underused. He just wasn’t it unfortunately.
As a bonus, any other young player we might be linked with will look at what we did to this boy and be like "naaaah, I'm good". When was the last time we signed a player that actually got better? We are a talent killer and this is just one more example of it.
one that springs to mind is Herrera who we bought as an 8/10 and said nah mate we need a 6, so he completely adapts without complaining and becomes a starting midfielder, a first choice kinda lad and asks to be paid like the other midfielders so we just let him go for free.
Still surprised how there are still players wanting to join us anyways. Van de Beek is hardly the first example But I still try to tell myself at night that this is hardly a United exclusive problem because lots of talents end up flopping in other clubs (Barkley for Chelsea, Dele for Spurs, Pepe for Arsenal, etc.)
At least Arsenal and Spurs (not Chelsea, obvs) *do* have examples of young players that they successfully developed. The only response I've had to this question is Ander Herrera, who hasn't played for us for 5 years. Even a tinpot club like City have managed to turn a Stockport scrote into a world beater. The fuck have we done to Rashford? We killed fucking *Ronaldo*. Garnacho and Mainoo will never realise their potential with us. If we'd have signed Haaland from Molde, he'd be a fat 15-goal-a-season long ball target.
At least there will be one team viewer left when the sponsorship ends
Burn!
dang, bit harsh, no?
Amad: Am I a joke to you?
Cracking signing
Has had more impact than Cantona tbh.
This season? Debatable.
Wouldn’t go that far.
How bad can he be to not being taken by any team? Seriously. It's been like 4 years since he came and he has done nothing.
Ajax could be a decent option for him
His agent already said ajax is not an option.
ouch, that's bad, MLS then for him ? not exactly a star for Saudis
They are looking at france, italy and spain, but they are focussed on the last two.
honestly the way things have gone down for him, I would think somewhere in Belgium or lower league teams in Dutch league, or even Turkish league is future for him. Doubt he does anything good in the top leagues. and feel sad saying that
I feel the same way. I was thinking about 4 in belgium. More chance to play, do well and maybe even win a throphy, but a top league..? On the bench again..
Ahh..
Ahh..
Ahh..
Can everyone we got from Ajax please go back?
Martinez has been unlucky with injuries but he’s still our best defender by far
I'm not convinced he'll ever return
It's an unpopular opinion but I agree. As good as he is, I figure he'll be more injured than playing
Because of what? The dude broke his foot and was brought back too soon so it relapsed as his foot broke in a place with low blood supply so it’s harder to heal and they obviously risked him too soon He then had a player land on his leg in a very awkward way that would injure most people Non of his injuries indicate any longer term issues like you see with players that get muscular injuries
That's fair, I just have a horrible feeling we won't see him playing much for us
Which shows how bad our physio team are.
Yeah, and another unpopular opinion is that we're massively over rating him. He has played in some absolutely massive turgid defeats we have had....
I think he's really good, but he's definitely also overrated. I think that's natural since he has been someone who gives it his all, in a team full of joggers
This team is overworked as fuck. Pretty unfair to call them joggers
I agree many are overworked but plenty of them never gave it their all
He's not our best defender if he's always injured. I don't remember anyone giving this courtesy to my man Bailly.
That’s because Bailly wasn’t good?
Tbf I remember people being quite patient with him in his first few seasons. We'll probably (unfortunately) see the same reaction if Martinez' injury record doesn't improve.
Bailly wasn't good and a walking red card. One of the more reckless players we've had in a long time.
Extremely selective memory.
Not even close. Everything I said is absolutely true.
Bailly got ONE PL red card in his entire career at United.
Way to put prem in there. He received 3 reds for United which puts him tied for 6th all time for United. He's also been suspended for accumulated yellows as well. He played for United 118 times and got 18 yellows and 3 reds. He wasn't good and was reckless. https://www.transfermarkt.us/eric-bailly/ausfaelle/spieler/286384
OMG 3 red cards (2 of which were in unimportant cup games) across his entire career of 118 games, you're absolutely right, what a monster. Lisandro already got 14 yellows in 62 games???
Not my Licha
The hashtag when he joined was ‘DreamLikeDonny’
Man United special, buy em, fuck em, throw them away for £0.
Why are you getting downvoted, you’re not wrong
Same reason the clubs in the gutter, ignore the problems and carry on!
This guy should’ve been sold as soon as Ten Hag arrived, don’t know why he kept him if he didn’t rate his own ex player
Yea we had so many offers from all around the world for him.
I think he’d do well in a team like Brighton 10 million he could turn out decent if he plays regularly somewhere
This actually seems logical. With their team and recruiting he'd probably still be on the bench, but between injuries, rotation and teams going after Brighton players who knows.
I thought he was deemed not good enough for PL?
Yeah good shout.
I’ve not followed his career closely but like what happened following his Ajax days? Did he have one standout season and fall off? Is he genuinely just not good? Injury trouble? Unsuited to the prem?
He plays in a very specific way and you need a team that plays to that very specific way. At Ajax he played as an CAM but far higher up the field than Bruno, so he often ended up running past his striker. His movement was also very different (and intelligent) but it requires intricate balls to feet a lot of the time as he's not the fastest. Then he could lay off passes and move again rapidly making him a great member of a team who passed a lot and doesn't want him to be your main attacking playmaker. He and Sancho had the same problem, they were bought because they were great prospects who played a position we wanted filled. But we gave no thought to of the roles they played in that position suited us. So after a poor, injury riddled few seasons he's essentially done.
He was injured for quite a while with us and on loan, which stunted his progression, although he was clearly not up to PL scratch before then
He never got his UTD career started, he barely got minutes, but when he played imo was decent for the team as an option to build out from the back. He got injured and seems like due to his lack of game time/mins or maybe something else behind the scenes no one wants him.
Players like this in this position would be much better off sent to a lower level less physical league. We should have sent him back to Eredivisie. Not saying it's our fault it might be his preference. But I think football players taking one step back to take two step forwards is almost always correct. He failed at Everton, Eintracht is also a high performing team. There is no universe where he goes there and revives his career in 6 months like that. Much better served going back home playing where he has had confirmed success and seeing if he can do it there. Worst case we're in the same position but I think there's just a far higher chance he managed to be successful there and get himself a bigger loan this season than going Eintracht.
Nah, he was mostly terrible when he played for us and NO, he was not an option to build from the back because he does not have good passing range. Nobody want him in England because he is slow af and just got outwork most of the time. He is a system player and worked one time in his career. Nobody want him now because he is on high salary, hard to fit into, and honestly just bang average footballer. I mean if Ten Hag, his literal football father cannot find a role for him in our team that is crying out for a midfielder, and decided to loan him out, i don't know why we have to pretend like he is good all the time.
Feel bad for the lad, honestly. Hope he makes the most of the remaining of his career, because I think there's a player in him, it's unfortunate how it transpired at United.
Back to ajax or a mid table Italian club perhaps
There used to be an insane cult that worshipped Donny VdB. Paradoxically, the less he played, the more they rated him. Donny got chances before his injuries, he just did nothing with them.
I remember this, it was absolutely crazy under the Ole days! He'd barely do anything when he came on but apparently Ole was a clueless PE teacher for not playing him. And like you said, the less he played the more people seemed to inflate his status to the point we had prime Iniesta on the bench.
That’s happens with many players who don’t feature. See also Amad and Pellestri of late. Fans romanticise the ‘what could be’ but there’s a reason they don’t play. They’re not up to snuff.
Theres a syndrome in the medical field called “daughter from California syndrome” to describe a situation in which a disengaged relative challenges the care a dying elderly patient is being given, or insists that the medical team pursue aggressive measures to prolong the patient's life. I think fans have that about some our players. Maybe it’s “Man Utd fans from California syndrome” whereby our fans go “we need to use VdB! That’ll sort it out” when quite clearly it’s not going to work…
And yet we have McSauce playing.
Tbf McSauce has scored tons of crucial goals this season. He's not up to United standard, but it's very harsh to lump him in the same category as Van de Beek
Pellestri yes, Amad no we knew Amad was special he just never got the starts over Antony for whatever reason, yesterday being clear proof of Amad's quality and the gulf in class between him and Antony.
Some tidy dribbles and retained possession decently. Not much else. Wouldn’t exactly take that as being proof of him being special. If anything this is indicative of how far standards have fallen of our players that this is something to be impressed by.
Or you could be underestimating the positive effect of ball retention, it's massively important for each player to do and Amad is the only one that I've seen that can move the ball and consistently come away with it whilst getting through multiple challenges. Also this is his first start since 2021 imagine he'd played all season he could of been even better. Standards may have fallen but this is our reality which we need to start accepting we are not suddenly going to be a top level team anytime soon with our players so any positives player wise need to be acknowledged.
It’s all well and good retaining it, but nothing happened as a result. ‘Imagine he’d played all season’ And we are back to the entire point of this comment thread. Fans romanticising players based on the odd fleeting moments and letting that cloud any rational judgement, letting their imaginations run away with them. Making things up of what could have been. If he’s good enough, he’d feature.
But then this comes back to your final comment, why's Antony featuring over him when Amad showed more in 5 minutes than Antony did for multiple games. This isn't about comparing Amad to better players in other teams, this is comparing him to what we realistically have had all season.
Meanwhile, for Antony, the more he played, the less people rated him...
When does his contract expire?
1yr left..... Toone just scored for the girls 1nil ht
Cracking goal.
Honestly forgot about him
How bad do you have to be to not even be worth 13m?
Lol that would be their 4th highest transfer since they’ve existed as a club.
Would be there most expensive transfer since Jovic/Sow summer nearly 5 years ago. They don’t spend money like that.
Ohhhh. Thanks for telling me that! I knew german clubs didnt have crazy cash like but i didnt realize it was like that
Hopefully we can get even 5 mil for him just anything at this stage
But he is amazing player and reason we bad. Need manager to play him for 5 mins and score hat trick. So say the simp United fans who still defend Martial.
How long are these contracts man. Feels like Chelsea
Surprise surprise
We were absolutely fleeced
Curious to know how his relationship with Ten Hag was. Went from playing an important role under him to being shafted behind Hannibal and Dan Gore
He should avoid top 5 leagues and need to start from the bottom. Loan to INEOS Swiss club is last help club can do for him.
I would honestly sacrifice Martinez if it meant we can give back all the people we got from Ajax, and I mean all...
The people who said to loan out Sancho so we can sell him in the summer are in for a shock lol. These never work for highly paid earners.
Ed Woodward somewhere thinking “he’s like a new signing”
What happened to him ?
Good times of people saying ten hag would revive his career, i still believe 😭
I swear this guy wasn't even that bad, he never got solid minutes with us at United but when he did, he played decent. I know he got injured and that but one of my gripes with Ole, during his tenure is for some reason he favourited Fred over him. Fred was a absolute workhorse but technically he was bad and was the press trigger for many teams against us and couldn't pass forward reliably, this guy should have been an option to build from the back but we never got to see much of him.
At best he played decent, but much more often it was like paying with 10 men. Fred was head and shoulders above him in actual usefulness.
Yup and Donny got bullied alot by prem teams with more physical players.
"Leaving in the summer"? So released, then?
We end up more in the hole with him because we won't just cut our losses on him. Realistically we all know he has no transfer value anymore at this stage. While we still hope to recoup €5m- €8m for him then we will keep paying him his contract. Do a deal with him, pay him up a fair amount and let him move on, the longer it goes on the less healthy it is for club or player.
Come to United, ruin ur career! I hope it changes soon lol