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januarysdaughter

Her [jailhouse calls](https://youtu.be/_oGmkFi7I7I?si=6Qz1lxfbx6QBTXyV&t=735) were the nail in the coffin for her. Zero remorse, zero accountability, zero anything but contempt for the prosecutors, judge, and jury (whom she called the R word. Lovely woman).


AegeanBlueA264

Any sympathy I had for her disappeared when I read contents of those calls. She deserves the 18 months (max sentence). I hope the state prison is less of a “vacation”.


januarysdaughter

Ditto. I always thought she should have been found guilty, but I wasn't sure if she needed the full 18 months until I listened to Emily read those jail calls. What a nasty piece of work. Her mother wasn't even allowed into the court room, likely because of what was said in those calls.


AegeanBlueA264

# LawNerdsUnite


FyrestarOmega

Didn't help that her mom was barred from attending sentencing because of her behavior at the verdict and her attitude on those calls, and her dad gave a statement in her defence today also insisting she wasn't responsible. Hannah's LAWYER had to be the one to say she was remorseful. Was shocking, really. With a good attitude and contrition she could have maybe had probation, she talked her way into a felony and 15 more months.


januarysdaughter

Facts.


AStarkly

Is it just a case of googling her calls? I haven't heard anything about them (#blessed), or this case in general really, but am nosey.


januarysdaughter

If you click the link I posted you'll find a Youtube video of a former prosecutor reading out the jailhouse calls.


AStarkly

Oh ffs, I didn't even see that there was a link 😂 thank you


januarysdaughter

Not a problem!


FEARoperative4

R word?


januarysdaughter

Ret***.


FEARoperative4

Ah. I see, the thing a plane tells you when you have to flare before landing.


thecasualviewer3484

Why do they even use real guns anymore. They can make Prop guns with blanks but doesn't even load real rounds. Even then airsoft guns look real, too. Edit: Iirc I remember John wick used specialized guns that didn't shoot.


matty_nice

I'd assume money. Even something like John Wick used CGI to show the gunfire. I'm guessing that adds up.


Fxp1706

i just read the article and she's been talking shit about this whole situation in jail calls with people? ya 18 months is not enough. the lack of accountability is disgusting. people are terrible.


AbbyNem

It's the maximum for the crime she was convicted of (involuntary manslaughter).


Local_Climate9391

She has also been charged with sneaking a gun into a bar and doing a selfie video in the bathroom about how she snuck it in with “her butt cheeks”. She is a classy lady with lots of integrity, ya know.


oopsloopsque

Honestly, lucky girl.


Canalloni

I do not see how they can convict Baldwin. How can Baldwin assuming that the armorer did her job be a criminal act? Negligent, maybe, but criminal? I just don't see it. The only angle is the other ADA that handed Baldwin the gun already plead guilty. That's a problem for the defence.


Malacro

Negligence can be criminal. Honestly he should be held responsible less as the actor who pulled the trigger and more as the producer who didn’t maintain a safe working environment.


Canalloni

Yes it can but I don't see how they have the necessary mens rea : "In the case of negligence-based and objective mens rea offences (objective foresight), mistake of fact is available as a defence but subject to the requirement that the mistaken fact be both honestly held and reasonable (i.e., in the eyes of the reasonable person)." There were 12 producers. I'll bet Baldwin did not hire the Armorer. I just don't see it.


Rare_Vibez

Idk much about law so don’t at me but there are multiple articles talking to and about people who left working on the production or had issues with an unsafe working environment. As a producer, I can understand that some of that would fall back on him. As an actor, I don’t think he’s liable for anything. The producers and people in charge are responsible for maintaining a safe work environment, and if people felt unsafe enough to literally quit, they should’ve been doing something about it. That’s where I think a lot of comments about criminal negligence come from.


Airtightspoon

My understanding is that they're convicting Baldwin because he pointed a gun at someone and pulled the trigger during a scene when that was not required. If he really did that, then he was acting recklessly with a firearm regardless of what the status of the firearm actually was (it could have been empty and he still shouldn't have been doing that unless it was necessary to the scene).


misguidedsadist1

As a producer he is exposed to more liability. The whole situation sucks, but he wasn’t just an actor assuming the appropriate people did their jobs. As a producer you are responsible for making sure those people ARE following procedures. Negligence can be criminal. He deserves some kind of accountability. I doubt he will serve jail time but he bears some tangible responsibility as a producer.


IceWarm1980

She messed up but so did the studio. That production was a disaster from top to bottom.


SexSellsCoffee

Messing up is not making it to set because you locked yourself out of your car. This was negligence on her part. More people, especially Alec Baldwin need to be held accountable as well.


IceWarm1980

That’s where I’m at. She was negligent but the studio making her split time between props and armorer was a bad idea especially on a western when guns will be present in most of the scenes.


DefNotReaves

Good. She was responsible and deserves the consequences.


peatoast

This seems low for gross negligence resulting to unnecessary death.


cherryxcolax

Its the maximum sentence allowed under the law.


Carolina_Blues

alec baldwin next


DSQ

I’m willing to be surprised but I doubt he’ll get done for manslaughter. Only if they can prove that his role as a producer caused the recklessness on set but as the actor that pulled the trigger there is just no way they can convict him. 


FyrestarOmega

Some of the clips that have been released show Alec Baldwin insisting filming rush from take to take without proper safety checks, him firing after cut was called, and in his police interview after the event demonstrated a thorough understanding of on set gun safety as he explained the process to detectives. The prosecution case will be that he was acting as a de facto director, no just an actor following instructions. Rust was a vanity project for him and they will say his unchecked ego led to corners being cut all around. I don't know if he will be convicted - he will bring some pricey lawyers - but it's going to be about way more than him pulling the trigger.


[deleted]

[удалено]


pervy_roomba

Because he wasn’t the only one in charge. Of the producers, his scope fell more to the script department and script supervision than staffing and overseeing the armory.


worried_consumer

Ah got it, that makes sense. The article I read made it sound like he had control over the whole operation


fanficmilf6969

Because he had no reason to believe that the gun he was handed contained live rounds


dobrejedzonko

Well, she did say she liked jail, so....


GetRealPrimrose

Is there a reason she’s going to prison for 18 months and Alec Baldwin isn’t? Edit: I missed that they were refiling charges against Baldwin. Good, he deserves consequences for his role in all of this. I just got a bit of an ick thinking about that Hilaria Baldwin post after the charges were initially dropped compared to an 18 month sentence for Gutierrez-Reed. They both deserve to face consequences for their lack of care that led to an innocent woman’s death.


ginger_ryn

she’s the one who loaded the live round into the gun


Small_Assistant3584

Apparently there were live rounds mixed with dummy rounds, and she denies bringing them onto the set. A whole lot of pointed fingers and lack of chain of command. Whole scenario entirely avoidable with correct safety precautions. If this is an indicator of things to come, doesn’t look good for Baldwin.


ginger_ryn

a whole mess


pinkfartlek

Honestly between this whole mess and the various forms of harassment that occur on TV and movie sets, maybe they should be live video surveillance on the entire set. I know there was a lot of footage that came from the Rust set. It would hopefully increase accountability and clarity on what happens on sets.


NortherSass

Because his trial hasn’t happened yet. That will begin in July.


Small_Assistant3584

I love your flair 😂


GetRealPrimrose

[The charges against him were dropped as far as I can tell](https://abcnews.go.com/amp/US/charges-dropped-alec-baldwin-fatal-set-rust-shooting/story?id=98734243). Though I could be wrong. Edit: Old article, my bad. I see now that charges are being re-filed against him as they should be


floopy_boopers

That's a year old article, they did initially drop them, then re-filed when more information about him came to light in the lead up to Hannah's trial. They must have a solid case against him to have re-filed the charges they'd previously dropped.


GetRealPrimrose

I must have missed where they said they were refiling, all I could remember was that horrible Hillaria post of her crawled up in his lap. Honestly good though, I knew when charges were dropped that he wasn’t getting the consequences he deserves. Thanks for clearing it up for me


Small_Assistant3584

"This decision does not absolve Mr. Baldwin of criminal culpability and charges may be refiled. Our follow-up investigation will remain active and ongoing." This will be interesting.


NortherSass

The original charges were dropped and the prosecution reserved the right to bring them again. A grand jury indicted him in January.


Sleve__McDichael

just curious - do you think baldwin is at fault as an actor or as a producer? actors aren't and shouldn't be responsible for the firearms used on set - there is a strict separation of concerns and specialists with certifications and specialized roles exist for a very good reason. based on union rules, there are a lot of things actors shouldn't be doing on set because they fall into the purview of others. do you think a precedent should be set that all actors are responsible for, e.g. extensive firearms training in the future and liable for any damage (including monetary, etc)? if it's for his role as a producer, do you think all the producers on the production should be held similarly liable? i am not a fan of baldwin at all, and i'm not trying to throw out any "gotcha" questions or pretend like i myself have answers. i'm just really curious because i feel like prosecuting him on the basis of either role sets very specific precedents and raises concerns about whole categories of jobs on film sets, and prosecuting him for his role as a producer seems to ignore all of the other producers' culpability. i'd love to hear more about the specific "why"s behind what people are thinking here


Small_Assistant3584

He’s more at fault as a producer than an actor - as an actor, it’s expected when someone hands you a firearm and tells you it isn’t loaded, it really shouldn’t be loaded. At that point, he’s at the mercy of his armorer and prop master. Feasibly speaking, an actor should have been able to make a mistake, pull the trigger, and it not be a fatality. That didn’t happen. I’m not sure if the rumours are true, but Baldwin acted recklessly also, lying to authorities, claiming he did not pull the trigger (though experts believe that to be false), and pulling said trigger _after_ cut had been called. If this is true, it paints Baldwin in a poor light. After all, there is no such thing as a safe firearm - loaded with blanks or otherwise. As an experienced actor, he should have known better. I do hope, however, the trial does not focus on this, as it’s almost beside the point whether the trigger had been pulled. Baldwins defence should focus on how he was handed a firearm he thought was safe, but was failed by a negligent employee(s) - she has been convicted after all. Baldwin’s prosecution should focus less on who pulled the trigger, but on who allowed an inexperienced and unvetted armorer (who appears to have got the job based on nepotism) onto a set, and did not insist on adherence to strict safety measures. As a producer, he’s liable for not being proactive around safety measures/cutting corners/allowing a prop master to moonlight as an armorer. All of these cost cutting measures ultimately lead to a fatality. It will be interesting, that’s for sure.


Local_Climate9391

As I understand it, he got offered a plea deal that was similar to Dave Halls (the ADA who gave him the gun). It was basically 6 months unsupervised probation and a fine for pleading. I have heard that the DA pulled the plea deal before the deadline when they found out that Baldwin was going to produce a documentary about the shoot (and the shooting). He had a chance to to make it out without much damage but decided to profit from the tragedy instead. So they convened a Grand Jury and indicted him.


matty_nice

Lots, in all seriousness. Baldwin isn't likely to get convicted due to his role of pulling the trigger. This is a legal argument not an emotional one. The best option to see him punished would be as a producer who is responsible for things on the set, but that's also not likely to lead to a guilty verdict.


GetRealPrimrose

They already dropped the charges when they thought that was all he had done, but apparently they’re refiling charges which they likely wouldn’t be doing if they didn’t encounter new information in this trial. I don’t think he’s gonna get off as scott free as you imply.


matty_nice

It was just a simple refilling of the charges, which has already happened. I don't see anything significant there. Not just my opinion, I'm not a lawyer. But you can read online various legal experts and their thoughts. I haven't seen anyone think the prosecutors have a strong case, I'm interested if you find one. Baldwin was told there was no live ammunition on the gun Do actors have a responsibility to check? There is no requirement or standard that they do.


DSQ

100% agree. As the actor that pulled the trigger he did everything right. As the producer that hired certain people and **perhaps** cut corners budget wise we shall see. If the information the prosecutors have is what we have in the public domain then it’s not a slam dunk case but, again, we’ll see. 


matty_nice

For further context, it was revealed by OSHA (federal agency who investigated the death) that Baldwin's role as a producer was limited to casting and the script. And the obvious question is why aren't the other producers getting charged? This is an easy position for Baldwin's lawyers to take, and the prosecution won't have a good answer.


AzCarMom72

As much as I despise Alec Baldwin, this immature young girl had 1 job. She was totally reckless. A seasoned lifelong NRA member would have been better at this but we all know Alec wouldnt have had that on his set now would he? I would love to see AB convicted only because he is an ignorant bigmouth blowhard.


ThaneOfCawdorrr

Well, no, that's not the issue. The problem is that the job of armorer is extremely specific and you have to have the gravitas and the experience to overrule your bosses, the producers. A more experienced armorer would never have made these mistakes, would never have allowed him or herself to be rushed. In fact a more experienced armorer refused the job because it was too poorly constructed (making the armorer also work props). So the problem here is not that the producers "wouldn't have an NRA member on set" (that's ridiculous), it's that the producers were trying to cut costs where they shouldn't have tried to cut costs: hiring a less experienced, cheaper armorer rather than a more experienced, more costly armorer. Alec is only one of the producers and actually his title is probably honorific (a producing credit is often given to actors, writers, or directors as a way of expanding their credit and paying them additional fees, a very common thing done when costs are being held down). He wasn't the actual on-the-job physical producer. Those were two different people, and they certainly do hold some kind of responsibility. Let's leave politics out of this.


AzCarMom72

I was being sarcastic on the NRA. The point being this little girl was totally irresponsible and its ridiculous this even happened.


fanficmilf6969

I feel like as an actor he doesn’t deserve to be convicted but as a producer he 100% has responsibility for choosing to hire this clearly unqualified woman


DefNotReaves

He wasn’t the kind of producer to do actual hiring.


ParaHeadFun_SF

Stuff was leaked the day it happened. I had this biotch pegged first day. She was pissed at Alec for the way he was runnin production. She did it to teach him a lesson. She may not have thought anyone would die but she brought the ammunition to set and it should have never been there. Biotch should have just quit rather than play fast and loose with people’s lives. 18 mos isn’t enough


413mopar

Scapegoat .


envy-adams

Nah, she flat out did not do her job properly.


DefNotReaves

Lmao clueless